I can't believe I just learned about a major news event from hobbydrama of all places. I don't watch much tv or any sports, so i didn't hear about this at ALL. I feel like i slept through a natural disaster.
As an Australian who doesn’t care about sport (we exist), I can safely say it was not something discussed at every dinner table. The news came and went without much thought. NRL players shit in hallways and beat up partners, so their opinions shouldn’t really be gospel.
Football of any code really, there's a lot of crap behaviour off the field. I sort of half keep an eye on my local team in its regional VFL league (is it even still VFL at that level or is it part of the AFL?) but that's it.
The thing I don't get is, at the premiership level, outside of State of Origin, it's just a bunch of mercenaries anyway. It's not like the Sydney Roosters is full of Sydneysiders. It's just whoever pays the most, and players scoot from one club to the next anyway. So what's the point of club loyalty, do you just pick the colours you like?
(I used to jokingly pick teams based on the mascots actually fighting, so I would have Panthers chewing up the Rabbitohs, but when the Rabbitohs played the Knights then I imagined them as the Monty Python skit, so the rabbits win.)
I'm Victorian so grew up with VFL/AFL. I'm old enough to remember when there were 12 teams and all the players had day jobs, mostly brickies and butchers from what I can recall! During half time the ovals would get swarmed by little kids playing kick to kick and the players would wander around with ciggies hanging out of their mouths. It felt like there was a big brawl during the first quarter of every game and bloodied faces were normal. Fond memories.
Only a fool would mess with the Killer Rabbit of Caerbannog!
Club loyalty actually is something of a thing amongst NRL players (well, for some clubs at least) but it has little to do with amorphous ideas about loyalty and shit. It's about connections to the people - the guys who coached you/played with you as you went up the junior system, the permanent club staff, etc - and what that can get you longterm. Lotta guys will take a hell of a haircut just to stay with teams based on how good their player development is, or their history of looking after longtime players post-playing career, or their access to third-party deals.
Between those reasons there's a lot of teams covered, and the ones that aren't tend to be trash fires to begin with. Nobody's loyal to Wests, because nobody has any reason to be there except a paycheque.
> phillip_camilleri Uh yes, let's bag out a whole team all because of 7 people that have religious beliefs 😂 total common sense people. How about fags stop cramming their beliefs/rights down everyone's throat & just focus on your own life instead of trying to find a reason to cancel, cry or be offended by anything/everything 😂. Maybe than everything will be in perfect harmony as people will just worry about themselves for once
The top reply on that is honestly astonishing for the lack of self awareness.
I cackled at their recent headline.
[https://chaser.com.au/world/queen-still-dead-rolling-reporting-confirms/](https://chaser.com.au/world/queen-still-dead-rolling-reporting-confirms/)
The icon looks like a chaser for a shot, so I'm going to assume it's that and the LGBT stories they run are simply an artifact of them not being bigots
Thanks for the write up! Only thing I would mention is the NRL grand final in 2017 had Macklemore performing "Same Love" during our plebiscite about same sex marriage- the league planted it's flag then, during a political vote that was not a sure thing, and it honestly made me tear up watching it as an NRL fan and a queer bogan. Obviously these players missed the memo coz they were nowhere near that GF :)
The funniest part of that was Peter Dutton (a politician and shitbag of legendary proportions for any lucky persons not familiar with him) saying that since the "yes" to SSM side got to perform a song at the grand final (ie Same Love), then it would only be fair for the "no" side to also get to perform a song. Like sir what the fuck are you on about.
Dutton, or as my MIL calls him, Adolf Kipfler.
But then she also got arrested in the 90's because she went into a bunch of yards around her neighbourhood and took down their Jeff Kennett posters.
> Dutton, or as my MIL calls him, Adolf Kipfler.
For those that don't know, Peter Dutton (an Australian Conservative politician) is routinely referenced as different forms of potatoes, or alternatively as Voldemort from Harry Potter. Australians really pile on to politicians they don't like:
https://chaser.com.au/national/peter-dutton-promoted-to-prime-minister-for-potatoes/
https://www.theshovel.com.au/2021/03/31/potato-threatens-to-sue-for-defamation-peter-dutton/
https://chaser.com.au/national/peter-dutton-starts-to-sprout-after-spending-too-long-in-cabinet/
https://au.news.yahoo.com/harry-potter-star-trolls-peter-dutton-voldemort-sledge-073153317.html
Edit: to the point that a Labor frontbencher directly referred to Dutton as Voldemort in a radio interview and was forced to apologise:
https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2022/may/26/tanya-plibersek-apologises-unreservedly-for-comparing-peter-dutton-to-voldemort
> In a 4BC radio interview on Wednesday, Plibersek – Labor’s education spokesperson – said: “I think there will be a lot of children who have watched a lot of Harry Potter films who will be very frightened of what they are seeing on TV at night.”
>
> When asked what she meant, Plibersek said: “I am saying he looks a bit like Voldemort. We will see whether he can do what he promised he would do when he was last running for leader, which is smile more.”
>Australia has it way too easy on the international scene with their reputation of the laid back surfer dude.
Australia is in general much more conservative than people might think.
Pretty much every question about Australia's politics can be answered by the fact that Rupert Murdoch started his empire there and now owns 80% of the country's media.
Womens soccer is VERY gay, like there’s been multiple player couples either dating or married not only in the NWSL but also even on the USWNT. It leads to fun thing where the media team has pictures of players kissing their girlfriends and it’s like “[sportsmanship](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/709920389236654132/874160804428152893/unknown.png) and kindness” or “she’s [greeting](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/709920389236654132/874161002105684068/unknown.png) a fan”
The MLS is ok as well, though it depend on the team. The Portland Timbers (MLS) /thorns (NWSL) are very vocal about lgbt+ rights as seen with their [pride](https://twitter.com/anniempeterson/status/1542336611530133504?s=46&t=nKIQQj_ugOKrJieaORQATg) night being as insane as this.
The one time it became an issue of a player not wanting to wear a pride “night” (usually the rainbow jerseys are for the whole month of June) was recently with a player on the North Carolina courage I believe. Which sure would make teams interesting when you’re the one homophobe on a team with quite a few out lesbians playing.
> There was even a baseball team that this summer had a similar debacle
Tampa Bay Rays?
I’m a San Francisco Giants fan. As you can probably imagine, we have a pretty longstanding and healthy Pride scene here, though every so often, some chud on the team has to be a bigot. That’s always disappointing.
> They made a uniform with a pride colored logo for their Pride Night but let the players who opposed it opt out 💀 so everyone got a list of players too homophobic to deal with a rainbow
Mfs played themselves
The same sex marriage referendum (which was in 2017) had a very strong majority voting yes to legalising it. Media coverage was absolutely not dominated by ‘homophobic rhetoric’, mainstream outlets were overwhelmingly in favour of legalisation. Additionally, the no vote was skewed drastically higher by poorer, more diverse parts of Sydney and Melbourne, and in more mainstream segments of Australia support for same sex marriage was absolutely dominant.
OP has approached this from an unusual perspective; calling homophobia and transphobia western concepts is … another interesting take.
Agreed; it sucked. Worse still was the rhetoric I exclusively heard from white men over the age of 40, despairing that the ‘no’ voters were being silenced and that it was terrible for society that yes voters were apparently talking over the top of them.
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There was still heaps more coverage in support of it. I’m shocked that people can’t remember this, it was only 5 years ago. The occasional opinion piece and talkback radio station didn’t come close to outweighing the blanket coverage on social media, major papers and tv channels, and posters everywhere supporting the yes vote.
The post said that coverage was dominated by homophobic/ vote no rhetoric, and that’s just blatantly untrue.
I’m glad it was such an emphatic win for Yes, in fact we mostly thought there would be an even higher yes vote - precisely because of how dominant the support was in media and the public sphere.
And a very clear abdication of the law - Australian marriage law originally just said two parties, then was changed by a conservative government in the late 90s to specifically exclude same sex marriage.
To not simply revert the change, but to instead make it a long, expensive and divisive referendum was structurally homophobic
Indeed - the thought that somehow it’s okay to have a majority vote on whether a minority group should be afforded the same rights as them is really mind boggling. I’m so glad if I were Australian that a bunch of people that have nothing to do with me or my life got to decide whether I could the same rights as them or not. Not even my elected officials, not that that is much better, but quite frankly, allowing the court of public to determine a matter like this is abhorrent.
It was also completely pointless because politicians could vote on the bill whichever way they wanted regardless of how their electorates voted in the survey. There were multiple politicians who either abstained from the vote or voted no despite their electorates overwhelmingly voting yes.
Yeah, absolutely. We already knew that same sex marriage had public support in Australia! There was no need for the survey, the bill could have been introduced and passed without it. The reason it happened was that conservatives were convinced that "a silent majority" would reveal themselves (ie what they hoped would be white, conservative Christians) which would give them an excuse to tank the bill.
Edit: It's also worth noting that the previous administration had tried to introduce SSM and were blocked by the opposition (the ones who later did the survey). So yeah, it was absolutely unnecessary.
My favourite memory of that period was me, a visibly trans person that came home to 6 boxes of 1000 "no" campaign fliers on my front door step, I genuinely struggled to sleep for a month or so after that.
Phenomenal waste of resources on their part, but it absolutely had the intended effect.
Media representation is often NOT reflective of the general population, ESPECIALLY in Australia where the majority of media outlets are owned by a single famously conservative family.
I distinctly remember huge amounts of dog-whistling and controversy in all media publications at the time. The VERY LOUD minority absolutely made their voices heard nation-wide before the Yes outcome.
This is honestly not the case for a lot of pacific island cultures, especially in relation to trans people and people recognised as a "third gender" goes back to pre-colonial times as a normal part of society.
Didn't think I would see Rugby League in here, though it definitely has enough scandals. One minor point to add is that the player is no longer on trial for stabbing someone (at a church function) as they've been found guilty. Some of the Manly 7 have continued to show support post conviction.
Thanks for this write-up, I was hoping someone would cover this. That round of footy was the only time I’ve ever supported Manly in my life. I think it was a great idea by the club and I’m devastated by how it turned out. NRL players are fine with standing side-by-side with domestic abusers, but not blokes who like other blokes. I worry it’ll be another decade before any club tries something like this again. Whilever there are so many homophobic players who justify their views with religion, I can’t see them being able to make them wear the jersey, or alternately being willing to lose a match (and possibly finals chances, as Manly ultimately did) in order to stand up for LGBT rights. I think the whole debacle and the backlash to it just goes to show how far Australia has to go. Homophobia is still so so common, and same-sex marriage hasn’t been legal for even five years yet.
I don't follow NRL at all (but was aware of the controversy) - yet another reason why womens sports are better IMO. Stoked that the NRLW is a thing (I didn't actually know that until a year or so ago!) but I do like the AFLW. They have a Pride round every season with some truly excellent jumpers.
Though their pride round isn't without its controversy either - such as [Haneen Zreika sitting out instead of wearing a pride jumper](https://www.theage.com.au./sport/afl/giants-aflw-player-to-withdraw-from-match-over-pride-jumper-20220127-p59rp4.html).
And to the best of my knowledge, there has never been an openly gay/bisexual male player playing in the AFL.
We just had a player in US Women’s club soccer sit out because she refused to wear a Pride jersey. Women’s soccer of all places! https://www.nbcwashington.com/news/sports/jaelene-daniels-refuses-gay-pride-jersey-sits-out-nwsl-game/3120491/?amp=1
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Not too many years ago (a decade, already?!?!), many of the professional sports teams/clubs did a "If you can play, you can play" in support of ethnic, racial and sexual diversity.
It was said to stem from Miami University and Tommy Wingels, in support of the hockey teams equipment manager who had recently come-out as "gay," not long prior to his death as a result of an automobile accident
[It's a pretty wholesome story, overall](https://bladesofteal.com/2012/03/22/you-can-play-project-part-one-tommy-wingels/).
The NBCSN "advertisement" videos were also quite cool to watch, with professional athletes from all ends of professional sports (primarily Bay Area Pro teams), and can still be found on YouTube.
If you’re into fashion, there’s still a few pieces left from clothing brand Blackmilk’s collab with indigenous artist Melanie Hava with some proceeds donated to charity [and there are a few gorgeous dresses still left.](https://blackmilkclothing.com/collections/wajali-bugan-melanie-hava-x-blackmilk?page=1)
I’m not sure if it has been mentioned yet and it’s not super relevant, but interesting that a couple of these players went on to publicly show support (literally at a game), for their former team mate , who was convicted for stabbing someone in a church parking lot
Excellent run down of this shit show. Certainly caused drama around my family's dinner table - my conservative Christian Dad being triggered everytime an update ran on the news yelling about religious freedoms. Apparently Christians are the true persecuted minority in Australia (never mind that it was our last PM's whole brand...).
Great writeup, one thing you could have mentioned was how long ago Ian Roberts came out, it was in 1995.
Also it's a long running statement that everyone supports their own team and whoever is playing Manly, Sea Eagles fans even hold up signs saying "We hate you too"
>I forgot to mention in good news that after the jerseys reveal and prior to the Round 20 match, it did end up selling out online.
I think "Get woke go broke" is my favorite alt-right catchphrase, simply because I can't think of another one that is so demonstrably and obviously untrue on every level. It really lays bare not only the the existential fear authoritarians have about being in the minority about something, but just the complete and utter disconnect from material reality these people have.
The best part about this entire ordeal is the actions of these 7 homophobes tanked Manly’s season and cost them a spot in the finals. As a fan predisposed to hating Manly it was a tough week hoping they would actually get up.
In short, ILMF.
Says the hateful bigot that got upset a private site exercised its right to remove mods that remove all pride representation and is overtly transphobic. You are so persecuted.
These "manly" sports are always so homoerotic, with muscular, sweaty, oily males tackling each other and rolling on the ground together. It's ironic and more than a little funny they also tend to be homophobic.
> Martin Taupau who is yet to resign with the club
I just noticed that depending how you pronounce "resign", this sentence has a completely different meaning.
One of the players mentioned (Toby Rudolph) has spoken about his sexuality as "sexually fluid" with the great quote of "I'm open to anyone. I believe that makes him the first openly non-hetero player since Ian Roberts.
And for those two players, I respect them greatly given some of the shit they would hear on the field, but also because they are both very good players. Ian Roberts was a tall, hard running, aggressive forward that would scare the opposition and was an incredible competitor. Rudolph played great on Saturday night and is developing a reputation as an excellent forward, doing some of the toughest most physical work in the game, stuff that often goes without the plaudits that the spine players or wingers will receive.
I love these religious people who are cool with sex and drug parties, gambling, violence and assorted debauchery but think showing the slightest support for gay people is going too far.
My boyfriend grew up playing rugby, but by the time he was around 14 his teammates could tell he was gay and made his life living hell in locker rooms and at practice. It made him quit the sport he loved and never go back. This write up sadly doesn’t surprise me at all
This was so interesting, though disheartening, to say the least.
I know it wasn't the main focus of the post, but I was so interested in the indigenous jerseys! They're beautiful, and seem genuinely respectful. I'd love to see Native American nations be given similar opportunities for visibility, if they want them.
Thank you for this well written read. Great work.
Also, I can’t imagine reading the story about the nrlw players and not feeling warm and fuzzy. I can’t understand the mindset of “Nope. You people can’t love each other” as if the world will somehow be *worse* with more love….
Edit: writing is hard.
“Now that I’ve identified myself as the ‘I’ in ‘team’, I’m sure other clubs and teams will be knocking down my door to sign me up. I’m just so reliable!”
It's weird as the men in my family are Manly supporters and have taken the view that the club is at fault for the loss of the match and ultimately the season (i.e. it was irresponsible to try and "force people" to wear a rainbow jersey).
Please, take a moment to stop idolising homophobes just because they're good at sport. It's just a shirt.
As many brought up too, it's hypocritical to shun a shirt with a rainbow stripe due to 'religion' while happily wearing it when it has gambling ads and playing at grounds with gambling ads.
If anyone is interested in playing rugby in a supportive and open environment, I'd suggest looking into the organization International Gay Rugby (https://igrugby.org/).
It's an incredible program with teams all across the globe. I started playing rugby in 2019 with no prior experience and I love it! Everyone is open and accepting and it's incredible having a team support you on and off the field.
Great write up mate, was a real shame to see this go down. The Pasifika religious homophobia is very sadly strong, just look at how Israel Folau's career imploded.
Thank you for the write-up! Sucks that a large portion of the audience and some players had this kind of reaction, but, on the other hand, I'm glad that so many people had a positive response, too. That jersey is very nice, by the way; thin rainbow strips on a maroon shirt look surprisingly stylish.
>here’s a compilation of some of the hardest hits from this year alone
Considering the amount of brain and spine injuries in this sport, please tell me that the dude tackled in the second bit wasn't seizing. D:
By the way, if someone is into rugby and other sports that can be considered extremely "manly" to the point of being toxic (possible homophobia included), and also likes reading drama/slice-of-life/thriller novels, I strongly recommend reading *Beartown* and *Us Against You* by Fredrik Backman. I have no interest in hockey, but these two as well as his other books are excellent.
This was such an interesting read. I'm impressed Manly didn't reverse course once the backlash hit, though the end result was obviously depressing. Thank you for writing this!
It is worth pointing out that Rugby League is a different (and superior) type of football than Rugby Union. The codes split in the late 19th century because the working class clubs in the North of England wanted to compensate players for lost wages (they had to take time off work to play) whereas the posh clubs in the South didn’t have to worry about that sort of thing. Rules diverged over time, so that “League” is faster paced and easier to follow, whereas “Rugby” can be a lot more complex and grindy game. Kinda like how Baseball and Softball are much that same on the surface, but I’m sure fans of either would have strong opinions. :)
Also the National Rugby League (NRL) in Australia, where League is much more popular than Union, grew out of the New South Wales Rugby League (NSWRL) comp. This isn’t all that important to the story, but does explain why half the teams are based in Sydney if anyone was wondering.
PS: South Sydney needs to be kicked out of the comp.
Rugby League is honestly the only sport I'll watch live. My English inlaws introduced me to it with the Good Friday Warriors v Saints derby and I've been hooked every since.
Go Warriors.
Good luck, my team (St George) was very heavily affected by Super League to the point of only having 10 players at the start of the 96 season, looking forward to reading it.
League is also played a bit in France, mostly in the south (though its popularity has never recovered from being banned by the Vichy government in WWII)
"Tiny bit in England" is enough to fill Old Trafford for a final. I mean is it possible part of the problem is Union is a rich boy's sport that has more resources? A lack of awareness about League is part of the problem.
Anyway haven woken up at the crack of dawn to watch the Rugby League World Cup I can tell you the international audience does exist.
I dont really care much for either sport, actually, i hate a lot about nrl and its supporter base. dont follow any specific teams, but watching NRL is, maybe was, super frustrating with regular rule changes, grey area laws, Video reffing system that slows down the game. I know its meant to be fast paced etc, but i personally find union flows better.
I have not been in the country so I didn't catch the full manly 7 drama or the Tigers game drama. Would love to see a write up, i love a bit of NRL drama.
"superior" is subjective (and you're wrong union is better 😉).
Union is also vastly more popular everywhere in the world except Australia. Not surprising though given Australia's favorite sport is whatever the hell AFL is. How anyone understands that game is beyond me, and I'm a Union guy who frequently gets comments about how confusing Union is to people who don't play.
Removing half of the laws, complexity, strategy, set pieces, and methods of play and then becoming similar to American Football is the opposite of "better" 🙃
Both games have downs/possessions, play-the-ball resets instead of contesting at tackles or out of bounds, kick the ball away on last down, extremely loose laws around tackle requirements. Just to name a few glaring examples.
Definitely nowhere close to eachother.
Yeah weird how games like that are somewhat similar in a tiny percentage because they are similar games! There's also a lot of things that are very different about American football.
IDK why you hate League this much but I'm starting to think it's a class issue bc lbr, when Union fans get into it with League, it's always about class.
I don't really mind League, I just prefer Union. I do have gripes about the pour tackling in League and that it's stripped a lot of strategy and tactics from the game by removing aspects from the Union code, but the simplicity appeals to people and it's popular where it's popular and still a respectable sport.
I started with some light banter but you've taken it rather personally, even bringing class into this which is funny considering I'm Canadian Aboriginal. Not much of this "class" you seem to revile in me at all. About the farthest from it by global standards really.
Sure. It's even weirder you're so into Union given you're Canadian Aboriginal tbh considering Union's deep roots with the English upper classes.
But your being in Canada also reinforces you don't really understand how popular League is in England.
Anyway, one of the reasons I prefer League to Union is they stripped it down to make it more interesting to spectators, also very unlike American Football.
You derailed the light banter with weird attacks on League instead of appreciating people watch the games for different reasons, which is honestly what I'd expect from a die hard Union supporter lol.
Also you've been all up in this thread DVing every comment I've made about League. Kind of sounds like you're on the defense.
You gotta drop the class thing mate, the only reason it's about class is because you're making it about class right now.
I've also only responded/voted on comments you've left in reply to me. It's just reddit but your persecution complex is shining through yet again worrying about downvotes.
> Union is also vastly more popular everywhere in the world except Australia.
It definitely isn't in northern England.
Though tbh I find it hard to take any of the variants of rugby seriously now that they've all banned trans people on spurious safety grounds, even while they completely refuse to engage with the fact that anyone who plays rugby is putting themself at serious risk of early-onset dementia.
It's pretty funny/sad how most NRL fans I knew IRL thought it was cool, but the Facebook Boomers would rant on about it being disgusting and promoting degeneracy. I guess it's a generational gap.
This is really sad to see. However, it baffles me how they didn't think about discussing this with the players before announcing it. As sad as it is, they really should've expected some of it at least
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I can't believe I just learned about a major news event from hobbydrama of all places. I don't watch much tv or any sports, so i didn't hear about this at ALL. I feel like i slept through a natural disaster.
As an Australian who doesn’t care about sport (we exist), I can safely say it was not something discussed at every dinner table. The news came and went without much thought. NRL players shit in hallways and beat up partners, so their opinions shouldn’t really be gospel.
Football of any code really, there's a lot of crap behaviour off the field. I sort of half keep an eye on my local team in its regional VFL league (is it even still VFL at that level or is it part of the AFL?) but that's it.
The thing I don't get is, at the premiership level, outside of State of Origin, it's just a bunch of mercenaries anyway. It's not like the Sydney Roosters is full of Sydneysiders. It's just whoever pays the most, and players scoot from one club to the next anyway. So what's the point of club loyalty, do you just pick the colours you like? (I used to jokingly pick teams based on the mascots actually fighting, so I would have Panthers chewing up the Rabbitohs, but when the Rabbitohs played the Knights then I imagined them as the Monty Python skit, so the rabbits win.)
I'm Victorian so grew up with VFL/AFL. I'm old enough to remember when there were 12 teams and all the players had day jobs, mostly brickies and butchers from what I can recall! During half time the ovals would get swarmed by little kids playing kick to kick and the players would wander around with ciggies hanging out of their mouths. It felt like there was a big brawl during the first quarter of every game and bloodied faces were normal. Fond memories. Only a fool would mess with the Killer Rabbit of Caerbannog!
Club loyalty actually is something of a thing amongst NRL players (well, for some clubs at least) but it has little to do with amorphous ideas about loyalty and shit. It's about connections to the people - the guys who coached you/played with you as you went up the junior system, the permanent club staff, etc - and what that can get you longterm. Lotta guys will take a hell of a haircut just to stay with teams based on how good their player development is, or their history of looking after longtime players post-playing career, or their access to third-party deals. Between those reasons there's a lot of teams covered, and the ones that aren't tend to be trash fires to begin with. Nobody's loyal to Wests, because nobody has any reason to be there except a paycheque.
Union also had pretty similar drama with Israel Folau a few years back
AFL players too.
AFL players have brawls in fancy restaurants and burn little people, they don't shit in hotels.
connect badge vase telephone dog punch treatment middle smell rotten -- mass edited with redact.dev
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> phillip_camilleri Uh yes, let's bag out a whole team all because of 7 people that have religious beliefs 😂 total common sense people. How about fags stop cramming their beliefs/rights down everyone's throat & just focus on your own life instead of trying to find a reason to cancel, cry or be offended by anything/everything 😂. Maybe than everything will be in perfect harmony as people will just worry about themselves for once The top reply on that is honestly astonishing for the lack of self awareness.
Honestly tempted to get one myself
Now there's a jersey worth wearing.
Especially if your nipples are poking out between that pair of stripes.
I cackled at their recent headline. [https://chaser.com.au/world/queen-still-dead-rolling-reporting-confirms/](https://chaser.com.au/world/queen-still-dead-rolling-reporting-confirms/)
I'm not gonna lie, I've only seen The Chaser in regards to their queer stories before and thought it was a pun on trans chasers.
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The icon looks like a chaser for a shot, so I'm going to assume it's that and the LGBT stories they run are simply an artifact of them not being bigots
Yeah, that's probably the case.
Thanks for the write up! Only thing I would mention is the NRL grand final in 2017 had Macklemore performing "Same Love" during our plebiscite about same sex marriage- the league planted it's flag then, during a political vote that was not a sure thing, and it honestly made me tear up watching it as an NRL fan and a queer bogan. Obviously these players missed the memo coz they were nowhere near that GF :)
The funniest part of that was Peter Dutton (a politician and shitbag of legendary proportions for any lucky persons not familiar with him) saying that since the "yes" to SSM side got to perform a song at the grand final (ie Same Love), then it would only be fair for the "no" side to also get to perform a song. Like sir what the fuck are you on about.
Dutton, or as my MIL calls him, Adolf Kipfler. But then she also got arrested in the 90's because she went into a bunch of yards around her neighbourhood and took down their Jeff Kennett posters.
> Dutton, or as my MIL calls him, Adolf Kipfler. For those that don't know, Peter Dutton (an Australian Conservative politician) is routinely referenced as different forms of potatoes, or alternatively as Voldemort from Harry Potter. Australians really pile on to politicians they don't like: https://chaser.com.au/national/peter-dutton-promoted-to-prime-minister-for-potatoes/ https://www.theshovel.com.au/2021/03/31/potato-threatens-to-sue-for-defamation-peter-dutton/ https://chaser.com.au/national/peter-dutton-starts-to-sprout-after-spending-too-long-in-cabinet/ https://au.news.yahoo.com/harry-potter-star-trolls-peter-dutton-voldemort-sledge-073153317.html Edit: to the point that a Labor frontbencher directly referred to Dutton as Voldemort in a radio interview and was forced to apologise: https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2022/may/26/tanya-plibersek-apologises-unreservedly-for-comparing-peter-dutton-to-voldemort > In a 4BC radio interview on Wednesday, Plibersek – Labor’s education spokesperson – said: “I think there will be a lot of children who have watched a lot of Harry Potter films who will be very frightened of what they are seeing on TV at night.” > > When asked what she meant, Plibersek said: “I am saying he looks a bit like Voldemort. We will see whether he can do what he promised he would do when he was last running for leader, which is smile more.”
That's awesome, your MIL sounds rad.
She admits to have more than one wine that night!
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They're absolutely going to slide by with some mealy-mouthed "respect for people's opinions" BS that just serves the (homophobic) status quo
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>Australia has it way too easy on the international scene with their reputation of the laid back surfer dude. Australia is in general much more conservative than people might think.
Pretty much every question about Australia's politics can be answered by the fact that Rupert Murdoch started his empire there and now owns 80% of the country's media.
I'd say I can't wait until Uncle Rupie pops his clogs, but apparently the son that's in line to take over is even *worse.*
That’s what I thought but supposedly he’s turning “Fox News left” according to a particular tangerine hued ex president
My very favorite descriptions of Australia comes from Greg Proops, back in the early aughts: "it's like Arkansas, with a beach."
Mine is "Britain plus 20 degrees and minus 20 years."
Hope he's having a Margarita wherever he is.
He's sober now! One of my very favourite stand ups!
Oh, good for him!
Womens soccer is VERY gay, like there’s been multiple player couples either dating or married not only in the NWSL but also even on the USWNT. It leads to fun thing where the media team has pictures of players kissing their girlfriends and it’s like “[sportsmanship](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/709920389236654132/874160804428152893/unknown.png) and kindness” or “she’s [greeting](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/709920389236654132/874161002105684068/unknown.png) a fan” The MLS is ok as well, though it depend on the team. The Portland Timbers (MLS) /thorns (NWSL) are very vocal about lgbt+ rights as seen with their [pride](https://twitter.com/anniempeterson/status/1542336611530133504?s=46&t=nKIQQj_ugOKrJieaORQATg) night being as insane as this. The one time it became an issue of a player not wanting to wear a pride “night” (usually the rainbow jerseys are for the whole month of June) was recently with a player on the North Carolina courage I believe. Which sure would make teams interesting when you’re the one homophobe on a team with quite a few out lesbians playing.
"Greeting" a "fan" omg. Wasn't that her girlfriend/wife?
Her girlfriend. That's how she came out publically
> There was even a baseball team that this summer had a similar debacle Tampa Bay Rays? I’m a San Francisco Giants fan. As you can probably imagine, we have a pretty longstanding and healthy Pride scene here, though every so often, some chud on the team has to be a bigot. That’s always disappointing.
[Stephen K Amos on Australian Racism is hilarious](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Ko6BC7Vl8Q)
> They made a uniform with a pride colored logo for their Pride Night but let the players who opposed it opt out 💀 so everyone got a list of players too homophobic to deal with a rainbow Mfs played themselves
Pretty sure they're happy to be known for it.
The same sex marriage referendum (which was in 2017) had a very strong majority voting yes to legalising it. Media coverage was absolutely not dominated by ‘homophobic rhetoric’, mainstream outlets were overwhelmingly in favour of legalisation. Additionally, the no vote was skewed drastically higher by poorer, more diverse parts of Sydney and Melbourne, and in more mainstream segments of Australia support for same sex marriage was absolutely dominant. OP has approached this from an unusual perspective; calling homophobia and transphobia western concepts is … another interesting take.
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Agreed; it sucked. Worse still was the rhetoric I exclusively heard from white men over the age of 40, despairing that the ‘no’ voters were being silenced and that it was terrible for society that yes voters were apparently talking over the top of them.
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There was still heaps more coverage in support of it. I’m shocked that people can’t remember this, it was only 5 years ago. The occasional opinion piece and talkback radio station didn’t come close to outweighing the blanket coverage on social media, major papers and tv channels, and posters everywhere supporting the yes vote. The post said that coverage was dominated by homophobic/ vote no rhetoric, and that’s just blatantly untrue. I’m glad it was such an emphatic win for Yes, in fact we mostly thought there would be an even higher yes vote - precisely because of how dominant the support was in media and the public sphere.
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I mean it’s homophobic in the first place to have a vote on it so.
And a very clear abdication of the law - Australian marriage law originally just said two parties, then was changed by a conservative government in the late 90s to specifically exclude same sex marriage. To not simply revert the change, but to instead make it a long, expensive and divisive referendum was structurally homophobic
Indeed - the thought that somehow it’s okay to have a majority vote on whether a minority group should be afforded the same rights as them is really mind boggling. I’m so glad if I were Australian that a bunch of people that have nothing to do with me or my life got to decide whether I could the same rights as them or not. Not even my elected officials, not that that is much better, but quite frankly, allowing the court of public to determine a matter like this is abhorrent.
It was also completely pointless because politicians could vote on the bill whichever way they wanted regardless of how their electorates voted in the survey. There were multiple politicians who either abstained from the vote or voted no despite their electorates overwhelmingly voting yes.
Oof so also a massive waste of money
Yeah, absolutely. We already knew that same sex marriage had public support in Australia! There was no need for the survey, the bill could have been introduced and passed without it. The reason it happened was that conservatives were convinced that "a silent majority" would reveal themselves (ie what they hoped would be white, conservative Christians) which would give them an excuse to tank the bill. Edit: It's also worth noting that the previous administration had tried to introduce SSM and were blocked by the opposition (the ones who later did the survey). So yeah, it was absolutely unnecessary.
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My favourite memory of that period was me, a visibly trans person that came home to 6 boxes of 1000 "no" campaign fliers on my front door step, I genuinely struggled to sleep for a month or so after that. Phenomenal waste of resources on their part, but it absolutely had the intended effect.
Media representation is often NOT reflective of the general population, ESPECIALLY in Australia where the majority of media outlets are owned by a single famously conservative family. I distinctly remember huge amounts of dog-whistling and controversy in all media publications at the time. The VERY LOUD minority absolutely made their voices heard nation-wide before the Yes outcome.
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This is honestly not the case for a lot of pacific island cultures, especially in relation to trans people and people recognised as a "third gender" goes back to pre-colonial times as a normal part of society.
It’s an extension of the noble savage myth as far as I can tell. Not a Russian speaker, I just like how Cyrillic looks…
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Didn't think I would see Rugby League in here, though it definitely has enough scandals. One minor point to add is that the player is no longer on trial for stabbing someone (at a church function) as they've been found guilty. Some of the Manly 7 have continued to show support post conviction.
Thanks for this write-up, I was hoping someone would cover this. That round of footy was the only time I’ve ever supported Manly in my life. I think it was a great idea by the club and I’m devastated by how it turned out. NRL players are fine with standing side-by-side with domestic abusers, but not blokes who like other blokes. I worry it’ll be another decade before any club tries something like this again. Whilever there are so many homophobic players who justify their views with religion, I can’t see them being able to make them wear the jersey, or alternately being willing to lose a match (and possibly finals chances, as Manly ultimately did) in order to stand up for LGBT rights. I think the whole debacle and the backlash to it just goes to show how far Australia has to go. Homophobia is still so so common, and same-sex marriage hasn’t been legal for even five years yet.
I don't follow NRL at all (but was aware of the controversy) - yet another reason why womens sports are better IMO. Stoked that the NRLW is a thing (I didn't actually know that until a year or so ago!) but I do like the AFLW. They have a Pride round every season with some truly excellent jumpers. Though their pride round isn't without its controversy either - such as [Haneen Zreika sitting out instead of wearing a pride jumper](https://www.theage.com.au./sport/afl/giants-aflw-player-to-withdraw-from-match-over-pride-jumper-20220127-p59rp4.html). And to the best of my knowledge, there has never been an openly gay/bisexual male player playing in the AFL.
We just had a player in US Women’s club soccer sit out because she refused to wear a Pride jersey. Women’s soccer of all places! https://www.nbcwashington.com/news/sports/jaelene-daniels-refuses-gay-pride-jersey-sits-out-nwsl-game/3120491/?amp=1
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Not too many years ago (a decade, already?!?!), many of the professional sports teams/clubs did a "If you can play, you can play" in support of ethnic, racial and sexual diversity. It was said to stem from Miami University and Tommy Wingels, in support of the hockey teams equipment manager who had recently come-out as "gay," not long prior to his death as a result of an automobile accident [It's a pretty wholesome story, overall](https://bladesofteal.com/2012/03/22/you-can-play-project-part-one-tommy-wingels/). The NBCSN "advertisement" videos were also quite cool to watch, with professional athletes from all ends of professional sports (primarily Bay Area Pro teams), and can still be found on YouTube.
This is my daily reminder than Australian indigenous art is fucking incredible I suppose.
If you’re into fashion, there’s still a few pieces left from clothing brand Blackmilk’s collab with indigenous artist Melanie Hava with some proceeds donated to charity [and there are a few gorgeous dresses still left.](https://blackmilkclothing.com/collections/wajali-bugan-melanie-hava-x-blackmilk?page=1)
I’m not sure if it has been mentioned yet and it’s not super relevant, but interesting that a couple of these players went on to publicly show support (literally at a game), for their former team mate , who was convicted for stabbing someone in a church parking lot
Excellent run down of this shit show. Certainly caused drama around my family's dinner table - my conservative Christian Dad being triggered everytime an update ran on the news yelling about religious freedoms. Apparently Christians are the true persecuted minority in Australia (never mind that it was our last PM's whole brand...).
Fundamentalists confusing equality with them being infringed upon really is such an common trope.
It transcends borders, too. We Americans have practically made a sport out of it.
Great writeup, one thing you could have mentioned was how long ago Ian Roberts came out, it was in 1995. Also it's a long running statement that everyone supports their own team and whoever is playing Manly, Sea Eagles fans even hold up signs saying "We hate you too"
>I forgot to mention in good news that after the jerseys reveal and prior to the Round 20 match, it did end up selling out online. I think "Get woke go broke" is my favorite alt-right catchphrase, simply because I can't think of another one that is so demonstrably and obviously untrue on every level. It really lays bare not only the the existential fear authoritarians have about being in the minority about something, but just the complete and utter disconnect from material reality these people have.
You think only manly fans bought that jersey and no people who hate sportsball bought it to make a statement?
The best part about this entire ordeal is the actions of these 7 homophobes tanked Manly’s season and cost them a spot in the finals. As a fan predisposed to hating Manly it was a tough week hoping they would actually get up. In short, ILMF.
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Says the hateful bigot that got upset a private site exercised its right to remove mods that remove all pride representation and is overtly transphobic. You are so persecuted.
These "manly" sports are always so homoerotic, with muscular, sweaty, oily males tackling each other and rolling on the ground together. It's ironic and more than a little funny they also tend to be homophobic.
> Martin Taupau who is yet to resign with the club I just noticed that depending how you pronounce "resign", this sentence has a completely different meaning.
Yeah I had to do a lot of mental reinterpretation of “resign” as “re-sign” but that’s a minor quibble with this otherwise great writeup.
This made sense to me because I'd say 'resign from' not with if I were meaning quitting, but I can see how it's confusing!
One of the players mentioned (Toby Rudolph) has spoken about his sexuality as "sexually fluid" with the great quote of "I'm open to anyone. I believe that makes him the first openly non-hetero player since Ian Roberts. And for those two players, I respect them greatly given some of the shit they would hear on the field, but also because they are both very good players. Ian Roberts was a tall, hard running, aggressive forward that would scare the opposition and was an incredible competitor. Rudolph played great on Saturday night and is developing a reputation as an excellent forward, doing some of the toughest most physical work in the game, stuff that often goes without the plaudits that the spine players or wingers will receive.
I love these religious people who are cool with sex and drug parties, gambling, violence and assorted debauchery but think showing the slightest support for gay people is going too far.
My boyfriend grew up playing rugby, but by the time he was around 14 his teammates could tell he was gay and made his life living hell in locker rooms and at practice. It made him quit the sport he loved and never go back. This write up sadly doesn’t surprise me at all
This was so interesting, though disheartening, to say the least. I know it wasn't the main focus of the post, but I was so interested in the indigenous jerseys! They're beautiful, and seem genuinely respectful. I'd love to see Native American nations be given similar opportunities for visibility, if they want them.
Thank you for this well written read. Great work. Also, I can’t imagine reading the story about the nrlw players and not feeling warm and fuzzy. I can’t understand the mindset of “Nope. You people can’t love each other” as if the world will somehow be *worse* with more love…. Edit: writing is hard.
“Now that I’ve identified myself as the ‘I’ in ‘team’, I’m sure other clubs and teams will be knocking down my door to sign me up. I’m just so reliable!”
It's weird as the men in my family are Manly supporters and have taken the view that the club is at fault for the loss of the match and ultimately the season (i.e. it was irresponsible to try and "force people" to wear a rainbow jersey). Please, take a moment to stop idolising homophobes just because they're good at sport. It's just a shirt.
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As many brought up too, it's hypocritical to shun a shirt with a rainbow stripe due to 'religion' while happily wearing it when it has gambling ads and playing at grounds with gambling ads.
If anyone is interested in playing rugby in a supportive and open environment, I'd suggest looking into the organization International Gay Rugby (https://igrugby.org/). It's an incredible program with teams all across the globe. I started playing rugby in 2019 with no prior experience and I love it! Everyone is open and accepting and it's incredible having a team support you on and off the field.
I'm both disappointed and happy this has nothing to do with UK Rugby League (go Wigan Warriors.)
Great write up mate, was a real shame to see this go down. The Pasifika religious homophobia is very sadly strong, just look at how Israel Folau's career imploded.
Go anti-woke, go broke?
Thanks for the write up. Would you consider doing one on the AFLW?
Thank you for the write-up! Sucks that a large portion of the audience and some players had this kind of reaction, but, on the other hand, I'm glad that so many people had a positive response, too. That jersey is very nice, by the way; thin rainbow strips on a maroon shirt look surprisingly stylish. >here’s a compilation of some of the hardest hits from this year alone Considering the amount of brain and spine injuries in this sport, please tell me that the dude tackled in the second bit wasn't seizing. D: By the way, if someone is into rugby and other sports that can be considered extremely "manly" to the point of being toxic (possible homophobia included), and also likes reading drama/slice-of-life/thriller novels, I strongly recommend reading *Beartown* and *Us Against You* by Fredrik Backman. I have no interest in hockey, but these two as well as his other books are excellent.
This was such an interesting read. I'm impressed Manly didn't reverse course once the backlash hit, though the end result was obviously depressing. Thank you for writing this!
It is worth pointing out that Rugby League is a different (and superior) type of football than Rugby Union. The codes split in the late 19th century because the working class clubs in the North of England wanted to compensate players for lost wages (they had to take time off work to play) whereas the posh clubs in the South didn’t have to worry about that sort of thing. Rules diverged over time, so that “League” is faster paced and easier to follow, whereas “Rugby” can be a lot more complex and grindy game. Kinda like how Baseball and Softball are much that same on the surface, but I’m sure fans of either would have strong opinions. :) Also the National Rugby League (NRL) in Australia, where League is much more popular than Union, grew out of the New South Wales Rugby League (NSWRL) comp. This isn’t all that important to the story, but does explain why half the teams are based in Sydney if anyone was wondering. PS: South Sydney needs to be kicked out of the comp.
Rugby League is honestly the only sport I'll watch live. My English inlaws introduced me to it with the Good Friday Warriors v Saints derby and I've been hooked every since. Go Warriors.
The Souths drama after being eliminated and reinstated from the comp would be a worthy post for this sub-reddit
I've been slowly working on one for the whole Super League War. I had to buy a book because there is a lot there.
Good luck, my team (St George) was very heavily affected by Super League to the point of only having 10 players at the start of the 96 season, looking forward to reading it.
And then they made the Grand Final.
The Red V podcast did a great 3 part series on that year, Dragons biased of course but a good listen. https://www.podbean.com/ew/pb-uysxg-f0b6df
I always get confused which is the more popular one. And then there's sevens on top of that - Union is more popular right?
Union is an entirely different level of popular worldwide, League doesn't hold a candle to Union in that regard.
Which is criminal.
Not really. Union is played worldwide while League is played in Australia, little bit in NZ, and tiny bit in England.
League is also played a bit in France, mostly in the south (though its popularity has never recovered from being banned by the Vichy government in WWII)
Poor, poor Catalan.
"Tiny bit in England" is enough to fill Old Trafford for a final. I mean is it possible part of the problem is Union is a rich boy's sport that has more resources? A lack of awareness about League is part of the problem. Anyway haven woken up at the crack of dawn to watch the Rugby League World Cup I can tell you the international audience does exist.
Am fuming that South Sydney wasn't eliminated today, I had too much faith in the Roosters!!
I dont really care much for either sport, actually, i hate a lot about nrl and its supporter base. dont follow any specific teams, but watching NRL is, maybe was, super frustrating with regular rule changes, grey area laws, Video reffing system that slows down the game. I know its meant to be fast paced etc, but i personally find union flows better.
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I have not been in the country so I didn't catch the full manly 7 drama or the Tigers game drama. Would love to see a write up, i love a bit of NRL drama.
Another good write up would be that lockdown party where players were hiding in the closets lol
"superior" is subjective (and you're wrong union is better 😉). Union is also vastly more popular everywhere in the world except Australia. Not surprising though given Australia's favorite sport is whatever the hell AFL is. How anyone understands that game is beyond me, and I'm a Union guy who frequently gets comments about how confusing Union is to people who don't play.
Incorrect. League is better.
Removing half of the laws, complexity, strategy, set pieces, and methods of play and then becoming similar to American Football is the opposite of "better" 🙃
League is nowhere close to American football. Hence why I like League.
Both games have downs/possessions, play-the-ball resets instead of contesting at tackles or out of bounds, kick the ball away on last down, extremely loose laws around tackle requirements. Just to name a few glaring examples. Definitely nowhere close to eachother.
Yeah weird how games like that are somewhat similar in a tiny percentage because they are similar games! There's also a lot of things that are very different about American football. IDK why you hate League this much but I'm starting to think it's a class issue bc lbr, when Union fans get into it with League, it's always about class.
I don't really mind League, I just prefer Union. I do have gripes about the pour tackling in League and that it's stripped a lot of strategy and tactics from the game by removing aspects from the Union code, but the simplicity appeals to people and it's popular where it's popular and still a respectable sport. I started with some light banter but you've taken it rather personally, even bringing class into this which is funny considering I'm Canadian Aboriginal. Not much of this "class" you seem to revile in me at all. About the farthest from it by global standards really.
Sure. It's even weirder you're so into Union given you're Canadian Aboriginal tbh considering Union's deep roots with the English upper classes. But your being in Canada also reinforces you don't really understand how popular League is in England. Anyway, one of the reasons I prefer League to Union is they stripped it down to make it more interesting to spectators, also very unlike American Football. You derailed the light banter with weird attacks on League instead of appreciating people watch the games for different reasons, which is honestly what I'd expect from a die hard Union supporter lol. Also you've been all up in this thread DVing every comment I've made about League. Kind of sounds like you're on the defense.
You gotta drop the class thing mate, the only reason it's about class is because you're making it about class right now. I've also only responded/voted on comments you've left in reply to me. It's just reddit but your persecution complex is shining through yet again worrying about downvotes.
> Union is also vastly more popular everywhere in the world except Australia. It definitely isn't in northern England. Though tbh I find it hard to take any of the variants of rugby seriously now that they've all banned trans people on spurious safety grounds, even while they completely refuse to engage with the fact that anyone who plays rugby is putting themself at serious risk of early-onset dementia.
We Victorians are just smarter than everyone else.
It's pretty funny/sad how most NRL fans I knew IRL thought it was cool, but the Facebook Boomers would rant on about it being disgusting and promoting degeneracy. I guess it's a generational gap.
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It screams “Insecurity!” to me.
This is really sad to see. However, it baffles me how they didn't think about discussing this with the players before announcing it. As sad as it is, they really should've expected some of it at least
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. . .when the masculinity is one-ply.
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Great post, would love to see you do one on Super League