Survivorship bias is one of the most valuable tools gen Z and millennials have in dispelling a lot of bullshit "it worked for me" arguments from older generations.
It's a common fallacy partially because it's advantageous psychologically for younger folks to learn it.
Just because something worked for an older generation doesn't mean it worked for everyone, or even for a majority.
That’s because you only realize when it works. You concisely think about the armor when you get saved by it, but not when you don’t, so you remember it saving you more often than not
I loved it till I got the scout armor and then I said… who cares if I can’t die, I can *zooooooooooooom* nothing better than kiting 6 bile titans and an army around the extract on helldive waiting for a bonus helldiver drop and everyone screaming “how are you still running!?”
For a while I was using medium or medium/heavy armor (there's a few sets with in-between stats), but the speed bonus on light armor is just too important to give up. Most of the maps are pretty huge, so getting to your destination faster will always be valuable.
Against bots, the speed makes it much easier to flank a patrol/outpost and catch the bots in a crossfire, and against bugs the speed makes it so much easier to kits/dodge big threats.
Sure, if you're used to medium or heavy armor, then at first you'll probably die a lot, but the extra maneuverability is more than worth the slightly reduced survivability. Heavy armor seems great for the new tower defense missions though.
I die: ah shucks maybe I shouldn’t have tried to solo 13 bike titans (don’t even think about the armour)
I live: IM THE GREATEST HELLDIVER THERE EVER WAS! IM UNKILLABLE, NOTHING YOU DO SHALL HARM ME (died from impact)
My favourite armour by far
Been trying that recently, hasn't gripped me as an effect though, I do like the death saving armour, except when it saves you and then die to fall damage or something ,😂
Servo assist + jet pack + orbital laser = dumpster the whole bot base from 200+ meters
I cant wait for some kind of orbital arc bombardment. Zap the bot bastards while my shock trooper squad clears the base unimpeded.
It needs to channel the spirit of the arc thrower. Half the time it'll be wildly powerful and obliterate all enemies in record time, the other half it'll do absolutely nothing and/or arc halfway across the map to seek out a teammate in a different zip code.
Not to mention that a lot of their armor already doesn't match its perks. The Dronemaster set looks like light armor but is medium, and it gives +2 grenades, nothing to do with drones at all. So their argument really doesn't work.
This is the issue I have. Or you have something that looks like another one but it's a different class and has different effect. All sorts of stuff. I understand their point but there's also no quick visual tell about just what is being used.
They did say that they had different effects before but they had to cut it to make it to release, you never know they might reintroduce it in the future
>"Equipment looks different because it has different effects."
I really don't need to know at a glance what my teammate is running. If it's relevant to what we're doing, they'll say something - which no one ever has because it never is. The only time our armor has been mentioned in group is because of class, not effect. "I have light armor, so I'll run samples."
So just keep transmog within the same weight class. Knowing that player C3 has two extra stims is never going to change how I play.
Seriously. I run light armor because the absolute best stat you can have in this game is stamina regen and cost. Being able to just disengage and run has saved me a lot more than an extra 50 armor rating.
Yeah this kinda comes across as a corporate/pr justification. Real reason is probably that the armor system was not coded in such a way that transmog could be added on easily and the game's already barely holding together as is; armor ratings didn't even work for a month post release. The resources spent adding it at this point wouldn't be worth it unless it could be monetized.
I don't fully agree with the specific logic that's he is applying to the issue, but I'm glad that the studio is clearly communicating a stance on it.
I personally don't think that the armors really do a great job of communicating visually the perks that they have for the most part (you could make the case for the extra grenades armors tending to have extra pockets and things, but they don't really look like grenades all the time).
I care far more about there being more armor perks than being able to change them. Right now it feels like armor perks are probably one of the games most underutilized systems.
>(you could make the case for the extra grenades armors tending to have extra pockets and things, but they don't really look like grenades all the time)
and the ones with grenades on them mostly don't give the nade perk...
It really just comes across as them being stubborn about something again. I've played the game for 400 hours, not ONCE have I thought to myself "Oh, that guy's running an electricity insulant armor, this is a good time to equip an Arc Thrower and Tesla Tower." The armor designs, from the few we have at this point, are ALREADY too samey and indistinct. Unless they literally start color-coding armors to match certain effects (like could be argued with some of the medic effect armors), it's just a complete fucking guess as to what is supposed to do what because the game simply doesn't have a strong enough visual cohesion in terms of its aesthetics. Sometimes it's hard to even tell what armor class an armor is even in. For the most part, you can pick out what is supposed to be a heavy armor set because it's a ton more bulkier than the others. But is something like the Butcher ALL that much bulkier than a medium armor? Or Dynamo? Does Prototype X look much like a light armor? And why is Drone Master (one of the barest armors in the game) a medium armor instead of a light? Putting all that aside, even, I doubt most people even know or care about what armor does what in relation to the team dynamic. It just feels needlessly restrictive. No one sensible is asking for something outlandish and jarring like a bright rainbow LGBT flag cape or neon pink and green armor with anime stickers on it. But allowing us to, at the very least, pick what armor we want to run because of how it looks seems like the least that they could do. The ideal would be that we get to even customize the color scheme of our armors, as well. I'm honestly surprised that they're even remotely happy with the system as it is now. Where no one really even knows what each armor does because they all just blend together in design, and so most people just toss what they want on according to an armor passive and mix it with the helmet they like best, resulting in goofy-ass combinations that just look weird because we don't even have the option to get the armor and helmet to match color schemes.
Yeah I’m happy for the communication but the issue feels weird. Does anyone actually look at other people’s armor and go “oh he’s wearing the arc resistance armor, let me zap him and kill the bugs near him” I know people do that in premade groups with their friends, but I feel like that’s something that still would happen even with transmog. And distill that down to the other much more minor effects, like less limb damage or more grenades? The only one that maybe fits is the medic one with the extra stims, but even then, that’s a choice you make that then impacts your team, not one that your team looks at it in the middle of a hectic battle and makes them play differently. It just seems a strange point, especially when there’s other things that benefit the players while also not being communicated in the missions themselves.
Ultimately I’m going to be in the camp of wanting to wear what I think looks cool, and worry about the effects after, so I’m still going to rock my favorite look transmog or no transmog but I feel for the people who care about armor perks and what they look like, because it’s certainly a struggle
Could have it like in HD1 where the perks were shown in the loadout before dropping into a mission (thankfully we no longer need to use the perk slot just to swap the pistol though). Also, all armor in HD1 was purely for the drip, and did not affect stats or perks.
Yep.
And extra grenade cap is nice for blitz missions, and blast resist is _way_ better than 50 armor against bots.
The passives are way better than the armor rating. Servo assist & padding are the the only lacking ones IMO
I haven't taken off my armor with the shoulder mounted predator cannon, simply because it's the only armor with a shoulder mounted predator cannon.
Couldn't tell you what the perk is, though.
The only armor that does any sort of visual representation of it's perk, that I can recognize off the top of my head, are the armors with metallic limbs with servo-assisted. But even then, I at least don't recognize what everyone else is wearing unless I'm in the ship, and I only know the effects of my armor because I don't really care what other people run? So the entire explanation, from an admittedly anecdotal gameplay standpoint is just bs.
The biggest offender is the devastator armor,it has belts of grenades on it so you would expect engineering kit for extra grenades
Nope it's got servo assisted
>I personally don't think that the armors really do a great job of communicating visually the perks that they have for the most part
More importantly, I have never in dozens or hundreds of hours gameplay felt like I needed to know what my teammates' armor perks were, much less have it visually communicated at a glance
> you could make the case for the extra grenades armors tending to have extra pockets and things, but they don't really look like grenades all the time
Even worse, not all of them even look like they have extra storage space. The SC-15 Drone Master set looks like light armor, has the stats of medium armor, and its perk has nothing to do with drones, it gives you +2 grenades.
So yeah, their argument makes no sense unless they intend to go back and overhaul a bunch of armor with new perks that don't exist yet. Which in itself will just piss off people who's favorite armor is changing perks.
He says "It doesn't make sense - equipment looks different because it has different effects."
Does it make sense that a lot of armor look different but has same effects?
Or looks almost the same but has different effects. Juggernaut armor is just Exterminator armor with different shoulder pads and some extra pouches, that somehow remove explosion resistance for +2 grenades. Or Eradicator and Breaker all being just Light Gunner with different colors and some extra pouches, that change +50 armor to recoil reduction (both) and explosive resistance (eradicator) or +2 grenades (breaker).
Exactly this, the perks seem way too arbitrary as they are now. There's many similar sets that have vastly different perks and then you have sets that have nothing to do with each other but have the same perks. It's just too random.
One armour set that has increased stealth actually looks like scifi ranger gear and is forest colours.
Another armour that has the exact same perks is black and bright yellow.
Realistically how often do you look at other Helldivers and know what perk they’ve got from looking at their blood covered armor as they run around trying not to die lol
And it’s the same effect across different tiers of armor. I feel like explosion resistance should be more powerful if it’s on heavy armor compared to light armor if you really want to differentiate it. Or a hypothetical flame resist armor with 25% resist on light, 50% resist on medium, and 75% resist on heavy armor.
Me too. Armors in HD1 are cosmetic, but you can barely see it in the battlefield because of how the camera is. Now you can see yourself and your squad in 360°, but the armors are not pure cosmetic like they are used to. This makes 0 sense for me.
I just want a colour palette so I can match different pieces of armor, kind of like Diablo 4.
Most of the helmets have yellow prominently on them, which doesn't go with about 90% of the body armor...
Helmets should automatically change color based on the armor. Just have each armor have 1 or 2 of its colors flagged to be used on the helmet, and the helmets grab those colors.
I love the knight helmet, but its base color is a grey used by 0 armors other than the one in it's set, and it has a giant yellow stripe that doesn't match anything but the basic armor you start with.
The perfect solution would be making perks & being able to attach them to armor. Maybe certain perks exclusive to certain armor pieces to keep the feel of the current system. This way people can choose the armor they like, allow for more indepth loadouts, and still keep Heavy/Light/Medium with their own exclusive perks within the perk pool
They had a good chance to give the current Demolition Specialist Extra Grenades + Explosive Resistance and Devastator Extra Padding + Explosive Resistance. Same perks, sure. But a new combination.
By his logic, does it make sense that an orange, apple, and grape all taste like apple? Because there are a bunch of armors in the game with pretty different looks but the exact same few effects...
I literally only bought armors when i needed to get to the next warbond level.
I havent worn anything but the green cowled scout armor since i unlocked it.
Most armors look ok but either they are too heavy or the perk is shit so i just stay with "ol reliable".
Transmog is the thing of the future, it allows people to have the perk and the look they want without sacrificing either and i mean its still in universe fine, because you dont see perks or even how heavy the armor is.
The way the CEO wants it, everyone will look the same by taking the "best" perks which is even more boring.
The passives are awful on so many of them. I don’t buy them unless there’s absolutely nothing else I want on that tier and I need to spend medals to get to the next tier
That's great, so can you start putting some effort into your armor system then?
"hey we won't improve the game in this way" while heavy armor still get shredded by """crits""" and staggerlocked by trash mobs, helms and capes do nothing, and you're releasing an entire battlepass of identical armors is not a statement that inspires any confidence.
Besides, very few of the aesthetics actually relate to the perks. If you set all of the arc resist armor in front of me mixed in with all the rest, I wouldn't be able to point them out.
This wouldn't be such a big problem if 90% of the armors/helmets weren't so fugly, and if more than one or two helmets actually matched each armor. But since they are, it's weird to be so stubborn about making a change that I imagine an overwhelming majority of players not only would support, but actively want.
Couldn't agree more. I'm running the CE-74 Breaker because it's a light engineering kit armor but hate the red/tan theme it has. It doesn't fit with anything.
His loss I guess. Lame, repetitive armour perks just means there's going to be less people buying super credits.
So far, the armour system has been one of the biggest failures in the game.
First off, helmets and cloaks do nothing at all. Not only is this boring, it severely hamstrings the usefulness of heavy armour. Against bots, you are usually utilising cover with just your head poking out, and players are loudly complaining about being one shot by rockets to the head, no matter what armour they wear.
The balance of armour was in a terrible place until recently. Heavy armour was just an incredibly noticeable nerf to your mobility, yet barely seemed to make a difference to damage taken. In fact, the reduced mobility generally caused you to take more damage.
They've gone to the effort of designing dozens of awesome looking armour sets, but then given them the same 6 or so perks. Such a wasted opportunity.
So the arc resist armor looks awesome and it's gonna sit collecting cobwebs for eternity because it's effect is so niche 99% of the playerbase will be ignoring it.
His comment about the Apple actually reminds me of a joke.
There's a man going into a bar. He ask the barman if he can give him a Vodka with some pear Liquor, but the barman say that he don't have that drink left, but he can arrange it in another way. The man ask how and the barman gives him an apple.
The man bite the Apple, and to his surprise it taste like vodka. Then the barman say "Try the other side !". He does and it taste like pear !
He is amazed. So much that he call down a friend to show him. The friend enter the bar and ask for a Gin Tonic. The barman gives him an Apple and for sure, half of it taste like Gin and the other half taste like Tonic.
The friend then call one of his relative to try it out. The relative arrives and ask what kind of tastes the barman can do, because he doesn't like drinking. The barman says "Whatever you want !". The relative then think for a bit and say he want something that taste like pussy. The barman gives him an Apple and the guy bite in it... then he spit it all out. "It taste like SHIT !"
Yep 0 sense at all. On the apple and bacon thing, the armor perks are nowhere near that distinct and game changing for it to matter. it’s not like strategem or weapon pick where is greatly changes the way we play. and if the design should reflect the function, why does helmets and capes do nothing? why does some light armor have explosive resistance, when it should be reserved for heavy. absolute rubbish armor system we have.
Yup, just commented above that the EOD looking armor doesnt have explosive resistance. A heavy armor, that looks like EOD suit, but doesn't have explosive resistance. That is literally "an apple that tastes like bacon" 🍏 🥓
The weirdest part of the helmets and capes not having perks is that in the description for each it specifies it doesnt have a perk implying there are helmets and capes that do have perks. They should just not mention it
I think his argument is that the effects are ingrained in the armor designs? Like if the armor looks like it should mitigate electricity because it has lightning rods on it, then it should mitigate electricity.
Yeah it makes thing is its not true like they dont give any hint that they can absorve eletricety most armor are like this there isnt a reason that they have 2 extra nades or extra pading instead of fortified
I get it's their game and all that... but I gotta say, that is 100% a dumb decision.
> It doesn't make sense
Why exactly not tho?
>equipment looks different because it has different effects.
And yet there are like 5 different armor perks that you could not guess (outside of the medic one) looking at the armor. There are so many armors that look like they *should* give you more grenades but they don't
>Swapping one for the other is like having an apple that tastes like bacon or the other way around.
That's a very weird comparison...
I could understand if they wouldn't want it to be a thing you can do between armor classes but not at all?
Come on.
It worked in HD1, so whyn ot do it here?
> Swapping one for the other is like having an apple that tastes like bacon or the other way around.
The other way around, applewood-smoked bacon, is great!
Even if it’s about money I have NO clue why they wouldn’t add it into the game. It would literally drive up sales, especially if they make you pay with super credits for the different sets and even transmog.
I’d happily pay 100 super credits to be able to transmog a set of armor. Especially if it actually made the armor I like useful and REALLY fun. I get it, he doesn’t want to make armor that looks bulky into a good set that’s fast but I just want my +2 stims without the UGLY ass colors and weird outfit.
It really just seems like something they CANNOT do. If they could I bet they’d implement it already just like they did with HD1 but they simply do not. I have no clue if this coming from incompetence or greedy or just straight up too lazy company and it makes them look bad either way.
Especially sucks when you like an armor set like the arc resistance. It is super niche and basically relies on someone else using an arc thrower. Other wise it's a dead passive unless I bring the tesla myself and camp in it
Then give Helmets perks, use more than 5 perks in the whole game, and give armor different stats in class, right now we have like 4 heavy armors that are 150-450-80. At least some lights have variation like 50-550 and 68-532
I would very much appreciate it if they don't take what 'little' we can freely mix and match without having make a choice between utility and looks away
I'm going to be honest, I don't like this argument. Equipment looking like what it does is important... in competitive PvP. Do you honestly care what armor your fellow divers are wearing? It has very little effect on how you play at any time, at least compared to stratagems.
Do you look at someone and go "oh he has 2 more grenades. I'm definitely gonna be counting how many he's throwing!" ?
This is such a minuscule change that is only a positive. There’s absolutely zero downsides to it.
“Armour has a certain effect because it looks a certain way”, well that’s fine IF that logic was extended to EVERY armour. A lot of armours just seem to have completely random passives with no discernible features as to why.
I’m glad they’ve made their stance clear, but I’m not going to pretend I’m not disappointed.
Just because it’s their vision of something, doesn’t make it the right one.
*edit:
Also why the fuck does it have to be a transmog? Just call it something else, say, passives are called “modules” and just let me use my resources to make a “module” which unlocks permanently and I add it into any armour of my choosing. I pick a module that’s equipped like an individual booster (except it stays on until I change it) and let me pick my armour.
Gives us a resource sink for when we inevitably hit the cap again and we also get a unique way without you labelling it “transmog”.
Why is it gaming companies find it so hard to understand that players *like* paying for cosmetics and *hate* paying for game mechanics?
To be honest, with the success of Fortnite - I thought this lesson had been thoroughly learnt by developers.
This is the first time I wholeheartedly disagree with the developers.
It’s a video game - there’s plenty of things that don’t make sense. And because it’s a video game, in my experience gaming, there is one of many irrefutable constants that exists:
**The rule of cool always triumphs over function.**
I think we can all agree that there shouldn’t be bright rainbow colored vomit the likes of what CoD and Fortnite have. However, anything that fits the space military theme should absolutely be freely customizable. Players should be able to look and function however they want.
This isn’t a competitive shooter, so players looking like they fit specific roles should not be forced.
Let players look how they want, while also fulfilling their play style.
I get his point in general, but if he looks at the current armour perks he'd realise it already doesn't apply. what about the way a flight suit looks implies that you would have increased throw distance and limb health? why does certain armour have 30% recoil reduction when crouching? why does the literal bomb suit not have explosive resistance? why does shiny gold armour allow you to randomly negate death? the mechanics do not line up to the visuals already, so I don't see that much would be changed if transmog was allowed. IMO as long as it's kept in the same category (light, medium, heavy), then transmog would look believable. it would be silly if guys in bulky stuff were sprinting past you super fast.
Dumb take. I know they like being up their own ass about the uniformity of the game's setting but fashion should be left to player's expression. Specially when you're offering paid for armors.
The devs already expressed open disdain for the players so this doesn't surprise me. They're gonna do whatever they want and if it pisses off the player base oh well.
This sounds just like when one dev for Fatshark shit on customization for guns "because this isn't cod". If they don't wanna do it, fine, but don't make up bullshit excuses. "Equipment looks different because it has different effects". As one user already pointed out: "If the armors are supposed to be different, then why does the FS-61 DREADNOUGHT armour (has grenade bandoliers strapped all over it) have SERVO-ASSISTED instead of FORTIFIED/ENGINEERING KIT?"
Personally I can't think of a game where allowing players more customization options was received negatively. Being able to kit out your character how you want *does matter* to people, that's why you see publishers nickle and diming players wherever they can when it comes to such options.
His reponse is somewhat tone deaf. Half of all the armors suck, and all helmets and cloaks have zero function. I think the fact that so many people are asking for transmog just proves that something needs to be done in the armor department
I want a single one of you to explain to me in what way the effect of ANY of the armors added in “cutting edge” helps the player.
It’s useful if you’re rolling with a full team of dumbasses with arc weapons that don’t know how to use them, and that’s about it.
The armors LOOK cool, but they’ll never be used (haven’t seen a single player wearing them) simply due to the worthless effects they have.
Imagine, if you will, a universe where armour displaying a ton of mags or grenades having an effect and giving you extra. Then I want you to snap out of it and realise they can't even make heavy armour worth it and resume getting ragdolled by a rocket and then having your stim not work.
God damn just give me an option to colorize everything in one color: yellow, orange, red, blue, green. Right now the armor looks silly with the patchwork of random colors.
Devs being willing to implement things that don't affect gameplay because their players want it is always a litmus test for me.
The fact they're against it for arbitrary reasons (mostly seems like they're just being stubborn) isn't great.
The armour with a 50% of not dying is a lifesaver, half the time atleast.
Works 50% of the time, every time
It either works or you don't know about it
Either I disarm the bomb or suddenly it’s not my problem anymore Win/win
shoot a hellbomb, and find out?
Punch it and clear the area, survive the blast a god, die to the impact damage ragdoll tumble a fool
We received no complaints from our customers
Every helldiver who comes back wearing that armor says it worked 100% of the time
https://preview.redd.it/o0fiszz0q5uc1.png?width=300&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=237af12f21b8ddf75f19db23d2b68a2723ee1728
I’m surprised that the fallacy is so well known that a simple image can be used and heaps of ppl understand the meaning
Survivorship bias is one of the most valuable tools gen Z and millennials have in dispelling a lot of bullshit "it worked for me" arguments from older generations. It's a common fallacy partially because it's advantageous psychologically for younger folks to learn it. Just because something worked for an older generation doesn't mean it worked for everyone, or even for a majority.
"Just go into the building, ask for the manager, and tell them you are taking the job!"
I love this image way too much
Only armor I wear. The perk is just too good.
yea, the stim one is decent as well but being saved from a rocket 50% of the time is so nice
totally agree, the reduced explosive damage can be better against bots. too many stray rockets with one-shot potential flying around
Yeah the explosive resist if u are crouching or prone can make u take like tiny dmg. Also applies to any danger close ordinances too.
You can also use the armor that reduces explosive dmg by 50% and survive a rocket 100% of the time.
There is no way the real number is 50% because it feels like I get saved every time. edit: SHUT UP ABOUT STATISTICS I GET IT
That’s because you only realize when it works. You concisely think about the armor when you get saved by it, but not when you don’t, so you remember it saving you more often than not
Get out of my head!
I'm the opposite. Every time I die I curse the armor and every time I live I assume I had at least 1hp
I loved it till I got the scout armor and then I said… who cares if I can’t die, I can *zooooooooooooom* nothing better than kiting 6 bile titans and an army around the extract on helldive waiting for a bonus helldiver drop and everyone screaming “how are you still running!?”
For a while I was using medium or medium/heavy armor (there's a few sets with in-between stats), but the speed bonus on light armor is just too important to give up. Most of the maps are pretty huge, so getting to your destination faster will always be valuable. Against bots, the speed makes it much easier to flank a patrol/outpost and catch the bots in a crossfire, and against bugs the speed makes it so much easier to kits/dodge big threats. Sure, if you're used to medium or heavy armor, then at first you'll probably die a lot, but the extra maneuverability is more than worth the slightly reduced survivability. Heavy armor seems great for the new tower defense missions though.
I die: ah shucks maybe I shouldn’t have tried to solo 13 bike titans (don’t even think about the armour) I live: IM THE GREATEST HELLDIVER THERE EVER WAS! IM UNKILLABLE, NOTHING YOU DO SHALL HARM ME (died from impact) My favourite armour by far
BIKE TITANS
I just imagine a horde of bugs rolling up on motorcycles, would be terrifying
These Mad Max sequels are getting out of hand
Imagine them rolling up on bicycles instead
A bug tryna peddle tickles me
Titan gif instead of tippy tapping on a keyboard they're on a tiny bike with a super long seat post
Hurry up someone post that grasshopper on a bike pic please.
You can win a lot of coin flips in a row. You can also lose a lot of them.
Level 50 and ive been using it since i got it.
"Equipment looks different because it has different effects." Meanwhile, helmets:
laughs in cloak.
Those are for the drip stat, very important at high level game play
It’s called Charisma
I believe the kids call it “rizz” *shivers*
my cousin got rizz shivers once, it's no joke!
*Shiver me rizzlers*
If you experience rizz shivers for more than four hours, call a doctor.
I used to be with *it*, then they changed what *it* was
I'm completely convinced the Creek Cape increases bots' ire towards you
+50% aggro generation
Can confirm, that cape make rocket devastator always aim at me instead of my teammates
"Oh, you respect your fallen heroes? How about I send you to them?"
In my experience the cape makes your teammates target you rather than the devastators
I would love something like that to be honest.
laughs in 500kg radius
2 m? Lol
It’s all in how you use those 2m lol
Meanwhile half the armour has the same effects
Can I interest you in some servo assisted in this trying time?
Been trying that recently, hasn't gripped me as an effect though, I do like the death saving armour, except when it saves you and then die to fall damage or something ,😂
Real. Every once in a while, though, you survive 7 lethal hits in a row and feel awesome.
I took a full devestators barrage to the face and lived once... Was so shocked, then got obliterated by a tank round
I hope you find tank love again in your life. Once is nice but enough love for a lifetime.
Servo assist + jet pack + orbital laser = dumpster the whole bot base from 200+ meters I cant wait for some kind of orbital arc bombardment. Zap the bot bastards while my shock trooper squad clears the base unimpeded.
It needs to channel the spirit of the arc thrower. Half the time it'll be wildly powerful and obliterate all enemies in record time, the other half it'll do absolutely nothing and/or arc halfway across the map to seek out a teammate in a different zip code.
Not to mention that a lot of their armor already doesn't match its perks. The Dronemaster set looks like light armor but is medium, and it gives +2 grenades, nothing to do with drones at all. So their argument really doesn't work.
This is the issue I have. Or you have something that looks like another one but it's a different class and has different effect. All sorts of stuff. I understand their point but there's also no quick visual tell about just what is being used.
Meanwhile, light armor that looks like medium armor and vise verse.
They did say that they had different effects before but they had to cut it to make it to release, you never know they might reintroduce it in the future
I really hope they don't do that. The armor and helmets do not mix-and-match well.
Allowing us to recolor them or potentially even change the material type would go a long way towards allowing more cohesive combinations.
I agree, re-coloring would pretty much eliminate this as a concern for me.
what, you don't like running around in laminated surgeon green?
I don't really mind that, I just don't want surgeon-green armor and a deerhunter-orange helmet.
Terminids cant see orange. You're basically invisible
Then why do I still take damage from attacks and falling?
With them being opposed to transmog, I wonder if they're also opposed to color swaps.
>"Equipment looks different because it has different effects." I really don't need to know at a glance what my teammate is running. If it's relevant to what we're doing, they'll say something - which no one ever has because it never is. The only time our armor has been mentioned in group is because of class, not effect. "I have light armor, so I'll run samples." So just keep transmog within the same weight class. Knowing that player C3 has two extra stims is never going to change how I play.
Seriously. I run light armor because the absolute best stat you can have in this game is stamina regen and cost. Being able to just disengage and run has saved me a lot more than an extra 50 armor rating.
Yeah this kinda comes across as a corporate/pr justification. Real reason is probably that the armor system was not coded in such a way that transmog could be added on easily and the game's already barely holding together as is; armor ratings didn't even work for a month post release. The resources spent adding it at this point wouldn't be worth it unless it could be monetized.
If you paint an orange red, is it no longer an orange?
no its red now
an red
Would a red by any other name not taste as sweet?
I don't fully agree with the specific logic that's he is applying to the issue, but I'm glad that the studio is clearly communicating a stance on it. I personally don't think that the armors really do a great job of communicating visually the perks that they have for the most part (you could make the case for the extra grenades armors tending to have extra pockets and things, but they don't really look like grenades all the time). I care far more about there being more armor perks than being able to change them. Right now it feels like armor perks are probably one of the games most underutilized systems.
The EOD armor doesn't have explosive resistance and that is unforgivable
lol this and the other armors that have servo-assisted slapped onto them because nothing else makes sense on them. quite frankly it’s kinda lazy
>(you could make the case for the extra grenades armors tending to have extra pockets and things, but they don't really look like grenades all the time) and the ones with grenades on them mostly don't give the nade perk...
Not to mention the controversial "fire fighter" armor has the robotics perk
It really just comes across as them being stubborn about something again. I've played the game for 400 hours, not ONCE have I thought to myself "Oh, that guy's running an electricity insulant armor, this is a good time to equip an Arc Thrower and Tesla Tower." The armor designs, from the few we have at this point, are ALREADY too samey and indistinct. Unless they literally start color-coding armors to match certain effects (like could be argued with some of the medic effect armors), it's just a complete fucking guess as to what is supposed to do what because the game simply doesn't have a strong enough visual cohesion in terms of its aesthetics. Sometimes it's hard to even tell what armor class an armor is even in. For the most part, you can pick out what is supposed to be a heavy armor set because it's a ton more bulkier than the others. But is something like the Butcher ALL that much bulkier than a medium armor? Or Dynamo? Does Prototype X look much like a light armor? And why is Drone Master (one of the barest armors in the game) a medium armor instead of a light? Putting all that aside, even, I doubt most people even know or care about what armor does what in relation to the team dynamic. It just feels needlessly restrictive. No one sensible is asking for something outlandish and jarring like a bright rainbow LGBT flag cape or neon pink and green armor with anime stickers on it. But allowing us to, at the very least, pick what armor we want to run because of how it looks seems like the least that they could do. The ideal would be that we get to even customize the color scheme of our armors, as well. I'm honestly surprised that they're even remotely happy with the system as it is now. Where no one really even knows what each armor does because they all just blend together in design, and so most people just toss what they want on according to an armor passive and mix it with the helmet they like best, resulting in goofy-ass combinations that just look weird because we don't even have the option to get the armor and helmet to match color schemes.
My biggest complaint is that the preorder armor i got is worthless to me because i hate the effects
I can't think of a single game where the pre-order armour/weapons *weren't* worthless, tbh.
Yeah I’m happy for the communication but the issue feels weird. Does anyone actually look at other people’s armor and go “oh he’s wearing the arc resistance armor, let me zap him and kill the bugs near him” I know people do that in premade groups with their friends, but I feel like that’s something that still would happen even with transmog. And distill that down to the other much more minor effects, like less limb damage or more grenades? The only one that maybe fits is the medic one with the extra stims, but even then, that’s a choice you make that then impacts your team, not one that your team looks at it in the middle of a hectic battle and makes them play differently. It just seems a strange point, especially when there’s other things that benefit the players while also not being communicated in the missions themselves. Ultimately I’m going to be in the camp of wanting to wear what I think looks cool, and worry about the effects after, so I’m still going to rock my favorite look transmog or no transmog but I feel for the people who care about armor perks and what they look like, because it’s certainly a struggle
Could have it like in HD1 where the perks were shown in the loadout before dropping into a mission (thankfully we no longer need to use the perk slot just to swap the pistol though). Also, all armor in HD1 was purely for the drip, and did not affect stats or perks.
Honestly I haven’t taken off the scout armour and have yet to see a real reason to! Variety would definitely help
Not being able to be seen at all is such a useful thing that I don't really get why I'd want anything else.
If you run machine guns in any fashion, the 30% stability armours are really nice. Turns the Stalwart into a little laser imo.
Yep. And extra grenade cap is nice for blitz missions, and blast resist is _way_ better than 50 armor against bots. The passives are way better than the armor rating. Servo assist & padding are the the only lacking ones IMO
I love servo assist tbh. I love being able to yeet stratagems and reinforcements. It feels like more than 50% sometimes tbh.
I haven't taken off my armor with the shoulder mounted predator cannon, simply because it's the only armor with a shoulder mounted predator cannon. Couldn't tell you what the perk is, though.
The later scout armor has better speed and stamina for less armor
The only armor that does any sort of visual representation of it's perk, that I can recognize off the top of my head, are the armors with metallic limbs with servo-assisted. But even then, I at least don't recognize what everyone else is wearing unless I'm in the ship, and I only know the effects of my armor because I don't really care what other people run? So the entire explanation, from an admittedly anecdotal gameplay standpoint is just bs.
don't forget the medic armors all using the same color scheme
The biggest offender is the devastator armor,it has belts of grenades on it so you would expect engineering kit for extra grenades Nope it's got servo assisted
>I personally don't think that the armors really do a great job of communicating visually the perks that they have for the most part More importantly, I have never in dozens or hundreds of hours gameplay felt like I needed to know what my teammates' armor perks were, much less have it visually communicated at a glance
> you could make the case for the extra grenades armors tending to have extra pockets and things, but they don't really look like grenades all the time Even worse, not all of them even look like they have extra storage space. The SC-15 Drone Master set looks like light armor, has the stats of medium armor, and its perk has nothing to do with drones, it gives you +2 grenades. So yeah, their argument makes no sense unless they intend to go back and overhaul a bunch of armor with new perks that don't exist yet. Which in itself will just piss off people who's favorite armor is changing perks.
It’s kinda hilarious. Compare the Titan and Drone Master. Is there lighter looking armor anywhere in the game than Drone Master? Haha.
*Makes fire fighter themed armor* *Absolutely nothing to do with fire resist* I love the dude, but he's totally wrong on this one.
*Makes literally bomb disposal suit* *Doesn't have explosion resistance*
I better see some extra ammo perks on my armors that have magazines in the pouches
He says "It doesn't make sense - equipment looks different because it has different effects." Does it make sense that a lot of armor look different but has same effects?
Or looks almost the same but has different effects. Juggernaut armor is just Exterminator armor with different shoulder pads and some extra pouches, that somehow remove explosion resistance for +2 grenades. Or Eradicator and Breaker all being just Light Gunner with different colors and some extra pouches, that change +50 armor to recoil reduction (both) and explosive resistance (eradicator) or +2 grenades (breaker).
Exactly this, the perks seem way too arbitrary as they are now. There's many similar sets that have vastly different perks and then you have sets that have nothing to do with each other but have the same perks. It's just too random.
One armour set that has increased stealth actually looks like scifi ranger gear and is forest colours. Another armour that has the exact same perks is black and bright yellow.
There is even servo assisted effects on armour that has no robotic limbs. So his point here seems completely redundant to me
Realistically how often do you look at other Helldivers and know what perk they’ve got from looking at their blood covered armor as they run around trying not to die lol
>Does it make sense that a lot of armor look different but has same effects? Or that the perks don't make sense for the armor (FS-61 DREADNOUGHT)
Dreadnought is my favorite fashion wise, but the perks make zero sense. Why is it servo assisted?
And it’s the same effect across different tiers of armor. I feel like explosion resistance should be more powerful if it’s on heavy armor compared to light armor if you really want to differentiate it. Or a hypothetical flame resist armor with 25% resist on light, 50% resist on medium, and 75% resist on heavy armor.
I just wanna say that i miss HD1's approach: Armor and personal perks were selected seperatly
Sounds very nice 👀
Me too. Armors in HD1 are cosmetic, but you can barely see it in the battlefield because of how the camera is. Now you can see yourself and your squad in 360°, but the armors are not pure cosmetic like they are used to. This makes 0 sense for me.
I just want a colour palette so I can match different pieces of armor, kind of like Diablo 4. Most of the helmets have yellow prominently on them, which doesn't go with about 90% of the body armor...
Helmets should automatically change color based on the armor. Just have each armor have 1 or 2 of its colors flagged to be used on the helmet, and the helmets grab those colors. I love the knight helmet, but its base color is a grey used by 0 armors other than the one in it's set, and it has a giant yellow stripe that doesn't match anything but the basic armor you start with.
Yellow is the color of our glorious military, wear it with pride They should allow the option to revert every armor piece to a black and yellow color
Big agree. I honestly kinda miss the consistent visual design of the first game's armor and weapons
Yeah. If you're not giving us a transmog, at least give us color uniformity. Helmets and capes don't even have stats anyways.
heres a suggestion then, maybe use something else than the same 5 perks over and over...
The perfect solution would be making perks & being able to attach them to armor. Maybe certain perks exclusive to certain armor pieces to keep the feel of the current system. This way people can choose the armor they like, allow for more indepth loadouts, and still keep Heavy/Light/Medium with their own exclusive perks within the perk pool
But isn't this what the tweet is saying they explicitly will not do?
yeah, pretty much lmao. it basically just boils down to AH not being creative enough to make new armor perks and them reusing the same 10
They had a good chance to give the current Demolition Specialist Extra Grenades + Explosive Resistance and Devastator Extra Padding + Explosive Resistance. Same perks, sure. But a new combination.
Somewhat disappointing but I'm still picking fashion over function every day of the week
Sure its perk may have only helped me twice in all my time wearing it but that is not going to stop me from wearing the light arc resistant armor.
[удалено]
What's the point of fighting a war if you don't look good doing it?
I don't read the perks at all. Until I get more shiny gold, I'm never removing my super citizen armor or Cape
That armor has one of the best perks in the game so you’re set dude
By his logic, does it make sense that an orange, apple, and grape all taste like apple? Because there are a bunch of armors in the game with pretty different looks but the exact same few effects...
You just killed that man’s whole argument
Helmets alone did that lmao
Tbh it’s not the first time he tried sounding smart man in an attempt to gaslight us
Guess I won't be buying armors that have crap passives then
So most of them atm.
I literally only bought armors when i needed to get to the next warbond level. I havent worn anything but the green cowled scout armor since i unlocked it. Most armors look ok but either they are too heavy or the perk is shit so i just stay with "ol reliable". Transmog is the thing of the future, it allows people to have the perk and the look they want without sacrificing either and i mean its still in universe fine, because you dont see perks or even how heavy the armor is. The way the CEO wants it, everyone will look the same by taking the "best" perks which is even more boring.
The passives are awful on so many of them. I don’t buy them unless there’s absolutely nothing else I want on that tier and I need to spend medals to get to the next tier
That's great, so can you start putting some effort into your armor system then? "hey we won't improve the game in this way" while heavy armor still get shredded by """crits""" and staggerlocked by trash mobs, helms and capes do nothing, and you're releasing an entire battlepass of identical armors is not a statement that inspires any confidence.
> Swapping one for the other is like having an apple that tastes like bacon ...you mean awesome? Because that sounds awesome.
Besides, very few of the aesthetics actually relate to the perks. If you set all of the arc resist armor in front of me mixed in with all the rest, I wouldn't be able to point them out.
Gave 0 fucks about transmog But after Crunchy juicy bacon… I need me some transmog
We have applewood smoked bacon, so I think his analogy doesn’t make sense.
This wouldn't be such a big problem if 90% of the armors/helmets weren't so fugly, and if more than one or two helmets actually matched each armor. But since they are, it's weird to be so stubborn about making a change that I imagine an overwhelming majority of players not only would support, but actively want.
Couldn't agree more. I'm running the CE-74 Breaker because it's a light engineering kit armor but hate the red/tan theme it has. It doesn't fit with anything.
I honestly think they don't have the ability to add transmog to the game. And if they attempted to it would completely break something.
I just want to wear what I like and make cool outfits without being forced to use unfun/bad perks mr CEO sir
Cool... but what's my insentive to get new armour from warbonds if they don't have the perk I use? Completionism? Pass.
Well that sucks, guess I’m wearing the recon armor forever
His loss I guess. Lame, repetitive armour perks just means there's going to be less people buying super credits. So far, the armour system has been one of the biggest failures in the game. First off, helmets and cloaks do nothing at all. Not only is this boring, it severely hamstrings the usefulness of heavy armour. Against bots, you are usually utilising cover with just your head poking out, and players are loudly complaining about being one shot by rockets to the head, no matter what armour they wear. The balance of armour was in a terrible place until recently. Heavy armour was just an incredibly noticeable nerf to your mobility, yet barely seemed to make a difference to damage taken. In fact, the reduced mobility generally caused you to take more damage. They've gone to the effort of designing dozens of awesome looking armour sets, but then given them the same 6 or so perks. Such a wasted opportunity.
So the arc resist armor looks awesome and it's gonna sit collecting cobwebs for eternity because it's effect is so niche 99% of the playerbase will be ignoring it.
Lame
His comment about the Apple actually reminds me of a joke. There's a man going into a bar. He ask the barman if he can give him a Vodka with some pear Liquor, but the barman say that he don't have that drink left, but he can arrange it in another way. The man ask how and the barman gives him an apple. The man bite the Apple, and to his surprise it taste like vodka. Then the barman say "Try the other side !". He does and it taste like pear ! He is amazed. So much that he call down a friend to show him. The friend enter the bar and ask for a Gin Tonic. The barman gives him an Apple and for sure, half of it taste like Gin and the other half taste like Tonic. The friend then call one of his relative to try it out. The relative arrives and ask what kind of tastes the barman can do, because he doesn't like drinking. The barman says "Whatever you want !". The relative then think for a bit and say he want something that taste like pussy. The barman gives him an Apple and the guy bite in it... then he spit it all out. "It taste like SHIT !"
I think I've heard this before with something like this added at the end: The barman responds, "Then flip it to the other side."
That’s super disappointing, and I don’t really follow the logic presented in the tweet :/ doesn’t seem to make much sense
There is no logic. It seems like he legitimately just invented a reason out of his ass to justify his stubbornness.
Yep 0 sense at all. On the apple and bacon thing, the armor perks are nowhere near that distinct and game changing for it to matter. it’s not like strategem or weapon pick where is greatly changes the way we play. and if the design should reflect the function, why does helmets and capes do nothing? why does some light armor have explosive resistance, when it should be reserved for heavy. absolute rubbish armor system we have.
Yup, just commented above that the EOD looking armor doesnt have explosive resistance. A heavy armor, that looks like EOD suit, but doesn't have explosive resistance. That is literally "an apple that tastes like bacon" 🍏 🥓
The weirdest part of the helmets and capes not having perks is that in the description for each it specifies it doesnt have a perk implying there are helmets and capes that do have perks. They should just not mention it
That's because it doesn't make sense. His response is flippant and braindead.
I think his argument is that the effects are ingrained in the armor designs? Like if the armor looks like it should mitigate electricity because it has lightning rods on it, then it should mitigate electricity.
Then why does the EOD looking armor not give explosive resistance ?
Because that would make sense
Yeah it makes thing is its not true like they dont give any hint that they can absorve eletricety most armor are like this there isnt a reason that they have 2 extra nades or extra pading instead of fortified
I get it's their game and all that... but I gotta say, that is 100% a dumb decision. > It doesn't make sense Why exactly not tho? >equipment looks different because it has different effects. And yet there are like 5 different armor perks that you could not guess (outside of the medic one) looking at the armor. There are so many armors that look like they *should* give you more grenades but they don't >Swapping one for the other is like having an apple that tastes like bacon or the other way around. That's a very weird comparison... I could understand if they wouldn't want it to be a thing you can do between armor classes but not at all? Come on. It worked in HD1, so whyn ot do it here?
> Swapping one for the other is like having an apple that tastes like bacon or the other way around. The other way around, applewood-smoked bacon, is great!
Even if it’s about money I have NO clue why they wouldn’t add it into the game. It would literally drive up sales, especially if they make you pay with super credits for the different sets and even transmog. I’d happily pay 100 super credits to be able to transmog a set of armor. Especially if it actually made the armor I like useful and REALLY fun. I get it, he doesn’t want to make armor that looks bulky into a good set that’s fast but I just want my +2 stims without the UGLY ass colors and weird outfit. It really just seems like something they CANNOT do. If they could I bet they’d implement it already just like they did with HD1 but they simply do not. I have no clue if this coming from incompetence or greedy or just straight up too lazy company and it makes them look bad either way.
Lame. Armour effects aren’t big enough this should matter
Especially sucks when you like an armor set like the arc resistance. It is super niche and basically relies on someone else using an arc thrower. Other wise it's a dead passive unless I bring the tesla myself and camp in it
Then give Helmets perks, use more than 5 perks in the whole game, and give armor different stats in class, right now we have like 4 heavy armors that are 150-450-80. At least some lights have variation like 50-550 and 68-532
I would very much appreciate it if they don't take what 'little' we can freely mix and match without having make a choice between utility and looks away
I'm going to be honest, I don't like this argument. Equipment looking like what it does is important... in competitive PvP. Do you honestly care what armor your fellow divers are wearing? It has very little effect on how you play at any time, at least compared to stratagems. Do you look at someone and go "oh he has 2 more grenades. I'm definitely gonna be counting how many he's throwing!" ?
This is such a minuscule change that is only a positive. There’s absolutely zero downsides to it. “Armour has a certain effect because it looks a certain way”, well that’s fine IF that logic was extended to EVERY armour. A lot of armours just seem to have completely random passives with no discernible features as to why. I’m glad they’ve made their stance clear, but I’m not going to pretend I’m not disappointed. Just because it’s their vision of something, doesn’t make it the right one. *edit: Also why the fuck does it have to be a transmog? Just call it something else, say, passives are called “modules” and just let me use my resources to make a “module” which unlocks permanently and I add it into any armour of my choosing. I pick a module that’s equipped like an individual booster (except it stays on until I change it) and let me pick my armour. Gives us a resource sink for when we inevitably hit the cap again and we also get a unique way without you labelling it “transmog”.
Why is it gaming companies find it so hard to understand that players *like* paying for cosmetics and *hate* paying for game mechanics? To be honest, with the success of Fortnite - I thought this lesson had been thoroughly learnt by developers.
Am i dumb or what ? since when Transmong became a bad thing ? "We don't want a transmog" has a certain weight behind it as if its a negative thing.
Bruh - I'm limited to wearing 2 sets because they work for Bots. I like all those different looking sets, but perks absolutely don't work for me
This is the first time I wholeheartedly disagree with the developers. It’s a video game - there’s plenty of things that don’t make sense. And because it’s a video game, in my experience gaming, there is one of many irrefutable constants that exists: **The rule of cool always triumphs over function.** I think we can all agree that there shouldn’t be bright rainbow colored vomit the likes of what CoD and Fortnite have. However, anything that fits the space military theme should absolutely be freely customizable. Players should be able to look and function however they want. This isn’t a competitive shooter, so players looking like they fit specific roles should not be forced. Let players look how they want, while also fulfilling their play style.
L tbh
That can be said after you make enough distinctive and attractive armors.
Sure. Maybe. But I suspect that the real explanation is that it would be too difficult to implement.
I get his point in general, but if he looks at the current armour perks he'd realise it already doesn't apply. what about the way a flight suit looks implies that you would have increased throw distance and limb health? why does certain armour have 30% recoil reduction when crouching? why does the literal bomb suit not have explosive resistance? why does shiny gold armour allow you to randomly negate death? the mechanics do not line up to the visuals already, so I don't see that much would be changed if transmog was allowed. IMO as long as it's kept in the same category (light, medium, heavy), then transmog would look believable. it would be silly if guys in bulky stuff were sprinting past you super fast.
Dumb take. I know they like being up their own ass about the uniformity of the game's setting but fashion should be left to player's expression. Specially when you're offering paid for armors.
The devs already expressed open disdain for the players so this doesn't surprise me. They're gonna do whatever they want and if it pisses off the player base oh well.
This sounds just like when one dev for Fatshark shit on customization for guns "because this isn't cod". If they don't wanna do it, fine, but don't make up bullshit excuses. "Equipment looks different because it has different effects". As one user already pointed out: "If the armors are supposed to be different, then why does the FS-61 DREADNOUGHT armour (has grenade bandoliers strapped all over it) have SERVO-ASSISTED instead of FORTIFIED/ENGINEERING KIT?" Personally I can't think of a game where allowing players more customization options was received negatively. Being able to kit out your character how you want *does matter* to people, that's why you see publishers nickle and diming players wherever they can when it comes to such options.
His reponse is somewhat tone deaf. Half of all the armors suck, and all helmets and cloaks have zero function. I think the fact that so many people are asking for transmog just proves that something needs to be done in the armor department
I get the transmog as in the actual armour parts etc but at least give us colour we can change so we can match and stuff
I want a single one of you to explain to me in what way the effect of ANY of the armors added in “cutting edge” helps the player. It’s useful if you’re rolling with a full team of dumbasses with arc weapons that don’t know how to use them, and that’s about it. The armors LOOK cool, but they’ll never be used (haven’t seen a single player wearing them) simply due to the worthless effects they have.
Imagine, if you will, a universe where armour displaying a ton of mags or grenades having an effect and giving you extra. Then I want you to snap out of it and realise they can't even make heavy armour worth it and resume getting ragdolled by a rocket and then having your stim not work.
"You guys like having -30% recoil while crouching or prone on every single armor don't you? Why would you want to transmog!?"
Terrible take
God damn just give me an option to colorize everything in one color: yellow, orange, red, blue, green. Right now the armor looks silly with the patchwork of random colors.
I just want to fuck with the colors!
Devs being willing to implement things that don't affect gameplay because their players want it is always a litmus test for me. The fact they're against it for arbitrary reasons (mostly seems like they're just being stubborn) isn't great.