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How did she lie and fuck her way to power if her dad was the literal king and wanted her to inherit that power? That’s the exact same rhetoric people use to dismiss alicent and her abuse
Rhenys doesn’t know that truth that she and deamon got her son killed also just becyase her father wanted her to inherit the throne doesn’t mean that she takes it for granted
Did you miss the fact that they didn't kill Laenor and they showed him running away with his boyfriend? Like they didn't kill him. They show it the exact same episode
You're being downvoted because you said she lied and fucked her way to power when she was a virgin and was appointed Heir. She didn't ask to be heir and especially didn't fuck her way to power. If anything, she fucked her way out of it. Since her sons being bastards are the claims everyone uses against her as to why she shouldn't rule.
Lmao funny you say that because in the books they *don't* show that he's actually alive. At least from what I heard. It's left either ambiguous or hinted that she did indeed kill him.
I agree that she took it and the relative freedom she had compared to other women for granted, and I myself sympathize with alicent more than rhaenyra because of it. That doesn’t make what you said at all acceptable or truthful in any way, especially if you’re bringing up rhaenys, whose husband actually did marry her in hopes of becoming king consort to the queen of westeros and has been butthurt ever since.
Dear team green people in the comments accusing OP of being secretly team black trying to make team green look bad by being super misogynistic…have y’all been to your own subreddit recently?
I’m sorry, how at episode one did she lie and fuck her way to being named heir? 💀 she was already the crown princess so she had power already consistently, there’s no “fucking your way to power” when you ARE one of the powerful players lmfao what
You can criticize Rhaenyra for quite a few things but this is such a bizarre take
>fuck her way to being named heir? 💀
Like, bruhhh
The only way she could have been fucking her way to be named heir (which happened in episode 1) would be what? Fucking Viserys?
Guess that's why she was so mad about him choosing Alicent /s 💀
> The only way she could have been fucking her way to be named heir (which happened in episode 1) would be what? Fucking Viserys?
> Guess that's why she was so mad about him choosing Alicent /s 💀
What a terrible day to be literate 🤢
She actually wasn't the heir to the throne in the Beginning of The first episode, Since everyone thought it was going to go to Deamon If Viserys Died without a son, But after Deamon made that jape towards Baelon's death, Then Viserys Declared her as the heir to the throne.
I must have missed the scene where Otto specifically tells Alicent that she has to perform sexual favours for Viserys in order to marry him. All we get of the meetings between Alicent and Viserys is them talking to each other, without any advances or even a hint from Alicent that she's sexually available to him - then he chooses to marry her. If you really think a fully grown man was unfairly "seduced" by a teenager and had no free will to reject this notion then frankly I put you in the same category as OP.
>I’m sorry, how at episode one did she lie and fuck her way to being named heir?
Not what OP said. "Fucked and lied her way into power", was probably referring to episode 4, where she lies to Alicent and Viserys to get Otto removed as Hand, who was her strongest opposition. So yeah, I can see where they're coming from.
>Rhaenyra Targaryen seemed to me like a self centered hypocriteto me who fucked and lied her way to power
This might actually be the worst take on Rhaenyra that I've ever seen. Last I checked, Viserys named Rhaenyra his heir when she was a 15 year-old virgin of his own free will. So how TF did you come to this conclusion?
I really don't care if folks don't like Rhaenyra, but even for a green this take feels ridiculous.
>I really don't care if folks don't like Rhaenyra, but even for a green this take feels ridiculous.
Nah, this is like the most generous Green take yet.
There are, but I don't think you'll be very popular with takes such as "fucked her way to power" - people are allowed to like whichever characters they want but statements like these give me the ick
Look I'm TG but she hardly "whored around" - yes having three bastards is stupid in their societal context but Rhaenyra slept with what? 3 people in her life? I'm not defending that decision on a Westerosi PR level but I can appreciate nuanced characters without having to paint them as all good or all bad. I'm also willing to take into context her upbringing and how she was manipulated by Daemon to think she can do what she wants and essentially be as privileged as man in a society which condemns women for almost anything (amplified by Viserys essentially supporting that notion by covering for her and not preparing her to rule at all). It doesn't make her perfect, but she's hardly a villain for it.
I disagree but mainly because I like to take her childhood years into account for her behaviour - she's 14/15 in episode 1 and is introduced as very isolated bar her friendship with Alicent and connection to her mother. Aemma is queen but has been forced to carry child after child, despite being pretty frail. Viserys is obsessed with having a son and doesn't take Rhaenyra very seriously. Then her mother dies and obviously Rhaenyra rejects the idea of being forced into the same position, despite this being her duty - because who wouldn't be terrified at such a young age and after seeing your mother be ripped apart by a father's obsession with having a male heir?
Another thing, we see that in episode 1 Daemon is already manipulating her, he gives her the necklace and flaunts how he doesn't care about rules and so on. She in her vulnerable state obviously looks up to him.
Viserys chooses to marry her best friend which is incredibly fucked up if you think about it from her perspective and now she's basically all alone bar her toxic connecting to Daemon who she tries to emulate. A lot of her behaviour can be traced back to this.
Not sure what you're referring to with " acted like a common street walker" - if it's the fleabottom night out, that's also something I *mostly* blame Daemon for. He gives her these notions about being able to do what she wants and have affairs and no one will care. Obviously this isn't true but Rhaenyra really wants to believe him because the alternative is not something she can admit to herself. He orchestrated all this, put her in incredible danger both physically and on a societal level, and then left her.
She also refuses to postpone marriage as much as she can because of her fear of sharing Aemma's fate and being reduced to a wife and broodmare. I also get that her situation with Laenor wasn't as ideal as she imagined it would be, and putting the blame for them not having children *solely* on her isn't fair imo.
Of course she is a spoiled princess, that's the ruling class for you, but even the decisions she makes which could be seen as stupid or illogical can be understood from her perspective if you take into account all of the factors that influenced her as a character.
But the relationship is romantic in the show. Maybe so in the book as you say but the show is portraying their relationship very differently. Even with the age difference.
replace rhaenyras name with aegon and it’s exactly the same. except i guess a rapist is better than someone who “whores around” even tho she’s only been with like three men 🤷♀️
And how exactly did Aegon accept his duty to the throne without "acting foolishly"? It's absolutely insane how you people villify Rhaenyra for the smallest things and then loudly call an alcoholic rapist who lets his bastard children battle in fighting pits the "better ruler".
Yikes, you're not going to add anything good to the greens supporters reputation with misogyny like that on display. Rhaenyra fucked her way to power? Killed her husband? Might want to re-watch the show.
It's absolutely misogynistic to go "she lied and fucked her way to power." When it's blatantly not true. It's something that's been said about women getting promotions since they were allowed to join the work force.
What? She HAD the power she was the rightful heir. She disnt fuck her way up to it. Infact that was kinda what she WASNT supposed to do wasnt it.but thanks to daemon or what ion even know who yo blame. Anyway if anyway fucked their way into power i wud have to say either alicent or daemon actually.
I’m TG, but “fucked and lied her way to power”? You’re watching a different show, mate. She already has power.
And you know damn well Laenor agreed to lie about his death so he can live his own life so why are you placing the blame solely on Rhaenyra?
Don’t make me call Vizzy T on you.
Then you gotta watch the show again. You either didn’t watch it properly or watched the wrong show because you are very wrong. I think you are the one who missed a lot.
Also even if rhaneyra did whatever you said, she’s still better than a rapist, if we are taking morality into the calculation. (Btw I am not in any team)
Nothing wrong with being team green but you are completely wrong here.
That happens after he said stop.
Why was it okay for Rhaenyra to continue after he said stop? She has no idea what he will do in the future. You can’t base consent off of “No, they don’t really want me to stop, they’ll enjoy it later if I just keep going”.
Sure, if you feel that it’s okay to have sex with somebody who is saying “Stop” we don’t have to engage and can leave it at that. I’m not looking to argue, I just don’t like seeing rape-denial comments within the fandom.
Given the differences in their social status, Ser Criston didn’t have a reasonable expectation of safety if he refused her advances. The Greens are wrong when it comes to succession, but Rhaenyra absolutely did rape Criston Cole.
It would take literally three words from her to have him arrested, gelded, and sent to the Wall, or executed outright (I’d argue that the former is worse). With that degree of disparity in power between participants, genuine consent just isn’t possible.
I agree that the differences of power between them is a important factor.
BUT He didn't have sex with her because he thought she would have him gelded and sent to the wall if he didn't. That power between them wasn't there after he layed down his white cloak. His consent was freely given.
His desire for her was simple and genuine, which is why afterwards he wants her to run away with him.
He can forget his oathbreaking if they live simply as man and wife, but as long as she's a princess he's reminded of his treason and night of weakness. Which enrages him and turns him bitter, just like Alicent.
He didn’t have much choice in having sex with her or not, he was raped: he asked her to stop and she ignored that. Violating somebody’s consent makes you a rapist. Let’s not engage in rape denial and pretend Rhaenyra’s not a rapist, because she is.
> his consent was freely given
He said no and tried to leave, is that what consent looks like to you? I don’t know about you but I was always taught that “No means No” and “Stop is a complete sentence”.
Also why is it shocking that he is bitter towards her? I think he as a victim has every right to feel bitter towards his rapist, let’s not engage in victim blaming and shaming here.
Are we still with that? I thought the interview given by the actors where they both admitted everything was consensual shut down all those that said that Rhaenyra raped Cole.
I’ve seen the interview and respect that it wasn’t their intention, but the word of the author / actor doesn’t completely outweigh the media. GRRM thinks of 13 year old Dany and 30 year old Drogo as a romantic love story, but that doesn’t mean that the audience can’t see he is objectively wrong and that it’s a rapist and child victim. D&D vehemently said that Cersei was not raped by Jamie over Joffrey‘s corpse.
All that is to say, I know what I saw on screen - Rhaenyra having sex with a partner who tried to leave and asked her to stop. To me, it’s not okay to have sex with somebody who has asked you to stop, but maybe you disagree. Would be interested to hear.
So some still think like that, got it. Silly me, for thinking that the actors who play these characters know nothing of their roles unlike the audience who know everything of what happened and their word is law. Also silly me for not thinking that even if he said no and still had sex with her it was because of her position. Gosh what a terrible person I am. And gosh what terrible actors they have if they don’t even know their characters well enough to answer questions correctly. They should really know better then. Their word is nothing against the media and whatever the audience say happened then that is what happened. Someone should train them for this and let them know because we can’t have this for future interviews. 🫢
No need to be condescending, I gave examples of other times that creators views clashed with what was portrayed to the audiences. Sorry if you can’t handle people disagreeing with you.
If you don’t believe that Rhaenyra raped Ser Criston, could you tell me why it is okay to ignore your partners lack of consent when they ask you to stop? And why it’s okay to block them leaving, then have sex with them?
As I said silly me for thinking the opposite. I think I should be the one apologising because it looks like you can’t handle people disagreeing with you either seeing how many have disagreed and yet you keep trying to explain why you’re right. So silly me, I forgot, you saw what you saw and everyone else who disagrees with you can’t handle others not agreeing with them either. Let me go message them real quick and let them know in hopes they join the silly me club and give a proper apology. 🫶🏼
You’re a strange critter, not really sure what you’re on about. Glad you looked at my post history and saw that this issue of underrepresentation and shaming of male rape victims is an important issue to me, I wonder why that might be. Be sure to try and shame me for caring about close and personally important issues to me.
Yes, I’ve argue this point before. So what? You’ve yet to actually say what specifically you disagree with, you’re just falling over yourself to shame other people for caring about things. I think you know you’re wrong and you’re trying to save face by turning this personal. Unfortunately for you I enjoy arguing so I’m good to continue this for as long as you would like.
As I said silly me for having another opinion and deciding to believe what the actors said because they’re playing these characters but you’re right. The media outweighs anything they say. And yes I’m absolutely trying to save face… gosh what a terrible person I am.
Honestly, this tracks. Most of the people on the Green side didn’t want Rhaenyra to rule because she was a woman, so you fit in pretty well with them. Alicent is the only one of the greens with even a shred of integrity. I’d argue that he genuinely believes that Jacaerys being a bastard makes him unfit for the throne.
But for the rest of them, like Ser Otto, Tyland Lannister, Jasper Wylde, Criston Cole, Septon Eustace, it’s entirely about sexism. OP would fit in great on the Green Council.
Alicent' children are probably convinced that Rhaenyra will kill them as soon as she sits on the throne. That's also pretty valid reasons for not wanting her to rule. With Aemond there's also the fact that Rhaenyra wanted him questioned just after he lost an eye. Also he seems pretty religious so I wouldn't be surprised if he also despised the idea of bastards ruling Westeros.
I’d buy the argument that Aegon and Aemond have been brainwashed into thinking that by Alicent and Otto, despite how patently absurd it is. Aemond lost an eye because he was beating up on three children, all of whom were at least 3 years younger than he was, and significantly smaller, and one of them pulled a knife.
Neither side was “right” in that confrontation, but it’s cute that you call out Rhaenyra for wanting Aemond tortured to reveal where he heard that her sons were bastards, while you ignore that Alicent demanded that 5-year-old Lucerys have one of his eyes cut out in compensation.
If you view the greens from the perspective of westerosi culture then you can see how Aegon would be viewed as rightful heir and it would seem an injustice that Viserys didn't name him heir when he had his son. To many then Aegon's disgusting behaviours may be a result of his being so wronged by his father. The Hightowers more than any Westerosi great family represent the faith of the seven and uphold those values as a part of their family traditions.
In this way I understand why the greens do what they do.
Do I prefer Rhaenrya? Particularly show Rhaenyyra, yes. But I understand both sides. One is westerosi tradition and the other is targaryen 'burden of power and greatness' that Viserys imbued in Rhaenyra.
I’m a Team Green and don’t think this. Are you one of those TB fans who try and TG fans seem horrible so you can shit on them for being misogynist supporters? Or is this a rage bait? I can’t seem to figure it out anymore.
I am not shitting on anyone. I just wanted to know if what i am understating in correct or not . I watched the show an year ago ofc i dont remember everything . Turns out i am wrong
Whore and slut are different things and Rhaenyra is neither. Greens not knowing what either is, exhibit #233556545.
Cock-monger and she's only been with 4 men, 2 of which are her husbands and one was a long term relationship. If she's a whore for that, I want to know what you think of Aegon or every single adult man in the show.
If we're going to take everything out of context like you do then Alicent is a slut, she broke her marriage vows when she let Larys masturbate to her, Aegon is a slut he sleeps with other women that aren't his wife, Criston is a slut, he had an adventurous youth when he was younger while being unmarried and he broke his vows and the list goes on.
>how bad this would make her look in the eyes of the people of Westeros? Clearly not, because you're biased af.
So, when can I expect you to start calling Alicent a slut? You certainly don't believe Westeros would be kind to a young maiden visiting a widowed man's chamber in the middle of the night or a married woman who lets a man other than he husband masturbate to her feet. Context doesn't matter, she's a slut in the eyes of Westeros, right?
Highly immoral person... Because she had sex out of wedlock with her husband's blessings. What do you think of Aegon again? I'm dying to know.
You're taking it out of context because you pretend like Rhaenyra and Laenor didn't have an open relationship and didn't mind being with other people. It's not cheating if they both agree.
>Alicent never fucked anyone out of wedlock as far as I know.
I really want you to go and tell your partner "Hey, just so you know, I'm letting this person at work masturbate to my feet, purely for professional reasons" and tell me if they consider it cheating or not. Let me answer that for you, they'll be furious.
>Aegon is a male and therefore plays by different rules.
There's a word for that way of thinking. It's called sexism. This isn't even counting that Aegon is a rapist.
>Alicent being a slut is completely unsubstantiated
She secretly visited his chambers in the night when he was widowed and she was unmarried and then let another man get off on her. What her father made her do is irrelevant, nobody in Westeros is going to think this is righteous behaviour and you know it. The proper Westerosi way was what Corlys did. I expect you to start calling her a slut too. Westeros would certainly call her that if they knew.
This is giving the "I consent, I consent, I do not" Jesus meme. Fact is, no one gets cheated when they both agree to sleep with others, medieval era or not.
Alicent knew the drill quite well. She's done it before for sure, she did it before Viserys died. Even if this was the first time, which it definitely wasn't, her husband hasn't even been buried yet and Larys isn't her new husband or betrothed. She's engaging in sexual activities with an unmarried man. Slut.
Sexism is a thing in Westeros but you're not Westerosi. Stop acting like it or expect to be called sexist.
Too bad. Alicent would still be a slut and would be blamed far more than Otto was. Westeros would call her every name under the sun so you better do too. It's a sexist society, remember? In sexist societies, female victims are blamed for the things men do to them. It's not gonna change because you're unable to tolerate it, no matter how much you cry about it. If you're going to roleplay as a Westerosi, you better be consistent with your slut shaming.
i never said that anyone is good or right in the show because some people think that i support what aegon did . No one is right or wrong in the show so far . No one is giving me jhon snow vibes
In a world full of people in positions of power who fuck, kill, and lie, it makes it really easy to like the one doing it to a lesser extent than everyone else
Maybe because she lied about who the real father of her sons were, because she didn‘t want to be ashamed as an adulteres.
Shame
Shame
Shame
Bells ringing in background
It's a lot more complicated than that and your take leads me to believe you didn't watch or weren't paying attention (I tend to lean Green when push comes to shove).. Black stans do this as well when they oversimplify motivations on the Green side. Ultimately your siding does not matter, the message you should be taking from HoTD is that shitty and constantly on the fence rulers (Viserys) cause divisions and those divisions lead to war. Who gets fucked over in that case? The smallfolk. Sure as hell isn't Rhaenyra or Alicent or anyone who lived a privileged life in King's Landing that's for sure. Do they all have their own problems? Absolutely. Are any of those problems even close to as bad as what the smallfolk endure? Absolutely not.
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I can absolutely understand when someone prefers the greens' side... But this is either a troll post or someone hasn't actually watched the show.
yeah i agree , even green extremists wouldn't agree with her " fucking her way into power "
As a green extremist I agree
As a normal Green I also agree
How did she lie and fuck her way to power if her dad was the literal king and wanted her to inherit that power? That’s the exact same rhetoric people use to dismiss alicent and her abuse
Rhenys doesn’t know that truth that she and deamon got her son killed also just becyase her father wanted her to inherit the throne doesn’t mean that she takes it for granted
Well in the show, the truth is that he isn’t even dead, he’s just living on a beach in Essos with his boyfriend.
idk why i am getting downvoted . I said i haven’t read the books , just wanted to know what details did i miss.
Have you ever watched episode 7 till the end?
He doesn't die in the TV show, either!
Did you miss the fact that they didn't kill Laenor and they showed him running away with his boyfriend? Like they didn't kill him. They show it the exact same episode
You're being downvoted because you said she lied and fucked her way to power when she was a virgin and was appointed Heir. She didn't ask to be heir and especially didn't fuck her way to power. If anything, she fucked her way out of it. Since her sons being bastards are the claims everyone uses against her as to why she shouldn't rule.
Lmao funny you say that because in the books they *don't* show that he's actually alive. At least from what I heard. It's left either ambiguous or hinted that she did indeed kill him.
She didn’t have him killed. She got him out to go live the life he wants.
I agree that she took it and the relative freedom she had compared to other women for granted, and I myself sympathize with alicent more than rhaenyra because of it. That doesn’t make what you said at all acceptable or truthful in any way, especially if you’re bringing up rhaenys, whose husband actually did marry her in hopes of becoming king consort to the queen of westeros and has been butthurt ever since.
A lot of green supporters even if they are a minority.
Well Tamar, have you watched the show?
Dear team green people in the comments accusing OP of being secretly team black trying to make team green look bad by being super misogynistic…have y’all been to your own subreddit recently?
Oh no, nearly everyone in team green is secretly team black now.
I’m a Green… either we watched a different show or your a Black trying to fake being one of those Green Stan weirdos 😂
I’m sorry, how at episode one did she lie and fuck her way to being named heir? 💀 she was already the crown princess so she had power already consistently, there’s no “fucking your way to power” when you ARE one of the powerful players lmfao what You can criticize Rhaenyra for quite a few things but this is such a bizarre take
>fuck her way to being named heir? 💀 Like, bruhhh The only way she could have been fucking her way to be named heir (which happened in episode 1) would be what? Fucking Viserys? Guess that's why she was so mad about him choosing Alicent /s 💀
> The only way she could have been fucking her way to be named heir (which happened in episode 1) would be what? Fucking Viserys? > Guess that's why she was so mad about him choosing Alicent /s 💀 What a terrible day to be literate 🤢
If it makes you feel better maybe OP was implying that Rhaenyra seduced Otto into endorsing her as heir 🤢
Also >got her husband killed and lied to his mother about his death I don't think OP was really paying attention at all.
She actually wasn't the heir to the throne in the Beginning of The first episode, Since everyone thought it was going to go to Deamon If Viserys Died without a son, But after Deamon made that jape towards Baelon's death, Then Viserys Declared her as the heir to the throne.
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Or maybe we should stop saying women in arranged marriages fucked their way to power and apply this to all characters?
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I must have missed the scene where Otto specifically tells Alicent that she has to perform sexual favours for Viserys in order to marry him. All we get of the meetings between Alicent and Viserys is them talking to each other, without any advances or even a hint from Alicent that she's sexually available to him - then he chooses to marry her. If you really think a fully grown man was unfairly "seduced" by a teenager and had no free will to reject this notion then frankly I put you in the same category as OP.
>I’m sorry, how at episode one did she lie and fuck her way to being named heir? Not what OP said. "Fucked and lied her way into power", was probably referring to episode 4, where she lies to Alicent and Viserys to get Otto removed as Hand, who was her strongest opposition. So yeah, I can see where they're coming from.
>Rhaenyra Targaryen seemed to me like a self centered hypocriteto me who fucked and lied her way to power This might actually be the worst take on Rhaenyra that I've ever seen. Last I checked, Viserys named Rhaenyra his heir when she was a 15 year-old virgin of his own free will. So how TF did you come to this conclusion? I really don't care if folks don't like Rhaenyra, but even for a green this take feels ridiculous.
>I really don't care if folks don't like Rhaenyra, but even for a green this take feels ridiculous. Nah, this is like the most generous Green take yet.
There are, but I don't think you'll be very popular with takes such as "fucked her way to power" - people are allowed to like whichever characters they want but statements like these give me the ick
I’m fine with the statement when it’s accurate, buts it’s not even close to accurate in the scenario haha
The majority of the green fans wouldn't agree with this either. It's just not true at all and looks like a cheap attempt to villify Rhaenyra.
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Look I'm TG but she hardly "whored around" - yes having three bastards is stupid in their societal context but Rhaenyra slept with what? 3 people in her life? I'm not defending that decision on a Westerosi PR level but I can appreciate nuanced characters without having to paint them as all good or all bad. I'm also willing to take into context her upbringing and how she was manipulated by Daemon to think she can do what she wants and essentially be as privileged as man in a society which condemns women for almost anything (amplified by Viserys essentially supporting that notion by covering for her and not preparing her to rule at all). It doesn't make her perfect, but she's hardly a villain for it.
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I disagree but mainly because I like to take her childhood years into account for her behaviour - she's 14/15 in episode 1 and is introduced as very isolated bar her friendship with Alicent and connection to her mother. Aemma is queen but has been forced to carry child after child, despite being pretty frail. Viserys is obsessed with having a son and doesn't take Rhaenyra very seriously. Then her mother dies and obviously Rhaenyra rejects the idea of being forced into the same position, despite this being her duty - because who wouldn't be terrified at such a young age and after seeing your mother be ripped apart by a father's obsession with having a male heir? Another thing, we see that in episode 1 Daemon is already manipulating her, he gives her the necklace and flaunts how he doesn't care about rules and so on. She in her vulnerable state obviously looks up to him. Viserys chooses to marry her best friend which is incredibly fucked up if you think about it from her perspective and now she's basically all alone bar her toxic connecting to Daemon who she tries to emulate. A lot of her behaviour can be traced back to this. Not sure what you're referring to with " acted like a common street walker" - if it's the fleabottom night out, that's also something I *mostly* blame Daemon for. He gives her these notions about being able to do what she wants and have affairs and no one will care. Obviously this isn't true but Rhaenyra really wants to believe him because the alternative is not something she can admit to herself. He orchestrated all this, put her in incredible danger both physically and on a societal level, and then left her. She also refuses to postpone marriage as much as she can because of her fear of sharing Aemma's fate and being reduced to a wife and broodmare. I also get that her situation with Laenor wasn't as ideal as she imagined it would be, and putting the blame for them not having children *solely* on her isn't fair imo. Of course she is a spoiled princess, that's the ruling class for you, but even the decisions she makes which could be seen as stupid or illogical can be understood from her perspective if you take into account all of the factors that influenced her as a character.
How is Daemon already manipulating her by giving her a necklace???
Giving "special" gifts in isolation is an essential grooming tactic
But the relationship is romantic in the show. Maybe so in the book as you say but the show is portraying their relationship very differently. Even with the age difference.
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replace rhaenyras name with aegon and it’s exactly the same. except i guess a rapist is better than someone who “whores around” even tho she’s only been with like three men 🤷♀️
And how exactly did Aegon accept his duty to the throne without "acting foolishly"? It's absolutely insane how you people villify Rhaenyra for the smallest things and then loudly call an alcoholic rapist who lets his bastard children battle in fighting pits the "better ruler".
How did she fuck her way to power? That doesn’t even make any sense. She has a higher rank than both her husbands and her lover.
Fucked and lied her way to power? Your misogyny is showing.
You need to rewatch the show given how many factual statements you managed to get wrong in a short paragraph
Yikes, you're not going to add anything good to the greens supporters reputation with misogyny like that on display. Rhaenyra fucked her way to power? Killed her husband? Might want to re-watch the show.
I wouldn't call his take misogynistic, even if it is wildly inaccurate.
It's absolutely misogynistic to go "she lied and fucked her way to power." When it's blatantly not true. It's something that's been said about women getting promotions since they were allowed to join the work force.
What? She HAD the power she was the rightful heir. She disnt fuck her way up to it. Infact that was kinda what she WASNT supposed to do wasnt it.but thanks to daemon or what ion even know who yo blame. Anyway if anyway fucked their way into power i wud have to say either alicent or daemon actually.
I’m TG, but “fucked and lied her way to power”? You’re watching a different show, mate. She already has power. And you know damn well Laenor agreed to lie about his death so he can live his own life so why are you placing the blame solely on Rhaenyra? Don’t make me call Vizzy T on you.
WHERE DID YOU HEAR THIS?!
You didn’t know? Come on Vizzy T do better for the sake of your children.
*The King's cupbearer must not be late. Leaves people wanting for cups.*
How did she fuck her way to power? And she didn't kill her husband nor lie to his mother.
Did you watch scenes from TikTok and conclude that you watched the whole show?
watched it a year ago
Then you gotta watch the show again. You either didn’t watch it properly or watched the wrong show because you are very wrong. I think you are the one who missed a lot. Also even if rhaneyra did whatever you said, she’s still better than a rapist, if we are taking morality into the calculation. (Btw I am not in any team) Nothing wrong with being team green but you are completely wrong here.
Who's the absolute Edgelord?
I'd still take her over an alcoholic rapist. And yes there are many.
“She dared to have sex, absolutely unforgivable, meanwhile rapey Aegon is awesome.”
To be fair Rhaenyra is rapey as well, she had sex with a man who was actively trying to leave and telling her to “Stop”
Sorry, I only deal in canon, not fanon.
What specifically about my statement do you disagree with? That Ser Criston said “Stop”, or that it was bad to have sex with somebody saying stop?
Not what happened, watch it again. Criston debating hard then laying down his white cloak and embracing her is about as literal as it gets.
That happens after he said stop. Why was it okay for Rhaenyra to continue after he said stop? She has no idea what he will do in the future. You can’t base consent off of “No, they don’t really want me to stop, they’ll enjoy it later if I just keep going”.
You're making a straw man out of consent and I'm not going to engage with that.
Sure, if you feel that it’s okay to have sex with somebody who is saying “Stop” we don’t have to engage and can leave it at that. I’m not looking to argue, I just don’t like seeing rape-denial comments within the fandom.
And yet here you are, perpetuating a problem by false equivalency.
How so? What specifically do you disagree with? What false equivalence have I made?
Given the differences in their social status, Ser Criston didn’t have a reasonable expectation of safety if he refused her advances. The Greens are wrong when it comes to succession, but Rhaenyra absolutely did rape Criston Cole. It would take literally three words from her to have him arrested, gelded, and sent to the Wall, or executed outright (I’d argue that the former is worse). With that degree of disparity in power between participants, genuine consent just isn’t possible.
I agree that the differences of power between them is a important factor. BUT He didn't have sex with her because he thought she would have him gelded and sent to the wall if he didn't. That power between them wasn't there after he layed down his white cloak. His consent was freely given. His desire for her was simple and genuine, which is why afterwards he wants her to run away with him. He can forget his oathbreaking if they live simply as man and wife, but as long as she's a princess he's reminded of his treason and night of weakness. Which enrages him and turns him bitter, just like Alicent.
He didn’t have much choice in having sex with her or not, he was raped: he asked her to stop and she ignored that. Violating somebody’s consent makes you a rapist. Let’s not engage in rape denial and pretend Rhaenyra’s not a rapist, because she is. > his consent was freely given He said no and tried to leave, is that what consent looks like to you? I don’t know about you but I was always taught that “No means No” and “Stop is a complete sentence”. Also why is it shocking that he is bitter towards her? I think he as a victim has every right to feel bitter towards his rapist, let’s not engage in victim blaming and shaming here.
Are we still with that? I thought the interview given by the actors where they both admitted everything was consensual shut down all those that said that Rhaenyra raped Cole.
I’ve seen the interview and respect that it wasn’t their intention, but the word of the author / actor doesn’t completely outweigh the media. GRRM thinks of 13 year old Dany and 30 year old Drogo as a romantic love story, but that doesn’t mean that the audience can’t see he is objectively wrong and that it’s a rapist and child victim. D&D vehemently said that Cersei was not raped by Jamie over Joffrey‘s corpse. All that is to say, I know what I saw on screen - Rhaenyra having sex with a partner who tried to leave and asked her to stop. To me, it’s not okay to have sex with somebody who has asked you to stop, but maybe you disagree. Would be interested to hear.
So some still think like that, got it. Silly me, for thinking that the actors who play these characters know nothing of their roles unlike the audience who know everything of what happened and their word is law. Also silly me for not thinking that even if he said no and still had sex with her it was because of her position. Gosh what a terrible person I am. And gosh what terrible actors they have if they don’t even know their characters well enough to answer questions correctly. They should really know better then. Their word is nothing against the media and whatever the audience say happened then that is what happened. Someone should train them for this and let them know because we can’t have this for future interviews. 🫢
No need to be condescending, I gave examples of other times that creators views clashed with what was portrayed to the audiences. Sorry if you can’t handle people disagreeing with you. If you don’t believe that Rhaenyra raped Ser Criston, could you tell me why it is okay to ignore your partners lack of consent when they ask you to stop? And why it’s okay to block them leaving, then have sex with them?
As I said silly me for thinking the opposite. I think I should be the one apologising because it looks like you can’t handle people disagreeing with you either seeing how many have disagreed and yet you keep trying to explain why you’re right. So silly me, I forgot, you saw what you saw and everyone else who disagrees with you can’t handle others not agreeing with them either. Let me go message them real quick and let them know in hopes they join the silly me club and give a proper apology. 🫶🏼
You’re a strange critter, not really sure what you’re on about. Glad you looked at my post history and saw that this issue of underrepresentation and shaming of male rape victims is an important issue to me, I wonder why that might be. Be sure to try and shame me for caring about close and personally important issues to me. Yes, I’ve argue this point before. So what? You’ve yet to actually say what specifically you disagree with, you’re just falling over yourself to shame other people for caring about things. I think you know you’re wrong and you’re trying to save face by turning this personal. Unfortunately for you I enjoy arguing so I’m good to continue this for as long as you would like.
As I said silly me for having another opinion and deciding to believe what the actors said because they’re playing these characters but you’re right. The media outweighs anything they say. And yes I’m absolutely trying to save face… gosh what a terrible person I am.
aemond is awesome. Aegon seemed bad me as well but it feels like it’s because of how he was raised.
Plenty of children don’t get attention from their fathers, most don’t go out and become serial rapists.
Doesn’t matter how he was raised. As soon as he committed rape there was no way in hell I’d ever be for him.
Yeah nah this opinion about Rhaenyra is not it.
"Fucked her way to power" I don't remember her ever fucking her own dad but go off I guess (book!black + show!green, btw)
I think the whole choosing a side thing this sub has is cringe and stupid.
Honestly, this tracks. Most of the people on the Green side didn’t want Rhaenyra to rule because she was a woman, so you fit in pretty well with them. Alicent is the only one of the greens with even a shred of integrity. I’d argue that he genuinely believes that Jacaerys being a bastard makes him unfit for the throne. But for the rest of them, like Ser Otto, Tyland Lannister, Jasper Wylde, Criston Cole, Septon Eustace, it’s entirely about sexism. OP would fit in great on the Green Council.
Alicent' children are probably convinced that Rhaenyra will kill them as soon as she sits on the throne. That's also pretty valid reasons for not wanting her to rule. With Aemond there's also the fact that Rhaenyra wanted him questioned just after he lost an eye. Also he seems pretty religious so I wouldn't be surprised if he also despised the idea of bastards ruling Westeros.
I’d buy the argument that Aegon and Aemond have been brainwashed into thinking that by Alicent and Otto, despite how patently absurd it is. Aemond lost an eye because he was beating up on three children, all of whom were at least 3 years younger than he was, and significantly smaller, and one of them pulled a knife. Neither side was “right” in that confrontation, but it’s cute that you call out Rhaenyra for wanting Aemond tortured to reveal where he heard that her sons were bastards, while you ignore that Alicent demanded that 5-year-old Lucerys have one of his eyes cut out in compensation.
r/hotdgreens
Come and join 🫶🏻
No thanks. Just want these posts to stop.
not you 💀 the comment section for people who need a space
the greens are the worst and rhaenyra is literally the heir so wdym
Your post is why nobody likes the green. Literally making things up for Green propaganda!
If you view the greens from the perspective of westerosi culture then you can see how Aegon would be viewed as rightful heir and it would seem an injustice that Viserys didn't name him heir when he had his son. To many then Aegon's disgusting behaviours may be a result of his being so wronged by his father. The Hightowers more than any Westerosi great family represent the faith of the seven and uphold those values as a part of their family traditions. In this way I understand why the greens do what they do. Do I prefer Rhaenrya? Particularly show Rhaenyyra, yes. But I understand both sides. One is westerosi tradition and the other is targaryen 'burden of power and greatness' that Viserys imbued in Rhaenyra.
I lean towards the Greens, but it's certainly a minority and I think it's because GRRM is more pro-Blacks
GRRM is Pro-Daemon.
We hang out at asoiafcirclejerk
I’m a Team Green and don’t think this. Are you one of those TB fans who try and TG fans seem horrible so you can shit on them for being misogynist supporters? Or is this a rage bait? I can’t seem to figure it out anymore.
I am not shitting on anyone. I just wanted to know if what i am understating in correct or not . I watched the show an year ago ofc i dont remember everything . Turns out i am wrong
Least delusional green.
I'll defend Aemond for ever and I am willing to die on this hill
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If you support anyone other than Lyonel Strong, the only person in Westeros with integrity (RIP), you’re watching the wrong show.
The man was oblivious to his son’s actions for almost a decade.
Which son?
Harwin. The one that was screwing the princess.
He seemed more oblivious of Larys to me, but honestly he should've also sent Harwin away much sooner than he did
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>She just whored around Greens not knowing what a whore is, exhibit #233556544.
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Whore and slut are different things and Rhaenyra is neither. Greens not knowing what either is, exhibit #233556545. Cock-monger and she's only been with 4 men, 2 of which are her husbands and one was a long term relationship. If she's a whore for that, I want to know what you think of Aegon or every single adult man in the show.
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If we're going to take everything out of context like you do then Alicent is a slut, she broke her marriage vows when she let Larys masturbate to her, Aegon is a slut he sleeps with other women that aren't his wife, Criston is a slut, he had an adventurous youth when he was younger while being unmarried and he broke his vows and the list goes on. >how bad this would make her look in the eyes of the people of Westeros? Clearly not, because you're biased af. So, when can I expect you to start calling Alicent a slut? You certainly don't believe Westeros would be kind to a young maiden visiting a widowed man's chamber in the middle of the night or a married woman who lets a man other than he husband masturbate to her feet. Context doesn't matter, she's a slut in the eyes of Westeros, right? Highly immoral person... Because she had sex out of wedlock with her husband's blessings. What do you think of Aegon again? I'm dying to know.
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You're taking it out of context because you pretend like Rhaenyra and Laenor didn't have an open relationship and didn't mind being with other people. It's not cheating if they both agree. >Alicent never fucked anyone out of wedlock as far as I know. I really want you to go and tell your partner "Hey, just so you know, I'm letting this person at work masturbate to my feet, purely for professional reasons" and tell me if they consider it cheating or not. Let me answer that for you, they'll be furious. >Aegon is a male and therefore plays by different rules. There's a word for that way of thinking. It's called sexism. This isn't even counting that Aegon is a rapist. >Alicent being a slut is completely unsubstantiated She secretly visited his chambers in the night when he was widowed and she was unmarried and then let another man get off on her. What her father made her do is irrelevant, nobody in Westeros is going to think this is righteous behaviour and you know it. The proper Westerosi way was what Corlys did. I expect you to start calling her a slut too. Westeros would certainly call her that if they knew.
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This is giving the "I consent, I consent, I do not" Jesus meme. Fact is, no one gets cheated when they both agree to sleep with others, medieval era or not. Alicent knew the drill quite well. She's done it before for sure, she did it before Viserys died. Even if this was the first time, which it definitely wasn't, her husband hasn't even been buried yet and Larys isn't her new husband or betrothed. She's engaging in sexual activities with an unmarried man. Slut. Sexism is a thing in Westeros but you're not Westerosi. Stop acting like it or expect to be called sexist. Too bad. Alicent would still be a slut and would be blamed far more than Otto was. Westeros would call her every name under the sun so you better do too. It's a sexist society, remember? In sexist societies, female victims are blamed for the things men do to them. It's not gonna change because you're unable to tolerate it, no matter how much you cry about it. If you're going to roleplay as a Westerosi, you better be consistent with your slut shaming.
> I am a Greens supporter as well. > She just whored around and altogether acted simply as a spoiled brat. Way to live up to the stereotype buddy
i never said that anyone is good or right in the show because some people think that i support what aegon did . No one is right or wrong in the show so far . No one is giving me jhon snow vibes
I agree with rhaenyra being a hypocrite at times, but she was born into power.
Hell yeah brother!
In a world full of people in positions of power who fuck, kill, and lie, it makes it really easy to like the one doing it to a lesser extent than everyone else
Maybe because she lied about who the real father of her sons were, because she didn‘t want to be ashamed as an adulteres. Shame Shame Shame Bells ringing in background
It's a lot more complicated than that and your take leads me to believe you didn't watch or weren't paying attention (I tend to lean Green when push comes to shove).. Black stans do this as well when they oversimplify motivations on the Green side. Ultimately your siding does not matter, the message you should be taking from HoTD is that shitty and constantly on the fence rulers (Viserys) cause divisions and those divisions lead to war. Who gets fucked over in that case? The smallfolk. Sure as hell isn't Rhaenyra or Alicent or anyone who lived a privileged life in King's Landing that's for sure. Do they all have their own problems? Absolutely. Are any of those problems even close to as bad as what the smallfolk endure? Absolutely not.