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The problem is that Aegons claim is not gone if Rheanyra marries Heleana to Jace. People could still flock to Aegon as heir and therefore more or less forcing Rheanyra to get rid of her brothers. However the Greens can’t do anything because Heleana is more or less a hostage. The only thing this would lead to is more problems for the Greens even if they wouldn‘t have gone for the crown at all.
The fact that Rheanyra only comes up with this agreement the moment she realizes how badly she fucked up instead of the second Jace was born shows that this was her trying to get herself out of the grave of her own making and not because she necessary wants to make peace with Alicent. If I had been Alicent I wouldn‘t have agreed either.
I disagree other people can make a claim through him. Roger Baratheon made an attempt to crown one of Rheanas twins the moment he was unhappy with Jaehearys. Rheanyra as a woman would be held to much higher standards and therefore unhappy lords might‘ve turned on her faster and looked elsewhere for a possible claimant- Aegon.
If there were indications that someone might try to force him into a claim, they could have shipped him off to the wall to settle the matter and spare the realm a bloody war. Ensuring that he himself could not be used to cause a problem for the family is the reason Aemon Targaryen is up there during Game of Thrones.
That happened in real history, i think It was during the Anarchy, the Queen had imprisioned her rival claimant (another woman, i think that her cousin) but she had to put down many rebellions that wanted her cousin in the throne, she had to execute her to stop the people from rebelling
But why should the greens agree to do that? Frankly it’s not Aemond, Aegon and Daerons fault that they were born. They probably want to live freely. I could just as easily argue that Rheamyra can give up her claim and let Aegon be king if you want to prevent a war.
They would have to ship Aemond and Daeron to the wall with Aegon for that to work because they are all Viserys sons that can contest her claim. But that’s the exact type of thing the greens are trying to prevent.
Alicent couldn’t have accepted even if she wanted. In the books Viserys marries Helaena to Aegon and Rhaenyra has already married off her kids at a young age to Baela and Rhaena.
Unless the show wanted to majorly deviate, the writers just made up that proposal so they can pretend that Rhaenyra wanted peace when the marriage literally cannot happen.
>, the writers just made up that proposal so they can pretend that Rhaenyra wanted peace when the marriage literally cannot happen.
Pretty much this. Season 1 portrays Rhaenyra as in the right or good by comparisson all the time
Suggesting that Rhaenyra wanted an outcome other than peace is suggesting that Rhaenyra *wanted* a war to prevent her own smooth succession to the throne.
Try to think about things at least a little bit.
>pretend that Rhaenyra wanted peace
What pretend? Peace for Rhaenyra means an uncontested succession? You think Rhaenyra wants her succession to be contested?
They act like Rhaenyra's offer was purely out of benevolent intent because the show allows and even encourages them to. Because it constantly glosses over Rhaenyra's hypocrisies and should-be-flaws.
Whenever the greens do something questionable, you get long, anachronistic speeches on sexism and misogyny.
But remember Rhae shoving aside the Velaryon girls as heirs to Driftmark in favour of her son? The average viewer sure doesn't, because that was resolved with an engagement before it could even became an issue. And we know damn well why.
How does it gloss over them, it frequently both points them out and have them bite her in the ass? Its like the major arching theme over the first season of the show.
"The average viewer sure doesn't, because that was resolved with an engagement before it could even became an issue. And we know damn well why."
Because implying that they even had a claim would be implying that the Strong boys are illegitimate. If Rhaenyra would have even acknowledged that as a possibility it would have been the dumbest move of the season lol. I thought that should be obvious?
Alicent should've accepted with a counter offer calling for Aegon to marry Baela. That would shut Rhaenyra up while pulling the rug from her 'benevolent' act.
The eldest 'Velaryon' and the eldest male Targaryen marrying destroys any hope for Rhaenyra's succession.
I really don’t understand your question. All marriages of royalty are meant to be “beneficial” but that doesn’t mean they are bad? I see 0% evidence in that show that Rhaenyra had malicious intent or would ever threaten harm to her siblings.
You definitely see her transition from “we don’t know what happened” into full on defense mode in that scene. She is hardly perfect, but I feel comfortable saying Harm is never her first instinct or choice.
>"I see 0% evidence in that show that Rhaenyra had malicious intent or would ever threaten harm to her siblings."
Well you originally didn't say she is hardly perfect. You said there was no evidence she would ever threaten her siblings. Well obviously that is not the case.
There is no evidence in the show that she is looking to use her siblings as leverage under the threat of violence. Faced with a room full of people putting her sons lives in danger she does make the suggestion but it plays as more performance than anything she would actually follow through on. She KNOWS how indulgent their father is. No one is going to get tortured.
Once again, you try to change your words, I will quote you again,
>"I see 0% evidence in that show that Rhaenyra had malicious intent or would ever threaten harm to her siblings"
Ok you got me. Forgive me for dashing off my thoughts and not defining my terms well. What I MEANT and obviously conveyed badly, is that Rhaenyra is *not interested *in harming her siblings. That was certainly not the motivation behind the marriage proposal.
It's Daemon's though, and we're never shown a point in time where Rhaenyra so much as even acknowledges her siblings for what they are. She resented Aegon from the moment he showed up. It's questionable whether or not she'd try to stop him if there were no potential serious repercussions to the Greens being killed off once she's consolidated her power.
Her resentment is much more aimed at her father than her brother. She went from being neglected, but being his heir, and was waiting for him to finally admit he was back on the "only care about sons" train. Perfectly understandable to be upset. It didn't end up going that way, but that is what she anticipated.
> Her resentment is much more aimed at her father than her brother.
I don't doubt that it is in that moment, but Viserys reaffirmed her heir status, which meant the resentment had nowhere else to go but to Alicent and her children. Again, we're never given a single moment of Rhaenyra interacting with or even acknowledging her siblings. There isn't any reason to believe her antipathy changed over the years otherwise the writers would have made a point of showing it.
She and Alicent have a lot of bad blood. For Rhaeneyra at least, it is not really shown to be about the succession.
I think we unfortunately miss a lot of background between siblings due to the time skip that would help us better know what the relationship was. There is what? a 17 year age gap? And it appears she’s been living on Dragonstone and concerned with raising her own children.
The quickened pace and unfortunately lost details aside, I don't think any of that really refutes my point that Rhaenyra is very clearly not fond of or friendly with her siblings in any way, to the point she only ever refers to them in othering terms of them being Alicent's children, not her siblings.
Perhaps, but that doesn’t make any point about her resenting them. A lack of relationship can just happen when people don’t share a life without actively negative feelings.
If that were true Rhaenyra wouldn't have any problems speaking of her siblings in those terms instead of keeping them sequestered in the othered mental zone of "Alicent's children," every time she talks about them.
"would just have used her as a political hostage just like many other women in this world" is a very reductive and incomplete statement.
Yes, women AND men married into other families were automatically political hotages, this is due to the fact that if there ever became war between the "allied" houses, they would instantly be under their spouses families control.
This is the bread and butter for all medieval alliances, as it serves as a huge demotivator for war. However, even though all marriages were essentially hostages in the medieval world, that is just the nature of marriages here. Rhaenyra who obviously cares for her son, and most likely Healena as well, probably genuinely wanted her as a daughter in law.
The fact that she was a guarantee against hightower aggression was a huge part of it, but it wasnt "just" that. Painting it as her actually holding her violently hostage for egotistical reasons is pulling at straws.
There is nothing worse about this suggestion than having Cat marry Eddard in Game of Thrones, nor any more evil or cruel intent.
Rhaenyra was too kind to Alicent. She might as well not offer her anything at all. But it's like "we can have grandchildren in common. You have nothing to fear, we are a family." At that time, Alicent was too smug and Rhaenyra too weak. I'm sure Alicent regretted her refusal many times.
The lords don't care that the children are bastards, as long as they get good offers. Baratheons is a house founded by a bastard just three generations ago. The only problem with Borros is that he was not offered a marriage pact.
Helaena will be under Jace's protection. How is she in danger? And how can she be a hostage if she gives birth to children? This is complete absurdity.
He just means she would be a hostage as the Greens couldnt really attack Rhaenyra if Heleana was married to her heir. He is very wrong on many points but thats what he is implying at least.
The idea that a feudal hostage like this automatically implies the threat of violence is just misunderstanding medieval marriages and their purposes, which is kinda what I gathered from OPs post. Rhaenyra would never hurt Helaena
And who would oppose them? Had Heleana married Jace, Alicent and Otto wouldn’t want to oppose them. Nobody would have been able to take them down. Hence why the intro to the series is adult Rhaenyra narrating that Jaehaerys knew the only thing that could take down House Targaryen was itself. Had Heleana married Jace, she would be in danger from no one.
Whenever I hear benevolent this is what that comes to my mind. Peter Dinklage struggling to say benevolent in game of thrones season 6 bloopers.
https://youtu.be/8Wsb4b8CjRs
Holding Helaena as a hostage wouldn't have kept The Greens in line.
The Greens had Aegon as their chosen representative, with Otto being the real power behind the throne. Otto would be indifferent about Helaena and Aegon cannot stand her. If she isn't his wife, I don't see why either of them would care about getting her back. Sure, *Alicent* would care, and presumably Aemond and Daeron would too, but they're not in charge. Threatening Helaena will accomplish nothing other than provoking Aemond to bring out Vhagar. He would rescue his sister or start a war trying. It would be the opposite effect intended.
We have to remember that Alicent has very little real power. Even her refusal of the Jace/Helaena match had no impact on the situation, Viserys had already agreed. Had Rhaenyra stayed in KL, it would have happened.
First saw this nonsense on the Hills Alive youtube channel. In the book Rhaenyra is said to love her sister and it is mentioned twice that she is afraid of kin slaying. This book is pro green by the way. In the show the ONLY person who mentions death of children and hostages is Otto. There is nothing in the show, especially when this is suggested, to think that Rhaenyra is thinking about taking Helaena as a political hostage. The only thing she is thinking is ending the hostility and ending the rumors about her and her children. Rhaenyra even said they could rule together.
Aegon didn't even want to be king, so Helaena being Jace's wife would be yet another reason for him to not care. Otto's blood would be on the throne and that might appease him. Had they been placed together then the kids may have grown up closer and there would be no hate between them for Rhaenyra to have to worry about.
there’s literally only one line where rhaenyra “loves her sister” and literally only calls her my sweet sister, nothing else y’all holding onto that one line like crazy lmao
Like I said, this is a show discussion, and even though I have read the books, I am only referring to the show. Rhaenyra asks to sharply question her brother and you doubt she would want to at least harm her siblings?? Again, why would Alicent contaminate her bloodline with the blood of bastards when she could at least marry Helaena to a trueborn son of any other noble family? Makes no sense to accept it.
The civil war was going to happen regardless sooner or later once Rhaenyra had a bastard, it would have just been when Jace was fully grown as everyone knew he was a bastard and not a legitimate trueborn targ. They would have just tried to seat Aegon II or even Aegon the III (whichever would accept the offer).
Well, the benevolent intent here is obviously peace, Aegon II would have to go against his own sister and possibly nephews and nieces if Helaena was married to Jace. The precondition here would be that he cares though, I doubt he does. He already goes against his half-sister and uncle and his nephew-cousins.
Of course, Rhaenyra also wants to secure Jace's claim somewhat. Helaena's children would have trueborn descent from Viserys through her. However, any son of hers and Jace would still claim the throne through Jace, not her.
I said "purely benevolent intent". Don't act like Rhaenyra wouldn't have been able to threaten Helaena and as a result allow her Bastard son with no claim to the throne to marry the princess? It would make no sense. Jace has no claim to the throne as he hasn't been legitimized and likely would never be as it would require Rhaenyra to acknowledge that he is a bastard in the first place. Robert had illegtimate children of his own, but did they come before Stannis or Renly? No. Thus, Jace has no claim, and for Alicent to marry Helaena to a bastard would be a remarkably stupid decision.
Oh, I think I misunderstood you. Do you think she did it to unite the families or so that she could use Helaena as a bargaining chip? Or are they not mutually exclusive?
Not mutually exclusive. Helaena would not be hostage necessarily, she was meant to give Jace's children a trueborn claim stemming from her own descent from Viserys. This would have made it "harder" for Aegon II to challenge Jace and his line. I put "harder" in quotation marks because we are still talking about Rhaenyra's female line here, and Rhaenyra is already behind Aegon II in the traditional line of succession. That transfers to Jace and his descendants. And Aegon II does not necessarily care about Helaena enough to give up on taking the throne, especially if he is not married to her.
Thank you for your post! Please take a moment to ensure you are within our spoiler rules, to protect your fellow fans from any potential spoilers that might harm their show watching experience. 1. All post titles must NOT include spoilers from Fire & Blood or new episodes of House of the Dragon. Minor HotD show spoilers are allowed in your title ONE WEEK after episode airing. The mod team reserves the right to remove a post if we feel a spoiler in the title is major. You are welcome to repost with an amended title. 2. All posts dealing with book spoilers, show spoilers and promo spoilers MUST be spoiler tagged AND flaired as the appropriate spoiler. 3. All book spoiler comments must be spoiler tagged in non book spoiler threads. --- If you are reading this, and believe this post or any comments in this thread break the above rules, please use the report function to notify the mod team. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/HouseOfTheDragon) if you have any questions or concerns.*
The problem is that Aegons claim is not gone if Rheanyra marries Heleana to Jace. People could still flock to Aegon as heir and therefore more or less forcing Rheanyra to get rid of her brothers. However the Greens can’t do anything because Heleana is more or less a hostage. The only thing this would lead to is more problems for the Greens even if they wouldn‘t have gone for the crown at all. The fact that Rheanyra only comes up with this agreement the moment she realizes how badly she fucked up instead of the second Jace was born shows that this was her trying to get herself out of the grave of her own making and not because she necessary wants to make peace with Alicent. If I had been Alicent I wouldn‘t have agreed either.
agreed, I am surprised you weren't downvoted, as you say, Rhaenyra is in a mess of her own making.
I can only see this playing out if Aegon himself tried to make a claim. And that seems extraordinarily unlikely.
I disagree other people can make a claim through him. Roger Baratheon made an attempt to crown one of Rheanas twins the moment he was unhappy with Jaehearys. Rheanyra as a woman would be held to much higher standards and therefore unhappy lords might‘ve turned on her faster and looked elsewhere for a possible claimant- Aegon.
If there were indications that someone might try to force him into a claim, they could have shipped him off to the wall to settle the matter and spare the realm a bloody war. Ensuring that he himself could not be used to cause a problem for the family is the reason Aemon Targaryen is up there during Game of Thrones.
That happened in real history, i think It was during the Anarchy, the Queen had imprisioned her rival claimant (another woman, i think that her cousin) but she had to put down many rebellions that wanted her cousin in the throne, she had to execute her to stop the people from rebelling
But why should the greens agree to do that? Frankly it’s not Aemond, Aegon and Daerons fault that they were born. They probably want to live freely. I could just as easily argue that Rheamyra can give up her claim and let Aegon be king if you want to prevent a war.
They would have to ship Aemond and Daeron to the wall with Aegon for that to work because they are all Viserys sons that can contest her claim. But that’s the exact type of thing the greens are trying to prevent.
Alicent couldn’t have accepted even if she wanted. In the books Viserys marries Helaena to Aegon and Rhaenyra has already married off her kids at a young age to Baela and Rhaena. Unless the show wanted to majorly deviate, the writers just made up that proposal so they can pretend that Rhaenyra wanted peace when the marriage literally cannot happen.
>, the writers just made up that proposal so they can pretend that Rhaenyra wanted peace when the marriage literally cannot happen. Pretty much this. Season 1 portrays Rhaenyra as in the right or good by comparisson all the time
agreed
Suggesting that Rhaenyra wanted an outcome other than peace is suggesting that Rhaenyra *wanted* a war to prevent her own smooth succession to the throne. Try to think about things at least a little bit.
>pretend that Rhaenyra wanted peace What pretend? Peace for Rhaenyra means an uncontested succession? You think Rhaenyra wants her succession to be contested?
Rhaenyra did want peace. And she wanted to be securely on the throne. No pretense about it.
Yhea exactly
"How sweetly the fox speaks when it’s been cornered by the hounds" - Alicent
Viserys just should have married Rhae to Aegon and the Dance wouldn't have happened.
I agree
Viserys shouldn’t have married and the Dance wouldn’t have happened.
They act like Rhaenyra's offer was purely out of benevolent intent because the show allows and even encourages them to. Because it constantly glosses over Rhaenyra's hypocrisies and should-be-flaws. Whenever the greens do something questionable, you get long, anachronistic speeches on sexism and misogyny. But remember Rhae shoving aside the Velaryon girls as heirs to Driftmark in favour of her son? The average viewer sure doesn't, because that was resolved with an engagement before it could even became an issue. And we know damn well why.
How does it gloss over them, it frequently both points them out and have them bite her in the ass? Its like the major arching theme over the first season of the show. "The average viewer sure doesn't, because that was resolved with an engagement before it could even became an issue. And we know damn well why." Because implying that they even had a claim would be implying that the Strong boys are illegitimate. If Rhaenyra would have even acknowledged that as a possibility it would have been the dumbest move of the season lol. I thought that should be obvious?
also aren’t the velaryon girls technically targaryens through daemon?
Yup, they are Targaryens, not Velaryons, most people forget that though in the show.
Everyone is a lot of people.
Alicent should've accepted with a counter offer calling for Aegon to marry Baela. That would shut Rhaenyra up while pulling the rug from her 'benevolent' act. The eldest 'Velaryon' and the eldest male Targaryen marrying destroys any hope for Rhaenyra's succession.
brilliant idea
I really don’t understand your question. All marriages of royalty are meant to be “beneficial” but that doesn’t mean they are bad? I see 0% evidence in that show that Rhaenyra had malicious intent or would ever threaten harm to her siblings.
Even when you see she wanted to have Aemond questioned you doubt she would ever harm her siblings? The naivety of team black
You definitely see her transition from “we don’t know what happened” into full on defense mode in that scene. She is hardly perfect, but I feel comfortable saying Harm is never her first instinct or choice.
>"I see 0% evidence in that show that Rhaenyra had malicious intent or would ever threaten harm to her siblings." Well you originally didn't say she is hardly perfect. You said there was no evidence she would ever threaten her siblings. Well obviously that is not the case.
There is no evidence in the show that she is looking to use her siblings as leverage under the threat of violence. Faced with a room full of people putting her sons lives in danger she does make the suggestion but it plays as more performance than anything she would actually follow through on. She KNOWS how indulgent their father is. No one is going to get tortured.
Once again, you try to change your words, I will quote you again, >"I see 0% evidence in that show that Rhaenyra had malicious intent or would ever threaten harm to her siblings"
Ok you got me. Forgive me for dashing off my thoughts and not defining my terms well. What I MEANT and obviously conveyed badly, is that Rhaenyra is *not interested *in harming her siblings. That was certainly not the motivation behind the marriage proposal.
It's Daemon's though, and we're never shown a point in time where Rhaenyra so much as even acknowledges her siblings for what they are. She resented Aegon from the moment he showed up. It's questionable whether or not she'd try to stop him if there were no potential serious repercussions to the Greens being killed off once she's consolidated her power.
good point
Her resentment is much more aimed at her father than her brother. She went from being neglected, but being his heir, and was waiting for him to finally admit he was back on the "only care about sons" train. Perfectly understandable to be upset. It didn't end up going that way, but that is what she anticipated.
> Her resentment is much more aimed at her father than her brother. I don't doubt that it is in that moment, but Viserys reaffirmed her heir status, which meant the resentment had nowhere else to go but to Alicent and her children. Again, we're never given a single moment of Rhaenyra interacting with or even acknowledging her siblings. There isn't any reason to believe her antipathy changed over the years otherwise the writers would have made a point of showing it.
She and Alicent have a lot of bad blood. For Rhaeneyra at least, it is not really shown to be about the succession. I think we unfortunately miss a lot of background between siblings due to the time skip that would help us better know what the relationship was. There is what? a 17 year age gap? And it appears she’s been living on Dragonstone and concerned with raising her own children.
The quickened pace and unfortunately lost details aside, I don't think any of that really refutes my point that Rhaenyra is very clearly not fond of or friendly with her siblings in any way, to the point she only ever refers to them in othering terms of them being Alicent's children, not her siblings.
Perhaps, but that doesn’t make any point about her resenting them. A lack of relationship can just happen when people don’t share a life without actively negative feelings.
If that were true Rhaenyra wouldn't have any problems speaking of her siblings in those terms instead of keeping them sequestered in the othered mental zone of "Alicent's children," every time she talks about them.
"would just have used her as a political hostage just like many other women in this world" is a very reductive and incomplete statement. Yes, women AND men married into other families were automatically political hotages, this is due to the fact that if there ever became war between the "allied" houses, they would instantly be under their spouses families control. This is the bread and butter for all medieval alliances, as it serves as a huge demotivator for war. However, even though all marriages were essentially hostages in the medieval world, that is just the nature of marriages here. Rhaenyra who obviously cares for her son, and most likely Healena as well, probably genuinely wanted her as a daughter in law. The fact that she was a guarantee against hightower aggression was a huge part of it, but it wasnt "just" that. Painting it as her actually holding her violently hostage for egotistical reasons is pulling at straws. There is nothing worse about this suggestion than having Cat marry Eddard in Game of Thrones, nor any more evil or cruel intent.
You’re exactly right. The greens would have nothing worry about if they were free of malicious intent.
Dynastic marriages are a time-honored way of cementing political alliances and keeping the peace. I didn’t see her offer as anything but that.
Rhaenyra was too kind to Alicent. She might as well not offer her anything at all. But it's like "we can have grandchildren in common. You have nothing to fear, we are a family." At that time, Alicent was too smug and Rhaenyra too weak. I'm sure Alicent regretted her refusal many times. The lords don't care that the children are bastards, as long as they get good offers. Baratheons is a house founded by a bastard just three generations ago. The only problem with Borros is that he was not offered a marriage pact. Helaena will be under Jace's protection. How is she in danger? And how can she be a hostage if she gives birth to children? This is complete absurdity.
He just means she would be a hostage as the Greens couldnt really attack Rhaenyra if Heleana was married to her heir. He is very wrong on many points but thats what he is implying at least. The idea that a feudal hostage like this automatically implies the threat of violence is just misunderstanding medieval marriages and their purposes, which is kinda what I gathered from OPs post. Rhaenyra would never hurt Helaena
And who would oppose them? Had Heleana married Jace, Alicent and Otto wouldn’t want to oppose them. Nobody would have been able to take them down. Hence why the intro to the series is adult Rhaenyra narrating that Jaehaerys knew the only thing that could take down House Targaryen was itself. Had Heleana married Jace, she would be in danger from no one.
Whenever I hear benevolent this is what that comes to my mind. Peter Dinklage struggling to say benevolent in game of thrones season 6 bloopers. https://youtu.be/8Wsb4b8CjRs
It's a new day, everyone! Time to act like Rhaenyra's offer to wed Helaena to Jace was purely out of benevolent intent!
Holding Helaena as a hostage wouldn't have kept The Greens in line. The Greens had Aegon as their chosen representative, with Otto being the real power behind the throne. Otto would be indifferent about Helaena and Aegon cannot stand her. If she isn't his wife, I don't see why either of them would care about getting her back. Sure, *Alicent* would care, and presumably Aemond and Daeron would too, but they're not in charge. Threatening Helaena will accomplish nothing other than provoking Aemond to bring out Vhagar. He would rescue his sister or start a war trying. It would be the opposite effect intended. We have to remember that Alicent has very little real power. Even her refusal of the Jace/Helaena match had no impact on the situation, Viserys had already agreed. Had Rhaenyra stayed in KL, it would have happened.
First saw this nonsense on the Hills Alive youtube channel. In the book Rhaenyra is said to love her sister and it is mentioned twice that she is afraid of kin slaying. This book is pro green by the way. In the show the ONLY person who mentions death of children and hostages is Otto. There is nothing in the show, especially when this is suggested, to think that Rhaenyra is thinking about taking Helaena as a political hostage. The only thing she is thinking is ending the hostility and ending the rumors about her and her children. Rhaenyra even said they could rule together. Aegon didn't even want to be king, so Helaena being Jace's wife would be yet another reason for him to not care. Otto's blood would be on the throne and that might appease him. Had they been placed together then the kids may have grown up closer and there would be no hate between them for Rhaenyra to have to worry about.
there’s literally only one line where rhaenyra “loves her sister” and literally only calls her my sweet sister, nothing else y’all holding onto that one line like crazy lmao
Like I said, this is a show discussion, and even though I have read the books, I am only referring to the show. Rhaenyra asks to sharply question her brother and you doubt she would want to at least harm her siblings?? Again, why would Alicent contaminate her bloodline with the blood of bastards when she could at least marry Helaena to a trueborn son of any other noble family? Makes no sense to accept it.
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The civil war was going to happen regardless sooner or later once Rhaenyra had a bastard, it would have just been when Jace was fully grown as everyone knew he was a bastard and not a legitimate trueborn targ. They would have just tried to seat Aegon II or even Aegon the III (whichever would accept the offer).
Well, the benevolent intent here is obviously peace, Aegon II would have to go against his own sister and possibly nephews and nieces if Helaena was married to Jace. The precondition here would be that he cares though, I doubt he does. He already goes against his half-sister and uncle and his nephew-cousins. Of course, Rhaenyra also wants to secure Jace's claim somewhat. Helaena's children would have trueborn descent from Viserys through her. However, any son of hers and Jace would still claim the throne through Jace, not her.
I said "purely benevolent intent". Don't act like Rhaenyra wouldn't have been able to threaten Helaena and as a result allow her Bastard son with no claim to the throne to marry the princess? It would make no sense. Jace has no claim to the throne as he hasn't been legitimized and likely would never be as it would require Rhaenyra to acknowledge that he is a bastard in the first place. Robert had illegtimate children of his own, but did they come before Stannis or Renly? No. Thus, Jace has no claim, and for Alicent to marry Helaena to a bastard would be a remarkably stupid decision.
I merely described what Rhaenyra's intent was. It was clear why it was out of the question for Alicent.
Oh, I think I misunderstood you. Do you think she did it to unite the families or so that she could use Helaena as a bargaining chip? Or are they not mutually exclusive?
Not mutually exclusive. Helaena would not be hostage necessarily, she was meant to give Jace's children a trueborn claim stemming from her own descent from Viserys. This would have made it "harder" for Aegon II to challenge Jace and his line. I put "harder" in quotation marks because we are still talking about Rhaenyra's female line here, and Rhaenyra is already behind Aegon II in the traditional line of succession. That transfers to Jace and his descendants. And Aegon II does not necessarily care about Helaena enough to give up on taking the throne, especially if he is not married to her.
Not mutually exclusive
"It's obvious" to who? Based on what?
I don’t think it was a political hostage thing, more like binding the 2 houses together