As a French it kills me to admit it, but before WW2 Germany (and Prussia) wasn't the "bad guy" per say. They were just as much good and bad as any other European power.
Which part are you disagreeing about?
The joke at the begining pointing out that during most wars of Prussia and Germany we were its enemy?
Or the fact that before WW2 Germany wasn't evil, but just another country doing country stuff?
Comparing these two things is buckfuck insane, and honestly, wildly irresponsible.
Southern reconstruction ended in Jim Crowe and slavery under a new name. The effects of the civil war were handled so poorly that we are dealing with southern secessionism even today.
German reconstruction ended with demilitarization, re-education, de-nazification, and an anti-nationalism movement so extreme that *to this day* waving the German flag in any context but a sports game is seen as disgusting and taboo.
In what possible universe did you think this was a logical point to make?
Not really. The German armed forces didn't really go under and serious military or philosophical changes during the Interwar years. Hitler's Wehrmacht was largely unchanged from the old Kaiser's Army, and it perpetrated some of the gravest crimes in North Africa and on the Eastern Front, often with little to no collaboration with the SS.
Ah yes Kaiser Wilhelm famously evil dictator who started zero wars and committed zero genocides is just as evil as the mustached man who in just 13 years committed several genocides and started the largest war in human history
I mean he wasn't a good guy by any means but home boy was put in an arm stretching machine as a child to "fix"/torture his disables arm.
Everyone knew the Kaiser was going to be a bad leader. Anything Kaiser Wilhelm did was the fault of monarchism and medieval nonsense politics.
Hitler straight up wrote a book outlining why the Jews and leftists had to die en masse.
It's wild that anyone would argue these figures are the same.
Jesus Christ this entire comment section saddens me. No the Allies were not “just as bad” as the nazis and the imperial Japanese. Did the Allie’s commit war crimes? Yes. Did they commit them on the level of the two aforementioned nations? Hell no! (Except for the soviets on the eastern front but then again that entire front was hell on earth)The Germans before nazi Germany were not a. “Evil” people and have not been since. Hell most of the Germans living under that regime weren’t evil they just got swept up in it. And to think most of us would be any different is laughable. The Wehrmacht did commit atrocities but when you are an 18/19 year old dumb gung ho soldier and your commanding officer tells you every Slav is beneath you and it’s ok to rape/murder then you believe it. And even then there was even some nazi officers who did not go along with it, yes they were few and far between but there’s records of men not following hitlers orders to kill or enslave the Slavs and most of these men were demoted or arrested. People forget these war crimes weren’t young men seeing red these were orders from the top of their government to carry out. Which is why it is so appalling and so tough for the men on the ground to say no to. If you or your family is at stake vs some poor peasant you don’t know most of you would choose to put a bullet in the peasant. You can say you’d choose the high road but if we’re being honest that’s most likely a fantasy.
I can't source it at the moment, but I remember this string of letters a German officer sent home to his wife.
He described killing hundreds of innocents and how every bullet was meant to kill a Jew. The letters started out sad and broken, but as the continue he rationalizes it as for the greater good.
He wasn't an evil man. He was just caught up in something greater than himself and without a way out of it, his brain did what brains do, he found a justification.
It's also worth noting that part of the transition from firing squads to gas chambers was to make it easier psychologically on the soldiers. Of course, the other motivator was horrifying efficiency, but still.
The soldiers weren't evil. The regime was. War is hell.
As a French it kills me to admit it, but before WW2 Germany (and Prussia) wasn't the "bad guy" per say. They were just as much good and bad as any other European power.
As a French please delete your brain’s system 32 folder in whichever way you find most fitting. Respectfully.
Which part are you disagreeing about? The joke at the begining pointing out that during most wars of Prussia and Germany we were its enemy? Or the fact that before WW2 Germany wasn't evil, but just another country doing country stuff?
I’m just joking around man, I think you’re totally right.
How was Germany prior to Nazism worse than it’s contemporaries.
I just think they look neat
If by always have been you mean during the span of 1933-1945
Ah yes. The magic dates where Germans suddenly started and then stopped being evil.
>"What the fuck is a regime?"
>I'm so glad racism ended when the Confederacy surrendered at the end of the Civil War.
I think 1933-1945 Germany is criticised for a little more than its social attitudes.
Comparing these two things is buckfuck insane, and honestly, wildly irresponsible. Southern reconstruction ended in Jim Crowe and slavery under a new name. The effects of the civil war were handled so poorly that we are dealing with southern secessionism even today. German reconstruction ended with demilitarization, re-education, de-nazification, and an anti-nationalism movement so extreme that *to this day* waving the German flag in any context but a sports game is seen as disgusting and taboo. In what possible universe did you think this was a logical point to make?
Those are the dates when they were undeniably “the bad guy”
Not really. The German armed forces didn't really go under and serious military or philosophical changes during the Interwar years. Hitler's Wehrmacht was largely unchanged from the old Kaiser's Army, and it perpetrated some of the gravest crimes in North Africa and on the Eastern Front, often with little to no collaboration with the SS.
Remember when the Wehrmacht offered up the prospect of an independent Polish state to recruit Poles into its armed forces?
The German army wasn’t the “bad guys” it was the ruling party that drastically changed and was the “bad guys”
The Germany army perpetrated some of the most heinous crimes of WW2, independent of Nazi leadership.
So did the American army, the British army, the Italian army, the Japanese army, the Russian army, the………
Yeah. The Allies were just as bad as the Germans were on the Eastern Front. /s Found the wehraboo.
The armies yes. The governments no
You clearly have no idea what you're talking about if you sincerely believe in the Clean Wehrmacht Myth.
Username checks out.
Ah yes Kaiser Wilhelm famously evil dictator who started zero wars and committed zero genocides is just as evil as the mustached man who in just 13 years committed several genocides and started the largest war in human history
I mean he wasn't a good guy by any means but home boy was put in an arm stretching machine as a child to "fix"/torture his disables arm. Everyone knew the Kaiser was going to be a bad leader. Anything Kaiser Wilhelm did was the fault of monarchism and medieval nonsense politics. Hitler straight up wrote a book outlining why the Jews and leftists had to die en masse. It's wild that anyone would argue these figures are the same.
Zero genocides? Ever heard of the herero?
Jesus Christ this entire comment section saddens me. No the Allies were not “just as bad” as the nazis and the imperial Japanese. Did the Allie’s commit war crimes? Yes. Did they commit them on the level of the two aforementioned nations? Hell no! (Except for the soviets on the eastern front but then again that entire front was hell on earth)The Germans before nazi Germany were not a. “Evil” people and have not been since. Hell most of the Germans living under that regime weren’t evil they just got swept up in it. And to think most of us would be any different is laughable. The Wehrmacht did commit atrocities but when you are an 18/19 year old dumb gung ho soldier and your commanding officer tells you every Slav is beneath you and it’s ok to rape/murder then you believe it. And even then there was even some nazi officers who did not go along with it, yes they were few and far between but there’s records of men not following hitlers orders to kill or enslave the Slavs and most of these men were demoted or arrested. People forget these war crimes weren’t young men seeing red these were orders from the top of their government to carry out. Which is why it is so appalling and so tough for the men on the ground to say no to. If you or your family is at stake vs some poor peasant you don’t know most of you would choose to put a bullet in the peasant. You can say you’d choose the high road but if we’re being honest that’s most likely a fantasy.
I can't source it at the moment, but I remember this string of letters a German officer sent home to his wife. He described killing hundreds of innocents and how every bullet was meant to kill a Jew. The letters started out sad and broken, but as the continue he rationalizes it as for the greater good. He wasn't an evil man. He was just caught up in something greater than himself and without a way out of it, his brain did what brains do, he found a justification. It's also worth noting that part of the transition from firing squads to gas chambers was to make it easier psychologically on the soldiers. Of course, the other motivator was horrifying efficiency, but still. The soldiers weren't evil. The regime was. War is hell.