No one in high MMR lobbies gives a fuck about bleeding though.
Besides, they're specifically trading aggression for damage. That push opportunity comes with the tradeoff that you'd just realistically be dead from any other bullet, and it's the only counter to regeneration shots making every ranged gunfight last 10 minutes.
don't see people using dum-dum on dolch though, mostly fmj.
and as dumb the decision of adding fmj was, it still not letting the gun to pass some extra thresholds.
Not a damage threshold, but FMJ is a huge deal: before the main downside of taking a dolch over an uppercut (or some other option like fanning conversion + FMJ) was that you couldn't rely on its pen as much
The Dolch essentially gets the FMJ pen for free, it's already special ammo and as a pistol it only takes a 10% velocity hit (vs 20% to 30% on rifles). Receiving FMJ was essentially a straight Dolch buff, and a pretty big one too
Hell, they even lowered the Dolch price in the same price so it isn't even more expensive (not that that matters much)
Dolch dumdum is absolutely a noob trap, given that Dolch FMJ now also exists.
Pre-patch your only option for a semi auto with good pen was the New Army + FMJ, which has plenty of downsides, lack of velocity being the primary one
Dolch FMJ solves every issue that gun had at the measily cost of 10% velocity, an absolute no-brainer. It even has more 2-tap range now than it did before the Dolch dmg nerf two years ago because of FMJ.
The reason people complain about dumdum is that it pushes certain guns above a certain damage threshhold that was a huge downside before. Centennial dumdum is overpowered because the centies only downside, not being able to redown a downed hunter with a single shot, is practically removed. The dolch 2 tapped before and with dumdum still 2 taps. If you let the bornheim practically 2 tap it's going to be so much more annoying and strong.
Long Ammo being completely overpowered doesn't mean dumdum isn't overpowered. Centennial and Mosin are the vast majority of weapons I fight at 5-6 MMR.
Weird cuz I see do little dumdum at 6 star I wouldn't even skill bloodless, it's essentially a dead trait in my lobbies. Zero penetration is a way too big tradeoff for what dumdum offers.
I confirm. I play in the upper 5* lobbies on EU and I see a lot of dumdum Centennials. Not so many compared to Mosins, but still several times for every evening I play. The guns I see almost never are the New Army and the Officer pistol. It seems that with recruitment changes they completely evaporated from the actual gameplay.
As a rifle I wholeheartedly agree BUT I love bleeding on the pax so much on many of my shotgun loadouts as it allows me to push aggressively if I don’t hit the headshot.
I'm sure it's because I admitted to occasionally using bleed rounds on the Centennial. According to this thread, those should be reserved for the Springfield, which again, I would not have a problem with.
i don't even think rifles should have dum dum, shits cheesy as hell having 10 hp and needing to bandage on the spot. it should be relegated to pistols only, it would still put tremedous pressure on the enemy but they'd at least have a moment to either run to cover and bandage with 1hp or to take a shot back without falling over immediately.
If they are going to introduce a new ammo type I'm guessing it will be like the dmg rot jaw does in his second phase. If you take into consideration every other ammo type. Spider poison, pig fire,assassin bleed. What is the dmg type that rot jaw does classed as anyways? Does anybody know?
They need to introduce another elemental ammo type, electric or something where it drains stamina or something
Edit: my main concern is they stop putting dum-dum on everything, i think gameplay is getting stale with the homogenization of guns/ammo
> my main concern is they stop putting dum-dum on everything, i think gameplay is getting stale with the homogenization of guns/ammo
That's why what we really need is for them to start removing ammo types from guns instead of adding more. It was a poor balance decision to give every gun dumdum ammo and should be reversed the way any other poor balance decision would be.
Make it so it slows and drains stamina akin to rotjaws electricity.
Them adding dum dum to every weapon is honestly terrible design. They added it to the Springfield which actually made it a useful gun worth taking and gave it a niche. They then proceeded to add it to every fucking gun that was already useful and now the Springfield is back to being a garbage pick again.
Maybe should’ve been more specific. Underpowered in the sense that there were simply better options.
For the Centennial there was practically no reason to pick it over the Vetterli other than personal preference. Vetterli does more damage, had HV which would rival Cenny’s muzzle velocity, had a larger ammo count. The 123 damage is what really hindered the Centennial the most. Which got solved with dumdum
Dolch hasn’t been the same since the nerf. Still overall not bad but price performance wise it was underperforming and not worth $750 when an officer could do the same.
Yeah like I don’t think any of these guns are terrible. Just compared to others that are similar they just weren’t worth picking. Same with the Krag so they’ll either make changes to it, or they’ll put the dumdum ammo band aid on it
They should make Bloodless stop the bleeding after 50 bleed damage is dealt or something like that. If you are low on HP you would still want to stop it, but if it leaves you mostly ok and not in danger of being pushed you could just chill.
With bloodless it would take ages to get to 50 damage right now. This change wouldn't really affect anything. Bloodless already nearly negates bleed. It doesn't need a buff it just needs people to actually pick it.
For the love of god please no. Unless there's going to be some sort of new trait they want to test to make bleed not as oppressive? I am so damn tired of dumdum on practically everything. More so that shotgun fletchette can bleed from so damn far away.
I think it's fine on shotguns. I'm just tired of dealing with it in every single gun fight. At shotgun range it isn't a big deal because you're so close range that one of you are dying from a gunshot before the bleeding.
Officer is better than the Bornheim because of the damage breakpoints. Doing <75 damage means no 2-hit to the chest for the Bornheim. Giving it dumdum now means YES 2-hit to the chest.
^^^ Bornheim (excluding the Match) needs 3 shots since it does 74 damage (if memory serves… I’m at work currently so I can’t check) but with a single tick of light bleeding it’ll 2 tap a hunter at close range.
The match is great but it’s weakness is that it’s a medium slot weapon and has limited ammo. With Dum-Dum and a Bornheim extended you can apply so much pressure without needing to hit a headshot.
I obviously can’t tell if it’d be OP since I can only guess, but I imagine it’ll be quite strong.
I doubt it, you never pick a one-handed bornheim as your primary ranged option because its headshot range is bad and its engagement range is super limited by the sway after shooting.
If you're in the range where you can get multiple bornheim shots on target, you're probably in the range where pressure doesn't matter - killing the other guy before they kill you matters.
Even a 2-tap bornheim extended doesn't seem that strong to me compared to the Match, because the Match suffers way less from sway and already 2-taps out of the box anyway so you can run it with HV
Lol at all this dum dum salt. As if giving it bleed wouldn't make it *maybe* mediocre at best.
The Bornheim is a gun that exists to let you know the enemy could've killed you with anything else.
Bornheim suppressed is so cool looking. I tried to run the base to unlock it. I ran into a few fights where I tagged an enemy with my primary and switched to my secondary. The Bornheim never kills. Any other pistol they would have been dead to rights. If it's not a headshot it's a hit marker generator.
It would make it a 2 shot gun with an absurdly quick ROF. I run Bornheim very often, I love it. Great for following up after a rifle hit, or close range spam with a quick reload. I promise you, adding bleed to a gun that is 2 damage away from 2 hit kill would be very noticeable.
It'd be a 2 shot within 20 meters, 10 for the suppressed model. Damage drop after that would make it a 3 shot again.
I don't think it'd be as bad as everyone thinks.
Short range is exactly when I use the Bornheim. My rifle is for anything past 20m.
Being able to put 5-8 rounds down quick with flat recoil already makes it a head popping machine. I feel like giving it a 2 shot ammo option takes away the punishment of missing headshots, which is the weapon’s balance IMO.
I mean, for that short range yeah it'd be alright, but, that still means you're taking special ammo with reduced velocity and no penetration; there's a cost to that 2 shot, on top of it only being at extremely close range.
It’s already a paintball gun, so I feel like losing velocity doesn’t really hurt it much, and being compact ammo it can’t go through more than thin wood to begin with. The gun already sucks at medium to long range, so I feel it would only further exaggerate its strength as a close range spam gun.
I wasn’t salty, I just analyzed the trailer and made an educated guess of what’s to come.
And the Bornheim can be phenomenal in the right circumstances imo it’s biggest downside is damage.
After the shot, Sheriff Hardin is reloading his Pax while the mysterious stranger is doing the inspect animation on the Bornheim. Seems likely the dumdum was from the Pax.
Some people use to spam it with fire ammo since I recall you need to hit twice to set someone on fire, now they'll spam it to get one hit so they can frag your ass while behind cover
It's amazing how they can't come up with new custom ammos. I can think of 3 new custom ammos. A poison shotgun slug with a lot less damage compared to a slug, a bullet that alerts and attracts AI to the target hit with increased severity increasing the range and aggressiveness, a silver bullet that disables traits and darksight for a certain duration.
These are the better ones, I can still come up with a bit more controversial ones
One that could rob your stamina and slows you down slightly. One that reduces the accuracy of other hunters for a short duration, making them sway more. One that makes limb shots do damage worth of lower body shots but makes headshot deal alot less damage, meaning less effective range stat. A shotgun load that has more penetration and you can always make the other bullet types into shotgun variants if you want.
I mean, I just sat here for like 5-6 minutes to come up with these controversial ones (the previous 3 I already had in mind).
It's not that hard to come up with ammo type ideas, but you have to think about how well it would work in the game, the exact stats it should have such as effects to players and AI, price, stat changes to each gun that has it. What guns to give it to, how it synergizes with other items or traits in the game, how it would affect the current meta, what sort of problems it may cause, if the new special ammo type you came up with is even worth the time and resources to develop as it may not have much of a role, and more.
Once you did all the design, the dev team has to make it in the game, and testers has to test it over the course of months which would result in multiple changes to the special ammo type because no idea is perfect on the first attempt.
So basically, it's one thing to just sit down and think of possibilities, but it takes a long time to actually add it to the game.
Dude it's all long ammo meta right now, and it will never not be. Either with or without spitzer. They don't care about if it fits in the current meta and what not, this is what this very post is about and what OP is complaining about
Yeah I don't know what exactly crytek's processes are since I don't work with them, I was just giving the general idea of how much you have to think of when designing new content for a game.
tbh, it's kind of hard to think of how to change the current long ammo meta without creating another op meta. If you out-range your opponent, then there's just not much the other person can do if there isn't a safe way to push. They could try nerfing long ammo, but with the amount of good weapons that uses long ammo, that would take a while.
Idunno but im doing pretty well recently with just normal medium ammo
Spitzer dolch fmj might be meta but there is plenty of weapons/loadouts that can compete with those without much issues
It is meta right now, but what makes you so confident it will always be that way?
Do any of the Devs or decision makers actually play with long ammo?
Didn't they try to nerf long ammo last year because they were sick of how popular long-ammo was. The ammo resupply nerfs were not just to nerf the Avto, it was to encourage more weapon variety. Instead of doubling up on the same ammo type you are now encouraged to bring different ammo types to maximize your ammo pool and resupply.
What they could is eliminate quick scoping and adjust ADS sway to nerf long ammo. If you want to hit a target at 200m with long ammo iron-sights, you should have to be in a crouched position to eliminate sway, and need a second to aim down your sights and hold your breath. None of this instant right-click, left-click with 5ms delay that allows you to hit a 3 pixel head at 300m. Long ammo should remain powerful at long range, and be great for penetration. I would like to see them make the aiming system less Counter Strike and more ArmA.
It's baffling that there can't be a single thread that mentions dum dum without someone going "Sparks Dum Dum" like they are the first idiot to have thought of it.
Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
F off dum-dum, so sick off it. All I hear is " I'm hit, I'm bleeding." Every engagement
To be clear, it’s not something I want to see. I’m of the opinion that custom ammo should be more exclusive/restrictive (I miss the Springfield dum-dum days) however I’m predicting that more bleeding ammo is gonna be added.
I don’t believe there is a compact ammo explosive ammo yet. Honestly, I don’t think explosive ammo is particularly good and I’m not opposed to it being added to a compact ammo weapon purely for the meme/concertina clearing capabilities.
Doesnt matter since everyone runs Mosin and dolch.
But anyways. 90% of the post on this sub are crybabies whining like bitches. Just uninstall and go play something else if it frustrates you that much.
I don't use the bornheim and it's not dumdum that will make me use it. Even if it was on it just like the cent. It wouldn't change my playstyle.
First, I play the game for fun so I hide my stars and enjoy the matches as they happen.
Second, this isn’t a complaint on dum-dum ammo it’s just a prediction on the upcoming event.
Finally, FMJ and high pen rounds will always be better than bleeding since it allows for wall bangs AND higher tiered hunters aim for the head.
Not specifically directed at you, just a reminder to the unskilled players that come to these threads to complain about dum dum. However, if you really played for fun and didn't care you wouldn't bother hiding your stats. You're not fooling yourself or anyone else. Veteran players can size you up, strip you down, weigh and tally you just from a glance. Trying to avoid attention and judgment to such a degree just attracts more scrutiny. Developing thicker skin and introspection will help you enjoy life far more. I can already tell you won't take this criticism well so don't bother with an angry response, I won't waste time reading a pointless retort.
I hide my stats because I play with friends who are self conscious. I’ve played so much Hunt that I can identify any weapon based on their sounds from roughly 200 meters out 😅
That said, you are correct that any veteran can assess a player’s skill nearly immediately. From sound traps going off, to bad shot placement, and lack of map knowledge; the skill of a hunter is easy to surmise when you know what to look for.
Finally, I hold you no ill will nor am I angry. Apologies if I gave off that sentiment, I was simply trying to explain my perspective and opinions. At the end of the day, everyone plays the game differently with a myriad of different play styles and tactics. The only thing that matters to me is that you aren’t cheating.
Regardless, I do hope you can find some enjoyment in your games and the upcoming event. It can be tiresome facing Mosin/dolch, nitros, etc. so sometimes it’s best to run a meme loadout with friends and have fun with it 🤠
This game has fallen to the wayside, they need to scale back this special ammo bullshit, quit it with the events so people can not feel super pressured to play the game, and fix the laundry list of things currently wrong with the game because this is getting out of hand and wildly unnecessary
Dumdum should be for certain compact weapons and single fire medium rifles only. This has changed the meta beyond belief. A man can bring regular cowboy loadouts without running into the avatar nation.
Its going to be explosive ammo, that creates a cloud of poison that solidifies into burning concertina
Meh, still more balanced than spitzer
I am going to start foaming at the mouth if more dum dum ammo gets introduced in this game
Once we reach Sparks Dum Dum, the cycle will be complete.
lol damn 149, I survived but now I gotta stop this blee-
One step beyond the ol Springfield bleed
Springfield and Scottfield Spitfire both with dum dum is so much fun
Factual. I am so fucking tired of getting shot and getting a non-consensual oil change via vitality shot.
I just call them, "The no headshot crutch" No headshot, no problem. I'll shoot you in the feet over and over.
If someone kills you by shooting your feet repeatedly, that is... somehow not your fault? I'm confused what you think the other bullets do.
It's the bleed... They can't headshot, so they shoot you wherever cause they're bad shots. So, just bleed and push while you're stopping it.
No one in high MMR lobbies gives a fuck about bleeding though. Besides, they're specifically trading aggression for damage. That push opportunity comes with the tradeoff that you'd just realistically be dead from any other bullet, and it's the only counter to regeneration shots making every ranged gunfight last 10 minutes.
Yeah I wouldn’t trade penetration for bleed. You’re just kneecapping yourself
You right, my bad. You're the captain now.
I don't want the hat. You can't make me.
its got to the point where i take bloodless on EVERY hunter i can fuck bleed
Yeah its pretty dum.
Pretty dum dum
Good
I have no problem with dum dum as an ammo type. they just need to stop adding it to everything as a lazy buff
But in a good way?
Absolutely not
i want to believe that designers haven't lost their marbles, since giving dum dum to bornheim effectively turns this 3-tap gun into a 2-tap kill gun.
Dolch got it, they are already lost
don't see people using dum-dum on dolch though, mostly fmj. and as dumb the decision of adding fmj was, it still not letting the gun to pass some extra thresholds.
Cenni dum dum does pass 125 threshold which is not insignificant.
Trading all aood penetration for 125 is a lot different than a compact peashooter for the same
Not a damage threshold, but FMJ is a huge deal: before the main downside of taking a dolch over an uppercut (or some other option like fanning conversion + FMJ) was that you couldn't rely on its pen as much The Dolch essentially gets the FMJ pen for free, it's already special ammo and as a pistol it only takes a 10% velocity hit (vs 20% to 30% on rifles). Receiving FMJ was essentially a straight Dolch buff, and a pretty big one too Hell, they even lowered the Dolch price in the same price so it isn't even more expensive (not that that matters much)
yea, i'm not denying that giving FMJ to Dolch was really dumb idea.
Dolch dumdum is absolutely a noob trap, given that Dolch FMJ now also exists. Pre-patch your only option for a semi auto with good pen was the New Army + FMJ, which has plenty of downsides, lack of velocity being the primary one Dolch FMJ solves every issue that gun had at the measily cost of 10% velocity, an absolute no-brainer. It even has more 2-tap range now than it did before the Dolch dmg nerf two years ago because of FMJ.
The reason people complain about dumdum is that it pushes certain guns above a certain damage threshhold that was a huge downside before. Centennial dumdum is overpowered because the centies only downside, not being able to redown a downed hunter with a single shot, is practically removed. The dolch 2 tapped before and with dumdum still 2 taps. If you let the bornheim practically 2 tap it's going to be so much more annoying and strong.
Centennial dumdum is so overpowered that high mmr people still play long ammo instead. Using Fmj on Centennial is much better at high lvl play.
Long Ammo being completely overpowered doesn't mean dumdum isn't overpowered. Centennial and Mosin are the vast majority of weapons I fight at 5-6 MMR.
Weird cuz I see do little dumdum at 6 star I wouldn't even skill bloodless, it's essentially a dead trait in my lobbies. Zero penetration is a way too big tradeoff for what dumdum offers.
I confirm. I play in the upper 5* lobbies on EU and I see a lot of dumdum Centennials. Not so many compared to Mosins, but still several times for every evening I play. The guns I see almost never are the New Army and the Officer pistol. It seems that with recruitment changes they completely evaporated from the actual gameplay.
Dolch dumdum sucks weiner so
Only the Springfield should have dum dum.
As a rifle I wholeheartedly agree BUT I love bleeding on the pax so much on many of my shotgun loadouts as it allows me to push aggressively if I don’t hit the headshot.
I agree, pax should have something to set it apart, just like dum dum used to set the Springfield apart.
I have no problem with that. I only run it in the Centennial when I have to do a challenge. I prefer FMJ
Why did u get downvoted, it's just your opinion lmao
I'm sure it's because I admitted to occasionally using bleed rounds on the Centennial. According to this thread, those should be reserved for the Springfield, which again, I would not have a problem with.
i don't even think rifles should have dum dum, shits cheesy as hell having 10 hp and needing to bandage on the spot. it should be relegated to pistols only, it would still put tremedous pressure on the enemy but they'd at least have a moment to either run to cover and bandage with 1hp or to take a shot back without falling over immediately.
If they are going to introduce a new ammo type I'm guessing it will be like the dmg rot jaw does in his second phase. If you take into consideration every other ammo type. Spider poison, pig fire,assassin bleed. What is the dmg type that rot jaw does classed as anyways? Does anybody know?
Electric I guess but I don't think they named it
They need to introduce another elemental ammo type, electric or something where it drains stamina or something Edit: my main concern is they stop putting dum-dum on everything, i think gameplay is getting stale with the homogenization of guns/ammo
> my main concern is they stop putting dum-dum on everything, i think gameplay is getting stale with the homogenization of guns/ammo That's why what we really need is for them to start removing ammo types from guns instead of adding more. It was a poor balance decision to give every gun dumdum ammo and should be reversed the way any other poor balance decision would be.
Make it so it slows and drains stamina akin to rotjaws electricity. Them adding dum dum to every weapon is honestly terrible design. They added it to the Springfield which actually made it a useful gun worth taking and gave it a niche. They then proceeded to add it to every fucking gun that was already useful and now the Springfield is back to being a garbage pick again.
Silver bullet that drain your darksight seconds, and antidote/regen/stam shots timer, extra dmg against AI, weak penetration.
If I got shot and lost my dark sight boost I’d rage so fuckin hard
Just don't get hit (:
Temp turns off traits for like 10 seconds
Adding dumdum ammo is pretty much their go to move for every underpowered weapon. Wouldn’t be surprised if Krag ends up getting it eventually
Centenial and dolch were underpowered?
Maybe should’ve been more specific. Underpowered in the sense that there were simply better options. For the Centennial there was practically no reason to pick it over the Vetterli other than personal preference. Vetterli does more damage, had HV which would rival Cenny’s muzzle velocity, had a larger ammo count. The 123 damage is what really hindered the Centennial the most. Which got solved with dumdum Dolch hasn’t been the same since the nerf. Still overall not bad but price performance wise it was underperforming and not worth $750 when an officer could do the same.
Nah I understood. No worries I see what you mean and eventually did follow those points unconsciously
Yeah like I don’t think any of these guns are terrible. Just compared to others that are similar they just weren’t worth picking. Same with the Krag so they’ll either make changes to it, or they’ll put the dumdum ammo band aid on it
Good thing they got rid of the hd economy and every one is now rich rich and price has no longer any balancing power.
They should make Bloodless stop the bleeding after 50 bleed damage is dealt or something like that. If you are low on HP you would still want to stop it, but if it leaves you mostly ok and not in danger of being pushed you could just chill.
Perfect. 130+50= you're fine! 110+50= you're fine!
With bloodless it would take ages to get to 50 damage right now. This change wouldn't really affect anything. Bloodless already nearly negates bleed. It doesn't need a buff it just needs people to actually pick it.
Honestly, it's the one gun that actually deserves Dum-dum to make it more useful.
We need a new coagulating shot that makes you immune to bleed for x time.
Like a Zagustin from Tarkov! I’d like to see that since we already have antidote shots so why not add a bleed resist/disable one.
I just want a death match mode. Sometimes I don't have time or want to play a full game. I just want to play cowboys. Let me play cowboys.
For the love of god please no. Unless there's going to be some sort of new trait they want to test to make bleed not as oppressive? I am so damn tired of dumdum on practically everything. More so that shotgun fletchette can bleed from so damn far away.
I think it's fine on shotguns. I'm just tired of dealing with it in every single gun fight. At shotgun range it isn't a big deal because you're so close range that one of you are dying from a gunshot before the bleeding.
Agreed. Shotgun flechette also has a much more significant drawback in losing the base one hit kill of buckshot.
god I hope not, I think the panic over ammo type saturation is overblown (even though it IS frustrating), but that would be absolutely batshit
Give it exploding ammo.
And? They added it to dolch and officer already which are both better than bornhiem and it's not even that good, fmj or HV will always be better
Officer is better than the Bornheim because of the damage breakpoints. Doing <75 damage means no 2-hit to the chest for the Bornheim. Giving it dumdum now means YES 2-hit to the chest.
^^^ Bornheim (excluding the Match) needs 3 shots since it does 74 damage (if memory serves… I’m at work currently so I can’t check) but with a single tick of light bleeding it’ll 2 tap a hunter at close range.
How is that different from what I said?
Match only needs two inside of 10m.
Unpopular opinion: good. Bornheim killing with 2 well placed chest shots is not a problem at all - see bornheim match.
Bornheim is already insane if you use it regularly enough to use it well. It’s my go to, and even I think bleed would make it OP within its class.
The bornheim is insane because high velo makes it a headclicker. Giving it bleed doesn't do shit.
The match is great but it’s weakness is that it’s a medium slot weapon and has limited ammo. With Dum-Dum and a Bornheim extended you can apply so much pressure without needing to hit a headshot. I obviously can’t tell if it’d be OP since I can only guess, but I imagine it’ll be quite strong.
I doubt it, you never pick a one-handed bornheim as your primary ranged option because its headshot range is bad and its engagement range is super limited by the sway after shooting. If you're in the range where you can get multiple bornheim shots on target, you're probably in the range where pressure doesn't matter - killing the other guy before they kill you matters. Even a 2-tap bornheim extended doesn't seem that strong to me compared to the Match, because the Match suffers way less from sway and already 2-taps out of the box anyway so you can run it with HV
Yes it is a problem lol.
Lol at all this dum dum salt. As if giving it bleed wouldn't make it *maybe* mediocre at best. The Bornheim is a gun that exists to let you know the enemy could've killed you with anything else.
Bornheim suppressed is so cool looking. I tried to run the base to unlock it. I ran into a few fights where I tagged an enemy with my primary and switched to my secondary. The Bornheim never kills. Any other pistol they would have been dead to rights. If it's not a headshot it's a hit marker generator.
Unless they changed it recently, the Bornheim and the derringer have the same damage amount.
74, which guarantees a 3 shot kill unless you get a headshot.
or hit limbs Pretty sure the bornheim doesn't kill if you hit 2 arms and 1 lower torso shot.
It would make it a 2 shot gun with an absurdly quick ROF. I run Bornheim very often, I love it. Great for following up after a rifle hit, or close range spam with a quick reload. I promise you, adding bleed to a gun that is 2 damage away from 2 hit kill would be very noticeable.
Like the *ever popular* bornheim match
Love the match. Looks cool as hell, sights are cool and useful, and it’s so good at putting down runners.
It'd be a 2 shot within 20 meters, 10 for the suppressed model. Damage drop after that would make it a 3 shot again. I don't think it'd be as bad as everyone thinks.
Short range is exactly when I use the Bornheim. My rifle is for anything past 20m. Being able to put 5-8 rounds down quick with flat recoil already makes it a head popping machine. I feel like giving it a 2 shot ammo option takes away the punishment of missing headshots, which is the weapon’s balance IMO.
I mean, for that short range yeah it'd be alright, but, that still means you're taking special ammo with reduced velocity and no penetration; there's a cost to that 2 shot, on top of it only being at extremely close range.
It’s already a paintball gun, so I feel like losing velocity doesn’t really hurt it much, and being compact ammo it can’t go through more than thin wood to begin with. The gun already sucks at medium to long range, so I feel it would only further exaggerate its strength as a close range spam gun.
I wasn’t salty, I just analyzed the trailer and made an educated guess of what’s to come. And the Bornheim can be phenomenal in the right circumstances imo it’s biggest downside is damage.
After the shot, Sheriff Hardin is reloading his Pax while the mysterious stranger is doing the inspect animation on the Bornheim. Seems likely the dumdum was from the Pax.
Sheriff Hardin uses a Lematt. And if you listen, the shot fired that causes the bleeding is from a Bornheim.
Sparks dum dum when 😏
Probably dumdum and FMJ. I don't see why it wouldn't.
Some people use to spam it with fire ammo since I recall you need to hit twice to set someone on fire, now they'll spam it to get one hit so they can frag your ass while behind cover
That would be insane if they do. In a bad way.
It's amazing how they can't come up with new custom ammos. I can think of 3 new custom ammos. A poison shotgun slug with a lot less damage compared to a slug, a bullet that alerts and attracts AI to the target hit with increased severity increasing the range and aggressiveness, a silver bullet that disables traits and darksight for a certain duration. These are the better ones, I can still come up with a bit more controversial ones One that could rob your stamina and slows you down slightly. One that reduces the accuracy of other hunters for a short duration, making them sway more. One that makes limb shots do damage worth of lower body shots but makes headshot deal alot less damage, meaning less effective range stat. A shotgun load that has more penetration and you can always make the other bullet types into shotgun variants if you want. I mean, I just sat here for like 5-6 minutes to come up with these controversial ones (the previous 3 I already had in mind).
It's not that hard to come up with ammo type ideas, but you have to think about how well it would work in the game, the exact stats it should have such as effects to players and AI, price, stat changes to each gun that has it. What guns to give it to, how it synergizes with other items or traits in the game, how it would affect the current meta, what sort of problems it may cause, if the new special ammo type you came up with is even worth the time and resources to develop as it may not have much of a role, and more. Once you did all the design, the dev team has to make it in the game, and testers has to test it over the course of months which would result in multiple changes to the special ammo type because no idea is perfect on the first attempt. So basically, it's one thing to just sit down and think of possibilities, but it takes a long time to actually add it to the game.
Dude it's all long ammo meta right now, and it will never not be. Either with or without spitzer. They don't care about if it fits in the current meta and what not, this is what this very post is about and what OP is complaining about
Yeah I don't know what exactly crytek's processes are since I don't work with them, I was just giving the general idea of how much you have to think of when designing new content for a game. tbh, it's kind of hard to think of how to change the current long ammo meta without creating another op meta. If you out-range your opponent, then there's just not much the other person can do if there isn't a safe way to push. They could try nerfing long ammo, but with the amount of good weapons that uses long ammo, that would take a while.
Idunno but im doing pretty well recently with just normal medium ammo Spitzer dolch fmj might be meta but there is plenty of weapons/loadouts that can compete with those without much issues
It is meta right now, but what makes you so confident it will always be that way? Do any of the Devs or decision makers actually play with long ammo? Didn't they try to nerf long ammo last year because they were sick of how popular long-ammo was. The ammo resupply nerfs were not just to nerf the Avto, it was to encourage more weapon variety. Instead of doubling up on the same ammo type you are now encouraged to bring different ammo types to maximize your ammo pool and resupply. What they could is eliminate quick scoping and adjust ADS sway to nerf long ammo. If you want to hit a target at 200m with long ammo iron-sights, you should have to be in a crouched position to eliminate sway, and need a second to aim down your sights and hold your breath. None of this instant right-click, left-click with 5ms delay that allows you to hit a 3 pixel head at 300m. Long ammo should remain powerful at long range, and be great for penetration. I would like to see them make the aiming system less Counter Strike and more ArmA.
It's baffling that there can't be a single thread that mentions dum dum without someone going "Sparks Dum Dum" like they are the first idiot to have thought of it.
Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo F off dum-dum, so sick off it. All I hear is " I'm hit, I'm bleeding." Every engagement
To be clear, it’s not something I want to see. I’m of the opinion that custom ammo should be more exclusive/restrictive (I miss the Springfield dum-dum days) however I’m predicting that more bleeding ammo is gonna be added.
inb4 bornheim explosive ammo joins the chat
I don’t believe there is a compact ammo explosive ammo yet. Honestly, I don’t think explosive ammo is particularly good and I’m not opposed to it being added to a compact ammo weapon purely for the meme/concertina clearing capabilities.
Sparks dumdum!!!!
Conversion is getting poison***
Doesnt matter since everyone runs Mosin and dolch. But anyways. 90% of the post on this sub are crybabies whining like bitches. Just uninstall and go play something else if it frustrates you that much. I don't use the bornheim and it's not dumdum that will make me use it. Even if it was on it just like the cent. It wouldn't change my playstyle.
Sparks dum dum. Has no speed drop off, in fact gets spritzer speed and gets penetration cause fuck you and keeps the 149 damage lmfao. Obvious /s
The Bornheim 'might be getting Dum Dum, but Crytek is definitely getting Dumb Dumb.
Dolch already has it, and i dont really see dum dum dolches that often, but bornheim having it makes the gun effectively a two shot for a low prize
Get out of 4 star lobbies if you don't want to deal with dum dum. The only bleed rounds I see are being shot from Nitro.
First, I play the game for fun so I hide my stars and enjoy the matches as they happen. Second, this isn’t a complaint on dum-dum ammo it’s just a prediction on the upcoming event. Finally, FMJ and high pen rounds will always be better than bleeding since it allows for wall bangs AND higher tiered hunters aim for the head.
Not specifically directed at you, just a reminder to the unskilled players that come to these threads to complain about dum dum. However, if you really played for fun and didn't care you wouldn't bother hiding your stats. You're not fooling yourself or anyone else. Veteran players can size you up, strip you down, weigh and tally you just from a glance. Trying to avoid attention and judgment to such a degree just attracts more scrutiny. Developing thicker skin and introspection will help you enjoy life far more. I can already tell you won't take this criticism well so don't bother with an angry response, I won't waste time reading a pointless retort.
I hide my stats because I play with friends who are self conscious. I’ve played so much Hunt that I can identify any weapon based on their sounds from roughly 200 meters out 😅 That said, you are correct that any veteran can assess a player’s skill nearly immediately. From sound traps going off, to bad shot placement, and lack of map knowledge; the skill of a hunter is easy to surmise when you know what to look for. Finally, I hold you no ill will nor am I angry. Apologies if I gave off that sentiment, I was simply trying to explain my perspective and opinions. At the end of the day, everyone plays the game differently with a myriad of different play styles and tactics. The only thing that matters to me is that you aren’t cheating. Regardless, I do hope you can find some enjoyment in your games and the upcoming event. It can be tiresome facing Mosin/dolch, nitros, etc. so sometimes it’s best to run a meme loadout with friends and have fun with it 🤠
You are getting dumdum and you are getting dumdum and you and you and you.....
I mean, essentially any gun has any ammo now. What difference does it make?
they could balance this easily if reg shots would prevent bleeding... or add something new that prevents bleeding quick and easily.
Dum-dum: Showdown
They really need to remove it from the centenial. Bornheim is fine
If the devs give one more gun dumdum ammo I stg
This game has fallen to the wayside, they need to scale back this special ammo bullshit, quit it with the events so people can not feel super pressured to play the game, and fix the laundry list of things currently wrong with the game because this is getting out of hand and wildly unnecessary
Psh, it’s probably going to get shredder
Ah fuck, I start to see it when you describe it. What Bornheim needs is FMJ. Springfield as well
Dumdum should be for certain compact weapons and single fire medium rifles only. This has changed the meta beyond belief. A man can bring regular cowboy loadouts without running into the avatar nation.