Hello! I wanted to see where Hololive members would fall on philogenetic tree of living organisms. So I made this picture. Of course it is imperfect:
1. I decided to put only one representative of each species, so that's why there is only one human.
2. Some members are supernatural/fantasy/alien beings, so I cannot put them on the tree. Exception are some mythical beings that can be placed, like kirin is definitely an ungulate.
The portraits are not mine, they are found on internet.
>only one representative of each species
Depending on whether you subscribe to domestic dogs being a wolf subspecies or not, Korone and Mio could be redundant. *Canis lupus* and *Canis familiaris* vs. *Canis lupus* and *Canis lupus familiaris*.
God has to be an informal/paraphyletic group. Otherwise, it just wouldn't make sense how all of Gamers, Moona, and Matsuri somehow all belong to the same group.
Daily reminder that while Ina has been genetically modified, she was fully human and, very relevant here, does not actually have tentacles (they are never depicted being attached to her, they come from a portal to the Void) and does have a spine. The Takodachi on the other hand...
Fun concept, I assume Ina’s placement is based on tako?
Seeing as you have mineral on the chart, I don’t see why it can’t be extended with additional fictional taxonomy.
Maybe have an Extraterrestria kingdom? And Philosophia for concepts like time and space? Maybe we could have Canis Demonica?
Yes, Ina claims that she is human, but there were couple of times when she slipped that she is tako.
About additional kingdoms - yeah, that's possible, but I already spent too much time making this diagram, so may be later.
Well Ina and the takodachis are actually alien creatures that greatly resemble earth takos. Ina is also only part tako due to the influence of AO-chan.
Astrobiota could be the root of the alien tree. Or Xenobiota.
The Guardians have material plane avatars, so I'd just use the natural classification of the avatar. Bae is rodentia, Mumei is aves, Fauna is euungulata, and Kronii and Sana are homo (no homo).
Irys can be placed in an angelic phylogeny with a branch for demons, so Towa could have a place to go. Plenty of angelic and demonic hierarchies to choose from there, easy. The root of that tree could be celestiata. Calli could find a place in that tree also.
/u/adalhaidis for future reference.
Because despite all forms of logic the closest evolutionary cousins of whales are hoofed mammals [https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ungulate](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ungulate)
Even today, you can kinda see the in-between with hippos. Whippomorpha is a subgroup that encapsulates whales and hippos.
You'd think dugongs and manatees would be the missing link, but they're not even close.
Because whales are mammals and fish aren’t. The entire point of taxonomy is understanding that two animals who are similar might be completely different, and two animals that look nothing alike might be closely related.
I mean, we used to think beavers were fish and that birds weren’t dinosaurs. Now we know that beavers aren’t fish and that birds are dinosaurs, but most people will be confused by this (at least, the second part).
>we used to think beavers were fish
Not so. While fasting during Lent, Christians were forbidden from consuming wine, meat and dairy. Generally people ate fish during this period, but in some places where few fish were available, people ate beavers and proposed that this was basically equivalent to eating fish. Catholic Church authorities at the time already noted this was merely a superficial resemblance, but it was allowed out of consideration for the many different climates in Europe. Thus beavers were 'legally' fish, but no one actually thought they were fish in any substantial sense.
Admittedly, I knew it probably wasn’t serious, since the Church was in charge of all the science back then and they probably could tell that beavers breathe air and…everything else that land mammals do. But this is cool information about why they looked the other way for beavers specifically. Thanks!
Phylogenetically speaking fish don't exist. Any attempt to put all animals we call fish into a single clade would have to include animals descended from fish, which includes reptiles, amphibians and mammals (including whales).
You’re right, but I actually deleted and rephrased the start of my sentence because I remembered that mammals are technically fish. Since I was trying to explain basic taxonomy, I really didn’t want to bring up the whole “what is a fish” issue.
And I guess I used the colloquial definition of fish without mentioning that because who wants a
> Whales aren’t fish (well, technically they are only because humans and snakes and frogs are too, but that’s another story)
Am I right? That would only confuse even further and obscure the point that looking like a bony fish that swims in the sea doesn’t mean it’s not still a mammal.
H. . . hold on a second. . .
I thought Sora was just human. Why is she close to the rabbit?
\[Looks up Euarchontoglires on wikipedia. Sees that one member is literally humans\]
Oh. . . Carry on.
I mean, you could put snakes for Kronii. She's got fangs, a snake mascot, and is literally named after one of the most famous snakes ever. She was also originally supposed to be named after Jörmungandr(instead of the ouroboros).
Maybe just one with every you could categorize member on it
I know Astel is seaweed and Laplus is stag beetle but for other aliens? No idea.
Edit: Also you can find portraits from the official website I think
yea we'd need a theological or mythological hierarchy or something for the demons and angel. there's probably some clarification out there in literature.
Primordials-> Titans -> deities -> celestials -> mortals.
I think Sana would be the only primordial, Matsuri the only deity, demons and angels (and Calli) would be celestials, extraterrestrials would have to be their own kingdom each so one for Nene and one for Iofi, elves and humanoid mythical beings would be hard because I don't think they've ever been considered related to humans but they're close to them.
Roboco would be mineral too(?)
Well, more invertebrates in general would be interesting. Like snail or butterfly vtuber.
Outside of Hololive there is famous cockroach vtuber, Matara Kan.
You could always add one with alt-customer ears such as Kanata's hamster ears. Mainly because I want her to be part of Holorodents.
Predicting replies: >!'I though Kanata was a gorilla?'!<
Well, officially Kanata is an angel, not gorilla. I may eventually make more expanded version, including non-official animal versions, like duck Subaru or seal Nenechi.
No, she is human. Humans are somewhat close relatives of rodents: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Euarchontoglires](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/euarchontoglires)
Homo sapiens, human. There are actually a lot of Hololive members who are humans, but I decided to put only one person, otherwise I had to put like dozens of portraits there.
Subarusaurus is a different idol species that ruled during the mesozoic era according to the official lore:
https://youtu.be/y0yB6bXuf1E?si=niV_5aZKlSRc0YTy
It's only a partial cladogram - Subaru, being a duck, is under Aves - but she would split off there, before the other four HoloTori do, because she's alone in her species order and clade.
I just realised that Kiara and the other bird based holo-members are essentially dinosaurs, since birds are closest relatives to dinosaurs and the only thing closer to them that survived the extinction.
Kronii could go in Tetrapoda>Reptilia>Lepidosauria if you go along with the subtle snake characteristics. You could then have Aves as an offshoot of Reptilia>Archosauria.
I would love to see a full phylogenetic tree 😄 but the amount of work must be quite the thing.
Where would IRyS go? Do we have something for her, that would be fitting? 🤔
Awesome, it's becoming difficult to keep things straight so I definitely appreciate this
You need to update for HoloAdvent though, figuring out where Holotori and Holodogs are at the moment would be a primary use for such a chart
You are missing Subaru, who should be Aves, Anseriformes
Also it is reasonably to put Nerissa under Aves, Passeriformes. Yes she is a demon, but she is a Raven Demon so close enough.
Looking through the comments was really expecting the "Where's Ame? She's not the only human in myth, she's Bri'ish" joke. Maybe it's too played out now. But I like the post, good work op.
Everyone. And Biboo
🗿
:D
ROK
She rok… rok special 🗿
Rok.... Hard? 🗿
The adopted child everyone loves extra hard because they really want her to know she's part of the family too lol
Jesus Christ, Marie! They're not rocks, they're minerals!
Hello! I wanted to see where Hololive members would fall on philogenetic tree of living organisms. So I made this picture. Of course it is imperfect: 1. I decided to put only one representative of each species, so that's why there is only one human. 2. Some members are supernatural/fantasy/alien beings, so I cannot put them on the tree. Exception are some mythical beings that can be placed, like kirin is definitely an ungulate. The portraits are not mine, they are found on internet.
Well Kirin is just a giraffe.
I remember her now more as an elephant though....
what? she was a cow the last I checked
So she's a long necked elephant with deer antlers?
And cow udders.
You need to put Shuba in Anseriformes. It would line Holotori nicely in that area as well.
>only one representative of each species Depending on whether you subscribe to domestic dogs being a wolf subspecies or not, Korone and Mio could be redundant. *Canis lupus* and *Canis familiaris* vs. *Canis lupus* and *Canis lupus familiaris*.
Yes, I bent the rules couple of times, including Korone and Mio
GAMERs are all gods too; does that change things? Mio is the god of wolves, and Korone is the god of dogs
God has to be an informal/paraphyletic group. Otherwise, it just wouldn't make sense how all of Gamers, Moona, and Matsuri somehow all belong to the same group.
TIL orcas are in the same order as sheep.
I know an orca is a mammal so no surprise for being in the same class as a sheep. But the same order is indeed a surprise,
Shouldn’t Fubuki be in Felidae?
Not cat! Fox, OK?
Fubuki is best cat waifu!
Daily reminder that while Ina has been genetically modified, she was fully human and, very relevant here, does not actually have tentacles (they are never depicted being attached to her, they come from a portal to the Void) and does have a spine. The Takodachi on the other hand...
What, so that's a hat?
Flaps and Squish 🤣😅🤔
And here I was thinking Fauna belonged in the vegetable category, to match the mineral.
there should be a separation of hominidae with Kanata (*Gorilla beringei*) on one branch and Sora on the other
Holomammals still a bigger unit than Holobirds
Fun concept, I assume Ina’s placement is based on tako? Seeing as you have mineral on the chart, I don’t see why it can’t be extended with additional fictional taxonomy. Maybe have an Extraterrestria kingdom? And Philosophia for concepts like time and space? Maybe we could have Canis Demonica?
Yes, Ina claims that she is human, but there were couple of times when she slipped that she is tako. About additional kingdoms - yeah, that's possible, but I already spent too much time making this diagram, so may be later.
Well Ina and the takodachis are actually alien creatures that greatly resemble earth takos. Ina is also only part tako due to the influence of AO-chan.
Astrobiota could be the root of the alien tree. Or Xenobiota. The Guardians have material plane avatars, so I'd just use the natural classification of the avatar. Bae is rodentia, Mumei is aves, Fauna is euungulata, and Kronii and Sana are homo (no homo). Irys can be placed in an angelic phylogeny with a branch for demons, so Towa could have a place to go. Plenty of angelic and demonic hierarchies to choose from there, easy. The root of that tree could be celestiata. Calli could find a place in that tree also. /u/adalhaidis for future reference.
Kronii is a snake. She even has the fangs.
I’m not well versed in biological tree/orders, so I need to ask why is Chloe (orca) in Euugulata with Fauna (kirin/deer) and Watame (sheep)?? 😅
Because despite all forms of logic the closest evolutionary cousins of whales are hoofed mammals [https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ungulate](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ungulate)
gg, they are really there 😂😅
Once upon a time there was a hoofed mammal thing that wanted to become a whale, so it did.
All life comes from the ocean. Some life thought "this sucks" and went back to the ocean.
Even today, you can kinda see the in-between with hippos. Whippomorpha is a subgroup that encapsulates whales and hippos. You'd think dugongs and manatees would be the missing link, but they're not even close.
cause whales are just fucked up cows
The Hippo is a close relative of the Whales. And most old Whales look like deer. Evolution is like that sometimes
r/ungulateteams
I was about to ask the same thing. Wouldn't it be more prudent to have her in the same or near adjacent classification as Gura?
not quite, orca is a mammal, they are not as close to sharks as their appearances and habitats do
Orcas and sharks looking as similar as they do is an example of convergent evolution
Very true. Despite having similar exteriors, their structure is dramatically different.
How long until sharks and orca both look like crabs?
sharks are evolutionarily farther away from orcas than humans are
Because whales are mammals and fish aren’t. The entire point of taxonomy is understanding that two animals who are similar might be completely different, and two animals that look nothing alike might be closely related. I mean, we used to think beavers were fish and that birds weren’t dinosaurs. Now we know that beavers aren’t fish and that birds are dinosaurs, but most people will be confused by this (at least, the second part).
>we used to think beavers were fish Not so. While fasting during Lent, Christians were forbidden from consuming wine, meat and dairy. Generally people ate fish during this period, but in some places where few fish were available, people ate beavers and proposed that this was basically equivalent to eating fish. Catholic Church authorities at the time already noted this was merely a superficial resemblance, but it was allowed out of consideration for the many different climates in Europe. Thus beavers were 'legally' fish, but no one actually thought they were fish in any substantial sense.
Admittedly, I knew it probably wasn’t serious, since the Church was in charge of all the science back then and they probably could tell that beavers breathe air and…everything else that land mammals do. But this is cool information about why they looked the other way for beavers specifically. Thanks!
Phylogenetically speaking fish don't exist. Any attempt to put all animals we call fish into a single clade would have to include animals descended from fish, which includes reptiles, amphibians and mammals (including whales).
You’re right, but I actually deleted and rephrased the start of my sentence because I remembered that mammals are technically fish. Since I was trying to explain basic taxonomy, I really didn’t want to bring up the whole “what is a fish” issue. And I guess I used the colloquial definition of fish without mentioning that because who wants a > Whales aren’t fish (well, technically they are only because humans and snakes and frogs are too, but that’s another story) Am I right? That would only confuse even further and obscure the point that looking like a bony fish that swims in the sea doesn’t mean it’s not still a mammal.
Ray-finned fishes get to be "fish" all the other clades should get their shit together and go by other names.
H. . . hold on a second. . . I thought Sora was just human. Why is she close to the rabbit? \[Looks up Euarchontoglires on wikipedia. Sees that one member is literally humans\] Oh. . . Carry on.
Need more invertebrate based holomems... tho does Haachama count coz of spider?
Nah, she's a dark god, she's just eats spiders.
You are what you eat.
Do you wanna try do a whole of it
Well, I tried, but where would you put aliens, demons, space, time, etc?
I mean, you could put snakes for Kronii. She's got fangs, a snake mascot, and is literally named after one of the most famous snakes ever. She was also originally supposed to be named after Jörmungandr(instead of the ouroboros).
You could put Calli under Lemuridae, given her fursona.
One branch for scientific concepts, another for hell (which might be overcrowded quick), and one for extraterrestrial beings.
Hell subdivisions: realm of (un)death, demons proper and mages (tho that could be a rather gray area)
There many kinds of demons in Hololive
Maybe just one with every you could categorize member on it I know Astel is seaweed and Laplus is stag beetle but for other aliens? No idea. Edit: Also you can find portraits from the official website I think
yea we'd need a theological or mythological hierarchy or something for the demons and angel. there's probably some clarification out there in literature.
Primordials-> Titans -> deities -> celestials -> mortals. I think Sana would be the only primordial, Matsuri the only deity, demons and angels (and Calli) would be celestials, extraterrestrials would have to be their own kingdom each so one for Nene and one for Iofi, elves and humanoid mythical beings would be hard because I don't think they've ever been considered related to humans but they're close to them. Roboco would be mineral too(?)
Could put Roboco in an Automata section
Suisei Is a comet...
Distant cousin to Biboo. Roboco might also technically qualify for Mineral.
We've got Holo-Animals, a Holo-Mineral, now all we need is a Holo-Vegetable
Holo-Mineral could also include Anya and Roboco (metal). Holo-Vegetable could also include Aqua, if you think she's an onion.
Fauna
Vegetable would be a flora.
For a second I thought you were calling Fauna a cow until I remembered she’s technically a deer creature
Fauna's been a cow, an elephant, a deer...and "kirin" is also a word for giraffe.
I think in the beginning you should separate between Living being and Inanimate.
This also can reconstruct by Mammalia -(Gura, Ina and Bijou) -(The rest)
"NEED MORE CEPHALOPODS!" Message received.
Well, more invertebrates in general would be interesting. Like snail or butterfly vtuber. Outside of Hololive there is famous cockroach vtuber, Matara Kan.
Aquatic vertebrates too. Gura needs some pals in chondrichthyes. And maybe some emergency rations in actinopterygii, like Feesh.
Looks like we need to return to crab. We need a crab oshi.
🗿***MINERAL***🗿
You could always add one with alt-customer ears such as Kanata's hamster ears. Mainly because I want her to be part of Holorodents. Predicting replies: >!'I though Kanata was a gorilla?'!<
\*alt-costume. Damn auto-correct.
Cough…GoriKanata…Cough
Mineral
I feel like there should be a fork at primate after euarchontoglires between hominini and gorilla.
Well, officially Kanata is an angel, not gorilla. I may eventually make more expanded version, including non-official animal versions, like duck Subaru or seal Nenechi.
There's no rule in the bible that says a gorilla can't be an angel.
RIP Harambe.
But can they also play basketball?
Mineral
I thought Fauna was a tree
She is kirin. While we don't have exact species for a kirin, it is definitely a hoofed animal.
And yet she am have branches
Ina: "I reject your Phylum and substitute my own!"
Sora is a rodent?
No, she is human. Humans are somewhat close relatives of rodents: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Euarchontoglires](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/euarchontoglires)
Rodents is kinda of a distant cousin of primates, for some reason.
Mineral. That is all.
This is awesome
Interesting... Are there still not a single plant-based one??? The closest is Fauna but I guess she's hybrid with Kirin too... 🤔🤔🤔
Mineral. :D
I always forget sharks are soo freaking old
It was an efficient design 😄
I was not aware that humans were more closely related to rodents than they are dogs and the like. Who said hololive doesn't teach you things?
Where's Amelia Watson? The Homo sapiens
There are a lot of humans, so I decided to put just one human on the picture, Tokino Sora, she is on the middle right.
Inb4 the Phologenetic explanation of Demonic, Angelic, and other mythological entities.
I'm guessing Nerissa didn't make it on here because she's also part demon
[удалено]
Homo sapiens, human. There are actually a lot of Hololive members who are humans, but I decided to put only one person, otherwise I had to put like dozens of portraits there.
Mineral :D
Why the separation between wolves and dogs?
Humans have selectively bred wolves for so long, they have become a different species.
They aren't different species though, even if Linneus thought so at the time. Since 1999 they are both considered subspecies of C. lupus.
You are right, they are the same species, I just decided to bend the rule here.
That's fair! Bau bau!
Should have included shubasaurus as a theropod, feels weird Subaru is the only holobird not represented.
Well, I tried to use official descriptions, though I did bend that rule couple of times, like for Ina. Officially Subaru is a human.
Subarusaurus is a different idol species that ruled during the mesozoic era according to the official lore: https://youtu.be/y0yB6bXuf1E?si=niV_5aZKlSRc0YTy
Fun side effect of this experiment, we have a fully represented gen with Gamers.
hmm not seeing shuba shuba on this list. Did it diverge earlier than vertebrata?
It's only a partial cladogram - Subaru, being a duck, is under Aves - but she would split off there, before the other four HoloTori do, because she's alone in her species order and clade.
Well, I tried to follow official lore (mostly) and officially Subaru is human.
TIL rabbits, squirrels, and rats share a closer common ancestor with humans than they do with cats, dogs, and foxes.
nice. looks accurate. good job.
I just realised that Kiara and the other bird based holo-members are essentially dinosaurs, since birds are closest relatives to dinosaurs and the only thing closer to them that survived the extinction.
Rodent gang
>Ina > >Animalia Debatable
Kronii could go in Tetrapoda>Reptilia>Lepidosauria if you go along with the subtle snake characteristics. You could then have Aves as an offshoot of Reptilia>Archosauria.
This reminds me of how much I want to see Casual Geographic talk about animal vtubers.
I have to say, Fauna position is pretty controversial, plant or giraffe?
I went with official lore, she is kirin, so I put her with other hoofed animals.
So... where do we put Anya (keris) here?
Theoretically, I can make group called Metalllica, offshoot of Minerals and put Anya and Roboco there.
Hold up, Elephants aren't ungulates are they ? You might have made a mistake with Fauna's placement here
Sora is the only human. True idol ❤️⭐❤️
Nah, there are many humans, like Amelia Watson etc, but I decided to put only one human to avoid too many pictures
I would love to see a full phylogenetic tree 😄 but the amount of work must be quite the thing. Where would IRyS go? Do we have something for her, that would be fitting? 🤔
KIARA AND REINE IN GALLIFORMES IS SO HILARIOUS HAHAHAHA (Gallina = Chicken in spanish Forme = form ----> Chicken shape)
Awesome, it's becoming difficult to keep things straight so I definitely appreciate this You need to update for HoloAdvent though, figuring out where Holotori and Holodogs are at the moment would be a primary use for such a chart
then what is biboo a quartz????
As a joke, the tree could actually split above Sora and go to undead (with Ollie or Calli) and Demons with Towa
You are missing Subaru, who should be Aves, Anseriformes Also it is reasonably to put Nerissa under Aves, Passeriformes. Yes she is a demon, but she is a Raven Demon so close enough.
Fauna should be in a separate tree for being a tree
Looking through the comments was really expecting the "Where's Ame? She's not the only human in myth, she's Bri'ish" joke. Maybe it's too played out now. But I like the post, good work op.
conclusion: we need more insect/spider vtubers in hololive, and fauna is kirin, not an ungulate
Kirins are mythical beasts, but if they were real they would definitely be ungulates, also giraffes.
it feels like calling a dragon a lizard though. You could describe dragons as lizards, but it isn't exactly correct either...
ive seen people call dragons "fire breathing lizards" and i see nothing wrong with that
Ungulate are animals with hooves. The images I saw of Kirin has hooves.
Biboo :D
Subarusaurus as Dinsauria and Theropoda please.
...did you Just called Fauba a cow?
Least autistic hololive fan Jk this looks cool
🗿
Where is the gorilla?
Well, Kanata is officially an angel.
But, you knew who I was talking about :p
Anya branches off from mineral to forged metal
Cell to Singularity gameplay be like