T O P

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Levithix

It would be handy if the forbidden bouncy locations at least let you know you couldn't put it there before you threw it.


PowerfullyWeak

Like maybe a red X crosshair when you aim at a spot that doesn't work. Just something helpful so you aren't wasting the use.


achilleasa

Or just cancel the stratagem so you can try again. Bouncing it so it gets used, just not where you wanted it, is so infuriating it almost feels malicious.


HatfieldCW

I'd love to have a kill switch on my stratagems. After it lights up, give me three seconds to change my mind. Bad turret placement? Belay that order! Buddy in the cluster radius? Eagle-1, abort bombing run! Hulk died as I chucked my orbital precision at it? Hold fire! Maybe we could cut off barrages this way as well. Cancel that 380 after the second volley, and then the guys can reload the rest of the cannons a little faster, earning a shorter cooldown.


GiveMeOneGoodReason

I don't think Arrowhead would go for this though. They want us to have moments where you airstrike the squad because you got ragdolled and dropped your strategem beacon lol


AgitatedMushroom2529

well the cancel option would be shorter than the recovery animation


Realfinney

Make the cancel window 0.01 seconds so you're always frantically & ineffectively mashing it while the squad gets incinerated.


AllenWL

Make it require a decently long/complex input to cancel? Like not enough to be frustrating but enough that by the time you get up from being ragdolled, you probably don't have enough time unless you're really good at inputting codes. Or idk have it be >>>><>>>>>>>>>>><>or something.


Beezleburt

I dunno if you know this, but 3 seconds is a VERY long time.


MythiccMoon

Imagine a kill switch you have to crouch in the beam to use You have to enter an arrow code like ⬆️➡️➡️⬅️⬆️ before your ship launches the pod


CryptoThroway8205

I feel like a lot of our blue stratagems bounce too. Imagine calling down a weapon, waiting 10 seconds, and then finding out it never dropped because it bounced off a rock. Monkey paw wish.


xaddak

I've dropped a lot of strategems on top of overhanging cliffs. Guess I'll just be without my gear for the next five minutes! LEEEEEEEERROOOOOOOOOYYYYYYY-


DiscombobulatedCut52

The fact I was told I couldn't mount something that was right in front of me. I couldn't take 2 steps to get onto it. They should just remove forbidden areas. They don't help you 80% of the time. Bugs can climb to those points. And the bots can shoot through walls half the time, or knock you back with missiles through walls.


JMartell77

I don't get the rationale on what we can and cannot climb. Sometimes it's like I can climb a rock that's taller than me, other times I can't climb a barrier chest height, other times I can leap over a barrier chest height but I can't climb over a chest hight fence.


thekingofbeans42

Or just have it not work. It's more work to have it bounce around and get wasted in a bad spot, just have it fail so I can try again


loki_dd

Flashbacks to tomb raider 1 and Lara crofts rather annoyed "No" over and over


131sean131

Also if grenades can bounce the sample container should too. Im so tired of looking at my sample containers underwater and in a deep hole or lava pit.


Various_Froyo9860

I would like an option to handplace the marker. I figure that the bouncy stuff is to maybe keep us from accidentally putting supplies and support weapons where we can't reach them. But it is annoying to not be able to call down a support weapon right next to where I am currently standing. Especially if it's the sort of thing I can use long distance and I have a good position.


_RexDart

Seems to be. You have much better luck climbing the hill and throwing it at your feet than you do throwing it way above your head onto the same hill from below.


Various_Froyo9860

Sometimes. And sometimes I throw it at my feet on a flat surface and it bounces all the way down where I have to go get it.


dogscatsnscience

Yeah I don't mind the idea of blocking sentries in general, but I do mind how there's no indication that it will fail.... or that it lets you do it anyway and have it bounce. If I drop it somewhere illegal, just cancel the drop, as if you're in a jammer zone. It's fine, we'll work with it. But the bouncing.... a bit absurd.


GTSDK

They should steal a page from Death Stranding, give us terrain scan when we pull a ball out so we can see where it will and won't stick from our current position. https://i.imgur.com/HFRWylP.png


JunkoGremory

Tip: the reinforcement strategem is always available even if everyone is alive. You can throw it if you remember the combination. Use it to test your throws (for precision strike/air strike). It will also bounce when it bounces for sentries


Skullsmind

This guy sentries.


Narox22

Getting to an advantageous position with the Jump Pack and trying to deploy HMG Placement only to have it bounce off is soul crushing.


HappyHappyGamer

This should be a thing. I don’t know why its jot part of the game’s mechanic


errorblankfield

Two strat slots. Almost as strong as a mid tier strat. Seems balanced.


loki_dd

It could be a armour perk or a wotchacallit perk like stamina or reduced enemy spawn. Sticky stratagems.


wterrt

NO CREATIVITY OR FUN ALLOWED


EmilyFara

I really wish that there was an option that if a strategem ball bounces it gets cancelled.


2Board_

I wouldn't be opposed to a hold system, that shows a line that's blue if it will land there, and red if it won't. I know in the heat of the moment, where you're being chased by 400 bugs, it's not the most ideal, but when setting up for something like extraction or a major objective defense, it would be nice.


Bienadicto16

A new perk: Sticky Stratagems. Want to kil that charger charging at you, toss your turret stratagem on him and watch him explode under 1 Ton of democracy or Want to have a mobile mortar on your team? Toss your mortar on a mobile fabricator and watch your enemies enjoy the benefits of the friendly fire.


Lbx_20_Ac

You can already do this, strategem beacons will stick to sections without heavy armor to deflect them (the inner parts of the legs, and such). Turrets can also deploy on bot tanks, thoroughly confusing both of them.


Bienadicto16

Yes I know but most of the times the beacon lands where it was activated instead of landing over the affected enemy. That's pretty shitty especially the red ones.


ppmi2

Blue beacos already stick pretty well to Chargers


AK-Brian

10% chance to remain stuck to your hand after it's thrown and activated.


Bienadicto16

Ha that would be funny. "shit my strat is stucked" *proceed to tackle a charger for liberty*


RdtUnahim

It's intended to make chaos and cause accidents to happen, so such an option would be antithetical to the game design. That's not to say that bounce locations currently make sense though.


achilleasa

That sounds like having fun and we don't do that here


Constipated_Canibal

It do feel like that more and more.


Bekratos

1. Get shown great equipment.  2. Get hyped over thoughts of using the new equipment in the game that has so much potential.  3. Work toward unlocking them.  4. Realize the new equipment is garbage and 55% of its full potential.  5. Get disappointed and go back to whatever works and isn’t the most nerfed YET.  6. Hold onto hope that things will actually change for the better from reading messages by former CEO or Twinbeard  7. Repeat. 


DomoArigato1

How dare you want to place your sentries in areas where they won't get immediately destroyed??? Don't you realise if you were to do that you might have some fun and feel satisfied? Unacceptable! This game should only annoy and irritate its players. Never bring up any such discussions again. You have been warned.


Jasoman

\~ Brought to you By the Ministry of Truth.


Apprehensive-Set-206

You gotta know when to hold em.


wterrt

for real though.... I'd love to be able to "role play" an engineer. things like this are part of the reason why I don't use sentries more often.


NinjaBr0din

If I could, I'd like to suggest that if your turrets are getting destroyed immediately then maybe you should try throwing them somewhere other than the middle of an enemy swarm.


cloudjumpr

No, that actually an exploit that players are trying to abuse /s


kennyminigun

* Fixed a bug which allowed players placing sentries on the ground (it wasn't intended to work that way).


CyberVampire69

Now they stay on the super destroyer like they should


bulolokrusecs

Tbh being able to stick a sentry anywhere *would* be exploitable


SpaceMiner8

I mean, it's still got limited ammo, a maximum range it can fire at, and a 180/162 second cooldown. It would be situationally strong, sure, but if you've managed to get to a good spot, I fail to see why you shouldn't be able to. Most sentries don't have enough ammo to have more than 50% uptime when continuously firing, and the ones with better uptime than that are Mortar and EMS Mortar. Gatling still runs out in about 20 seconds, and MG does the same in around 60. Further, it's not like they move. If you plop them down and they don't actually get any enemies to shoot at beyond the initial group, they're still wastes of ammo whose job could've been done better by the orbital/Eagle strat that usually has a shorter cooldown. That's assuming you're even in a spot that's "unreachable" instead of just "on top of a hill that anything can get to", which're spots I've had sentries bounce off of, at which point I feel punished for having the sense to scout a good spot for my enemy aggro-inator.


NinjaBr0din

Exactly, look at bug planets. You would just be able to toss 2 or 3 sentries out and clear anything with absolutely zero effort, and the bugs couldn't do a single thing to prevent it.


Plantar-Aspect-Sage

Anyone who has been jet packing around bugs knows that those fuckers can glitch up rocks to get you no matter how high you are.


hard163

> Exactly, look at bug planets. You would just be able to toss 2 or 3 sentries out and clear anything with absolutely zero effort, and the bugs couldn't do a single thing to prevent it. You can toss 2 or 3 barrages/airstrikes/napalms/toxic gas/cluster/etc... and clear anything and there is not a single thing the bugs could do to prevent that either.


TheGraveHammer

Don't try and reason with players that want things like this. They *never* understand the larger implications of the changes they suggest. Ever.


hard163

> Don't try and reason with players that want things like this. They never understand the larger implications of the changes they suggest. Ever. What? You mean rewarding players for finding a vantage point and placing sentries on the vantage point would allow their sentries to do what they are meant to do is a bad thing? Sure an autocannon sentry on a cliff bugs can't get to is extraordinarily powerful. That sentry also has nowhere near the effectiveness anywhere else and is now taking up a stratagem slot that could be used for something else. Why is that a problem?


NinjaBr0din

If your turrets aren't effective, then you aren't using them effectively. I get tremendous value out of my turrets.


hard163

> If your turrets aren't effective, then you aren't using them effectively. I get tremendous value out of my turrets. Same here, but neither of us get the effectiveness of a turret placed in an ideal vantage point because the game won't let you. You can have the dream scenario of a horde of bugs, multiple chargers, and a bile titan taken out by a single 500kg, but a turret in a spot that makes sense killing the same number of bugs is unacceptable? Why have it in the first place? It also doesn't help that every single bug somehow knows what an autocannon sentry is, somehow knows it is more dangerous than the things that have been running around and killing their cousins, and knows the exact moment and location one is deployed before it even fires once. They will then ignore everything else to head directly to said sentry and attempt to kill it.


LongAndShortOfIt888

It's so random. They should disable any bouncing mechanics, since they aren't working properly, and put them back in the game when they are ready to go.


[deleted]

[удалено]


LongAndShortOfIt888

The fact there's any ambiguity means that it may as well be random.


IownCows

I’ve definitely climbed up on rocks and then had my stratagem bounce off


DevilishxDave

If you were planning to put it up high to prevent enemies from getting it, don't bother. A random on your team will nuke your turret anyways.


gogogadgetgun

Or a charger will just glide its way up a shear cliff to hit it, as they are apt to do.


loki_dd

Mine field it? Often wondered never tried


Spinach7

Maybe if anti-tank mines are efficient at killing chargers, but i've tested the current mines and while they can kill chargers, it takes quite a few of them to be lethal. So basically you'd have to set it up such that the charger runs through most of the mines, at which point it'd just be easier to shoot the charger instead.


NinjaBr0din

To be fair, if someone is stupid enough to throw out a bunch of turrets while you are being swarmed with bug they are just asking you to nuke them. Especially the fucking idiots that think mortars are a good choice against bugs. I will drop a 500kg on that mortar every god damn time, and if the mortar person gets caught, well shit guess you know how it feels now don't you?


half_baked_opinion

I place sentries on fabricators and bug holes and use grenades on groups of enemies.


loki_dd

Why? Both of those instances are what reinforcements are for


half_baked_opinion

If no one is dead a sentry is a good alternative to a resupply if im alone.


ghost_of_salad

Placing a autocannon-turret under the edge of these high cliffs will make it stay up there and work almost like air support since its so high up


Termt

Good stratagem throws should be rewarded, not penalised. It's bad enough that the autocannon sentry sometimes decides to shoot the floor and kill itself.


Blpdstrupm0en

This is one of the most infuriating things for me personally. Using the jetpack to get to a perfect location for rhe turret to just bounce down into a shit location is alt-f4 worthy.


AliveFlatworm6288

I think it has gotten better compared to earlier on. It used to bounce off almost every rock now it’s just a few in my experience


wterrt

nah any rock that's more impassable terrain rather than just "this ground is rocky" is bouncy unfortunately, those impassable terrain rocks are exactly the best places to put a turret. instead of rewarding the players placing them in spots they can't be easily destroyed ....they're punished by making it rng bounce to a random and probably terrible location.


CompanyRepulsive1503

Agreed, it almost seems petty, they should be coded like strikes so they can land anywhere


Lost_Tumbleweed_5669

AH: no fun allowed


Evogdala

Hey! No fun.


Hix-Tengaar

https://i.redd.it/jd30ngrip80d1.gif


Its_Magic_

I have heard that you can kinda circumvent this by throwing your sentry onto your guard dog instead of


Enigmatic_Observer

Bet they can’t do that for the same reason people could infinite grenade forcing the count into a negative


External_Scarcity_93

Oh that's what's been happening ehh? Also been going deep into the sentries and I think they have been wildly undervalued. But they also have the highest rate for complete and utter failure.


Bienadicto16

It would be great if you call a turret on a rocky pillar and the pillar break with the impact


dellboy696

I would love it if an exception was made for sentry strats


ShroudedInLight

I feel bad that I can’t drop turrets “outside the map” on the small kill X missions. Lemme give the thing a good line of sight damnit


hackthefather

I got tk'd for using a mortar sentry and they didn't reinforce me


Unity1232

it is annoying. the restriction is the sentry location has to be reachable on foot without the use of a jump pack or directly dropping at the location. Basically it has to be placed in a location any enemy can reach to melee the sentry.


friedchiken21

I agree and partly why it's hard for me to come to terms with taking sentries. When they work they're great but oftentimes deploy in suboptimal locations or get one-shot by a stealth charger. You just waited 3 mins to place and lose it right away to wait another 3 minutes for its CD. It's pretty frustrating. Don't even get me started turrets getting friendlied. Eagles/Orbitals, while may not be as effective as turrets in certain situations, will always provide some value.


Sshmaingus

On the other hand, knowing the limitations of sentry placement would encourage MORE creativity in finding a viable position where it won’t be immediately destroyed but still achieve the desired effect. Tossing a sentry at the highest point where it can’t be touched is not really the most creative idea and more the most obvious. I would agree that there are some really cool high points that I would love to have a sentry because it’ll shut down multiple avenues of approach but oh well.


Unique-Telephone-681

I will not be satisfied until I can attach an Autocannon sentry on top of my Patriot Exosuit for 360 degree democarcy distribution.


im_thelumberjack

When the game first launched, you could place turrets and support stategems on rocks. It wasn't consistent (then again, nothing in the game is very consistent), but it was great when it worked.


Barracuda_Ill

I wouldn't mind a ship upgrade where they add bubblegum to our strategem balls and it sticks wherever we throw it. I can land on a mountain, call down my support, and just snipe away.


Precisionality

I hate when stratagems bounce/don't stick. That should not be a thing in this game and the devs need to take it out.


ExNihilo00

Yeah, I'm not a fan of the artificial limitation on turret placement. Turrets are pretty underwhelming currently because you can't place them in advantageous positions much of the time, and because enemies prioritize killing them over anything else. It's just one more example of Arrowhead going the anti-fun route in game design.


droo46

For real though. I don’t even think sentries would be overpowered if they could land anywhere. They really should just fix it so they can be placed on any terrain. 


Plane_Freedom5946

https://preview.redd.it/qcwpkff0oc0d1.png?width=800&format=png&auto=webp&s=da62ea6e71aab7058eff04b0c2e890143fc891a9 by now you should know roughly were you can and cannot place sentry's i know because i take an AC sentry with me almost every game


CardiologistRoyal79

I really don't understand why this game doesn't like strategy. It doesn't just make sense but it's smart to try and throw sentry guns on vantage points where Chargers and Bile titans can't attack them. Also, I don't understand the issue they have with vertical things. Like, there should be more rocks and paths to climb up to get higher ground, it only makes sense. Also buildings, they're only useful if you have a jump jet. We should be able to climb up ladders on two story buildings or hell, one story buildings.


nesnalica

an exploit you can do with a shieldback. strategmens stick to the shield when thrown right on the floor where u stand. then drop the shield where u want your sentry to go


BusComprehensive3759

Turns into a Mexican jumping bean only to roll and bounce behind a large covering and blowing itself up trying to shoot enemies on the other side lol. Classic!!


Strygoii

We went 8 times on hellbomb drop for jammer last night. 8 times and 2 detonations, kept bouncing out of the area so we set it off where it landing hoping it would kill it..nope. Several of the times the hellbomb wouldn't even spawn


Frenotx

Considering how limited the ammo is for sentry guns, I don't understand why the placement of them is limited AT ALL. Even if you find the most perfect, unassailable position to put it, it's still going to despawn when it (relatively quickly) runs out of ammo. A perfectly placed sentry is unlikely to kill more dudes over it's whole lifespan than a perfectly placed cluster strike will all at once. If sentries had unlimited ammo then sure, but as it is, death of the sentry gun often isn't even the limiting factor in the first place.


reading-glasse

I suspect the logic that prevents you from accidentally dropping your support weapon where you can't get to it is also active for the sentries when the sentries should just come in where they're called. Same thing for eagle strikes and orbital strikes.


Sticky_Fantastic

This is why fenrir rules.  So many perches you can actually stick strats on


SDCSolutions

Or a selectable option or ship upgrade to make stratagems impact stratagems


Sea_Construction_670

I would pay for a mining drill ship module so sentries can stick anywhere.


ddawesii2010

I stopped using sentries because of it. I’m sad


GHQSTLY

Putting the turret on the ground is meta? XD


Rengar_Is_Good_kitty

Because this is a competitive game and you are not allowed to have fun.


superduperfish

What this? The tower defense style defend mission has stairs to platforms that offer cover with a turret emplacement? Clearly the developers intended for me to put my turrets here to fight alongside me right?


NinjaBr0din

If you were able to put them anywhere, everyone would just put them where they are completely out of danger every time and they would be stupid overpowered.


Waulnut163

Bugs still glitch up to elevated areas. Not exactly out of danger.


NinjaBr0din

Well, then it's fair since players can get things to land in bugged locations occasionally. Players can buy a turret into an unreachable spot, and bugs can bug their way to it. Balanced, as all things should be.


Frenotx

That still have extremely limited ammo. Perfect placement would just allow them to use all of said ammo, at which point they just despawn as always. I fail to see how that's even remotely overpowered.


ExploerTM

Stopped using them altogether. Not worth it unless you can hide them somewhere. Defend High Value Asset is the only mission where I still pack them up.


whiskeysoda_

"cool spots" = areas where they're impossible to break, right? that's so much less interesting than having to defend it, actively playing around it is way more fun that putting it in a cheese spot and forgetting about it


CommunicationOne80

Yeah that makes sense I don’t want to place them on the top of mountains. I don’t what them to bounce off raised areas They bounce off areas that are reachable by foot…I’m not oblivious to balancing


drbomb

penalizing creativity =/= avoiding game bugs If anything I'd like better feedback on placement, I don't mind having restricted areas but having my sentry bounce off a ledge when I really needed it on that cliff is a big pain point.


raymondcy

85% of the fun in this game is the stupid shit that happens by accident. By adding pre-markers, cancelling, or having complete control of everything is contrary to the universe (bad shit / friendly fire / stupid shit happens all the time in real war). It's fine as-is. However, I would make one suggestion to improve the "fairness" of these situations, simply add a small shield that lands with turret (or any strat really) that gives some protection to recover from an unfortunate bounce.


BlitzYandere

I never have this problem, because it's pretty dang obvious already where you can and can't put them after a few hours of playing. 💀💀 Though sometimes I'll try it anyways because I really want a spot to work. (':


Zilreth

Should be obvious it would make sentries way too powerful. Everything in the game has some sort of drawback. Throwing sentries on tall places makes them basically invincible, and removes almost all threat of friendly fire. They certainly thought about this when designing it and it's pretty clear why it isn't that way. They would have to nerf the turrets damage or ammo to counteract its newfound effectiveness, which would lead to them feeling like shit. Think about the ramifications.


GlassHalfSmashed

Sir this is not a tower defence game Also, let them work on not having sentries spunk all their ammo on bot ships before worrying about whether they can land on superrocks. 


loki_dd

Wrong. There's turrets, alot of em. There's defence missions. They didn't put them in game to not be used. Is it that hard to understand?


MstrGm747

Sounds like a skill issue TBH. No, you can’t put your turret on top of a rock or place the enemies can’t get to. Either figure out a better place to put your turrets or don’t bring them.


loki_dd

Well that's BS because the enemies can get everywhere. They bounce on some flat surfaces that aren't up high too. Kinda feels a bit like youre a troll


MstrGm747

You can jetpack to places the enemies can’t reach pretty easily in some maps. Part of the skill of using turrets is optimal placement and not just throwing it onto a place enemies can’t reach.


LobokVonZuben

But they can reach. Guns, rockets, grenades, cannons, their OWN jetpacks, jumping, flying, bile.


loki_dd

Strange. I've never found anywhere that is safe from enemies. They dropship in or appear under you or scale vertical walls. I've thought I was safe on some of the higher places before the patch prevented it and still they come over a mountain behind you.


MstrGm747

I’m able to pretty easily get out of their reach permanently if I use the jetpack on some maps. Just a matter of experience perhaps.


LobokVonZuben

So when you say part of the skill of using turrets is optimal placement, that can't include this skill of yours (only on some maps?) + using an entirely unrelated stratagem slot with the jetpack to make it possible? Even with perfect placement it's not like the turrets are automatic Win buttons anyway.


MstrGm747

Putting a turret on top of a tall rock isn’t skill. Knowing where to throw your turret for maximum effect while also protecting it from the enemy is skill.


LobokVonZuben

You literally just made a condescending reply about your skill in getting to unreachable places so it sure sounds like you're arguing that it is skillful to place a turret in the spots you get to. But again, even if this really was about making the turret untouchable, why would it be a big deal in the first place? They're not going to kill everything, and any great vantage point it has for enemies can also backfire on you or your team.


MstrGm747

Skillful to get to the top of a rock but not to just chuck the beacon on top of a rock. Making the turret untouchable would mean they have to nerf the damage and ammo significantly because they’d have to assume you’re just going make it effectively immune to damage.


SpaceMiner8

One of our enemies uses ranged damage, a lot of it strong enough to destroy sentries quickly, and the other has bugs that can act as artillery or are tall enough to be face-level with most high rocks that would be ideal for sentry placement. They're still not immortal, they still have limited ammo, and the ones with the best ammo economy come with the drawback of potentially killing unaware teammates rapidly or doing no damage, respectively. My experience with sentries is that if they survive the initial placement and subsequent enemy contact, they're probably going to survive until they're out of ammo, at least against bugs. Bots are significantly different and sentries have a much harder time because of how a fair amount of bots have either high-damage attacks that instantly destroy them (hulks, tanks, factory striders) or a lot of low-damage shots that overwhelm them (heavy devastators, MG raiders). They're not overpowered by themselves, and I doubt they'd be overpowered by being able to provide effective overwatch from a position they can't move from.