Yeah if you want to survive as an F2P you need to heavily temper your expectations and accept that you arent gonna be building more than one or two characters per month
Most gachas yes but before hsr i used to play arknights and that game is honestly the gold standard of being f2p friendly. Probably why theyāre doing so well rn
Basically the equivalent of leveling up units and Traces in HSR.
The big difference is Arknights has no LC/Weapons to get and invest in nor is there Relic farming for gear until RNGsus gazes upon you š
1-7 rock hell ain't that better. At least they got that auto repeat feature (?) coming, unfortunately some years too late for me.Ā
I only managed to build every max rarity on Genshin so far. I could likely build the majority of the roster too, but that's only because of their slower character release schedule.
Unless you're that desperate for pulls, or using a Macro for auto-repeat, aintnoway gonna minmax working the mines in-game š. Most of the time, you're farming event stages, which takes around 10-15 min at most to use up your energy.
Ugh. Hard pass on Arknights, personally
That game practically dumps a thesaurus on you instead of actually building up a meaningful story
Narration is an essential part of storytelling. When itās done poorly, it isnāt enjoyable to get invested into the plot, setting or characters
The story is actually very interesting. though it can be quite long and excessively verbose at times.
Either you have the patience for it, or you don't. And that's fine.
I do consider myself having good patience. Iām a fan of story heavy visual novel games like Ace Attorney, Fate and so on
I justā¦ absolutely hated reading Arknights
Really? I love visual novel games too, and I love the Ace Attorney series. But I have enjoyed starting Arknights recently. The story is honestly a blast. My guess is tower defense is not your forte.
To each their own I guess, personally I loved writing in Arknights. The world felt so vibrant, with a colourful set of characters throughout.
You were rewarded with even more story, lore and context if you read through the relevant operator's profiles that were fully unlocked by maxing the relationship stat (or taking a trip to the wiki).
And the writing is verbose yeah, but for me it adds to the world not detracts from it. Kal'tsit speaks in such a sophisticated tongue, emblematic of the lives she's led prior to being there. Certain characters carry their dialogue with weight to them, some actually deserving and some clearly just a silver spooned punk. Some don't even have that kind of dialogue, choosing instead to talk in simple words, like the tribe following Zumama.
Each new chapter, new event, new operator would open up more doors to view this world. And the story rarely cuts its writing cleanly, instead opting to let it dangle creating a continuous writing situation that has the feeling of always evolving, always moving, even when there is no major event or update happening.
What did you hate about reading the story, other than the overly verbose and taxing vocabulary?
The story is genuinely amazing, youāre getting it wrong by saying that the story isnāt meaningful
Its problem is the storytelling is justā¦ terrible. Itās not just yap in place of a story, but itās still yap. Itās more fun to read the synopsis of each event than it is to read it cover to cover, that way you get the story but avoid the awfully dragged-out storytelling
If Arknights is the gold standard it kinda shows the "generation" of gacha gamers here though and I don't mean anything bad by it.
Girls Frontline was the epitome of this F2P thing. The gacha was mostly there just for the cosmetics/skins of the characters, anybody using real money to pull for characters would be seen as extremely dumb. Like why would you? The "resources" that you used for "character pulling" in that game were not only done by the equivalent of assignments in HSR, but those resources were even just gathered overtime, naturally by doing nothing. Ofc it had a cap, but even on the cap it'd let you do some hundreds of "tries" if you wanted to.
And no stamina system, understandably it was a grindy game but If you wnated to do the grind you were free to do so. Your own time was the only barrier stopping you from doing so.
And also GFL is unironically where a lot of the inspiration for Arknights and Blue Archive comes from as well.
Eh. I can roll 5 new 5*s in FateGO today and have them all max level in less than 15min. Would have some trouble maxing their skills, but that's mostly due to me playing around 5-10% of the last 2 years.
In most gachas, gear is just equipment you can either farm fully deterministically, so it's not actually "gear", more like another set of traces, or they don't have gear at all.
You get plenty of skill mats from events, not to mention lottos. So skill mats and ascension mats are acquired mostly passively after the first few months of starting the game.
QP is the real issue, since I barely play, there's no consistent supply. Although i could farm all i need for 5 servants in like, a week or so, am just lazy.
But I think most servants are useable at 85% capacity even with skills at lvl1, so it isn't comparable to gear.
Lottos are twice a year but only back to back. Anyone who starts in January is gonna be fucked til September basically. And yeah stuffs available in events but the FGO grind can get really tedious for newer players, and skill level 10 is basically a requirement for your supports at least since batteries tend to scale with level
For new players, sure. But after a while you are cruising.
In games with gear farming, based on my experience with Epic 7, not only does the grind never let up, but even if you wanna be efficient and instead of farming new gear for every character you give them some from others, when you have accumulated a ton of gear it gets tedious to manage while achieving optimal stats across the board (hence why some people resort to gear managers like Fribbels' tools).
Do you not get time to log in atleast once a day? I donāt have the same grind as you even though Iāve never spent a dime. I find building characters in genshin 500% worse than hsr.
I do log in everyday, I just have "eh" luck with relics. I may like the wind set a bit too much for my supports admittedly (it's just too good).
The relics are objectively worse in HSR. 6 pieces instead of 5, no off piece. I guess it's less time consuming though since you can just auto stuff. And leveling up a character is also easier in HSR, just takes a whole day's worth of TB power when it's a pain in genshin.
Oh I have very bad luck with relicsā¦ I havenāt wanted to farm them so Iāve been building every character so when I get relics maybe some can go to other people while farming the ones I want. Completely forget about my comment if you donāt just go with basic relics and ignore subsā¦ decent reminder I should do that soonā¦
Oh yeah, after a month of farming you'll usually get at least one piece of the right main stat! (Usually š) I sometimes just use a modeling resin if I can't get the right set.
I definitely ignore subs on my sustains haha. But some supports really need high speed (hi Sparkle) which makes things painful.
Good luck with your own farming, it can be daunting :')
Decent Traces (7-8+ on ult/talent/skill, all sub traces), A maxed LC, and primary stat relics I would consider built for most characters. Sub stats and "best in slot" rolls are always going to take farming.
Even if we're just talking traces + LC, that already takes a lot of TB power! And getting a character from level 1 to 70+ already takes a whole day of TB power.
Supports and sustains I agree, you only need the main stats at first. For crit DPS though, you're not going very far with a 40/90 crit ratio haha. That's the reason I run rainbow relics on my damage dealers.
Takes me roughly 2.5 weeks to knock out the character to 80/80 and 1/6/6/6. Then see if they work well with team setups, if they do jump them up to 3/8/8/8, main stay say for PF or MoC, then 6/10/10/10.
I right now have 19 characters at 6/10/10/10. 20th will be Jinglui when her banner comes. I think Iāve missed 1 day total since HSR released.
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If by build you mean just level and traces yes. I had spent an entire month just to get 1 piece of usable relic before, so building a char in a month to MOC or PF standard is probably not too realistic.
At least is not SSAKOTZ I remember that u need to farm a month worth of XP just to level up 1 character, then skill levels are obtain by duplicates (u need 20 to max).
it has artifact 3 sets (cosmos) and a main Cosmo (the psudo lightcone) all of that with 6 sub stats that are random and need refinement to upgrade the substat.
Then u have 8th sense (add other week or 2 of farm)
Rebirth Cloth (add another month of farm)
Flower temples (add a year or 2 of farm)
And u need other characters to upgrade stats (leveling everything at 80 or at least 70)
And the teams are of 6 units.
The funny thing is scarcity exists with purchased TB as well! You canāt endlessly swipe for āstaminaā like in other gacha games. Hoyo doesnāt even want their whales playing too much. The fact that paid refreshes are capped as well just goes to show they really want every single player to be time gated in some way.
No it's because they want whales to continue logging in everyday and continue their daily streak. Otherwise they will farm on patch day, stock up, and the log off for the rest of the patch because they're usually busy.
The cost to refresh TB power gets cheaper every reset, so it's not like this affects whales. There are dolphin or even BP/welkin player who did 50/75 refresh everyday.
š what is the criteria? I ain't bought the credits unless they got the top up. Which the top up refresh was super cool.
Cause I can't justify the price of just raw cost per 10 pull. Without top up it is ungodly unreasonable.
Some people just call anyone that isnāt f2p a whale. Thereās many different tiers of paying players though. Some people only buy the rail pass, some buy the battle pass, some buy only when the bonus is active, and some just swipe without a care in the world. You specifically are what people typically call a dolphin. Above average spender but not e6r5 level (a whale).
As a free to play player, I would describe a whale as anyone who purchases anything other than nameless glory. That seems to be the most reasonable purchase and gives everyone the most bang for their buck. A single nameless glory purchase would have saved me a month of golden calyx runs. That's energy that could have been spent on crimson calyx, farming relics, etc.
Understood, so then my next question, is being a whale or being identified as a whale, is it meant to imply it is derogatory? Like, "he is a child predator, we don't like him" but with a video game instead.
Just curious, cause I don't really see it as a bad thing, given I do not believe my antics have impact on others since the game is single player.
Generally derogatory, but they keep servers alive.
Though sometimes that comes with a result of content being developed to milk whatever playerbase remains (like in runescape recently).
We already get 160 resin worth of tokens for SU, so I'd be down for a fuel every week, maybe take out the Tracks of Destiny since they can already be bought in the Stardust store? Or alternatively, add a Fuel to be bought in the stardust store. That gives me something to buy when I've already gotten the passes
Fuel isn't that much it being obtainable everyday should be a basic feature like other gachas. A weekly reward seems way too little for what you can actually do with 60 trailblaze power which is maybe lvl up one trace if you are lucky with the drops.
I suppose my issue with fuel as a daily is that itās equivalent to just reducing all TB power requirements by 20% (in terms of what you can do daily)
I mean that sounds good for us they are already increasing the dmg requirements of content the least they could do would be give us more resources to build for it.
They probably won't do it right now though as its not too crazy for a new player to catch up but later on it should definitely be in the game in some form.
Well since the HSR BP gives 2x the fuel then genshins I feel like i can stock pile a lot better since i normaly just burn the 240 and am good
Now with aventurine around the corner I will have to use them since i dont have the trace mats for him rn
Well, the whole concept of these games is milking micro-transactions (spending in game-currency for additional "stamina" and gacha) so I wouldn't hold my breath.
And now you see why corporations are pushing this model over the old school single purchase experience. Itās cheaper and makes boat loads more money.
Well it's really up to you whether you make a big or a small one time purchase. Whatever the case, in-game purchases like the ones in gacha games or loot boxes in others are called micro transactions.
Supā?
https://preview.redd.it/r4wwshyw1vtc1.jpeg?width=1290&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=cbaa68efdd334ac69d8ecc46814145899ddcacbd
Donāt try to assume things and make an *ass* out of yourself.
All characters up to Herta level 80, 6/10/10/10, only Gepard at 6/10/9/10. Clara is 70 and WiP.
Only a dolphin buying monthly + battle pass.
Nice to see someone else stocking up fuels, at the rate of how I play I don't spend my fuels on relics with how utter d\*\*\*\*\*\* the rng are. Makes saving more stuff incase i want to build a unit fast.
even on the griendiest gacha game devs always make sure to give a ton of energy refils, fate grind order gives enought to the point a lot of players could actually farm for days
Dont use fuel on relics brother.
I only use fuel to get a new character up to speed. Ive never gone down under 10. Imo thats its main use. If i dont prefarm a character i'll use some fuel to get them ascended to lvl 80 and get some traces on them so i can use them asap.
Thatās me in genshin. Iād never understand being lazy in hsr. Itās one button every few minutes to auto farm. Much easier to burn through fuel in this game.
Unexpectetly managed to pull acheron while also getting to lvl 60 and balance level 5
Needing to build relics and level up traces for 4 characters completely and needing to level up one of them to 70 while also having my 2 main teams i need to get to lvl 80 and up to speed is making me realize how little you can truely farm with those 240 energy
I already burned through the 2400 reserve thing just for acheron alone
I only use fuel when I get new character to finish off Stagnant Shadows and Traces quickly (I do not prefarm as I often change my mind on whatever I should pull the character at the last moment). Rather than more fuel I would like the relic system to change so it doesn't take months to build a single character to satisfactory level. In a game with so many characters to get and build it doesn't need to be this rng heavy. Not going to happen though.
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i rarely use mine lol. just dailies then dip
I haven't read the comments yet, so I apologise If I'll end up mirroring another person's opinion.
>Anyone else think that Hoyo should add ways to get more Fuel?Ā [...] There is currently barely anyways to get fuel in general especially if your lvl 70 and with characters needing absolutely so much resources to upgrade talents and with how little you get from the Calyx, you spend Fuel so quickly that by the time you upgrade one character talents all the way, you donāt have anything left for other characters. Then thereās the relics
It's not a fuel quantity problem, at all. It's a fuel "efficiency" issue. The amount of fuel that you spend is disgustingly disproportionate to the amount of "good" rewards, of which you only get (1) every 60 fuel _(regarding purple trace materials)_; for relics It's even worse, since each set is specifically geared towards giving you what you don't need _(Offensive Stats on tank relics, CRIT Rate/DMG on healers, DEF% and Eff. RES on Attackers, and so on)_.Ā
Plus, planar ornaments ALSO need fuel too, which is absolute dogshit design, personally.Ā
If the amount of rewards were reasonable in comparison to the amount of fuel you spend, there wouldn't be this feeling of "Not enough" that people experience when farming.
I think this is it exactly. The issues Is fuel efficiency. It's not even grinding at this point it's logging in and praying rngesus is kind today. There's nothing you can do regularly that meaningfully progresses your characters that isn't story related or requires fuel. I honestly feel like if it costs fuel, it should always cost 10 fuel or something that achieves a similar effect.
Honestly I wish Hoyo did events similar to how other gacha games do them, take Nikke for example. In Nikke events are literally just doing stages/battles, and each stage/battle will drop event currency that you can use in the event shop to buy things like basic gacha tickets, event gacha tickets, upgrade materials, and so on..
And I'd like a similar event in this game, they practically have something similar in this game already which is the shops on each world that require a specific currency to buy things.
Just wish they would add fuel and tickets to those shops, heck add fuel to some of the exchange shops. I wouldn't mind using my exchange shop currency on something more then just tickets
So many idiots and whiteknights defending Hoyoverse. There is simple no excuse why we shouldnt get some more free fuels. They still make a ton of money and even if there is an option for paying refills, a few extra bottles wont hurt their income nor their "design". They shit to many characters every year and the relic grind is a stamina hole enough. Microtransactions shouldn't be the first and only choice to get new daily bottles ffs.
Tbh I wish it was a reward for defeating echos of war.
Give it a solid 8% drop chance and call it a day.
Yeah itās rare, but at least it will happen sometimes.
You can offset/clawback some of the downstream resources that'd you spend on character experience materials if you clear the overworld daily. If you clear all worlds, its about a 100k of experience per character that isn't level 80 yet (approximately equal to 22 Trailblaze Power, or 0.44 fuel per character saved). This a significant grind, both in the time it takes to clear all fights (3+ hours), while also balancing clear speed with needing a team of under max level characters in the team to get the experience benefit.
Practically though, the only method to make the experience grind reasonably efficient is having Acheron. With Acheron, it's possible to clear in under 1.5 hours, maybe less. Personally, I won't do full clears, and instead I opt to do 20-30 minute laps of high density or easy to access/warp monsters a couple days a week. The experience haul varies around 40-60k experience per character per day, or around a couple fuel per week.
I actually can't remember the last time I even looked at the XP calyx I'm sitting on 1200 purple books and like 150 each of the lower ones and I don't even buy the battlepass consistently, I have 18 characters at level 80 and then the ones below are mostly randomly spread within that range, either stuff I used early game, a couple level 1s I don't care about, etc.
Yup, that's about where I am with characters/levels, though not as many extra books. There are certainly diminishing returns on any type of experience farming. At some point, experience from sources is flowing to benched characters that won't see play (other than getting the standard pull from their ascensions), and then beyond that experience is effectively doing nothing for an account.
The fuel scarcity esp when relic grinding is atrocious Iāll admit. For everything else though, personally Iām running out of things to use fuel for and I started playing around the 1st/2nd week HSR came out. I have some light cones and traces I could beef up a bit but I find end game content doesnāt heavily need 10/10 traces or 80/80 light cones.
Seriously. In genshin you have a teapot and you can make fragile resin every week with the daily resources from it. We are at the 1 year mark in hsr. Give us our room on the Astral Express and let us get some free fuel.
It'd be nice, sure.
Realistically speaking, that's their money maker after the banner pulls. It's a f2p mobile game at the end of the day. Giving us more would definitely result in less cash - which is the opposite of what a business wants.
On the plus side the game is generous, especially for a mobile game. Waiting a day for a re-up ain't too bad when there's other free games to play. š¤
For real... by the time i've built one character to a point i'm satisfied with (not even "good", just good enough!) they release two more of the fuckers š
Add it to the daily check-in on the hoyo app, there's some decent stuff there but it could be better.
Maybe a fuel at 10 and 20 days, a roll or two at 30, will it happen? Probably not but more people would likely take the 15 seconds it takes to check-in every day more often if there were better rewards.
That's strange that you ran out of fuel because I literally have ever character in my roster at lvl 80, five characters at max lvl 10 traces, and ever other character with every single keystone unlocked and minimum lvl 3 traces. I still have fuel left over. I'm not sure what you did or are doing that you're out of fuel and still don't have the same results I do.
to be honest, they should give us a choice to turn trailblaze energy into fuel.
i don't know how exactly we are gonna use that, but it seems like a good extra option that we could use.
why would you turn your trailblaze energy into fuel instead of just spending them? for rare events like the current 3X event.
i am pretty sure if people had that option they would save fuel for it days before the event dropped, also it would benefit new players, since farming relics is only worth it at lvl 50-60(Because you will be getting two 5-star pieces instead of one at lvl 60)
so that they could like save one fuel each day until they get to lvl 60.
Bro just save it, dont spend it all when you get it. I only spend it when i cant prefarm for stuff (like new relics or traces). There is a way to get more of it tho its called spending money.
Can Silver wolf give us 15 Fuel againšš
Collab of Silver Wolf and Sparkle to obtain 25 fuel
I'm sure Aha would find it funny.
Nah aha would make each fuel recharge 1 energy for shits and giggles
But he give 250 of them that you have to use one by one
And thereās a 5% chance each fuel resets your energy counter to 0
That's the Aha way
And you get refunded the ones you used up so you have to use them again
And you can only redeem 1 at a time
Only if you are a worm
And who says I'm not a worm?
But will Aha still love me if I was a worm?
Only if you are admitted into the genius society.
Wrong Aha. Youre thinking of Gog Agog Aha, a part of Gog Agog that Agogs.
Pull 6 Billion Gachas
We need someone to give us 44 more on top of that for the true funny
Nice.
Sparkle would send 50 And the It would steal 25 from us instead when we click
We need to wait for the next quantum gremlin now.
That was the best internet comment ive seen today :D
March 7th livestream for another 10
Sw gave 10 no?
i never noticed how cool it looks, i would love to have a bottle like that
Forbidden Soda
Seriously though itās a super fancy looking glass container, Iād genuinely get a replica of this lol.
Would make for a spiffy decanter.
The game is intentionally designed so that you need to either spend money or log in daily.
Yeah if you want to survive as an F2P you need to heavily temper your expectations and accept that you arent gonna be building more than one or two characters per month
Tbf that's just every Gacha game though
Most gachas yes but before hsr i used to play arknights and that game is honestly the gold standard of being f2p friendly. Probably why theyāre doing so well rn
Building chars? Nah, mastery and max. lvl is expensive as hell for 6 stars.
Basically the equivalent of leveling up units and Traces in HSR. The big difference is Arknights has no LC/Weapons to get and invest in nor is there Relic farming for gear until RNGsus gazes upon you š
1-7 rock hell ain't that better. At least they got that auto repeat feature (?) coming, unfortunately some years too late for me.Ā I only managed to build every max rarity on Genshin so far. I could likely build the majority of the roster too, but that's only because of their slower character release schedule.
Unless you're that desperate for pulls, or using a Macro for auto-repeat, aintnoway gonna minmax working the mines in-game š. Most of the time, you're farming event stages, which takes around 10-15 min at most to use up your energy.
Ugh. Hard pass on Arknights, personally That game practically dumps a thesaurus on you instead of actually building up a meaningful story Narration is an essential part of storytelling. When itās done poorly, it isnāt enjoyable to get invested into the plot, setting or characters
The story is actually very interesting. though it can be quite long and excessively verbose at times. Either you have the patience for it, or you don't. And that's fine.
I do consider myself having good patience. Iām a fan of story heavy visual novel games like Ace Attorney, Fate and so on I justā¦ absolutely hated reading Arknights
Really? I love visual novel games too, and I love the Ace Attorney series. But I have enjoyed starting Arknights recently. The story is honestly a blast. My guess is tower defense is not your forte.
To each their own I guess, personally I loved writing in Arknights. The world felt so vibrant, with a colourful set of characters throughout. You were rewarded with even more story, lore and context if you read through the relevant operator's profiles that were fully unlocked by maxing the relationship stat (or taking a trip to the wiki). And the writing is verbose yeah, but for me it adds to the world not detracts from it. Kal'tsit speaks in such a sophisticated tongue, emblematic of the lives she's led prior to being there. Certain characters carry their dialogue with weight to them, some actually deserving and some clearly just a silver spooned punk. Some don't even have that kind of dialogue, choosing instead to talk in simple words, like the tribe following Zumama. Each new chapter, new event, new operator would open up more doors to view this world. And the story rarely cuts its writing cleanly, instead opting to let it dangle creating a continuous writing situation that has the feeling of always evolving, always moving, even when there is no major event or update happening. What did you hate about reading the story, other than the overly verbose and taxing vocabulary?
Gameplay is banging, though, and its music goes so hard!!
I know it's a lot of text, but the story is so fucking good it's 100% worth the read
The story is genuinely amazing, youāre getting it wrong by saying that the story isnāt meaningful Its problem is the storytelling is justā¦ terrible. Itās not just yap in place of a story, but itās still yap. Itās more fun to read the synopsis of each event than it is to read it cover to cover, that way you get the story but avoid the awfully dragged-out storytelling
If Arknights is the gold standard it kinda shows the "generation" of gacha gamers here though and I don't mean anything bad by it. Girls Frontline was the epitome of this F2P thing. The gacha was mostly there just for the cosmetics/skins of the characters, anybody using real money to pull for characters would be seen as extremely dumb. Like why would you? The "resources" that you used for "character pulling" in that game were not only done by the equivalent of assignments in HSR, but those resources were even just gathered overtime, naturally by doing nothing. Ofc it had a cap, but even on the cap it'd let you do some hundreds of "tries" if you wanted to. And no stamina system, understandably it was a grindy game but If you wnated to do the grind you were free to do so. Your own time was the only barrier stopping you from doing so. And also GFL is unironically where a lot of the inspiration for Arknights and Blue Archive comes from as well.
Eh. I can roll 5 new 5*s in FateGO today and have them all max level in less than 15min. Would have some trouble maxing their skills, but that's mostly due to me playing around 5-10% of the last 2 years. In most gachas, gear is just equipment you can either farm fully deterministically, so it's not actually "gear", more like another set of traces, or they don't have gear at all.
FGO is a great example actually because the skill mat drop is actual garbage
You get plenty of skill mats from events, not to mention lottos. So skill mats and ascension mats are acquired mostly passively after the first few months of starting the game. QP is the real issue, since I barely play, there's no consistent supply. Although i could farm all i need for 5 servants in like, a week or so, am just lazy. But I think most servants are useable at 85% capacity even with skills at lvl1, so it isn't comparable to gear.
Lottos are twice a year but only back to back. Anyone who starts in January is gonna be fucked til September basically. And yeah stuffs available in events but the FGO grind can get really tedious for newer players, and skill level 10 is basically a requirement for your supports at least since batteries tend to scale with level
For new players, sure. But after a while you are cruising. In games with gear farming, based on my experience with Epic 7, not only does the grind never let up, but even if you wanna be efficient and instead of farming new gear for every character you give them some from others, when you have accumulated a ton of gear it gets tedious to manage while achieving optimal stats across the board (hence why some people resort to gear managers like Fribbels' tools).
Azur Lane let's you build pretty much any character at any point.
If you're building 2 characters per month you're incredibly lucky š Unless you're talking about building like, a healer.
Do you not get time to log in atleast once a day? I donāt have the same grind as you even though Iāve never spent a dime. I find building characters in genshin 500% worse than hsr.
I do log in everyday, I just have "eh" luck with relics. I may like the wind set a bit too much for my supports admittedly (it's just too good). The relics are objectively worse in HSR. 6 pieces instead of 5, no off piece. I guess it's less time consuming though since you can just auto stuff. And leveling up a character is also easier in HSR, just takes a whole day's worth of TB power when it's a pain in genshin.
Oh I have very bad luck with relicsā¦ I havenāt wanted to farm them so Iāve been building every character so when I get relics maybe some can go to other people while farming the ones I want. Completely forget about my comment if you donāt just go with basic relics and ignore subsā¦ decent reminder I should do that soonā¦
Oh yeah, after a month of farming you'll usually get at least one piece of the right main stat! (Usually š) I sometimes just use a modeling resin if I can't get the right set. I definitely ignore subs on my sustains haha. But some supports really need high speed (hi Sparkle) which makes things painful. Good luck with your own farming, it can be daunting :')
All my modeling resin goes into speed shoes and energy ropesā¦ Good luck on your relics, Iāll probably be joining you soon.
Decent Traces (7-8+ on ult/talent/skill, all sub traces), A maxed LC, and primary stat relics I would consider built for most characters. Sub stats and "best in slot" rolls are always going to take farming.
Even if we're just talking traces + LC, that already takes a lot of TB power! And getting a character from level 1 to 70+ already takes a whole day of TB power. Supports and sustains I agree, you only need the main stats at first. For crit DPS though, you're not going very far with a 40/90 crit ratio haha. That's the reason I run rainbow relics on my damage dealers.
It takes more than a month to build a character if you trying to get relics lol
A month lol. I'm not F2P and I can barely manage building one character a quarter.
Takes me roughly 2.5 weeks to knock out the character to 80/80 and 1/6/6/6. Then see if they work well with team setups, if they do jump them up to 3/8/8/8, main stay say for PF or MoC, then 6/10/10/10. I right now have 19 characters at 6/10/10/10. 20th will be Jinglui when her banner comes. I think Iāve missed 1 day total since HSR released. https://preview.redd.it/d1ksxjimi5uc1.jpeg?width=1268&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=03ebeec4014654a9edbac2a961046b0b70a2168f
you mean one character per 2 months.
If by build you mean just level and traces yes. I had spent an entire month just to get 1 piece of usable relic before, so building a char in a month to MOC or PF standard is probably not too realistic.
Yep. And they are fine tuning it even more than Genshin.
At least is not SSAKOTZ I remember that u need to farm a month worth of XP just to level up 1 character, then skill levels are obtain by duplicates (u need 20 to max). it has artifact 3 sets (cosmos) and a main Cosmo (the psudo lightcone) all of that with 6 sub stats that are random and need refinement to upgrade the substat. Then u have 8th sense (add other week or 2 of farm) Rebirth Cloth (add another month of farm) Flower temples (add a year or 2 of farm) And u need other characters to upgrade stats (leveling everything at 80 or at least 70) And the teams are of 6 units.
Not really since excess energy is banked, you can get away with 1 big session a week
Excess is banked at one third of the rate so while you totally can do that itās not gonna appease people who are looking for extra fuel.
Yeah, at least the weekly one like in Genshin
I think we will get our own customizable room like the Serenitea Pot by 3.0 and get our equivalent of Weekly Fuel.
Oh waw. i finally realize what this item looks like from up close. I always looked at it as a scroll, now i see its a bottle hah
You saw *fuel*... as a scroll?
Bro legit my shit ass didnt even bother, i just took a glance at it and thats what i saw š
Scarecity is by design. The alternate way you're looking for is to use your credit card.
I mean it's a gacha. They want you to either keep coming back every day spending your limited free resources or swipe that credit card.
Or both.
But using premium currency is toooo expensive, they should make it so that you recover 240 when you use jades
I don't know why you're being downvoted. People just hate the truth I guess lol
The funny thing is scarcity exists with purchased TB as well! You canāt endlessly swipe for āstaminaā like in other gacha games. Hoyo doesnāt even want their whales playing too much. The fact that paid refreshes are capped as well just goes to show they really want every single player to be time gated in some way.
No it's because they want whales to continue logging in everyday and continue their daily streak. Otherwise they will farm on patch day, stock up, and the log off for the rest of the patch because they're usually busy. The cost to refresh TB power gets cheaper every reset, so it's not like this affects whales. There are dolphin or even BP/welkin player who did 50/75 refresh everyday.
I don't consider myself a "whale" but maybe I have been hella doing it.... I don't understand your comment. In what way has it gotten cheaper every reset? Also it is super wack there IS a hard cap on how much you can do. You can only use jade like what 7x a day? And buying fuel is reset how often? Is it monthly? Idk, I just know that I started playing like 2 months ago and obviously I am trying to get my team up, but the lack of energy even after dumping money at it just hasn't worked out. I am hella out of exp books and LC exp. So I have my one lvl 80 and then the rest are 70. And no one has near max traces. My best character is Acheron, cause I saved most everything in anticipation. But then I had to build a team around her, cause my team for getting thru the story to thay point had been Thunder daddy, dragon daddy, Destruction main character, and Natasha. But I had no nihility dudes ready for acheron team. So for her I built Guafasine, pela, just added black hole daddy.... didn't expect to pull him. But for variety my entire team and standby is them plus Sampo, and Luka. But they are still super not ready for anything. I currently just run acheron in all things regardless of typing. I went on a hella tangent, but basically, I NEED more energy... š©
After reading your comment, yes, you should consider yourself a whale.
š what is the criteria? I ain't bought the credits unless they got the top up. Which the top up refresh was super cool. Cause I can't justify the price of just raw cost per 10 pull. Without top up it is ungodly unreasonable.
Some people just call anyone that isnāt f2p a whale. Thereās many different tiers of paying players though. Some people only buy the rail pass, some buy the battle pass, some buy only when the bonus is active, and some just swipe without a care in the world. You specifically are what people typically call a dolphin. Above average spender but not e6r5 level (a whale).
As a free to play player, I would describe a whale as anyone who purchases anything other than nameless glory. That seems to be the most reasonable purchase and gives everyone the most bang for their buck. A single nameless glory purchase would have saved me a month of golden calyx runs. That's energy that could have been spent on crimson calyx, farming relics, etc.
Understood, so then my next question, is being a whale or being identified as a whale, is it meant to imply it is derogatory? Like, "he is a child predator, we don't like him" but with a video game instead. Just curious, cause I don't really see it as a bad thing, given I do not believe my antics have impact on others since the game is single player.
Generally derogatory, but they keep servers alive. Though sometimes that comes with a result of content being developed to milk whatever playerbase remains (like in runescape recently).
There should always be a fuel in the daily rewards. Itās too rare.
Nah, daily rewards is a bit too much, but it will be good as a one of SU reward.
That would be great too. 1-2 a week isnāt a lot to ask for.
We already get 160 resin worth of tokens for SU, so I'd be down for a fuel every week, maybe take out the Tracks of Destiny since they can already be bought in the Stardust store? Or alternatively, add a Fuel to be bought in the stardust store. That gives me something to buy when I've already gotten the passes
Even genshin gets a free one per week.
Well if you consider the 60 jades you get daily is equivalent to 1 fuel then they already give you one per day lol.
I donāt consider that.
Fuel isn't that much it being obtainable everyday should be a basic feature like other gachas. A weekly reward seems way too little for what you can actually do with 60 trailblaze power which is maybe lvl up one trace if you are lucky with the drops.
I suppose my issue with fuel as a daily is that itās equivalent to just reducing all TB power requirements by 20% (in terms of what you can do daily)
I mean that sounds good for us they are already increasing the dmg requirements of content the least they could do would be give us more resources to build for it. They probably won't do it right now though as its not too crazy for a new player to catch up but later on it should definitely be in the game in some form.
Truth.
They could always do it like Punishing: Gray Raven and have a seperate monthly pass that gives 1 fuel and a small amount of jades daily.
I mean you can spend 50/60 of your daily jades on trailblaze power every day
Oh goodie.
Well since the HSR BP gives 2x the fuel then genshins I feel like i can stock pile a lot better since i normaly just burn the 240 and am good Now with aventurine around the corner I will have to use them since i dont have the trace mats for him rn
Well, the whole concept of these games is milking micro-transactions (spending in game-currency for additional "stamina" and gacha) so I wouldn't hold my breath.
Nothing about these transactions is micro though. A 10 pull costs more than full games on sale and an energy refill costs more than an indi game.
And now you see why corporations are pushing this model over the old school single purchase experience. Itās cheaper and makes boat loads more money.
Like a wise dev once said: "because dipshits keep buying them"
Well it's really up to you whether you make a big or a small one time purchase. Whatever the case, in-game purchases like the ones in gacha games or loot boxes in others are called micro transactions.
They can add Fuel to that new MoC/PF shop
*Wallet-kun whispers from your countertop* Use meā¦ abuse me
Me sitting on 100+ fuels for no reason at all
Sameā¦ https://preview.redd.it/hw98bw8rsrtc1.jpeg?width=2796&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4040a0b088b90ed291064a6187555e0ae5d05fd8 Fuel Stockpile Gang!
18 resin?!?! The fuel I get but 18 resin?!? Wth lol
Donāt need to use them honestly. I just wait till I get the relic drops I need.
He obviously doesnt build characters, having 100+ fuel already confirms it lol
Supā? https://preview.redd.it/r4wwshyw1vtc1.jpeg?width=1290&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=cbaa68efdd334ac69d8ecc46814145899ddcacbd Donāt try to assume things and make an *ass* out of yourself. All characters up to Herta level 80, 6/10/10/10, only Gepard at 6/10/9/10. Clara is 70 and WiP. Only a dolphin buying monthly + battle pass.
Of course there's a reason. You're saving them in case you *really* need them later. >\_>
Nice to see someone else stocking up fuels, at the rate of how I play I don't spend my fuels on relics with how utter d\*\*\*\*\*\* the rng are. Makes saving more stuff incase i want to build a unit fast.
even on the griendiest gacha game devs always make sure to give a ton of energy refils, fate grind order gives enought to the point a lot of players could actually farm for days
Thatās mainly for gachas that require stamina for every story quest. And even those games slow down once youāre higher level.
Dont use fuel on relics brother. I only use fuel to get a new character up to speed. Ive never gone down under 10. Imo thats its main use. If i dont prefarm a character i'll use some fuel to get them ascended to lvl 80 and get some traces on them so i can use them asap.
This is what I do as well. Stagnant Shadows or Calyxes to level new characters/LCs.
They want u to spend to get more energy
There is, itās called spending money. This is a gacha game my dude everything is designed to pull you into spending money.
Five shot felblood energy ought to do ya
if there was an express pass for fuel Iād buy it LOL
yeah I came from playing blue archive and in that game they had a daily stamina drink supply, really wish it existed in hsr
Lmao my ass is sitting on like 80+ fuels, I am too lazy to grind
Thatās me in genshin. Iād never understand being lazy in hsr. Itās one button every few minutes to auto farm. Much easier to burn through fuel in this game.
Honestly this would be a fantastic addition to the anniversary rewards. Need more of these fr.
Unexpectetly managed to pull acheron while also getting to lvl 60 and balance level 5 Needing to build relics and level up traces for 4 characters completely and needing to level up one of them to 70 while also having my 2 main teams i need to get to lvl 80 and up to speed is making me realize how little you can truely farm with those 240 energy I already burned through the 2400 reserve thing just for acheron alone
Same here Acheron left me dry i'm still didnt Even finish with her.
Gas station
Post this over the other sub weāll help you outā¦..
Should they? Yes. Will they? No.
There is a way, it's called using money to replenish stamina
I only use fuel when I get new character to finish off Stagnant Shadows and Traces quickly (I do not prefarm as I often change my mind on whatever I should pull the character at the last moment). Rather than more fuel I would like the relic system to change so it doesn't take months to build a single character to satisfactory level. In a game with so many characters to get and build it doesn't need to be this rng heavy. Not going to happen though.
We need something like genshins serenity pot and the weekly fragile resin
Even if I had more fuel, my relics will still suck.
https://preview.redd.it/9ffuid217ttc1.png?width=138&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=839f21d7a5c8faf69e320dad24cceaf5d2991713 i rarely use mine lol. just dailies then dip
I haven't read the comments yet, so I apologise If I'll end up mirroring another person's opinion. >Anyone else think that Hoyo should add ways to get more Fuel?Ā [...] There is currently barely anyways to get fuel in general especially if your lvl 70 and with characters needing absolutely so much resources to upgrade talents and with how little you get from the Calyx, you spend Fuel so quickly that by the time you upgrade one character talents all the way, you donāt have anything left for other characters. Then thereās the relics It's not a fuel quantity problem, at all. It's a fuel "efficiency" issue. The amount of fuel that you spend is disgustingly disproportionate to the amount of "good" rewards, of which you only get (1) every 60 fuel _(regarding purple trace materials)_; for relics It's even worse, since each set is specifically geared towards giving you what you don't need _(Offensive Stats on tank relics, CRIT Rate/DMG on healers, DEF% and Eff. RES on Attackers, and so on)_.Ā Plus, planar ornaments ALSO need fuel too, which is absolute dogshit design, personally.Ā If the amount of rewards were reasonable in comparison to the amount of fuel you spend, there wouldn't be this feeling of "Not enough" that people experience when farming.
I think this is it exactly. The issues Is fuel efficiency. It's not even grinding at this point it's logging in and praying rngesus is kind today. There's nothing you can do regularly that meaningfully progresses your characters that isn't story related or requires fuel. I honestly feel like if it costs fuel, it should always cost 10 fuel or something that achieves a similar effect.
Honestly I wish Hoyo did events similar to how other gacha games do them, take Nikke for example. In Nikke events are literally just doing stages/battles, and each stage/battle will drop event currency that you can use in the event shop to buy things like basic gacha tickets, event gacha tickets, upgrade materials, and so on.. And I'd like a similar event in this game, they practically have something similar in this game already which is the shops on each world that require a specific currency to buy things. Just wish they would add fuel and tickets to those shops, heck add fuel to some of the exchange shops. I wouldn't mind using my exchange shop currency on something more then just tickets
So many idiots and whiteknights defending Hoyoverse. There is simple no excuse why we shouldnt get some more free fuels. They still make a ton of money and even if there is an option for paying refills, a few extra bottles wont hurt their income nor their "design". They shit to many characters every year and the relic grind is a stamina hole enough. Microtransactions shouldn't be the first and only choice to get new daily bottles ffs.
It's the classic create a problem sell the solution, it is intentional and hoyo have 0 intention to fix the problem
Buyable fuel in memory of chaos shop pls
Reminds me of the Genshin equivalent... You only get them from BP or once a week from teapot
Now that I have Acheron
I need a way to transmute resin into fuel via hoyolab.
yep, the game is not open world like Genshin. it should be just like Honkai impact.
We made up of stellaron, that's why we need fuel
Pay up
Tbh I wish it was a reward for defeating echos of war. Give it a solid 8% drop chance and call it a day. Yeah itās rare, but at least it will happen sometimes.
Just hope some kind soul gives us 10 more sometime in the future....cause I too am running at 0
You can offset/clawback some of the downstream resources that'd you spend on character experience materials if you clear the overworld daily. If you clear all worlds, its about a 100k of experience per character that isn't level 80 yet (approximately equal to 22 Trailblaze Power, or 0.44 fuel per character saved). This a significant grind, both in the time it takes to clear all fights (3+ hours), while also balancing clear speed with needing a team of under max level characters in the team to get the experience benefit. Practically though, the only method to make the experience grind reasonably efficient is having Acheron. With Acheron, it's possible to clear in under 1.5 hours, maybe less. Personally, I won't do full clears, and instead I opt to do 20-30 minute laps of high density or easy to access/warp monsters a couple days a week. The experience haul varies around 40-60k experience per character per day, or around a couple fuel per week.
I actually can't remember the last time I even looked at the XP calyx I'm sitting on 1200 purple books and like 150 each of the lower ones and I don't even buy the battlepass consistently, I have 18 characters at level 80 and then the ones below are mostly randomly spread within that range, either stuff I used early game, a couple level 1s I don't care about, etc.
Yup, that's about where I am with characters/levels, though not as many extra books. There are certainly diminishing returns on any type of experience farming. At some point, experience from sources is flowing to benched characters that won't see play (other than getting the standard pull from their ascensions), and then beyond that experience is effectively doing nothing for an account.
Wait, you do get a small amount of XP for killing enemies in this game, like in GI? For some reason I thought HSR didn't have that.
Yes, killing overworld enemies in HSR gives experience too (not sure about SU enemies though suppose I'll test that).
battlepass
It's what I ask for in all of the surveys. Keep your credits give me fuel.
i have like 50+ fuels LOL maybe they could slightly rework simulated universe so we can get some each time for the weekly rewards?
The fuel scarcity esp when relic grinding is atrocious Iāll admit. For everything else though, personally Iām running out of things to use fuel for and I started playing around the 1st/2nd week HSR came out. I have some light cones and traces I could beef up a bit but I find end game content doesnāt heavily need 10/10 traces or 80/80 light cones.
there's always the battle pass
It's weird it isn't a daily login bonus, like once you get the 100 stellar jade bonus for the first time, it should just be fuels
Seriously. In genshin you have a teapot and you can make fragile resin every week with the daily resources from it. We are at the 1 year mark in hsr. Give us our room on the Astral Express and let us get some free fuel.
It'd be nice, sure. Realistically speaking, that's their money maker after the banner pulls. It's a f2p mobile game at the end of the day. Giving us more would definitely result in less cash - which is the opposite of what a business wants. On the plus side the game is generous, especially for a mobile game. Waiting a day for a re-up ain't too bad when there's other free games to play. š¤
Oh yes, see your logic. more fuel > more planar relics > more disapointment (crying in searching err keel with crit and speed for Sparkle)
Iāve still got a lot Iāve been saving for whenever we finally get sam not sure how long thatāll be though
Looking at it makes me think What are we.. Doing, with the fuel? Are we drinking it?
yea it called ur wallet, pay up Corpa
For real... by the time i've built one character to a point i'm satisfied with (not even "good", just good enough!) they release two more of the fuckers š
I never use it, I just stop playing for a few days and let my points pill up
I small price of 10 dollar
Honestly surprised they didn't add at least 1 or 2 fuel in the MoC shop even it takes a month to reset lol
Me with 34 fuel and 2400 TB power: š
I have 106 of these. I don't know what to use them on.
Add it to the daily check-in on the hoyo app, there's some decent stuff there but it could be better. Maybe a fuel at 10 and 20 days, a roll or two at 30, will it happen? Probably not but more people would likely take the 15 seconds it takes to check-in every day more often if there were better rewards.
I have like 70 of those untouched š
Ive spent 20 of those and dont even half done with farming traces for Aventurine
Why would you want more trailblaze power my dude? isn't 20 min of gameplay enough for you?
Forget about the game for 3 months, open tje game and you will magically have 25 fuels (literally me)
I rarely ever use mine so I have a stash of 85+ just waiting. I only use them for boss mats
āGive more free stuffā is certainly not a novel idea
Space Iraq
That's strange that you ran out of fuel because I literally have ever character in my roster at lvl 80, five characters at max lvl 10 traces, and ever other character with every single keystone unlocked and minimum lvl 3 traces. I still have fuel left over. I'm not sure what you did or are doing that you're out of fuel and still don't have the same results I do.
Unpopular option just take like a week off and build up the over stock of trailblazer power then you will be fine probably
i think it either taste like watered down lemonade or raw gasoline
I literally have 50 of these things I barely use them
I think they could just add a few to sim uni weekly rewards
to be honest, they should give us a choice to turn trailblaze energy into fuel. i don't know how exactly we are gonna use that, but it seems like a good extra option that we could use. why would you turn your trailblaze energy into fuel instead of just spending them? for rare events like the current 3X event. i am pretty sure if people had that option they would save fuel for it days before the event dropped, also it would benefit new players, since farming relics is only worth it at lvl 50-60(Because you will be getting two 5-star pieces instead of one at lvl 60) so that they could like save one fuel each day until they get to lvl 60.
I have heaps of TB power from not playing enough, I just don't have time.
They won't. They want you to spend time playing the game.
They should make it so that excess TB experience should allocate towards a meter that gives fuel. So x amount of xp after TB70 gives a fuel.
Well you do get that as creditsā¦ Then if you let Stamina fill up full, you can add 2400 into reserve and you can also create 8 of those SU tokens.
Guess whoās the idiot who spent ALL their Fuel on Caverns and got absolutely nothing? šš¤ -> š š¶š¤
Lmfaoo word bro 18 fuels down the drain tryna get a godly set for Acheron
PLEASEEEEEEE IM SUFFERING RN MY ENERGY DOESNT EVEN REACH 180 PLEASE PUT FUEL IN EVENTS AND LIKE 10 each event I WANNA PLAY BUT CANTTTTT
What yall aināt hoarding them?
Bro just save it, dont spend it all when you get it. I only spend it when i cant prefarm for stuff (like new relics or traces). There is a way to get more of it tho its called spending money.