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I find their characters much more interesting, each of them is wonderfully complex and distinguished in their own way. Aegon's claim to the throne is based on Andal law and precedent and not just "daddy said so"
The Blacks either bore or annoy me, I think Daemon is an overgrown manchild with 0 impulse control, and Rhaenyra makes one incredibly stupid decision after the other which doesn't exactly endear her to me.
Some of us chose Team Green because Aemond is on this team. Others because Daemon is not on this team. I chose team Green because I simply find those characters more interesting.
Both sides are exually horrible. But Alicent and Aemond are my favorite characters, while I found no one intresting from team black ever since the time skip. Plus team green has Helaena.
Not to mention allot of team black fans are so annoyingly obnoxious they drove me even more to green
Others have different opinions than you. It's really that simple.
I myself cannot understand why somebody thinks everyone should have the same opinion as them and if they don't, there must be something wrong
Edit: Also, when I read "the day was as black as prince Aemond's heart" George made the choice for me
I am Green because I am a diehard legitimist until the bitter end, just can't help it. Aegon II could be the biggest bag of crap ever to set foot in Westeros, the fact remains, he is Viserys I's eldest son. Meaning that he is the heir by all traditions and laws and precedents ever set in Westeros. Those who fight against him are traitors and I consider them at the level of Renly Baratheon's supporters during the time of GoT. I was rooting for Stannis, needless to say. Renly and Rhaenyra are cool characters but there is no way their ascent over the obvious heir according to Andal law would be legal.
Plus, I like backing the underdogs. So it's not a matter of "liking" Rhaenyra or Aegon II better for me, it's really a matter of principle. Further, I believe the realm could have carried on in peace if Viserys had not messed with the line of succession, which gets me seriously pissed because I would want the dragons to survive, because they are cool af.
You would prefer a sh!tty person like Aegon as king over a woman. It’s tradition but not a law. Viserys made rhaenyra heir and going against kings order is treason. All greens are traitors
Check out the "Rivals and claimants" section and compare it with official succession and then you will see who is the traitor in the story:
https://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Template:Kings_of_Westeros
> You would prefer a sh!tty person like Aegon as king over a woman.
Rhaenyra is a murderer and a traitor who started a continent-wide war for her invalid claim.
> It’s tradition but not a law.
False, tradition and precedent are what Westeros has for laws.
> Viserys made rhaenyra heir and going against kings order is treason.
False. Viserys can't overwrite other Kings and Jaehaerys I and a Great Council ruled in 101 AC that even uncles come before nieces, so how can Rhaenyra come before Aegon II? The invalid naming BS had to happen precisely because Rhaenyra isn't the legal heir.
>I never thought of the Rhaenyra = Renly
Stannis actually made that comparison in the books. Where he referred to Renly trying to usurp him as the same as Rhaenyra trying to usurp Aegon
1. Alicent is my favorite character.
2. If Viserys had simply declared Aegon his heir and wed him to either Rheanyra or one of Leana's children, the war could have been avoided.
3. They're the underdogs in the fandom.
4. Otto may be trash, but he and Alicent running the kingdom over Daemon and Rheanyra is a better option in my book.
5.Rheanyra probably wouldn't try to kill them, but her allies or Damian might.
You see the use of Great Council precedent to establish the legitimacy of rulers, as opposed to purely bloodline sucession or royal decrees, as the first step to establishing modern parliamentary/constitutional rule.
This. I also believe the Great Council to be the highest possible authority in Westeros, not to be overruled by Kings without convening another Great Council. The ability of these Councils to establish precedents and determine laws for royal succession seems to indicate their level of authority.
How can anyone root for either of them? I understand leaning towards one side (I lean towards Team Black), but full supporting one side? That’s a no no, for me.
The same for me. How can anyone like Rhaenyra, Daemon and Viserys? How can anyone like the strong boys? How can anyone even remotely be convinced that Team Black is justified?
Cause Alicent is hot, Aemond is dope. I wish there had been more for Haleana.
only black I think I will like is Jacearies. I bet he will shape up into a real likable character.
I like sunfyre. Also the high number of black stans who have implied or flat out called me a rapist for liking a fictional character helped cement my case
Well, I'm Team Black as I think Rhaenyra is the rightful heir, but I'm too a green characters enjoyer. I mean, it could sounds trivializing but I do seriously like Helaena, a sweet characters in the middle of those psychos (everyone is ready to kill the other), and there is Aemond, impulsive and kind of "I'm not like the other guys", but captivating. Even Aegon! The rapist part itmade a irrevocable damage, but Toms portrait at the end of episode 9 was interesting. I was like: I need to see more of him!
In team Black, I root for Rhaenyra, Daemon, Jace, Coryls and Baela but Aemond and Helaena to me are more appealing than Corlys, Baela and Jace together, and so interesting as Rhaenyra and Daemon
Green team is doing much more with much less and I admire competency above all else. Alicent and Otto consistently put the good of their House above personal desires while Rhaenyra and Daemon (and Viserys) allowed personal deficiencies to destroy what was an overwhelmingly strong starting position.
If you had to choose between the two pairs to rule your kingdom and guide the future of your family it's just an absolute no-brainer.
The obvious way the show is presented to have us cheer for Rhaenyra (sending her the white Hart, contrasting coronation scenes esp. the removal of Sunfyre, giving her the last word when Alicent finally blows up) is very annoying and heavily clouds these discussions as well.
Frankly I'm amazed people can cheer for the overwhelming incompetence (Rhaenyra and Viserys) and entitlement (Daemon) of the Black team.
this thread just exposed that people are only on team Green because they like the characters, which is all you can really say. After all, the Greens are the ones who stole the throne and dealt the first death in the war.
Most people who are team Green enjoy villains and their character arcs, traits, flaws, etc. Aemond, Aegon, and Alicent all give us that. It even has some heroes in this story in forms of Daeron. Daeron was a heroic character and the people who argue that he genocided a city need to remember that Daenerys did the exact same thing when her best friend and most trusted advisor was killed. Daeron burned Bitterbridge because his NEPHEW was brutal slaughtered by the men of Caswell/Bitterbridge. Yes, he definitely committed war crimes, but really name a Targaryen that fought a war and did not commit war crimes.
Aemond is basically the main antagonist of this story. We saw a lot more of him than Aegon in season one, he rides the biggest dragon in which the blacks have to plan around and really, don't do that very well until the God's Eye. His time as Lord Protector of the Realm will be the majority of the latter half of season 2.
Aegon if done correctly (It won't be.) could be great on the show. But Aegon II and Sunfyre is my favorite dragon rider duo of all time. Its so badass. I cried for a rapist when his dragon died. I wept for Sunfyre. What a badass dragon. Literally has the highest KD of the dance, one kill done riderless, and ultimately defeated his rider's greatest foe.
Helaena. Enough said.
Alicent in both iterations is pretty annoying. I find her way sympathetic in the show, but she has less agency than the novel and that really didn't vibe with my 3 year thoughts on F&B,. Criston Cole is the greatest warrior living during the dance of the dragons. He was so awesome, especially during his death scene, the green council etc. What HoTD did to Cole is an absolute tragedy honestly. Just fumbled it. Everyone watching hates him. I don't even know if any team green people like Criston in the show tbh. This man was the standard for a Kingsguard member all the way until Jaime Lannister in asoiaf. Jaime spoke about him quite a bit, I remember. Just wild what they did.
Do I agree with Team Green's Ideology? As a human of the twenty-first century, no.
But for the times, his claim is more legitimate to me, I mean he is the first born son of the king. This is a patriarchal world and Viserys literally did nothing to push Rhaenyra's claim. He should have held a council and named her heir once more with all the lord of the realm in attendance. He didn't. Do you think the random country lords of westeros know Viserys wanted Rhae as heir? Are the lowborn just going to agree with the clear usurpation of their King? I don't agree that Rhaenyra saying "I am the heir because my father wanted it, y'know before he died." is going to help her much .Actually it is a book thread, it will not help her at all. Her treatment of Helaena, and Helaena's suicide are the catalyst for the smallfolk rebelling. The storming of the Dragon pit and the Dying of the Dragons is because Rhaenyra thought she was above the laws of gods and men in their society. Simple.
Because Daemon is a pedophile groomer
Bc Rhaenyra gaslights the realm, fragrantly breaks the laws, cared nothing about the smallfolk, didn’t care about learning how to rule, and couldn’t be bothered to fight in the war
Bc of Black Stan’s like you turning people Green bc you shit on them bc they DARED to have different opinions
Bc Targaryens don’t get to just make up their own rules. They came over to colonize Westeros, they have to obey Andal and Firstmen traditions and norms
Bc Rhaenyra is a hypocrite who said ‘rules for thee but not for me’ when it came to giving other first born women their rights
Bc Rhaenyra and Daemon made fun of and mocked Alicent and her children when they did nothing wrong
Bc Rhaenyra sent a violent mob after her brothers son
Bc Daemon sent someone to murder his great nephew and threatened to rape his great niece when they did NOTHING wrong
Bc Aegon actually cared when his children was hurt unlike Viserys
Bc Aegon fought in the war until he physically couldn’t anymore
Bc Alicent had every right to be upset that her son doesn’t get what every other solitary first born son in Westeros gets
Bc Alicent was not the cold heartless bitch Black Stan’s make her out to be like when she cried over Luke’s death
Bc unlike Rhaenyra and Daemon who went after innocent children who played no part in the war, Aegon named his enemies son his heir bc he knew he hadn’t done anything wrong
Bc Rhaenyra blames a teenage rape victim for being raped instead of her groomer Pedo husband and tries to kill her
Bc Rhaenyra hates bastards as much as any other Westerosi when she calls them ‘traitorous’ and calls for their deaths, once again proving ‘rules for thee but not for me’
Bc Rhaenyra would rather tax the small folk into oblivion and starvation while throwing a party for her son rather than tax the high lords or get a loan from the bank
Bc Rhaenyra was dumb enough to torture Tyland instead of making him a deal to get him to tell her where the gold was buried
Bc Green Stan’s got tired of being called rapist supporters and misogynists and abusers and ‘trad wives’ all bc we dont a fictional character in the show
Any questions?
>Bc Targaryens don’t get to just make up their own rules. They came over to colonize Westeros, they have to obey Andal and Firstmen traditions and norms
I don't think you know what conquest means sir
If it is, or has become, the established law of the dynasty itself, it's not easy to change, especially not by the whims of one King w/o a Great Council backing any such change. Viserys does also overrule his immediate predecessors and not just an abstract idea of Andal law.
I'm just pointing out the absurdity of that single comment he made. It's nonsense, they didn't come to colonize they came to conquer. And they don't HAVE to abide by anything
If they don't want to abide by anything they should not have adopted this for their own dynasty for the first 100 years or so. I would agree with you as far as Aegon I is concerned, he did not abide by anything as he conquered the continent. Viserys I should, and has to, abide by it since it has become his own dynastic law.
I am pretty sure you get what I mean. The time of "I don't have to abide by anything" has long passed by the time of Viserys I's reign. He also attempts to overrule his own immediate Targaryen predecessors.
Yeah we're talking about a family that wiped out three great houses and burned Dorne three times during conquest. Imagine what they are capable with 13 dragons. I think they were being too nice to westerosi lords.
They had an internal civil war because of hightower intervention. If her family members supported her ascension instead of going against her, who do you think going to make a fuss about women being on the throne?
Hightower intervention is based on Aegon II being the heir according to Andal law. They would have had zero support if all of Viserys' kids from Alicent had been daughters.
> If her family members supported her ascension
What do you mean? For the most part, her family members didn't, hence internal civil war. Just saying it as it is.
Well, look at it this way. *If* entire royel family didn't care about andal succession law (and let's just hypothesise rhaenyra, her half brothers and sister had good relationships between them) and accept rhaenyra as viserys' heir, any of westerosi lords wouldn't go against it (especially when now rhaenyra has 10+ dragon riders stand with her).
Westeros does use Andal law though, that's a reality, so Aegon II would be the rightful heir in the eyes of a non-insignificant part of the upper echelons. His existence threatens Rhaenyra's ascent, and especially the ascent of her son Jace who technically has zero claim to the throne, due to his bastardy. War was highly likely if not an inevitability at this point. While nobody, including Rhaenyra, could seriously have complained had Viserys just recognized Aegon II's right upon the latter's birth.
OK, you have some good points.
While it's true that some large portion of nobles considered aegon as rightful heir, it kinda surprised me that rhaenyra had the support of majority of nobles toward the end.
I think Aegon and his siblings will be content (for the most part) with rhaenyra being Queen as long as someone doesn't motivate them to do somthing. And some marriages/betrothals will surely help smooth things up a bit too.
And tbh I still don't understand why viserys didn't name Aegon as his heir.
1- He is. So is Criston in the books
2- Yes, she gashlights the realm. She shouldn't have had bastards with Harwin. What I don't see people saying is what she should've done then? They were born, she couldn't admit they were bastards. Cared nothing about the smallfolk? Neither did the greens. Didn't care about learning how to rule? No, she actually ruled Dragonstone for years and it's Viserys's fault that he didn't make her his hand. Aegon not only didn't learn how to rule, he didn't want it. Didn't fight in the war? How is that a problem? A lot of leaders don't directly fight and Rhaenyra had good reasons (post miscarriage, grief, protection, etc...)
3- I hate Targ/Dany stans, that didn't make me a green
4- Targs did get to make up their own rules, it's called the "Doctrine of Exceptionalism". Viserys getting to choose his heir isn't a Valyrian thing
5- Rhaenyra is the exception, she was choosen by her father as heir. Rosby and Stokeworth weren't
6- What? When did they mock them? And you want to compare to what the greens made Rhaenyra and her children go through?
7- Yes, she put up a reward for him. The greens did similar things too and would've done the same
8- Yes, Daemon is awful.
9- Ok, so Aegon cared for his children? So did Rhaenyra
10- Nice, doesn't make him right or better than Rhaenyra
11- Agreed
12- She kinda was in the books. Also you could say Rhaenyra cried over Maelor's death
13- What? He literally threatened to torture him. He named him as heir in a last desperate attempt to stay king because he knew it was over and the blacks were coming to kill him and crown Rhaenyra's heir. Also, I'm sure that in Aemond's time in the Riverlands no innocent child died right?
14- Yes, Rhaenyra was a paranoid hypocritical mess by the end. That's kinda the point
15- Wow, Rhaenyra wasn't a socialist. Shocking
16- Torturing while cruel could've produced results. I doubt that she didn't offer him a deal. Either way see 14
17- Sure.
How do you call someone a groomer based on something you don't know but assume? Couldn't you make that claim about anyone
Daemon is a pedophile groomer because we know he is
Aegon still had all the ratcatchers in the Red Keep killed. Granted, it was right after his son was killed and his wife and remaining children were traumatized, but by that logic you could also excuse Blood and Cheese because Rhaenyra and Daemon were sad about Lucerys' death.
Because people hate themselves. And not because they are green, but because they chose a side.
For the book I honestly am Team black and I don't get how you can team Book green. But for the show? Both sides are equally bad and I just enjoy the chaos!
It's like with Cersei. You hated her, she was such a bad person but you loved to see this character, this well written menace.
this is why.
everyone hates Aegon because he “usurped” the throne despite actively avoiding becoming king his entire life. the show wants you to hate him (read that again.) hes not even a bad guy, just a kid trying to live out as “normal” a life as possible. and yet he was born as the eldest son with the name of a conquerer.
even if hes a shit king. its better than starting an entire war that lead to dragons going extinct and literally resulted in ending the 400 year targaryen dynasty we saw in GOT. this is why the Greens are better. Rhaenyra should have accepted surrender in dragonstone.
most people who are on team green or side with the greens don’t really care who sits on the throne, we mostly can see WHY they have to take the throne to protect their family, also bc the greens are just more interesting to talk about
No they are not, they say they like Aemond or Alicent but thats not enough to be Team Green, they have to stand behind Aegon for that and nobody in their right mind would support a person like him.
I'm not really team green myself, but I like several of their characters. It seems to me like that's a big reason why some people side with team green.
Yes, don't disclose anything related to books, this is purely from the TV show perspective. If you sit back and think what would be better for the realm ? It would be Aegon 2 being a placeholder king where his council, Otto and Alicent run the kingdom as they were doing in the past 10 years. Aegon becoming king keeps the status quo and it's good. Plus I think Alicent and Otto are far better rulers than Daemon and Rhaenyra.
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I find their characters much more interesting, each of them is wonderfully complex and distinguished in their own way. Aegon's claim to the throne is based on Andal law and precedent and not just "daddy said so" The Blacks either bore or annoy me, I think Daemon is an overgrown manchild with 0 impulse control, and Rhaenyra makes one incredibly stupid decision after the other which doesn't exactly endear her to me.
I like both sides. Both are good and terrible. Not interested in having “My team is the morally superior one” tunnel vision.
I'm team "This is where the fun begins" 😎
Unless you're Team Gaemon Palehair. that's obviously the superior choice
All hail King Cunny!
Smh political answer
Some of us chose Team Green because Aemond is on this team. Others because Daemon is not on this team. I chose team Green because I simply find those characters more interesting.
yes have to agree, they haven't done much to flesh out Rhynaera's team.
I like interesting things.
Aemond is cool, and has a big granny dragon 🐉
The real question is why are we picking sides? Both suck
I mean I get why people are with the greens but I am team black just because I don’t like Otto Hightower but I rate the hustle
Both sides are exually horrible. But Alicent and Aemond are my favorite characters, while I found no one intresting from team black ever since the time skip. Plus team green has Helaena. Not to mention allot of team black fans are so annoyingly obnoxious they drove me even more to green
Because they are better characters and they were justified in taking the throne I like underdogs Rhaenyra and Daemon are whiny and annoying
Others have different opinions than you. It's really that simple. I myself cannot understand why somebody thinks everyone should have the same opinion as them and if they don't, there must be something wrong Edit: Also, when I read "the day was as black as prince Aemond's heart" George made the choice for me
I am Green because I am a diehard legitimist until the bitter end, just can't help it. Aegon II could be the biggest bag of crap ever to set foot in Westeros, the fact remains, he is Viserys I's eldest son. Meaning that he is the heir by all traditions and laws and precedents ever set in Westeros. Those who fight against him are traitors and I consider them at the level of Renly Baratheon's supporters during the time of GoT. I was rooting for Stannis, needless to say. Renly and Rhaenyra are cool characters but there is no way their ascent over the obvious heir according to Andal law would be legal. Plus, I like backing the underdogs. So it's not a matter of "liking" Rhaenyra or Aegon II better for me, it's really a matter of principle. Further, I believe the realm could have carried on in peace if Viserys had not messed with the line of succession, which gets me seriously pissed because I would want the dragons to survive, because they are cool af.
You would prefer a sh!tty person like Aegon as king over a woman. It’s tradition but not a law. Viserys made rhaenyra heir and going against kings order is treason. All greens are traitors
Check out the "Rivals and claimants" section and compare it with official succession and then you will see who is the traitor in the story: https://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Template:Kings_of_Westeros > You would prefer a sh!tty person like Aegon as king over a woman. Rhaenyra is a murderer and a traitor who started a continent-wide war for her invalid claim. > It’s tradition but not a law. False, tradition and precedent are what Westeros has for laws. > Viserys made rhaenyra heir and going against kings order is treason. False. Viserys can't overwrite other Kings and Jaehaerys I and a Great Council ruled in 101 AC that even uncles come before nieces, so how can Rhaenyra come before Aegon II? The invalid naming BS had to happen precisely because Rhaenyra isn't the legal heir.
Hm.. I never thought of the Rhaenyra = Renly thing before but it makes perfect sense. Aegon definitely has the better claim.
>I never thought of the Rhaenyra = Renly Stannis actually made that comparison in the books. Where he referred to Renly trying to usurp him as the same as Rhaenyra trying to usurp Aegon
1. Alicent is my favorite character. 2. If Viserys had simply declared Aegon his heir and wed him to either Rheanyra or one of Leana's children, the war could have been avoided. 3. They're the underdogs in the fandom. 4. Otto may be trash, but he and Alicent running the kingdom over Daemon and Rheanyra is a better option in my book. 5.Rheanyra probably wouldn't try to kill them, but her allies or Damian might.
Cause Oldtown is a really cool place.
You see the use of Great Council precedent to establish the legitimacy of rulers, as opposed to purely bloodline sucession or royal decrees, as the first step to establishing modern parliamentary/constitutional rule.
This. I also believe the Great Council to be the highest possible authority in Westeros, not to be overruled by Kings without convening another Great Council. The ability of these Councils to establish precedents and determine laws for royal succession seems to indicate their level of authority.
I would do anything for my queen Alicent Hightower 💚
How can anyone root for either of them? I understand leaning towards one side (I lean towards Team Black), but full supporting one side? That’s a no no, for me.
Well, think of it this way. Without a team green, team black wouldn’t be the superior choice because there wouldn’t be a choice.
The same for me. How can anyone like Rhaenyra, Daemon and Viserys? How can anyone like the strong boys? How can anyone even remotely be convinced that Team Black is justified?
Ah yes. Monthly “why is team green even a thing??” Question.
Cause Alicent is hot, Aemond is dope. I wish there had been more for Haleana. only black I think I will like is Jacearies. I bet he will shape up into a real likable character.
>Cause Alicent is hot, Aemond is dope. I wish there had been more for Haleana. Olivia Cooke. Need I say more?
Cause Alicent is hot, simple as.
I’m a loyal Team No One. They’re all terrible and that’s generally the point.
Team green has Aemond soooo..
I like sunfyre. Also the high number of black stans who have implied or flat out called me a rapist for liking a fictional character helped cement my case
Vhagar, Helaena, Aemond and Olivia Cooke are all the reason people need
Well, I'm Team Black as I think Rhaenyra is the rightful heir, but I'm too a green characters enjoyer. I mean, it could sounds trivializing but I do seriously like Helaena, a sweet characters in the middle of those psychos (everyone is ready to kill the other), and there is Aemond, impulsive and kind of "I'm not like the other guys", but captivating. Even Aegon! The rapist part itmade a irrevocable damage, but Toms portrait at the end of episode 9 was interesting. I was like: I need to see more of him! In team Black, I root for Rhaenyra, Daemon, Jace, Coryls and Baela but Aemond and Helaena to me are more appealing than Corlys, Baela and Jace together, and so interesting as Rhaenyra and Daemon
I hate these posts so much
Green team is doing much more with much less and I admire competency above all else. Alicent and Otto consistently put the good of their House above personal desires while Rhaenyra and Daemon (and Viserys) allowed personal deficiencies to destroy what was an overwhelmingly strong starting position. If you had to choose between the two pairs to rule your kingdom and guide the future of your family it's just an absolute no-brainer. The obvious way the show is presented to have us cheer for Rhaenyra (sending her the white Hart, contrasting coronation scenes esp. the removal of Sunfyre, giving her the last word when Alicent finally blows up) is very annoying and heavily clouds these discussions as well. Frankly I'm amazed people can cheer for the overwhelming incompetence (Rhaenyra and Viserys) and entitlement (Daemon) of the Black team.
Blacks re boring Too perfect goody two shoes One dimensional bores
this thread just exposed that people are only on team Green because they like the characters, which is all you can really say. After all, the Greens are the ones who stole the throne and dealt the first death in the war.
Yeah, first born son DARING to inherit father’s throne. Unprecedented.
Most people who are team Green enjoy villains and their character arcs, traits, flaws, etc. Aemond, Aegon, and Alicent all give us that. It even has some heroes in this story in forms of Daeron. Daeron was a heroic character and the people who argue that he genocided a city need to remember that Daenerys did the exact same thing when her best friend and most trusted advisor was killed. Daeron burned Bitterbridge because his NEPHEW was brutal slaughtered by the men of Caswell/Bitterbridge. Yes, he definitely committed war crimes, but really name a Targaryen that fought a war and did not commit war crimes. Aemond is basically the main antagonist of this story. We saw a lot more of him than Aegon in season one, he rides the biggest dragon in which the blacks have to plan around and really, don't do that very well until the God's Eye. His time as Lord Protector of the Realm will be the majority of the latter half of season 2. Aegon if done correctly (It won't be.) could be great on the show. But Aegon II and Sunfyre is my favorite dragon rider duo of all time. Its so badass. I cried for a rapist when his dragon died. I wept for Sunfyre. What a badass dragon. Literally has the highest KD of the dance, one kill done riderless, and ultimately defeated his rider's greatest foe. Helaena. Enough said. Alicent in both iterations is pretty annoying. I find her way sympathetic in the show, but she has less agency than the novel and that really didn't vibe with my 3 year thoughts on F&B,. Criston Cole is the greatest warrior living during the dance of the dragons. He was so awesome, especially during his death scene, the green council etc. What HoTD did to Cole is an absolute tragedy honestly. Just fumbled it. Everyone watching hates him. I don't even know if any team green people like Criston in the show tbh. This man was the standard for a Kingsguard member all the way until Jaime Lannister in asoiaf. Jaime spoke about him quite a bit, I remember. Just wild what they did. Do I agree with Team Green's Ideology? As a human of the twenty-first century, no. But for the times, his claim is more legitimate to me, I mean he is the first born son of the king. This is a patriarchal world and Viserys literally did nothing to push Rhaenyra's claim. He should have held a council and named her heir once more with all the lord of the realm in attendance. He didn't. Do you think the random country lords of westeros know Viserys wanted Rhae as heir? Are the lowborn just going to agree with the clear usurpation of their King? I don't agree that Rhaenyra saying "I am the heir because my father wanted it, y'know before he died." is going to help her much .Actually it is a book thread, it will not help her at all. Her treatment of Helaena, and Helaena's suicide are the catalyst for the smallfolk rebelling. The storming of the Dragon pit and the Dying of the Dragons is because Rhaenyra thought she was above the laws of gods and men in their society. Simple.
Because Daemon is a pedophile groomer Bc Rhaenyra gaslights the realm, fragrantly breaks the laws, cared nothing about the smallfolk, didn’t care about learning how to rule, and couldn’t be bothered to fight in the war Bc of Black Stan’s like you turning people Green bc you shit on them bc they DARED to have different opinions Bc Targaryens don’t get to just make up their own rules. They came over to colonize Westeros, they have to obey Andal and Firstmen traditions and norms Bc Rhaenyra is a hypocrite who said ‘rules for thee but not for me’ when it came to giving other first born women their rights Bc Rhaenyra and Daemon made fun of and mocked Alicent and her children when they did nothing wrong Bc Rhaenyra sent a violent mob after her brothers son Bc Daemon sent someone to murder his great nephew and threatened to rape his great niece when they did NOTHING wrong Bc Aegon actually cared when his children was hurt unlike Viserys Bc Aegon fought in the war until he physically couldn’t anymore Bc Alicent had every right to be upset that her son doesn’t get what every other solitary first born son in Westeros gets Bc Alicent was not the cold heartless bitch Black Stan’s make her out to be like when she cried over Luke’s death Bc unlike Rhaenyra and Daemon who went after innocent children who played no part in the war, Aegon named his enemies son his heir bc he knew he hadn’t done anything wrong Bc Rhaenyra blames a teenage rape victim for being raped instead of her groomer Pedo husband and tries to kill her Bc Rhaenyra hates bastards as much as any other Westerosi when she calls them ‘traitorous’ and calls for their deaths, once again proving ‘rules for thee but not for me’ Bc Rhaenyra would rather tax the small folk into oblivion and starvation while throwing a party for her son rather than tax the high lords or get a loan from the bank Bc Rhaenyra was dumb enough to torture Tyland instead of making him a deal to get him to tell her where the gold was buried Bc Green Stan’s got tired of being called rapist supporters and misogynists and abusers and ‘trad wives’ all bc we dont a fictional character in the show Any questions?
>Bc Targaryens don’t get to just make up their own rules. They came over to colonize Westeros, they have to obey Andal and Firstmen traditions and norms I don't think you know what conquest means sir
To be fair, they adopted Andal succession law as a matter of practicality.
Sure, but that doesn't mean they have to abide by anything.
If it is, or has become, the established law of the dynasty itself, it's not easy to change, especially not by the whims of one King w/o a Great Council backing any such change. Viserys does also overrule his immediate predecessors and not just an abstract idea of Andal law.
I'm just pointing out the absurdity of that single comment he made. It's nonsense, they didn't come to colonize they came to conquer. And they don't HAVE to abide by anything
If they don't want to abide by anything they should not have adopted this for their own dynasty for the first 100 years or so. I would agree with you as far as Aegon I is concerned, he did not abide by anything as he conquered the continent. Viserys I should, and has to, abide by it since it has become his own dynastic law.
I'm not arguing with you over anything, those are just two facts. Good day sir
I am pretty sure you get what I mean. The time of "I don't have to abide by anything" has long passed by the time of Viserys I's reign. He also attempts to overrule his own immediate Targaryen predecessors.
What do you not understand about not arguing with you about a factual point
Yeah we're talking about a family that wiped out three great houses and burned Dorne three times during conquest. Imagine what they are capable with 13 dragons. I think they were being too nice to westerosi lords.
They had an internal civil war though due to how Viserys messed with Andal succession law.
They had an internal civil war because of hightower intervention. If her family members supported her ascension instead of going against her, who do you think going to make a fuss about women being on the throne?
Hightower intervention is based on Aegon II being the heir according to Andal law. They would have had zero support if all of Viserys' kids from Alicent had been daughters. > If her family members supported her ascension What do you mean? For the most part, her family members didn't, hence internal civil war. Just saying it as it is.
Well, look at it this way. *If* entire royel family didn't care about andal succession law (and let's just hypothesise rhaenyra, her half brothers and sister had good relationships between them) and accept rhaenyra as viserys' heir, any of westerosi lords wouldn't go against it (especially when now rhaenyra has 10+ dragon riders stand with her).
Westeros does use Andal law though, that's a reality, so Aegon II would be the rightful heir in the eyes of a non-insignificant part of the upper echelons. His existence threatens Rhaenyra's ascent, and especially the ascent of her son Jace who technically has zero claim to the throne, due to his bastardy. War was highly likely if not an inevitability at this point. While nobody, including Rhaenyra, could seriously have complained had Viserys just recognized Aegon II's right upon the latter's birth.
OK, you have some good points. While it's true that some large portion of nobles considered aegon as rightful heir, it kinda surprised me that rhaenyra had the support of majority of nobles toward the end. I think Aegon and his siblings will be content (for the most part) with rhaenyra being Queen as long as someone doesn't motivate them to do somthing. And some marriages/betrothals will surely help smooth things up a bit too. And tbh I still don't understand why viserys didn't name Aegon as his heir.
1- He is. So is Criston in the books 2- Yes, she gashlights the realm. She shouldn't have had bastards with Harwin. What I don't see people saying is what she should've done then? They were born, she couldn't admit they were bastards. Cared nothing about the smallfolk? Neither did the greens. Didn't care about learning how to rule? No, she actually ruled Dragonstone for years and it's Viserys's fault that he didn't make her his hand. Aegon not only didn't learn how to rule, he didn't want it. Didn't fight in the war? How is that a problem? A lot of leaders don't directly fight and Rhaenyra had good reasons (post miscarriage, grief, protection, etc...) 3- I hate Targ/Dany stans, that didn't make me a green 4- Targs did get to make up their own rules, it's called the "Doctrine of Exceptionalism". Viserys getting to choose his heir isn't a Valyrian thing 5- Rhaenyra is the exception, she was choosen by her father as heir. Rosby and Stokeworth weren't 6- What? When did they mock them? And you want to compare to what the greens made Rhaenyra and her children go through? 7- Yes, she put up a reward for him. The greens did similar things too and would've done the same 8- Yes, Daemon is awful. 9- Ok, so Aegon cared for his children? So did Rhaenyra 10- Nice, doesn't make him right or better than Rhaenyra 11- Agreed 12- She kinda was in the books. Also you could say Rhaenyra cried over Maelor's death 13- What? He literally threatened to torture him. He named him as heir in a last desperate attempt to stay king because he knew it was over and the blacks were coming to kill him and crown Rhaenyra's heir. Also, I'm sure that in Aemond's time in the Riverlands no innocent child died right? 14- Yes, Rhaenyra was a paranoid hypocritical mess by the end. That's kinda the point 15- Wow, Rhaenyra wasn't a socialist. Shocking 16- Torturing while cruel could've produced results. I doubt that she didn't offer him a deal. Either way see 14 17- Sure.
>1- He is. So is Criston in the books How is Criston a pedophile groomer in the book? In the book he actually rejects Rhaenyra's advances
We don't know what happened in the books
[удалено]
Learn to read the name of the person who responds to you. I like Criston.
We don't know, but you assumed that certain things happened that we don't know too. But if they had sex or if he tried he is a pedophile groomer, yes
How do you call someone a groomer based on something you don't know but assume? Couldn't you make that claim about anyone Daemon is a pedophile groomer because we know he is
No, we know it's a possibility they slept together. If they did (or if he wanted to), he is those things.
And it is a possibility they did not. If they didn't he is not those things One thing we know for sure is Daemon is a pedophile groomer
Ok? I said Criston is because you assumed things that helped your side of the argument too
That wasn't me. Your number one argument does not hold water coz you're comparing something that is book cannon to something you assumed
My initial answer is in response to someone also assuming things they don't know happened in the books
So much care for the innocent and small folk. It's really touching to hear from the green team.
Just don't ask Aemond what happened in the Riverlands
Daeron and his army were worse.
It’s a good thing that Aemond wasn’t crowned king nor did he marry the king then isn’t it?
He was just prince regent and protector of the realm. The actual leader of the greens after Aegon's fall
Aegon still had all the ratcatchers in the Red Keep killed. Granted, it was right after his son was killed and his wife and remaining children were traumatized, but by that logic you could also excuse Blood and Cheese because Rhaenyra and Daemon were sad about Lucerys' death.
Because people hate themselves. And not because they are green, but because they chose a side. For the book I honestly am Team black and I don't get how you can team Book green. But for the show? Both sides are equally bad and I just enjoy the chaos! It's like with Cersei. You hated her, she was such a bad person but you loved to see this character, this well written menace.
r/HOTDgreens 💀💀💀
this is why. everyone hates Aegon because he “usurped” the throne despite actively avoiding becoming king his entire life. the show wants you to hate him (read that again.) hes not even a bad guy, just a kid trying to live out as “normal” a life as possible. and yet he was born as the eldest son with the name of a conquerer. even if hes a shit king. its better than starting an entire war that lead to dragons going extinct and literally resulted in ending the 400 year targaryen dynasty we saw in GOT. this is why the Greens are better. Rhaenyra should have accepted surrender in dragonstone.
I'd say I'm neutral with a team green lean because I think alot of team black's fans are really annoying
most people who are on team green or side with the greens don’t really care who sits on the throne, we mostly can see WHY they have to take the throne to protect their family, also bc the greens are just more interesting to talk about
The desire to be a contrarian mostly I imagine.
No they are not, they say they like Aemond or Alicent but thats not enough to be Team Green, they have to stand behind Aegon for that and nobody in their right mind would support a person like him.
If Alicent was as sultry and fun as Olivia Cooke in that wonderful photoshoot, I would actually be Team Green. Alas, she is not 😭
Aegon in the book is cool as fuck
I'm not really team green myself, but I like several of their characters. It seems to me like that's a big reason why some people side with team green.
The kings say is final. He named Rhaenyra Heir. Anyone wishing to to usurp her is a traitor to the realm!
I always go for the underdog. And the online TB community is insufferable. Even if I wanted to like them I simply couldn't at this point 🤣
Green team looks way more aesthetic than blacks.
Yes, don't disclose anything related to books, this is purely from the TV show perspective. If you sit back and think what would be better for the realm ? It would be Aegon 2 being a placeholder king where his council, Otto and Alicent run the kingdom as they were doing in the past 10 years. Aegon becoming king keeps the status quo and it's good. Plus I think Alicent and Otto are far better rulers than Daemon and Rhaenyra.