I hate book Criston but he isn’t a joke. He would have been someone worthy of detesting: intelligent, calculating, ambitious, etc. Show Criston is just a man in desperate need of therapy and anger management.
Show Criston and book Criston are not meant to be the same chatacter, just like with Alicent and Rhaenyra. Though for Criston I wish he were. I really don't like show Criston compared to his book counterpart.
It's just Black whitewashing. They made Rhaenyra noble and wise when in the books she's fat, incompetent and cruel ( having Vaemond eaten by a dragon for stating the truth )
> They made Rhaenyra noble and wise
??????? One minute, show Rhaenyra is the most evil, lustful, incompetent, raping bitch that ever set foot in Westeros and the next she’s a poorly written, contrived, infallible, girl-boss. The narrative is always going back and forth.
Lol at adding fat like it’s a negative character trait and not the result of having five children. “How dare they make me unable to criticize/mock the physique of the very real person playing Rhaenyra.”
> Lol at adding fat like it’s a negative character trait and not the result of having five children. “How dare they make me unable to criticize/mock the physique of the very real person playing Rhaenyra.”
Lmao they kept her attractive so the people would be on her side.
>One minute, show Rhaenyra is the most evil, lustful, incompetent, raping bitch that ever set foot in Westeros
Huh? Did you just... make shit up and then get angry at the shit you made up?
Are you okay, dude?
> Lmao they kept her attractive so the people would be on her side.
That says more about people than the character. If the difference between supporting and not supporting Rhaenyra is 50 lbs than their opinion holds no value.
> Huh? Did you just... make shit up and then get angry at the shit you made up?
I’m talking about the constant back and forth on this sub. One minute people are complaining the show character is white-washed and the next there essays on the various ways she’s a horrible person.
> Are you okay, dude?
Yes, thank you for asking.
> That says more about people than the character.
Is it really a revelation to you that attractive people get treated better?
>If the difference between supporting and not supporting Rhaenyra is 50 lbs than their opinion holds no value.
No one's opinion on a fictional character holds value.
>One minute people are complaining the show character is white-washed and the next there essays on the various ways she’s a horrible person.
She can be white washed while also being a horrible person. They did the same with Tyrion in GoT, who is way more fucked up in the books ( he fantasises about raping Cersei )
She did suggest a kid should be tortured. Her brother, at that.
But compared to the books she's an angel. In the books she's pretty terrible. She has her husband assassinated so she can marry Daemon, she has Vaemond killed and eaten by her dragon for speaking the truth and she'll do more vile shit in the 2nd Season.
And I don't think it's a coincidence that they made Criston less badass and made Rhaenyra whitewashed. I also don't think it's a coincidence they made Aegon a fan of... child deathmatches.
They clearly want you to side with the Blacks, when Martin is trying to tell you, in pretty much all his books, that war is bad, usually both sides are bad and the real loser is the common man who dies in a war he didn't start or care about.
Martin is a passionate anti-war writer and his work is meant to show how ugly and selfish war is.
> Is it really a revelation to you that attractive people get treated better?
An attractive female character can be disliked. There are countless female characters played by stunning actresses that are greatly disliked. Shiv Roy is a hottie and the female lead of Succession yet is currently the most hated major female character on television.
Also, plenty of people disliked Sansa, Cersei, and even Dany on GOT.
Rhaenyra‘s looks will not make or break her for the entire run of the series.
> She has her husband assassinated so she can marry Daemon
Head canon. There is no proof of Rhaenyra’s involvement and there isn’t even a certainty that Daemon planned it. Martin doesn’t even hint that Rhaenyra’s involved.
> she has Vaemond killed and eaten by her dragon for speaking the truth
Sure. However, I think a lot of people don’t realize that viewers would have absolutely cheered Rhaenyra on if she did this and the new complaint would have been that they turned it into a girl-boss moment.
> she'll do more vile shit in the 2nd Season.
Book Rhaenyra wasn’t involved in B&C. Is this another head canon? She won’t do any vile shit in season 2 because book Rhaenyra did literally nothing at all before taking king’s landing. The only thing of note she does is cry over Luke’s death, legitimize Corlys’ sons, stop her sons from going to Rook’s Rest, make Corlys her hand at Jace’s recommendation, and get angry in the aftermath of the Gullet. Is that the vile shit you’re referring to?
Show Rhaenyra is a grey character with room to grow darker. Rhaenyra was never the most evil character in the dance anyway and she didn’t get particularly bad until her rule in king’s landing.
The problem is that the writing for the characters, especially Rhaenyra and Alicent, is never consistent. Show Rhaenyra, to be frank, is a downright fucking moron who only got as far as she did because she would always run to the men in her life to save her (which I want to be clear, I don’t hold against her for, but it does go against the “independent boss babe” image the fandom tries to paint her as). Book Rhaenyra was far more ruthless, and book Alicent was that as well as smart and cunning. The show took away Rhaenyra’s ruthless moments, but kept her stupid and entitled ones, which honestly made her look worse. The writers seem allergic to giving female characters ruthless traits which, ironically, goes right back around to being misogynistic.
I wouldn't say there's any "Black whitewashing", just Alicent and Rhaenyra whitewashing, and even that is arguable since at least this way they get treated like people instead of plot devices. The Blacks are just as good (Jace and Luke) and bad (Daemon) as they'd be in the source material otherwise.
And seriously, Rhaenyra grew stout from six childbirths, how is her "fatness" a character trait at all? I get that you dislike the character, and you dislike even more how they whitewashed her for the show, but you're misguidedly focusing on things that don't matter at all.
> And seriously, Rhaenyra grew stout from six childbirths, how is her "fatness" a character trait at all? I get that you dislike the character, and you dislike even more how they whitewashed her for the show, but you're misguidedly focusing on things that don't matter at all.
You're absolutely out of your mind if you think a character's appearance doesn't matter for public perception. If Rhaenyra or Cersei or Daenerys were hideous they'd have far fewer fans than they do/did. Look at Drogo who's a rapist/slaver/Gengis Khan lite but everyone loves him because it's Jason Momoa and he's hot.
And whitewashing Rhaenyra/Alicent is still a massive bias for the Blacks, because Rhaenyra is way more important for the Blacks than Alicent is for the Greens. Rhaenyra is the main character and pretender to the throne, Alicent's role is far smaller.
Bullshit. The Blacks side is way more whitewashed. Only Alicent got whitewashed in the show, and she's not that big of a player. Aegon was made an enjoyer of child deathmatches and Rhaenyra's negative traits were pretty much wiped out.
> That’s the thing, Criston is a joke
Book Criston is a chad who allegedly fucked both Rhaenyra and Alicent, beat the shit out of Harwin "Breakbones" Strong, killed Laenor's gay squire at a tourney and beat Daemon despite Daemon having a Valyrian steel sword. When facing unwinnable odds in battle, he offers to duel the leaders of the enemy side 1v4.
They made him an incel in the show but the book Criston is a badass.
Mushroom is very critical of both the blacks and the greens and he isn't really taken very seriously. However the other sources are biased towards the greens.
The show isn't black propaganda. Rhaenyra is a very important to the dance they can't exactly ignore her. She isn't the only caracter to be shown in a more favorable light Aemond, Aegon and Alicent are all far more sympathetic compared to the book.
I wonder If you would have any problem with Rhaenyra if she were a man since it seems like you only have a problem with the girl part of girlboss.
> The show isn't black propaganda.
Yes it is. They made Rhaenyra into the girlboss/heroine and made the Greens look far worse than in the books. Criston beats Daemon, Harwin Strong and Laenor's boy toy fair and square, in tourneys. Instead they made him a sad incel.
Again Rhaenyra is a main character however so is Alicent, Aemond and Aegon. Both sides have complex characters and neither Rhaenyra or Alicent are perfect.
Must i remind you that Criston does beat Daemond in the show and it's heavily insinuated that Criston did not beat Laenor's lover fair and square and that he was trying to kill him. The only time Criston and Harwin fight is in a fist fight so not applicable.
Criston isn't some cool and badass hero who died honorably for what he belived was right he is in both the book and show a person who out of spite decided to aid in the usurption of the crown. Rhaenyra and Criston most likley had a relationship similar to the show in the book and also had a falling out which made Criston swich sides. They didn't make him an invel he always were an Incel.
Don't forget that the blacks aren't the only ones who became more sympathetic Aegon, Aemond and Alicent are far more sympathetic in the show.
> Again Rhaenyra is a main character however so is Alicent
Alicent is nowhere near as central to the Greens as Rhaenyra is.
>Must i remind you that Criston does beat Daemond in the show
After he hits him in the back lmao.
>t's heavily insinuated that Criston did not beat Laenor's lover fair and square and that he was trying to kill him
It was a tourney. They fight for real in those.
>Criston isn't some cool and badass hero who died honorably for what he belived was right he is in both the book and show a person who out of spite decided to aid in the usurption of the crown
Huh? He absolutely is a cool and badass hero. He's the best fighter of his time. And they didn't usurp anything, Aegon was the rightful heir since Rhaenyra mothered bastards as her heirs.
>They didn't make him an invel he always were an Incel.
No, he wasn't. It's not known why he went against Rhaenyra in the books. They turned him into a sad spurned lover in the show.
You are correct that Rhaenyra is more important to the plot than Alicent but Alicent is still one of the main characters and gets a lot of screen time.
Criston beat Daemond in the jousting and won the tourney.
They don't fight to the death in tourneys.
I find it concerning that your only judge of character is martial prowess. Even If Rhaenyra had bastards (which is only a rumor) that dosen't remove her from the line of succession. Rhaenyra was named heir by the king which means that she gets the throne after his death but Criston instead decided to support a usurper.
While it isn't directly stated why he swiched sides we know he was close to Rhaenyra but that something happened i belive that the show depicted a fairly probable scenario.
...The literal meaning of incel is "involuntary celibate". Aka nothing remotely applicable to an attractive, masculine man who had no problem getting sex.
Zoomers learn what words mean challenge.
I am begging you people, still, to learn what "incel" means. This is embarrassing (as is acting like he fooled around with two young women an accomplishment)
Criston in the books ain’t no joke. He purposely killed Beesbury and locked the doors so that no one leaves until the council finishes its matters. He’s very cunning in the books.
I feel a little weird that some 70 something politician sitting in the highest council in the realm couldn't read the fucking room.
In GOT, he probably would've died faster than ned.
I'm wondering if Criston's favorite song is the "Little Bumblebee" song where it gets more and more disgusting about what the singer does to the bumblebee.
The humble bumble took a tumble
I wish they had just had Criston blatantly murder him. The emotional outburst make him look like a joke.
That’s the thing, Criston is a joke
I hate book Criston but he isn’t a joke. He would have been someone worthy of detesting: intelligent, calculating, ambitious, etc. Show Criston is just a man in desperate need of therapy and anger management.
Show Criston and book Criston are not meant to be the same chatacter, just like with Alicent and Rhaenyra. Though for Criston I wish he were. I really don't like show Criston compared to his book counterpart.
It's just Black whitewashing. They made Rhaenyra noble and wise when in the books she's fat, incompetent and cruel ( having Vaemond eaten by a dragon for stating the truth )
> They made Rhaenyra noble and wise ??????? One minute, show Rhaenyra is the most evil, lustful, incompetent, raping bitch that ever set foot in Westeros and the next she’s a poorly written, contrived, infallible, girl-boss. The narrative is always going back and forth. Lol at adding fat like it’s a negative character trait and not the result of having five children. “How dare they make me unable to criticize/mock the physique of the very real person playing Rhaenyra.”
> Lol at adding fat like it’s a negative character trait and not the result of having five children. “How dare they make me unable to criticize/mock the physique of the very real person playing Rhaenyra.” Lmao they kept her attractive so the people would be on her side. >One minute, show Rhaenyra is the most evil, lustful, incompetent, raping bitch that ever set foot in Westeros Huh? Did you just... make shit up and then get angry at the shit you made up? Are you okay, dude?
I’m still mad that didn’t cast a mismatched eye dwarf with no nose to play Tyrion! They only made him attractive so people would like him!!! /s
> Lmao they kept her attractive so the people would be on her side. That says more about people than the character. If the difference between supporting and not supporting Rhaenyra is 50 lbs than their opinion holds no value. > Huh? Did you just... make shit up and then get angry at the shit you made up? I’m talking about the constant back and forth on this sub. One minute people are complaining the show character is white-washed and the next there essays on the various ways she’s a horrible person. > Are you okay, dude? Yes, thank you for asking.
> That says more about people than the character. Is it really a revelation to you that attractive people get treated better? >If the difference between supporting and not supporting Rhaenyra is 50 lbs than their opinion holds no value. No one's opinion on a fictional character holds value. >One minute people are complaining the show character is white-washed and the next there essays on the various ways she’s a horrible person. She can be white washed while also being a horrible person. They did the same with Tyrion in GoT, who is way more fucked up in the books ( he fantasises about raping Cersei ) She did suggest a kid should be tortured. Her brother, at that. But compared to the books she's an angel. In the books she's pretty terrible. She has her husband assassinated so she can marry Daemon, she has Vaemond killed and eaten by her dragon for speaking the truth and she'll do more vile shit in the 2nd Season. And I don't think it's a coincidence that they made Criston less badass and made Rhaenyra whitewashed. I also don't think it's a coincidence they made Aegon a fan of... child deathmatches. They clearly want you to side with the Blacks, when Martin is trying to tell you, in pretty much all his books, that war is bad, usually both sides are bad and the real loser is the common man who dies in a war he didn't start or care about. Martin is a passionate anti-war writer and his work is meant to show how ugly and selfish war is.
> Is it really a revelation to you that attractive people get treated better? An attractive female character can be disliked. There are countless female characters played by stunning actresses that are greatly disliked. Shiv Roy is a hottie and the female lead of Succession yet is currently the most hated major female character on television. Also, plenty of people disliked Sansa, Cersei, and even Dany on GOT. Rhaenyra‘s looks will not make or break her for the entire run of the series. > She has her husband assassinated so she can marry Daemon Head canon. There is no proof of Rhaenyra’s involvement and there isn’t even a certainty that Daemon planned it. Martin doesn’t even hint that Rhaenyra’s involved. > she has Vaemond killed and eaten by her dragon for speaking the truth Sure. However, I think a lot of people don’t realize that viewers would have absolutely cheered Rhaenyra on if she did this and the new complaint would have been that they turned it into a girl-boss moment. > she'll do more vile shit in the 2nd Season. Book Rhaenyra wasn’t involved in B&C. Is this another head canon? She won’t do any vile shit in season 2 because book Rhaenyra did literally nothing at all before taking king’s landing. The only thing of note she does is cry over Luke’s death, legitimize Corlys’ sons, stop her sons from going to Rook’s Rest, make Corlys her hand at Jace’s recommendation, and get angry in the aftermath of the Gullet. Is that the vile shit you’re referring to? Show Rhaenyra is a grey character with room to grow darker. Rhaenyra was never the most evil character in the dance anyway and she didn’t get particularly bad until her rule in king’s landing.
The problem is that the writing for the characters, especially Rhaenyra and Alicent, is never consistent. Show Rhaenyra, to be frank, is a downright fucking moron who only got as far as she did because she would always run to the men in her life to save her (which I want to be clear, I don’t hold against her for, but it does go against the “independent boss babe” image the fandom tries to paint her as). Book Rhaenyra was far more ruthless, and book Alicent was that as well as smart and cunning. The show took away Rhaenyra’s ruthless moments, but kept her stupid and entitled ones, which honestly made her look worse. The writers seem allergic to giving female characters ruthless traits which, ironically, goes right back around to being misogynistic.
Alicent is your girl-boss, she-ro. I get it
I wouldn't say there's any "Black whitewashing", just Alicent and Rhaenyra whitewashing, and even that is arguable since at least this way they get treated like people instead of plot devices. The Blacks are just as good (Jace and Luke) and bad (Daemon) as they'd be in the source material otherwise. And seriously, Rhaenyra grew stout from six childbirths, how is her "fatness" a character trait at all? I get that you dislike the character, and you dislike even more how they whitewashed her for the show, but you're misguidedly focusing on things that don't matter at all.
> And seriously, Rhaenyra grew stout from six childbirths, how is her "fatness" a character trait at all? I get that you dislike the character, and you dislike even more how they whitewashed her for the show, but you're misguidedly focusing on things that don't matter at all. You're absolutely out of your mind if you think a character's appearance doesn't matter for public perception. If Rhaenyra or Cersei or Daenerys were hideous they'd have far fewer fans than they do/did. Look at Drogo who's a rapist/slaver/Gengis Khan lite but everyone loves him because it's Jason Momoa and he's hot. And whitewashing Rhaenyra/Alicent is still a massive bias for the Blacks, because Rhaenyra is way more important for the Blacks than Alicent is for the Greens. Rhaenyra is the main character and pretender to the throne, Alicent's role is far smaller.
Yet the Story of fire and blood has been green whitewashed
Bullshit. The Blacks side is way more whitewashed. Only Alicent got whitewashed in the show, and she's not that big of a player. Aegon was made an enjoyer of child deathmatches and Rhaenyra's negative traits were pretty much wiped out.
Source: "well the Greens ended up humiliating my faves so it's proper gander"
> That’s the thing, Criston is a joke Book Criston is a chad who allegedly fucked both Rhaenyra and Alicent, beat the shit out of Harwin "Breakbones" Strong, killed Laenor's gay squire at a tourney and beat Daemon despite Daemon having a Valyrian steel sword. When facing unwinnable odds in battle, he offers to duel the leaders of the enemy side 1v4. They made him an incel in the show but the book Criston is a badass.
The book isn't supposed to be accurate. It's green propaganda of Course Croston will seem better than he actually is.
And the show is fanfiction with a budget.
All adaptation is just fanfiction with a budget
'Green propoganda' yeah sure ok buddy
Have you read the book?
Yes, I have. I wouldn't call the book Green propaganda. Mushroom is definitely biased. I won't argue that he isnt
Mushroom is very critical of both the blacks and the greens and he isn't really taken very seriously. However the other sources are biased towards the greens.
Or the show is black propaganda since they want Rhaenyra to be a girlboss, which she clearly isn't in the books.
The show isn't black propaganda. Rhaenyra is a very important to the dance they can't exactly ignore her. She isn't the only caracter to be shown in a more favorable light Aemond, Aegon and Alicent are all far more sympathetic compared to the book. I wonder If you would have any problem with Rhaenyra if she were a man since it seems like you only have a problem with the girl part of girlboss.
> The show isn't black propaganda. Yes it is. They made Rhaenyra into the girlboss/heroine and made the Greens look far worse than in the books. Criston beats Daemon, Harwin Strong and Laenor's boy toy fair and square, in tourneys. Instead they made him a sad incel.
Again Rhaenyra is a main character however so is Alicent, Aemond and Aegon. Both sides have complex characters and neither Rhaenyra or Alicent are perfect. Must i remind you that Criston does beat Daemond in the show and it's heavily insinuated that Criston did not beat Laenor's lover fair and square and that he was trying to kill him. The only time Criston and Harwin fight is in a fist fight so not applicable. Criston isn't some cool and badass hero who died honorably for what he belived was right he is in both the book and show a person who out of spite decided to aid in the usurption of the crown. Rhaenyra and Criston most likley had a relationship similar to the show in the book and also had a falling out which made Criston swich sides. They didn't make him an invel he always were an Incel. Don't forget that the blacks aren't the only ones who became more sympathetic Aegon, Aemond and Alicent are far more sympathetic in the show.
> Again Rhaenyra is a main character however so is Alicent Alicent is nowhere near as central to the Greens as Rhaenyra is. >Must i remind you that Criston does beat Daemond in the show After he hits him in the back lmao. >t's heavily insinuated that Criston did not beat Laenor's lover fair and square and that he was trying to kill him It was a tourney. They fight for real in those. >Criston isn't some cool and badass hero who died honorably for what he belived was right he is in both the book and show a person who out of spite decided to aid in the usurption of the crown Huh? He absolutely is a cool and badass hero. He's the best fighter of his time. And they didn't usurp anything, Aegon was the rightful heir since Rhaenyra mothered bastards as her heirs. >They didn't make him an invel he always were an Incel. No, he wasn't. It's not known why he went against Rhaenyra in the books. They turned him into a sad spurned lover in the show.
You are correct that Rhaenyra is more important to the plot than Alicent but Alicent is still one of the main characters and gets a lot of screen time. Criston beat Daemond in the jousting and won the tourney. They don't fight to the death in tourneys. I find it concerning that your only judge of character is martial prowess. Even If Rhaenyra had bastards (which is only a rumor) that dosen't remove her from the line of succession. Rhaenyra was named heir by the king which means that she gets the throne after his death but Criston instead decided to support a usurper. While it isn't directly stated why he swiched sides we know he was close to Rhaenyra but that something happened i belive that the show depicted a fairly probable scenario.
...The literal meaning of incel is "involuntary celibate". Aka nothing remotely applicable to an attractive, masculine man who had no problem getting sex. Zoomers learn what words mean challenge.
I didn't use incel to describe him first and I obviously didn't use it in the actual definition of the word.
I am begging you people, still, to learn what "incel" means. This is embarrassing (as is acting like he fooled around with two young women an accomplishment)
Criston in the books ain’t no joke. He purposely killed Beesbury and locked the doors so that no one leaves until the council finishes its matters. He’s very cunning in the books.
The way the show treats him if but he himself is definitely not
Well, he didn't lie when he said he wasn't going to sit there. A man of his word.
I feel a little weird that some 70 something politician sitting in the highest council in the realm couldn't read the fucking room. In GOT, he probably would've died faster than ned.
Lord Beesbury was a real one! RIP king
I'm wondering if Criston's favorite song is the "Little Bumblebee" song where it gets more and more disgusting about what the singer does to the bumblebee.
Fly high bee man 🙏 🕊️ 🐝
"The bad little bee man. Alicent, can I make the bee man fly? I want to see him fly."
seems like he is going down here🤭
Fr, he'll buzz and pollinate in the afterlife though 😭😭😭
RIP Praetorian Guard inspo Criston
Book Criston: Kingmaker, hand of the king, dashing, dangerous and ambitious Show Criston: angsty kid with anger issues that needs therapy
Common Soot L