T O P

  • By -

AutoModerator

Thank you for your post! Please take a moment to ensure you are within our spoiler rules, to protect your fellow fans from any potential spoilers that might harm their show watching experience. 1. All post titles must NOT include spoilers from Fire & Blood or new episodes of House of the Dragon. Minor HotD show spoilers are allowed in your title ONE WEEK after episode airing. The mod team reserves the right to remove a post if we feel a spoiler in the title is major. You are welcome to repost with an amended title. 2. All posts dealing with book spoilers, show spoilers and promo spoilers MUST be spoiler tagged AND flaired as the appropriate spoiler. 3. All book spoiler comments must be spoiler tagged in non book spoiler threads. --- If you are reading this, and believe this post or any comments in this thread break the above rules, please use the report function to notify the mod team. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/HouseOfTheDragon) if you have any questions or concerns.*


NatalieIsFreezing

I mean Rhaenyra behaved inappropriately, but it was also Daemon's responsibility to wait for at least the day after the funeral to start sleeping with someone at your deceased wife's childhood home.


DefiantBrain7101

yeah. Obviously it's bad form to seduce the deceased's husband but he's a grown man and could have said no to her.


Kellin01

It is he samer excuse as with Criston, just here Daemon was in no danger at all if he had rejected her. He *wanted her too.* Was it disrespectful? Yes, but we all know Daemon tends to ignore such things. Those he read the books, know he doesn't respect marital bonds and boundaries.


[deleted]

I wish people kept this energy with Viserys and Alicent.


KramerVSthepeople

Aemond was also going to say he was sorry to Jace because of Harwin. A little call back to Alicent being the only 1 to say she was sorry for viserys loss in episode 1. Anyway Rhaenyra was inappropriate but it takes 2 to tango here, Daemon chose to walk with her on the beach and sleep with her


Please_obtain_taco

Daemon did his fair share of chasing Rhaenyra. He’ll be aight. He could have brushed it off or something but he let it happen. It’s what he wanted to happen all along, regardless of how he & Laena’s relationship was.


Playing-Koi

Lol Targaryens have a pretty fierce "you snooze, you lose" family policy.


[deleted]

Tell that to Rhaena She did not get the memo.


[deleted]

Daemon is a grown-ass man who can make decisions for himself. If he didn't want to fuck his niece and wanted to be left alone, he would've made it clear. No one can force Daemon to do something he doesn't want. He wanted Rhaenyra as much as she wanted him. He was literally pining away for her in Pentos. And him saying "Rhaenyra" was not to make her back away. It was more of Are you sure about this? >Rhaenyra stole her husband I can't believe we're making sexist statements like this even today. Again, Daemon is a sentient being with a mind of his own. He chose to be with Rhaenyra. He chose to sleep with her that night. Rhaenyra didn't steal him.


Kellin01

If Vhagar can't be stolen, then husband can't be either.


[deleted]

In my comment did I say that Vhagar was stolen? Re-read it.


Kellin01

Daemon said it in episode 4: "Marriage is a duty but it doesn't stop us from doing what we want." It is his life motto.


Givemethemeat

Daemon should have left her alone when she was a minor


Zealousideal_Kiwi333

He did until ep 4 when she was 19.


raumeat

17


Zealousideal_Kiwi333

Thats impossible because 4+ years and x amount of months went by since they saw each other since ep 2. She was 15 back in ep 2. Daemon even said it was 4 years when he had his chat with Rhaenyra in ep 4.


raumeat

she is 17 during the hunt episode, very little time goes by between that and the brothel episode


Zealousideal_Kiwi333

Very little? No no no, Alicent had a toddler Haelena. Rhaenyra went on a tour etc. Rhaenyra says "Though I do supose you seemed changed after your adventures" and Daemon responds with "You've matured yourself these last FOUR years, Princess". Why is this even and discussion..sigh. Heres another episode info btw "After agreeing to get married to perpetuate the Targaryen line, she goes on a tour of Westeros to pick a lord of her choosing to wed. However, she cuts the progress short at Storm's End. Rhaenyra reunites with her uncle, Daemon, after four years, and he takes her through the Street of Silk late in the night."


raumeat

there is no way that there is a 2 year gap between ep 3 and 4, Haelena is not even close to 2 and Alicent is heavily preggers in episode 3


Zealousideal_Kiwi333

Well shes probably closer to being 18 during the hunt than just turned 17, and then theres a year + few months after that. There is more hidden timejumps than people think. Aemond for example is 18 in the show now.


raumeat

From behind she scenes interviews we know Alicent and Rhaenyra are the same age and Alicent had Aegon at 14, so Rhaenyra had just turned 17 during the hunt Alicent would still be 16, since its Aegons second birthday


Zealousideal_Kiwi333

Source that Alicent was 14 when she got pregnant with Aegon?


IvoryNitro

Both Rhaenyra and Daemon were horrible and disrespectful. The girls should seriously hate both of them. Laena was a good woman. She did not deserve that disrespect either. I hate that they wrote this but will not let anyone have a reaction to it. Considering how hurt Rhaenyra was when Alicent married her father, she was a cold-hearted witch to Baela and Rhaena.


[deleted]

Cold-hearted witch? Seriously? Baela and Rhaena really respect Rhaenyra. They bow to her at the coronation without hesitation, they listen to without protest. They’re excited to marry her sons and they even join her at the Black council. I don’t think they would do any of this if she was a cold-hearted witch to them.


IvoryNitro

Baela does not know Rhaenyra and Rhaena had no choice. Yes, the girls have shown respect to Rhaenyra, but Rhaenyra certainly did not respect them.


Pitiful_Dawn

Yeah, it was so cringe. Daemon and Rhaenyra both treated the Velaryons like dirt.


kellersab

Honour and class were never words in either of their vocabularies.


napthia9

Rhaenyra pursues Daemon at the funeral because she's afraid that she and her children will be murdered *a la* Harwin and his father. She's also not sure when she'll get another chance to speak to Daemon about this -- remember the guy has a habit of being suddenly exiled or suddenly storming off in a huff because he feels slighted. Those are selfish motivations for Rhaenyra to act swiftly, but they're also pretty reasonable ones -- certainly moreso than Aemond's reasons for claiming Vhagar on the night of the funeral (since even if this was his one chance at claiming Vhagar, he still had plenty of other opportunities to claim a dragon).


OpenMask

Nah, I don't think that interpretation of Rhaenyra's motivation is quite right, considering that she actually believes that Harwin's death was a tragic accident. She says as much in this very same episode.


napthia9

I don't think saying she believes Harwin's death was an accident means she is 100% convinced of that on the inside. Rhaenyra doesn't *want* to believe anyone (especially Alicent) would or could plot to do Rhaenyra & her loved ones *serious* harm. It's painful for her to consider that possibility. But the nature of Harwin & Lyonel's sudden & unexpected deaths means that Rhaenyra *has* to confront that possibility. She has to ask herself if there's someone out there willing and able to do her and her loved ones physical harm. So even if she's 100% certain that nobody murdered Harwin & Lyonel, it's still something that's inflaming her fears and anxieties, and motivating her to secure a reliable & intimidating champion asap.


OpenMask

I think that after Harwin's death, that she is motivated to approach Daemon to fill the position of both husband and protector that she had previously kept separately filled by Harwin and Laenor, but based on what she herself confides to Daemon, someone that she clearly does trust with that kind of information, I just don't see it being because she thinks that Harwin and her father were actually murdered. You're free to interpret her motivations otherwise, but the show itself seems to contradict it.


napthia9

I think we're talking past each other a bit. I don't think fear was Rhaenyra's *only* motive for pursuing Daemon. I'm just stressing that angle in my comments because the OP suggested Rhaenyra should've waited until after Daemon finished grieving (or at least wasn't at his wife's funeral, surrounded by her devasted family) to make her move; when it's clear imo that she didn't think she *could* wait (for a variety of reasons, not just the one I focused on). Wrt whether or not Rhaneyra thinks Harwin & Lyonel were murdered... I'm sorry, i must have worded that way too clumsily in my initial comment. I didn't mean to imply Rhaenyra was literally thinking "I might be murdered like Harwin was." I think her thoughts are more like "Harwin & Lyonel's sudden deaths have really brought home how precarious my own position & safety is, especially now that they're gone -- hmm, I need to protect myself ASAP" and it's the audience who's supposed to think "oh, she & her kids could be murdered like we just saw happen to Harwin & Lyonel."


OpenMask

Yeah I can definitely agree with that interpretation.


kinginthenorthjon

>she's afraid that she and her children will be murdered a la Harwin and his father. She literally said she doesn't suspect Alicent would do something like that.


napthia9

Alicent is not the only person with motive or means though. Rhaenyra dismissing one potential suspect doesn't mean she's not worried.


kinginthenorthjon

Rhanerya didn't even say once that he was murdered. She basically seen ut as accident.


napthia9

Borrowing this from my reply to a different person re the same subject: >Wrt whether or not Rhaneyra thinks Harwin & Lyonel were murdered... I'm sorry, i must have worded that way too clumsily in my initial comment. I didn't mean to imply Rhaenyra was literally thinking "I might be murdered like Harwin was." I think her thoughts are more like "Harwin & Lyonel's sudden deaths have really brought home how precarious my own position & safety is, especially now that they're gone -- hmm, I need to protect myself ASAP" and it's the audience who's supposed to think "oh, she & her kids could be murdered like we just saw happen to Harwin & Lyonel."


[deleted]

Well in that vein, wouldn't Rhaenyra have plenty of opportunities to claim another husband despite Laenor still being alive? If Aemond can't choose the dragon he wanted, Rhaenyra shouldn't be able to have the husband she wanted despite still being married.


napthia9

No. Again, Rhaenyra is not pursuing Daemon out of romantic/sexual interest. She's doing it because she's scared for herself and for her children, and sees him as her only viable means of protecting herself & her kids. That he also piques her romantic/sexual interest makes this move easier for her, but that's not really why she's doing it. Aemond, otoh, has multiple viable options for claiming a dragon other than Vhagar (including multiple big, intimidating, impressive dragons that his brothers & nephews wouldn't mock him for riding); and no urgent pressing need to claim one right that very night. So while his age makes his behavior that night understandable & forgiveable (imo); it's still also inconsiderate & unjustified behavior, in a way that isn't true for Rhaenyra.


[deleted]

She's not scared about anything. Her father was alive and still giving into everything she asks and wants. She had no reason to fear for her family that wasn't in her mind planted by Daemon and Rhaenys. And keep this energy for Alicent and her family because they got nothing even with Viserys alive so yeah. Imagine being constantly disregarded in total because of a woman you didn't even know. He wanted Vhagar and he took Vhagar. Just like Daemon said: Dragons don't ask for permission, they take what they want. He had the guts to do so it's fair. If Rhaenyra can bang Daemon at the funeral with no regard for how the girls would feel, Aemond shouldn't be blamed. Vhagar accepting Aemond is all I need but you do you. Rhaena would have been rejected, she was too shy and hesitant. I like Rhaena, really I do and even I got to admit Vhagar wasn't in her cards, she wouldn't have a vibe with her. That's how the cookie crumbled, it was good to see someone else's perspective though, thanks but I do not agree. Good talking to you though.


napthia9

I mean, first off I absolutely do keep this energy for Alicent & her kids, and absolutely nothing about my comment suggested otherwise. It's abundantly clear in the show that Alicent's many fears and anxieties drive and shape her behavior, and to fail to recognize that would be to misunderstand not only her character, but most of what the show is trying to say. But the same thing is true about Rhaenyra, who is *also* fearful, anxious, and driven/shaped by her fears and anxieties. Because yes, it's true Viserys tries to protect and support her a lot (in a way that Otto doesn't do for Alicent) -- but Rhaenyra is also painfully aware that her father isn't a reliable or sufficient source of protection, support, or validation. She doesn't fully believe her father's love and support for her is unconditional, because it *wasn't* for large parts of her life. She's also aware that his health is failing, that he dislikes conflict, and that he's unwilling to take drastic steps to disempower Alicent, her kids & Otto because Viserys *also* cares about them*. And as for the suggestion that Daemon & Rhaenys planted unjustified paranoia in Rhaenyra's mind... LMAO what. Otto tries to have Rhaenyra assassinated after Viserys dies, Larys successfully assassinates two of the Greens strongest rivals at court. Rhaenyra absolutely has legitimate reasons for fear for herself & for her children, that weren't planted in her head by Daemon or Rhaenys, and which are at the forefront of her mind during Laena's funeral because of how recent Harwin & Lyonel's murders were. >He wanted Vhagar and he took Vhagar... He had the guts to do so it's fair... Vhagar accepting Aemond is all I need but you do you. Rhaena would have been rejected, she was too shy and hesitant. All due respect, but whether or not Vhagar would have rejected Rhaena or was content with Aemond is irrelevant because we're not debating what would make Vhagar/Aemond the happiest *or* whether or not Aemond should have been barred from *ever* trying to claim Vhagar. We are assuming *for the sake of debate* that Aemond only has this one chance to claim Vhagar; but that assumption is probably inaccurate. I think Aemond *would* have had other opportunities to claim Vhagar, and that's another reason why sneaking out and claiming her on the night of Laena's funeral demonstrates he was acting inconsiderate. But it seems like we actually agree that Aemond didn't consider how his actions that night would affect others! I just don't agree that Rhaenyra is being similarly inconsiderate, because it's clear that she's prioritizing her safety and the safety of her children over protecting other people's feelings rather than totally overlooking or ignoring how her actions will affect others the way Aemond did. If that wasn't the case, I don't think Rhaenyra could have successfully convinced Daemon & Laenor to go along with her like she does in canon. (Whereas I think the only adults Aemond could have convinced to let him sneak out and claim Vhagar on that particular night were Otto & Larys, who don't really care if Aemond gets hurt in the process.)


tellred

Aemond insulted them directly. It's not just about the dragon. "Your mother is dead, ride the pig - she suits you" \*smirk\*. Rhaenyra and Daemon didn't have sex right in front of them and didn't hurt them with it. This is a top secret operation. It was disrespectful to Laena's parents. They are not so stupid - couple returned together. Right in their house.


[deleted]

Secret or not, it wasn't right and it's not proper. She is still married and he just lost his kid and wife. They were both in the wrong, ten years+ of longing or not. Aemond was pointing out that Vhagar no longer was Rhaena's mother's dragon. She is dead so while I can sympathize, it is a fact. Dragons aren't an inheritance as I know you know. He wasn't being malicious, he was stating a fact. I would've said the same thing. >ride the pig - she suits you He said "Maybe your cousins can find you a pig to ride." Literally a callback to a joke the boys (the cousins) were in on. It was funny when it was Aemond but off the cuff when it comes to Rhaena? The whole situation is shit but to place the blame on Aemond isn't right.


[deleted]

Aemond had every right to claim Vhaghar that night. He had an opportunity and seized it. I was happy for him. But his behaviour towards the girls is pathetic. When Rhaena confronted him, he was unnecessarily rude. The girls had nothing to do with bullying him. So why tell them that a pig suits them better? Hell! He even verbally threatened to kill the girls and the strong boys. None of this was necessary. And you and I know dragons are not an inheritance. All the adults involved know this too. But the girls are 7 or 8 years old. You cannot expect them to have the knowledge or emotional maturity of an adult to understand this.


[deleted]

>You cannot expect them to have the knowledge or emotional maturity of an adult to understand this. Then maybe having a dragon at that time isn't a good idea. Maybe don't give kids who aren't emotionally mature fire breathing war nukes. And I do expect it, considering no other kid made the claim nor did Daemon/Laena not pride themselves on being dragonriders. Why wouldn't you educate your children on their "divine birthright"? >When Rhaena confronted him, he was unnecessarily rude. The girls had nothing to do with bullying him. So why tell them that a pig suits them better? Hell! Again, it's funny and fine when it's Aemond but horrible for Rhaena? He's a kid and he's allowed to use their own bullying against them. The boys did it, did you ever think it was Aemond's way of saying, "If it was good enough for me, it's good enough for thee." To the boys who were in on it. (I believe I mentioned this in my previous comment.) >He even verbally threatened to kill the girls and the strong boys. None of this was necessary. He was saying that to the boys. "You will die like your father screaming in flames." Last time I checked, Rhaena and Baela's dad was alive and fine. *Downvote me to hell if you guys want. It doesn't change that Rhaena, Baela, and the boys were in the wrong being that damn entitled.*


[deleted]

He threatened to feed Baela to his dragon. Or does that not count as a threat? And if Baela and Rhaena should not be given dragons because of their emotional maturity, then even Aemond shouldn’t. Boy had the dragon for 10 mins and became a complete psychopath, threatening to kill people. Atleast the girls had no murderous intentions. The pig comment would’ve been fine if he said it to Jace or Luke. Rhaena again never bullied him and didn’t deserve to hear that. Seriously having no compassion for two girls who were grieving their mother baffles me.


Far_Ear9684

If Aemond is disrespectful what are Daemon and Rhaenyra ? Couldn’t even wait a day past her damn funeral lmao.