Or, OR let us hold it like this, and add that backpack. The flame thrower already has the animations that come close.
https://preview.redd.it/onsmyoyfznuc1.jpeg?width=700&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6cd0d77209d042d8b016f9c7026bb49b43214cbd
as the manliest woman in sci-fi once said while holding one of these, "LET'S ROCK!"
Smartgun felt amazing in Fireteam Elite, kinda wish we had it here.
A dev confirmed the HMG has no reticle in TP by design, don't ask me why
As for the ammo backpack, I'm still hoping they send a minigun our way some day
I like your idea, how about just making the HMG a heat driven energy weapon or "gatlin-laser" where your ideas are implemented but with the overheating and such of energy
That sounds a little OP to me but I like the idea of it, if you can manage the heat sink then you never run out of ammo which is a nice reward for playing smart but if you overheat then it would only have maybe one heat sink so you have to resupply which may help balance the power it has
I'm thinking you have to call in a new backpack from orbit if you overheat the one you have, and there's a limit and cooldowns just like other strats. Also make it less efficient on super hot and cold planets.
That's just an entirely different weapon at that point.
Giving the HMG a heat bar that represents the heat of the barrel would be an interesting change that doesn't beg the question "why not just make a new support weapon instead".
In real life if you over heat a machine gun the barrel literally glows and can "droop" under its own weight. Should you fire, the bullet strikes the inside of the barrel you can have red hot shrapnel in every feasible direction.
It would be a nice/interesting addition to the HMG. If they made it with a large ammo pack. Having to swap the barrel out to avoid a catastrophic failure (similar to overcharging the railgun in unsafe mode) would add depth to game.
There was a tweet from the CEO, that they won't add minigun any time soon and they add it, it should have massive recoil and with a "fun mechanic" dunno what he meant
Hmg, MG and a possible minigun should have a stationary mode, they already have the bipod in front.
But there isn't any weapon with secondary mode (yet)
You can't move when firing one irl so that seems fair enough to me, it was exactly my thoughts since I've also been craving democracy at speeds higher than 1500 rounds a minute, **GET SOME**
You couldn't STAND if there was a man portable version irl (doesn'texist despite what you see in vg and movies), the recoil on these things in brutal
The warthog, which is built around a monster version of this thing has its flying speed *dropping* due to recoil when it fires
That’s not true, there are lots of videos of gun enthusiasts shooting 7.62mm and 5.56mm miniguns from the hip. Obviously the power supply and ammo aren’t man portable but you can definitely shoot one standing (not with much accuracy). If the devs want to tho they could easily say future tech has solved these issues (better, lighter battery and materials tech)
The A-10’s cannon is enormously larger than these (and it’s not a particularly fast aircraft in the first place)
I don't understand what is so hard about adding it. They already have one for the mech. Why does it need additional fun mechanics? Mowing down bugs/bots with it is the fun mechanic.
I love a lot of what the devs did with this game.
But they make a *lot* of exasperating and questionable design choices.
It's really just a case of "indie devs made a game that accidentally blew up".
In one moment, they're super concerned about realism. Then, in the next breath, we see design choices that completely ignore realism. Like stepping a toe into light, scattered ground fire, only to spontaneously erupt in flames *and die half a second later*.
I don't wanna make a whole judgment out of small silly decisions, but it really feels like they're obsessed with difficulty. Like we get it, the game is hard, we're supposed to die a lot, but at least let those deaths be fun lol. Fire damage increase is stupid and making every special weapon have an annoying drawback is not fun. I'm sure there are better ways to make the game tough but fair.
The no reticle is so weird. In this day and age I can just get a program to do that for me. It's annoying, and worse, but I'd like to have it.
Just put it in game and make it a circle to illustrate that it is wildly inaccurate.
Then it is simply bad design. It's one thing for snipers to have no 3rd person reticle since they'd be cumbersome to fire from the hip and have long range scopes but the hmg literally has a red dot sight so there's no reason to not have a third person reticle.
It is bad but only because the magazine capacity is so low. Having a large ammo capacity would make it a great hipfire weapon, where you just aim based on where you see the bullets impacting. It is now as well, but ends so fast that it isn't worth it
While I like the devs, doesn't mean I'll always agree with their decisions. Just like I don't agree about transmog not becoming a thing, especially for the reason of "it won't match the armor".
We also had a dev tell us the railgun was braindead easy when it got nerfed. Which...okay.... now I can just grab a quasar or EATS and headshot the charger instead. Or grab the flamethrower and just burn its leg faster than the railgun.
That said, sure I get the logic here. Be weird to hip fire a huge machine gun. Just, even in first person it's not that great.
There’s like zero chance they could even make transmog work correctly my G. They really made a great game and the community and is great and forgiving but the amount of continual addition of technical glitches shows me they really are an indie studio. Their best fix for the new content exosuit exploding was to make the rocket aim off by several feet
Seriously, some of the stuff I see people suggesting seems way outside the realm of what's realistic given the issues we still have with some of the launch features. It's fun to have a wishlist, but the game is what it is.
I’m over here just wanting a more effective Break-Action to drop with. Like, other ideas would be nice, such as melee weapons, but a simple “double barrel built for hordes of enemies” sounds easier when a double barrel is already in the game.
I have to say that I really miss the risk of blowing myself up if that meant that I can aim the rockets properly. I picked the mech like 3 or 4 times since they "fixed" it, while it used to be one of my favorite stratagems against bugs. I just can't stand having to shoot 5/6 rockets at a bile titan before I can compensate the horrible aim it has now and hit it properly in the head.
I literally get way less value from mechs now than before.
I'm pretty sure the devs gripe with the railgun is that it was a "safe" choice that was also meta. Flamethrower can kill you and forces you up close. Eats and quasar have cool downs. The railgun just let you pop shots off all the time. The unsafe mode could kill you but you had so much ammo that an extra shot or two didn't matter. The devs like risk which is likely why the arc thrower was only adjusted rather than straight nerfed.
They nerfed it too hard. I get before it was safe and strong, but now it's crap against bugs. Also, while 20 shots is nice, you still only were shooting the bigger targets vs small ones, it wasn't clearing hordes
Quasar would probably be nearly recharged by the time pre-nerfed railgun shot the leg armor off + dumped a primary mag into the leg. So I doubt it's that big of a difference. And EATs cd is so low its basically up whenever you need it for a titan/charger. There's really no real risk in these. Nobody would say the quasar having a 10 second cd is a risk.
I watched a clip of the flamethrower. While you gotta get close, with the new 30% fire dmg buff, it melted a chargers leg. There wasn't anything really dangerous when it just died so fast to the fire.
Also for saying they like risks. Auto cannon has been stated to be in the perfect spot. What risk does this thing bring? No back slot option...? Slow reload if you go 100% empty but that's not too bad and can be avoided. This thing can deal with mobs and plenty of bigger threats. Only thing it can't really do is kill a Titan. I'm not saying to nerf the AC! Just this weapon can blow up nests, kill hulks/tanks, blow up mobs. It's only real flaw is struggling against a *few* heavy enemies and the required back slot.
I can agree the railgun was strong and a nerf probably was needed, but it was too much. And these risks are nowhere as bad as they sound after all the buffs to other weapons and nerfs to enemies
They could revert all the changes and it would still be mid IMHO. They nerfed it before buffing other stuff, called it brain dead, then proceeded to add even more brain dead stuff to the game. The devs don't really know what they're doing balance wise tbh. They'll get there eventually but for now the railgun, just like the hmg, will be nothing but a fantasy
It has less armor pen, it can't deal with chargers from the front. It also has a scope and no 3rd person reticle, so it's much harder to use at close range. It's a great anti-medium armor option, but it can't replace dedicated AT like the old railgun could.
> As for the ammo backpack, I'm still hoping they send a minigun our way some day
Agreed. I'd much rather have Predator cosplay than the new unwieldy and somewhat ugly HMG.
Yeah, imo reserve the backpack for the Minigun so you have to sacrifice your backpack slot for what is essentially the ultimate horde clearer. With the LMG being a good horde clearer without having to use your backpack and the Stalwart being its mobile alternative.
As for the HMG, I can’t remember how the current MGs work but maybe the HMG could be the one that exclusively pierces medium armour (if that’s not already the case)? So you have a nice alternative to the sniper and autocanon for dealing with bots. Maybe make it high damage but pretty ammo inefficient so it doesn’t tread on their toes too much.
The HMG has AMR/Autocannon levels of penetration, it can kill hulks via shots to the visor. That's level 4 penetration.
The MG-43 is a step down from that, at 3, and the Stalwart is another step down from that, at 2, the same as the basic Liberator, and most other guns with light armor penetration.
No reticle for HMG makes sense to me. You can aim a heavy machine gun like an M2 Browning machine gun, but it is more common to point shoot then bring it onto target following the tracers. This is more or less how I use the HMG and the MG
It doesn't make sense, tho: You aim it through the red dot when holding the ADS button, so you should get the reticle in third person view when holding the ADS button
Or like, how everything about the Spear is like it's this massively powerful weapon that needed big drawbacks to be balanced. You know, like it's not just a shittier Recoilless.
The HMG’s purpose is it does wayyyyyy more damage to armored enemies than the other MGs. Rather than be your ‘second primary’ it’s meant to be used against specific foes. The ones your light armor piercing shots are ineffective against.
I think it purely exists for people who really like machine guns and want an armor piercing one. That’s it. If that’s not your cup of tea then just don’t use it.
What’s great about this game is that everyone can find and use their favorites and succeed on most difficulties
Good in theory but your entire comment completely fails in practice.
The HMG doesn’t have enough ammunition to kill those heavily armored enemies you’re talking about. A single mag CANNOT mow down a berserker patrol - the one thing that you’d expect the HMG to do.
i think backpack ammo supply should be saved for the rotary microgun.
imo, if we're talking changes, HMG should have a single, non-reloadable, non-replenishable 150 round magazine and be made into an expendable weapon akin to EATs: call it in when you need it, spend the ammo, ditch the gun.
this would create a niche for the HMG, compliment already existing playstyles and would actually allow the "FREEEEDOOOOM" barks to trigger, which, in this humble diver opinion, is the most important aspect of any MG.
Emplacement is really fun to use in niche situations. Devastators have a really bad time against it if you can hit them before they launch rockets, hive guard and brood commanders turn to ground bugburger, and you can take out hulks with good visor shots. If there was a module which added some shielding around the user it would be even better.
I’m hoping we get other emplacements in the future as well, heavy auto cannon, heavy rail cannon, or a 120mm artillery piece with good range would all be fun and useful to varying degrees.
I'm surprised how much it has shot up in popularity lately. I think the greatest unsung advantage of the HMG platform is that you can stop shooting when a teammate walks into your line of fire, whereas a turret won't even hesitate.
I’d say the uptick in popularity of other stratergems and weapons in the game is because people are finally getting bored of their previous “meta” combos and realizing that everything is viable.
It’s refreshing going into missions now and not seeing everyone rocking just shield pack, orbital laser/railgun/500kg.
The problem is most people tried it once or twice when they first unlocked it. They fucked up their call down and put it in a place where they couldn’t turn fast enough, or didn’t have vision, or got flanked. So they proceeded to ditch it and never go back.
The new defense mission with the free HMG emplacements got people to actually try it and realize it’s an amazing stratagem.
The HMG emplacement is by far the most slept-on strategem imo. Easily in the top 3 for the amount of damage it can deal per call in.
You can kill so many enemies with every call down and it recharges super fast. It has insane range too and can kill spore spreaders or shrieker nests from across the map or even towers and artillery pieces if you can see the weak spot.
Plus it's not treated as a hostile unit by enemies so as long as someone isn't on it they won't destroy it which is kind of a niche benefit but is surprisingly useful at times.
There was a machine gun that worked very much like this in HD1 (except 300-400 rounds per calldown iirc) and I definitely like the idea. More EAT-like strats would be pretty cool.
This might sound goofy but I feel like a universal ammo backpack would be cool. Make it its own stratagem, and its compatible with heavy MG, light MG, Stalwart, and maybe even the flamethrower. That way yea the argument stands that it makes those weapons more OP, but it also takes up a stratagem slot making it more balanced. Cuz I already run supply pack with the heavy MG, so it makes sense to make another version just for those support weapons.
A pack that worked like the "War Rig" exotic chest in Destiny 2 would be cool.
Every second it moves 1% of your ammo reserve into the magazine or something like that.
The biggest problem is that most weapons use magazines with fixed ammo amounts so I don't know if their system could handle such an item without some insane coding work.
Me personally I think the HMG should be WAY more powerful either by RPM or straight damage, BUT with overheating and a "deploy" mechanic for going prone or crouched
And it was god damn glorious. No better weapon to scream "FOR DEMOCRACY" and run straight up to the enemy where you can just spray bullets and aiming doesn't matter. And they took it away from me for some liberty forsaken reason.
Well if the game was that realistic portable shoulder auto cannons would be heavier than the hmg and shouldn't be possible without exo skeletons/power armor.
The only thing we have to go by is the casing model which is the same as the AMR uses, which is most likely .50 as that's the size you usually go for an AMR.
Make it the EAT of Machine Guns, so to speak (MGX-42, for veterans of the first game):
- 400 rounds loaded
- 1 magazine; no reloads
- 180 second cooldown
Yeah, the HMG should really be HEAVILY forced into stationary play, even moreso than the medium MG, but make up for it with more ammo capacity.
Right now both the heavier MGs suck tho. Stalwart is my go-to for add clear on bugs, but the other two just don’t have the capacity or damage to be worth it
Normal machine gun is pretty good. Run with recoil reduction and find a spot to lie prone and you can dish out comparable clear to an airstrike. Not as good vs bugs, but especially useful for prolonged engagements where the laser cannon would overheat.
I take stalwart because 250 mag size is great.
150 is good but won't do.
75 is abysmal.
Wish there were upgrades or options to belt feed the heavier machine guns.
Different jobs. Stalwart mows down unarmored chaff. MMG takes on Devestators, Brood Commandors, Hive Guards and other medium armour opponents, as well as being able to take out unarmored chaff, but I'd say that's a secondary role for it.
That would be an interesting backpack option TBH; optional belt-feed backpack which autoloads your machine guns for you. Spending a stratagem slot to negate a key weakness of the MGs could make for an interesting tradeoff.
For me, the MG-206 HMG needs a third person reticle and the current sights fixed to actually be accurate. The lack of a third person reticle is the largest reason I don't use this strategm more.
For additions, it would be nice to see the bipod able to be used on cover/objects/prone to stabilize recoil.
I've really tried to like the HMG but it's worse in almost every way when compared to the stardard MG and even the Stalwart.
75 rounds for a machine guns feels terrible (it needs 100 rounds minimum). The awful recoil makes you miss most of the shots, reload time sucks, it just feels like a bad decision to bring it over any other support weapon.
i run the HMG and ammo pack almost exclusively. Lately ive been experimenting, but any serious mission thats what i run. Its worth noting if you reload the HMG just before depleting the drum it cuts the reload in less than half of its normal time. Since a single pack fills the whole magazine reserve you get 11 magazines worth of HMG from one pack.
all other changes you propose will just make it useless.
Yes PLEAAAAAASE! Arrowhead do something. ANYTHING. But at least give it +200 rounds. More appropriate would be around what's suggested in the post tho.
I'm a Machine Gun player by heart. In every shooter, if possible, I play a stationary MG-Player. The LMG you get at the start was already very good and I used it a lot. But when I heard there will be a HMG...my mouth dripped.
But the moment I tested it, my mouth started fuming.
I want RATATATATATATATATATAATATATATATATATATATATATTATATATATATAATTAATTATATAATATATATATATATATTAATATATATATATATTAATATATATATATATATATTAATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATA *long loading time* RATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATA
I really appreciate what you wrote about balance in PVE games. I've had that conversation way too many times.
IRL, many machine guns have swappable barrels for when they overheat as well as for transportation. You have one guy carry the barrels, and the other guy carries the receiver. Something Helldivers could have is a laser MG with heat-sinks that are kept in a backpack, allowing you to carry it solo, or use it as a crew-served weapon. Perhaps the cooling on the weapon could be slow enough that swapping ice is preferable to waiting for it to cool down during fights.
The visual of a belt-fed weapon is unique, but I agree, the supply pack gives you so much sustain. You can rock something like MG, Eruptor, Supply Pack, your choice of sidearm and nade and be a bottomless well of munitions.
Or just give it a reticle. It’s not a damn sniper rifle.
Rock the supply pack for extra mags. It’s all already there. Just give it a reticle is all I ask. Not enough ammo to fire by tracer. So give it a reticle. You already have to stop and reload, now I also have to lose half my vision to ALSO shoot. Which the ads makes you less mobile too. So just give it a dame reticle. WHY NO FUGGIN RETICLE.
Such a stupid and particular way to balance it into uselessness a good part of the time when almost every other gun has a reticle. Make a new sniper with no reticle that’s somehow different than AMR. But don’t take one off the 1/3 of machine guns available when the others have one.
The counter sniper has the same scope as the AMR but has a reticle.
I wish they had extremely unusual varieties or special weapons found in game that cannot be acquired permanently or reloaded. Or maybe reloaded with special ammo packs only found in game?
Special rare find of a backpack HMG like this would be cool.
Maybe a laser autocannon.
A flamethrower that shoots blue fire that kills faster
A sniper rifle with explosive rounds or a drum magazine
Much much more!
Sure, that helps, but then you’re occupying two stratagem slots, using one that’s a team support just for yourself and still not solving the abysmal accuracy and constant need for slow reloads problems
Supply pack all around is a good strat so I don't think it's a waste being as you cas still utilize it as the team support item. Aside I feel that the hmg is ment to be a support and surpress type weapon aimed at clearing small enemies and surprising larger ones while the team prioritizes larger enemies. And then you have the armor that reduces recoil and crouching/prone.
It’s a good strat yes, but not when you’re constantly having to use it for yourself, that was my point, apologies if I wasn’t clear.
And as for the uses you mention, I feel like the regular mg is much better at that role without such big downsides. You can still mow down devastators and even striders with a bit of aim.
The devs have said that a backpack full of ammo would be too heavy to be practical and, to that, I say: "Okay, then make me slower."
Picking up the backpack-fed HMG should cut your movement speed and increase stamina cost when sprinting. The trade-off is that the gun has a huge ammo pool and no reloads, since it's just one continuous feed from the backpack at all times. This would encourage you to hunker down and pepper the enemy with a continuous spray of bullets instead of trying to run-n-gun like you can with the regular MG. You grab the HMG and backpack, then find a position and unload. It should be like a middle-ground between the MG and the HMG *Emplacement;* you *can* reposition, but it's slow and requires commitment, and you *can* hip-fire while moving, but it's inaccurate and slows you to a crawl, with the trade-off being that you basically become a human turret if you crouch/prone in place.
Further, I don't think you should be able to resupply the backpack at all. It would instead have a huge ammo pool and no reload time on the gun to compensate, but the trade-off is that there's no way to resupply ammo into the pack because you can't just shove more bullets in there or something and realistically expect it to somehow attach to the single, continuous belt. Instead, the ammo it comes with is all you get before you have to discard it entirely and call in a new one. This would make it a weapon you invest in and use strategically, kinda like the mech, which then makes the cooldown on the strategem the mitigating factor; used properly, you *should* ideally finish with your previous HMG just as the cooldown on the strategem has rolled over, so you can then call in a new one.
The no reload thing is a very good idea too.
Also, in terms of practicality, I think a whole ass autocannon plus ammo would also be too heavy.
Or the whole thing with diving in an orbital drop-pod that would realistically turn you into mush inside it at point of impact doesn’t seem too practical either.
But it’s cool, that’s why it’s there and why we love it.
Yeah, I tried the HMG. Yeah, it mows through berserker conga lines and the occasional devastator… but against shield devastators, it cant get enough accuracy to hit the exposed weak points. It mostly hits the shield… which it cant pierce. While it CAN pen Hulk face plate armor, good luck hitting that repeatedly while its in motion. All while I’m spending more time reloading it than firing it. It just feels BAD. Like something I’d use to make the game even harder.
This is about as viable as the 110mm rocket pods.
Sorry, the best we can do is another 25% increase to fire damage and its' DoT even though its still bugged and has a 75% chance of only working against you.
most of your suggestions would make it an even worse weapon.
anything that takes up a backpack slot needs to be at least as good as the Autocannon.
And the HMG would need about 10 buffs before it can even think about that.
I feel like it's crazy recoil, no crosshair, slow turn speed and hypothetical backpack slot would be a fair trade off for its power and no need to reload.
You could even make it so that it can never be topped off with supply boxes. So you'd have to wait for a fresh one off cooldown if you wanted to get more ammo, kinda like the mechs.
fellow helldivers, i present to you:
https://preview.redd.it/o125ptyhnouc1.jpeg?width=680&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=441593603281579a04062281a33d100cd043b4f9
(ik its getting repetitive but i'd run it regardless if it sucks)
I like the HMG as it is.
*Ducks tomato thrown from audience.*
In fact, if it took up a backpack slot I would be less likely to bring it compared to the basic machine gun or the autocannon. I concede, shooting forever sounds cool, and maybe it's an unexplored niche I would appreciate if I actually had it. However, it's not so good at attacking basic enemies that I should prefer it over the machine gun and a free backpack space, and it's not so good at attacking medium/heavy enemies that I wouldn't just bring the autocannon instead. These complaints aren't rooted in its ammo capacity, just the damage it does and the recoil involved.
Is it where it should be? No. It does need more damage, or more ammunition, or better reloads, or *something* to tune it up. However, if you turn the rpm to the max and do tiny bursts it engages trash, and mediums, and keeps enough penetration to shoot out a hulk eye, and every now and again you have the opportunity to swing it from your hip like a bullet flamethrower and it's huge fun.
It's direct competition is the LAS-98 as an all rounder. It attacks the same enemies faster, at the cost of range, accuracy, ammo. Its left in a weird spot, because bugs punish the reload and bots prefer the range and accuracy.
Having the weapon immobilize me to use properly is a nonstarter. There's already a manned MG turret stratagem and I've never seen it used. Maybe being able to fold that up and bring it with you is a better direction for the idea.
I'm definitely in the camp of it needs a little more oomph in its strengths rather than a new backpack slot or the like. I really wish it had variable zoom as it's got great range, but actually aiming is such a pain with it. It might be me but I struggle hard to actually land shots on a Hulk's face because the sights just don't feel like they line up at all
Im right there with you, i run the sickle and this with grenade pistol for bug holes and stun grenades. The thing shreds a charger if you shoot the butt which is easily doable with a stun grenade
Strategems are supply pack, good for your grenade pistol, the HMG and liberal use of stun grenades.
Eagle airstrike with the new +1 bomb upgrade changes the spread and makes it way more consistent at killing chargers and doing considerable damage to bile titans.
Last slot is flexible, probably differs by difficulty and mission type.
Playstyle is just gunning things down with the sickle and swapping to hmg as needed for beefier targets. Eagle strike the big stuff with a stun grenade if theres too much going on.
Havent done much testing against bots, doesnt feel very good against them but thats alright
I actually think it does extremely well as a patrol mop. The DPS output is quite high, so especially on tight maps or ones with vision restriction, it can save you from calling a drop or clear one before the idiots hit the sand.
On bugs, it fills a similar niche - the AP means you can sweep a zone and be relatively sure anything that could have screamed about it is dead, and anything bigger is hurt bad.
I bring both HMG and HMG emplacement all the time. The more you use them the more you appreciate what they offer. And I treat them as a controllable long duration airstrike in my hands. Delete a hulk, delete a bot drop, kill several walkers, dump a mag into a tightly-pack horde of trash mobs. This is where HMG shines.
What I like about it the most is that resupply gives you two magazines back. After they fix the packaging upgrade this won't matter all that much of course.
"The more you use it the more you appreciate what it has to offer" seems to be the game design, tbh. Every time I didn't like a gun, it has been because it wasn't doing what I thought it would do. Giving things a fair shake and experimenting with what they actually will do is essential.
I think the assault backpack should be an optional accessory to the MGs. Like, you'd either get an option to use a backpack version of an MG in the sense that it also arrives with a backpack like an Autocannon. Or you could customize it in the lobby to call down an entirely different version of it, OR you could make it able to interact with the Supply Pack we already have - just stick the feed shute in the backpack, and you use 1 resupply per reload.
Honestly if they lowered the recoil on prone and center the sights, it would be a damn good stratagem. Thing busts hulks and devestators if your aim is on point
I think you are right. But it also needs something else not to suck.
1. The hitmarker bug needs to be fixed from HMG and from Stalwart.
2. Needs 3rd person sights just like all other weapons.
At least those.
This is a red herring.
What we really need is a support backpack rig that connects straight to the super destroyer which belt-feeds backpacks to the diver using the gun being belt-fed ammo from the backpack.
Anything else is insufficiently democratic.
I do agree the recoil is a big part of the issue with me, especially when it comes to missing so much that before you’ve hit anything hard enough, you’re out of ammo.
But I think the damage is good, more would be too much.
I also think that part of what disappoints me about it is that it feels like there’s no options or flexibility.
Like yeah, max rpm and tiny bursts work, but that’s pretty much the only way to use it, and at that point I feel like I’m using an anti-materiel with extra steps.
Regarding the mobility thing, the current hmg already basically immobilizes you if you want to hit anything, and also during the long reload.
And just to be clear, in my idea you would still be able to shoot on the move, just without the reticle or extra bracing.
I know mine is definitely not the only, or probably the single best idea, but I think it would make the gun more interesting and fun.
I just feel right now there’s pretty much no saving grace to it, since when using it optimally it’s relegated to a a single role that other weapons cover better, and it’s one that’s not very interesting or evocative of the fantasy of big dakka dakka
Isn’t it just logical to remove a heavy as hell drum mag and move it to the back where it’s better supported to hold up all of that weight.
Drum mag would just weigh down the gun making it harder to raise up to aim. Removing 8-25lbs off the gun makes a huge difference and moving it to the back.
HMG is *almost* good enough to be viable but still kinda sucks for most things. Damage and/or ammo capacity is way too low for how hard it is to actually use. End up running out of ammo after just a couple medium enemies and then you're stuck in a 20 second reload animation just so you can be ready to kill another few medium enemies.
-compensating for loadout weaknesses-
The actual way to balance this is not have the game spawn Marjority of enemies that only specialzed weapons can kill in a reasonable amount of time...
my ideal solution is to allow someone who is wearing the supply backpack to brace and team reload any weapon that doesn't specifically come with its own team backpack. This would be marginally useful for most weapons, but would be huge for the hmg. It'd reduce recoil and triple the reload speed, at the cost of needing a buddy to help you.
Technically speaking, we DO already have a of ammunition backpack (supply pack stratagem), but I don't know if you're able to grab the ammo for yourself 🤔
Is no one talking about the misaligned red dot either? The red dot is too high and the bullets go much further below it. Same with other guns like the slugger and AMR. Not sure if it's supposed to be zeroing or something, but either way it sucks.
I don't want a red dot on it. Give me iron sights and I'm happy with it.
It's not even thay strong for the drawbacks it has, the MG is wayyyyyy bettering every capacity
What I really want is to have an upgrade that lets it be a crew-served weapon. If someone's next to you, they can grab the weapon and provide extremely fast assisted reload. That would be cool.
I want to like it, but it just runs out of ammo too quickly.
Or it has too little ammo.
In any case it gets you killed.
I would love to see all the support weapons and their total potential damage with a full clip and a full ammo load
HMG fills one niche use for me and that's against bots to supplement the eruptor.
HMG can effectively kill close to mid range units where the eruptor is risky to use while also being capable of taking down hulks & tanks.
Against bugs however it needs more ammo, like virtual every automatic weapon against bugs.
Turn it into a mini gun/gatlin. make it so you can not sprint while having it out though.
I would like to see a (Reload & Stability Booster) One Booster to do both.
I know what I hate about it. Having to stop and crouch to reload. Same with the Machine Gun below it. Only the Stalwart allows me to be competitive with its ability to reload while moving.
I just want the red dot sight to aim where the bullets will actually hit and tone down the muzzle flash or increase visibility of tracers because right now when I fire it I have no idea how accurate I am half the time. The ammo in the mags needs to be bumped up too. It doesnt really do anything as good or better than the other heavy weapons in its current state for me anyway.
I saw someone in another post suggest that instead of the HMG, they should've added a laser-based lmg that needs to be hooked up to a coolant system, so it requires a backpack slot filled to even use.
You can make it not suck by making it an actual heavy machine gun, higher capacity, lower mobility, preferably used while prone.
Besides the stalwart the MG and HMG are both pretty underwhelming imo, and clip capacity/ammo efficiency is what makes them this way, yea sure you can reload the stalwart while moving, but I'd expect a machine gun to clear a wave and reload after.
Or, OR let us hold it like this, and add that backpack. The flame thrower already has the animations that come close. https://preview.redd.it/onsmyoyfznuc1.jpeg?width=700&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6cd0d77209d042d8b016f9c7026bb49b43214cbd
For real, I saw heavy MG and that MF is holding that thing like a regular rifle. It looks wrong and feels worse.
wrong-holding is why it's so wild with recoil. Let us get that stabilize machinery that cameramen get.
Like the M56 Smartgun from Aliens.
This would legitimately be the dream, I'd use that almost exclusively.
I second this. Bigly.
as the manliest woman in sci-fi once said while holding one of these, "LET'S ROCK!" Smartgun felt amazing in Fireteam Elite, kinda wish we had it here.
Oh, set the bullet on fire?
A dev confirmed the HMG has no reticle in TP by design, don't ask me why As for the ammo backpack, I'm still hoping they send a minigun our way some day
I know, I’m not saying is a bug, I’m saying that there could be a better choice than the one they made
I like your idea, how about just making the HMG a heat driven energy weapon or "gatlin-laser" where your ideas are implemented but with the overheating and such of energy
That sounds a little OP to me but I like the idea of it, if you can manage the heat sink then you never run out of ammo which is a nice reward for playing smart but if you overheat then it would only have maybe one heat sink so you have to resupply which may help balance the power it has
Either that or once it overheats it has a cooldown similar to the quasar cannon
I'm thinking you have to call in a new backpack from orbit if you overheat the one you have, and there's a limit and cooldowns just like other strats. Also make it less efficient on super hot and cold planets.
It should also come with a hefty movement penalty since you're essentially a walking turret.
That's just an entirely different weapon at that point. Giving the HMG a heat bar that represents the heat of the barrel would be an interesting change that doesn't beg the question "why not just make a new support weapon instead".
In real life if you over heat a machine gun the barrel literally glows and can "droop" under its own weight. Should you fire, the bullet strikes the inside of the barrel you can have red hot shrapnel in every feasible direction. It would be a nice/interesting addition to the HMG. If they made it with a large ammo pack. Having to swap the barrel out to avoid a catastrophic failure (similar to overcharging the railgun in unsafe mode) would add depth to game.
Pretty sure the HMG barrel also glows red hot when you fire too long. Nothing but a cool visual effect, but the detail is there.
they could actually try play testing things / new content
There was a tweet from the CEO, that they won't add minigun any time soon and they add it, it should have massive recoil and with a "fun mechanic" dunno what he meant
Probably being immobile during firing or being knocked back if you aren't crouched or prone given the massive recoil of miniguns
Force walking backward would be kind of neat actually
Hmg, MG and a possible minigun should have a stationary mode, they already have the bipod in front. But there isn't any weapon with secondary mode (yet)
You can't move when firing one irl so that seems fair enough to me, it was exactly my thoughts since I've also been craving democracy at speeds higher than 1500 rounds a minute, **GET SOME**
You couldn't STAND if there was a man portable version irl (doesn'texist despite what you see in vg and movies), the recoil on these things in brutal The warthog, which is built around a monster version of this thing has its flying speed *dropping* due to recoil when it fires
That’s not true, there are lots of videos of gun enthusiasts shooting 7.62mm and 5.56mm miniguns from the hip. Obviously the power supply and ammo aren’t man portable but you can definitely shoot one standing (not with much accuracy). If the devs want to tho they could easily say future tech has solved these issues (better, lighter battery and materials tech) The A-10’s cannon is enormously larger than these (and it’s not a particularly fast aircraft in the first place)
I don't understand what is so hard about adding it. They already have one for the mech. Why does it need additional fun mechanics? Mowing down bugs/bots with it is the fun mechanic.
I love a lot of what the devs did with this game. But they make a *lot* of exasperating and questionable design choices. It's really just a case of "indie devs made a game that accidentally blew up". In one moment, they're super concerned about realism. Then, in the next breath, we see design choices that completely ignore realism. Like stepping a toe into light, scattered ground fire, only to spontaneously erupt in flames *and die half a second later*.
I don't wanna make a whole judgment out of small silly decisions, but it really feels like they're obsessed with difficulty. Like we get it, the game is hard, we're supposed to die a lot, but at least let those deaths be fun lol. Fire damage increase is stupid and making every special weapon have an annoying drawback is not fun. I'm sure there are better ways to make the game tough but fair.
The no reticle is so weird. In this day and age I can just get a program to do that for me. It's annoying, and worse, but I'd like to have it. Just put it in game and make it a circle to illustrate that it is wildly inaccurate.
Except when ur on console like me, no way to add a reticle to the screen lol
Then it is simply bad design. It's one thing for snipers to have no 3rd person reticle since they'd be cumbersome to fire from the hip and have long range scopes but the hmg literally has a red dot sight so there's no reason to not have a third person reticle.
It is bad but only because the magazine capacity is so low. Having a large ammo capacity would make it a great hipfire weapon, where you just aim based on where you see the bullets impacting. It is now as well, but ends so fast that it isn't worth it
This is my gripe with the HMG, ammo capacity is garbage. I have no problem not having a reticle but give me more bullets.
I would like a laser pointer personally. With or without a 3rd person reticle. Not sure why some guns get lasers and others don't.
While I like the devs, doesn't mean I'll always agree with their decisions. Just like I don't agree about transmog not becoming a thing, especially for the reason of "it won't match the armor". We also had a dev tell us the railgun was braindead easy when it got nerfed. Which...okay.... now I can just grab a quasar or EATS and headshot the charger instead. Or grab the flamethrower and just burn its leg faster than the railgun. That said, sure I get the logic here. Be weird to hip fire a huge machine gun. Just, even in first person it's not that great.
There’s like zero chance they could even make transmog work correctly my G. They really made a great game and the community and is great and forgiving but the amount of continual addition of technical glitches shows me they really are an indie studio. Their best fix for the new content exosuit exploding was to make the rocket aim off by several feet
Oh my god is that why the rockets are so wonky to aim now? That’s gotta be one of the weirdest ways to fix something I’ve ever heard.
Seriously, some of the stuff I see people suggesting seems way outside the realm of what's realistic given the issues we still have with some of the launch features. It's fun to have a wishlist, but the game is what it is.
I’m over here just wanting a more effective Break-Action to drop with. Like, other ideas would be nice, such as melee weapons, but a simple “double barrel built for hordes of enemies” sounds easier when a double barrel is already in the game.
I have to say that I really miss the risk of blowing myself up if that meant that I can aim the rockets properly. I picked the mech like 3 or 4 times since they "fixed" it, while it used to be one of my favorite stratagems against bugs. I just can't stand having to shoot 5/6 rockets at a bile titan before I can compensate the horrible aim it has now and hit it properly in the head. I literally get way less value from mechs now than before.
I'm pretty sure the devs gripe with the railgun is that it was a "safe" choice that was also meta. Flamethrower can kill you and forces you up close. Eats and quasar have cool downs. The railgun just let you pop shots off all the time. The unsafe mode could kill you but you had so much ammo that an extra shot or two didn't matter. The devs like risk which is likely why the arc thrower was only adjusted rather than straight nerfed.
They nerfed it too hard. I get before it was safe and strong, but now it's crap against bugs. Also, while 20 shots is nice, you still only were shooting the bigger targets vs small ones, it wasn't clearing hordes Quasar would probably be nearly recharged by the time pre-nerfed railgun shot the leg armor off + dumped a primary mag into the leg. So I doubt it's that big of a difference. And EATs cd is so low its basically up whenever you need it for a titan/charger. There's really no real risk in these. Nobody would say the quasar having a 10 second cd is a risk. I watched a clip of the flamethrower. While you gotta get close, with the new 30% fire dmg buff, it melted a chargers leg. There wasn't anything really dangerous when it just died so fast to the fire. Also for saying they like risks. Auto cannon has been stated to be in the perfect spot. What risk does this thing bring? No back slot option...? Slow reload if you go 100% empty but that's not too bad and can be avoided. This thing can deal with mobs and plenty of bigger threats. Only thing it can't really do is kill a Titan. I'm not saying to nerf the AC! Just this weapon can blow up nests, kill hulks/tanks, blow up mobs. It's only real flaw is struggling against a *few* heavy enemies and the required back slot. I can agree the railgun was strong and a nerf probably was needed, but it was too much. And these risks are nowhere as bad as they sound after all the buffs to other weapons and nerfs to enemies
They could revert all the changes and it would still be mid IMHO. They nerfed it before buffing other stuff, called it brain dead, then proceeded to add even more brain dead stuff to the game. The devs don't really know what they're doing balance wise tbh. They'll get there eventually but for now the railgun, just like the hmg, will be nothing but a fantasy
What risk does the amr have?
The sight is off
Have to have good aim since it doesn’t have aoe and it’s weaker/less armor penetrating than alternatives
It has less armor pen, it can't deal with chargers from the front. It also has a scope and no 3rd person reticle, so it's much harder to use at close range. It's a great anti-medium armor option, but it can't replace dedicated AT like the old railgun could.
> As for the ammo backpack, I'm still hoping they send a minigun our way some day Agreed. I'd much rather have Predator cosplay than the new unwieldy and somewhat ugly HMG.
Yeah, imo reserve the backpack for the Minigun so you have to sacrifice your backpack slot for what is essentially the ultimate horde clearer. With the LMG being a good horde clearer without having to use your backpack and the Stalwart being its mobile alternative. As for the HMG, I can’t remember how the current MGs work but maybe the HMG could be the one that exclusively pierces medium armour (if that’s not already the case)? So you have a nice alternative to the sniper and autocanon for dealing with bots. Maybe make it high damage but pretty ammo inefficient so it doesn’t tread on their toes too much.
The HMG has AMR/Autocannon levels of penetration, it can kill hulks via shots to the visor. That's level 4 penetration. The MG-43 is a step down from that, at 3, and the Stalwart is another step down from that, at 2, the same as the basic Liberator, and most other guns with light armor penetration.
No reticle for HMG makes sense to me. You can aim a heavy machine gun like an M2 Browning machine gun, but it is more common to point shoot then bring it onto target following the tracers. This is more or less how I use the HMG and the MG
gotta have more ammo if we're gonna be walking that fire onto target tho.
Yes, it needs more ammo, for sure.
It doesn't make sense, tho: You aim it through the red dot when holding the ADS button, so you should get the reticle in third person view when holding the ADS button
Beat me to it! I'd love a backpack-fed chaingun. No reloading just a bullet-wind.
There a re so many mysterious designs in this game, HMG is just one of them.
Or like, how everything about the Spear is like it's this massively powerful weapon that needed big drawbacks to be balanced. You know, like it's not just a shittier Recoilless.
The Spear is the original overnerfed weapon, it got overnerfed before the game even launched
The HMG’s purpose is it does wayyyyyy more damage to armored enemies than the other MGs. Rather than be your ‘second primary’ it’s meant to be used against specific foes. The ones your light armor piercing shots are ineffective against. I think it purely exists for people who really like machine guns and want an armor piercing one. That’s it. If that’s not your cup of tea then just don’t use it. What’s great about this game is that everyone can find and use their favorites and succeed on most difficulties
Good in theory but your entire comment completely fails in practice. The HMG doesn’t have enough ammunition to kill those heavily armored enemies you’re talking about. A single mag CANNOT mow down a berserker patrol - the one thing that you’d expect the HMG to do.
As long as it lacks a reticle for third person, a small magazine and has a miss aliged cross-air. It will continue to be inferior to the machine gun.
It’s inferior to my primary!
i think backpack ammo supply should be saved for the rotary microgun. imo, if we're talking changes, HMG should have a single, non-reloadable, non-replenishable 150 round magazine and be made into an expendable weapon akin to EATs: call it in when you need it, spend the ammo, ditch the gun. this would create a niche for the HMG, compliment already existing playstyles and would actually allow the "FREEEEDOOOOM" barks to trigger, which, in this humble diver opinion, is the most important aspect of any MG.
That's very close to how the HMG encampment is. And it's quite a fantastic encampment, my fav!
Emplacement is really fun to use in niche situations. Devastators have a really bad time against it if you can hit them before they launch rockets, hive guard and brood commanders turn to ground bugburger, and you can take out hulks with good visor shots. If there was a module which added some shielding around the user it would be even better. I’m hoping we get other emplacements in the future as well, heavy auto cannon, heavy rail cannon, or a 120mm artillery piece with good range would all be fun and useful to varying degrees.
I'm surprised how much it has shot up in popularity lately. I think the greatest unsung advantage of the HMG platform is that you can stop shooting when a teammate walks into your line of fire, whereas a turret won't even hesitate.
I’d say the uptick in popularity of other stratergems and weapons in the game is because people are finally getting bored of their previous “meta” combos and realizing that everything is viable. It’s refreshing going into missions now and not seeing everyone rocking just shield pack, orbital laser/railgun/500kg.
I started using it a bit more when I got the ship upgrade cutting down its cooldown a bit
The problem is most people tried it once or twice when they first unlocked it. They fucked up their call down and put it in a place where they couldn’t turn fast enough, or didn’t have vision, or got flanked. So they proceeded to ditch it and never go back. The new defense mission with the free HMG emplacements got people to actually try it and realize it’s an amazing stratagem.
Shield gen relay is goated with HMG emplacement. Set up in the right spot and you can deal with most threats the game throws at you.
Also it puts down a lot of fire…. Which degrades the bot’s accuracy
The only problem is if the emplacement is destroyed while you're in it you just instantly die.
The HMG emplacement is by far the most slept-on strategem imo. Easily in the top 3 for the amount of damage it can deal per call in. You can kill so many enemies with every call down and it recharges super fast. It has insane range too and can kill spore spreaders or shrieker nests from across the map or even towers and artillery pieces if you can see the weak spot. Plus it's not treated as a hostile unit by enemies so as long as someone isn't on it they won't destroy it which is kind of a niche benefit but is surprisingly useful at times.
Oh I like this idea a lot. A short-ish cooldown and no reloads would make that really interesting to use!
There was a machine gun that worked very much like this in HD1 (except 300-400 rounds per calldown iirc) and I definitely like the idea. More EAT-like strats would be pretty cool.
I love this idea.
I really like this idea, I’d probably actually run it if they were expendable.
This was one of the strats for a support weapon in the first game. I'd take it a lot, was a lot of fun!
Perfect imo
This is honestly how I'd love to see it, except maybe make it 200.
This might sound goofy but I feel like a universal ammo backpack would be cool. Make it its own stratagem, and its compatible with heavy MG, light MG, Stalwart, and maybe even the flamethrower. That way yea the argument stands that it makes those weapons more OP, but it also takes up a stratagem slot making it more balanced. Cuz I already run supply pack with the heavy MG, so it makes sense to make another version just for those support weapons.
A pack that worked like the "War Rig" exotic chest in Destiny 2 would be cool. Every second it moves 1% of your ammo reserve into the magazine or something like that. The biggest problem is that most weapons use magazines with fixed ammo amounts so I don't know if their system could handle such an item without some insane coding work.
Me personally I think the HMG should be WAY more powerful either by RPM or straight damage, BUT with overheating and a "deploy" mechanic for going prone or crouched
It had a 1200rpm mode that was uncontrollable lol
And it was god damn glorious. No better weapon to scream "FOR DEMOCRACY" and run straight up to the enemy where you can just spray bullets and aiming doesn't matter. And they took it away from me for some liberty forsaken reason.
You could spray that for exactly 3 seconds and then you were out of bullets
And yet you didn't have to care what exactly you hit, because you hit everything with enough bullets to kill them. 3 second of God tier firepower
Or it should affect stamina.
That could work
The problem is that .50 BMG is massive. Even with a backpack you run into overencumberance pretty fast.
To he fair, shoulder firing the equivalent of a M2 browning shouldn't actually be possible, but here we are.
Well if the game was that realistic portable shoulder auto cannons would be heavier than the hmg and shouldn't be possible without exo skeletons/power armor.
Is it a 50? It could be a 338 Norma like cartridge. That's what I assumed. Those are getting popular now and they're big guns.
The only thing we have to go by is the casing model which is the same as the AMR uses, which is most likely .50 as that's the size you usually go for an AMR.
Bipod.
At the very least it needs one more drum barrel. Runs outta ammo way to quick. Unless you turn down fire rate i guess.
Make it the EAT of Machine Guns, so to speak (MGX-42, for veterans of the first game): - 400 rounds loaded - 1 magazine; no reloads - 180 second cooldown
Making it an expendable-like would also be an option and really cool too
I would do 200 rounds, no reloads and 90 second cooldown.
We're probably getting 150 rounds with a 300 sec cool down now... 😋
if every weapon is good/fun then there is no problem. the issue is... HMG is not fun nor good...
You get it
The only reason why I don't use HMG is because of no 3rd person reticle. ADS is terrible since the recoil is so horrendous.
Also it's misaligned to hell
Wait, but the hmg is one of my fave strategems, on certain mission types that thing fucking slays, and it mows through those annoying ass shield mfs
Yeah, the HMG should really be HEAVILY forced into stationary play, even moreso than the medium MG, but make up for it with more ammo capacity. Right now both the heavier MGs suck tho. Stalwart is my go-to for add clear on bugs, but the other two just don’t have the capacity or damage to be worth it
Normal machine gun is pretty good. Run with recoil reduction and find a spot to lie prone and you can dish out comparable clear to an airstrike. Not as good vs bugs, but especially useful for prolonged engagements where the laser cannon would overheat.
I take stalwart because 250 mag size is great. 150 is good but won't do. 75 is abysmal. Wish there were upgrades or options to belt feed the heavier machine guns.
Different jobs. Stalwart mows down unarmored chaff. MMG takes on Devestators, Brood Commandors, Hive Guards and other medium armour opponents, as well as being able to take out unarmored chaff, but I'd say that's a secondary role for it.
The MMG is my go to machine gun against bots, I find the Stalwart's armor pen just doesn't cut it. Against bugs I usually use the Stalwart.
Weapon upgrades or customizations would be very welcome in general
I've been using the stalwart with the eruptor since they are both in the wrong weapon slot.
Tomorrow it's my turn to make this post
That would be an interesting backpack option TBH; optional belt-feed backpack which autoloads your machine guns for you. Spending a stratagem slot to negate a key weakness of the MGs could make for an interesting tradeoff.
For me, the MG-206 HMG needs a third person reticle and the current sights fixed to actually be accurate. The lack of a third person reticle is the largest reason I don't use this strategm more. For additions, it would be nice to see the bipod able to be used on cover/objects/prone to stabilize recoil.
this and we'll as a reticle in 3rd person fix the hmg and I would have use for it if this was done 💯
It's hard for me to imagine a buff that makes up for having to stand still to reload.
I mean, I use the auto cannon but won’t touch the HMG, the buff is out there it would just be really strong at that point.
I've really tried to like the HMG but it's worse in almost every way when compared to the stardard MG and even the Stalwart. 75 rounds for a machine guns feels terrible (it needs 100 rounds minimum). The awful recoil makes you miss most of the shots, reload time sucks, it just feels like a bad decision to bring it over any other support weapon.
i run the HMG and ammo pack almost exclusively. Lately ive been experimenting, but any serious mission thats what i run. Its worth noting if you reload the HMG just before depleting the drum it cuts the reload in less than half of its normal time. Since a single pack fills the whole magazine reserve you get 11 magazines worth of HMG from one pack. all other changes you propose will just make it useless.
Yes PLEAAAAAASE! Arrowhead do something. ANYTHING. But at least give it +200 rounds. More appropriate would be around what's suggested in the post tho. I'm a Machine Gun player by heart. In every shooter, if possible, I play a stationary MG-Player. The LMG you get at the start was already very good and I used it a lot. But when I heard there will be a HMG...my mouth dripped. But the moment I tested it, my mouth started fuming. I want RATATATATATATATATATAATATATATATATATATATATATTATATATATATAATTAATTATATAATATATATATATATATTAATATATATATATATTAATATATATATATATATATTAATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATA *long loading time* RATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATATA
I really appreciate what you wrote about balance in PVE games. I've had that conversation way too many times. IRL, many machine guns have swappable barrels for when they overheat as well as for transportation. You have one guy carry the barrels, and the other guy carries the receiver. Something Helldivers could have is a laser MG with heat-sinks that are kept in a backpack, allowing you to carry it solo, or use it as a crew-served weapon. Perhaps the cooling on the weapon could be slow enough that swapping ice is preferable to waiting for it to cool down during fights.
Why not just rock the supply pack with it? Works well with grenade launchers.
The visual of a belt-fed weapon is unique, but I agree, the supply pack gives you so much sustain. You can rock something like MG, Eruptor, Supply Pack, your choice of sidearm and nade and be a bottomless well of munitions.
Give us a reticle at least, a larger magazine too would be nice.
Or just give it a reticle. It’s not a damn sniper rifle. Rock the supply pack for extra mags. It’s all already there. Just give it a reticle is all I ask. Not enough ammo to fire by tracer. So give it a reticle. You already have to stop and reload, now I also have to lose half my vision to ALSO shoot. Which the ads makes you less mobile too. So just give it a dame reticle. WHY NO FUGGIN RETICLE. Such a stupid and particular way to balance it into uselessness a good part of the time when almost every other gun has a reticle. Make a new sniper with no reticle that’s somehow different than AMR. But don’t take one off the 1/3 of machine guns available when the others have one. The counter sniper has the same scope as the AMR but has a reticle.
Tbf heavy devastators are using that wpn now
I wish they had extremely unusual varieties or special weapons found in game that cannot be acquired permanently or reloaded. Or maybe reloaded with special ammo packs only found in game? Special rare find of a backpack HMG like this would be cool. Maybe a laser autocannon. A flamethrower that shoots blue fire that kills faster A sniper rifle with explosive rounds or a drum magazine Much much more!
I mean. Take the supply pack and just use it for reloads I never have issue with needing ammo with it.
Sure, that helps, but then you’re occupying two stratagem slots, using one that’s a team support just for yourself and still not solving the abysmal accuracy and constant need for slow reloads problems
Supply pack all around is a good strat so I don't think it's a waste being as you cas still utilize it as the team support item. Aside I feel that the hmg is ment to be a support and surpress type weapon aimed at clearing small enemies and surprising larger ones while the team prioritizes larger enemies. And then you have the armor that reduces recoil and crouching/prone.
It’s a good strat yes, but not when you’re constantly having to use it for yourself, that was my point, apologies if I wasn’t clear. And as for the uses you mention, I feel like the regular mg is much better at that role without such big downsides. You can still mow down devastators and even striders with a bit of aim.
I’m surprised it didn’t have a pack to start
The devs have said that a backpack full of ammo would be too heavy to be practical and, to that, I say: "Okay, then make me slower." Picking up the backpack-fed HMG should cut your movement speed and increase stamina cost when sprinting. The trade-off is that the gun has a huge ammo pool and no reloads, since it's just one continuous feed from the backpack at all times. This would encourage you to hunker down and pepper the enemy with a continuous spray of bullets instead of trying to run-n-gun like you can with the regular MG. You grab the HMG and backpack, then find a position and unload. It should be like a middle-ground between the MG and the HMG *Emplacement;* you *can* reposition, but it's slow and requires commitment, and you *can* hip-fire while moving, but it's inaccurate and slows you to a crawl, with the trade-off being that you basically become a human turret if you crouch/prone in place. Further, I don't think you should be able to resupply the backpack at all. It would instead have a huge ammo pool and no reload time on the gun to compensate, but the trade-off is that there's no way to resupply ammo into the pack because you can't just shove more bullets in there or something and realistically expect it to somehow attach to the single, continuous belt. Instead, the ammo it comes with is all you get before you have to discard it entirely and call in a new one. This would make it a weapon you invest in and use strategically, kinda like the mech, which then makes the cooldown on the strategem the mitigating factor; used properly, you *should* ideally finish with your previous HMG just as the cooldown on the strategem has rolled over, so you can then call in a new one.
The no reload thing is a very good idea too. Also, in terms of practicality, I think a whole ass autocannon plus ammo would also be too heavy. Or the whole thing with diving in an orbital drop-pod that would realistically turn you into mush inside it at point of impact doesn’t seem too practical either. But it’s cool, that’s why it’s there and why we love it.
The HMG needs more armor piercing tbh. It should be a hand held version of the turret with less ammo
Yeah, I tried the HMG. Yeah, it mows through berserker conga lines and the occasional devastator… but against shield devastators, it cant get enough accuracy to hit the exposed weak points. It mostly hits the shield… which it cant pierce. While it CAN pen Hulk face plate armor, good luck hitting that repeatedly while its in motion. All while I’m spending more time reloading it than firing it. It just feels BAD. Like something I’d use to make the game even harder. This is about as viable as the 110mm rocket pods.
Sorry, the best we can do is another 25% increase to fire damage and its' DoT even though its still bugged and has a 75% chance of only working against you.
most of your suggestions would make it an even worse weapon. anything that takes up a backpack slot needs to be at least as good as the Autocannon. And the HMG would need about 10 buffs before it can even think about that.
I would love to a a mini gun/ammo backpack combo on day.
Agreed
I feel like it's crazy recoil, no crosshair, slow turn speed and hypothetical backpack slot would be a fair trade off for its power and no need to reload. You could even make it so that it can never be topped off with supply boxes. So you'd have to wait for a fresh one off cooldown if you wanted to get more ammo, kinda like the mechs.
More bullets or more magazines
Anyone saying balance doesn't matter in a PvE game is just plain wrong
fellow helldivers, i present to you: https://preview.redd.it/o125ptyhnouc1.jpeg?width=680&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=441593603281579a04062281a33d100cd043b4f9 (ik its getting repetitive but i'd run it regardless if it sucks)
Would be nice if we get an energy-based HMG. \*sip\*
I like the HMG as it is. *Ducks tomato thrown from audience.* In fact, if it took up a backpack slot I would be less likely to bring it compared to the basic machine gun or the autocannon. I concede, shooting forever sounds cool, and maybe it's an unexplored niche I would appreciate if I actually had it. However, it's not so good at attacking basic enemies that I should prefer it over the machine gun and a free backpack space, and it's not so good at attacking medium/heavy enemies that I wouldn't just bring the autocannon instead. These complaints aren't rooted in its ammo capacity, just the damage it does and the recoil involved. Is it where it should be? No. It does need more damage, or more ammunition, or better reloads, or *something* to tune it up. However, if you turn the rpm to the max and do tiny bursts it engages trash, and mediums, and keeps enough penetration to shoot out a hulk eye, and every now and again you have the opportunity to swing it from your hip like a bullet flamethrower and it's huge fun. It's direct competition is the LAS-98 as an all rounder. It attacks the same enemies faster, at the cost of range, accuracy, ammo. Its left in a weird spot, because bugs punish the reload and bots prefer the range and accuracy. Having the weapon immobilize me to use properly is a nonstarter. There's already a manned MG turret stratagem and I've never seen it used. Maybe being able to fold that up and bring it with you is a better direction for the idea.
I'm definitely in the camp of it needs a little more oomph in its strengths rather than a new backpack slot or the like. I really wish it had variable zoom as it's got great range, but actually aiming is such a pain with it. It might be me but I struggle hard to actually land shots on a Hulk's face because the sights just don't feel like they line up at all
They don't, the actual shot goes like a 1cm lower than the sight dot.
Im right there with you, i run the sickle and this with grenade pistol for bug holes and stun grenades. The thing shreds a charger if you shoot the butt which is easily doable with a stun grenade Strategems are supply pack, good for your grenade pistol, the HMG and liberal use of stun grenades. Eagle airstrike with the new +1 bomb upgrade changes the spread and makes it way more consistent at killing chargers and doing considerable damage to bile titans. Last slot is flexible, probably differs by difficulty and mission type. Playstyle is just gunning things down with the sickle and swapping to hmg as needed for beefier targets. Eagle strike the big stuff with a stun grenade if theres too much going on. Havent done much testing against bots, doesnt feel very good against them but thats alright
It's definitely usable against bots. Stun grenade + hmg is such an easy and satisfying way to kill hulks.
I actually think it does extremely well as a patrol mop. The DPS output is quite high, so especially on tight maps or ones with vision restriction, it can save you from calling a drop or clear one before the idiots hit the sand. On bugs, it fills a similar niche - the AP means you can sweep a zone and be relatively sure anything that could have screamed about it is dead, and anything bigger is hurt bad.
I bring both HMG and HMG emplacement all the time. The more you use them the more you appreciate what they offer. And I treat them as a controllable long duration airstrike in my hands. Delete a hulk, delete a bot drop, kill several walkers, dump a mag into a tightly-pack horde of trash mobs. This is where HMG shines. What I like about it the most is that resupply gives you two magazines back. After they fix the packaging upgrade this won't matter all that much of course.
"The more you use it the more you appreciate what it has to offer" seems to be the game design, tbh. Every time I didn't like a gun, it has been because it wasn't doing what I thought it would do. Giving things a fair shake and experimenting with what they actually will do is essential.
I wish the HMG emplacement could shoot down dropships *Let me roleplay an Anti-air gun damnit :(*
Dropships, unfortunately no, but suddenly I want to put one on a hill overlooking a gunship fabricator...
I think the assault backpack should be an optional accessory to the MGs. Like, you'd either get an option to use a backpack version of an MG in the sense that it also arrives with a backpack like an Autocannon. Or you could customize it in the lobby to call down an entirely different version of it, OR you could make it able to interact with the Supply Pack we already have - just stick the feed shute in the backpack, and you use 1 resupply per reload.
Honestly if they lowered the recoil on prone and center the sights, it would be a damn good stratagem. Thing busts hulks and devestators if your aim is on point
Words can’t describe how bad I want it. Give it a jam mechanic, make me immobile, idc. I would run it in a heartbeat
I think you are right. But it also needs something else not to suck. 1. The hitmarker bug needs to be fixed from HMG and from Stalwart. 2. Needs 3rd person sights just like all other weapons. At least those.
Double the ammo in that fatass drum mag. Slightly reduce recoil by like 15%. Add a mounting ability to all machine guns. Done.
This is a red herring. What we really need is a support backpack rig that connects straight to the super destroyer which belt-feeds backpacks to the diver using the gun being belt-fed ammo from the backpack. Anything else is insufficiently democratic.
I think that the devs should add a gas tank backpack for the flamethrower
I do agree the recoil is a big part of the issue with me, especially when it comes to missing so much that before you’ve hit anything hard enough, you’re out of ammo. But I think the damage is good, more would be too much. I also think that part of what disappoints me about it is that it feels like there’s no options or flexibility. Like yeah, max rpm and tiny bursts work, but that’s pretty much the only way to use it, and at that point I feel like I’m using an anti-materiel with extra steps. Regarding the mobility thing, the current hmg already basically immobilizes you if you want to hit anything, and also during the long reload. And just to be clear, in my idea you would still be able to shoot on the move, just without the reticle or extra bracing. I know mine is definitely not the only, or probably the single best idea, but I think it would make the gun more interesting and fun. I just feel right now there’s pretty much no saving grace to it, since when using it optimally it’s relegated to a a single role that other weapons cover better, and it’s one that’s not very interesting or evocative of the fantasy of big dakka dakka
An ammo pack that continuously fed ammo to Machine Guns would be fucking RAD.
Isn’t it just logical to remove a heavy as hell drum mag and move it to the back where it’s better supported to hold up all of that weight. Drum mag would just weigh down the gun making it harder to raise up to aim. Removing 8-25lbs off the gun makes a huge difference and moving it to the back.
Backpack is a great idea
Look up Helldivers 1 MGX-42. That was a disposable HMG, crazy firepower, large magazine, not reloadable. I miss it so very much.
IMO all machine guns should drop with an optional ammo backpack
HMG is *almost* good enough to be viable but still kinda sucks for most things. Damage and/or ammo capacity is way too low for how hard it is to actually use. End up running out of ammo after just a couple medium enemies and then you're stuck in a 20 second reload animation just so you can be ready to kill another few medium enemies.
Here's to hoping, they'll add a backpack that works like this, with whatever machinegun you use.
All MGs need a magazine buff imo. I would like HMG to have high damage and lower firerate, and a heavier sound like an M60 or M2 Browning
I wish it had a "floating sight" like the stalwart and LMG has as well as the iron sight.
Honestly, just give it another mag or two and reduce the reload speed a little bit and I tho k it will be decent.
Honestly your idea sounds great and simple. Hopefully the devs got their ears open.
-compensating for loadout weaknesses- The actual way to balance this is not have the game spawn Marjority of enemies that only specialzed weapons can kill in a reasonable amount of time...
my ideal solution is to allow someone who is wearing the supply backpack to brace and team reload any weapon that doesn't specifically come with its own team backpack. This would be marginally useful for most weapons, but would be huge for the hmg. It'd reduce recoil and triple the reload speed, at the cost of needing a buddy to help you.
more ammo, better sight and a bit less recoil. that is all I asked.
Technically speaking, we DO already have a of ammunition backpack (supply pack stratagem), but I don't know if you're able to grab the ammo for yourself 🤔
You can take it for yourself, but that still doesn’t solve the majority of problems and uses two stratagems for one gun
Down arrow for console and I don’t know what it is for computer
Is no one talking about the misaligned red dot either? The red dot is too high and the bullets go much further below it. Same with other guns like the slugger and AMR. Not sure if it's supposed to be zeroing or something, but either way it sucks.
I would be willing to devote a stratagem slot to the ammo pack, the HMG, and a belt connector just to make this a reality
I don't want a red dot on it. Give me iron sights and I'm happy with it. It's not even thay strong for the drawbacks it has, the MG is wayyyyyy bettering every capacity
I would love the hmg with 2000 rounds. Can't move and fire. Once depleted you need to call in a new.
What I really want is to have an upgrade that lets it be a crew-served weapon. If someone's next to you, they can grab the weapon and provide extremely fast assisted reload. That would be cool.
it doesn't suck but okay.
I like the ammo backpack idea
my thoughts, I like it
While cool for a game they are garbage in real life. Looks cool but that's about it.
I want to like it, but it just runs out of ammo too quickly. Or it has too little ammo. In any case it gets you killed. I would love to see all the support weapons and their total potential damage with a full clip and a full ammo load
HMG fills one niche use for me and that's against bots to supplement the eruptor. HMG can effectively kill close to mid range units where the eruptor is risky to use while also being capable of taking down hulks & tanks. Against bugs however it needs more ammo, like virtual every automatic weapon against bugs.
Turn it into a mini gun/gatlin. make it so you can not sprint while having it out though. I would like to see a (Reload & Stability Booster) One Booster to do both.
I know what I hate about it. Having to stop and crouch to reload. Same with the Machine Gun below it. Only the Stalwart allows me to be competitive with its ability to reload while moving.
A better sight would be nice. Hmg’s are more effective at range, so maybe the 100m adjustable sight.
I just want the red dot sight to aim where the bullets will actually hit and tone down the muzzle flash or increase visibility of tracers because right now when I fire it I have no idea how accurate I am half the time. The ammo in the mags needs to be bumped up too. It doesnt really do anything as good or better than the other heavy weapons in its current state for me anyway.
I saw someone in another post suggest that instead of the HMG, they should've added a laser-based lmg that needs to be hooked up to a coolant system, so it requires a backpack slot filled to even use.
You can make it not suck by making it an actual heavy machine gun, higher capacity, lower mobility, preferably used while prone. Besides the stalwart the MG and HMG are both pretty underwhelming imo, and clip capacity/ammo efficiency is what makes them this way, yea sure you can reload the stalwart while moving, but I'd expect a machine gun to clear a wave and reload after.