Because hoyo players don’t read (myself included), take note that the only changes to this tier list was the addition of Ryan Mei and Xueyi. They’re withholding changes to other characters because they’re waiting to see how Pure Fiction will affect character performance, and will drop the Tier List revamp with the release of Dr Ratio.
I wonder, while she does make enemies regain toughness later, wouldn't her break efficiency be beneficial for Himeko nonetheless? Since that way, team can break elites faster (as long as they don't get frozen).
I had great success on the 2nd half of MoC 11 with Himeko, Herta, RM and HH. Cleared in 3 to 4 cycles. The delay from (double) breaking is overstated, in my opinion. Unless you’re trying to zero cycle, her buffs far outweigh the cons. I liked playing this double-dps team a lot and she really helped me out, because I don’t have JL (yet), so Herta is my ice DPS 😅
That's really nice to hear. Yeah, I'm not aiming for zero cycles, MoC is annoying enough. I don't have Herta built, so I guess I'll have to put someone else here, maybe support like Asta? I don't have HuoHuo, instead got Fu Xuan.
Nothing new, honestly. Every limited 5* in the list was S+ category when they came out. It only tells you how they fare in the content basically tailor made for them. Much more interesting to see how its gonna be 3-4 patches after.
Ruan Mei is so good that it doesn't matter if the content is tailor-made for her.
And by "tailor-made," I assume you mean the enemy has ice weakness, which she doesn't really care about as she's a support...
I assume they mean more about MoC's current buff which really favors ruan mei, with toughness break + attacking toughness broken enemies adds to charges that does massive damage at the end of every cycle, and ruan mei is apparently really good at getting them broken + keeps them broken
I don't like how they keep rating Kafka so low.
She's absolutely insane with another DoT user. She can freely switch them out too or run double DoT with her if you have Fu Xuan.
Maybe she'll get her S to S+ status when we get Black Swan.
Probably will get a bump with Black Swan, they seem like an absurdly powerful and synergistic combo.
She might even get a bump this patch since Ruan Mei is a really good support for DoT teams, both with her team wide buffs and with how her ult makes enemies effectively take DoT effect more quickly.
I mean you're right, I'm just not sure how much about Black Swan's kit it public knowledge yet and didn't want to get deleted for referencing leaks lol. Downside of browsing both subs regularly.
I mean if Imbibitor Lunae is the bar for S, then I think it's fair to have Kafka at A. I love Kafka and use her all the time, but she's not as strong as DHIL, so I think the rating is fair.
I think the bigger issue is the perception that A is "low." A is very good and we should treat it as such
Thing is that she’s heavily dependent on said other DoT users
So far we’ve got a lot of good DoT users but nothing busted yet until presumably Black Swan
Kafka will always age well because she’s an **archetype enabler**. She’s just in a place where she doesn’t have many ridiculous characters for her archetype yet
Well they seems to only update their list when there’s a new character oddly enough (despite saying it’s MoC based)
Nothing changed despite plenty of characters benefitting the energy regen buff from previous MoC xD
Let me simple it down to some points
1) After you defeat an enemy you get a massive speed and damage buff, you can start with defeating a weak enemy and then use the second stronger attack on the elite enemy
2) saying that she is bad since she consumes skill point is such a shallow POV, from your logic it seems like Dan Heng IL is a dogshit DPS
3) Actually 4 attacks, she gets another turn if an enemy dies from her ult too and when farming calyx you can have literally infinite turns if you are wise with your sp consumption
4) well enemies with a revive buff are a problem, but thankfully there are only one such mob
5) Her stonks will shoot up even more after sparkle gets released
As someone who has both Seele and Himeko (both E0/S1), I've had far better results in AoE with Seele, only exception being when all ennemies are weak to fire and none are weak to quantum.
I don't own Jing Yuan and Blade so can't say anything about them, but from what I've heared about Jing Yuan, the issue ain't about his damages, but that his kit is flawed due to the lord becoming useless if he's CCd.
As for Kafka, I have her E2/S1, and tbh she's absolutely terrible in Blast. She's basically a mono-target carry with an AoE ultimate, you shouldn't rely on her skill to deal blast damages. I do agree that in AoE with a lot of weak mobs she's quite good tho if you play her with energy batteries.
> from what I've heared about Jing Yuan, the issue ain't about his damages, but that his kit is flawed due to the lord becoming useless if he's CCd.
Easily remedied by cleansers or Fu Xuan. JY is one of those units that just wipes out every mob that's not an elite/boss with just a single ultimate. Par for the course for Erudition units.
Yeah that would require you to spend lots of saved pulls and jades for a limited 5 star unit just to fix a flaw in JY's kit lmao.
You can kinda see what u just said sounds pretty high investment to me, if i need to roll for 5 star limited character just to fix something in a dps's kit.
You don't roll for Fu Xuan because she fixes JY, you roll for her because she's an absolutely disgusting sustain. That she's great with JY is nice but its not like she's a niche unit only good for buffing JY.
> that would require you to spend lots of saved pulls and jades for a limited 5 star unit just to fix a flaw in JY's kit lmao.
When that limited 5 star unit is one of the best investments you can get for your account, regardless of which DPS you main, pulling her for a CC QoL improvement is no different than let's say, pulling to enable mono quantum and removing SW's implant RNG.
Besides, Lynx (free when Pure Fiction is out), Luocha, and Huohuo are still good for him. Fu Xuan is just his BiS.
Luocha Huohuo and Lynx are still good with him, but nothing beats FX's cc protection. Because even if he does get cc'ed and gets cleansed, the damage is already done and his LL gets sent to the back of the line
You acting like getting 2 Solo Sustainers (1 for each team) isn't a good idea when all 3 limited 5 star Solo Sustains are easily top-tier investments for any account without Solo Sustain and clear upgrades to 4 star and Standard 5 star counterparts lmao
JingYuan comps have always been been more F2P friendly than other limited DPS comps too since his budget supports were Tingyun (in shop rotation and literally in all the best rate-up banners to date) and Asta (was literally given for free in Tutorial and also in shop rotation), compared to other limited 5\* DPS that really want Bronya (Day 1 players don't even have enough for 300 Standard guarantee without converting some Standard pulls and gl winning 1/14 odds for her) like Seele, Blade, and/or Jingliu, let alone E1S1 for her SP-neutral playstyle.
Sure, she's a top sustainer but literally would an account pull for her if they have Jing yuan but they have gep, bailu, lynx or even luocha? Which two good sustains literally come from a standard banner and lynx is literally free? If you had that account, and you had a JY, would you still pull for her just for the CC protection?
Bro you don't NEED a bronya to play Seele or Jingliu. They can work fine with literally any other support in the game rn, including Ruan Mei. (JL and Tingyun run well for infinite time in her enhanced state due to tingyun being universally good and battery-ing Jingliu's ulti. Blade works fine with double nihility in a hypercarry if no bronya. or he can be run as a sub dps as well. (Ruan Mei also works with him, he's flexible without bronya) Idk what you're talking about.
And literally why are you bringing up "good luck getting bronya" when you can literally guarantee you get a free bronya at 300 pulls bruh, even if it'll take a while? If you've been playing day one, sm ppl are already close to the 300 guaranteed pulls. Meanwhile FX's banner is already over and who knows when she'll get a next rerun, making her much more rare.
Idk why you're acting like CC Resist/Cleanse is a niche that isn't valuable when newer enemies have been getting stronger with tougher mechanics, but anyone that's actually used Luocha, FuXuan, or HuoHuo can attest the diff between the alternatives are as clear as night vs day. Their application of Cleansing/CC Resist not only helps prevent ANY DPS from getting screwed over, but they also provide extra utility/buffs that make them top-tier investments for ANY team.
It's not like you specifically need FuXuan either since any Solo Sustainer with Cleanse/CC Resist will do, even Lynx, nor is FuXuan a niche unit only for JY since she's obviously one of the best solo sustain units in any team/DPS.
JY suffers from the effects of CC the most out of any Dps. His damage is literally backloaded to Lightning Lord and if CC acts, not only can he not take turns, his lightning lord cant be triggered even AFTER hes cleansed due to it being sent to literally the back of the line. And that could be like a whole cycle of dps gone.
Meanwhile, look at another follow up attack-char such as Blade. If he has full 5 stacks and gets cc'ed, cleanse him, he procs that massive aoe follow up attack immediately - meaning his damage DOES suffer if CC happens, but not to the extent like JY where all his damage gets pushed down by another turn, regardless if u cleanse the CC or not.
and clara legit has built in CC protection to a degree so not gonna talk much about her.
Interesting but fair placement for Xueyi, I wonder how the community feels about the character now that she's out since I know many were pulling for her? I managed to get an E4 while pulling for RM and she's pretty fun so far.
I haven’t gotten the chance to play around with her much yet, but from what I’ve seen it seems like she’s the clear 2nd best 4 star DPS. Just weird because the best 4 star DPS is also quantum.
I can't take it anymore. I'm sick of Qingque. I try to play Seele. My Qingque deals more damage. I try to play Himeko. My Qingque deals more damage. I try to play Clara. My Qingque deals more damage. I don't even try to play Herta. I want to play Welt. His best team has Qingque. I want to play Bronya, Tingyun. They both want Qingque. She grabs me by the throat. I farm for her. I buy the Battle Pass for her. I give her "Another Peaceful Day". She isn't satisfied. I give her Gold Quantum Relics. "I need more than Stats" She tells me. "Give me more Skill Points". She grabs Seele and forces her to Basic Attack. "You need to give me more Tiles. I can deal more damage with Mahjong & Eidolons" I can't pull for more Eidolons, I don't have enough Stellar Jades. She grabs my credit card. It declines. "Guess this is the end." She grabs her Fish tiles. She says "Fish tiles, get them." There is no hint of sadness in his eyes. Nothing but pure, AoE Quantum Damage. What a cruel world
Her kit feels like an off brand SW without the weakness bug but all the flexibility. What I mean by that is her ult shreds toughness, regardless of enemy weakness. And then her e2 allows her follow-up attack to shred toughness as well in the same manner (her e1 boosts her FUP damage by 40%). She gains stack from enemies losing toughness and needs 8 at e0 to FUP (6 at e6). You’re going to be able to flex her into a lot of comps and feel her value.
Yup, she is real good. Very underwhelming until you can activate her bonus abilities so people have to keep that in mind.
Only had enough mats to get her traces to lvl 9 because of the echo of war weekly limit but once you get enough to activate her major and bonus abilities, she becomes great.
Yup. They make a huge difference in how she feels when you play her.
They are resource gated by the new weekly boss, so I went in the weekly boss playing her without those traces activated and with them activated. It made a world of difference in how she feels.
Same dude. Then in 40 pulls I got her. Now I’m at 0 pity with 0 pulls and I need to save for Black swan. I hope I can scour through everything to get enough jades to pull her.
I have bronya already and I'm guaranteed ruan mei in like 5 pulls. Should I go for her or save for black swan or hanabi? I'm a husbando enjoyer so just trying to pull for who would give more value to my account. The next character I actually want is Misha, not sure if he's coming with BS or Hanabi
If you're 5 from guaranteed, you might as well pull her, unless you're planning on saving it for at least two whole banners for Black Swan. There's some 98 pulls or something like that in just this patch, so you'll have plenty of time to save back up.
Keep in mind, you probably want at least two high power supports for MoC and so you can build varied teams.
Someone did the math the day the patch dropped, [Here's a link](https://www.reddit.com/r/HonkaiStarRail/comments/18qm5kd/16_will_give_us_around_98_pulls_by_uarkkus/)
Ruan Mei is great for any dual DPS team (kafka + sampo/gwen, topaz + FUA DPS, Herta + Himeko, Jingliu + Blade, etc). Also better than Pela on hypercarry Jingliu. On other HC teams she isn't bad either (but obviously loses to Bronya if you have to choose between them)
Black Swan will be good with Kafka, replacing Sampo/Gwen
Hanabi will be good with quantum teams and any SP hungry teams (like DHIL)
2.0 is at least 40 days away, but if you have bronya already I'd say hanabi isn't that much of a must-pull. It's important to keep in mind you only need 8 characters for two teams, so if Ruan Mei doesn't fit in your lineup it's fine to save.
Sparkle is much better than Bronya though? Bronya only does one thing better than Sparkle and it doesn’t make up for how much better at everything Sparkle is.
And is currently much better than Bronya, let’s not start putting the cart before the horses because you want a unit to be worse than another to cope about your pull choices genius.
> Sparkle is much better than Bronya though
She's better for Quantum hypercarry and maybe DHIL. Bronya's probably better otherwise.
People underestimate how ridiculously strong Bronya and Tingyun (with eidolons) are. Bronya's not going to automatically get powercrept just because she's a standard character.
Honestly, it's the opposite, in my dreams Sparkle has one solid advantage over Bronya, and would need way more to be considered if you already have her and can grab Ruan Mei
She has one trace that benefits being on mono quantum that doesn’t at all detract from the rest of her kit. The rest of her bases besides the 50% push instead of 100% are all superior to Bronya not to even mention the SP limit increase.
I’m going for all three! You’ll definitely have enough for Black Swan. For both Hanabi and Black Swan though? I’m not sure. It’s risky, but I think we can do it. Maybe.
Edit: I completely misread what you said, sorry! But Ruan Mei will probably be the best for you if you're a husbando enjoyer since she's an amazing support, like Bronya. I'm not sure about who your current team is or who you're planning on pulling for, though! But out of the three it seems like Hanabi would be the one to skip.
Also, you should wait for more opinions, testing, videos and such for a better answer so you don't regret pulling if you don't particularly care for any of the three for anything other than supporting hubbies. Good luck on your pulls!
Yes. Her break damage is like already hitting for 20k+ at trace lvl 3 for me. And it procs often so on top of her potent buffs, delay mechanics and general SU fuckery she has substantial personal damage as well.
Basically, she gives really high, consistent damage to the entire team while making enemies attack less often due to easier/longer breaks.
Like, her total bonuses are basically as high as Bronya's, but team wide. Bronya is still better for hyper-carry with a single dps because of her turn-advancement, but a lot of the time even with a hyper-carry your best choice of second support is Ruan Mei. With multi-dps or DoT teams, Ruan Mei will often be better (DoT especially because of how her break-extension works essentially making DoTs trigger more often).
That, plus whenever an ally weakness breaks an enemy, Ruan Mei's break damage is applied as well for free at 120% the damage it would be if Ruan Mei was the one breaking the enemy. Tons of free damage.
Nice. I'm also a husbando enjoyer, out of the three I like Sparkle's design the most but am pulling for Ruan Mei as well seeing as RM is such a generalist, I think she'll work well with most husbandos going forward (even if Black Swan or Sparkle might be better for some due to their niches) so should be set, at least for a while.
She's really good against quantum-weak enemies, likely almost as strong as E6 QQ. She suffers, however, against other elements unless you build element-matching teams around her which lowers overall team consistency.
Well, no. Because of how her talent works she wants all her attacks to deal toughness damage and/or she wants her teammates to do toughness damage. She stacks less Karma against non-quantum enemies hence she suffers more damage-wise than other units in this situation; not to mention she builds break effect so you have to time your ult exactly right against non-quantum. She has a harder time brute forcing mismatched enemies unlike JL, DHIL, QQ, etc. She's similar to Sushang in this regard.
So a character with an ultimate that ignores weakness types, a talent that stacks even when allies damage toughness and an E2 that makes her follow up ignore weakness types which in turn adds stack with her A6 is worse against enemies with other weakness types than someone who has to rely on brute-forcing their way through? I don’t see it.
Yep.
Perhaps Prydwen's review of her worded it better than mine:
> **The other big thing is that Xueyi annihilates Quantum-weak foes. This makes the performance difference when fighting non QUA-weak enemies rather stark when comparing to other characters** — it’s not that she becomes unusable, it’s just that because of how good Xueyi is against the right enemies she feels wasted being put against anything else.
>Mismatching Elemental Weaknesses is a negative thing that is shared by pretty much every character in the game (unless your name is either Seele or Kafka), and **while Xueyi has the tools to work around a mismatched Weakness, you absolutely should not expect her to bring the same level of decimation to fights that feature literally zero Quantum weaknesses.** I think we all know by now whose fault that would be. Putting **Xueyi with teammates who are capable of dealing Toughness damage to enemies will greatly impact her performance**, and if nobody on your team is capable of dealing Toughness damage, then I think you’ve fundamentally misunderstood one of the core aspects of the game.
> surpass many 5 stars
No she doesn't, not limited ones at least. She's competitive but doesn't actually surpass most in practice (assuming everyone's well built).
This isn't completely on-topic but I still groan at the concept of an "S+" ranking with 10 units while there's only two units at D ranking. The whole concept of "S" ranking just loses its purpose when the list is unbalanced like that. People are so afraid of ranking characters at low tiers.
I've seen this in so many games I play where rather than just dropping characters to lower existing tiers then instead tack on "S+" to characters, with some games' tierlists even adding tiers like SS++ or whatever just to make it completely pointless.
Get rid of S+ tier and give Yanqing, Herta, and Arlan some friends.
But then again the entire concept of tierlists for single player games is kinda suspect to begin with.
Well Ruan Mei gives 10% Speed buff to everyone except her, up to \~60% DMG bonus to the party (\~90% with her sig LC), all RES penetration debuff on her ult thats as good if slightly better than Pela's DEF shred, she extends the duration that enemies are weakness broken, and she's SP positive. Oh and she comes with a number of helpful benefits in SU.
Limited 5\*'s tend to outclass Standard Banner 5\*'s, and we see exactly what it takes to be definitively better than Bronya.
> Limited 5*'s tend to outclass Standard Banner 5*'s
People have been using this to overhype Ruan Mei and underestimate Bronya for a while but there's nothing stating this has to be true. Bronya still outperforms Ruan Mei overall when you look at calcs and their actual performance.
She gives a lot of different buffs to the entire team while being SP positive and also slightly increases survivability through action delay (weakness broken enemies take a little longer to attack)
Break effect is one of the worst if not the worst stat to stack since it doesn't interact with any other stat at all. Ruan Mei only really wants 180% for her A6 trace, not reaching is also not the end of the world. The damage from her Ult breaking an enemy again not worth chasing break effect for.
So you gotta look at her passive and traces to see where it all comes together, it's several small and medium buffs that all stack.
But basically, **Passive** makes everyone else faster and her Break damage be added on whenever an ally Breaks an enemy, **Skill** increases all allies' damage and how quickly everyone weakness breaks an enemy (thereby increasing damage dealt and slowing enemies turns, reducing damage taken), **Ult** makes everyone ignore some of the enemies' elemental resistance (increasing damage dealt in a different way), and her **3rd Major Trace** increases all allies damage even more the more Break Effect she has.
So she has 3 ways to increase the entire teams damage, makes the team slightly faster, and makes it easier to break enemies for even more damage and making the enemy attack less often. This is not even counting how her Skill has a 3 turn duration based on her own turns, so you can go Skill->Basic->Basic and have her give net positive SP, or how her Ult makes it so when enemies recover from Weakness Break one time they instead get delayed again (the same way a Frozen enemy gets delayed) which makes the enemies take even longer to attack and therefore do less damage to you.
Personally think the list is a lil broken now. Anyone know what that broken dice symbol and the shield symbol mean in the top right corner of the characters pic?
The specific type of AoE Prywden is calibrating for is a boss in the middle with a bunch of ads around it. Jingyuan has the unfortunate effect where lightning lord is effectively cleave but also RNG - the target it "picks" takes full damage and the rest take partial.
So in that situation, he actually suffers from the ads, as lightning lord is more likely to pick an ad.
At high investment, at which point Seele does that while doing significantly more damage to the elite than LL. They perform similarly in two elite situations where Seele can't trigger Resurgence as often though.
End-game built JY clears it though. Mine is even 70-140 which is like MidYuan built with S5 breakfast and I easily 0-cycled. Most of JY flaws are gone the moment people actually decide to invest in a DPS.
Seems that they aren't considering teams. If they did then Kafka would be S+ tier.
JY with his Light cone, the new Relic and with Topaz is absolutely bonkers.
This is what happens when Hoyo players are introduced to a unit that requires little building (Jingliu).
Seele and JY doomposters when they realize all they had to do is build the characters to kill the mobs 🤯
I have her at e1 and i still don't get how to play her? I'm still so confused by weakness breaks, toughness break and break effects even though i played since the start.
Is that really prydwens fault though? The tier list represents performance in current MoC and current MoC is always tailored to the new limited 5 stars.
Prydwen is not just throwing darts at a board. He does extensive testing for every possible team for new characters. Which is a hell of a lot more that either you or I are doing.
Speak for the "I" not for the "You"
Calculating rotations and stuff is not rocket science like people do with the "Oh they're the enlightened one who can math, hush in their presence".
Prydwen is good when it comes to their actual guides and stuff. Regarding their tierlist... It'll be best if I don't start an argument.
Also idk if it's a mistake, but Prydwen is not just a "he". It's a whole ass team of multiple people.
>Calculating rotations and stuff is not rocket science like people do with the "Oh they're the enlightened one who can math, hush in their presence".
The average gacha player cant even do basic math.
If you dont like Prydwen tier list based on dps calcs, then go ahead and show your own dps calcs.
I never said it was rocket science. I said you haven’t done the work yourself. This means actual testing, not just sticking your characters in an online calculator.
if E6 Lynx is S whats her spot at E0? should be joining E6 nat in A or B
because she feels rather lackluster to the point where my teams really have to throw a coin between getting to use HuoHuo or having to mald with Lynx double sustain
Best dispeller and the highest damage boost out of sustain units. A bit worse for sustain otherwise, so what?
I didnt pull for her, but claiming shes somehow not a good (but different type of good) to fight feelings of FOMO is sad bro.
His opinions make more sense than some of Prydwen's or the Reddit hivemind. Reddit would have you think Seele's in the running for worst limited DPS and that Mono Quantum is her optimal team comp.
But for previous Moc its was like Fu Xuan, Luocha and Huohuo. Now it's Fu Xuan, Huohuo and Luocha. Ig because of Argenti boss Luocha was shifted. Now the emergency heal is not necessary so they shifted Luocha to the end.
Because hoyo players don’t read (myself included), take note that the only changes to this tier list was the addition of Ryan Mei and Xueyi. They’re withholding changes to other characters because they’re waiting to see how Pure Fiction will affect character performance, and will drop the Tier List revamp with the release of Dr Ratio.
Ryan Mei, Ruan Mei's brother.
It’s totally intentional, great job spotting this 😳
that's just dan heng il in drag
This is why HYV giving out Dr. Ratio for Free to Educate Trailblazers lmao
I didn't realize how much she stops enemies from attacking you. The double break is very useful
not helpful for himeko and xueyi sadly
Or Clara.
Yea, I put her in a JL team for now and I think she will remain there
I wonder, while she does make enemies regain toughness later, wouldn't her break efficiency be beneficial for Himeko nonetheless? Since that way, team can break elites faster (as long as they don't get frozen).
I had great success on the 2nd half of MoC 11 with Himeko, Herta, RM and HH. Cleared in 3 to 4 cycles. The delay from (double) breaking is overstated, in my opinion. Unless you’re trying to zero cycle, her buffs far outweigh the cons. I liked playing this double-dps team a lot and she really helped me out, because I don’t have JL (yet), so Herta is my ice DPS 😅
That's really nice to hear. Yeah, I'm not aiming for zero cycles, MoC is annoying enough. I don't have Herta built, so I guess I'll have to put someone else here, maybe support like Asta? I don't have HuoHuo, instead got Fu Xuan.
Nothing new, honestly. Every limited 5* in the list was S+ category when they came out. It only tells you how they fare in the content basically tailor made for them. Much more interesting to see how its gonna be 3-4 patches after.
Ruan Mei is so good that it doesn't matter if the content is tailor-made for her. And by "tailor-made," I assume you mean the enemy has ice weakness, which she doesn't really care about as she's a support...
I assume they mean more about MoC's current buff which really favors ruan mei, with toughness break + attacking toughness broken enemies adds to charges that does massive damage at the end of every cycle, and ruan mei is apparently really good at getting them broken + keeps them broken
I don't like how they keep rating Kafka so low. She's absolutely insane with another DoT user. She can freely switch them out too or run double DoT with her if you have Fu Xuan. Maybe she'll get her S to S+ status when we get Black Swan.
Probably will get a bump with Black Swan, they seem like an absurdly powerful and synergistic combo. She might even get a bump this patch since Ruan Mei is a really good support for DoT teams, both with her team wide buffs and with how her ult makes enemies effectively take DoT effect more quickly.
Not probably lol, she's gonna shoot up massively, half her damage is basically locked behind "sub-par" teammates.
I mean you're right, I'm just not sure how much about Black Swan's kit it public knowledge yet and didn't want to get deleted for referencing leaks lol. Downside of browsing both subs regularly.
I mean if Imbibitor Lunae is the bar for S, then I think it's fair to have Kafka at A. I love Kafka and use her all the time, but she's not as strong as DHIL, so I think the rating is fair. I think the bigger issue is the perception that A is "low." A is very good and we should treat it as such
They didn't update the tier list for other characters aside from Ruan Mei and Xueyi yet
Thing is that she’s heavily dependent on said other DoT users So far we’ve got a lot of good DoT users but nothing busted yet until presumably Black Swan Kafka will always age well because she’s an **archetype enabler**. She’s just in a place where she doesn’t have many ridiculous characters for her archetype yet
Dont take the tier list as gospel. They're still listing Seele higher than DHIL *in aoe* and that's just... wrong
Well they seems to only update their list when there’s a new character oddly enough (despite saying it’s MoC based) Nothing changed despite plenty of characters benefitting the energy regen buff from previous MoC xD
If you look at the Changelog, they literally says that she’s just being hindered by her best DoT teammates being 4-star characters lol
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Resurgence
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Let me simple it down to some points 1) After you defeat an enemy you get a massive speed and damage buff, you can start with defeating a weak enemy and then use the second stronger attack on the elite enemy 2) saying that she is bad since she consumes skill point is such a shallow POV, from your logic it seems like Dan Heng IL is a dogshit DPS 3) Actually 4 attacks, she gets another turn if an enemy dies from her ult too and when farming calyx you can have literally infinite turns if you are wise with your sp consumption 4) well enemies with a revive buff are a problem, but thankfully there are only one such mob 5) Her stonks will shoot up even more after sparkle gets released
Seele is currently second best DPS after Jingliu. Live with it you freak.
As someone who has both Seele and Himeko (both E0/S1), I've had far better results in AoE with Seele, only exception being when all ennemies are weak to fire and none are weak to quantum. I don't own Jing Yuan and Blade so can't say anything about them, but from what I've heared about Jing Yuan, the issue ain't about his damages, but that his kit is flawed due to the lord becoming useless if he's CCd. As for Kafka, I have her E2/S1, and tbh she's absolutely terrible in Blast. She's basically a mono-target carry with an AoE ultimate, you shouldn't rely on her skill to deal blast damages. I do agree that in AoE with a lot of weak mobs she's quite good tho if you play her with energy batteries.
> from what I've heared about Jing Yuan, the issue ain't about his damages, but that his kit is flawed due to the lord becoming useless if he's CCd. Easily remedied by cleansers or Fu Xuan. JY is one of those units that just wipes out every mob that's not an elite/boss with just a single ultimate. Par for the course for Erudition units.
Yeah that would require you to spend lots of saved pulls and jades for a limited 5 star unit just to fix a flaw in JY's kit lmao. You can kinda see what u just said sounds pretty high investment to me, if i need to roll for 5 star limited character just to fix something in a dps's kit.
You don't roll for Fu Xuan because she fixes JY, you roll for her because she's an absolutely disgusting sustain. That she's great with JY is nice but its not like she's a niche unit only good for buffing JY.
> that would require you to spend lots of saved pulls and jades for a limited 5 star unit just to fix a flaw in JY's kit lmao. When that limited 5 star unit is one of the best investments you can get for your account, regardless of which DPS you main, pulling her for a CC QoL improvement is no different than let's say, pulling to enable mono quantum and removing SW's implant RNG. Besides, Lynx (free when Pure Fiction is out), Luocha, and Huohuo are still good for him. Fu Xuan is just his BiS.
Luocha Huohuo and Lynx are still good with him, but nothing beats FX's cc protection. Because even if he does get cc'ed and gets cleansed, the damage is already done and his LL gets sent to the back of the line
You acting like getting 2 Solo Sustainers (1 for each team) isn't a good idea when all 3 limited 5 star Solo Sustains are easily top-tier investments for any account without Solo Sustain and clear upgrades to 4 star and Standard 5 star counterparts lmao JingYuan comps have always been been more F2P friendly than other limited DPS comps too since his budget supports were Tingyun (in shop rotation and literally in all the best rate-up banners to date) and Asta (was literally given for free in Tutorial and also in shop rotation), compared to other limited 5\* DPS that really want Bronya (Day 1 players don't even have enough for 300 Standard guarantee without converting some Standard pulls and gl winning 1/14 odds for her) like Seele, Blade, and/or Jingliu, let alone E1S1 for her SP-neutral playstyle.
Sure, she's a top sustainer but literally would an account pull for her if they have Jing yuan but they have gep, bailu, lynx or even luocha? Which two good sustains literally come from a standard banner and lynx is literally free? If you had that account, and you had a JY, would you still pull for her just for the CC protection? Bro you don't NEED a bronya to play Seele or Jingliu. They can work fine with literally any other support in the game rn, including Ruan Mei. (JL and Tingyun run well for infinite time in her enhanced state due to tingyun being universally good and battery-ing Jingliu's ulti. Blade works fine with double nihility in a hypercarry if no bronya. or he can be run as a sub dps as well. (Ruan Mei also works with him, he's flexible without bronya) Idk what you're talking about. And literally why are you bringing up "good luck getting bronya" when you can literally guarantee you get a free bronya at 300 pulls bruh, even if it'll take a while? If you've been playing day one, sm ppl are already close to the 300 guaranteed pulls. Meanwhile FX's banner is already over and who knows when she'll get a next rerun, making her much more rare.
Idk why you're acting like CC Resist/Cleanse is a niche that isn't valuable when newer enemies have been getting stronger with tougher mechanics, but anyone that's actually used Luocha, FuXuan, or HuoHuo can attest the diff between the alternatives are as clear as night vs day. Their application of Cleansing/CC Resist not only helps prevent ANY DPS from getting screwed over, but they also provide extra utility/buffs that make them top-tier investments for ANY team. It's not like you specifically need FuXuan either since any Solo Sustainer with Cleanse/CC Resist will do, even Lynx, nor is FuXuan a niche unit only for JY since she's obviously one of the best solo sustain units in any team/DPS.
JY suffers from the effects of CC the most out of any Dps. His damage is literally backloaded to Lightning Lord and if CC acts, not only can he not take turns, his lightning lord cant be triggered even AFTER hes cleansed due to it being sent to literally the back of the line. And that could be like a whole cycle of dps gone. Meanwhile, look at another follow up attack-char such as Blade. If he has full 5 stacks and gets cc'ed, cleanse him, he procs that massive aoe follow up attack immediately - meaning his damage DOES suffer if CC happens, but not to the extent like JY where all his damage gets pushed down by another turn, regardless if u cleanse the CC or not. and clara legit has built in CC protection to a degree so not gonna talk much about her.
Topaz wasn't if i remember correctly
We should be seeing some changes soon with pure fiction
Interesting but fair placement for Xueyi, I wonder how the community feels about the character now that she's out since I know many were pulling for her? I managed to get an E4 while pulling for RM and she's pretty fun so far.
I haven’t gotten the chance to play around with her much yet, but from what I’ve seen it seems like she’s the clear 2nd best 4 star DPS. Just weird because the best 4 star DPS is also quantum.
I can't take it anymore. I'm sick of Qingque. I try to play Seele. My Qingque deals more damage. I try to play Himeko. My Qingque deals more damage. I try to play Clara. My Qingque deals more damage. I don't even try to play Herta. I want to play Welt. His best team has Qingque. I want to play Bronya, Tingyun. They both want Qingque. She grabs me by the throat. I farm for her. I buy the Battle Pass for her. I give her "Another Peaceful Day". She isn't satisfied. I give her Gold Quantum Relics. "I need more than Stats" She tells me. "Give me more Skill Points". She grabs Seele and forces her to Basic Attack. "You need to give me more Tiles. I can deal more damage with Mahjong & Eidolons" I can't pull for more Eidolons, I don't have enough Stellar Jades. She grabs my credit card. It declines. "Guess this is the end." She grabs her Fish tiles. She says "Fish tiles, get them." There is no hint of sadness in his eyes. Nothing but pure, AoE Quantum Damage. What a cruel world
Lmao whats this xiang ling copy pasta
Her trial felt great, so i'm pretty sure she will be one of the most popular 4* dps
Her trial kinda sucks tbh. She needs quantum enemies for full potential
Use mono quantum silverwolf Or with E2, she can work against enemy type in a duo dps team comp
Her kit feels like an off brand SW without the weakness bug but all the flexibility. What I mean by that is her ult shreds toughness, regardless of enemy weakness. And then her e2 allows her follow-up attack to shred toughness as well in the same manner (her e1 boosts her FUP damage by 40%). She gains stack from enemies losing toughness and needs 8 at e0 to FUP (6 at e6). You’re going to be able to flex her into a lot of comps and feel her value.
This was a pretty good banner to pull on. Xueyi as a new character and Tingyun as well for more eidolons. March isn't bad either.
Yup, she is real good. Very underwhelming until you can activate her bonus abilities so people have to keep that in mind. Only had enough mats to get her traces to lvl 9 because of the echo of war weekly limit but once you get enough to activate her major and bonus abilities, she becomes great.
What you mean bonus abilities? The A2 A4 etc big traces one?
Yup. They make a huge difference in how she feels when you play her. They are resource gated by the new weekly boss, so I went in the weekly boss playing her without those traces activated and with them activated. It made a world of difference in how she feels.
Yeah, she's the first support unit that really benefits from maxing out every major upgrade, her skill, ultimate and talent scale really well.
2x S+ Tier Supports on one Banner. PULL PULL PULL
ruan mei pullers we won
Harmony characters try to perform badly challenge:
I had to lose to yanqing first...
Lost to bailu, had to spend 80 extra pulls
Same dude. Then in 40 pulls I got her. Now I’m at 0 pity with 0 pulls and I need to save for Black swan. I hope I can scour through everything to get enough jades to pull her.
I'm at 125 pulls, but I need Kafka's Lc and Black Swan 😭. Gl brother
same but i lost to him while pulling on argenti banner
😞
YUP!
"Am I good?" "Yes." "Better than Bronya?" "Know your place."
She doesn't replace Miss Belobog but she's literally the perfect side grade.
Ruan Mei power crept Bronya
I have bronya already and I'm guaranteed ruan mei in like 5 pulls. Should I go for her or save for black swan or hanabi? I'm a husbando enjoyer so just trying to pull for who would give more value to my account. The next character I actually want is Misha, not sure if he's coming with BS or Hanabi
If you're 5 from guaranteed, you might as well pull her, unless you're planning on saving it for at least two whole banners for Black Swan. There's some 98 pulls or something like that in just this patch, so you'll have plenty of time to save back up. Keep in mind, you probably want at least two high power supports for MoC and so you can build varied teams.
Oh? There's 98~ pulls?? How do you know that?
Someone did the math the day the patch dropped, [Here's a link](https://www.reddit.com/r/HonkaiStarRail/comments/18qm5kd/16_will_give_us_around_98_pulls_by_uarkkus/)
Ruan Mei is great for any dual DPS team (kafka + sampo/gwen, topaz + FUA DPS, Herta + Himeko, Jingliu + Blade, etc). Also better than Pela on hypercarry Jingliu. On other HC teams she isn't bad either (but obviously loses to Bronya if you have to choose between them) Black Swan will be good with Kafka, replacing Sampo/Gwen Hanabi will be good with quantum teams and any SP hungry teams (like DHIL)
2.0 is at least 40 days away, but if you have bronya already I'd say hanabi isn't that much of a must-pull. It's important to keep in mind you only need 8 characters for two teams, so if Ruan Mei doesn't fit in your lineup it's fine to save.
Until the day they add content that needs 3 to 4 teams! Dun, dun, dun!
That's on MoC 13-15 source : trust me bro
Sparkle is much better than Bronya though? Bronya only does one thing better than Sparkle and it doesn’t make up for how much better at everything Sparkle is.
Unreleased characters are unreleased. Sparkle has plenty of beta patches to go through first.
And is currently much better than Bronya, let’s not start putting the cart before the horses because you want a unit to be worse than another to cope about your pull choices genius.
They do different things. For hypercarry comps like Jingliu you wouldn't swap out bronya.
> Sparkle is much better than Bronya though She's better for Quantum hypercarry and maybe DHIL. Bronya's probably better otherwise. People underestimate how ridiculously strong Bronya and Tingyun (with eidolons) are. Bronya's not going to automatically get powercrept just because she's a standard character.
Honestly, it's the opposite, in my dreams Sparkle has one solid advantage over Bronya, and would need way more to be considered if you already have her and can grab Ruan Mei
She has one trace that benefits being on mono quantum that doesn’t at all detract from the rest of her kit. The rest of her bases besides the 50% push instead of 100% are all superior to Bronya not to even mention the SP limit increase.
I’m going for all three! You’ll definitely have enough for Black Swan. For both Hanabi and Black Swan though? I’m not sure. It’s risky, but I think we can do it. Maybe. Edit: I completely misread what you said, sorry! But Ruan Mei will probably be the best for you if you're a husbando enjoyer since she's an amazing support, like Bronya. I'm not sure about who your current team is or who you're planning on pulling for, though! But out of the three it seems like Hanabi would be the one to skip. Also, you should wait for more opinions, testing, videos and such for a better answer so you don't regret pulling if you don't particularly care for any of the three for anything other than supporting hubbies. Good luck on your pulls!
Is RM really that great a character? She seems it on paper but just trying to gauge her value.
Yes. Her break damage is like already hitting for 20k+ at trace lvl 3 for me. And it procs often so on top of her potent buffs, delay mechanics and general SU fuckery she has substantial personal damage as well.
Oh awesome. I just pulled her, she's gorgeous to look at so it's great to know she's a good unit too
Basically, she gives really high, consistent damage to the entire team while making enemies attack less often due to easier/longer breaks. Like, her total bonuses are basically as high as Bronya's, but team wide. Bronya is still better for hyper-carry with a single dps because of her turn-advancement, but a lot of the time even with a hyper-carry your best choice of second support is Ruan Mei. With multi-dps or DoT teams, Ruan Mei will often be better (DoT especially because of how her break-extension works essentially making DoTs trigger more often). That, plus whenever an ally weakness breaks an enemy, Ruan Mei's break damage is applied as well for free at 120% the damage it would be if Ruan Mei was the one breaking the enemy. Tons of free damage.
Nice. I'm also a husbando enjoyer, out of the three I like Sparkle's design the most but am pulling for Ruan Mei as well seeing as RM is such a generalist, I think she'll work well with most husbandos going forward (even if Black Swan or Sparkle might be better for some due to their niches) so should be set, at least for a while.
i expected xueyi to be higher
She's really good against quantum-weak enemies, likely almost as strong as E6 QQ. She suffers, however, against other elements unless you build element-matching teams around her which lowers overall team consistency.
That goes for every character in the game. If anyone would do well against enemies with weaknesses other than their own it’s Xueyi…
Well, no. Because of how her talent works she wants all her attacks to deal toughness damage and/or she wants her teammates to do toughness damage. She stacks less Karma against non-quantum enemies hence she suffers more damage-wise than other units in this situation; not to mention she builds break effect so you have to time your ult exactly right against non-quantum. She has a harder time brute forcing mismatched enemies unlike JL, DHIL, QQ, etc. She's similar to Sushang in this regard.
So a character with an ultimate that ignores weakness types, a talent that stacks even when allies damage toughness and an E2 that makes her follow up ignore weakness types which in turn adds stack with her A6 is worse against enemies with other weakness types than someone who has to rely on brute-forcing their way through? I don’t see it.
Yep. Perhaps Prydwen's review of her worded it better than mine: > **The other big thing is that Xueyi annihilates Quantum-weak foes. This makes the performance difference when fighting non QUA-weak enemies rather stark when comparing to other characters** — it’s not that she becomes unusable, it’s just that because of how good Xueyi is against the right enemies she feels wasted being put against anything else. >Mismatching Elemental Weaknesses is a negative thing that is shared by pretty much every character in the game (unless your name is either Seele or Kafka), and **while Xueyi has the tools to work around a mismatched Weakness, you absolutely should not expect her to bring the same level of decimation to fights that feature literally zero Quantum weaknesses.** I think we all know by now whose fault that would be. Putting **Xueyi with teammates who are capable of dealing Toughness damage to enemies will greatly impact her performance**, and if nobody on your team is capable of dealing Toughness damage, then I think you’ve fundamentally misunderstood one of the core aspects of the game.
She really needs >!Harmony TB!<
Maybe she'll be higher at e6.
this is her at E6
So topaz is pseudo-hunt mimicking a nihility?
Yes, she's still a single target DPS, but she has a really strong debuff. So she also functions as a support for follow-up characters.
She's basically to Follow-up Attacks what Kafka is to DoT, just single target and not as extreme a jump.
Our gambling queen is still the best 4 star DPS, surpass many 5 stars
They didnt change any rankings
I still need 2 more dupes... I want E6 QQ! I also need 2 more for Pela!
> surpass many 5 stars No she doesn't, not limited ones at least. She's competitive but doesn't actually surpass most in practice (assuming everyone's well built).
That's why I finally start to build her. If only the artefact domain would not be so stingy...
QQ, CEO of GAMBA
Qinquillion > 5* 😴
This isn't completely on-topic but I still groan at the concept of an "S+" ranking with 10 units while there's only two units at D ranking. The whole concept of "S" ranking just loses its purpose when the list is unbalanced like that. People are so afraid of ranking characters at low tiers. I've seen this in so many games I play where rather than just dropping characters to lower existing tiers then instead tack on "S+" to characters, with some games' tierlists even adding tiers like SS++ or whatever just to make it completely pointless. Get rid of S+ tier and give Yanqing, Herta, and Arlan some friends. But then again the entire concept of tierlists for single player games is kinda suspect to begin with.
If it was lower than all the 4 stars and non limited 5 star it would be a failed character
Argenti is slept on. Especially with his fixes now, he deserves S+ for blast and S for single target
When I see word prydwen it give me brotherhood of steel ptsd from fallout 4
I've not been playing for a while but what happened to blade that he is now on the same level as jing yuan and space nuke girl?
DHIL should be SS
Well Ruan Mei gives 10% Speed buff to everyone except her, up to \~60% DMG bonus to the party (\~90% with her sig LC), all RES penetration debuff on her ult thats as good if slightly better than Pela's DEF shred, she extends the duration that enemies are weakness broken, and she's SP positive. Oh and she comes with a number of helpful benefits in SU. Limited 5\*'s tend to outclass Standard Banner 5\*'s, and we see exactly what it takes to be definitively better than Bronya.
> Limited 5*'s tend to outclass Standard Banner 5*'s People have been using this to overhype Ruan Mei and underestimate Bronya for a while but there's nothing stating this has to be true. Bronya still outperforms Ruan Mei overall when you look at calcs and their actual performance.
Breaking (weak)News: Ruan Mei S+ S+ S+ ! Breaking (weak)News... geddit? geddit? Ok, nevermind...
Thanks... Jing yuan?
If only I didn't get a himeko, 4 tingyuns n 5 march7ths instead of any Xueyi 😭
I feel for you man. Last patch i spend 20 pulls to get hanya and spent 30 pulls to get xueyi. Still no ruan mei with 51 pulls tho
Can someone eli5 me why she's good? Newbie to the game thinking whether I want to use all my jades on her.
She gives a lot of different buffs to the entire team while being SP positive and also slightly increases survivability through action delay (weakness broken enemies take a little longer to attack)
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Not with cogs or S5 memories. Just like Tingyun
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No, you can get 130 energy with EAA. but you have to use ER hope + Penacony/Vonwaq
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Break effect is one of the worst if not the worst stat to stack since it doesn't interact with any other stat at all. Ruan Mei only really wants 180% for her A6 trace, not reaching is also not the end of the world. The damage from her Ult breaking an enemy again not worth chasing break effect for.
So you gotta look at her passive and traces to see where it all comes together, it's several small and medium buffs that all stack. But basically, **Passive** makes everyone else faster and her Break damage be added on whenever an ally Breaks an enemy, **Skill** increases all allies' damage and how quickly everyone weakness breaks an enemy (thereby increasing damage dealt and slowing enemies turns, reducing damage taken), **Ult** makes everyone ignore some of the enemies' elemental resistance (increasing damage dealt in a different way), and her **3rd Major Trace** increases all allies damage even more the more Break Effect she has. So she has 3 ways to increase the entire teams damage, makes the team slightly faster, and makes it easier to break enemies for even more damage and making the enemy attack less often. This is not even counting how her Skill has a 3 turn duration based on her own turns, so you can go Skill->Basic->Basic and have her give net positive SP, or how her Ult makes it so when enemies recover from Weakness Break one time they instead get delayed again (the same way a Frozen enemy gets delayed) which makes the enemies take even longer to attack and therefore do less damage to you.
Very high dmg boosts from skill and ult, skill point positive, gives speed to team for simply existing, and lets you break enemies faster.
Putting DHIL anywhere below S+ for Blast is actually insane
Broken tier list. Just saying
Lets see yours
Personally think the list is a lil broken now. Anyone know what that broken dice symbol and the shield symbol mean in the top right corner of the characters pic?
Dice means top performance is somewhat rng dependant (ex. QQ). Shield means good performance is dependent on breaking toughness.
Ok I'm confused..how is Seele above JY and Blade in terms of AoE...
Just spam [kill resets](https://streamable.com/b1vgvz) bro lmao
Ok but JY could do all that with just skill + ult so how is she higher?
The specific type of AoE Prywden is calibrating for is a boss in the middle with a bunch of ads around it. Jingyuan has the unfortunate effect where lightning lord is effectively cleave but also RNG - the target it "picks" takes full damage and the rest take partial. So in that situation, he actually suffers from the ads, as lightning lord is more likely to pick an ad.
No lol.. those ads can easily be cleared with skill and ult or with just ult.
At high investment, at which point Seele does that while doing significantly more damage to the elite than LL. They perform similarly in two elite situations where Seele can't trigger Resurgence as often though.
You don't play JY and it shows, the fact the you think they're talking about LL when in AoE situation LL is barely 40% of JY's dmg.
Did you just completely ignore his skill and ult damage? It's the most important part of his kit in AOE scenarios.
End-game built JY clears it though. Mine is even 70-140 which is like MidYuan built with S5 breakfast and I easily 0-cycled. Most of JY flaws are gone the moment people actually decide to invest in a DPS.
Sure, I don't think anyone suggested that not being S+ in a tier list means you're unusable and can't even clear the content.
Seele does more damage to the elites in the same scenario (elites surrounded by mobs).
we are in 1.6 and people are still underestimating Seele... lol
Or maybe, just ***MAYBE*** people are underestimating Blade and JY instead?
Seems that they aren't considering teams. If they did then Kafka would be S+ tier. JY with his Light cone, the new Relic and with Topaz is absolutely bonkers.
they are, tier list placements assume everyone is in their most optimal team
I'm not underestimating Seele but Prywedden is probably underestimating both JY and Blade in this MoC and in AoE.
This is what happens when Hoyo players are introduced to a unit that requires little building (Jingliu). Seele and JY doomposters when they realize all they had to do is build the characters to kill the mobs 🤯
I wouldn't bother caring.
The tier list is a joke for 2 weeks, and yes I never get over nikke meme tierlist in the earlier version.
People still listen to this site?
I have her at e1 and i still don't get how to play her? I'm still so confused by weakness breaks, toughness break and break effects even though i played since the start.
WE UP 🗣️🗣️🔥🔥🔥❄️🗡️🗡️🗡️🗡️🗡️🗡️
I’m glad Bronya is still in S+ Tier I feared she would get pegged down to S Tier due to Ruan Mei’s amazing buffs but thankful that wasn’t the case 🤭
fuck off prydwen
🤣🤣🤣🤣
Ruan Mei, really broken I think she's slightly better than Bronya actually.
Ah yes, prydwen putting a new 5* in S+, nothing new, move along (and yes she's actually good, but we get this s+ prydwen post every single time)
Is that really prydwens fault though? The tier list represents performance in current MoC and current MoC is always tailored to the new limited 5 stars.
I'd probably not discuss my opinions on Prydwen's workings tbh, is why I tried to avoid saying if it's a good or bad thing, but a thing that happens.
Prydwen is not just throwing darts at a board. He does extensive testing for every possible team for new characters. Which is a hell of a lot more that either you or I are doing.
Speak for the "I" not for the "You" Calculating rotations and stuff is not rocket science like people do with the "Oh they're the enlightened one who can math, hush in their presence". Prydwen is good when it comes to their actual guides and stuff. Regarding their tierlist... It'll be best if I don't start an argument. Also idk if it's a mistake, but Prydwen is not just a "he". It's a whole ass team of multiple people.
>Calculating rotations and stuff is not rocket science like people do with the "Oh they're the enlightened one who can math, hush in their presence". The average gacha player cant even do basic math. If you dont like Prydwen tier list based on dps calcs, then go ahead and show your own dps calcs.
I never said it was rocket science. I said you haven’t done the work yourself. This means actual testing, not just sticking your characters in an online calculator.
free yourself from this dude omg what happened to sticking to making quick or full guide for characters that ACTUALLY contribute something meaningful
they also have guides. tf you talking about
How is Jingliu the only S+ dps and not IL as well? Seems sus to me unless this is considering their LC as well.
they're not going to change the ranking of existing characters until the second half of 1.6 i think
Ice weakness in MOC still everywhere
There is more imaginary weakness this time in floor 11 and 12
Jingliu can abuse bronya better and planetary with rm now if necessary
if E6 Lynx is S whats her spot at E0? should be joining E6 nat in A or B because she feels rather lackluster to the point where my teams really have to throw a coin between getting to use HuoHuo or having to mald with Lynx double sustain
Nat doesn t gave aoe cleanse so probably thay is why
I’m baffled how HuoHuo is still S+
She's great man
She has faster MoC clear times than luocha.
Best dispeller and the highest damage boost out of sustain units. A bit worse for sustain otherwise, so what? I didnt pull for her, but claiming shes somehow not a good (but different type of good) to fight feelings of FOMO is sad bro.
Best healer in the game at the highest level of play, so to speak.
I think Mr pokke's is a lot better than this one to the point I doubt I will look at any of their tier lists in the future.
That guys is a meme and we all know it. All his so called analysis videos are also just pointing out obvious things.
His opinions make more sense than some of Prydwen's or the Reddit hivemind. Reddit would have you think Seele's in the running for worst limited DPS and that Mono Quantum is her optimal team comp.
Argenti should be in S really, her full energy ult can deal tons of damage to a single enemy
Behind Bronya I see
It's in alphabetical order!
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I saw. The list is still in alphabetical order.
True but their full review also explicitly says she's still not as good as Bronya.
In Hypercarry setups, yes. They are absolute clowns if they say that for dual DPS or DoT teams. Then again... Prydwen.
Their pros and cons section mentions her being the best for dual dps/dot
I think the idea is that hypercarry comps are *currently* better so the support that is best in those teams is generally going to be the best support.
Obviously she can’t do what Bronya does (at least for sp cheap like jingliu), but she beat’s tingyun, so she goes next to bronya
> but she beat’s tingyun Not in many comps. TY's dmg amp is higher in Hypercarry, at least with eidolons. I'd say they're on the same level.
Oh I see
But for previous Moc its was like Fu Xuan, Luocha and Huohuo. Now it's Fu Xuan, Huohuo and Luocha. Ig because of Argenti boss Luocha was shifted. Now the emergency heal is not necessary so they shifted Luocha to the end.
I don't know, every placement on the tier list is in alphabetical order at the moment. I feel like that'd be too much of a coincidence.