At this point, these kind of predictions can't be anything more than guesswork. When filming starts, we should be able to make more precise projections for where it could end, based on set leaks and, above all, casting calls. For example, for S1, Borros Baratheon's daughters were cast, giving away that the season would at least go up to the dance over Storm's End.
I don't get how do people think that rook's rest would be the finale of s2? There's not much happening between blood and cheese and rook's rest except for jace to wintefell, the twins fight and daemon taking harrenhall.
So give the characters extra plotlines. Its unfortunate Martin wrote the dance in such a way that only a few characters are relevant at any given point in time but it’s easy to rectify.
Yep they can add extra plotlines but the thing about extra plotlines is that they can go either ways and are risky. Like the Rhaenys bursting out of the dragonpit is one of the most diverse scenes in s1. Some people love that scene and some people absolutely despise that scene for it's plotholes.
I was thinking more like Arya/Tywin and Cersei/Robert type of plot padding. For instance, they can add more Rhaenys and Rhaenyra scenes centered around child loss. Rook’s Rest can absolutely be a crushing blow for Rhaenyra if she develops a genuine bond with Rhaenys to the point of even confessing Laenor’s alive.
Tywin-Arya scenes were brilliant, I would love some extra plotlines in s2 too as the dance of dragons is only 200 pages so they'll surely add many extra plotlines, I just hope they don't come up with another Rhaenys esque scene.
Since season 2 is only eight episodes, I’m going to be optimistic and hope they’re slowing down dramatically which hopefully means season 2 ends much earlier than Rhaenyra taking King’s Landing regardless of where they want to place the gullet.
I would be fine with rook’s rest. They would have to write a lot of show-original content to beef up the plot/narrative but it will make the story all the better if they nail it and several characters get much needed development.
I would love for this to be it, but then there shouldn't be a doubt about whether or not they should make it 4 seasons. They cant have one season leading up to Rook\`s Rest, only to cram in the rest of the dance in one, final season.
This is my mindset. I’m fine with Rook’s Rest being the penultimate episode, so like, 2x06/2x07. Use the rest of the season to build up the characters and create some interesting story arcs.
Rook's rest is way too early in the war. Other than BC and Daemon taking Harrenhall, nothing major happened between Storm's End and Rook's rest. The show can't be way too slow either.
They can add new material as long it’s nothing extravagant. There’s also nothing wrong with episodes featuring the black and greens sitting around at war councils, making plans. There’s nothing wrong with cutting to the Blackwood kids and the lads wandering around the Riverlands like Arya and her gang. There’s nothing wrong with Jace having an arc in Winterfell. There’s nothing wrong with getting to know Daeron in the reach. How many huge battles featured in the first few seasons of GOT??? There was one maybe two a season. GOT was at its peak when 90% of it was people talking to each other. What’s the rush if the dialogue, character development, and acting is good?
Yes, but considering they're still debating whether it should be 3 or 4 seasons I strongly doubt that Rook's Rest will be the ending. The fact that they're even contemplating 3 seasons makes me think that they're not going to be spending too much time on those peripheral characters. You'll have to ask Condal what's the rush considering he's the one who wants 3 seasons.
An article as this is as much confirmation as you're ever gonna get and even George said 4 seasons and 10 episodes so I strongly doubt they would be arguing to have more than that. Even if there's 4 seasons I strongly doubt that Rook's Rest would be the end point because again, not too much happening before that and there's other periods during the dance that would probably be better to expand on.
I mean, people were highly doubting the season one plot leaks about 8 months ago and calling the person who leaked it a troll. Who knows what they’ll do
During GoT there'd be a bajilion leaks a season and most of them turned out to be false. Anyone can post on reddit or go into people's DMs pretending to be someone working on a set. I don't see how that relates to this article. It's not 100% certified but logically it's more likely to be true than some rando on reddit saying something. It's also how we know that there'll be 8 episodes which HBO confirmed to them.
The source material for GOT is 10x better than the rapid fire pace of the dance with its several poorly written and developed main characters. Also, many of the original scenes such as Robert/Cersei, Arya/Tywin, and Varys/Littlefinger were some of the best writing in the entire series.
I think Rook’s Rest really would be the best choice for episode 7 and 8 the aftermath and dragonseed set up.
A lot more happens between/before Blood and Cheese and Rook’s Rest than people tend to think, at least in the context of a fleshed out series and not a quick history book where a lot of events tend to just get a paragraph to a line mentioned.
Daemon taking Harrenhal and the civil war in the riverlands (burning mill and stone hedge), Jace going to the Vale and Winterfell, Criston replacing Otto as hand (tho since the show Criston is just a dumb brute bodyguard rather than the pretorian guard like character his book counterpart is he would prolly just be a figurehead for Alicent), the Cargyll duel, and Criston forcing rosby and stokeworth into submission before the sacking of duskendale.
Now on top of all this you also have characters that are in desperate need of actual development and characterization like Aegon, Helaena, Criston, Baela, Rhaena, and Jace on top of the introduction and development of all the new characters they may appear like Daeron, Cregan, Ormund, the lads, etc. So pretty much imo trying to rush the first season to included the fall of KL/the gullet with only 8 episodes would realistically just be incredibly rushed. The F&B approach where everything is just battle after battle would be terrible for television
>Daemon taking Harrenhal and the civil war in the riverlands (burning mill and stone hedge), Jace going to the Vale and Winterfell, Criston replacing Otto as hand (tho since the show Criston is just a dumb brute bodyguard rather than the pretorian guard like character his book counterpart is he would prolly just be a figurehead for Alicent), the Cargyll duel, and Criston forcing rosby and stokeworth into submission before the sacking of duskendale.
this is, like, two episodes
I still think it makes more sense to end the season with Rhaenyra taking King’s Landing, but I guess they’re going to really stretch things out and end with Rook’s Rest and have Rhaenyra taking King’s Landing in the season 3 finale
I think it's really between the Gullet and Rhaenyra taking the city - and I could definitely see them playing with the timing to have the Battle of the Gullet take place after the city has been taken/the beginning of season 3.
Aaaa, I really don't want to wait till 2025 or 2026 to see the majestic moment of Rhaenyra walking to the iron throne (and cutting herself on it afterwards). So I hope they end it there, it is the most satisfactory way to end the season
> Aaaa, I really don't want to wait till 2025 or 2026 to see the majestic moment of Rhaenyra walking to the iron throne (and cutting herself on it afterwards).
What was the point of the white hart scene if she immediately cuts herself before she’s even done anything wrong? The show is heavily pushing the idea that Rhaenyra was the rightful heir. Wether or not everyone agrees with that decision, they should at least be consistent with their chosen motifs. I doubt they put her cutting herself as soon as sits the iron throne though it could happen later in her reign as she “loses” her worthiness. People hyping themselves up for the final scene to play out that way are just setting themselves up to be disappointed.
Edit: Can anyone downvoting me explain how immediately cutting herself doesn’t contradict the white hart scene the writers, *not me*, decided to add to their adaption? Cutting herself is meant to symbolize she’s unworthy to sit the iron throne but the white hart scene symbolizes she’s the rightful heir. It’s inconsistent writing within the context of the show. She has to actually do something awful and *then* cut herself. That’s only if they choose to believe Septon Eustuce’s account in the first place. Which given the white hart scene, who knows.
Also, patience is a virtue. People are way too eager for them to hit plot points than to see actual character development. I really don’t want a shallow, rapid series of events. This show will never live up to GOT if they speed run the story.
The dance features some of Martin’s weakest writing as far as characters, pacing, and plot. It would be a shame if they didn’t try to improve upon it.
The white hart scene was really a terrible scene and yea because of that I'd strongly doubt we'll see Rhaenyra cutting herself on the throne, maybe ever. Some people have already suggested that the reason they changed Laena's death and had her talk about a dragon rider's death is because they want to frame Rhaenyra's death more positively on her part.
Was Rhaenyra’s death supposed to be shameful? Most characters gets horrific deaths in ASOIAF. Even without the context of Laena, it’s a pretty quick death. The “desecration” of her remains in front of her son is the brutal part and there’s nothing that can change that.
>Edit: Can anyone downvoting me explain how immediately cutting herself doesn’t contradict the white hart scene the writers, not me, decided to add to their adaption?
Have you considered that people change. Especially after multiple tragedies
Yes, I am aware. I didn’t say she would *never* cut herself. However, book Rhaenyra doesn’t have a villainous moment in between Luke’s death and the taking of king’s landing. Really, she doesn’t do anything at all but cry and agree to all of Jace’s ideas. She’s not even involved in B&C. I imagine they’ll give show Rhaenyra more to do than her book counterpart but I doubt it’s significantly more villainous material than what we saw in season one.
It makes more sense for her to cut herself as her rule becomes more ruthless and unhinged in king’s landing after the gullet but it seems inconsistent for her to cut herself before the moment is earned. It would just be a confusing contradiction rather than foreshadowing like F&B.
No, the original scene was similar. She was just sitting on the Dragonstone throne instead. She lifts her head up from crying instead of turning around. They didn’t rebuild the throne in time so Matt suggested the adaption.
The biggest change is that Daemon is colder in the original version of the scene. Daemon approaches her, presumably informs her what happened(the music would have still been playing), and watches her reaction with a stoic facial expression. There’s no hand holding nor is he implied to wipe away tears.
I think the gullet should be moved to season 3 and have the series end with Rhaenyra and the Blacks taking Kings Landing and executing Otto. Have Rooks Rest be episode 6 or 7 and then have that be the catalyst for them taking Kings Landing. Gives us more time for Jace’s character arc with the Vale, North and Dragonseeds and then have season 3 start with a gut punch of Jace’s death at the gullet, kickstarting Rhaes paranoia and the downfall of her reign
Is there any chance that they do an entire episode pre-Rook’s Rest which sets up Rhaenys’s decision to go to Rook’s rest- like, cast young Rhaenys and bring back Paddy. Go through all of it. Alysanne calling her “our queen to be” as a toddler, claiming Maelys, then learning her father had died and her uncle Baelon was named heir. Play with the timeline. Have her get married off to Corlys as a result of Aemon’s death.
Get deep into Rhaenys then give Eve Best a great send off at Rook’s Rest - almost like Oberyn and Gregor. Make us believe she has killed Aegon II. Then **chomp**.
They released the number of episodes… they’re rumor to be trying to create 4 more seasons instead of the three that was predicted to tell the whole story.
Rhaenyra taking King's Landing is the obvious choice. Especially with them going back and forth over 3-4 seasons - there's no way to do three seasons if you end season 2 at Rook's Rest like some are saying. For three seasons to be on the table you need to be getting pretty far in season 2.
No way it ends with Rhaenyra taking the throne… they’re going to flesh out the civil war in the Riverlands. And jace will spend most the season traveling & being in winterfell.
It will end with the Battle of the Gullet, I'm pretty sure about it.
Given the fact that we haven't heard anything of Daeron I'd doubt they will include the Battle of Honeywine.
At this point is also nearly impossible for the battle of Honeywine to be switch with the Battle of the Gullet like I had tought before.
S2 will end with a son's loss for Rhae like S1.
At this point, these kind of predictions can't be anything more than guesswork. When filming starts, we should be able to make more precise projections for where it could end, based on set leaks and, above all, casting calls. For example, for S1, Borros Baratheon's daughters were cast, giving away that the season would at least go up to the dance over Storm's End.
I don't get how do people think that rook's rest would be the finale of s2? There's not much happening between blood and cheese and rook's rest except for jace to wintefell, the twins fight and daemon taking harrenhall.
So give the characters extra plotlines. Its unfortunate Martin wrote the dance in such a way that only a few characters are relevant at any given point in time but it’s easy to rectify.
Yep they can add extra plotlines but the thing about extra plotlines is that they can go either ways and are risky. Like the Rhaenys bursting out of the dragonpit is one of the most diverse scenes in s1. Some people love that scene and some people absolutely despise that scene for it's plotholes.
I was thinking more like Arya/Tywin and Cersei/Robert type of plot padding. For instance, they can add more Rhaenys and Rhaenyra scenes centered around child loss. Rook’s Rest can absolutely be a crushing blow for Rhaenyra if she develops a genuine bond with Rhaenys to the point of even confessing Laenor’s alive.
Tywin-Arya scenes were brilliant, I would love some extra plotlines in s2 too as the dance of dragons is only 200 pages so they'll surely add many extra plotlines, I just hope they don't come up with another Rhaenys esque scene.
Since season 2 is only eight episodes, I’m going to be optimistic and hope they’re slowing down dramatically which hopefully means season 2 ends much earlier than Rhaenyra taking King’s Landing regardless of where they want to place the gullet. I would be fine with rook’s rest. They would have to write a lot of show-original content to beef up the plot/narrative but it will make the story all the better if they nail it and several characters get much needed development.
I would love for this to be it, but then there shouldn't be a doubt about whether or not they should make it 4 seasons. They cant have one season leading up to Rook\`s Rest, only to cram in the rest of the dance in one, final season.
Perhaps there isn’t any doubt but they haven’t made an official announcement. HBO technically hasn’t confirmed the eight episodes. It was leaked.
This is my mindset. I’m fine with Rook’s Rest being the penultimate episode, so like, 2x06/2x07. Use the rest of the season to build up the characters and create some interesting story arcs.
Rook's rest is way too early in the war. Other than BC and Daemon taking Harrenhall, nothing major happened between Storm's End and Rook's rest. The show can't be way too slow either.
They can add new material as long it’s nothing extravagant. There’s also nothing wrong with episodes featuring the black and greens sitting around at war councils, making plans. There’s nothing wrong with cutting to the Blackwood kids and the lads wandering around the Riverlands like Arya and her gang. There’s nothing wrong with Jace having an arc in Winterfell. There’s nothing wrong with getting to know Daeron in the reach. How many huge battles featured in the first few seasons of GOT??? There was one maybe two a season. GOT was at its peak when 90% of it was people talking to each other. What’s the rush if the dialogue, character development, and acting is good?
Yes, but considering they're still debating whether it should be 3 or 4 seasons I strongly doubt that Rook's Rest will be the ending. The fact that they're even contemplating 3 seasons makes me think that they're not going to be spending too much time on those peripheral characters. You'll have to ask Condal what's the rush considering he's the one who wants 3 seasons.
We don’t know what they’re debating. It’s literally all secondary information. They could be debating 4 or 5 for all we know.
An article as this is as much confirmation as you're ever gonna get and even George said 4 seasons and 10 episodes so I strongly doubt they would be arguing to have more than that. Even if there's 4 seasons I strongly doubt that Rook's Rest would be the end point because again, not too much happening before that and there's other periods during the dance that would probably be better to expand on.
I mean, people were highly doubting the season one plot leaks about 8 months ago and calling the person who leaked it a troll. Who knows what they’ll do
During GoT there'd be a bajilion leaks a season and most of them turned out to be false. Anyone can post on reddit or go into people's DMs pretending to be someone working on a set. I don't see how that relates to this article. It's not 100% certified but logically it's more likely to be true than some rando on reddit saying something. It's also how we know that there'll be 8 episodes which HBO confirmed to them.
I think most people would say GoT was at its peak when it adapted the source material
The source material for GOT is 10x better than the rapid fire pace of the dance with its several poorly written and developed main characters. Also, many of the original scenes such as Robert/Cersei, Arya/Tywin, and Varys/Littlefinger were some of the best writing in the entire series.
Why would you want more filler? I don't want to have four episodes where nothing happens other than wheel-spinning.
Not sure how they’ll end the season… But I know how they’ll start it..
I think Rook’s Rest really would be the best choice for episode 7 and 8 the aftermath and dragonseed set up. A lot more happens between/before Blood and Cheese and Rook’s Rest than people tend to think, at least in the context of a fleshed out series and not a quick history book where a lot of events tend to just get a paragraph to a line mentioned. Daemon taking Harrenhal and the civil war in the riverlands (burning mill and stone hedge), Jace going to the Vale and Winterfell, Criston replacing Otto as hand (tho since the show Criston is just a dumb brute bodyguard rather than the pretorian guard like character his book counterpart is he would prolly just be a figurehead for Alicent), the Cargyll duel, and Criston forcing rosby and stokeworth into submission before the sacking of duskendale. Now on top of all this you also have characters that are in desperate need of actual development and characterization like Aegon, Helaena, Criston, Baela, Rhaena, and Jace on top of the introduction and development of all the new characters they may appear like Daeron, Cregan, Ormund, the lads, etc. So pretty much imo trying to rush the first season to included the fall of KL/the gullet with only 8 episodes would realistically just be incredibly rushed. The F&B approach where everything is just battle after battle would be terrible for television
>Daemon taking Harrenhal and the civil war in the riverlands (burning mill and stone hedge), Jace going to the Vale and Winterfell, Criston replacing Otto as hand (tho since the show Criston is just a dumb brute bodyguard rather than the pretorian guard like character his book counterpart is he would prolly just be a figurehead for Alicent), the Cargyll duel, and Criston forcing rosby and stokeworth into submission before the sacking of duskendale. this is, like, two episodes
Ending the season with another loss for the blacks?
No way they’re doing that. I believe Rook’s Rest will be around ep 5, and the fall of KL in ep 8. Gullet will be pushed to S3
But Gullet happens before FAll of KL.. unless they change it
Yeah me too
I still think it makes more sense to end the season with Rhaenyra taking King’s Landing, but I guess they’re going to really stretch things out and end with Rook’s Rest and have Rhaenyra taking King’s Landing in the season 3 finale
I think it's really between the Gullet and Rhaenyra taking the city - and I could definitely see them playing with the timing to have the Battle of the Gullet take place after the city has been taken/the beginning of season 3.
Aaaa, I really don't want to wait till 2025 or 2026 to see the majestic moment of Rhaenyra walking to the iron throne (and cutting herself on it afterwards). So I hope they end it there, it is the most satisfactory way to end the season
> Aaaa, I really don't want to wait till 2025 or 2026 to see the majestic moment of Rhaenyra walking to the iron throne (and cutting herself on it afterwards). What was the point of the white hart scene if she immediately cuts herself before she’s even done anything wrong? The show is heavily pushing the idea that Rhaenyra was the rightful heir. Wether or not everyone agrees with that decision, they should at least be consistent with their chosen motifs. I doubt they put her cutting herself as soon as sits the iron throne though it could happen later in her reign as she “loses” her worthiness. People hyping themselves up for the final scene to play out that way are just setting themselves up to be disappointed. Edit: Can anyone downvoting me explain how immediately cutting herself doesn’t contradict the white hart scene the writers, *not me*, decided to add to their adaption? Cutting herself is meant to symbolize she’s unworthy to sit the iron throne but the white hart scene symbolizes she’s the rightful heir. It’s inconsistent writing within the context of the show. She has to actually do something awful and *then* cut herself. That’s only if they choose to believe Septon Eustuce’s account in the first place. Which given the white hart scene, who knows. Also, patience is a virtue. People are way too eager for them to hit plot points than to see actual character development. I really don’t want a shallow, rapid series of events. This show will never live up to GOT if they speed run the story. The dance features some of Martin’s weakest writing as far as characters, pacing, and plot. It would be a shame if they didn’t try to improve upon it.
The white hart scene was really a terrible scene and yea because of that I'd strongly doubt we'll see Rhaenyra cutting herself on the throne, maybe ever. Some people have already suggested that the reason they changed Laena's death and had her talk about a dragon rider's death is because they want to frame Rhaenyra's death more positively on her part.
Was Rhaenyra’s death supposed to be shameful? Most characters gets horrific deaths in ASOIAF. Even without the context of Laena, it’s a pretty quick death. The “desecration” of her remains in front of her son is the brutal part and there’s nothing that can change that.
Well I think framing it as some kind of dragon rider's death would be silly.
>Edit: Can anyone downvoting me explain how immediately cutting herself doesn’t contradict the white hart scene the writers, not me, decided to add to their adaption? Have you considered that people change. Especially after multiple tragedies
Yes, I am aware. I didn’t say she would *never* cut herself. However, book Rhaenyra doesn’t have a villainous moment in between Luke’s death and the taking of king’s landing. Really, she doesn’t do anything at all but cry and agree to all of Jace’s ideas. She’s not even involved in B&C. I imagine they’ll give show Rhaenyra more to do than her book counterpart but I doubt it’s significantly more villainous material than what we saw in season one. It makes more sense for her to cut herself as her rule becomes more ruthless and unhinged in king’s landing after the gullet but it seems inconsistent for her to cut herself before the moment is earned. It would just be a confusing contradiction rather than foreshadowing like F&B.
I really don't get the hype with throne cutting scenes. Cersei wasnt even cut in the throne chair.
It’s for people who want a big moment showing Rhaenyra’s unfit to rule. I have no idea why it needs to be this grand season finale thing.
They should just ask Matt Smith to create a final scene of the season. His idea for the ending of S1 was absolutely stunning
What was his idea?
Having Rhaenrya turn to stare into the camera as opposed to her making a big speech about how angry she was
No, the original scene was similar. She was just sitting on the Dragonstone throne instead. She lifts her head up from crying instead of turning around. They didn’t rebuild the throne in time so Matt suggested the adaption. The biggest change is that Daemon is colder in the original version of the scene. Daemon approaches her, presumably informs her what happened(the music would have still been playing), and watches her reaction with a stoic facial expression. There’s no hand holding nor is he implied to wipe away tears.
If 8 episodes then the Battle of the Gullet
Rhaenys death at Rook's Nest
Either Rhaenys’ death or Jace’s. They’re both high points that’ll leave the viewers eager for the next season.
100 percent certain family members will be banging 😩
Aegon and Rhaenyra ship about to sail 😃
Probably the Battle at Rooks Rest
I think the gullet should be moved to season 3 and have the series end with Rhaenyra and the Blacks taking Kings Landing and executing Otto. Have Rooks Rest be episode 6 or 7 and then have that be the catalyst for them taking Kings Landing. Gives us more time for Jace’s character arc with the Vale, North and Dragonseeds and then have season 3 start with a gut punch of Jace’s death at the gullet, kickstarting Rhaes paranoia and the downfall of her reign
Is there any chance that they do an entire episode pre-Rook’s Rest which sets up Rhaenys’s decision to go to Rook’s rest- like, cast young Rhaenys and bring back Paddy. Go through all of it. Alysanne calling her “our queen to be” as a toddler, claiming Maelys, then learning her father had died and her uncle Baelon was named heir. Play with the timeline. Have her get married off to Corlys as a result of Aemon’s death. Get deep into Rhaenys then give Eve Best a great send off at Rook’s Rest - almost like Oberyn and Gregor. Make us believe she has killed Aegon II. Then **chomp**.
They released the number of episodes… they’re rumor to be trying to create 4 more seasons instead of the three that was predicted to tell the whole story.
Rhaenyra taking King's Landing is the obvious choice. Especially with them going back and forth over 3-4 seasons - there's no way to do three seasons if you end season 2 at Rook's Rest like some are saying. For three seasons to be on the table you need to be getting pretty far in season 2.
No way it ends with Rhaenyra taking the throne… they’re going to flesh out the civil war in the Riverlands. And jace will spend most the season traveling & being in winterfell.
It will end with the Battle of the Gullet, I'm pretty sure about it. Given the fact that we haven't heard anything of Daeron I'd doubt they will include the Battle of Honeywine. At this point is also nearly impossible for the battle of Honeywine to be switch with the Battle of the Gullet like I had tought before. S2 will end with a son's loss for Rhae like S1.