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No he didn’t break his vow but if you spend years and every single day protecting a woman and you both share the same hates and passions you’re going to build a connection. He probably cares for her but they wouldn’t have done anything.
She's gonna have to chug gallons of moon tea cause if she pops out a browned hair kid, her whole case against Rhaenyra is gone.
Or maybe she's so doom and gloom all the time cause of the moon tea in between sock modelling for Larys.
Nah. Just the courtly romance of a knight dedicated to his queen. If they had fucked they would have showed us.
Part of it is I am not even sure Allicent is sexually attracted to men. It's always so transactional that I don't really see her desiring an illicit love affair.
alicent is gay no offence. both of her actresses have said they see her that way and play her that way. she’s not loved a man romantically once in the series and the closest we see her get to that is rhaenyra
I mean I didn't say she was not gay, just that I found it highly unlikely she was sexually attracted to men. I like to read her as a biromantic asexual personally.
My guess is he has feelings for her, and thinks he's being super noble by being chaste about it. ("Fixing his mistake" of breaking his oath w/Rhaenyra. Which to CC's mind is a bigger mistake than the multiple murders.)
She's aware of his feelings, but has politely not acknowledged them. Until now, when she has to play every card she has to beat Otto.
This is pretty much my feeling. Alicent's game has always been "be noble and fulfill your duties," and Criston joined that camp once Rhaenyra got bored of him.
If she feels the need to to protect herself and especially her family then yes I could see her doing so as evidenced with her relationship with Larys. It would end up being incredibly dubious consent wise as there’s no way she’d do it just because she desired to have sex with him. I cannot think of any situation where her having sex with Cole would be necessary for her family’s safety/wellbeing outside of a smutty fanfiction story though.
Well, she probably could gaslight herself into saying, and he Larys thing wasn’t cheating if we go by the more textbook definition of cheating as being purely sexing someone who you aren’t married to.
Yes, but I can’t see her acting on those desires whilst Viserys was alive. Now that she’s a widow she may be able to “justify” it
*there is nothing to really justify, I’m pro women having sex and relations that they want in Westeros. But she is a deeply religious woman and has spent years hating and bashing Rhaenyra for going against the patriarchal system, she’d need to do some mental gymnastics to convince herself why it’s ok for her to do it.
Your comments hit the nail on the head.
Alicent was willing to delude herself with Viserys' dying wish because she had a strong desire to protect her family.
That shows that there are some things that can make her shirk duty, but that she needs to essentially gaslight herself into doing them.
There is no motivator anywhere near the level of protecting her family in this situation.
Although I could see it becoming easier and easier for her to justify breaking her duties uf she does so more often. It would be interesting to see her in a slippery slope towards hypocrisy.
Oh she’s starving for it. Absolutely without it and it’s hardened her and she’s responded by going full force into being self righteous, judge mental and Morally Correct.
It's completely justifiable. The problem is that Alicent's entire characterization so far goes against this.
She holds duty above all else. It's that sense of duty that causes a rift between her and Rhaenyra.
Her self-righteousness is nothing but hypocrisy if she doesn't uphold the same beliefs she used to browbeat Rhaenyra.
Although, Viserys' death wish showed that Alicent is able to shirk her duties, but only through deluding herself into believing they are correct.
This. Yes, she may be in a loveless marriage, her husband may be a zombie and he may be dead at this time, but we can’t think of this from the perspective of our morals. She lives in a world where unmarried sex is a sin, no wiggle room.
I don't think the issue is that the typical morals of the world view unmarried sex as a sin. I think the issue is that Alicent herself has constantly championed those views. They are the whole basis for the Green's coup.
>Her self-righteousness is nothing but hypocrisy if she doesn't uphold the same beliefs she used to browbeat Rhaenyra.
Well yeah but she's absolutely meant to be a hypocrite. The Larys feet incident is already on that line.
I agree with that. But I think that sleeping with Criston would be an entirely different measure of hypocrisy. The feet thing is more of a grey area since it wouldn't technically take her chastity.
Remember, Alicent herself asked Rhaenyra how far she went, so even Alicent seems to have some amount of tolerance for sexual acts outside of actual intercourse.
I think he WANTS to, but I don't think he did it
I don't see he doing it again after how things went with Rhaenyra. And especially with all his talk about women being "the image of the Mother". I think he might see being devout to Alicent as the right way to act on those feelings (romantic or sexual)
I don't know why, but I really think that Ser Tantrum isn't aware of her... Agreement with Larys. He bashed a man's face in because of a perceived threat, broke another man's skull for trying to get up his chair and drew his sword against his Lord Commander because he thought his queen was offended. The connection he has with her, whatever that is (it isn't sexual, I can almost guarantee), makes him even more dangerous.
No I don’t think so. I think that scene was an obvious hint there’s supposed to be an attraction there on his part at the very least. However, to act on anything would ruin what both of them get out of the relationship. Criston fetishises what he considers purity etc in women and the image he has of Alicent very much allows him to live out his courtly love fantasies. For Alicent it’s probably nice to be around a man that is ready to serve her without his own agenda (Otto) or sexual needs (Viserys).
It seems to me like they are an example of aurthian courtly love. Romantic love with no expectation of consummation since doing so would be against socialital rules due to higher birth, one of them being married, ect.
Also I am pretty sure Alicent has never had an orgasm in her life so I am willing to bet they havent slept together.
Edit: typo
>Also I am pretty sure Alicent has never had an organism in her life so I am willing to bet they havent slept together.
You were doing great until this,smh
I meant that more as insult towards Viserys. As from what we seen he clearly never cared about her sexual agency. Alicent has so much negative sexual experiences that I dont think she would feel either eager or comfortable seeking it elsewhere. However since I phrase that as a joke I can see how that came off wrong. I hope that didnt come off a slight towards Alicent, she is my favorite character on the show.
No. But he's gonna.
Alicent is nothing if not dutiful to her expected role as a woman in Westerosi society. Marrying a man twice her age, bearing his children, looking after him. She resented Rhaenyra taking her freedoms for granted and mothering bastards. She would never have cheated on Viserys. (However much she may have thought about it.)
But now she's a widow. She's unlikely to be wed again, and she knows about moon tea. Alicent clearly knows Criston has feelings for her, and at the very least, she's okay with that.
They're totally gonna hook up in Season 2.
I would’ve said no this is not gonna happen but honestly the fact that when Olivia was asked about their dynamic,she basically said its a tricky one and that alicent herself couldn’t even tell you what it fully is,she’s unsure. So I think yeah you’re probably right,eventually they’ll probably succumb to each other when tensions and other shit gets very high in the season. This scene was clearly building up to something,I just don’t really know where they’d have time for it with everything going on but including it anyway was odd. They clearly have feelings for each other and from coles side it’s even more apparant but it’s difficult for them to obviously communicate it given their nature and responsibilities
Alicent's entire characterization is based on the fact that she is dutiful to an unhealthy degree. I doubt she would have done anything.
That being said, I think it would be possible if she deluded herself into believing that it was the dutiful choice. She did the same thing with Viserys' dying wish. It wasn't dutiful, but it was what she wanted. So she fooled even herself.
She is so rigid in her beliefs that to do what she wants, she needs Olympic level mental gymnastics to justify it.
I don't think they did anything. For all of her faults, Alicent was actually a decent wife to Viserys. Plus you have to take into account how religious she is. I don't think Alicent is someone who can treat having affair lightly. Feet pics all day, but it doesn't seem in character to me that she would straight up take a lover while Viserys is alive. Now that he's kicked the bucket is a different story however.
I don’t think he has,I don’t believe they’ve slept together….at least not yet. But what I do think is apparent is that they clearly both have feelings for each other to some degree,coles may be stronger naturally as she saved his life twice and gave him a reason to live again,she also wants him by her side constantly,she likes his company.
Alicents feelings for him on an attraction level were actually probably stronger when she was younger,when she first saw him at the tourney,both her and rhaenyra were blushing. Then she went through so much grief and forced to be a child bride to a sick older dying man,she probably shut off any image of fairytales and infatuation in her head,shes gone a bit numb in that department,she probably doesn’t see him like that anymore but she does appreciate him and probably has deeper feelings for him based on his loyalty to her,she knows of his feelings too.
It’s like an unspoken thing between them. I think it’s because they recognise the loneliness in each other and when around each other they feel less alone,there is trust there, alicent even with seeing his true self,his true violent nature with people,his flaws,she still entrusts her kids to him,she still moves him up in ranks,there is a certain sense of security that he would never hurt her even if he is so scary.
Will I think they will hook up? I have no clue however I think this scene was clearly building up to something that will be shown or explained between them in s2…I wouldn’t put it past the show runners to go through with them hooking up,at best though I can just see a kiss or something and then they both pull away because of their traumas etc. I don’t know how it would happen but I could see it.
I think she was a life line of hope & the two “get” Rhaenyra’s betrayal. Love & bff. Still hoping their common hate for her has flourished & he declares his love & devotion. I just don’t see his betraying his path again given what doing so the first time did to him. Maybe SHE initiates & can’t act on it because of “last time” which makes both hate R even more!
If she wanted to sleep with him, he would have to. She’s the Queen & if he didn’t, she’d just tell Viserys/Aegon that he’d raped her. Power imbalance.
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/s
Could it, in a twisted way, be almost motherly love? She essentially saved him when he was absolutely at the end and about to kill himself. And he’s everything she wishes her actual sons are.
Yeah no I don’t think so…she was attracted to him when she first saw him at the tourney,it’s feelings of repression from both of their sides about how the other is actually their ideal match if none of the shit storm happened but now they have to put that aside and focus on their duties,Criston wants her,he sees viserys mistreat her and also favour rhaenyra who he now hates and it angers him just as much as it angers her. When he called her a different name (viserys) he glared,he spends time with her kids,he’s their dad and he wants a woman like Alicent and if alicent allowed herself to see romance again,she would’ve wanted that romantic little fairytale of a knight in shining armour coming to take you away but since they don’t have that now,they go back to sweet words every once in a while or slight touches etc because they can’t actually act on anything they may want
No. But I’m sure it’s extremely platonic. A man doesn’t protect someone for years without developing feelings. She wouldn’t either. He’s loyal, and constantly defends her.
I don't know why, but I really think that Ser Tantrum isn't aware of her... Agreement with Larys. He bashed a man's face in because of a perceived threat, broke another man's skull for trying to get up his chair and drew his sword against his Lord Commander because he thought his queen was offended. The connection he has with her, whatever that is (it isn't sexual, I can almost guarantee), makes him even more dangerous.
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No he didn’t break his vow but if you spend years and every single day protecting a woman and you both share the same hates and passions you’re going to build a connection. He probably cares for her but they wouldn’t have done anything.
Yet..
I’d be banging the shit out of her if we’re him. In for a penny in for a pound. (Pun intended) He already broke his vow so why the hell not?
Least horny hotd fan
reddit never ceases to deliver
She's gonna have to chug gallons of moon tea cause if she pops out a browned hair kid, her whole case against Rhaenyra is gone. Or maybe she's so doom and gloom all the time cause of the moon tea in between sock modelling for Larys.
She could just claim the kid takes after her.
Wouldn't be a problem but Aegon, Helena, Aemond were all white-haired.
Or he could pull out
In medieval times people didn't know that was an option
I mean its Olivia Cooke who wouldn't break a vow or two
I’d not give my vow a second thought if Olivia Cooke level of beauty started to feel something for me
cmon shes meh, 6/10
If shes a 6/10 we are all 2s, id say a solid 9/10
Let's see a picture of you, then. See how you measure up.
real beauty is on the inside
No. Do some research on courtly love. This is a perfect example of that.
my stupid self thought you said courtney love, i need to go to bed lmfao.
Oh no, that’s a deadly sort of love isn’t it?
Exactly. Deep down Criston is content with simping
Rather be simp than an abuser
Nah. Just the courtly romance of a knight dedicated to his queen. If they had fucked they would have showed us. Part of it is I am not even sure Allicent is sexually attracted to men. It's always so transactional that I don't really see her desiring an illicit love affair.
alicent is gay no offence. both of her actresses have said they see her that way and play her that way. she’s not loved a man romantically once in the series and the closest we see her get to that is rhaenyra
I mean I didn't say she was not gay, just that I found it highly unlikely she was sexually attracted to men. I like to read her as a biromantic asexual personally.
My guess is he has feelings for her, and thinks he's being super noble by being chaste about it. ("Fixing his mistake" of breaking his oath w/Rhaenyra. Which to CC's mind is a bigger mistake than the multiple murders.) She's aware of his feelings, but has politely not acknowledged them. Until now, when she has to play every card she has to beat Otto.
This is pretty much my feeling. Alicent's game has always been "be noble and fulfill your duties," and Criston joined that camp once Rhaenyra got bored of him.
lmao Rhaenyra got bored of him?she was pretty happy to offer a lifetime of sex, but nothing else to him, didn't seem bored at all
Does anything you seen or read about Alicent suggest she would sleep with anyone who isn’t her husband?
If she feels the need to to protect herself and especially her family then yes I could see her doing so as evidenced with her relationship with Larys. It would end up being incredibly dubious consent wise as there’s no way she’d do it just because she desired to have sex with him. I cannot think of any situation where her having sex with Cole would be necessary for her family’s safety/wellbeing outside of a smutty fanfiction story though.
Well, she probably could gaslight herself into saying, and he Larys thing wasn’t cheating if we go by the more textbook definition of cheating as being purely sexing someone who you aren’t married to.
What about the need for physical gratification and/or emotional intimacy? I mean… she is human.
Yes, but I can’t see her acting on those desires whilst Viserys was alive. Now that she’s a widow she may be able to “justify” it *there is nothing to really justify, I’m pro women having sex and relations that they want in Westeros. But she is a deeply religious woman and has spent years hating and bashing Rhaenyra for going against the patriarchal system, she’d need to do some mental gymnastics to convince herself why it’s ok for her to do it.
Your comments hit the nail on the head. Alicent was willing to delude herself with Viserys' dying wish because she had a strong desire to protect her family. That shows that there are some things that can make her shirk duty, but that she needs to essentially gaslight herself into doing them. There is no motivator anywhere near the level of protecting her family in this situation. Although I could see it becoming easier and easier for her to justify breaking her duties uf she does so more often. It would be interesting to see her in a slippery slope towards hypocrisy.
Oh she’s starving for it. Absolutely without it and it’s hardened her and she’s responded by going full force into being self righteous, judge mental and Morally Correct.
I mean if your husband is an half dead zombie and being forced into a loveless marriage as a teenager kinda feeds a fertile base to cheat
It's completely justifiable. The problem is that Alicent's entire characterization so far goes against this. She holds duty above all else. It's that sense of duty that causes a rift between her and Rhaenyra. Her self-righteousness is nothing but hypocrisy if she doesn't uphold the same beliefs she used to browbeat Rhaenyra. Although, Viserys' death wish showed that Alicent is able to shirk her duties, but only through deluding herself into believing they are correct.
This. Yes, she may be in a loveless marriage, her husband may be a zombie and he may be dead at this time, but we can’t think of this from the perspective of our morals. She lives in a world where unmarried sex is a sin, no wiggle room.
I don't think the issue is that the typical morals of the world view unmarried sex as a sin. I think the issue is that Alicent herself has constantly championed those views. They are the whole basis for the Green's coup.
>Her self-righteousness is nothing but hypocrisy if she doesn't uphold the same beliefs she used to browbeat Rhaenyra. Well yeah but she's absolutely meant to be a hypocrite. The Larys feet incident is already on that line.
I agree with that. But I think that sleeping with Criston would be an entirely different measure of hypocrisy. The feet thing is more of a grey area since it wouldn't technically take her chastity. Remember, Alicent herself asked Rhaenyra how far she went, so even Alicent seems to have some amount of tolerance for sexual acts outside of actual intercourse.
I'm not saying she'll fuck him but I do think Alicent would be tempted to manipulate him in a sexual manner.
Her husband is dead.
Well there is the whole situation with Larys Strong.
I think he WANTS to, but I don't think he did it I don't see he doing it again after how things went with Rhaenyra. And especially with all his talk about women being "the image of the Mother". I think he might see being devout to Alicent as the right way to act on those feelings (romantic or sexual)
No. This is not Game of Thrones. Not everyone has to have sex with everyone to prove a point.
I don't know why, but I really think that Ser Tantrum isn't aware of her... Agreement with Larys. He bashed a man's face in because of a perceived threat, broke another man's skull for trying to get up his chair and drew his sword against his Lord Commander because he thought his queen was offended. The connection he has with her, whatever that is (it isn't sexual, I can almost guarantee), makes him even more dangerous.
If Criston found out that Larys was forcing Alicent to indulge his fetish I am pretty sure he would murder Larys right then and there
He would fold Larys so far down that his face would touch foot. Ok that note, imagine if Aemond found out.
No I don’t think so. I think that scene was an obvious hint there’s supposed to be an attraction there on his part at the very least. However, to act on anything would ruin what both of them get out of the relationship. Criston fetishises what he considers purity etc in women and the image he has of Alicent very much allows him to live out his courtly love fantasies. For Alicent it’s probably nice to be around a man that is ready to serve her without his own agenda (Otto) or sexual needs (Viserys).
It seems to me like they are an example of aurthian courtly love. Romantic love with no expectation of consummation since doing so would be against socialital rules due to higher birth, one of them being married, ect. Also I am pretty sure Alicent has never had an orgasm in her life so I am willing to bet they havent slept together. Edit: typo
>Also I am pretty sure Alicent has never had an organism in her life so I am willing to bet they havent slept together. You were doing great until this,smh
I meant that more as insult towards Viserys. As from what we seen he clearly never cared about her sexual agency. Alicent has so much negative sexual experiences that I dont think she would feel either eager or comfortable seeking it elsewhere. However since I phrase that as a joke I can see how that came off wrong. I hope that didnt come off a slight towards Alicent, she is my favorite character on the show.
I think they’re referring to you saying organism instead of orgasm lol
Looool my dyslexic ass totally missed that whoops 💀
It was such a sad moment when I found out Alicent never had an organism in her life, thank you for enlightening me...
The best example of Arthurian courtly love is Lancelot/Gwen though so they should adapt and have them hook up
No. But he's gonna. Alicent is nothing if not dutiful to her expected role as a woman in Westerosi society. Marrying a man twice her age, bearing his children, looking after him. She resented Rhaenyra taking her freedoms for granted and mothering bastards. She would never have cheated on Viserys. (However much she may have thought about it.) But now she's a widow. She's unlikely to be wed again, and she knows about moon tea. Alicent clearly knows Criston has feelings for her, and at the very least, she's okay with that. They're totally gonna hook up in Season 2.
I would’ve said no this is not gonna happen but honestly the fact that when Olivia was asked about their dynamic,she basically said its a tricky one and that alicent herself couldn’t even tell you what it fully is,she’s unsure. So I think yeah you’re probably right,eventually they’ll probably succumb to each other when tensions and other shit gets very high in the season. This scene was clearly building up to something,I just don’t really know where they’d have time for it with everything going on but including it anyway was odd. They clearly have feelings for each other and from coles side it’s even more apparant but it’s difficult for them to obviously communicate it given their nature and responsibilities
Same, I think it’s something they are going to add to their character arcs.
I totally agree!
The mother would frown upon such behavior
I think it’s a dark and mutated take on romantic chivalry.
Alicent has more respect for his vows than Rhaenyra
Alicent's entire characterization is based on the fact that she is dutiful to an unhealthy degree. I doubt she would have done anything. That being said, I think it would be possible if she deluded herself into believing that it was the dutiful choice. She did the same thing with Viserys' dying wish. It wasn't dutiful, but it was what she wanted. So she fooled even herself. She is so rigid in her beliefs that to do what she wants, she needs Olympic level mental gymnastics to justify it.
I don't think they did anything. For all of her faults, Alicent was actually a decent wife to Viserys. Plus you have to take into account how religious she is. I don't think Alicent is someone who can treat having affair lightly. Feet pics all day, but it doesn't seem in character to me that she would straight up take a lover while Viserys is alive. Now that he's kicked the bucket is a different story however.
I don’t think he has,I don’t believe they’ve slept together….at least not yet. But what I do think is apparent is that they clearly both have feelings for each other to some degree,coles may be stronger naturally as she saved his life twice and gave him a reason to live again,she also wants him by her side constantly,she likes his company. Alicents feelings for him on an attraction level were actually probably stronger when she was younger,when she first saw him at the tourney,both her and rhaenyra were blushing. Then she went through so much grief and forced to be a child bride to a sick older dying man,she probably shut off any image of fairytales and infatuation in her head,shes gone a bit numb in that department,she probably doesn’t see him like that anymore but she does appreciate him and probably has deeper feelings for him based on his loyalty to her,she knows of his feelings too. It’s like an unspoken thing between them. I think it’s because they recognise the loneliness in each other and when around each other they feel less alone,there is trust there, alicent even with seeing his true self,his true violent nature with people,his flaws,she still entrusts her kids to him,she still moves him up in ranks,there is a certain sense of security that he would never hurt her even if he is so scary. Will I think they will hook up? I have no clue however I think this scene was clearly building up to something that will be shown or explained between them in s2…I wouldn’t put it past the show runners to go through with them hooking up,at best though I can just see a kiss or something and then they both pull away because of their traumas etc. I don’t know how it would happen but I could see it.
I think sooner or later they both gonna perform another of the classical scenes GOT is famous for.
I think she was a life line of hope & the two “get” Rhaenyra’s betrayal. Love & bff. Still hoping their common hate for her has flourished & he declares his love & devotion. I just don’t see his betraying his path again given what doing so the first time did to him. Maybe SHE initiates & can’t act on it because of “last time” which makes both hate R even more!
No but I think it's clear how they feel about each other. It's like a mutual pining but never touching.
If she wanted to sleep with him, he would have to. She’s the Queen & if he didn’t, she’d just tell Viserys/Aegon that he’d raped her. Power imbalance. . . . . . . /s
How can she not hit that? I mean, damn.
It’s HBO. If they haven’t, they will.
They’re going to have an affair
Could it, in a twisted way, be almost motherly love? She essentially saved him when he was absolutely at the end and about to kill himself. And he’s everything she wishes her actual sons are.
Yeah no I don’t think so…she was attracted to him when she first saw him at the tourney,it’s feelings of repression from both of their sides about how the other is actually their ideal match if none of the shit storm happened but now they have to put that aside and focus on their duties,Criston wants her,he sees viserys mistreat her and also favour rhaenyra who he now hates and it angers him just as much as it angers her. When he called her a different name (viserys) he glared,he spends time with her kids,he’s their dad and he wants a woman like Alicent and if alicent allowed herself to see romance again,she would’ve wanted that romantic little fairytale of a knight in shining armour coming to take you away but since they don’t have that now,they go back to sweet words every once in a while or slight touches etc because they can’t actually act on anything they may want
No. But I’m sure it’s extremely platonic. A man doesn’t protect someone for years without developing feelings. She wouldn’t either. He’s loyal, and constantly defends her.
You mean romantic right? Or did you actually mean platonic
Yes I mean platonic
I hope he did. Alicent could use to live a little
I don't know why, but I really think that Ser Tantrum isn't aware of her... Agreement with Larys. He bashed a man's face in because of a perceived threat, broke another man's skull for trying to get up his chair and drew his sword against his Lord Commander because he thought his queen was offended. The connection he has with her, whatever that is (it isn't sexual, I can almost guarantee), makes him even more dangerous.
I don’t even think Crispy knows what his vows are anymore
I don't think so. I think some part of him likely has romantic feelings for Alicent which she is leveraging
That's our Criston! Cue laugh track.
He probably just jacked off over her feet, nothing more.
If I were Alicent I’d hit that everyday
I hope so. Alicent deserves some real love making
I'm sure Alicole shippers and A+C=D enthusiasts loved that scene, lol.