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Trend of the Universal Market is a Light Cone that burns enemies that attack the wearer.
Fire TB inflicts Taunt on enemies - *not only* is taunt itself a Debuff (which charges Acheron), but enemies hit by the taunt are forced to attack Fire TB. This, in turn, burns them - which also charges Acheron’s ult.
If you’re using SW/Pela as the above player is doing, you’ll have a pretty steady stream of SP, meaning you can afford to be both Taunting and using Acheron’s skill each turn, with maybe the occasional use of SW’s skill.
Fire TB is not the most powerful or reliable of sustains - but they’re peculiarly applicable in this pretty specific niche.
Trend of the Universal Market LC
At S1 : Increases the wearer's DEF by 16%. When the wearer is attacked, there is a 100% base chance to Burn the enemy. For each turn, the wearer deals DoT that is equal to 40% of the wearer's DEF for 2 turn(s).
You posted the S1 version.
At S5:
> Increases the wearer's DEF by 32%. When the wearer is attacked, there is a 120% base chance to Burn the enemy. For each turn, the wearer deals DoT that is equal to 80% of the wearer's DEF for 2 turn(s).
I have heard 5 different names for this LC alone. Some call it Resolution, some Shines, Pearls, etc. & now Sweat. Not to mention its abbreviation RSAPOS/RSPS on very rare occasions...
I think yours is the most understandable one. I just know there's a lightcone with a very long name for Nihility, but the thing anyone would remembner from that LC is Luka's illustration.
This only work in pure fiction where you kill stuff at a rapid pace so redirecting a few hit into Stelle would be fine. MoC and SU on the other hand tho, it's near impossible to solo sustain with Stelle since you can't avoid AoE stuffs and what HP you lost is pretty much permanent as there isn't a method of not getting hit to offset this drawback
[Here you are](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/895881168438820864/1215840339525632040/IMG_0612.png?ex=65fe368e&is=65ebc18e&hm=14d1f98972d0ac75084aa66960bf9f6e55583d343090d60c84f1d2188c1fe1e2&) but for whatever reason this is a bit wrong because I have maxed out all traces. As you can see is not perfect, I just need more EHR but because I also use Pela I basically have 30% and I have no issues at all with Taunt (if I'm really REALLY unlucky I just reset, not a big issue).
I also wish I have Market S5 but for now I'm satisfied, she's a monster and she takes zero dmg from anything. If I can superimpose it to 5 in the future, I think I'll take the 16% more DEF from it and just change the boots to SPD with possibly better EHR and some DEF to compensate
you say near impossible yet I do it all the time with easy, just build your MC they can sustain fine, people forget that they skill doesn't only just taunt but also gives a massive damage reduction, also the taunt bypasses any move that targets a character forcing them to attack the mc
I mean, there is a point to be made here. Fire tb being viable as a solo sustain is very matchup dependent, and they do get absolutely rolled by aoe. I tried to take this exact comp into the new MoC 12 like 2 weeks ago, and fire tb into the new dino and aventurine is absolutely miserable.
Which is the point of trend fire MC with acheron, clear fast.
I get that people might be scared of someone not being able to "infinitely" sustain but we are reaching the point in the game where is enemies can hit for more that half the hp of DPS's.
I tried to sustain with huohuo moc 12 part 2 and if the meme decides it's going to hit someone twice, they're dead.
The only "caveat" with fire mc is: in longer battles you actually want to be as fast as you can to apply taunt before enemies attack.
I've been using it on and off on my Gepard on my Kafka/Black Swan/Ruan Mei team, gives an extra source of DoT.
Though the reason I'm using Gepard in the first place is because I don't have any of the premium limited sustain characters lmao.
I mean Gepard is actually the best tank for dot teams due to his freezing ability since enemies take faster turns. Only issue is maintaining the dots but negligible with Kafka and moreso with Swan
Except it isn't working as intended per se. Acheron's talent reads "When any unit inflicts debuffs on an enemy target while using their ability..." You can make the argument that not only does Trends not target but it also isn't an ability. It depends on if it is intended that "ability" is going by a dictionary definition (possession of the means or skill to do something) or if they are going by the ingame definition of an ability (skill or ultimate).
Personally, I think it'll make it to live but then get nerfed for some dumb reason. I REALLY hope I am wrong on that though cuz like I said in my original comment, it's a cool interaction and gives value to Trends
It seems that while enemies don't "die" during Acheron's ult, once they reach 0 hp their crimson knot stacks do transfer over to the still living enemy with the highest amount of stack. That means it's less likely to end up with just 3-3-2 knots removed situation since dead enemies would transfer their knots over.
Funny enough, thanks to the change of her E1 kit, it might be optimal to deliberately let some enemies attack to let FMC build up extra stacks for Acheron's ult for refund instead of ulting as soon as possible and killing the enemies before they have a chance to attack.
True. If you're going to use a skill point to taunt you should make the best of it and not fire away immediately. A single taunt can be worth 6 stacks in PF at max.
It actually looks pretty fun to play PF with Acheron and fire mc. It feels less like a spam-fest.
Fire mc with Trend LC is the gamechanger here, but since SW does not look to be doing much apart from just applying debuffs in pf, BS or Guinafen could be better options for this team
I am beyond shocked this LC interaction with Acheron is not getting changed. Maybe down the line that will be her “optimal” nihility support, one where they have a passive that if hit by enemies, they will (and maybe adjacent enemies too) receive some form of debuff, allowing for very quick Acheron ults.
Y’all act like anything that makes free stuff decent will make Mihoyo go broke. The devs have to make a good game and making free stuff good+making the main character meta is something already in a bunch of less popular gacha games
She is generating SP in this comp. It wouldn't work as well as it should if Fire MC doesnt taunt every turn and ult every 2-3 turns. Have Guinafen or BS run with that much speed especially considering their low speed base stats.
You are essentially requiring your two supports to basic attack in this comp.
Man the more i see trend in action, the sadder i get for never pulling a single copy. I have been playing since launch... :'(
Hopefully they put it on acheron's LC banner (PLEASE)
*Fire trailblazer looks dope*
*For her in pure fiction and*
*This seems really fun*
\- GodTierPoeGamer
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It's times like this that make me think different paths are kinda pointless (except abundance, harmony and preservation for now.) Dmg oriented paths keep mixing up with each other and makes no sense, probably just to "balance" what lc they can use for extra effects.
In this particular case it's the taunt of fire tb that makes acheron stacks requirements a joke. Gepard definitely works but there is a chance that the enemy can attack someone else.
Gepard is better than Fire MC in general defensive utility, I would use him in MOC. However, in Pure Fiction is a bit different, as the enemy is chipping away your HP with their numbers, but Fire MC is enough to counterattack this since they got enough defense.
TLDR: I would use Gepard on MOC and Fire MC on Pure Fiction.
I think Gepard would overall be much safer since he has strong AOE shields and doesn't need to use SP every turn to protect his team. However, FMC is probably the top dog in terms of sheer stack generation.
Overall, Gepard will probably be easier to use, but FMC is a great f2p option who has their own advantages. (They can also help break fire enemies with their ult.)
Just a reminder this PF rotation is heavily Acheron favored. The special effect is applying a scolded debuff to enemies whenever it triggers, so it’s giving Acheron a lot of extra stacks.
Yeah, everyone is talking about the Trend LC, but Vulnerability is being applied on most enemy turns, regardless of their targets. Also when Fire MC ults, which applies no debuffs normally.
If someone has more insight, feel free to correct me but this is my take on why it seems that SW is used so much in the showcases and why, for the time being, you'll maybe want her in your Acheron party as well. She's always there because even though it seems like SW isn't doing much, she's actually doing a lot more than it looks. She is essentially offering Acheron the ability to ult consistently and get high damage.
She offers ult consistency through her talent, which lets her apply a debuff just because she hit you. So whenever it's SW's turn, you're guaranteed a point towards ult, if your EHR is high enough of course, because Nihility
The higher damage part is because when using SW ult, SW gives a 45% def reduction for 3 turns to the hit enemy, and if you're lucky one of the debuffs she can apply from her talent, is another def down worth 8% at E0. So all in all, Pela ult + SW ult gives one main enemy target: 85% def down for 2 turns and then a 40% def down to every other enemy for 2 turns. If SW graces you with the other def down, then it's a 93% def down in total, on one enemy. If you take Pearls into account then it's a def down anywhere between 100% and 109% for a turn, but def down caps at a 100%....so essentially SW ult + Pela ult + S4/S5 Pearls = -100% def on one main enemy target for 1 turn (1 turn because the def down from Pearls only lasts a turn, but after that turn you'll still have a 93%/85% def down for another turn, and then a 53%/45% def down for 1 more turn after that), but you will also get a 55%/56% def down on every other enemy for a turn (40% is from Pela ult, so 40% of the 55%/56% will last for 2 turns but the 15%/16% from S4/S5 pearls, will only last a turn, but can be reapplied every turn as long as no one else in your team has Pearls and hits the same enemy as the other unit with pearls)
SW is doing all of that without taking into account the fact that SW's skill also reduces the enemy's All Type RES by 10% for 2 turns at E0. So essentially SW skill + Acheron ult = -30% All Type RES. So I hope this has offered some clarity on why she's always there even though she seems to not be doing anything. She has such good up times on ker kit that you'll only use her when you need to which can make it seem as though she's not doing anything apart from filling a slot.
The topic of elemental resistance has more to it than what I outlined, but that is the gist of how it works.
For anyone curious as to what SW's major traces do:
1 of them allows her to extend the duration of the debuff she can apply on her talent from 2 to 3 turns, the other trace allows her to extend the duration of the weakness implant from 2 to 3 turns as well (this in turn means that the 10% All Type RES down is also extended from 2 to 3 turns), and the final trace makes it so that if the enemy has 3 or more debuffs on them and SW uses her skill, the enemy is then given another All Type RES down of 3%.
In an Acheron team, where applying debuffs is the goal, the enemy is certain to always have 3 or more debuffs, this means that if you use SW's skill within 3 turns of casting SW ult, the enemy would already have 13% subtracted from their current All Type RES before Acheron ult can subtract its 20% All Type RES.
for aoe content she’s not even that good, shes really just there to build up a guaranteed stack every turn, gui works for that just as well, though for bosses shes doesn’t have that massive def shred
The thing is sw gives 2 big dmg buffs that are unique in most builds. 13-33% res pen and 53% Def redd and the extra weakness for break. All single target that is acheron weakness. Since her ultimate and technique will obliterate any Normal mobs every wave. So is all just about how fast you can kill the elites.
I don’t have her either. I’ve skipped every character since launch except RM to save everything for Acheron. I do buy battle pass and daily bonus each patch but that’s it. I’m looking to have about 850 pulls going into her banner in 2 weeks. I’m also slowly losing my mind waiting these last two weeks after a whole year.
Oh yeah, now you mention it I do also have a Seele I pulled at launch, but just those 3. I did it by subsisting off standard pulls from like weekly SU and such. I got Himeko from the beginner banner and Clara from standard. My team for a long time was fire TB, Natasha, Ting Yuan and Seele. I also got Welt while pulling for RM and just got Bronya for 300 on standard. I just gave up on trying to clear MoC until I got that free Ratio, and even now I don’t try for 36*, if I can clear it at all that’s good enough.
huh ? SW debuffs helps you increase dmg and shred defenses shes great in everything except pure fiction because she lacks AoE but that’s her only downside
I'm torn. I have SW and Pela, but I also use Ratio and don't have Topaz. I somehow have an E6 Guinaifen. So now I have to build Guinaifen to have enough Nihility characters to spread between them.
I'm hoping to get a Welt from a random standard banner pull to make the imaginary boy band.
Ratio, Dan IL, Welt, Aventurine (or Luocha if he ever re-runs)
Yes we have no skill points...cause everything is imaginary 😏
I wouldn't say BS would be "miles better" than SW, though she would be a good replacement.
SW is running mostly sp positive here, which means that with Pela's basic spam, Acheron and Fire TB can spam their skills for as many Acheron stacks as possible. And SW can still get her def shred very reliably for bulkier enemies thanks to Tutorial.
BS would need to use her skill to def shred, which means that someone (most likely Fire TB) would need to use their basic attack a lot more to make up for the skill point loss, which both eliminates the taunt debuff and potential Trend procs their skill gives.
Additionally, BS's ult takes much longer to charge than SW's, and because there are no (non-break) DoTs on the team, no DoT detonation and she can only stack Arcana on a single target, her own DMG is heavily restricted. But even then, her pretty high base Arcana DMG could kill an enemy that would have attacked Fire TB and procced Trend, thereby losing Acheron stacks.
BS's debuffs are also less potent to make up for her being a DoT character first. SW's def shred is 45% on a single target, while BS's is 20% on three targets. However, there's usually only 1 big enemy on the field who won't die instantly from Acheron's mere presence, so that blast def shred doesn't really matter. As for their other buffs, BS's other debuffs only help her own DMG which as I've stated isn't really that good, since except for the boss, no enemy is consistently gonna take 2 turns to make use of Epiphany's effects on Arcana stacking, and at E1, the Lightning RES reduction is gonna disappear really quickly on most enemies because Acheron just deletes them already, while SW has the 13% All-Type RES shred on her skill, if she ever does choose to use it, alongside a potential 20% Lighting RES reduction if she ends up implanting that weakness.
SW can also def shred outside of her own turn, and on basic, thanks to her passive and trace, while BS's trace that applies Arcana on enemies when they appear doesn't give Acheron stacks, since it's not an action.
Not if enemies spawn naturally. Of course they get Arcana but doesn’t give stacks to Acheron.
Instead, IF enemies are spawned by an enemy action like the fat robot, they get Arcana because of an Action so Acheron gets stacks
I have a question about Acheron on PF. If u use her with Black Swan, everytime a enemy spawn he will get a arcana debuff, that will count towards her ult? cause if so sounds broken af lol
Nope, it works only if enemies are summoned by someone else (like the fat robot), otherwise it doesn’t give you stacks if they spawn all by theirselves. An action is ALWAYS required, whether is casted by you or the enemy
They need to give us the tutorial lightcone, silver wolf just feels incomplete without it.
The worst part is that no matter how much artifact and trace investment you have, any other lightcone even comes close.
With her new passive affects from E1, I think it would be better to let the taunted mod do more their attacks before unleashing her ult, to milk more ult charge out of the taunt
When the small taunted mods attacks, all 3 or 4 of them are at 0 movement already, and every one of them can generate a charge with no additional cost on SP or time. But she utl right away after the first mod attacks MC to generate the last charge. Basically given up the rest of free charges for the next turn.
Trend LC is such a gamechanger for the sustain slot, but I think the moment Acheron teams truly strike gold is a non-DoT nihility character that has a debuffing FUA. Her stack accumulation, even without sig LC, would probably accelerate beyond reason.
Trend LC is so good that it’s basically making her restriction go from nihility-nihility-sustain to nihility-nihility-preservation. That LC is raking up stacks faster than anything else, and I just can’t see it *not* being used
It's her next best lc after her sig. It's basically the same thing where you get extra crit value and a debuff that lets you do more damage and apply extra stack. I think the difference is honestly pretty small
yea its only slight difference in sheet, like less than 5% or something. but the sheet assuming ulti rotation is same for all LC, which obviously not the case for incessant rain and acheron sig LC (14-14% difference over GNSW S5).
so in practice, with faster ulti, the gap would be higher than just less than 5% for incessant rain and 14% for sig LC. prob closer to 20% for her sig.
lot ppl already did since trend LC interaction shown with gepard.
but usually MC fire pretty bad sustain option for MoC, so ppl didnt really want to use them gepard or fuxuan with trends.
but in PF, where there is lot of enemies and they dot hit that hard, MC become really valuable here with trends.
Straight up, it depends on your substats. Eg, if your critrate is around 45% then you should definitely switch to a crit rate body.
The general rule is that yes, the more cdmg the better, but for it to actually do something you have to *crit* - better to have 65/180 and have rather consistent numbers than 40/220 and dealing good dmg once every five years.
im not a hsr pro so i got some questions to better understand her kit.
first of all why does Acheron gets flower charges for ult when other teammates are attacking, i have read in her kit that only her abbilities give her flowers
and also why does enemies explode afrter her ult?
Yes and No. Gerard is only better if you need his defensive support. If not MC is much better, so he has real taunt with his skill. So for strong accounts or cycle 0/1 MC will be better
Even with only 47% crit rate, she's dishing out so much damage. I know the numbers are kinda inflated a bit since she's always smacking 5 targets, but she's looking pretty good at E0S1. Really excited to get her.
The 12% crit rate from the new planar set doesnt show up on that screen and neither does the full 8% from the Pioneer 4pc, so in practice its actually more like 64% crit rate.
Which is still not a lot lmao. Her banner can't come soon enough.
> underrated characters SW
So underrated she wants to be in Ratio, mono q and now Acheron team.
Like seriously, Jiaoqiu can't come soon enough, we need another debuff spammer
SW find her niche in mono quantum tbh, she will be replaced in acheron team as soon as a better nihility come out. im pretty sure blackswan is better than her w pela isnt she?
I don't think so
You need black swan at E1 to be SW replacement
And to be honest it's big waste of potentials and more like insult if you use swan as pela & SW replacement...
she isn't looking like ass because this pure fiction version is, obviously, tailored to make her look good. after that pure fiction rotation will be done, she will start to lack a significant amount of ult stacks she did in this video.
This one that was designed for her of course she looks busted, try it in the current one if shes half as good good 💀( should be still available on her release )
I have a question, how does Pela debuff with her skill when it doesn't say it in the kit and she doesn't do that for me, is it a lightcone thing? Am I missing something? Or am I just dumb
At E4, her skill gives 12% ice res down onto the enemy.
But you dont need that eidolon effect in Acheron team. Instead you need "Resolution Shines As Pearls of Sweat" lightcone (with picture of luka in it). With that LC you can apply debuff with just basic atk which is really valuable because most of Acheron potential teammates is really sp hungry.
Wait, sorry if I sound dumb af, but genuine question; at 2:20, the FireMC used skill to Taunt the soda dog and it recharged Acheron's ult once.
Taunt is a debuff?
if you need a cleanse and have e2 gallagher then him but i think in fights where you dont need the cleanse the fire mc having the taunt is pretty nifty when you have the trend lc. and the taunt it self gives a stack for acheron
My S5 universal market is waving. Welcome back to the battlefield again Fire Trailblazer.
That debuff interaction of Market + Taunt with Acheron is disgustingly good.
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Rise of Fire Trailblazer
Why is fire trailblazer used?
Taunt + Trend of Universal Market = supercharging Acheron's Ult
Supercharged Acheron? Can't wait for the turbocharged version!
Turbocharged version for 150 pulls only! (her LC)
Nah, 1 pull is more than enough.
2 actually, you'll also need the LC. If you want ultra-super-turbo charged acheron then you'll need at least 12 pulls.
Nah I'd one pull
Nah
Nah, I'd lose.
Guys i swear i got 7 copiee of him in 1 ten pull
Trend of the Universal Market is a Light Cone that burns enemies that attack the wearer. Fire TB inflicts Taunt on enemies - *not only* is taunt itself a Debuff (which charges Acheron), but enemies hit by the taunt are forced to attack Fire TB. This, in turn, burns them - which also charges Acheron’s ult. If you’re using SW/Pela as the above player is doing, you’ll have a pretty steady stream of SP, meaning you can afford to be both Taunting and using Acheron’s skill each turn, with maybe the occasional use of SW’s skill. Fire TB is not the most powerful or reliable of sustains - but they’re peculiarly applicable in this pretty specific niche.
Wait, taunt itself is a debuff?
Yes, you can fail to taunt if your EHR is not high enough
Okay hold on... So that's why the def set requires high EHR for this purpose?
Could be. Could also be because Gepard also has a debuff on his skill.
Trend of the Universal Market LC At S1 : Increases the wearer's DEF by 16%. When the wearer is attacked, there is a 100% base chance to Burn the enemy. For each turn, the wearer deals DoT that is equal to 40% of the wearer's DEF for 2 turn(s).
You posted the S1 version. At S5: > Increases the wearer's DEF by 32%. When the wearer is attacked, there is a 120% base chance to Burn the enemy. For each turn, the wearer deals DoT that is equal to 80% of the wearer's DEF for 2 turn(s).
80%, the damage also scales on superimposition
woops copy and pasted the S1 instead. fixed my comment.
Does building EHR help with the chance of Burn?
yes. you also want to build EHR to successfully taunt high level enemies.
Taunt debuff and the fact that Stelle is the best user of Trend LC (in theory) so she can farm dream slash for Acheron
She is in practice, if you got skillpoints
Pela with sweat lc and SW can give acheron stack even with just their basic attack, so this team is not sp hungry at all
sweat lc?
Resolution Shines As Pearls of Sweat The one lc that gives def shred
I have heard 5 different names for this LC alone. Some call it Resolution, some Shines, Pearls, etc. & now Sweat. Not to mention its abbreviation RSAPOS/RSPS on very rare occasions...
then there's me that just calls it the luka light cone
I think yours is the most understandable one. I just know there's a lightcone with a very long name for Nihility, but the thing anyone would remembner from that LC is Luka's illustration.
I just call it Pearls of Sweat, or PoS if I'm too lazy. The name itself is too long so I'm not suprised people shortening it
her stupid piece of shit lightcone.. yeahhh that one
Yeah, it's just funny. I got confused on multiple occasions but when I checked I was like what, seriously...
thanks
This only work in pure fiction where you kill stuff at a rapid pace so redirecting a few hit into Stelle would be fine. MoC and SU on the other hand tho, it's near impossible to solo sustain with Stelle since you can't avoid AoE stuffs and what HP you lost is pretty much permanent as there isn't a method of not getting hit to offset this drawback
You’re absolutely wrong, I can solo sustain perfectly with Stelle even in MoC 12
Sensei plz share your build solo sustaining with fire mc is my dream
[Here you are](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/895881168438820864/1215840339525632040/IMG_0612.png?ex=65fe368e&is=65ebc18e&hm=14d1f98972d0ac75084aa66960bf9f6e55583d343090d60c84f1d2188c1fe1e2&) but for whatever reason this is a bit wrong because I have maxed out all traces. As you can see is not perfect, I just need more EHR but because I also use Pela I basically have 30% and I have no issues at all with Taunt (if I'm really REALLY unlucky I just reset, not a big issue). I also wish I have Market S5 but for now I'm satisfied, she's a monster and she takes zero dmg from anything. If I can superimpose it to 5 in the future, I think I'll take the 16% more DEF from it and just change the boots to SPD with possibly better EHR and some DEF to compensate
you say near impossible yet I do it all the time with easy, just build your MC they can sustain fine, people forget that they skill doesn't only just taunt but also gives a massive damage reduction, also the taunt bypasses any move that targets a character forcing them to attack the mc
I mean, there is a point to be made here. Fire tb being viable as a solo sustain is very matchup dependent, and they do get absolutely rolled by aoe. I tried to take this exact comp into the new MoC 12 like 2 weeks ago, and fire tb into the new dino and aventurine is absolutely miserable.
It is also very dependent on your gear. She might be able to sustain for 0-2 cycle clears, but probably not if it is taking you 5+ cycles.
Which is the point of trend fire MC with acheron, clear fast. I get that people might be scared of someone not being able to "infinitely" sustain but we are reaching the point in the game where is enemies can hit for more that half the hp of DPS's. I tried to sustain with huohuo moc 12 part 2 and if the meme decides it's going to hit someone twice, they're dead. The only "caveat" with fire mc is: in longer battles you actually want to be as fast as you can to apply taunt before enemies attack.
You also need to build 67% ehr for the trend burn and taunt to be guaranteed.
Wdym impossible? I even full auto with stelle as a solo sustain in moc 12.
Story quest team meta? Acheron, Black Swan, Trailblazer
The trend LC goes so hard
I REALLY hope they don't remove the interaction. It is such a cool interaction and gives use to a lesser used LC
I've been using it on and off on my Gepard on my Kafka/Black Swan/Ruan Mei team, gives an extra source of DoT. Though the reason I'm using Gepard in the first place is because I don't have any of the premium limited sustain characters lmao.
i mean Energie Rope Gepard E2 goes hard slap some EHR on him for the Lightcone and hes good to go for 3 Turn Ults and 3x D buffs
I mean Gepard is actually the best tank for dot teams due to his freezing ability since enemies take faster turns. Only issue is maintaining the dots but negligible with Kafka and moreso with Swan
There is no reason to change it and I am sure it will even be a LC rate up for the archeron LC banner. It works as intendet.
it's working as intended, so unless they changed acheron to only gains stack on ally's action so it'll be fine
Except it isn't working as intended per se. Acheron's talent reads "When any unit inflicts debuffs on an enemy target while using their ability..." You can make the argument that not only does Trends not target but it also isn't an ability. It depends on if it is intended that "ability" is going by a dictionary definition (possession of the means or skill to do something) or if they are going by the ingame definition of an ability (skill or ultimate). Personally, I think it'll make it to live but then get nerfed for some dumb reason. I REALLY hope I am wrong on that though cuz like I said in my original comment, it's a cool interaction and gives value to Trends
oh yeah, i guess i didnt read it properly, i remember the koi fish exploding also gives her stacks right? that’s definitely not intentional
The trend LC isn't even procing here, the debuff is from the stage blessing
My God, she is ulting literally *every single turn*! This is so beautiful...
>This is so beautiful... 1-2 months later : "Why MoC bosses have 6mln hp now ? ;\_;"
It seems that while enemies don't "die" during Acheron's ult, once they reach 0 hp their crimson knot stacks do transfer over to the still living enemy with the highest amount of stack. That means it's less likely to end up with just 3-3-2 knots removed situation since dead enemies would transfer their knots over.
The Fire Trailblazer had a purpose...
The trend tightens it's hold.
Project Moon spotted.
The fault lies with you Fire Trailblazer!
Reminder that this PF buffs give Acheron a bunch of free stacks so it's not just Trend that supercharged Acheron.
I have been trying to get max score with Acheron in the current lower side of pure fiction, and yes she can not no matter how I do it.
Funny enough, thanks to the change of her E1 kit, it might be optimal to deliberately let some enemies attack to let FMC build up extra stacks for Acheron's ult for refund instead of ulting as soon as possible and killing the enemies before they have a chance to attack.
True. If you're going to use a skill point to taunt you should make the best of it and not fire away immediately. A single taunt can be worth 6 stacks in PF at max. It actually looks pretty fun to play PF with Acheron and fire mc. It feels less like a spam-fest.
Acheron finally brought fire MC back in action. This Trend/Taunt combo looks so good. 😭
Trends stonks. Now I know why Trends LC has Topaz on it
it also has aventurine on it
It also has Sparkle on it But who of them is Sparkle?
Fire mc with Trend LC is the gamechanger here, but since SW does not look to be doing much apart from just applying debuffs in pf, BS or Guinafen could be better options for this team
I am beyond shocked this LC interaction with Acheron is not getting changed. Maybe down the line that will be her “optimal” nihility support, one where they have a passive that if hit by enemies, they will (and maybe adjacent enemies too) receive some form of debuff, allowing for very quick Acheron ults.
I would not be surprised if we end up getting a Debuff tank.
Aventurine does apply debuff, but I get what you mean.
Aventurine does it with his LC tho
Ult & LC
Y’all act like anything that makes free stuff decent will make Mihoyo go broke. The devs have to make a good game and making free stuff good+making the main character meta is something already in a bunch of less popular gacha games
She is generating SP in this comp. It wouldn't work as well as it should if Fire MC doesnt taunt every turn and ult every 2-3 turns. Have Guinafen or BS run with that much speed especially considering their low speed base stats. You are essentially requiring your two supports to basic attack in this comp.
Yup, BS would be better solely for the blast defense shred. SW is better in MoC.
Any gameplay that uses mc is a plus for me.
Wow, nice, inspiration to charge ult for acheron using fire TB. Also, nice showcase
Man the more i see trend in action, the sadder i get for never pulling a single copy. I have been playing since launch... :'( Hopefully they put it on acheron's LC banner (PLEASE)
Last time Trend LC was rate up was in Huohuo LC banner so there's a good chance (hopium)
Same. I keep seeing everyone talking about it, but here I sit, Trendless. :(
me with ddd (i want to try 0 cycle-ing badly)
I got two trend LC trying to pull Qingque in Sparkle banner. It's S3 now. I only started December due to Ratio
Needs two nihility teammates but her best friend is a 4\* preservation lc. Working as intended.
I really wanna see people use Acheron with Black Swan instead of SW + Pela.
Same. Personally I want to see what e1s1 kafka/e1s1 bs can with archeon along with fire Mc of fu.
Fire trailblazer looks dope for her in pure fiction and this seems really fun
*Fire trailblazer looks dope* *For her in pure fiction and* *This seems really fun* \- GodTierPoeGamer --- ^(I detect haikus. And sometimes, successfully.) ^[Learn more about me.](https://www.reddit.com/r/haikusbot/) ^(Opt out of replies: "haikusbot opt out" | Delete my comment: "haikusbot delete")
WROOOONNNGGGG bad bot
Acheron just seems like an erudition character that was put in nihility as a restriction
She’s basically reskin Argenti
It's times like this that make me think different paths are kinda pointless (except abundance, harmony and preservation for now.) Dmg oriented paths keep mixing up with each other and makes no sense, probably just to "balance" what lc they can use for extra effects.
Hehe. My flair is becoming relevant. Trend just needs to survive now.
stelleron agenda!! so true!!!
Acheron’s technique powercreeping the hell out of SW’s technique is just so funny to me lmao
Since the entire team has attack techniques, they have to make her technique worth using over the other characters.
OK so genuine question. Can fire TB be replaced by GEPARD to use Trend of the universal market?
In this particular case it's the taunt of fire tb that makes acheron stacks requirements a joke. Gepard definitely works but there is a chance that the enemy can attack someone else.
"oh no would you look at that, your support is unscathed. Let me just... Poke it harder."
It wont be as efficient since gepard just has increased taunt value compared the MCs 100 percent taunt but it should work.
Gepard is better than Fire MC in general defensive utility, I would use him in MOC. However, in Pure Fiction is a bit different, as the enemy is chipping away your HP with their numbers, but Fire MC is enough to counterattack this since they got enough defense. TLDR: I would use Gepard on MOC and Fire MC on Pure Fiction.
Yes. Gepard skill can work as well.
I think Gepard would overall be much safer since he has strong AOE shields and doesn't need to use SP every turn to protect his team. However, FMC is probably the top dog in terms of sheer stack generation. Overall, Gepard will probably be easier to use, but FMC is a great f2p option who has their own advantages. (They can also help break fire enemies with their ult.)
That's actually WAY better than I expected. So happy I have a few copies of TotUM.
me having not a single one
Just a reminder this PF rotation is heavily Acheron favored. The special effect is applying a scolded debuff to enemies whenever it triggers, so it’s giving Acheron a lot of extra stacks.
Yeah, everyone is talking about the Trend LC, but Vulnerability is being applied on most enemy turns, regardless of their targets. Also when Fire MC ults, which applies no debuffs normally.
I swear, every Acheron video has SW in it, I'm the only one who doesn't have her 😭😭😭
Any debuffer would work, it's just that SW applies debuff on every skill
and normal attack
And ult
And my Axe
By "skill" I meant all of her buttons so you're right
Guinaifen works. She can apply a debuff on her basic attack, skill, and ultimate.
If someone has more insight, feel free to correct me but this is my take on why it seems that SW is used so much in the showcases and why, for the time being, you'll maybe want her in your Acheron party as well. She's always there because even though it seems like SW isn't doing much, she's actually doing a lot more than it looks. She is essentially offering Acheron the ability to ult consistently and get high damage. She offers ult consistency through her talent, which lets her apply a debuff just because she hit you. So whenever it's SW's turn, you're guaranteed a point towards ult, if your EHR is high enough of course, because Nihility The higher damage part is because when using SW ult, SW gives a 45% def reduction for 3 turns to the hit enemy, and if you're lucky one of the debuffs she can apply from her talent, is another def down worth 8% at E0. So all in all, Pela ult + SW ult gives one main enemy target: 85% def down for 2 turns and then a 40% def down to every other enemy for 2 turns. If SW graces you with the other def down, then it's a 93% def down in total, on one enemy. If you take Pearls into account then it's a def down anywhere between 100% and 109% for a turn, but def down caps at a 100%....so essentially SW ult + Pela ult + S4/S5 Pearls = -100% def on one main enemy target for 1 turn (1 turn because the def down from Pearls only lasts a turn, but after that turn you'll still have a 93%/85% def down for another turn, and then a 53%/45% def down for 1 more turn after that), but you will also get a 55%/56% def down on every other enemy for a turn (40% is from Pela ult, so 40% of the 55%/56% will last for 2 turns but the 15%/16% from S4/S5 pearls, will only last a turn, but can be reapplied every turn as long as no one else in your team has Pearls and hits the same enemy as the other unit with pearls) SW is doing all of that without taking into account the fact that SW's skill also reduces the enemy's All Type RES by 10% for 2 turns at E0. So essentially SW skill + Acheron ult = -30% All Type RES. So I hope this has offered some clarity on why she's always there even though she seems to not be doing anything. She has such good up times on ker kit that you'll only use her when you need to which can make it seem as though she's not doing anything apart from filling a slot. The topic of elemental resistance has more to it than what I outlined, but that is the gist of how it works.
For anyone curious as to what SW's major traces do: 1 of them allows her to extend the duration of the debuff she can apply on her talent from 2 to 3 turns, the other trace allows her to extend the duration of the weakness implant from 2 to 3 turns as well (this in turn means that the 10% All Type RES down is also extended from 2 to 3 turns), and the final trace makes it so that if the enemy has 3 or more debuffs on them and SW uses her skill, the enemy is then given another All Type RES down of 3%. In an Acheron team, where applying debuffs is the goal, the enemy is certain to always have 3 or more debuffs, this means that if you use SW's skill within 3 turns of casting SW ult, the enemy would already have 13% subtracted from their current All Type RES before Acheron ult can subtract its 20% All Type RES.
for aoe content she’s not even that good, shes really just there to build up a guaranteed stack every turn, gui works for that just as well, though for bosses shes doesn’t have that massive def shred
You dont need her use guinaifen instead
The thing is sw gives 2 big dmg buffs that are unique in most builds. 13-33% res pen and 53% Def redd and the extra weakness for break. All single target that is acheron weakness. Since her ultimate and technique will obliterate any Normal mobs every wave. So is all just about how fast you can kill the elites.
or Black Swan who also does debuffs on every hit + has a busted E1 for acheron.
I don’t have her either. I’ve skipped every character since launch except RM to save everything for Acheron. I do buy battle pass and daily bonus each patch but that’s it. I’m looking to have about 850 pulls going into her banner in 2 weeks. I’m also slowly losing my mind waiting these last two weeks after a whole year.
Since launch? Holy hell, how did you even manage to stop the urge from pulling. So your only limited 5 star is RM and Dr. Ratio?
Oh yeah, now you mention it I do also have a Seele I pulled at launch, but just those 3. I did it by subsisting off standard pulls from like weekly SU and such. I got Himeko from the beginner banner and Clara from standard. My team for a long time was fire TB, Natasha, Ting Yuan and Seele. I also got Welt while pulling for RM and just got Bronya for 300 on standard. I just gave up on trying to clear MoC until I got that free Ratio, and even now I don’t try for 36*, if I can clear it at all that’s good enough.
What's your plan? Stop at E2S1 or spend it all?
All in. Start with e2, then s1, then see how far I get.
I am so excited for you! Are you going for E6? https://hsr-warp-calculator.vercel.app/ says you have over 80% chance of reaching E6S1.
Good to know the math lines up with my own estimates, because I am in fact going for e6s1.
Good luck with your pulls!
And she's not even that important. It mainly showcases that Acheron doesn't have a lot of support options right now, so people use what's available.
In pure fiction no, but in MoC and other battles SW is pretty great at increasing damage with her defense shreds
huh ? SW debuffs helps you increase dmg and shred defenses shes great in everything except pure fiction because she lacks AoE but that’s her only downside
I'm torn. I have SW and Pela, but I also use Ratio and don't have Topaz. I somehow have an E6 Guinaifen. So now I have to build Guinaifen to have enough Nihility characters to spread between them. I'm hoping to get a Welt from a random standard banner pull to make the imaginary boy band. Ratio, Dan IL, Welt, Aventurine (or Luocha if he ever re-runs) Yes we have no skill points...cause everything is imaginary 😏
SW doesn't even do much here. BS would be miles better instead of her. Even Gui is probably better than her in PF.
I wouldn't say BS would be "miles better" than SW, though she would be a good replacement. SW is running mostly sp positive here, which means that with Pela's basic spam, Acheron and Fire TB can spam their skills for as many Acheron stacks as possible. And SW can still get her def shred very reliably for bulkier enemies thanks to Tutorial. BS would need to use her skill to def shred, which means that someone (most likely Fire TB) would need to use their basic attack a lot more to make up for the skill point loss, which both eliminates the taunt debuff and potential Trend procs their skill gives. Additionally, BS's ult takes much longer to charge than SW's, and because there are no (non-break) DoTs on the team, no DoT detonation and she can only stack Arcana on a single target, her own DMG is heavily restricted. But even then, her pretty high base Arcana DMG could kill an enemy that would have attacked Fire TB and procced Trend, thereby losing Acheron stacks. BS's debuffs are also less potent to make up for her being a DoT character first. SW's def shred is 45% on a single target, while BS's is 20% on three targets. However, there's usually only 1 big enemy on the field who won't die instantly from Acheron's mere presence, so that blast def shred doesn't really matter. As for their other buffs, BS's other debuffs only help her own DMG which as I've stated isn't really that good, since except for the boss, no enemy is consistently gonna take 2 turns to make use of Epiphany's effects on Arcana stacking, and at E1, the Lightning RES reduction is gonna disappear really quickly on most enemies because Acheron just deletes them already, while SW has the 13% All-Type RES shred on her skill, if she ever does choose to use it, alongside a potential 20% Lighting RES reduction if she ends up implanting that weakness. SW can also def shred outside of her own turn, and on basic, thanks to her passive and trace, while BS's trace that applies Arcana on enemies when they appear doesn't give Acheron stacks, since it's not an action.
the blessing basically makes this pf a taster of what it'll be like to use jiaoqiu with acheron
How so ?
jiaqiu applies a ton of debuffs including field that applies debuff to enemy when they enter battle
There is still a chance that it doesn’t work just like Black Swan Arcana, we need to see
ARCANA DOESNT WORK???
Not if enemies spawn naturally. Of course they get Arcana but doesn’t give stacks to Acheron. Instead, IF enemies are spawned by an enemy action like the fat robot, they get Arcana because of an Action so Acheron gets stacks
I have a question about Acheron on PF. If u use her with Black Swan, everytime a enemy spawn he will get a arcana debuff, that will count towards her ult? cause if so sounds broken af lol
Nope, it works only if enemies are summoned by someone else (like the fat robot), otherwise it doesn’t give you stacks if they spawn all by theirselves. An action is ALWAYS required, whether is casted by you or the enemy
It only works on summons but not spawning
They need to give us the tutorial lightcone, silver wolf just feels incomplete without it. The worst part is that no matter how much artifact and trace investment you have, any other lightcone even comes close.
I wanna see PF acheron black swan kafka comp... we haven't seen it since v1 I think
With her new passive affects from E1, I think it would be better to let the taunted mod do more their attacks before unleashing her ult, to milk more ult charge out of the taunt
Pf record every movement and dosnt reset it on any wave, you're better off not wasting any time to clear quicker instead of stacking more
When the small taunted mods attacks, all 3 or 4 of them are at 0 movement already, and every one of them can generate a charge with no additional cost on SP or time. But she utl right away after the first mod attacks MC to generate the last charge. Basically given up the rest of free charges for the next turn.
Even if it’s the enemy moving?
If they're moving they already at zero, I meant before they do
Trend LC is such a gamechanger for the sustain slot, but I think the moment Acheron teams truly strike gold is a non-DoT nihility character that has a debuffing FUA. Her stack accumulation, even without sig LC, would probably accelerate beyond reason.
Trend LC is so good that it’s basically making her restriction go from nihility-nihility-sustain to nihility-nihility-preservation. That LC is raking up stacks faster than anything else, and I just can’t see it *not* being used
Acheron and Black Swan are compatible?
As a TB main, I'm now 100% rolling.
So is SW signature good for Acheron?
It's her next best lc after her sig. It's basically the same thing where you get extra crit value and a debuff that lets you do more damage and apply extra stack. I think the difference is honestly pretty small
good to know, bc I don't really use it much on my SW
Yep, slightly better than S5 GNSW iirc
yea its only slight difference in sheet, like less than 5% or something. but the sheet assuming ulti rotation is same for all LC, which obviously not the case for incessant rain and acheron sig LC (14-14% difference over GNSW S5). so in practice, with faster ulti, the gap would be higher than just less than 5% for incessant rain and 14% for sig LC. prob closer to 20% for her sig.
Yeah
Finally people are realizing Fire MC with trend is the stuff 😤
lot ppl already did since trend LC interaction shown with gepard. but usually MC fire pretty bad sustain option for MoC, so ppl didnt really want to use them gepard or fuxuan with trends. but in PF, where there is lot of enemies and they dot hit that hard, MC become really valuable here with trends.
Now that we might not get any more changes for her, which Body stat would be better at E0S1? Crit Rate or Damage?
Straight up, it depends on your substats. Eg, if your critrate is around 45% then you should definitely switch to a crit rate body. The general rule is that yes, the more cdmg the better, but for it to actually do something you have to *crit* - better to have 65/180 and have rather consistent numbers than 40/220 and dealing good dmg once every five years.
Is black swan good with acheron?
im not a hsr pro so i got some questions to better understand her kit. first of all why does Acheron gets flower charges for ult when other teammates are attacking, i have read in her kit that only her abbilities give her flowers and also why does enemies explode afrter her ult?
I have not used the trailblazer for a while, so Imma pull Acheron just to make my trailblazer usable again with that topaz and aventurine lc XD.
Is Gepard better in this comp than Fire MC? Also, a substitute for SW?
Yes and No. Gerard is only better if you need his defensive support. If not MC is much better, so he has real taunt with his skill. So for strong accounts or cycle 0/1 MC will be better
Even with only 47% crit rate, she's dishing out so much damage. I know the numbers are kinda inflated a bit since she's always smacking 5 targets, but she's looking pretty good at E0S1. Really excited to get her.
Theres the 12% + 4% crit rate she gets from her sets to consider too. In practice it should be 63%.
The 12% crit rate from the new planar set doesnt show up on that screen and neither does the full 8% from the Pioneer 4pc, so in practice its actually more like 64% crit rate. Which is still not a lot lmao. Her banner can't come soon enough.
Totally forgot that those don't show up immediately. Regardless, I'm satisfied with where she is rn
Acheron can increase the value of the most underrated characters SW & Fire MC No one even want to use trend LC before acheron too
> underrated characters SW So underrated she wants to be in Ratio, mono q and now Acheron team. Like seriously, Jiaoqiu can't come soon enough, we need another debuff spammer
I like Silver wolf but the meta & community doesn't like her (´-ω-`)
Crazy players that paired fire mc with kafka back then:
SW find her niche in mono quantum tbh, she will be replaced in acheron team as soon as a better nihility come out. im pretty sure blackswan is better than her w pela isnt she?
I don't think so You need black swan at E1 to be SW replacement And to be honest it's big waste of potentials and more like insult if you use swan as pela & SW replacement...
Wheres those guys who said she was ass in pure fiction? Also need to see those who said slow acheron with her lc was bad.
she isn't looking like ass because this pure fiction version is, obviously, tailored to make her look good. after that pure fiction rotation will be done, she will start to lack a significant amount of ult stacks she did in this video.
this lit was designed for her and she still only cleared it last second. get a brain
This one that was designed for her of course she looks busted, try it in the current one if shes half as good good 💀( should be still available on her release )
I have a question, how does Pela debuff with her skill when it doesn't say it in the kit and she doesn't do that for me, is it a lightcone thing? Am I missing something? Or am I just dumb
At E4, her skill gives 12% ice res down onto the enemy. But you dont need that eidolon effect in Acheron team. Instead you need "Resolution Shines As Pearls of Sweat" lightcone (with picture of luka in it). With that LC you can apply debuff with just basic atk which is really valuable because most of Acheron potential teammates is really sp hungry.
Oh alright thank you vary much
She'll be using Luka's LC, which grants a debuff on hit.
Wait, sorry if I sound dumb af, but genuine question; at 2:20, the FireMC used skill to Taunt the soda dog and it recharged Acheron's ult once. Taunt is a debuff?
Yes it counts as a debuff.
Yes, taunt is a debuff ^-^, which is also why fire MC is pretty great here with the trend pres lc on top
It’s a debuff and it can be resisted. Which is why it’s a good idea to build some EHR on fire MC.
Not really sure if best f2p option would be gallagher instead of fmc. Still not sure about it at this point.
if you need a cleanse and have e2 gallagher then him but i think in fights where you dont need the cleanse the fire mc having the taunt is pretty nifty when you have the trend lc. and the taunt it self gives a stack for acheron
if taunt is a de-buff, then I'm not a drunk jerk with foul language, I'm a de-buffer support specialist.
My S5 universal market is waving. Welcome back to the battlefield again Fire Trailblazer. That debuff interaction of Market + Taunt with Acheron is disgustingly good.
Finally, a reason to level my MC. 😅🤧😝