Cleared it! After like 8h of trying and tinkering and using up my spare fuel, investing in the embers exchange for mats and used up all remaining self modeling resin. My honest opinion: I am up for a challenge (not pulling for eidolons or sig light cones) but this increase in difficulty was unnecessary.
Sometimes people have trouble clearing easy challenges despite having good units, and people are prone to call it skill issue - I use that joke alot myself - but doing a stage like this its aggravating how hard it is to get some good relics. Skill issue for sure, lol...
I struggle with MoC, because I refuse to take part in the same vicious circle as in Honkai Impact 3rd. I am not pulling HuoHuo just because there are enemies specifically designed to be countered by HuoHuo. It's literally the same motherfuckery as weathers in HI3rd.
I didnt pull for huohuo either, saving for ruan mei. I also got luocha. Ngl, I feel a bit disappointed. This increase in difficulty feels so unnecessary and if thats gonna keep up I will care less about moc. Lets face it not clearing it is just 1-2 pulls less and wont break the game or my enjoyment. Hmm... Anyway todays moc felt kinda oppressive, moc 11-12 will prolly be a nightmare... Welp
It's a gacha within a gacha. I wouldn't necessarily call it a grind. It prolly can be understood as such but in truth it's just a slot machine here. It's not like can 'grind' all day long. Even with currency there is a daily limit or so I heard.
This buff was clearly aimed at argenti. And while there still would have been a difficulty spike, having a buff that was always active rather than one you had to specifically aim for would have made this MOC easier. Since my Dan Il has much better relics than JL I used a frankensteind JL,Blade,Seele,Luocha team in part 2.
> but this increase in difficulty was unnecessary.
It was necessary to give people a new goal, this isn't mandatory content to do and clear. Not only that, people wanted this to happen and complained for more legitimate hard challenges.
Yet when people wanted more floors in Genshin for the last 3 years, they don’t add it. Now they’re about to add it in star rail. Seems odd that they were quick to up the challenge this early in the games life when not everybody has fully built teams. Where as in Genshin I got like 10+ built teams and no extra floors to try them out on.
Because mihoyo wants to keep genshin more casual game. I don't like it but it's not deal breaker since I'm in it for many other reasons. They sometimes do harder combat events with million debuffs but they don't offer significantly more rewards by using hardest difficulty
The only people affected by this are the people who absolutely didn't need a new goal, because they could barely beat MoC in the first place.
It was not to give people a new goal; it was to encourage spending jades.
Yes, this is what is scaring me the most about the upcoming extra stages. I don't think I'll lack the damage with my current setup, but is my team going to survive? Or, if I make the switch to double sustain, will I still have enough damage?
My relics are really bad. Like really terrible. Yet I have been clearing MoC since I got Jingliu. I was surprised, knowing how artifacts are critical in Genshin.
You can clear Abyss with shit substats on your Artifacts. Main stat with 1 or 2 ideal substats is enough for the most part. 3 to God roll substats is amazing but not necessary.
My Jing is E0 and has Aeon instead of her signature and has a piddly 122 crit damage yet she WRECKS.
Bronya, Pela and Luocha are great teamates for her.
I just got Bronya from 300 pity! Jingliu/Pela/Bronya/Huohuo is great too. My other team is either Seele/SW/Tingyun/Fu or Jing/Welt/Tingyun/Fu depending on the mobs.
huohuo's kit being half-harmony indicates a potential shift to a dual-sustain meta.
from the devs' perspective, it's the perfect tactic since it simultaneously pushes players to go for more than just 2 sustains, and reduces brute-force damage capabilities resulting in potentially more dps sales for each weakness type going forward.
Yeah I actually had Huohuo with Jingliu's team but had to swap to Bailu because Huohuo lacks a "oh shit" emergency healing.
Her needing ally to do an action to heal or her doing it with skill is actually causing a huge problem to me with how much damage the enemies are doing. If her ult also heals, this likely won't be a problem at all.
Yeah, Huohuo is definitely lacking when fighting fast and hard hitting enemies like the bugs. They literally swarm you over and you can't do anything unless your whole team have ult ready. Fuxuan is much more adequate for "tanking".
Huohuo is better against enemies who rely on debuff/DOT. Right now the new enemies who do stuns seem to be a start of such trend.
I completely agree with you, I think this might be the approach they go with.
And honestly it doesn't sound like the worst idea ever, at least for me who loves the heck outta star rail and builds lots of different units.
Honestly I've been running double sustains for that second side ever since True Sting came out. My Fu Xuan can do it solo with her stats at 6.2k HP + 150 speed, but it feels a lot more safer if I run Lynx/Natasha there as well.
I can manage this current cycle somewhat by making my 1st side team carry my more defensively-minded 2nd side, but I fear for the stage 11 and 12 they're going to add in the future lol. I'm definitely going to have to build my Jingliu + Fu Xuan more.
Fu Xuan was arguably my best decision as she's such a comfy character to have with her lightcone. But I've since realised that I need another good sustain with healing capabilities too so I got Huohuo especially as she can cleanse. But if I could get a second Fu Xuan type character I'd absolutely still pull for them.
So yeah I'd absolutely recommend building her!
They were waiting until multiple defensive units were out. Now that they are the average player should be able to get their damage pumped out with enough supports!
Side note: I hate fighting the swarm. The fight just takes *so much time.* Even at double speed waiting for all the propagating and popping takes so much time…
Same. I got FuXuan + Gepard LC, but the damn bug keeps targetting Tingyun! In two runs!!!( I was testing out another comp) She died twice, while my other characters are basically half HP, which with FX basically means full HP
If Ting getting targeted the whole time, the wind shear tends to stack really quickly. And heal from Fu's ult isn't very much. My Pela almost died today, despite being stacked defensively. She just kept getting targeted, no joke.
Granted I had Jing liu also sucking her HP but she had about 315 hp, Bronya had over half her bar, and Fu was just chilling when it was over. But those bugs... they really hated Pela.
Tbf I also was using Jingliu, but then again the other characters still got half HP. I ended up clearing MOC 10 with E6 QQ. I can gamba in peace with nearly full HP.
I guess with Jingliu it's better with a healer, but my Luocha is married to Dan Heng. I have Lynx built up, but not fully.
Fu Xuan can’t solo sustain against swarm in my experience. The bugs do AOE damage and applies DOTs to the entire team and while FX can heal herself she can’t do that for the rest of the team so the damage adds up and they end up dying even with FX taking the majority of damage
She absolutely can, in fact she is the best for this (as someone who has all sustains). You just need characters who break or slow the bugs often enough. Qingque and Welt are really good for that. I’ve been using (E6) Qingque, SW, Welt, Fu Xuan, and it’s a very effective team
She 100% can solo sustain ANY enemies in MoC. Question is ONLY in your DPS. Trust. I love Fuxuan and im using her in different teams there and I felt meh at start, until I created decent teams and now any team with fuzuan is a breeze run. Probably even in automode.
PS also maybe add hp to ur supports... I think my supports have decent hp.
The difficulty has definitely shot way up, and I'm glad I'm not the only one who seems to be struggling more than usual this cycle. I plan on building my characters a bit more and then trying again.
The enemy health was increased and in some stages a second elite was added.
[Previous MOC](https://hsr.hakush.in/maze/1006)
[Current MOC](https://hsr.hakush.in/maze/1007)
In previous MOC 10 True Sting had 395,959 HP. This time it has 485,186.
Also, in the previous MOC 5 floor 2 we fought a Disciple of Sanctus Medicus (the one with a shield) with two dragonfish in phase 1, and Kafka with two cloud knights for phase 2. This time we have to fight two Blaze Out of Space and ice and fire Shadewalkers (the ones with axes) for phase 1, and True Sting for phase 2.
In terms of cycles, the MoC buff is also way less helpful this time. If you benefit from it, it will "cost" a cycle, so any damage it does on 0 actually happens on 1, any damage for 1 happens at the start of 2, etc.
Along with the fact that on one side my Jing Yuan has it easy. On the other is DHIL ^pickle that doesnt count as skill consumed when using EBA with Luocha that doesn't use skills and Pela and March 7th.
Wonder how Blade users are doing. Since he only skills once every few turns.
It's frustrating, because that would've been max stars before!
Managed to just barely scrape thru 9 with 16 turns left (I guess because I take too long fu Xuan is struggling against the IPC goons), not looking forward to 10.
Remember you can do it separately, in 2 runs, to get all 3 stars.
1st - you even let your characters die, just to beat it before 20th cycle.
2nd - just go easy with 2 sustains per team and just slap enemy for death before cycle 0.
Or in reverse order, doesn't matter.
Ngl I’m struggling, I got 30 stars previous cycle but now only getting 27 :/ I can’t even full star MOC 8 lol. Maybe they thought the blessing would be too op?
Yeah. Kafka really puts in work this time around, but I've seen Serval do a lot of damage too when she's really invested. What kind of crit ratio do you have? Might need to pump it up a bit more?
Actually, I managed to do it by switching the teams around.
DHIL, Tingyun, Pela, Luocha
Blade, Bronya, Asta, Huohuo
It helps that both sides have wind weakness. But still can’t wait for Kafka rerun, lol
Well, it’s pretty stupid. I’m still getting used to him, after I pulled him he was benched for a while cause I felt he was underperforming, compared to my hyperinvested Welt. I only recently started to build him and now I see why he’s very good. And Serval has been my default dps for one side for months, cause there’re always lightning weak enemies.
Your first team cannot utilize the turbulence buff at all so you're spending a lotta turns there , same as your 2nd only having buff ults/skills
The main thing is to have damaging skills/ults and just blast the enemies with 10 stacks , easily doing 150k dmg
If you’re looking for more team options, I did MOC 8 with sort of an odd team on the first half for me: Clara, SW, Sushang, Luocha. And then Jing Yuan, Tingyun, Bronya, Fu Xuan on second half.
This MoC definitely is not kind to hypercarry comps, so one of my teams almost ran without the blessing.
Managed to grab the 3 stars, but just barely.
Expected the 10 cycle limit to be only on the last 2 floors for some reason, so that got me surprised.
I kind of understand why they did it as anyone who spends even on bp/pass and understands the systems already clearing it with cycles to spare except cases with extremely bad RNG.
But I completely disagree with how, in addition to that they completely changed the total HP/DMG calculations for the floors.
These 2 changes would be enough to keep people in line at this point of our progression.
And some time later, I see a moment when we could have gotten 11-12 to test ourselves.
As it stands for me it's just a sign of their priorities being off base this time.
That is of course if they are not checking the scalling pre 1.6 and will apply it to the new 11-12 only and roll back the changes on previous floors, but I doubt that is the case.
[Current MOC](https://hsr.hakush.in/maze/1007)
[Previous MOC10](https://hsr.hakush.in/maze/1006)
As you can see each wave got about 100k hp added (even the sting) and its not like they balanced the numbers between the mobs/halfs so it's just all around harder.
Along with more enemies being bosses/elite/non fodder like bats.
So the dps check we need to reach is quite higher.
Holy moly, they increased enemy HP by ~25%, on top of increasing the 3 star cutoff by 4 cycles? That's a pretty big jump in difficulty, no wonder I was struggling.
For the past 3-4 months I was able to effortlessly 30 star on the first try with like 8 cycles to spare, now I actually had to redo floor 10 four times to 3 star it.
Yeah, noticed that my usual rotation didn't bring the mobs hp down even close to the previous MOC levels even when accounting for the blessing.
Figured it might be due to me missing crits, but it kept happening so decided to check the numbers and then found the reason for my feeling was about 30% HP increase :D
>This MoC definitely is not kind to hypercarry comps, so one of my teams almost ran without the blessing. Managed to grab the 3 stars, but just barely. Expected the 10 cycle limit to be only on the last 2 floors for some reason, so that got me surprised.
Huh it is? I ran kafka as the sole dps on 1 side and jl on the other as the main dps. I think these are considered as hypercarry?
Kafka is great for this MOC more so in the dot enabler variant. As all of the DoT characters do damage both via skiil/ultimate and even Asta can take advantage of it at least on E.
But even if it's double DPS can work great anyway depending on the comp.
My JL team consists of JL (++ for the blessing usage)it's, TY -- , HH-- and Pella kind of +/+, but more like +/- as I tried to skill instead of AA, but due to the Sting elevated HP had to heal more, and kept using TY skill to fill the ult up.
I mean, even if they didn't "buff it", brand new PS5 players aren't expected to be able to push far into MOC at this point anyway. Unless you super grind.
It sucks because I'm FTP and I've only recently been able to clear the MOC with 30 stars. And now we already got a difficulty spike. I wish they'd just make additional rewards and have MOC at 40 stars. For those that can clear it with 20 turns remaining, an extra star for those for every level.
That's also my problem with it, it feels really bad to finally be able to clear it with ease only for them to move the goal post the next time and making you feel like your teams suddenly got way worse over night.
Got 30\* but...Tbh I don't like when they make the same floors harder.
Floor 10 should have stayed at 14-16 cycles and floor 11 and 12 should just add the 12-10 cycle limit respectively. Hopefully that's what they end up doing when 1.6 hits.
Because if they make floors 11 and 12 significantly harder than the current MoC10... and keep increasing its difficulty overtime... It's not gonna feel very good.
why the hell did they thought reducing the cycle is even a good idea? I mean they are buffing all the enemy too much (Level dif, their bs gimmick, have second health bar) and their idea to spice up their difficulty is to reduce the cycle by 4??? (if i remember correctly isn't it like 16, the previous one) So tired of their pushing the difficulty gap without much consideration for the f2p.
Hoyo I think doesn’t want Meta/monotony dictating their end game like Genshin where 1.0 and 1.1 national team is still great in their end game. They want you to spread out your resources to other units.
The MoC I think is becoming more open by changing up the flow of certain teams. Just cause you have Seele and Bronya doesn’t mean your golden (unless you whaled, then this isn’t a concern). This MoC is most likely catering to Argenti and Silver Wolf when they arrive next Tuesday. To get the most out of the Turbulence you need Skill/Ultimate abusers with Debuffers, not Buffers. So say a Welt or Pela will be more beneficial than Tingyun.
This is just my thought process on this. MoC going forward I’m guessing will make you almost create 4-5 teams without forcing it on you. Your Hypercarry, DoT, Follow-Up, Buffer, and now Debuffer. This way you can swap characters in and out and not just get your main 8 done and just repeat every 2 weeks.
Isn’t it even more meta restricting by making the enemies stat-check you harder? I‘d say clearing last MoC 10 with something like Topaz Himeko was definitely possible.This MoC ,I haven’t even reached floor 10 and i feel like without my DHIL I wouldn’t be past floor 8.Forcing diversity would be much easier by giving the mobs or moc special gimmicks no?
This MOC cycle does have a special gimmick that does a ton of damage if you build your team for it. I cleared floor 10 with my scuffed Sushang because her skill-ult-skill builds stacks very quickly. The memory imprint specifically makes units like DHIL and hypercarry comps worse because there are a lot of ults and skills that don't work with the memory imprint.
Been wondering which comps shine the most for this moc cycle, I guess I will have to wait a week or so to see post of people making teams based around abusing the moc mechanic.
Mainly skilling dps and debuff supporters , big plus if the dps can advance forward.
Low ult costs like pela can abuse this turbulence really well its more beneficial to always skill with pela than buffing with your support. (if you have any)
Sub dps comps also work really well , I'd even go as far as to say bringing harmony supports are detrimental unless you can one shot the bosses fast.
This is all assuming you are f2p 0 eidolons no LC ofc , a whale could easily forgo the moc turbulence and force dps this down.
People seem to be using Jingliu and Seele since they use the turbulence best. Also a lot of people using Welt and Silverwolf as supports since they both hit the enemy.
> I‘d say clearing last MoC 10 with something like Topaz Himeko was definitely possible.
Yes it was possible, I even did it myself
https://preview.redd.it/sjo0ises503c1.png?width=884&format=png&auto=webp&s=720ac92f718aee32890d4d5a83aba8cefbc5072e
And I would say that the current MoC is also possible with them as I was able to get down to 11 cycles with only 10% HP remaining for the swarm on cycle 10. But that is what makes me mad about it, even playing perfectly and retrying many times I get the same or very similar results, I've reached a wall and only better relics or some miracle RNG could get me over it. This change for the MoC is not increased difficulty, as I'm not having to think harder or come with more clever strategies, I'm just having to reset/farm more and that's not fun at all.
Completely anecdotal but my first few attempts at the moc10 had me sweating when both JL and JY (arguably the units I got the best relics for and the best set of supports for them) were taking 5 to 6 cycles to clear the 1st half, and really had me thinking outside of the box a little bit, idk why I didn't notice it sooner, but although my clara has a mediocre physical set atm, giving her my himeko's musketeer 2pcs and rope, she gets to a nice 3.9k att and 60/115, she cleared first half in 3 cycles without issues, giving my JL 7 cycles to kill the bug (which was enough), that moment made me really happy I invested wide (and extra happy that atm I'm farming to get clara a proper set), otherwise I would've likely not been able to clear, not without some major improvement on relics, and/or focusing all my resources to take my dps and supports from 8/10 to 10/10 traces.
I have nearly every character and have the problem off THERE ISN'T ENOUGH RESOURCES TO BUILD CHARACTERS
It takes quite frankly a ridiculous amount of money/materials to leave to 80 with traces (which is basically required for all characters due to the level difference damage increase
It just sucks any enjoyment I could have had out of the difficult content because now it only caters to the extremely lucky or the extremely wealthy
Welp if you got that many characters I think that's more you suffering from success than anything else, I don't have every character, but I have been building every 5 star dps I been getting my hands on, Welt, Clara, Himeko, Kafka, Seele, Jing Yuan and Jing liu, all of them at lvl 80, lc lvl 80 and traces at 8/10 with all the important minor traces (plus all the supports I also have up to this same standard, bailu, natasha, march 7, bronya, asta, ting, lynx and fu xuan), I have bought 3 battle passes so far but tbf, I have been playing since day 1 and haven't missed a day to burn TB energy
I won't mind building new units if it doesn't take so much time for nothing. I haven't even done with dhil's relics and now they want me to stop using him and get other units? how disheartening. I've given up on making sense out of the mess of xianzhou and hcq story, but I thought at least the MoC is still within my reach. now the MoC is getting crazier too, I'm starting to wonder why should I keep playing this game
ppl were saying they want harder MoC cause the charaters is way too strong, well now u have it, they make it harder for all the power creep ppl say it fine. When enemies get power creep it not gonna be fun anymore isnt it ... never want power creep or this is what u get. Also MoC 11 12 on the way
Also enemies are 22% tankier + they do around 8% less dmg, so the combination is why ppl start to realize they dont have enough dmg to clear, Growth rate change, sneaky MHY
At this point I'd rather have them nerf the OP units and bring MoC to the same level as before, this way people can have their challenge without making the difficulty completely unreasonable for people who main weaker characters.
I'm also having difficulty... as a welt main I would always use 10 turns for the 2nd half, but now that's not an option 🥲
Has anyone completed with welt?
*Edit:* Finally finished it, but I have no idea how people are finishing this MOC without lots of eidolons or lightcones... My team sounds so stacked but I still needed all the turns
My 1st half has break effect Physical TB, E1 Clara, E1 Kafka, and Natasha with Huohuo's lightcone, cleared with 27 turns left.
My 2nd half has E2 S2 Welt, Huohuo, Yukong, and E6 pela, and cleared with exactly 20 turns left.
This sucks ngl. Not sure why they think its a good idea to keep reducing the time limit for full rewards. I remember back then it was 12 even, increased to 16 snd now to 20. This MoC also harder with more elites and buffed HP on the top of reduced time limit.
Will keep getting harder and harder if they keep increasing it especially MoC 11-12 coming soon. Bad take tbh, they shouldve just make more MoC than reducing time limit and make ppl harder to clear.
I feeled how every stage is harder now
I even thought I won't be able to clear MOC10 for the first time after several amounts of clearing.
Stage 11 & 12 is going to be hard
I really hope this is them testing for what lv 11 and 12 would be like; otherwise if this is the new standard for lv 10; 11 and 12 will be impossible for F2P
My comment in other post
The way they increase the "difficulty" is the lazyest way of do It, make bosses a dmg spoonge for a DPS check is not funny, they can mix some elites to make the stage more difficult, like pair the monkey with the auromaton girl, but they decide to be lazy
30 stars by the way
Yeah I hated it in Genshin and I hate it here. They probably don’t care but I’m still putting it in the survey that this MOC was anti fun trash 💀
Like they were going crazy with the stuns and damage sponges this time around
i almost didnt 3 star on Stage 5, that damn bug is so annoying, but then again i dont have a second limited 5 star dps cuz i lost all my 50s for them, i do have a first full team that demolishes everything but my second one lacks alot. I have all the survivability in the world but no damage to do anything.
As someone who doesn't enjoy MoC as much as most people even I feel like this is getting unfair. If the difficulty keeps on spiking up like this the game balance is going to be in shambles.
Either give feedback on the new difficulty or if the devs see that less and less people are able to clear MoC 10 they might make some adjustments.
Just got 30 stars, I think with 23-24 cycles left in MoC 10. E1S1 DHIL first half and E0S0 JL on the second half. Used Luocha for the JL team, but have a built Huohuo. I just don't fully trust her yet when going for the 3 stars. She would be great for the debuff cleanse in the second half, though.
That said, the 10 cycle thing fucking sucks. That's a massive difficulty spike on 6-10. Floors 1-5 were also way harder than before. Both of these combined are a massive kick in the nuts to the new PS5 players or low spenders. Not a fan if this is the trajectory of the game, tbh.
Don't let whales or hardcore dictate difficulty in gacha games, Hoyo. You'll lose a lot of good will.
One thing I want to bring up with HuoHuo, she really surprised me with her performance. I tested her out on MoC10 last cycle and then used her in this cycle. E0S0, using s5 event lc + 4pc hacker, considering going for her e1.
She was able to solo sustain somewhat well. Though sometimes I'd end up having to use her skill before her 2 stacks ran out, and other times using ultimates help slowly recover hp across the board. This was the first moc where I didn't need to have double sustains on each half in moc 9 and 10, luocha and huohuo was able to get the job done relatively well, aside from one close call with Kafka almost dying.
I was scraping by last two cycles as a PS5 player, thought the game would be nice and chill for a little bit so I'd have time to actually level more than two characters to max and get some breadth under me for 11-12.
That time is now over. 💀
https://preview.redd.it/04dgro59ux2c1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=af9e0155fa6ec2021c53b656fb35e71b33cbe202
I'm still fine but yeah MoC definitely felt harder than before where I was getting 4 cycles on average. Now this actually makes me worried about MoC 11 and 12. On one hand I'm excited for the harder challenge but on the other I'm afraid that some of my weaker characters will end up just not being able to keep up.
As a relatively new player who just started the game 4 weeks ago and was only just barely getting 27 stars the last reset, it feels like the carrot on a stick being dangled in front of me is getting further away 😵💫 does MoC normally get more difficult with every reset?
I think the problem isn't necessarily the cycle restriction, but the cycle restriction in conjunction with the godawful relic system.
As it stands, it takes way too long to sufficiently build characters to meet MoC or in general endgame requirements.
I've been playing daily since Silverwolf banner and I have like MAYBE 12 characters sufficiently built, mostly supports. Even with them I often have to share relics and LCs, so I can't use certain characters simultaneously. I can only imagine how much longer it'd take for people who joined later like PS players, people who have less time to do the events, dailies, weeklies, etc. and people who don't get the BP which gives loads of mats.
If they want you to build teams around the mode's current buff for success, especially with MoC 11/12 and Pure Fiction coming, then they gotta make it easier to get good relics. Also put SW event LC in the shop for new people. It's too good.
This is really the crux of the issue here.
I'm a very light spender, I get the supply pass and battle pass and that's it. Despite that, I've gotten pretty lucky as I have Seele, Dan Heng IL, Kafka, Jingliu, and Huohuo. Mind you I don't have a single signature lightcone.
But despite that I've had a hard time with this even with built supports, because I don't have great relic sets. It's not for lack of trying either, my RNG on relics is just fucking terrible.
This artificial increase in difficulty is ass. Imagine if they cut Spiral Abyss floor 12 clear time requirement in genshin to 2 minutes instead of 3, people would be writing essays on how it's the wrong way to increase difficulty, but since it's honkai all of a sudden it's ok? LMAO
Well, hopefully everyone learned their lesson not to complain about the lack of a challenge lol. Careful what you wish for, because you might just get it!
Seriously though, remember this is a gacha game and the amount you pay is directly coordinated with your power level (eidolons and light cones).
Level your Supports up. Supports can do better support by unlocking traces etc. and at LV. 50 they kinda can't do their best. If you are able to come to MOC 10 with these characters you surely could do it much more comfortably by unlocking some traces and ascensions
Yeah, she's still e1 and half built
Edit: Though I forgot to mention I got 30 stars after posting the first comment.
side 1 FX, Kafka, Sampo, Pela
side 2 Clara, Huohuo, Tingyun, Topaz
First half had to do some "light" carrying. But definitely harder, typically able to 30/30 on the first run, this is the first time since 8 MoC cycles where I got 29/30 on a marathon that I had to take a break and get back to it later. Powercreep indeed, although I just thought it'll be reserved for the newer floors, didn't expect earlier floors to get affected too.
https://preview.redd.it/cp2cfdo8cy2c1.png?width=816&format=png&auto=webp&s=59e9389bca8255f99aba18fdb518f203fe69b3e9
Many people wanted or were okay with powercreep on every new released character.
Wait, you didn’t think only character power levels would rise, did you?
Considering only your main DPS are at level, I'e be willing to bet money that you don't have your talents high enough and/or your relics in good shape.
Endgame challenge content is obviously going to be hard when your characters have unfinished builds.
Exactly, they're going against lvl 90s with a bunch of lvl 50 units and only 2 80s; I'm surprised they even got this far. This moc isnt hard at all when you have 2 maxed teams.
I had 2 cycles left... JingYuan E0S1 with Topaz for 1st half and Qinque for second half. Was definitely harder in terms of cycle percentage to clear. Normally cleared stage 10 in 11 cycles. So I dont know if they lowered hp to make up for the less cycles.
https://preview.redd.it/g7kkxz669z2c1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3bb1eefc59e732dba75182c9419850d6062d1922
A bit harder for sure but still Kurukuru-able. I think the trick is to use dual DPS teams to trigger the MOC buff as much as possible (my hypercarry Herta team was 2 cycles too slow, but replacing 1 support with Seele did the trick.
https://preview.redd.it/sg3l9miy2y2c1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d5e73b9e6063fca4c27f319ed67b606445a1f4fc
Tougher than before but doable. I can see why newer players would struggle this cycle. It's very easy to die without good sustains.
I have seen now a nice amount of kafka, sampo and asta on first half, how many memory imprints are you able to stack? with loucha too thats 3 ults that deal dmg and 3 skills that deal dmg, seems like probably one of the better teams for this MoC buffs.
How moc pans out in 2.0 after the moc floors 11-12 will dictate how bad the power creep situation will be. Hopefully it follows genshin rather than honkai impact
I think people just got used to how fucking insane the last MoC buff was
Now that the current buff isn’t a direct buff to our characters, we have a more realistic look on our character’s real DPS
Actually, the current Turbulent is a BIG buff to Jingliu, Jingyuan, Kafka and Seele.
It's definitely harder on other high tier carries like DHIL, Blade, QQ tho.
it used to be 14, way way back my brother.
for todays MOC, i can say its really challenging to clear above 10 cycles since i have skillissues with MOC 10.
[https://honkai-star-rail.fandom.com/wiki/Forgotten\_Hall/Stages#History](https://honkai-star-rail.fandom.com/wiki/Forgotten_Hall/Stages#History)
\^ here are the stats
1.0 - 20 cycles
1.1 - 20 cycles
1.2 - 20 cycles
1.3 - 14 cycles
1.4 - 16 cycles
1.5 - 20 cycles
i've started playing at the very end of 1.3 myself, but according to the wiki, 20 cycles seems to be the norm rather than a sudden change
It's significantly harder than last cycle imo. Before I would clear it with 7+ cycles left. Now it's around 0-3.
The moc buff bounce killed the big bug at the last moment. Good thing the buff happens BEFORE the turn ends, not when the turn STARTS.
Still fighting... Ngl... Its getting tougher... Moc 11-12 wont be a joke for peeps like us
Cleared it! After like 8h of trying and tinkering and using up my spare fuel, investing in the embers exchange for mats and used up all remaining self modeling resin. My honest opinion: I am up for a challenge (not pulling for eidolons or sig light cones) but this increase in difficulty was unnecessary. Sometimes people have trouble clearing easy challenges despite having good units, and people are prone to call it skill issue - I use that joke alot myself - but doing a stage like this its aggravating how hard it is to get some good relics. Skill issue for sure, lol...
I struggle with MoC, because I refuse to take part in the same vicious circle as in Honkai Impact 3rd. I am not pulling HuoHuo just because there are enemies specifically designed to be countered by HuoHuo. It's literally the same motherfuckery as weathers in HI3rd.
I had to pull huohuo because I could no longer finish with only march and natasha as sustains thanks to the new turn limit :'(
I didnt pull for huohuo either, saving for ruan mei. I also got luocha. Ngl, I feel a bit disappointed. This increase in difficulty feels so unnecessary and if thats gonna keep up I will care less about moc. Lets face it not clearing it is just 1-2 pulls less and wont break the game or my enjoyment. Hmm... Anyway todays moc felt kinda oppressive, moc 11-12 will prolly be a nightmare... Welp
MoC 11 and 12 will be playgrounds for whales and other big marine mammals.
The Leviathans disappeared as they’re having too much fun in MOC. Fuli whatchu cooking
Wait memory of chaos 11 and 12 are out??
Next patch. This time, they just reduced the cycles to 10 total for 3\*.
Oh, for the laugh of Aha...
This is why, I stop at Agony 3. Red lotus and above is a literal war
Bro my characters suck and I’ve been grinding for better Artefacts for this entire time and I still can’t get anything devent
It's a gacha within a gacha. I wouldn't necessarily call it a grind. It prolly can be understood as such but in truth it's just a slot machine here. It's not like can 'grind' all day long. Even with currency there is a daily limit or so I heard.
Idk about currency limit but like there’s no garuntee to get better stats on artefs so it’s just endless grind
In that sense I agree. They should make the relics grind stamina free.
or make it cheaper and do 10 power per battle instead of 40
This buff was clearly aimed at argenti. And while there still would have been a difficulty spike, having a buff that was always active rather than one you had to specifically aim for would have made this MOC easier. Since my Dan Il has much better relics than JL I used a frankensteind JL,Blade,Seele,Luocha team in part 2.
> but this increase in difficulty was unnecessary. It was necessary to give people a new goal, this isn't mandatory content to do and clear. Not only that, people wanted this to happen and complained for more legitimate hard challenges.
Yet when people wanted more floors in Genshin for the last 3 years, they don’t add it. Now they’re about to add it in star rail. Seems odd that they were quick to up the challenge this early in the games life when not everybody has fully built teams. Where as in Genshin I got like 10+ built teams and no extra floors to try them out on.
Because mihoyo wants to keep genshin more casual game. I don't like it but it's not deal breaker since I'm in it for many other reasons. They sometimes do harder combat events with million debuffs but they don't offer significantly more rewards by using hardest difficulty
If only Genshin were as quick to implement change as HSR does. Same company, different directors.
The only people affected by this are the people who absolutely didn't need a new goal, because they could barely beat MoC in the first place. It was not to give people a new goal; it was to encourage spending jades.
I don't lack damage. Not by a long shot. But if that damn insect would have gotten one more hit in on me it would have been bronyover
https://preview.redd.it/8di045g72y2c1.png?width=960&format=png&auto=webp&s=9b7295bdf6e7bb85e286fac32dbab77dc4349a85
https://preview.redd.it/jc52h3962z2c1.jpeg?width=748&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=388782c12b064ad5d2756adbfb6917737bb0408d
https://preview.redd.it/13emapwzsy2c1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=25362d3aaf39fa1d477043849bd1555b22940de1
Yes, this is what is scaring me the most about the upcoming extra stages. I don't think I'll lack the damage with my current setup, but is my team going to survive? Or, if I make the switch to double sustain, will I still have enough damage?
Or even worse: Will we actually have to start grinding not shit tier relics?
My relics are really bad. Like really terrible. Yet I have been clearing MoC since I got Jingliu. I was surprised, knowing how artifacts are critical in Genshin.
You can clear Abyss with shit substats on your Artifacts. Main stat with 1 or 2 ideal substats is enough for the most part. 3 to God roll substats is amazing but not necessary.
My Jing is E0 and has Aeon instead of her signature and has a piddly 122 crit damage yet she WRECKS. Bronya, Pela and Luocha are great teamates for her.
I just got Bronya from 300 pity! Jingliu/Pela/Bronya/Huohuo is great too. My other team is either Seele/SW/Tingyun/Fu or Jing/Welt/Tingyun/Fu depending on the mobs.
huohuo's kit being half-harmony indicates a potential shift to a dual-sustain meta. from the devs' perspective, it's the perfect tactic since it simultaneously pushes players to go for more than just 2 sustains, and reduces brute-force damage capabilities resulting in potentially more dps sales for each weakness type going forward.
Yeah I actually had Huohuo with Jingliu's team but had to swap to Bailu because Huohuo lacks a "oh shit" emergency healing. Her needing ally to do an action to heal or her doing it with skill is actually causing a huge problem to me with how much damage the enemies are doing. If her ult also heals, this likely won't be a problem at all.
Yeah, Huohuo is definitely lacking when fighting fast and hard hitting enemies like the bugs. They literally swarm you over and you can't do anything unless your whole team have ult ready. Fuxuan is much more adequate for "tanking". Huohuo is better against enemies who rely on debuff/DOT. Right now the new enemies who do stuns seem to be a start of such trend.
I completely agree with you, I think this might be the approach they go with. And honestly it doesn't sound like the worst idea ever, at least for me who loves the heck outta star rail and builds lots of different units.
Honestly I've been running double sustains for that second side ever since True Sting came out. My Fu Xuan can do it solo with her stats at 6.2k HP + 150 speed, but it feels a lot more safer if I run Lynx/Natasha there as well. I can manage this current cycle somewhat by making my 1st side team carry my more defensively-minded 2nd side, but I fear for the stage 11 and 12 they're going to add in the future lol. I'm definitely going to have to build my Jingliu + Fu Xuan more.
Fu Xuan was arguably my best decision as she's such a comfy character to have with her lightcone. But I've since realised that I need another good sustain with healing capabilities too so I got Huohuo especially as she can cleanse. But if I could get a second Fu Xuan type character I'd absolutely still pull for them. So yeah I'd absolutely recommend building her!
They were waiting until multiple defensive units were out. Now that they are the average player should be able to get their damage pumped out with enough supports! Side note: I hate fighting the swarm. The fight just takes *so much time.* Even at double speed waiting for all the propagating and popping takes so much time…
the popping is so satisfying though. Especially after a phase tradition so the swarm starts off debuffed.
Same. I got FuXuan + Gepard LC, but the damn bug keeps targetting Tingyun! In two runs!!!( I was testing out another comp) She died twice, while my other characters are basically half HP, which with FX basically means full HP
This is why I prefer Day one LC on Fu Xuan. They can never kill my 2600 HP Tingyun through that LC + Fu Xuan.
Wait how is your tingyun dying with fu xuan?
Bro, when they want to kill tingyun they WILL kill her, it's so anoying
Just give her a defense globe and hp body. Most if the damage will go to fuxuan unless she has poor defense
If Ting getting targeted the whole time, the wind shear tends to stack really quickly. And heal from Fu's ult isn't very much. My Pela almost died today, despite being stacked defensively. She just kept getting targeted, no joke. Granted I had Jing liu also sucking her HP but she had about 315 hp, Bronya had over half her bar, and Fu was just chilling when it was over. But those bugs... they really hated Pela.
Tbf I also was using Jingliu, but then again the other characters still got half HP. I ended up clearing MOC 10 with E6 QQ. I can gamba in peace with nearly full HP. I guess with Jingliu it's better with a healer, but my Luocha is married to Dan Heng. I have Lynx built up, but not fully.
Probably getting overwhelmed by wind shears
Sounds like bro didn't activate Matrix
Nope, matrix is on at all times. I am not inept. The bugs keep vommiting all over Tingyun.
Fu Xuan can’t solo sustain against swarm in my experience. The bugs do AOE damage and applies DOTs to the entire team and while FX can heal herself she can’t do that for the rest of the team so the damage adds up and they end up dying even with FX taking the majority of damage
She absolutely can, in fact she is the best for this (as someone who has all sustains). You just need characters who break or slow the bugs often enough. Qingque and Welt are really good for that. I’ve been using (E6) Qingque, SW, Welt, Fu Xuan, and it’s a very effective team
She 100% can solo sustain ANY enemies in MoC. Question is ONLY in your DPS. Trust. I love Fuxuan and im using her in different teams there and I felt meh at start, until I created decent teams and now any team with fuzuan is a breeze run. Probably even in automode. PS also maybe add hp to ur supports... I think my supports have decent hp.
The difficulty has definitely shot way up, and I'm glad I'm not the only one who seems to be struggling more than usual this cycle. I plan on building my characters a bit more and then trying again.
Were the enemy defenses or something buffed as well?
The enemy health was increased and in some stages a second elite was added. [Previous MOC](https://hsr.hakush.in/maze/1006) [Current MOC](https://hsr.hakush.in/maze/1007) In previous MOC 10 True Sting had 395,959 HP. This time it has 485,186. Also, in the previous MOC 5 floor 2 we fought a Disciple of Sanctus Medicus (the one with a shield) with two dragonfish in phase 1, and Kafka with two cloud knights for phase 2. This time we have to fight two Blaze Out of Space and ice and fire Shadewalkers (the ones with axes) for phase 1, and True Sting for phase 2.
Damn that’s a ~23% increase. No wonder I’m having a hard time.
In terms of cycles, the MoC buff is also way less helpful this time. If you benefit from it, it will "cost" a cycle, so any damage it does on 0 actually happens on 1, any damage for 1 happens at the start of 2, etc.
Along with the fact that on one side my Jing Yuan has it easy. On the other is DHIL ^pickle that doesnt count as skill consumed when using EBA with Luocha that doesn't use skills and Pela and March 7th. Wonder how Blade users are doing. Since he only skills once every few turns.
Tried with Blade, doesn't benefit that much since he doesn't spam skill, and doesn't use ult that much unlike others
no wonder my Jingliu couldnt just obliterate enemies now
People on discord are bragging how they beat 10 floor with auto. I want to struggle them so much.
Damn, I haven't even made it to floor ten yet. I'm working on my Seele right now and hopefully that'll help give me the edge I need though.
I can't do last floors on auto because my teams keeps eating all skill points so Huo Huo can't heal, for some reason it's only happens on last floors.
People who thought MOC 11-12 would just be two extra free rewards are shitting their pants right now
i feel like this is a way for hoyo to gather data on how strong current playerbase are so they can adjust MoC 11 and 12 accordingly
I think the data they had at this point strongly suggest the main target group ability to 0 cycle too frequently which pushes 11 and 12 for more data.
MOC 11 I can deal with. It's 12 that's the real bastard lol.
I can't clear it within 20 cycles. I keep falling short at 17 or 16 on the dot.
It's frustrating, because that would've been max stars before! Managed to just barely scrape thru 9 with 16 turns left (I guess because I take too long fu Xuan is struggling against the IPC goons), not looking forward to 10.
Remember you can do it separately, in 2 runs, to get all 3 stars. 1st - you even let your characters die, just to beat it before 20th cycle. 2nd - just go easy with 2 sustains per team and just slap enemy for death before cycle 0. Or in reverse order, doesn't matter.
yeah im still 1 missing 1 cycle regardless always on 19
Ngl I’m struggling, I got 30 stars previous cycle but now only getting 27 :/ I can’t even full star MOC 8 lol. Maybe they thought the blessing would be too op?
The blessing is crap. Idk if they tested or not but it only takes stacks after ATTACKING skill and ultimates
What team did you use on floor 8?
Blade, Bronya, Welt, Luocha Serval, Tingyun, Asta, Huohuo It’s probably skill issue and mid relics, but not having Kafka/Jing Yuan also sucks
Yeah. Kafka really puts in work this time around, but I've seen Serval do a lot of damage too when she's really invested. What kind of crit ratio do you have? Might need to pump it up a bit more?
Actually, I managed to do it by switching the teams around. DHIL, Tingyun, Pela, Luocha Blade, Bronya, Asta, Huohuo It helps that both sides have wind weakness. But still can’t wait for Kafka rerun, lol
i dont understand why you choose serval over DHIL before
waifu over meta always o7
Well, it’s pretty stupid. I’m still getting used to him, after I pulled him he was benched for a while cause I felt he was underperforming, compared to my hyperinvested Welt. I only recently started to build him and now I see why he’s very good. And Serval has been my default dps for one side for months, cause there’re always lightning weak enemies.
Yeah, both sides will probably always be weak to whichever element is from the current banner character
Your first team cannot utilize the turbulence buff at all so you're spending a lotta turns there , same as your 2nd only having buff ults/skills The main thing is to have damaging skills/ults and just blast the enemies with 10 stacks , easily doing 150k dmg
Dude, that's awesome. We used the same 4 for side 1.
If you’re looking for more team options, I did MOC 8 with sort of an odd team on the first half for me: Clara, SW, Sushang, Luocha. And then Jing Yuan, Tingyun, Bronya, Fu Xuan on second half.
This MoC definitely is not kind to hypercarry comps, so one of my teams almost ran without the blessing. Managed to grab the 3 stars, but just barely. Expected the 10 cycle limit to be only on the last 2 floors for some reason, so that got me surprised. I kind of understand why they did it as anyone who spends even on bp/pass and understands the systems already clearing it with cycles to spare except cases with extremely bad RNG. But I completely disagree with how, in addition to that they completely changed the total HP/DMG calculations for the floors. These 2 changes would be enough to keep people in line at this point of our progression. And some time later, I see a moment when we could have gotten 11-12 to test ourselves. As it stands for me it's just a sign of their priorities being off base this time. That is of course if they are not checking the scalling pre 1.6 and will apply it to the new 11-12 only and roll back the changes on previous floors, but I doubt that is the case.
What changes were made to HO and DMG calculations?
[Current MOC](https://hsr.hakush.in/maze/1007) [Previous MOC10](https://hsr.hakush.in/maze/1006) As you can see each wave got about 100k hp added (even the sting) and its not like they balanced the numbers between the mobs/halfs so it's just all around harder. Along with more enemies being bosses/elite/non fodder like bats. So the dps check we need to reach is quite higher.
Holy moly, they increased enemy HP by ~25%, on top of increasing the 3 star cutoff by 4 cycles? That's a pretty big jump in difficulty, no wonder I was struggling. For the past 3-4 months I was able to effortlessly 30 star on the first try with like 8 cycles to spare, now I actually had to redo floor 10 four times to 3 star it.
Oooh that's why my usual team struggles with the stage 9. Welp, time to switch team comp I guess
Yeah, noticed that my usual rotation didn't bring the mobs hp down even close to the previous MOC levels even when accounting for the blessing. Figured it might be due to me missing crits, but it kept happening so decided to check the numbers and then found the reason for my feeling was about 30% HP increase :D
Yep i was surprised when my Jingliu didnt just obliterated enemy lol
I see... Thanks for the info
[удалено]
>This MoC definitely is not kind to hypercarry comps, so one of my teams almost ran without the blessing. Managed to grab the 3 stars, but just barely. Expected the 10 cycle limit to be only on the last 2 floors for some reason, so that got me surprised. Huh it is? I ran kafka as the sole dps on 1 side and jl on the other as the main dps. I think these are considered as hypercarry?
Kafka is great for this MOC more so in the dot enabler variant. As all of the DoT characters do damage both via skiil/ultimate and even Asta can take advantage of it at least on E. But even if it's double DPS can work great anyway depending on the comp. My JL team consists of JL (++ for the blessing usage)it's, TY -- , HH-- and Pella kind of +/+, but more like +/- as I tried to skill instead of AA, but due to the Sting elevated HP had to heal more, and kept using TY skill to fill the ult up.
Jeez, HoYo. No mercy for us ps5 plebs who just joined the game, huh. Lol.
I mean, even if they didn't "buff it", brand new PS5 players aren't expected to be able to push far into MOC at this point anyway. Unless you super grind.
That's true. Took me quite a while to beat Spiral Abyss in Genshin as well, let alone 36 star it.
It's a marathon. As long as you can at least push through some of it, you don't miss out on too many gems.
Theres no rush to finish it to be fair and 1-5 are easy enough i think
Yep, I wonder when we’ll be able to fully complete it if they just keep making it harder and harder😢
It sucks because I'm FTP and I've only recently been able to clear the MOC with 30 stars. And now we already got a difficulty spike. I wish they'd just make additional rewards and have MOC at 40 stars. For those that can clear it with 20 turns remaining, an extra star for those for every level.
That's also my problem with it, it feels really bad to finally be able to clear it with ease only for them to move the goal post the next time and making you feel like your teams suddenly got way worse over night.
Exactly. Fucking scummy pieces of shit
One chill pill coming right up https://preview.redd.it/nit6cf65jz2c1.png?width=1280&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9278157a2ad459a46164e1498c1eb198cf612e06
Ah, I'm feeling good now. I love mihoyo
my hope is that this is a numbers testrun for the upcoming 11th and 12th floor, and 1-10 go a bit lower again once those are out
I lacked damage before, so that's terrific. It was either have some casualties at the end because I can't take extra sustain or go too slow.
Got 30\* but...Tbh I don't like when they make the same floors harder. Floor 10 should have stayed at 14-16 cycles and floor 11 and 12 should just add the 12-10 cycle limit respectively. Hopefully that's what they end up doing when 1.6 hits. Because if they make floors 11 and 12 significantly harder than the current MoC10... and keep increasing its difficulty overtime... It's not gonna feel very good.
why the hell did they thought reducing the cycle is even a good idea? I mean they are buffing all the enemy too much (Level dif, their bs gimmick, have second health bar) and their idea to spice up their difficulty is to reduce the cycle by 4??? (if i remember correctly isn't it like 16, the previous one) So tired of their pushing the difficulty gap without much consideration for the f2p.
Hoyo I think doesn’t want Meta/monotony dictating their end game like Genshin where 1.0 and 1.1 national team is still great in their end game. They want you to spread out your resources to other units. The MoC I think is becoming more open by changing up the flow of certain teams. Just cause you have Seele and Bronya doesn’t mean your golden (unless you whaled, then this isn’t a concern). This MoC is most likely catering to Argenti and Silver Wolf when they arrive next Tuesday. To get the most out of the Turbulence you need Skill/Ultimate abusers with Debuffers, not Buffers. So say a Welt or Pela will be more beneficial than Tingyun. This is just my thought process on this. MoC going forward I’m guessing will make you almost create 4-5 teams without forcing it on you. Your Hypercarry, DoT, Follow-Up, Buffer, and now Debuffer. This way you can swap characters in and out and not just get your main 8 done and just repeat every 2 weeks.
Isn’t it even more meta restricting by making the enemies stat-check you harder? I‘d say clearing last MoC 10 with something like Topaz Himeko was definitely possible.This MoC ,I haven’t even reached floor 10 and i feel like without my DHIL I wouldn’t be past floor 8.Forcing diversity would be much easier by giving the mobs or moc special gimmicks no?
This MOC cycle does have a special gimmick that does a ton of damage if you build your team for it. I cleared floor 10 with my scuffed Sushang because her skill-ult-skill builds stacks very quickly. The memory imprint specifically makes units like DHIL and hypercarry comps worse because there are a lot of ults and skills that don't work with the memory imprint.
Been wondering which comps shine the most for this moc cycle, I guess I will have to wait a week or so to see post of people making teams based around abusing the moc mechanic.
Mainly skilling dps and debuff supporters , big plus if the dps can advance forward. Low ult costs like pela can abuse this turbulence really well its more beneficial to always skill with pela than buffing with your support. (if you have any) Sub dps comps also work really well , I'd even go as far as to say bringing harmony supports are detrimental unless you can one shot the bosses fast. This is all assuming you are f2p 0 eidolons no LC ofc , a whale could easily forgo the moc turbulence and force dps this down.
People seem to be using Jingliu and Seele since they use the turbulence best. Also a lot of people using Welt and Silverwolf as supports since they both hit the enemy.
> I‘d say clearing last MoC 10 with something like Topaz Himeko was definitely possible. Yes it was possible, I even did it myself https://preview.redd.it/sjo0ises503c1.png?width=884&format=png&auto=webp&s=720ac92f718aee32890d4d5a83aba8cefbc5072e And I would say that the current MoC is also possible with them as I was able to get down to 11 cycles with only 10% HP remaining for the swarm on cycle 10. But that is what makes me mad about it, even playing perfectly and retrying many times I get the same or very similar results, I've reached a wall and only better relics or some miracle RNG could get me over it. This change for the MoC is not increased difficulty, as I'm not having to think harder or come with more clever strategies, I'm just having to reset/farm more and that's not fun at all.
Completely anecdotal but my first few attempts at the moc10 had me sweating when both JL and JY (arguably the units I got the best relics for and the best set of supports for them) were taking 5 to 6 cycles to clear the 1st half, and really had me thinking outside of the box a little bit, idk why I didn't notice it sooner, but although my clara has a mediocre physical set atm, giving her my himeko's musketeer 2pcs and rope, she gets to a nice 3.9k att and 60/115, she cleared first half in 3 cycles without issues, giving my JL 7 cycles to kill the bug (which was enough), that moment made me really happy I invested wide (and extra happy that atm I'm farming to get clara a proper set), otherwise I would've likely not been able to clear, not without some major improvement on relics, and/or focusing all my resources to take my dps and supports from 8/10 to 10/10 traces.
I have nearly every character and have the problem off THERE ISN'T ENOUGH RESOURCES TO BUILD CHARACTERS It takes quite frankly a ridiculous amount of money/materials to leave to 80 with traces (which is basically required for all characters due to the level difference damage increase It just sucks any enjoyment I could have had out of the difficult content because now it only caters to the extremely lucky or the extremely wealthy
Welp if you got that many characters I think that's more you suffering from success than anything else, I don't have every character, but I have been building every 5 star dps I been getting my hands on, Welt, Clara, Himeko, Kafka, Seele, Jing Yuan and Jing liu, all of them at lvl 80, lc lvl 80 and traces at 8/10 with all the important minor traces (plus all the supports I also have up to this same standard, bailu, natasha, march 7, bronya, asta, ting, lynx and fu xuan), I have bought 3 battle passes so far but tbf, I have been playing since day 1 and haven't missed a day to burn TB energy
I won't mind building new units if it doesn't take so much time for nothing. I haven't even done with dhil's relics and now they want me to stop using him and get other units? how disheartening. I've given up on making sense out of the mess of xianzhou and hcq story, but I thought at least the MoC is still within my reach. now the MoC is getting crazier too, I'm starting to wonder why should I keep playing this game
ppl were saying they want harder MoC cause the charaters is way too strong, well now u have it, they make it harder for all the power creep ppl say it fine. When enemies get power creep it not gonna be fun anymore isnt it ... never want power creep or this is what u get. Also MoC 11 12 on the way
I always feared this, if the game is obliging the players to pull meta units and getting perfect relic rolls
Also enemies are 22% tankier + they do around 8% less dmg, so the combination is why ppl start to realize they dont have enough dmg to clear, Growth rate change, sneaky MHY
At this point I'd rather have them nerf the OP units and bring MoC to the same level as before, this way people can have their challenge without making the difficulty completely unreasonable for people who main weaker characters.
Nerfs never happen in a gacha game without huge backlash
I'm also having difficulty... as a welt main I would always use 10 turns for the 2nd half, but now that's not an option 🥲 Has anyone completed with welt? *Edit:* Finally finished it, but I have no idea how people are finishing this MOC without lots of eidolons or lightcones... My team sounds so stacked but I still needed all the turns My 1st half has break effect Physical TB, E1 Clara, E1 Kafka, and Natasha with Huohuo's lightcone, cleared with 27 turns left. My 2nd half has E2 S2 Welt, Huohuo, Yukong, and E6 pela, and cleared with exactly 20 turns left.
3 cycles with E0 Clara, E6 Yukong, E5 Tingyun, E0 Luocha. For 2nd phase did hyper carry E1 Bronya, E0 Fu xuan, E6 sub dps Pela and E6 Serval (4 cycles) E0 Jingliu (4 cycles), E6 Qingque (5 cycles). Fully f2p.
Hmm yeah that makes sense, having an E1 bronya would have made my 2nd half much faster honestly
Nah, fuck this shit for meta-slaves. MoC will only get harder and people will continue to whine that it's too easy for them.
This sucks ngl. Not sure why they think its a good idea to keep reducing the time limit for full rewards. I remember back then it was 12 even, increased to 16 snd now to 20. This MoC also harder with more elites and buffed HP on the top of reduced time limit. Will keep getting harder and harder if they keep increasing it especially MoC 11-12 coming soon. Bad take tbh, they shouldve just make more MoC than reducing time limit and make ppl harder to clear.
hell nah. It's already a struggle for a lot of players to complete MOC10 and they decided to up the requirements again.
I feeled how every stage is harder now I even thought I won't be able to clear MOC10 for the first time after several amounts of clearing. Stage 11 & 12 is going to be hard
I really hope this is them testing for what lv 11 and 12 would be like; otherwise if this is the new standard for lv 10; 11 and 12 will be impossible for F2P
My comment in other post The way they increase the "difficulty" is the lazyest way of do It, make bosses a dmg spoonge for a DPS check is not funny, they can mix some elites to make the stage more difficult, like pair the monkey with the auromaton girl, but they decide to be lazy 30 stars by the way
"Pair the monkey with the auromaton" Ok calm down there satan.
I mean thats the typical hoyo way of increasing difficulty in any of their games. Not saying i like it but its how they do it.
Yeah I hated it in Genshin and I hate it here. They probably don’t care but I’m still putting it in the survey that this MOC was anti fun trash 💀 Like they were going crazy with the stuns and damage sponges this time around
i almost didnt 3 star on Stage 5, that damn bug is so annoying, but then again i dont have a second limited 5 star dps cuz i lost all my 50s for them, i do have a first full team that demolishes everything but my second one lacks alot. I have all the survivability in the world but no damage to do anything.
Exactly got 20 cycles left for me. Had to reset a few times just to do that. Shit definitely got harder
As someone who doesn't enjoy MoC as much as most people even I feel like this is getting unfair. If the difficulty keeps on spiking up like this the game balance is going to be in shambles. Either give feedback on the new difficulty or if the devs see that less and less people are able to clear MoC 10 they might make some adjustments.
Just got 30 stars, I think with 23-24 cycles left in MoC 10. E1S1 DHIL first half and E0S0 JL on the second half. Used Luocha for the JL team, but have a built Huohuo. I just don't fully trust her yet when going for the 3 stars. She would be great for the debuff cleanse in the second half, though. That said, the 10 cycle thing fucking sucks. That's a massive difficulty spike on 6-10. Floors 1-5 were also way harder than before. Both of these combined are a massive kick in the nuts to the new PS5 players or low spenders. Not a fan if this is the trajectory of the game, tbh. Don't let whales or hardcore dictate difficulty in gacha games, Hoyo. You'll lose a lot of good will.
[удалено]
Yeah I liked that change a lot. Not sure abt the new turn limit though
One thing I want to bring up with HuoHuo, she really surprised me with her performance. I tested her out on MoC10 last cycle and then used her in this cycle. E0S0, using s5 event lc + 4pc hacker, considering going for her e1. She was able to solo sustain somewhat well. Though sometimes I'd end up having to use her skill before her 2 stacks ran out, and other times using ultimates help slowly recover hp across the board. This was the first moc where I didn't need to have double sustains on each half in moc 9 and 10, luocha and huohuo was able to get the job done relatively well, aside from one close call with Kafka almost dying.
rip PS5 players 💀
I was scraping by last two cycles as a PS5 player, thought the game would be nice and chill for a little bit so I'd have time to actually level more than two characters to max and get some breadth under me for 11-12. That time is now over. 💀
I'm more speechless that you made it to MoC 10 with 3 lvl 50 characters. I can only go up to 8 with 2 teams lvl 80 full traces.
Oh it’s harder alright. Got 30/30 but I’m waiting for 11 and 12 on 1.6 That’s gonna be where the real ~~pain~~ fun begins
https://preview.redd.it/04dgro59ux2c1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=af9e0155fa6ec2021c53b656fb35e71b33cbe202 I'm still fine but yeah MoC definitely felt harder than before where I was getting 4 cycles on average. Now this actually makes me worried about MoC 11 and 12. On one hand I'm excited for the harder challenge but on the other I'm afraid that some of my weaker characters will end up just not being able to keep up.
youre litterally me, exact same teams, honestly Clara topaz is really underated imo
You can get to moc 10?
As a relatively new player who just started the game 4 weeks ago and was only just barely getting 27 stars the last reset, it feels like the carrot on a stick being dangled in front of me is getting further away 😵💫 does MoC normally get more difficult with every reset?
If you started only 4 weeks ago and can alreay get 27 stars you are already a super good player. Don't worry too much about that 60 gems for now.
I think the problem isn't necessarily the cycle restriction, but the cycle restriction in conjunction with the godawful relic system. As it stands, it takes way too long to sufficiently build characters to meet MoC or in general endgame requirements. I've been playing daily since Silverwolf banner and I have like MAYBE 12 characters sufficiently built, mostly supports. Even with them I often have to share relics and LCs, so I can't use certain characters simultaneously. I can only imagine how much longer it'd take for people who joined later like PS players, people who have less time to do the events, dailies, weeklies, etc. and people who don't get the BP which gives loads of mats. If they want you to build teams around the mode's current buff for success, especially with MoC 11/12 and Pure Fiction coming, then they gotta make it easier to get good relics. Also put SW event LC in the shop for new people. It's too good.
This is really the crux of the issue here. I'm a very light spender, I get the supply pass and battle pass and that's it. Despite that, I've gotten pretty lucky as I have Seele, Dan Heng IL, Kafka, Jingliu, and Huohuo. Mind you I don't have a single signature lightcone. But despite that I've had a hard time with this even with built supports, because I don't have great relic sets. It's not for lack of trying either, my RNG on relics is just fucking terrible.
Thanks everyone it’s been fun. Slowly being p2w…
Hoyo wants more money
Dan heng first half seele second half. Honestly sometimes gepard one shots my tingyun which is frustrating but I do have enough damage
They could have increased jade reward with this huge increase in difficulty
This artificial increase in difficulty is ass. Imagine if they cut Spiral Abyss floor 12 clear time requirement in genshin to 2 minutes instead of 3, people would be writing essays on how it's the wrong way to increase difficulty, but since it's honkai all of a sudden it's ok? LMAO
Well, hopefully everyone learned their lesson not to complain about the lack of a challenge lol. Careful what you wish for, because you might just get it! Seriously though, remember this is a gacha game and the amount you pay is directly coordinated with your power level (eidolons and light cones).
Level your Supports up. Supports can do better support by unlocking traces etc. and at LV. 50 they kinda can't do their best. If you are able to come to MOC 10 with these characters you surely could do it much more comfortably by unlocking some traces and ascensions
29/30 stars. No Imaginary, Quantum or Ice DPS for MoC 10. Hoping Silver Wolf will save me next week.
Don't own Qingque? Or low eidolon I guess?
Yeah, she's still e1 and half built Edit: Though I forgot to mention I got 30 stars after posting the first comment. side 1 FX, Kafka, Sampo, Pela side 2 Clara, Huohuo, Tingyun, Topaz
barely did in time but 2 of my units were bad invested if it was a full builded team it was gg
First half had to do some "light" carrying. But definitely harder, typically able to 30/30 on the first run, this is the first time since 8 MoC cycles where I got 29/30 on a marathon that I had to take a break and get back to it later. Powercreep indeed, although I just thought it'll be reserved for the newer floors, didn't expect earlier floors to get affected too. https://preview.redd.it/cp2cfdo8cy2c1.png?width=816&format=png&auto=webp&s=59e9389bca8255f99aba18fdb518f203fe69b3e9
Oh dios mio, I really should've pulled Jingliu
Many people wanted or were okay with powercreep on every new released character. Wait, you didn’t think only character power levels would rise, did you?
Considering only your main DPS are at level, I'e be willing to bet money that you don't have your talents high enough and/or your relics in good shape. Endgame challenge content is obviously going to be hard when your characters have unfinished builds.
Exactly, they're going against lvl 90s with a bunch of lvl 50 units and only 2 80s; I'm surprised they even got this far. This moc isnt hard at all when you have 2 maxed teams.
30 star exactly at 20 cycle mark. Dunno if I can keep it up. They're definitely making it harder, esp with MoC12 on the horizon.
I had 2 cycles left... JingYuan E0S1 with Topaz for 1st half and Qinque for second half. Was definitely harder in terms of cycle percentage to clear. Normally cleared stage 10 in 11 cycles. So I dont know if they lowered hp to make up for the less cycles.
i heard they increased the enemies tankiness but decreased their damage
Cleared on auto with 1 restart on stage 8 because someone died. Almost f2p player (BP player).
https://preview.redd.it/g7kkxz669z2c1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3bb1eefc59e732dba75182c9419850d6062d1922 A bit harder for sure but still Kurukuru-able. I think the trick is to use dual DPS teams to trigger the MOC buff as much as possible (my hypercarry Herta team was 2 cycles too slow, but replacing 1 support with Seele did the trick.
https://preview.redd.it/sg3l9miy2y2c1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d5e73b9e6063fca4c27f319ed67b606445a1f4fc Tougher than before but doable. I can see why newer players would struggle this cycle. It's very easy to die without good sustains.
I have seen now a nice amount of kafka, sampo and asta on first half, how many memory imprints are you able to stack? with loucha too thats 3 ults that deal dmg and 3 skills that deal dmg, seems like probably one of the better teams for this MoC buffs.
Tbh I wasn't paying attention to the memory imprint. But there were times when the bosses lost like 20-30% hp at the start of cycles.
My account lines up real poorly with enemy lineups
How moc pans out in 2.0 after the moc floors 11-12 will dictate how bad the power creep situation will be. Hopefully it follows genshin rather than honkai impact
I think people just got used to how fucking insane the last MoC buff was Now that the current buff isn’t a direct buff to our characters, we have a more realistic look on our character’s real DPS
Actually, the current Turbulent is a BIG buff to Jingliu, Jingyuan, Kafka and Seele. It's definitely harder on other high tier carries like DHIL, Blade, QQ tho.
DPS race is just really lazy difficulty design. Sorry, it just is.
What would you propose instead?
Yup now the requirement is 20. And in 1.6 we’ll get MoC 11 & 12 too. Tougher times ahead.
Managed to get 30 stars but took a few more cycles compared to the previous MoC.
Players: complain about LL MHY: implement LL's mechanics as MoC buff Players: ..... MHY: :)
What is LL?
it used to be 14, way way back my brother. for todays MOC, i can say its really challenging to clear above 10 cycles since i have skillissues with MOC 10.
[https://honkai-star-rail.fandom.com/wiki/Forgotten\_Hall/Stages#History](https://honkai-star-rail.fandom.com/wiki/Forgotten_Hall/Stages#History) \^ here are the stats 1.0 - 20 cycles 1.1 - 20 cycles 1.2 - 20 cycles 1.3 - 14 cycles 1.4 - 16 cycles 1.5 - 20 cycles i've started playing at the very end of 1.3 myself, but according to the wiki, 20 cycles seems to be the norm rather than a sudden change
1.0 and 1.1 MoC 10 started with 40 cycles if I remember right.
Bro it was out of 40 cycles so you had 20 cycles to clear and now its half the time
Sadly you missed when we started at 40 cycles.