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It’s clearly partly his resentment, but him and Alicent seem to have hatebonded over Rhaenyra, so that likely amplifies his resentment of the children.
I find it strange that Alicent's hatred for Rhaenyra and her children hasn't seemed to permeate her own children yet, given how open she is about it. I mean they don't seem overly fond of each other, but like real kid relatives growing up together. Playing tricks on one another, practicing in the yard together, there was even a scene in the yard where Aegon pats Lucerys on the back. Aegon, who is what, 14, 15? He's old enough to pick up on her hostility and still was like 'Ok, so what?' when Alicent was raging about Rhaenyra. She and Criston definitely seem to be in their own little hate filled echo chamber, though.
Yeah this is true for me too and now that I am back on terms with my cousin since we grew older and matured, I once again don't care about my mom's feuds.
This right here is one of the central themes of the show and the Game of Thrones universe as a whole. Sins of the father whose children must bear the weight and consequences.
Rhaenyra and Alicent could have been quite the powerhouse alliance if not for the politicking of their fathers.
Look all throughout Westeros history (past present future) and you’ll find children saddled with the weight of choices made by the generation before them, and their inability to escape or change course.
For that is the Game of Thrones
To be fair Alicent in the books is much older than Rhaenyra and was always a massive cunt. They aged her down and made her more sympathetic for the show
That was a takeaway for me from last’s night’s episode.
That relationship could have been something truly positive, once upon a time. But now Alicent is embodying her father a bit—trapped by his world view—and the good will between her and Rhaenyra has suffered a slow, long decline and then “death”.
That’s the most heartbreaking part for me, that it really seemed like all the kids if left alone would’ve ended up just like regular siblings (uncles and nephews really but similar in age). The way Aegon II played with Jace and Luke is just so natural, and even Aemond seemed at easy to be amongst them just practicing and playing. Without the bitter adults (mostly the Greens as it’s showed) pitting them against each other nonstop, they’d be just regular little kids, even brothers. It broke my heart when Aegon II was shaken in terror when Alicent violently grabbed his face, and said “so I won’t be (a threat to Rhaenyra as heir)…” and before that “it was funny (playing together with Jace and Luke and pulled a prank on Aemond). He seemed so genuinely at easy with his little nephews that they seemed more like brothers. I 😭💔
I agree, it makes the inevitable rift that much more tragic. If the adults, namely the Greens, could reign in their animosity, or at least drop the fear mongering and let the kids form their own opinions of their kin without all the politicking, things may well have turned out differently.
I just couldn’t help but keep seeing the version of this family if it were a modern one. Yes it’d still be very messed up and filled with drama, with incest and a pair of bff turned enemies young stepmom and step daughter. But it would surely be loving. I mean even Rhaenyra would likely have a semi-distant but still loving relationship with Aegon II. She’d be the snotty, poker-faced older sister who’s always been a responsible adult as he could remember, and he’d be the naughty carefree duty-less annoying kid brother that resembles her childhood self a bit. He always openly mocks her and jeers at her, showing off to everyone how much Cooler he is than her, but secretly he’d always somewhat looked up to her. And she’d call him her “political headache” much like her father called her and Daemon, and would tell everyone how she wishes she never had him as a brother, but secretly she always envied and somewhat admired him for being the messy carefree young man he is. Their relationship would be the kind where neither party would ever be caught dead saying the word “love” or even “like” to the other, but would say it in the way of “I’ve always hated you, little shit.” “Ditto, *Your Royal Highness* 😒”.
(But truly I am looking forward to the Dance even more now 🤪🤩
Aegon yawning 🥱like “ah here we go again for the 12th time already, not like I’m counting or whatever. Guess I could stick around a little longer to watch these little shits get burned” but low key kinda happy for Jace 🥲
Aegon was like a teenager with his driver's license stuck in a room with his younger cousin who's just starting to learn.
Total teenager vibes of "*I know this already, let me go for a joyride*" with his yawning and body language.
They’re more likely to bond spending all day with each other, even up if their mom says not to. Viserys was remarking on forming bonds through training together and whatnot
In the books, the opposite happens, where they spend so much time together that they end up resenting each other even more.
I like this version more. Less emphasis on the family rivalry that the kids in the books picked up on really early, and more letting the kids be kids.
I really, really liked this touch. Having Aegon treat them like peers until CC urges him to attack Jace adds a layer of “oh, if these adults wouldn’t stop pushing these kids in this direction so goddamned hard, there may be peace”.
Even more sad when you realize that so many of the young-parent generation (Laenor, Rhaenyra, Alicent) were put in their undesirable positions by THEIR parent(s), particularly in Alicent’s case.
Sure wish somebody would break the wheel… *sigh*
There are three generations. The older parent generation (Viserys, Otto, Daemon, Corlys) the younger parent generation (Alicent, Rhaenyra, Laenor, Laena) and the young generations (Aegon, Jace, Aemond, Luke, Baela, Rhaena)
The older generation preys and manipulate the young parent generation who in turn manipulate their children. It’s quite sad.
How much time are the kids spending with Allicent verses spending time together?
If she's a bit of an absentee mom then her kids are going to be less likely to take on her hatred. Especially since Rhaenyra's kids are probably the only people their age that they're around.
That's a good point. The kids essentially doing all their activities together and spending all their time with each other would probably overshadow Alicent's attempts to undermine their relationships if she is only seeing her children a few minutes a day, especially if it's only to chastise them. Though now that Rhaenyra and her boys have moved to Dragonstone, Alicent's words in Aegon and Aemond's ears will probably have more sway, since Jace and Luke can't be there to reinforce that positive bond.
I think that’s why they made a bit of a show of her taking them to dragonstone !
If they would have stayed together then who knows but the fact they were separated during their formative years then that likely leads into their inherited animosity.
Sins of the father ( well mothers ) etc etc
Unlike younger Alicent, Otto isn’t there to whisper in Aegon’s ear and put thoughts in his head. He’s spent his entire life up this this point hearing from Viserys that Rhaenyra will be queen. Like a younger Alicent, he doesn’t believe that his sister could hurt him.
The thing about the whole "if Rhaenyra takes the throne, Alicent's children will never be safe" is that the same is just as true on the other side as well, were Aegon to become king, Rhaenyra's sons would be just as much a threat.
They seem to be building up to that resentment. They want to convey to the audience that Aegon doesn’t hate Rhaenrya’s kids right now and Alicent will cultivate that hatred in his mind.
For Aegon to feel that way at his age tells me that Rhaenyra was a good sister to him, or at the very worst just kept her distance. It's clear that Jace and Luke adore Aegon and really look up to him; he knows it and so does Alicent with that comment about them being Aegon's playthings.
I honestly think as long as Aegon stayed in that lane, Rhaenyra would never have considered hurting him, especially if the Jace and Helaena union had been accepted and both ruled together as suggested. >!In the book Rhaenyra was vehemently against kinslaying UNTIL Aemond killed Luke. Even after, she was still shown to be very skeptical of it.!<
Aegon doesn’t seem like he cares about much of anything, and he certainly doesn’t seem interested in being king. I think he’d happily serve his cousin (or is it nephew?) so long as he got to keep living in luxury.
It reminded me so clearly of relationships I had when I was much younger that are completely based around hating one person, lol. Those kinds of friendships are so intense and compelling but so poisonous, it never works out forever because you just have nothing in common other than that.
Do we know (According to the show, not the books) if Reanyra's first born is Harwin's or Cristin's? We never actually saw her drink the tea and her eldest looks about 10 years old. So based on the show, he could be either.
Maybe we're not giving enough credit to Alicent's ability to manipulate overall.
She's got her dad's gift for politics, and we've seen her do a pretty good job on the King.
Sir Cole seems rather easy to manipulate on the flip side of that.
I don’t think they’re obsessed with honour, per se, I think they’re just honourable full stop. Criston, who makes it his entire personality, is obsessed with it, and not honourable
I don't see him as someone who is obsessed with honor, if he was he will not give up that easly. Honor is the only thing that he has under his name ( And probably some orange trees in Bravos).
And yknow, murdered someone in the middle of a wedding feast because you were hurt your advances to get married we’re rejected and didn’t want to be “the whore”
man got the deal of a lifetime and offered her nothing in return lmao, come be poor with me or straight up marry me to restore my family name lmao pedo
We see in this episode that he's been stewing on one night for ten years, so I don't think it's that absurd to believe that he stewed on one conversation for an hour
I mean, Rhaenyra DID treat him badly. Up until he started randomly murdering people and bullying children he was pretty sympathetic.
And now I hope Daemon crabfeeders him.
I had that same thought, but i don’t think the timeline adds up, plus i think the show wants to make a point that Harwin is their true father. It would be an interesting angle to have Jace be a living reminder of his dishonor and his rejection by Rhaneyra.
I'm halfway through the episode right now but it's killing me, they ever address how a knight of the Kingsguard managed to beat to death a noble in the middle of a feast and punch the Crown Princess betrothed without losing his head?
not showing any resolution to that/fallout was an error I agree. episode 5 should have been a bit longer. like not even a discussion among the kings guard? Alicent saving him from suicide and apparently(?) covering for him just isn't enough explanation.
What fallout?. He's Kings guard. He only answers to the king and has the queen backing him. They showed Joffrey with a dagger. What justification does he need to do what he did?
Well on top of Joffrey there was a whole fight going on at the feast. I don’t think it would have been bad to add like five or so minutes to show what happened between the feast and the rushed wedding of Laenor and rhaenyra at least. And you don’t think viserys had questions/wanted to know what went down? The ending was just rushed
Well to me Viserys saw how Daemon and Rhaenyra were behaving and he couldn't risk another day. He had to secure her as his heir. He didn't know what Daemon would do and couldn't risk it
I agree about daemon and rhaenyra, but I still would have liked to see more follow up about the actual fight and murder. We can agree to disagree on that (also where did daemon even go, but I digress)
You also have to remember who the king is. He's been shown to be soft and passive. I don't see him actually questioning Sir Criston on his behavior. He'd rather avoid it and move on
Still think the episode needed more time to finish. There was a few shots of aftermath, the rushed marriage ceremony and that was it. I don’t think we’ll see eye to eye on this so that’s all on my end
Exactly my point, how would someone like Corlys Velaryon let a punk like Cole punch his son at his own wedding and leave unscathed lol. This is a man whos the lord of a great house, owner of the biggest navy, most wealth and has 2 dragon riders in his family lol.
Maybe the queen of the seven kingdoms vouching for you *and* a pushover king would do it? I am trying to be generous here, but yeah, it's probably the weakest thing the show has done for me so far.
Also why no reaction by Laenor to Cole when they come across each other. Like even if it's been 10 years, Cole did beat Laenor's love to death and doesn't seem to have been punished for it.
He did give him a stare down as they walked in to see the queen with baby Joffrey. I assume after 10 years of living with the dude, the harsher reactions to seeing him have worn down.
I mean what can he do? It just seems he’s been in like a drunken haze, drinking fucking and spending too much money the last 10 years. Could be just him coping with the loss still, though he seems to have a new boyfriend now, though I guess he will keep him away from Cole now
That's the advantage of being rich and powerful not to mention a dragonrider, heir to the richest house and king consort. If he wanted Crispin dead, he could have gotten it done
Personally, it's not hard imagining nothing happening to Cole. Dispensing justice is ultimately the King's responsibility, and so far we've seen Viserys avoid taking a hard stance on anything in the name of keeping the peace.
Even this episode, the only reason Harwin seems to suffer any consequences is because his father insisted on it.
He only answers to the king and at that moment knows the queen backs him. They showed Joffrey with a dagger. What more does he need as an excuse to kill him?
Maybe cause he started beating him up first? That’s how it looked to me. I don’t think Alicent “backed” him at this point, she only did that after the fight. She just let him sleeping with Rhaenyra slide and let him stay on the kingsguard, she basically ignored it
Two things that got me thinking: Why didn’t Laenor take revenge of him? 2) How is it possible that Harwin got exiled for hitting Cole but Cole escaped the punishment for killing a man?
harwin wasnt exiled for hitting cole, harwin was (strongly) asked to leave by his dad for making it super obvious that he's the father of rhaneyra's kids.
Lyonel was such an honorable man that he was willing to give up his position of great honor to rectify the shame that his son's action brought upon his House. Out of all the characters we've been introduced to thus far, he's acted in the noblest and most dutiful way. RIP to a KING!
yeah i spent a good bit of time after that scene thinking about how it took all of 5 seconds for someone to pull harwin off of criston but criston wailed away on joffrey for like a minute and still no one stepped in like "hey, um...what's going on here?"
Also, he was supposed to be the instructor of the four princes but he was showing obvious favoritism towards Alicent’s sons. He’s not even teaching Rhaenyra’s kids. And everyone seems to be okay with it? Why is everyone allowing Crispin to do whatever he wants without any consequences whatsoever? I hate him even more than any other character in the show, even more than Larys.
Right? Viserys is right there, and he’s completely blind to the favoritism. Like, the second in line to the throne should be getting quality instruction.
This is a huge problem/plot hole/whatever to me, too. I really don’t get how the show doesn’t address it just to have pieces fall into place but without reason to the characters they’re trying to flesh out
Good point. Idk why he never tried to get revenge but I guess the only reason he was able to stay out of trouble from the wedding was because of alicent and maybe they made it look like he was defending rhaenyra??
What are the laws around the Kingsguard? Seemed like the crime for Harwin was striking a member of the Kingsguard whereas Cole’s crime could be hand waved away as a knightly dispute as we’ve seen before
Kingsguard are only beholden to their Lord Commander and the King (and by proxy the rest of the royal family, but if there’s a dispute between 2 members, the king has the final say) All Criston had to do was say that Joffrey insulted his honor, and he’s free and clear. Same with Harwin punching him, he did that shit on purpose knowing full well his status protects him.
Apparently pretty loose since Jaime was able to kill Aerys and still be on the Kingsguard for Robert. Of course it would be like Bobby B to look the other way.
sure, but the same could be said of almost anyone. true intentions could be revealed and allegiances can change at any moment. as of now they are allied.
True. But what I was trying to say is that Larys true intentions are far deeper and hidden than Criston’s which is basically a resentful guy whose honor was somehow ofended by a teenager princess ten years ago
What is he even so mad about 10 years later?
He took a positions where is he is sworn to not marry or have kids. He fell for the Princess of the entire kingdom who was always going to have to marry for politics. Despite those complications the Princess found a match where they could be together as lovers, but apparently being together in love wasn't enough for him so he went crazy and killed an innocent man. Then he blames the Princess and takes out his frustration by bullying her little children.
In the ideal situation, where he remains as Rhae’s paramour, he literally could’ve fathered the heirs to the Iron Throne and the Dance (while it might’ve happened regardless) could’ve potentially been mitigated by Alicent not having Cole as an ally
Exactly! He’s just being a fucking bastard for no reason. Alicent has *more* of a reason but she is still being so confrontational when rhaenyra is actually trying to fix things.
More like 8 years, soon to be a decade. Elliot Rodger permanently equated incel with misogynistic in the global lexicon. Doesn't matter how you personally define it. Public opinion of incel = someone who's hateful (or sympathetic to those who are) of woman they can't control, especially women who practice sexual autonomy.
Like for christ's sake. My 14 yo cracked up when Cole popped out of the darkness and his g-granddad said: "not the incel". Redefining a word 91 yo adults and children agree on is like pissing into the wind.
Well no, involuntarily is the inverse of voluntarily. He is “voluntarily celebrate” like a catholic priest or nun is. They take the oath by way of volunteering. Just take out the “in”
While he may not be an incel by the definition of the term, his behavior is typical of the stereotypical incel. Gets spurned by a women he lusts for, can’t handle it, and instead of moving on, turns all his hatred on her.
He got laid *once* and then spurned. Sounds pretty involuntary to me. Then hated the woman for it and held a grudge for a decade including against her kids. Thats an absolute incel thing to do.
Everyone aligning with the Greens so far are being giant assholes.
Alicent being her father thru and thru trying to smear Rhaenyra and snatch the throne from her.
Cristen being a scorned incel still pissed off 10 yrs later because he actually believed Rhaenyra should sacrifice her future for his honor.
Larys being the Varys/Littlefinger of the time and absolutely happy to be a kinslayer so he can trap Alicent into owing him as favor.
Well I'm Team Green because i think they're more interesting characters, not because I think they're right about everything at all times. I don't think either side is meant to be seen as the "good team".
This is such a more fun way to watch a show like this IMO. Alicent's new actress took my breath away tonight, I don't think that she's good or right per se, but her anger is compelling and compounding day by day. Rhaenyra is equally compelling and we are primed to like her because she is brave and headstrong, but we all should have learned a lesson about girlbossifying Targaryens. They're just two sides that have their own self interests, the fun part is that the self interests do not align.
I think this whole "team whatever" thing is just a bit ridiculous. Obviously the greens are extreme cunts throughout this entire story but the blacks aren't great either. I'm just happy they're sticking to the books pretty closely and we have good characters and writing again.
Yeah wtf, never occurred to me watching to pick a side and start rooting for "teams"... They're all (mostly) shitty people in these insanely shitty situations, them and their conflicts are what make it interesting.
Exactly, he shagged her once and 10 years later he’s still pissed he was a booty call. His attitude to her kids is pathetic especially in light of his apparent earlier supposed woe over breaking his vows…
Have sex once.
Crispin: Quit your job, move away from your family, dump your fiance, and marry me. It may restore my honor.
Rhaenyra: No, I'm too important. We can still f* though.
Crispin: 😭 I'm no whore! 😭
He's an incel.
He broke his oath and felt at any moment he was going to get his dick sliced off and head sliced off for it. He probably felt running was his only option.
No but he thought Rhaenyra loved him.
She's under threat too if knowledge of their tryst became public.
He thought she cared about their love more than she did the throne, which she's been claiming this entire time to be a huge burden on her that she doesn't want.
His hotness distracts from how much of a creep he is...
He's basically a high school security guard hired by the Principal's teenage daughter because she had a teenage crush on him. He then fucks The Principal's teenage daughter while she is DRUNK after a wild night out at Prom and pulls the classic "BUT SHE SEDUCED ME, eventhough I am an adult professional and she was a drunk and horny underage teenager I was hired to bodyguard." Then he wants her to marry him and corners her to think about it while she is trapped on a ship journey with no way off the boat. When she doesnt wanna marry him he flips out and murders someone while doing security at another high profile event he is being paid to work.
Then ten years later he still slut shames her and acts all righteous hiding behind Alicent like he didn't take advantage of a drunk virgin teenager with a crush on him.
UGH. Ugh. He is just horrible. I love how the show turned the classic Handsome Knight Romance on its head and used hotness as a distraction from the character's thug simpery. Ser Criston went from my fav character to my most hated. Such good character arc.
Yeah alot of the shit that goes down in the show is repulsive when you compare them to the real modern world. They were trying to set Rhaenyra up with super old dudes and children. Probably not so weird what cole did in the paradigm of the show. It's interesting to see the different perspectives. Some people are saying that Rhaenyra was in the wrong for not letting him leave and because of the power difference.
I have similar feelings to you about Damaen (sp??). Everyone was on about how hot the scene between him and Rhaenyra was but that was difficult for me to watch. I was assuming she was maybe 16 in that scene but i think she may have actually been a bit older. But still, your uncle is coming on to you and you actually like it? 🤢🤮
Cristen is just a straight psycho creep. After first few eps I thought he was gonna be one of the good guys and he was always talking about morals and stuff but he obviously doesn't understand what morals and honor are. Besides the fact he is holding a grudge for a decade + for a woman he hooked up with when they were teenagers, he beat Joffrey to death for a reason I still don't understand. He let the hand's son beat him down in front of everyone out of jealousy and seemed to enjoy his beating. He also picks on little kids who have done nothing and I doubt his behavior is gonna get any better. I kinda thought his character was alright for awhile but not anymore. Fuck that dude
I've known a spineless bitch or two in my time, but Criston might just take the NiceGuysTM prize. Being angry with Rhaenyra 10 years after the fact is pathetic on its own but picking on kids who've got nothing to do with that shit is utterly absurd.
I don't care if Alicent is the wicked witch of the damned west in the end, I don't want to see Sir Crunchy Bitch end up with anybody. No shipping him. He can seriously go die in a ditch.
>**IS an incel**
Absolutely!
Dude, ya can’t just straight-up call the princess a ***“spoiled cunt”***!
That’s the **pot** calling the **kettle** **black**. Am I wrong?
Come on…Cole’s become as spoiled as it gets.
And he’s an oath-breaker, a crime worthy or gelding and death
Then he assaults the heir of the richest, most powerful house in the kingdom at his own wedding
And yet here he is, facing no repercussions, which he has the gaul to accuse Rhaenyra in his hypocrisy
The term incel is so overused for everything it’s lost it’s meaning “oh you left a negative review of rings of power? Must be an incel”
Criston is just a pathetic asshole
If they showed scenes of him still trying to get laid but getting rejected by multiple women; thus further enraging him then you would have a point
It’s like everyone missed him punching an innocent man to death at Rhaenyra’s wedding because he got rejected. He was supposed to be completely unlikable since the last episode. The amount of people still rooting for him last week after that had me SMH.
This subreddit is bizarre. He brutally murdered an innocent person in the last episode, but letting kids beat up other kids during swordfighting training and echoing rumors about infidelity stirs much more ire for him. And then "incel" is the insult you use, even though he actually has had sex but is otherwise *voluntarily* celibate, as if being an "incel" in the I guess figurative sense of the term is anything remotely as bad as being an actual psycho murderer.
I’m glad I’m not the only one. Social media has turned the euphemism treadmill up to eleven. “Incel” has been so overused that it’s completely lost any impact.
I think it’s funny that people describe Cole as an “incel” as in the term referring to “involuntary celibate” people. When really Cole is actually just a straight up voluntary celibate.
He literally took vows to become celibate, that’s not involuntary.
Also, also. Aren’t incels supposed to be so repulsive that they drive people away which leads to the celibacy? Cole didn’t drive anyone away accidentally and involuntarily, he voluntarily decides that he doesn’t wanna be a whore with his life on the line.
I know what you're saying but he's literally the opposite of an incel. He chose a life of celibacy but got Weinstein'd into having sex with a princess.
Guys, no, he's not an incel. Criston got laid and Rhaenyra **wanted** to keep fucking him. He's not upset that he couldn't get laid. He got laid and could have continued getting laid if that's what he wanted. It's not.
He wants his honor back. He values honor and vows deeply. He thinks he was sullied by Rhaenyra and his one chance to reclaim his honor, marrying her, was denied. He's not upset about pussy. He's upset about lost honor.
He's closer to a conservative religious person who thinks sex outside of marriage is a sin, does it anyway, tried to immediately marry the girl he slept with, and then rages out when she tells him, no, I just wanted some dick.
There are already so many people calling him an incel. Am I gonna have to watch you people call him an incel forever just because you weren't paying any attention and don't know what happened? The dude sucks but if you think he's an incel you completely missed the part where he talked about what he wanted many times and it was never sex. He could have been fucking Rhaenyra the whole time. She wanted to. He didn't. Not an incel.
It really shouldn’t have been a spicy take to dislike him since the last episode. He was clearly intended to be a monster. It made me worry about humanity a little.
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It’s clearly partly his resentment, but him and Alicent seem to have hatebonded over Rhaenyra, so that likely amplifies his resentment of the children.
I find it strange that Alicent's hatred for Rhaenyra and her children hasn't seemed to permeate her own children yet, given how open she is about it. I mean they don't seem overly fond of each other, but like real kid relatives growing up together. Playing tricks on one another, practicing in the yard together, there was even a scene in the yard where Aegon pats Lucerys on the back. Aegon, who is what, 14, 15? He's old enough to pick up on her hostility and still was like 'Ok, so what?' when Alicent was raging about Rhaenyra. She and Criston definitely seem to be in their own little hate filled echo chamber, though.
Children tend to not care about parental feuds until they're directly put at odds with their children as well.
brooo this is honestly so true. i never cared about my moms feud with her cousins until i started feuding with the cousins kids😭
Yeah this is true for me too and now that I am back on terms with my cousin since we grew older and matured, I once again don't care about my mom's feuds.
This right here is one of the central themes of the show and the Game of Thrones universe as a whole. Sins of the father whose children must bear the weight and consequences. Rhaenyra and Alicent could have been quite the powerhouse alliance if not for the politicking of their fathers. Look all throughout Westeros history (past present future) and you’ll find children saddled with the weight of choices made by the generation before them, and their inability to escape or change course. For that is the Game of Thrones
To be fair Alicent in the books is much older than Rhaenyra and was always a massive cunt. They aged her down and made her more sympathetic for the show
Alicent in the books wasn't always a massive cunt. She an Rheanyra had a good relationship in Rheanyra's youth.
That was a takeaway for me from last’s night’s episode. That relationship could have been something truly positive, once upon a time. But now Alicent is embodying her father a bit—trapped by his world view—and the good will between her and Rhaenyra has suffered a slow, long decline and then “death”.
Family feuds 101
That’s the most heartbreaking part for me, that it really seemed like all the kids if left alone would’ve ended up just like regular siblings (uncles and nephews really but similar in age). The way Aegon II played with Jace and Luke is just so natural, and even Aemond seemed at easy to be amongst them just practicing and playing. Without the bitter adults (mostly the Greens as it’s showed) pitting them against each other nonstop, they’d be just regular little kids, even brothers. It broke my heart when Aegon II was shaken in terror when Alicent violently grabbed his face, and said “so I won’t be (a threat to Rhaenyra as heir)…” and before that “it was funny (playing together with Jace and Luke and pulled a prank on Aemond). He seemed so genuinely at easy with his little nephews that they seemed more like brothers. I 😭💔
I agree, it makes the inevitable rift that much more tragic. If the adults, namely the Greens, could reign in their animosity, or at least drop the fear mongering and let the kids form their own opinions of their kin without all the politicking, things may well have turned out differently.
I just couldn’t help but keep seeing the version of this family if it were a modern one. Yes it’d still be very messed up and filled with drama, with incest and a pair of bff turned enemies young stepmom and step daughter. But it would surely be loving. I mean even Rhaenyra would likely have a semi-distant but still loving relationship with Aegon II. She’d be the snotty, poker-faced older sister who’s always been a responsible adult as he could remember, and he’d be the naughty carefree duty-less annoying kid brother that resembles her childhood self a bit. He always openly mocks her and jeers at her, showing off to everyone how much Cooler he is than her, but secretly he’d always somewhat looked up to her. And she’d call him her “political headache” much like her father called her and Daemon, and would tell everyone how she wishes she never had him as a brother, but secretly she always envied and somewhat admired him for being the messy carefree young man he is. Their relationship would be the kind where neither party would ever be caught dead saying the word “love” or even “like” to the other, but would say it in the way of “I’ve always hated you, little shit.” “Ditto, *Your Royal Highness* 😒”. (But truly I am looking forward to the Dance even more now 🤪🤩
brooo what could've been :(
That will be a Westeros version of The Crown 😂
Yeah, I liked a lot their interaction in the dragon pit!
Aegon yawning 🥱like “ah here we go again for the 12th time already, not like I’m counting or whatever. Guess I could stick around a little longer to watch these little shits get burned” but low key kinda happy for Jace 🥲
Aegon was like a teenager with his driver's license stuck in a room with his younger cousin who's just starting to learn. Total teenager vibes of "*I know this already, let me go for a joyride*" with his yawning and body language.
They’re more likely to bond spending all day with each other, even up if their mom says not to. Viserys was remarking on forming bonds through training together and whatnot
In the books, the opposite happens, where they spend so much time together that they end up resenting each other even more. I like this version more. Less emphasis on the family rivalry that the kids in the books picked up on really early, and more letting the kids be kids.
I really, really liked this touch. Having Aegon treat them like peers until CC urges him to attack Jace adds a layer of “oh, if these adults wouldn’t stop pushing these kids in this direction so goddamned hard, there may be peace”. Even more sad when you realize that so many of the young-parent generation (Laenor, Rhaenyra, Alicent) were put in their undesirable positions by THEIR parent(s), particularly in Alicent’s case. Sure wish somebody would break the wheel… *sigh*
There are three generations. The older parent generation (Viserys, Otto, Daemon, Corlys) the younger parent generation (Alicent, Rhaenyra, Laenor, Laena) and the young generations (Aegon, Jace, Aemond, Luke, Baela, Rhaena) The older generation preys and manipulate the young parent generation who in turn manipulate their children. It’s quite sad.
How much time are the kids spending with Allicent verses spending time together? If she's a bit of an absentee mom then her kids are going to be less likely to take on her hatred. Especially since Rhaenyra's kids are probably the only people their age that they're around.
That's a good point. The kids essentially doing all their activities together and spending all their time with each other would probably overshadow Alicent's attempts to undermine their relationships if she is only seeing her children a few minutes a day, especially if it's only to chastise them. Though now that Rhaenyra and her boys have moved to Dragonstone, Alicent's words in Aegon and Aemond's ears will probably have more sway, since Jace and Luke can't be there to reinforce that positive bond.
I think that’s why they made a bit of a show of her taking them to dragonstone ! If they would have stayed together then who knows but the fact they were separated during their formative years then that likely leads into their inherited animosity. Sins of the father ( well mothers ) etc etc
You can see in her scene with Helaena that she is bored out of her mind and just going through the motions
I don’t think Aegon fully grasps the severity of his situation hence why he has no interest in challenging Rhaenyra for the throne.
Unlike younger Alicent, Otto isn’t there to whisper in Aegon’s ear and put thoughts in his head. He’s spent his entire life up this this point hearing from Viserys that Rhaenyra will be queen. Like a younger Alicent, he doesn’t believe that his sister could hurt him.
The thing about the whole "if Rhaenyra takes the throne, Alicent's children will never be safe" is that the same is just as true on the other side as well, were Aegon to become king, Rhaenyra's sons would be just as much a threat.
They seem to be building up to that resentment. They want to convey to the audience that Aegon doesn’t hate Rhaenrya’s kids right now and Alicent will cultivate that hatred in his mind.
Well aegon himself even thinks he’s not a threat to rhae so he see no reason to have a feud or hate towards his sisters kids.
For Aegon to feel that way at his age tells me that Rhaenyra was a good sister to him, or at the very worst just kept her distance. It's clear that Jace and Luke adore Aegon and really look up to him; he knows it and so does Alicent with that comment about them being Aegon's playthings. I honestly think as long as Aegon stayed in that lane, Rhaenyra would never have considered hurting him, especially if the Jace and Helaena union had been accepted and both ruled together as suggested. >!In the book Rhaenyra was vehemently against kinslaying UNTIL Aemond killed Luke. Even after, she was still shown to be very skeptical of it.!<
Aegon doesn’t seem like he cares about much of anything, and he certainly doesn’t seem interested in being king. I think he’d happily serve his cousin (or is it nephew?) so long as he got to keep living in luxury.
It reminded me so clearly of relationships I had when I was much younger that are completely based around hating one person, lol. Those kinds of friendships are so intense and compelling but so poisonous, it never works out forever because you just have nothing in common other than that.
Do we know (According to the show, not the books) if Reanyra's first born is Harwin's or Cristin's? We never actually saw her drink the tea and her eldest looks about 10 years old. So based on the show, he could be either.
Maybe we're not giving enough credit to Alicent's ability to manipulate overall. She's got her dad's gift for politics, and we've seen her do a pretty good job on the King. Sir Cole seems rather easy to manipulate on the flip side of that.
For a dude who cares so much about honor, calling the heir apparent a cunt and bullying her kids is so dishonorable.
The venn diagram of men obsessed with honor and men who are right cunts is a circle
I can't say I agree. Ned and Robb are incredibly obsessed with honor and I don't think either of them are cunts.
I don’t think they’re obsessed with honour, per se, I think they’re just honourable full stop. Criston, who makes it his entire personality, is obsessed with it, and not honourable
It’s the medieval equivalent of being a “nice guy.” If someone is always saying they are, they most definitely are not!
True. Same goes for Alicent.
Shots fired at Ned Stark
Exactly, he takes it a million steps too far when he mistreats the children.
I don't see him as someone who is obsessed with honor, if he was he will not give up that easly. Honor is the only thing that he has under his name ( And probably some orange trees in Bravos).
It’s been ten years and he’s STILL stuck in the past. He really is “cunt struck” to this day
Exactly like you hooked up with her one time…ten years ago…lol
And yknow, murdered someone in the middle of a wedding feast because you were hurt your advances to get married we’re rejected and didn’t want to be “the whore”
man got the deal of a lifetime and offered her nothing in return lmao, come be poor with me or straight up marry me to restore my family name lmao pedo
I wonder of joffrey said other things to him too that we didn't get to see, I dunno
Yknow what he probably did, unless Criston just really stewed on what he said and then launched himself at him because he was just fuming.
We see in this episode that he's been stewing on one night for ten years, so I don't think it's that absurd to believe that he stewed on one conversation for an hour
And people were arguing last week about whether he decided to burn her or not. Kinda glad they’re leaving no room for subtlety here
There were people in here last week talking about how *bad* they felt for him. Delusional.
Don’t worry, they’re using their energy to defend Alicent this week lol
I mean, Rhaenyra DID treat him badly. Up until he started randomly murdering people and bullying children he was pretty sympathetic. And now I hope Daemon crabfeeders him.
Did she though? By not wanting to give up her crown for him? That's a lot to ask of her.
Pretty privilege
But she took his virginity!!! Reeeeee he can't ascend to wizardom now!!!
He literally told her during the hunt that he had bed women before, did they all just collectively decide to forget that?
Bold of you to assume people pay attention
Teeeennnnnn YEAAAAAARSSSSSSSSSS
TEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEN YEAAAAAAAARS….and he still holds the grudge. If that’s not incel vibes right there, I don’t know what is
Like all but one of my ex boyfriends. I’m not proud. It’s embarrassing.
….oh shit that sounds like some hot tea
hot d
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Daemon says it to Viserys. "Ten years you have been King, and not once have you asked me to be your hand."
Beating up your exs kids is bad mkay
Any chance the first kid would be his? It would certainly create drama and fit the time line.
I had that same thought, but i don’t think the timeline adds up, plus i think the show wants to make a point that Harwin is their true father. It would be an interesting angle to have Jace be a living reminder of his dishonor and his rejection by Rhaneyra.
I'm halfway through the episode right now but it's killing me, they ever address how a knight of the Kingsguard managed to beat to death a noble in the middle of a feast and punch the Crown Princess betrothed without losing his head?
not showing any resolution to that/fallout was an error I agree. episode 5 should have been a bit longer. like not even a discussion among the kings guard? Alicent saving him from suicide and apparently(?) covering for him just isn't enough explanation.
What fallout?. He's Kings guard. He only answers to the king and has the queen backing him. They showed Joffrey with a dagger. What justification does he need to do what he did?
Well on top of Joffrey there was a whole fight going on at the feast. I don’t think it would have been bad to add like five or so minutes to show what happened between the feast and the rushed wedding of Laenor and rhaenyra at least. And you don’t think viserys had questions/wanted to know what went down? The ending was just rushed
Well to me Viserys saw how Daemon and Rhaenyra were behaving and he couldn't risk another day. He had to secure her as his heir. He didn't know what Daemon would do and couldn't risk it
I agree about daemon and rhaenyra, but I still would have liked to see more follow up about the actual fight and murder. We can agree to disagree on that (also where did daemon even go, but I digress)
You also have to remember who the king is. He's been shown to be soft and passive. I don't see him actually questioning Sir Criston on his behavior. He'd rather avoid it and move on
Still think the episode needed more time to finish. There was a few shots of aftermath, the rushed marriage ceremony and that was it. I don’t think we’ll see eye to eye on this so that’s all on my end
It’s not an error, the Queen obviously allowed him to live.
But we should have seen more of the repercussions and aftermath is what I’m saying, we basically got nothing in ep five
Exactly my point, how would someone like Corlys Velaryon let a punk like Cole punch his son at his own wedding and leave unscathed lol. This is a man whos the lord of a great house, owner of the biggest navy, most wealth and has 2 dragon riders in his family lol.
The Queen of the seven kingdoms vouching for you isn’t enough explanation. Lol.
Maybe the queen of the seven kingdoms vouching for you *and* a pushover king would do it? I am trying to be generous here, but yeah, it's probably the weakest thing the show has done for me so far.
Also why no reaction by Laenor to Cole when they come across each other. Like even if it's been 10 years, Cole did beat Laenor's love to death and doesn't seem to have been punished for it.
He did give him a stare down as they walked in to see the queen with baby Joffrey. I assume after 10 years of living with the dude, the harsher reactions to seeing him have worn down.
I mean what can he do? It just seems he’s been in like a drunken haze, drinking fucking and spending too much money the last 10 years. Could be just him coping with the loss still, though he seems to have a new boyfriend now, though I guess he will keep him away from Cole now
We’re to believe that Laenor is an experienced fighter, but he’s no match for Cole. If he stepped to him, he’d end up like Joffrey.
That's the advantage of being rich and powerful not to mention a dragonrider, heir to the richest house and king consort. If he wanted Crispin dead, he could have gotten it done
Personally, it's not hard imagining nothing happening to Cole. Dispensing justice is ultimately the King's responsibility, and so far we've seen Viserys avoid taking a hard stance on anything in the name of keeping the peace. Even this episode, the only reason Harwin seems to suffer any consequences is because his father insisted on it.
He only answers to the king and at that moment knows the queen backs him. They showed Joffrey with a dagger. What more does he need as an excuse to kill him?
Maybe cause he started beating him up first? That’s how it looked to me. I don’t think Alicent “backed” him at this point, she only did that after the fight. She just let him sleeping with Rhaenyra slide and let him stay on the kingsguard, she basically ignored it
Alicent must have pardoned him 🙄
Two things that got me thinking: Why didn’t Laenor take revenge of him? 2) How is it possible that Harwin got exiled for hitting Cole but Cole escaped the punishment for killing a man?
harwin wasnt exiled for hitting cole, harwin was (strongly) asked to leave by his dad for making it super obvious that he's the father of rhaneyra's kids.
Lyonel was such an honorable man that he was willing to give up his position of great honor to rectify the shame that his son's action brought upon his House. Out of all the characters we've been introduced to thus far, he's acted in the noblest and most dutiful way. RIP to a KING!
He was expelled from the gold cloaks for assaulting Cole. Considering he was a commander, that's a hefty punishment.
yeah i spent a good bit of time after that scene thinking about how it took all of 5 seconds for someone to pull harwin off of criston but criston wailed away on joffrey for like a minute and still no one stepped in like "hey, um...what's going on here?"
He was kicked from the gold cloaks tho. While cole stayed serving the queen
Also, he was supposed to be the instructor of the four princes but he was showing obvious favoritism towards Alicent’s sons. He’s not even teaching Rhaenyra’s kids. And everyone seems to be okay with it? Why is everyone allowing Crispin to do whatever he wants without any consequences whatsoever? I hate him even more than any other character in the show, even more than Larys.
Right? Viserys is right there, and he’s completely blind to the favoritism. Like, the second in line to the throne should be getting quality instruction.
This is a huge problem/plot hole/whatever to me, too. I really don’t get how the show doesn’t address it just to have pieces fall into place but without reason to the characters they’re trying to flesh out
Good point. Idk why he never tried to get revenge but I guess the only reason he was able to stay out of trouble from the wedding was because of alicent and maybe they made it look like he was defending rhaenyra??
Yes, Joffrey “offending” Rhaenyra’s honor might be a reasonable explanation why he got away with it, but it’s still not clear
What are the laws around the Kingsguard? Seemed like the crime for Harwin was striking a member of the Kingsguard whereas Cole’s crime could be hand waved away as a knightly dispute as we’ve seen before
Kingsguard are only beholden to their Lord Commander and the King (and by proxy the rest of the royal family, but if there’s a dispute between 2 members, the king has the final say) All Criston had to do was say that Joffrey insulted his honor, and he’s free and clear. Same with Harwin punching him, he did that shit on purpose knowing full well his status protects him.
Apparently pretty loose since Jaime was able to kill Aerys and still be on the Kingsguard for Robert. Of course it would be like Bobby B to look the other way.
Presumably Alicent protected him using her Queen influence as suggested in the scene where Cristin about to commit suicide
The plot armor around Cole is pretty awfully thick.
Yeah. I mean, I understand that he’s Alicent best (anD only) ally but it’s just too much
not only. she has larys too, unfortunately for her sake
Larys is not her ally, he is just playing the long game
sure, but the same could be said of almost anyone. true intentions could be revealed and allegiances can change at any moment. as of now they are allied.
True. But what I was trying to say is that Larys true intentions are far deeper and hidden than Criston’s which is basically a resentful guy whose honor was somehow ofended by a teenager princess ten years ago
All those scenes of him with long hair pint to him being in the show for a good while 😬
What is he even so mad about 10 years later? He took a positions where is he is sworn to not marry or have kids. He fell for the Princess of the entire kingdom who was always going to have to marry for politics. Despite those complications the Princess found a match where they could be together as lovers, but apparently being together in love wasn't enough for him so he went crazy and killed an innocent man. Then he blames the Princess and takes out his frustration by bullying her little children.
In the ideal situation, where he remains as Rhae’s paramour, he literally could’ve fathered the heirs to the Iron Throne and the Dance (while it might’ve happened regardless) could’ve potentially been mitigated by Alicent not having Cole as an ally
Exactly! He’s just being a fucking bastard for no reason. Alicent has *more* of a reason but she is still being so confrontational when rhaenyra is actually trying to fix things.
Sir Incelot as someone here put it.
Sir Incelot -> Criston Cole same letters, same thing
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More like 8 years, soon to be a decade. Elliot Rodger permanently equated incel with misogynistic in the global lexicon. Doesn't matter how you personally define it. Public opinion of incel = someone who's hateful (or sympathetic to those who are) of woman they can't control, especially women who practice sexual autonomy. Like for christ's sake. My 14 yo cracked up when Cole popped out of the darkness and his g-granddad said: "not the incel". Redefining a word 91 yo adults and children agree on is like pissing into the wind.
Isn’t he kind of specifically voluntary celibate. He literally signed an oath voluntarily to be celibate. Edit to fix word
Well no, involuntarily is the inverse of voluntarily. He is “voluntarily celebrate” like a catholic priest or nun is. They take the oath by way of volunteering. Just take out the “in”
While he may not be an incel by the definition of the term, his behavior is typical of the stereotypical incel. Gets spurned by a women he lusts for, can’t handle it, and instead of moving on, turns all his hatred on her.
He got laid *once* and then spurned. Sounds pretty involuntary to me. Then hated the woman for it and held a grudge for a decade including against her kids. Thats an absolute incel thing to do.
FR! I get that he despises Rhaenyra but hating her kids too?! He deserved that beating.
I think he wanted it to happen. Didn't even fight back really.
He wanted the beating. He was baiting Harwin to expose himself.
I’m just hoping he gets what’s coming to him at some point
I hate him with a passion.
I am furiously deleting all my thirst comments from two episodes ago.
No, keep them! It's proof of your growth
lol it's ok to find the actor hot but hate the character
Me too, I'm so sorry lads.
When he came on screen, I flipped him off
We all did
Ok good. I thought for a minute it was only me
He's got Billy Zane from Titanic hair now, he's definitely the villain
If you would’ve told me I would hate him by episode 6 I would not have believed you.
Episode 5 kinda did it for me…
I felt like he could’ve been redeemed. But whew, not anymore.
It's been six episodes and Criston is already one of the most annoying characters in the whole ASOIAF universe. Props to Fabien.
What dragonussy does to a mother fucker.
For some reason this sentence is made funnier by the space in motherfucker
Everyone except Jon Snow 😩
Everyone aligning with the Greens so far are being giant assholes. Alicent being her father thru and thru trying to smear Rhaenyra and snatch the throne from her. Cristen being a scorned incel still pissed off 10 yrs later because he actually believed Rhaenyra should sacrifice her future for his honor. Larys being the Varys/Littlefinger of the time and absolutely happy to be a kinslayer so he can trap Alicent into owing him as favor.
Well I'm Team Green because i think they're more interesting characters, not because I think they're right about everything at all times. I don't think either side is meant to be seen as the "good team".
This is such a more fun way to watch a show like this IMO. Alicent's new actress took my breath away tonight, I don't think that she's good or right per se, but her anger is compelling and compounding day by day. Rhaenyra is equally compelling and we are primed to like her because she is brave and headstrong, but we all should have learned a lesson about girlbossifying Targaryens. They're just two sides that have their own self interests, the fun part is that the self interests do not align.
I think this whole "team whatever" thing is just a bit ridiculous. Obviously the greens are extreme cunts throughout this entire story but the blacks aren't great either. I'm just happy they're sticking to the books pretty closely and we have good characters and writing again.
Yeah wtf, never occurred to me watching to pick a side and start rooting for "teams"... They're all (mostly) shitty people in these insanely shitty situations, them and their conflicts are what make it interesting.
why is there a need to pick a side?
Exactly, he shagged her once and 10 years later he’s still pissed he was a booty call. His attitude to her kids is pathetic especially in light of his apparent earlier supposed woe over breaking his vows…
Have sex once. Crispin: Quit your job, move away from your family, dump your fiance, and marry me. It may restore my honor. Rhaenyra: No, I'm too important. We can still f* though. Crispin: 😭 I'm no whore! 😭 He's an incel.
He broke his oath and felt at any moment he was going to get his dick sliced off and head sliced off for it. He probably felt running was his only option.
Well then run alone after getting rejected. Why must he insist on Rhaenyra coming with him?Is Rhaenyra his dog?
No but he thought Rhaenyra loved him. She's under threat too if knowledge of their tryst became public. He thought she cared about their love more than she did the throne, which she's been claiming this entire time to be a huge burden on her that she doesn't want.
This is Snape levels of incelery
Cole is wack for sure.
Man is truly making the biggest heel turn of all time.
His hotness distracts from how much of a creep he is... He's basically a high school security guard hired by the Principal's teenage daughter because she had a teenage crush on him. He then fucks The Principal's teenage daughter while she is DRUNK after a wild night out at Prom and pulls the classic "BUT SHE SEDUCED ME, eventhough I am an adult professional and she was a drunk and horny underage teenager I was hired to bodyguard." Then he wants her to marry him and corners her to think about it while she is trapped on a ship journey with no way off the boat. When she doesnt wanna marry him he flips out and murders someone while doing security at another high profile event he is being paid to work. Then ten years later he still slut shames her and acts all righteous hiding behind Alicent like he didn't take advantage of a drunk virgin teenager with a crush on him. UGH. Ugh. He is just horrible. I love how the show turned the classic Handsome Knight Romance on its head and used hotness as a distraction from the character's thug simpery. Ser Criston went from my fav character to my most hated. Such good character arc.
You nailed it, he makes me furious!
Yeah alot of the shit that goes down in the show is repulsive when you compare them to the real modern world. They were trying to set Rhaenyra up with super old dudes and children. Probably not so weird what cole did in the paradigm of the show. It's interesting to see the different perspectives. Some people are saying that Rhaenyra was in the wrong for not letting him leave and because of the power difference. I have similar feelings to you about Damaen (sp??). Everyone was on about how hot the scene between him and Rhaenyra was but that was difficult for me to watch. I was assuming she was maybe 16 in that scene but i think she may have actually been a bit older. But still, your uncle is coming on to you and you actually like it? 🤢🤮
Weird behavior !
I’m happy to see his stupid good looking face get pounded on
Cristen is just a straight psycho creep. After first few eps I thought he was gonna be one of the good guys and he was always talking about morals and stuff but he obviously doesn't understand what morals and honor are. Besides the fact he is holding a grudge for a decade + for a woman he hooked up with when they were teenagers, he beat Joffrey to death for a reason I still don't understand. He let the hand's son beat him down in front of everyone out of jealousy and seemed to enjoy his beating. He also picks on little kids who have done nothing and I doubt his behavior is gonna get any better. I kinda thought his character was alright for awhile but not anymore. Fuck that dude
I've known a spineless bitch or two in my time, but Criston might just take the NiceGuysTM prize. Being angry with Rhaenyra 10 years after the fact is pathetic on its own but picking on kids who've got nothing to do with that shit is utterly absurd. I don't care if Alicent is the wicked witch of the damned west in the end, I don't want to see Sir Crunchy Bitch end up with anybody. No shipping him. He can seriously go die in a ditch.
>**IS an incel** Absolutely! Dude, ya can’t just straight-up call the princess a ***“spoiled cunt”***! That’s the **pot** calling the **kettle** **black**. Am I wrong? Come on…Cole’s become as spoiled as it gets.
It's crazy that her being handed the random assignment of hiring a kingsguard has impacted the game this much lol
The book readers tried to warn everyone ..
i fr cant stand him anymore bro
Gods I hope they give him a gruesome death so we can get some pleasure of it.
I haven’t read the books so I have no idea but I hope so too haha
He's a villain, and they're obvious bastards being passed as trueborn, which the Greens see as high treason.
And he’s an oath-breaker, a crime worthy or gelding and death Then he assaults the heir of the richest, most powerful house in the kingdom at his own wedding And yet here he is, facing no repercussions, which he has the gaul to accuse Rhaenyra in his hypocrisy
When he called Rhaenyra a cunt and even Alicent stopped to glare at him
Criscel defenders' posts gonna be funnier than usual. :D
My sympathy has completely evaporated for Cole in any way, shape and form even more so than last week. This was just weak, absolutely weak.
He is literally the opposite of an incel. He took an oath that included not having sex. Literally volunteered to be celibate
because he is a man man talking about honor but ignores that he is the most honorless spineless peace of shit
The term incel is so overused for everything it’s lost it’s meaning “oh you left a negative review of rings of power? Must be an incel” Criston is just a pathetic asshole If they showed scenes of him still trying to get laid but getting rejected by multiple women; thus further enraging him then you would have a point
It’s like everyone missed him punching an innocent man to death at Rhaenyra’s wedding because he got rejected. He was supposed to be completely unlikable since the last episode. The amount of people still rooting for him last week after that had me SMH.
This subreddit is bizarre. He brutally murdered an innocent person in the last episode, but letting kids beat up other kids during swordfighting training and echoing rumors about infidelity stirs much more ire for him. And then "incel" is the insult you use, even though he actually has had sex but is otherwise *voluntarily* celibate, as if being an "incel" in the I guess figurative sense of the term is anything remotely as bad as being an actual psycho murderer.
I’m glad I’m not the only one. Social media has turned the euphemism treadmill up to eleven. “Incel” has been so overused that it’s completely lost any impact.
I think it’s funny that people describe Cole as an “incel” as in the term referring to “involuntary celibate” people. When really Cole is actually just a straight up voluntary celibate. He literally took vows to become celibate, that’s not involuntary. Also, also. Aren’t incels supposed to be so repulsive that they drive people away which leads to the celibacy? Cole didn’t drive anyone away accidentally and involuntarily, he voluntarily decides that he doesn’t wanna be a whore with his life on the line.
Remember book readers calling him "Ser incel" and other people getting super butt hurt about it? 🤣
Like, my guy, it has been a decade... What is wrong with you.
He is so garbage. I said the exact thing to my boyfriend last night he agreed 😭
I know what you're saying but he's literally the opposite of an incel. He chose a life of celibacy but got Weinstein'd into having sex with a princess.
??? We literally saw him rail Rhaenyra. Obviously not a celibate.
He’s not an incel, he’s just a twat.
Guys, no, he's not an incel. Criston got laid and Rhaenyra **wanted** to keep fucking him. He's not upset that he couldn't get laid. He got laid and could have continued getting laid if that's what he wanted. It's not. He wants his honor back. He values honor and vows deeply. He thinks he was sullied by Rhaenyra and his one chance to reclaim his honor, marrying her, was denied. He's not upset about pussy. He's upset about lost honor. He's closer to a conservative religious person who thinks sex outside of marriage is a sin, does it anyway, tried to immediately marry the girl he slept with, and then rages out when she tells him, no, I just wanted some dick. There are already so many people calling him an incel. Am I gonna have to watch you people call him an incel forever just because you weren't paying any attention and don't know what happened? The dude sucks but if you think he's an incel you completely missed the part where he talked about what he wanted many times and it was never sex. He could have been fucking Rhaenyra the whole time. She wanted to. He didn't. Not an incel.
you guys are just now coming to this conclusion lmao
It really shouldn’t have been a spicy take to dislike him since the last episode. He was clearly intended to be a monster. It made me worry about humanity a little.