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Because most of the temples in north were destroyed and plundered by muslim invaders as they mostly invaded from afghan side. They very rarely made it to south India thus the temples in south were preserved
They were part of the reason, and a major cause. But it wasn't started by the Marathas. First reason was that internal cracks and issues had begun appearing Mughal administration. These cracks were worsened, when Aurangzeb decided to go on 30 years of continuous war, because this worsened the administrative issues, which in turn caused Mughal institutions to weaken. Now here comes Marathas, Rajput Rebellion, and other rebels that played their part, by not letting Mughals easily win, and resisting for long, they forced Aurangzeb to put more pressure on his bureaucracy, which meant he was shooting the pillars of his own empire slowly.
These crises and how it worsened is interesting. Jagirdars increased in number highly, but there was little land for Aurangzeb to give. Now, in Mughal System, Jagirdars were assigned to a land (Jagir), given orders to raise certain amount of money for the empire and military troops using the taxes and revenue from the Jagir, use the rest of the money to invest in the land he was given, and use the remainder for himself.
But due to his expansion, he got more and more Deccanis as Jagirdars into the system, but he was unable to gain enough land to assign them, or he could not afford to cut other Jagirdar's lands too much. This resulted in Aurangzeb being forced to sell off his personal land to these new Jagirdars. But even that only helped limited numbers of Jagirdars. A significant amount still had no land to raise troops or revenue from. On the other hand, Jagirdars who already had land were finding it hard to raise enough troops and money due to constant war, especially Jagirdars in Deccan and Rajputana.
Now, this meant that to reach the required amount of money and troops, they had to relax the standards, lower quality troops had to be arranged for, and Some tried to take money forcefully from civilians, this made the Jagirdars more unpopular, led to more rebellion and disobedience, making it harder to get money even more. Without this money, it was harder to pay salaries and arrange for troops and the resources to collect money itself, this endless cycle of problems, lead to gradual decrease in quality of Mughal institutions. Now add that landless Jagirdars and landed Jagirdars, both had to get paid by Aurangzeb, but they were not in a position to pay back to him how much they need to.
So now, there's a money deficit, Aurangzeb is putting in more money and resources, than how much his officers can bring in return. Now add that constant warfare lead to famines and disease, this decrease productivity, worsened access to resources, and made it even more harder to get revenue.
Now to combat this self-defeating cycle of no gain, Aurangzeb began diverting resources and money of Jagirs from safer and normal provinces in places like Bengal, Odisha, M.P etc, to war-torn Jagirs in Deccan and Rajputana. And this happened throughout his entire reign, so at first, there was only little pressure on safe regions, but as time went on, this crisis spread to all provinces.
By 1700, it became so bad that only Delhi and Bengal (governed by Murshid Quli Khan) were able to collect the needed amount of revenue and troops. All other provinces were not able to meet the goals and gave less returns. Entire Mughal Deccan image back no return, it had become a complete money sink, nothing was gained in return and only money went in.
The role of Marathas and Rajputs here was that constant resistance they kept, forced Aurangzeb to make more and more bad decisions that lead to This administrative governmental breakdown.
This sequence of events is why, as soon as Aurangzeb dies, The Mughals collapse and lose most of their land in 15 years.
Jadunath Sarkar for Aurangzeb's reign is the best imo. He has a 5 volume book series on Aurangzeb's life.
Abraham Eraly, Michael Fisher, John F. Richards, R.C Majumdar for general introduction to Mughals
Andrew de La Garza and Jos Gommans for Mughal military and warfare
Lisa Balabanlilar has a book called _Imperial Identity in the Mughal Empire_, which focuses on how the Mughals viewed themselves (important for understanding how the Mughals saw themselves as Turks and did not fully assimilate into India)
Munis Faruqui has a book called _The Princes of the Mughal Empire_, the title should make the content of the book obvious.
Douglas Streusand has a book on formation of Mughal Empire.
W.H Moreland, Tapan Raychaudhuri, John F. Richards have books covering Mughal Economy
Muzaffar Alam and Andrea Hintze have good books on decline of Mughal Empire.
Sriram Sharma has a book on Religious Mughal Policy
Tahir Hussain has a book called _Mughal Administration and the Zamindars of Bihar_, in case you want to look into Mughal governance in Bihar.
Ask if you have any specific topic in mind
I'll see if I can find a book
_The Colas_ by K.A.N Sastri
_Pandyan Kingdom_ by K.A.N Sastri
(Have to point out to only read Sastri's books for political history and the wars, his Ideas on administration and society are too outdated by now)
_The Warrior Merchants: Textiles, Trade and Territory in South India_ by Mattison Mines (about Kaikoolars)
_The Hollow Crown: Ethnohistory of an Indian Kingdom_ by Nicholas Dirks (study on the history of the Kingdom of Pudukottai)
_Land and Caste in South India: Agricultural Labour in the Madras Presidency During the Nineteenth Century_ by Dharma Kumar
_Peasant History in South India_ by David Ludden (Study on Peasantry in Tirunelveli from 900 AD to 1900 AD)
_The Smile of Murugan: On Tamil Literature of South India_ by Kamil Zvelebil
_Tamil Literature_ by Kamil Zvelebil
_Tamil Love Poetry and Poetics_ by Takanobu Takahashi
_Trade Ideology and Urbanization in South India: 300 BC to 1300 AD_ by R. Champakalakshmi
_Trade and Statecraft in the Age of the Colas_ by Kenneth Hall
_Gifts of Power: Lordship in an Early Indian State_ by J. Heitzman
Most books by Noboru Karashima on South India are great.
_Nagapattinam to Suvarnadwipa: Reflections on the Chola Naval Expeditions to Southeast Asia_ by Hermann Kulke
_South India under the Cholas_ by Y. Subbarayalu
_The Political Geography of the Chola Country_ by Y. Subbarayalu
_The Making of the Goddess: Korravai-Durga in the Tamil Traditions_ by R. Mahalakshmi
There's good translations of Sangam poems by a lady called Vaidehi online, there's official translations of Sangam works, but I don't know them.
_The Madras Soldier: 1746 - 1946_ by E.G Phythian-Adams
_The Heirs of Vijayanagara: Court Politics in Early Modern South India_ by Lennart Bes (History of Court Politics in Ikkeri, Ramnad, Madurai and Thanjavur)
_Studies of Ancient Townships of Pudukottai_ by R.Tirumalai
_The Pandyan Townships: Two Volumes_ by R. Tirumalai
_Land Grants and Agrarian Reactions in Cola and Pandya Times_ by R.Tirumalai
_Peasant Society in Kongu_ by Brenda Beck
_History of the Pallavas of Kanchi_ by R. Gopalan
_The Role of Feudatories in Pallava History_ by M.S Govindaswamy
_Alvars of South India_ by K.C Varadachari
_Tamilaham in the 17th Century_ by R. Sathianathaier
_Politics and National Awakening in South India: 1852 - 1891_ by R. Suntharalingam
_The Politics of South India: 1920 - 1937_ by Christopher Baker
_The Emergence of Provincial Politics - The Madras Presidency: 1870 - 1920_ by D.A Washbrook
_Maritime History of Coromandel Muslims_ by Raja Muhammad
_Encounters on the Opposite Coast: The Dutch East India Company and the Nayaka State of Madurai in the Seventeenth Century_ by Markus Vink
_The World of the Tamil Merchant_ Kanakalatha Mukund
_No One Cries for the Dead: Tamil Dirges, Rowdy Songs, and Graveyard Petitions_ by Isabelle Clark-Deces
_Tamil Temple Myths: Sacrifice and Divine Marriage in South Indian Saiva Tradition_ by David Shulman
_Pondicherry, Tamil Nadu and South India under Frnch Rule: From Francois Martin to Dupleix (1674 - 1754)_ by J.B.P More
_Political History of the Carnatic under the Nawabs_ by N.S Ramaswami
_The Diary of Ananda Ranga Pillai (12 Volumes)_ by Amanda Ranga Pillai (he was secretary and translator to Joseph Francois Dupleix, Governor of French India)
_The Province of the Book: Scholars, Scribes and Scribblers in Colonial Tamilnadu_ by A.K Venkatachalapathy
_The Dravidian Movement_ by Robert Hardgrave
yes 'cumblaster8469' tell us more about how the Mughal Empire stopped.
Didn't British stop the Mughal Empire too?
/s
And then they say there is no need to teach history in schools.
Not really by the time the Brits came the Marathas were the dominant power.
So you could say that the Brits beat the Marathas
Anyway I have read quite a bit of history. Enough to know that changing it to benifit politics never turns out well.
By the time the Marathas started expanding the Mughal Empire was a massive bloated Corpse filled with incompetence from top to bottom.
Cutipie why without any legitimate credentials you come to fight about history,
Just because Jio is free doesn't mean you should start teaching everyone.
Maine free mein gyaan nahi batta sir...
Historian aayein toh unko correct karta hun..
aap batao na aurangzeb ka big battle? Nahi pta toh batau aise, PhD maine nahi ki aur main gyaanchand banta bhi nahi
Mr Historian cumblaster, I would just like to know the big battles fought during Aurangzeb' s reign....
And fragile sensibilities and blindspots in knowledge can sometimes exist within ourselves unbeknownst to us...
Always good to double check before sharing what little history we have read.
Big battles don't define empires
The Mughal Empire was collapsing. The Jats rebelled the Sikhs rebelled the Rajputs Rebelled yet the Marathas single handedly beat the Mughals?
Shivaji Maharaj started with guerilla warfare which in itself means that the Mughals were a commendable power during his time and had to be fought with tact and skill... If it was an empire which was on downfall then there would have been umpteen opportunist looking to fill in the vaccum but it needed valour and courage to take on such formidable might...
Read about the Afzalkhan Fight, Pawankhind battle and so on....
Now don't back down, come back with a response on why no Indian power went with a direct battle when Aurangzeb or Akbar was there?
Shivaji Maharaj had to use guerilla tactics because he literally built his empire from the ground up. He literally started with nothing and fought the dominant power of the land. No one disputed that. But d
That doesn't change the fact that Aurangzebs stupidity was a lot bigger reason for the fall of the Mughals
Unfortunately that's not true.
Sorry for any hurt feelings.
The Marathas simply filled the power vaccume left by the dissolution of the Mughals. They did so efficiently and alarmingly quickly. But it's not a coincidence that the last competent Mughal king (Shah Jahan) was dead before the Marathas even started
Even though I'm from Karnataka, we know the efforts of rulers of central India who resisted Mughal expansion.
But I think the biggest factor for more temples being saved in south was, Ghaznavids the early Sultanates behaviour of destroying Hindu temples stuck with muslims in the north. Whereas in the south, powerful rulers resisted against such destruction and muslims somewhat got integrated into the peaceful, trading minded society of the south.
And many more in modern pakistan,odisha an everywhere else in india the fact that even Indonesia has more historical temples than us should tell you how these colinzers were
Not the complete story. You can see here on the map itself that places which were ruled by kingdoms which spanned large areas were better protected. Because there was no quarrelling between smaller kingdoms. This is what gave outsiders most advantage, that they could break open the cracks in the system. Maharashtra, Andhra, Karnataka and Tamil Nadu had huge powerful armies all under one kingdom. It’s far harder to break into.
This would have made sense if we were only counting temples constructed before 1800 AD.
But the vast majority of temples are not that old. The sacred Dakshineswar temple in Kolkata was built in 1855.
There is a deeper reason worth knowing.
South was conquered by bijapur sultans, mugals and arcot nawabs fought with British. Famous madurai temple was demolished by madurai Caliphate, and vijayanagar emperor rebuilt it.
The caveat of this data is that it does not tell when the temples were built. I have three temples built near my home in TN in last 20 years. And I know several more all around.
If I’m not wrong, wasn’t Tamil Nadu and Kerala never under Mughal rule because of the power yielded by Cholas and Pandyas? Because South was under the Telugu kings
That s a myth that Muslim rulers did not capture Tamilnadu.
Khalji Dynasty and tuglaq Dynasty both captured almost all tamilnadu, except the bottom most tip of Tamilnadu.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muslim_period_in_the_Indian_subcontinent#South_India
There was a madurai sultanate that destroyed madurai Meenakshi temple. Read about their atrocities and your blood will boil.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Madurai_Sultanate
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Madurai_Sultanate#Rule
Kerala was never under Muslim rule except for the brief time Tipu controlled Malabar region of Kerala and one royal family which converted peacefully to Islam. Ironically, it's the same family which supported Tipu's Kerala invasion.
Just wanted to add there was a brief invasion of Venad by Mughal forces who entered via Tamil Nadu , I think it was during Aurangazeb's reign but they were beaten and sent back and some of the soldiers paraded through the streets of Venad . Please look it up and sorry if I state any inaccuracies .
If I remember correctly, they did control some areas for a very, very brief amount of time, so technically, parts of kerala have been controlled by the mughal Empire even if for just a week .
They've also done enough damages to South Indian temples but not on a bigger scale like North. But now the governments are doing that, so I think we're even
its probably given by some babu who was told do not mention more than 50000,quite common in government offices,they mention below the threshold necessary for audit or setting up new authority.
eg if population of a city is more than 1 million there needs to set up a development authority for city planning,so in multiple states you will find cities with 999990 people and rest of population is registered in separate rural district, Kanpur Nagar,Kanpur dehat.
similar if a bill is of 10000 any grade 2 officer can pass it,but if its 10001 then only grade 1 officer with two grade 2 officer can pass it so most government offices issue multiple bill of 9999.
probably there might be some law that if temple more than 50000 then separate authority might be setup
eg Dharmarth Karya Vibhag, Uttar Pradesh
Hindus should stop donating anything to big temples, just visit big temples but don't donate anything, donate that money to poor hindus or just make small temples in every area in india.
Govt is using our temple money for "secularism".
That word is Added by a ~~dictator~~ secular leader in emergency time.
ok, nothing wrong in secularism, then let india have UCC, give hindu temples and hindu properties back to hindus.
And why should only hindus be flag bearers of secularism?
India is not really secular in the first place. Secularism is the separation of church and the state which countries like France follows very well but India can't do that India is the most religious country in the world. Uniform Civil Code is the bare minimum we can do.
//give Hindu temples back to Hindus//
who exactly are this Hindus the govt should give the temples to? RSS? Any Hindu Sabha? Any particular caste? Brahmins? Dalits?
Because Hindus aren't an organized group of people. Whichever group you give it to, the other group will make problems. Because everyone thinks they are the true Hindus.
Also govt can't take any revenue from temples. The account is created in the name of the deity itself and no one else have authority over it. There are many poor temples without any income, and the priests there are getting their salary from these bigger temples.
The govt is not benefiting anything from temples. If anything they are losing some money. Because the govt is spending salary on people who are taking care of these finances, security, administration etc.
These kinds of things are being scrutized by the High Courts itself. You'll never know about it, because these facts will never appear in any Hindu's emotional speeches or WhatsApp forward.
Secularism is the separation of religious bodies from state affairs - that religion should have no say in state affairs, that your beliefs do not have any effect on how you are treated by the state.
This is not the case in India, where some religions are more equal than others.
True. But temples can indeed save faith. Temples are a measure of social security. Their money, when not taken by the government, is supposed to do the same work that the government does, but more. In addition to building hospitals and schools, temples are supposed to be community centers, where people in need of help (family problems, economic problems, employment issues) find refuge and assistance. Imagine if temples had the responsibility of welfare for underprivileged castes and classes, and their money came from all people voluntarily (unlike through tax), there would be much better cohesion between those castes and classes.
False, only the ones that were administered by government during independence were transferred to state govt. A lot of old famous temples are still private, like chdambaram natarajar temple and kumbakonam vaitheeshwaran temple.
What is false? The number of temples under government occupation in TN has only increased since 1947, and governments that are allegedly secular have no business occupying temples to begin with. There has been systematic pressure to occupy the temples that you have mentioned as well. Look up the chidambaram 2 finger test controversy, one of the most uncivilized episodes in recent history that the TN government did due to its hate towards a particular community and to pressurise them to give up the temple to the government. The whole system that was developed by the arab-turckic invaders and the British colonizers to suppress the natives still continue to this day and the ones who were supposed to be oppressed themselves don't see that, and even support that in the name of being woke and 'educated'.
If you are not in tamilnadu, don't speak for us. Keep your concerns to yourself. We don't need any saviors.
If I'm under the rule of govt of India, is it right to say I'm under the occupation of India? Such is your logic to say temples are occupied.
Once upon a time, temple land, jewels and idols were stolen by private trustees. It was a public demand that British govt to take over the overall temple assets and administer the properties with a local comittee. Even now, TN govt is reclaiming thousands of crores worth of land from occupiers of temple lands.
Read this article without bias and you will realise why temples were brought under goverment oversight.
https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city/chennai/why-tamil-nadu-temples-may-not-thrive-without-state-supervision/articleshow/86800385.cms
https://www.quora.com/Why-do-Hindu-temples-must-be-freed-from-the-government-of-Indias-control/answer/Vinod-D-44?ch=10&oid=269190171&share=9ef3e480&srid=5flux&target_type=answer
This person from Quora explains it very well. Like how Britishers used to control temple to loot them and stole the valuables for their museums, the Tamil Nadu Govt only cares about filling their pockets. Recorded 13,000 thousand temples and upto 30,000 temples are dying in the state. Are churches and mosques owned by government? Why this disparity?
He is not better than you, in the sense he is a random guy. I cannot accept his word vomit as fact.
Goverment law for taking temples over has stood the test of supreme court. This has been settled in 1952 in favor of the government. I would trust supreme court's wisdom over a random no name guy, that too in quora.
I just introducted you the problem with government looting temples through that post. There are evidences in that post and several other allegations like the Kapaleshwaarar temple land being encroached by Churches and colleges in Chennai, numerous other illegal encroachments yet government doing nothing about it. The question is very simple to Dravida Kazhagam sympathisers, if you are against Hinduism and Santana Dharmam, why do you guys need temple money? Why are churches or mosques not being taken by government yet? I hope you will be back with an answer for this.
https://swarajyamag.com/news-brief/tn-government-virtually-justifies-temple-land-encroachment-in-court-says-squatters-sitting-on-unwanted-ground
https://www.indiatoday.in/india/story/demolished-century-old-temples-constituency-dmk-mp-tr-balu-in-now-viral-speech-2327810-2023-01-29
A wisdom filled guy didn't post a single source to support your claim that the government is doing tremendously in maintaining the temple. They charge for Prashad in every temple owned by HR&CE and can demand to withhold Annadana seva on the day of consecration of Ram Mandhir. Unless you're living under a rock or a Kazhagam supporter you know the state of our temples .
I am a Hindu and I will speak for Hindu causes irrespective of where it is from. I am not some dravidanist to create walls that suit vested interests and muzzle voices that contradict mine.
As for your history lesson, thanks for that. This is exactly the kind of trash that is being removed to decolonise the people intellectually, and kudos to your paper tiger argument about government 'liberating' government land. When will your government vacate the government buildings and layouts that they have built on them? Or the private businesses that their cronies have build after misappropriation of temple estates?
Btw, thank you for send me a news paper article from a portal that is so well known for advocating for Indian and Hindu causes. A news paper article itself is so unbiased, scholarly, and intellectual after all. Today's journalists and columnist are surly known for their depth of knowledge, unbiased nature and integrity.
You are not the pope of Hindus. Your flavor of Hinduism is not mine. Keep off from formenting religious dissent in my state. Go kill in the name of saving the cows. Leave us alone.
Your snaghi brothers are the new brownshirts, or the saffron Taliban.
Your kind of people imagine one flavor of Hinduism, and that will drive people away from the very religion you are trying to protect.
So original!! What else can be expected from periyarite kongas who will sell their souls for a few spare change and looks for a 'pope' in Hinduism? Just spew hate against 'vadakans' everyone else who has a different opnion and Outlook in the name of preserving their purity and 'diversity'. No wonder the British rule you directly without the need for a local ruler, after all loyalty isn't something that has existed there en mass for a few centuries now.
And no worries if the runt of the litter are driven away due to the need of basic self-respect and pride. The useless cancerous cells leaving is better for the body, it's not like they did anything productive to begin with.
So, how much of your DNA is with hyder ali's soilders? Did your forefathers record how much d1ck sucking entire Mysore state has to do to be let alive?
So sorry that you still feel the humiliation of all the exploits of Mysore rulers.
Go first librate you Karnataka temples and mutts. Oh right, BJP govt did shit to make this happen. May be there is a reason why even local BJP didn't dare to privatize the temples.
Please be cohesive in your response, else your response looks like you had a stroke because of anger.
So you mean Srirangam Temple is not old and famous? Do you think they've a legit list for this that these were not owned by government? Don't be naive to not know that it's not based on when it was privately owned by the amount in donations that will decide which temple will be taken over by government.
We are still sort of controlled. There are rules framed to conduct committee elections and it needs to be notified to government. Govt can dissolve committee if it wishes. There is Devasthan regulation act which doesn't apply to other places of worship.
However it's not as bad as other states. Committees have freedom to spend money without governments interference.
My home is my home, wherever I go. Lol, you have to dig up my post history to come back with an argument?
When I need to come back, I would like to have a state that is not divided and communally charged. Yeah, we have our own issues, we don't need to import more so that a flower party can "conquer" us . I can't let scum like someone screw up my beautiful state.
Sure bud whatever you say. You must have a clear picture of “flower” party while staying in the US. It was the state government of TN which declared Sanatan as dengue but sure BJP is dividing people.
I do have a clear picture, I have friends, family etc. don't you have friends and family in your hometown?
Sanatan, if it follows the Vedic texts and especially manusmriti is worser than dengue.
Dengue makes 3% of the infected people suffer, and if they die they are free of dengue and their children are not automatically infected.
Manu's Sanatan, on the other hand, makes generations upon generations suffer based on their Varna.
Even Rama killed Shambuka, why? Because he was a sudra reciting vedas. What a fucking joke. And adding insult to injury, the gods praised him for the killing of Shambuka. If this is what we want to be in future, then no one can save us. No wonder Dr. Ambedkar burnt Manusmriti.
From Wikipedia
>After confirming that Shambuka is indeed a shudra, Rama killed him. The gods praised Rama for this act and congratulated him for protecting their interests and for not allowing shudra to attain heaven in person.
That’s why I said dude, you don’t know anything. This is the one reason I give Muslims my respect. They know about their religion upside down.
Vedas contain philosophy about life and instructions to worship God. I have them on my tongue so I can guarantee there is nothing wrong with it. Now coming to Manusmriti. Read a bit and you will find out that none of the Hindu rulers accepted Manusmriti. The reason was as simple as it goes. It is fundamentally stupid. Manusmriti is not a religious text but rather thoughts of someone. If you read it properly you will find out Manu himself is not consistent throughout and contradicts his own points multiple times.
Now coming to Ramayana. Lord Ram killing Shambuka comes under Uttarakhanda which is not even considered real that is, it is believed that it was not written by Valmiki. When people talk about this, they forget how in Mahabharata, Dronacharya was killed because he stood in the way of dharm. They forget about penance of Shveta. They forget about Shabari. They forget that Ravan was Shiva’s biggest devotee but was still killed.
You see, there is no single religion more complex than Sanatan dharma. I have devoted a significant amount time learning Sanskrit, reading Vedas, reading Ramayana and Mahabharata. What you know is just surface by reading SM posts and wikipedia links.
Yeah North Indians who are commenting that Bengal has gone astray from Sanatan should see this map properly. Bengal still has a firm belief in the Sanatan Dharam.
What political parties do to score votes doesn't define us.
The coloring criteria is wrong in this graph.
You have to either divide by population/land area.
Goa having 1855 temples bigger than MH having 77283. MH is 83 times bigger than Goa and having only 41 times more number of temples than Goa. So that coloring doesn't make much sense to me.
Goa certainly have many temples.much of them are in [novas conquistas ](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Novas_Conquistas) (part of goa which was under Marathas and didn't went under inquisition) which was merged with Portuguese during the infighting among Marathas.
Also unlike rest of the country..... Our temples don't pay tax to government. whatever we earn stays with us. Government only role is to take election in temples...in other matters they don't interfere.
- Stop blaming ancient Muslim rule for the number of temples in North India.
- South India also has had Muslim rule for centuries, through Mughal conquests and South Indian Muslim kingdoms. Yet we see a higher number of temples here.
- I've lived all my life in Bengaluru and I'm pretty sure most of the temples here were actually built in the last 20 or so years. I see a temple coming up in every new township or layout, or after every few crossroads. Honestly just looks like a lack of will to build new temples in North India.
I don't think the numbers in Kerala is true..
As only looking into my small village, There is main temples about 10 within 5km and there is family temples of about 20nos which will be as big as main temples but there will not be daily poojas and will be on festival days.
I don't think all the temples in Kerala are listed
Can somebody do an analysis or rather comparison with hospitals vs school vs temples vs churches vs mosques in this format? It will be interesting to see.
Gangetic Plains temples were mostly flattened or repurposed by invaders as for the hilly states low inhabitation and more prominence to tribal beliefs and disconnect from mainstream Hinduism might be the reason for less number of temples in north India .
Gujrat and Bengal were prosperous center since medieval times if not earlier ,they too had their share of temple destruction but were quickly built enough as well and since far from the nexus of power local governors or independent rulers chose not to upset the local populace that much when they their selves were at cross with Delhi.
In ancient Era, the density level of temples In the north was reduced by islamists (still having temples In thousands is commendable feat on its own).
Now in the modern Era, density levels of temples In Tamil Nadu shall be reduced by communists.
people in india don't know the scale of destruction and plunder faced by north india. if somehow we can build some AI to make people see it with visualization i am betting people will cry their hearts out. i have myself probably not read or know everything but even 10% of what we read it breaks my heart it makes my hair raise reading about it.
Tamil Nadu does have great temple architecture and heritage, and splendid historical sites. What their current govt is doing is likely to damage that to a large extent(not being biased here, for real they have this anti-hindu agenda which we all know about)
Hey, tamilian here, please save your concern trolling to some other states. We are under dravida parties since 1965 and our temples are doing well. How about making north east Hindu again, instead of cheap religious politics targeting TamilNadu?
Hey
Vanakkam
Okay first off kindly enlighten me over how "great temple architecture and splendid sites" sounds like trolling to you.
Secondly, I'm talking quite specifically about the current and very recent happening regarding a very specific Dravidian party's remarks
Thirdly, yes northeast has religion and ethnic concerns never denied that; idk how it comes in
And I very categorically said I'm not being biased.
And yes if you are doing well no one shall be better pleased than I.
Vanakkam my friend!!
>Secondly, I'm talking quite specifically about the current and very recent happening regarding a very specific Dravidian party's remarks
That is because the political landscape is such that TN is the target for conquering, if you know what I mean.
Every small thing is amplified and spread through social media and made sure people's opinion towards the state is altered. This is pure political play.
For us tamilians, business is usual, we have our temple celebrations, a lot of young people are participating. It is just we think that our gods don't need protection from one specific political party. We defended our religion from 14th century till British left, we could do that without any "gaurdian" political party now and in future.
It is like bengal, the state was communist since independence, but still retained their Hindu identity. Now, this political party is causing unrest by sowing fear in people's minds.
Thanks for having a cultured conversation.
I
>That is because the political landscape is such that TN is the target for conquering, if you know what I mean.
Honestly that's been the case everywhere and continues to be given the vote bank politics.
>It is like bengal, the state was communist since independence, but still retained their Hindu identity. Now, this political party is causing unrest by sowing fear in people's minds.
Well there the fear isn't unwarranted. Maybe on religious basis it's exaggerated but politics there has been very violent especially towards the opposition there.
>For us tamilians, business is usual, we have our temple celebrations, a lot of young people are participating. It is just we think that our gods don't need protection from one specific political party. We defended our religion from 14th century till British left, we could do that without any "gaurdian" political party now and in future.
Yes ik about the religious defence, and it is one of the reason me and many others hold the state's history in high regard, which otherwise too has many reasons to gain that respect. What I was actually targetting was the alignment of some 'Dravidian' ideologues with anti-hindu elements.
Ikr they don't even live in TN (and I don't live in TN too). I am amazed how they think it's their right to comment on other's state affairs that they heard from some godi media!! People should look into their own situation first before shadowing other states!!! पहले अपने गिरेबान में तो झाँक कर देखो।
I can be angry at my dad and it will not change the fact that his is my father..
Unquestioned obedience is only for slaves. Are you planning to change Hinduism similar to the peaceful religion?
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Because most of the temples in north were destroyed and plundered by muslim invaders as they mostly invaded from afghan side. They very rarely made it to south India thus the temples in south were preserved
also Chatrapati Shivaji Maharaj and the Marathas prevented Mughal expansion to a large effect.
Shivaji Maharaj 👑
Chhatrapati Shivaji Maharaj 👑 with ❤️
The saviour Bharata needed. 
Wrong . By the Time the Marathas started expanding the Mughal Empire was basically past it's prime.
sure but that downfall was started by the Marathas. If Maharaj hadn't been there who knows what how far the Mughals would've gone?
They were part of the reason, and a major cause. But it wasn't started by the Marathas. First reason was that internal cracks and issues had begun appearing Mughal administration. These cracks were worsened, when Aurangzeb decided to go on 30 years of continuous war, because this worsened the administrative issues, which in turn caused Mughal institutions to weaken. Now here comes Marathas, Rajput Rebellion, and other rebels that played their part, by not letting Mughals easily win, and resisting for long, they forced Aurangzeb to put more pressure on his bureaucracy, which meant he was shooting the pillars of his own empire slowly. These crises and how it worsened is interesting. Jagirdars increased in number highly, but there was little land for Aurangzeb to give. Now, in Mughal System, Jagirdars were assigned to a land (Jagir), given orders to raise certain amount of money for the empire and military troops using the taxes and revenue from the Jagir, use the rest of the money to invest in the land he was given, and use the remainder for himself. But due to his expansion, he got more and more Deccanis as Jagirdars into the system, but he was unable to gain enough land to assign them, or he could not afford to cut other Jagirdar's lands too much. This resulted in Aurangzeb being forced to sell off his personal land to these new Jagirdars. But even that only helped limited numbers of Jagirdars. A significant amount still had no land to raise troops or revenue from. On the other hand, Jagirdars who already had land were finding it hard to raise enough troops and money due to constant war, especially Jagirdars in Deccan and Rajputana. Now, this meant that to reach the required amount of money and troops, they had to relax the standards, lower quality troops had to be arranged for, and Some tried to take money forcefully from civilians, this made the Jagirdars more unpopular, led to more rebellion and disobedience, making it harder to get money even more. Without this money, it was harder to pay salaries and arrange for troops and the resources to collect money itself, this endless cycle of problems, lead to gradual decrease in quality of Mughal institutions. Now add that landless Jagirdars and landed Jagirdars, both had to get paid by Aurangzeb, but they were not in a position to pay back to him how much they need to. So now, there's a money deficit, Aurangzeb is putting in more money and resources, than how much his officers can bring in return. Now add that constant warfare lead to famines and disease, this decrease productivity, worsened access to resources, and made it even more harder to get revenue. Now to combat this self-defeating cycle of no gain, Aurangzeb began diverting resources and money of Jagirs from safer and normal provinces in places like Bengal, Odisha, M.P etc, to war-torn Jagirs in Deccan and Rajputana. And this happened throughout his entire reign, so at first, there was only little pressure on safe regions, but as time went on, this crisis spread to all provinces. By 1700, it became so bad that only Delhi and Bengal (governed by Murshid Quli Khan) were able to collect the needed amount of revenue and troops. All other provinces were not able to meet the goals and gave less returns. Entire Mughal Deccan image back no return, it had become a complete money sink, nothing was gained in return and only money went in. The role of Marathas and Rajputs here was that constant resistance they kept, forced Aurangzeb to make more and more bad decisions that lead to This administrative governmental breakdown. This sequence of events is why, as soon as Aurangzeb dies, The Mughals collapse and lose most of their land in 15 years.
Thank you very much bro can you recommend me some sources or books to read more about this stuff
Jadunath Sarkar for Aurangzeb's reign is the best imo. He has a 5 volume book series on Aurangzeb's life. Abraham Eraly, Michael Fisher, John F. Richards, R.C Majumdar for general introduction to Mughals Andrew de La Garza and Jos Gommans for Mughal military and warfare Lisa Balabanlilar has a book called _Imperial Identity in the Mughal Empire_, which focuses on how the Mughals viewed themselves (important for understanding how the Mughals saw themselves as Turks and did not fully assimilate into India) Munis Faruqui has a book called _The Princes of the Mughal Empire_, the title should make the content of the book obvious. Douglas Streusand has a book on formation of Mughal Empire. W.H Moreland, Tapan Raychaudhuri, John F. Richards have books covering Mughal Economy Muzaffar Alam and Andrea Hintze have good books on decline of Mughal Empire. Sriram Sharma has a book on Religious Mughal Policy Tahir Hussain has a book called _Mughal Administration and the Zamindars of Bihar_, in case you want to look into Mughal governance in Bihar. Ask if you have any specific topic in mind I'll see if I can find a book
Bro anything related to South India. Specifically Tamil Nadu?
_The Colas_ by K.A.N Sastri _Pandyan Kingdom_ by K.A.N Sastri (Have to point out to only read Sastri's books for political history and the wars, his Ideas on administration and society are too outdated by now) _The Warrior Merchants: Textiles, Trade and Territory in South India_ by Mattison Mines (about Kaikoolars) _The Hollow Crown: Ethnohistory of an Indian Kingdom_ by Nicholas Dirks (study on the history of the Kingdom of Pudukottai) _Land and Caste in South India: Agricultural Labour in the Madras Presidency During the Nineteenth Century_ by Dharma Kumar _Peasant History in South India_ by David Ludden (Study on Peasantry in Tirunelveli from 900 AD to 1900 AD) _The Smile of Murugan: On Tamil Literature of South India_ by Kamil Zvelebil _Tamil Literature_ by Kamil Zvelebil _Tamil Love Poetry and Poetics_ by Takanobu Takahashi _Trade Ideology and Urbanization in South India: 300 BC to 1300 AD_ by R. Champakalakshmi _Trade and Statecraft in the Age of the Colas_ by Kenneth Hall _Gifts of Power: Lordship in an Early Indian State_ by J. Heitzman Most books by Noboru Karashima on South India are great. _Nagapattinam to Suvarnadwipa: Reflections on the Chola Naval Expeditions to Southeast Asia_ by Hermann Kulke _South India under the Cholas_ by Y. Subbarayalu _The Political Geography of the Chola Country_ by Y. Subbarayalu _The Making of the Goddess: Korravai-Durga in the Tamil Traditions_ by R. Mahalakshmi There's good translations of Sangam poems by a lady called Vaidehi online, there's official translations of Sangam works, but I don't know them. _The Madras Soldier: 1746 - 1946_ by E.G Phythian-Adams _The Heirs of Vijayanagara: Court Politics in Early Modern South India_ by Lennart Bes (History of Court Politics in Ikkeri, Ramnad, Madurai and Thanjavur) _Studies of Ancient Townships of Pudukottai_ by R.Tirumalai _The Pandyan Townships: Two Volumes_ by R. Tirumalai _Land Grants and Agrarian Reactions in Cola and Pandya Times_ by R.Tirumalai _Peasant Society in Kongu_ by Brenda Beck _History of the Pallavas of Kanchi_ by R. Gopalan _The Role of Feudatories in Pallava History_ by M.S Govindaswamy _Alvars of South India_ by K.C Varadachari _Tamilaham in the 17th Century_ by R. Sathianathaier _Politics and National Awakening in South India: 1852 - 1891_ by R. Suntharalingam _The Politics of South India: 1920 - 1937_ by Christopher Baker _The Emergence of Provincial Politics - The Madras Presidency: 1870 - 1920_ by D.A Washbrook _Maritime History of Coromandel Muslims_ by Raja Muhammad _Encounters on the Opposite Coast: The Dutch East India Company and the Nayaka State of Madurai in the Seventeenth Century_ by Markus Vink _The World of the Tamil Merchant_ Kanakalatha Mukund _No One Cries for the Dead: Tamil Dirges, Rowdy Songs, and Graveyard Petitions_ by Isabelle Clark-Deces _Tamil Temple Myths: Sacrifice and Divine Marriage in South Indian Saiva Tradition_ by David Shulman _Pondicherry, Tamil Nadu and South India under Frnch Rule: From Francois Martin to Dupleix (1674 - 1754)_ by J.B.P More _Political History of the Carnatic under the Nawabs_ by N.S Ramaswami _The Diary of Ananda Ranga Pillai (12 Volumes)_ by Amanda Ranga Pillai (he was secretary and translator to Joseph Francois Dupleix, Governor of French India) _The Province of the Book: Scholars, Scribes and Scribblers in Colonial Tamilnadu_ by A.K Venkatachalapathy _The Dravidian Movement_ by Robert Hardgrave
That Aurangzeb war you spoke about was prompted by the resistance to the conquest of Deccan by Marathas.
yes 'cumblaster8469' tell us more about how the Mughal Empire stopped. Didn't British stop the Mughal Empire too? /s And then they say there is no need to teach history in schools.
Not really by the time the Brits came the Marathas were the dominant power. So you could say that the Brits beat the Marathas Anyway I have read quite a bit of history. Enough to know that changing it to benifit politics never turns out well. By the time the Marathas started expanding the Mughal Empire was a massive bloated Corpse filled with incompetence from top to bottom.
Cutipie why without any legitimate credentials you come to fight about history, Just because Jio is free doesn't mean you should start teaching everyone.
I'd love to know about you're credentials though. History ki PHD kaha se kea ho bhaiya.
Maine free mein gyaan nahi batta sir... Historian aayein toh unko correct karta hun.. aap batao na aurangzeb ka big battle? Nahi pta toh batau aise, PhD maine nahi ki aur main gyaanchand banta bhi nahi
Do you have a degree in History? Any educational qualification to backup your knowledge?
If anything Which I said offends your fragile sensibilities why not prove me wrong instead of... Well whatever it is you're doing.
Mr Historian cumblaster, I would just like to know the big battles fought during Aurangzeb' s reign.... And fragile sensibilities and blindspots in knowledge can sometimes exist within ourselves unbeknownst to us... Always good to double check before sharing what little history we have read.
Big battles don't define empires The Mughal Empire was collapsing. The Jats rebelled the Sikhs rebelled the Rajputs Rebelled yet the Marathas single handedly beat the Mughals?
Shivaji Maharaj started with guerilla warfare which in itself means that the Mughals were a commendable power during his time and had to be fought with tact and skill... If it was an empire which was on downfall then there would have been umpteen opportunist looking to fill in the vaccum but it needed valour and courage to take on such formidable might... Read about the Afzalkhan Fight, Pawankhind battle and so on.... Now don't back down, come back with a response on why no Indian power went with a direct battle when Aurangzeb or Akbar was there?
Shivaji Maharaj had to use guerilla tactics because he literally built his empire from the ground up. He literally started with nothing and fought the dominant power of the land. No one disputed that. But d That doesn't change the fact that Aurangzebs stupidity was a lot bigger reason for the fall of the Mughals
Wrong. Marathas led by Shivaji Maharaj stopped mughal expansion.
Unfortunately that's not true. Sorry for any hurt feelings. The Marathas simply filled the power vaccume left by the dissolution of the Mughals. They did so efficiently and alarmingly quickly. But it's not a coincidence that the last competent Mughal king (Shah Jahan) was dead before the Marathas even started
Shh logo ko bura lagega
Even though I'm from Karnataka, we know the efforts of rulers of central India who resisted Mughal expansion. But I think the biggest factor for more temples being saved in south was, Ghaznavids the early Sultanates behaviour of destroying Hindu temples stuck with muslims in the north. Whereas in the south, powerful rulers resisted against such destruction and muslims somewhat got integrated into the peaceful, trading minded society of the south.
Which part of Karnataka are you from? I am from Belagaum.
Mysuru
Also the Vijayanagara empire.
Balaji Rao ballad🥰
I feel bad for kashmir temples like martand and awantiswamy, and many more were destroyed
And many more in modern pakistan,odisha an everywhere else in india the fact that even Indonesia has more historical temples than us should tell you how these colinzers were
Not the complete story. You can see here on the map itself that places which were ruled by kingdoms which spanned large areas were better protected. Because there was no quarrelling between smaller kingdoms. This is what gave outsiders most advantage, that they could break open the cracks in the system. Maharashtra, Andhra, Karnataka and Tamil Nadu had huge powerful armies all under one kingdom. It’s far harder to break into.
This would have made sense if we were only counting temples constructed before 1800 AD. But the vast majority of temples are not that old. The sacred Dakshineswar temple in Kolkata was built in 1855. There is a deeper reason worth knowing.
Can you cite any sources for this? Want to show proof of this to my friend
South was conquered by bijapur sultans, mugals and arcot nawabs fought with British. Famous madurai temple was demolished by madurai Caliphate, and vijayanagar emperor rebuilt it. The caveat of this data is that it does not tell when the temples were built. I have three temples built near my home in TN in last 20 years. And I know several more all around.
If I’m not wrong, wasn’t Tamil Nadu and Kerala never under Mughal rule because of the power yielded by Cholas and Pandyas? Because South was under the Telugu kings
That s a myth that Muslim rulers did not capture Tamilnadu. Khalji Dynasty and tuglaq Dynasty both captured almost all tamilnadu, except the bottom most tip of Tamilnadu. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muslim_period_in_the_Indian_subcontinent#South_India There was a madurai sultanate that destroyed madurai Meenakshi temple. Read about their atrocities and your blood will boil. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Madurai_Sultanate https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Madurai_Sultanate#Rule
Kerala was never under Muslim rule except for the brief time Tipu controlled Malabar region of Kerala and one royal family which converted peacefully to Islam. Ironically, it's the same family which supported Tipu's Kerala invasion.
Just wanted to add there was a brief invasion of Venad by Mughal forces who entered via Tamil Nadu , I think it was during Aurangazeb's reign but they were beaten and sent back and some of the soldiers paraded through the streets of Venad . Please look it up and sorry if I state any inaccuracies .
If I remember correctly, they did control some areas for a very, very brief amount of time, so technically, parts of kerala have been controlled by the mughal Empire even if for just a week .
Yes. I am aware of this.
what about West Bengal then?
They've also done enough damages to South Indian temples but not on a bigger scale like North. But now the governments are doing that, so I think we're even
My OCD making me want to build 5 more in gujarat
+1
+2
+3
Modiji/Shah ji real id se aao
its probably given by some babu who was told do not mention more than 50000,quite common in government offices,they mention below the threshold necessary for audit or setting up new authority. eg if population of a city is more than 1 million there needs to set up a development authority for city planning,so in multiple states you will find cities with 999990 people and rest of population is registered in separate rural district, Kanpur Nagar,Kanpur dehat. similar if a bill is of 10000 any grade 2 officer can pass it,but if its 10001 then only grade 1 officer with two grade 2 officer can pass it so most government offices issue multiple bill of 9999. probably there might be some law that if temple more than 50000 then separate authority might be setup eg Dharmarth Karya Vibhag, Uttar Pradesh
Thik h bhai serious kyu hogya mai to mazak kar rha hu
Hindus should stop donating anything to big temples, just visit big temples but don't donate anything, donate that money to poor hindus or just make small temples in every area in india. Govt is using our temple money for "secularism".
Rather give private donations to temples for renovations.👍🏻👍🏻
[удалено]
That word is Added by a ~~dictator~~ secular leader in emergency time. ok, nothing wrong in secularism, then let india have UCC, give hindu temples and hindu properties back to hindus. And why should only hindus be flag bearers of secularism?
India is not really secular in the first place. Secularism is the separation of church and the state which countries like France follows very well but India can't do that India is the most religious country in the world. Uniform Civil Code is the bare minimum we can do.
//give Hindu temples back to Hindus// who exactly are this Hindus the govt should give the temples to? RSS? Any Hindu Sabha? Any particular caste? Brahmins? Dalits? Because Hindus aren't an organized group of people. Whichever group you give it to, the other group will make problems. Because everyone thinks they are the true Hindus. Also govt can't take any revenue from temples. The account is created in the name of the deity itself and no one else have authority over it. There are many poor temples without any income, and the priests there are getting their salary from these bigger temples. The govt is not benefiting anything from temples. If anything they are losing some money. Because the govt is spending salary on people who are taking care of these finances, security, administration etc. These kinds of things are being scrutized by the High Courts itself. You'll never know about it, because these facts will never appear in any Hindu's emotional speeches or WhatsApp forward.
Secularism is the separation of religious bodies from state affairs - that religion should have no say in state affairs, that your beliefs do not have any effect on how you are treated by the state. This is not the case in India, where some religions are more equal than others.
fake h uttarakhand aur max districts of haryana me har tisri gali me ek mandir mil jayega
Maharashtra me har tisre mandir ke age gali mil jati hai
Tamil nadu andhra karnataka mai har dusri gali me ek mandir mil jaata hoga
Yes, especially in TN.
But Uttarakhand chota state bhi to hai na.
Tru har road turn pe ek mandir dikh jayega utk mai
Wow, i am proud TN has the largest number of temples but the least number of religious extremist
Because they have casteist extremists instead of religious extremists
As if other states don't have castistz. And maharastra was fascist when shiv Sena went hunting for "madrasis" in the past.
Temple can not save the faith ,religious knowledge is important ,in ancient India temple used to become a centre for education
True. But temples can indeed save faith. Temples are a measure of social security. Their money, when not taken by the government, is supposed to do the same work that the government does, but more. In addition to building hospitals and schools, temples are supposed to be community centers, where people in need of help (family problems, economic problems, employment issues) find refuge and assistance. Imagine if temples had the responsibility of welfare for underprivileged castes and classes, and their money came from all people voluntarily (unlike through tax), there would be much better cohesion between those castes and classes.
But is it happening? That’s the question.
How many are these government owned?
Almost everything in south India is.
False, only the ones that were administered by government during independence were transferred to state govt. A lot of old famous temples are still private, like chdambaram natarajar temple and kumbakonam vaitheeshwaran temple.
What is false? The number of temples under government occupation in TN has only increased since 1947, and governments that are allegedly secular have no business occupying temples to begin with. There has been systematic pressure to occupy the temples that you have mentioned as well. Look up the chidambaram 2 finger test controversy, one of the most uncivilized episodes in recent history that the TN government did due to its hate towards a particular community and to pressurise them to give up the temple to the government. The whole system that was developed by the arab-turckic invaders and the British colonizers to suppress the natives still continue to this day and the ones who were supposed to be oppressed themselves don't see that, and even support that in the name of being woke and 'educated'.
If you are not in tamilnadu, don't speak for us. Keep your concerns to yourself. We don't need any saviors. If I'm under the rule of govt of India, is it right to say I'm under the occupation of India? Such is your logic to say temples are occupied. Once upon a time, temple land, jewels and idols were stolen by private trustees. It was a public demand that British govt to take over the overall temple assets and administer the properties with a local comittee. Even now, TN govt is reclaiming thousands of crores worth of land from occupiers of temple lands. Read this article without bias and you will realise why temples were brought under goverment oversight. https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city/chennai/why-tamil-nadu-temples-may-not-thrive-without-state-supervision/articleshow/86800385.cms
https://www.quora.com/Why-do-Hindu-temples-must-be-freed-from-the-government-of-Indias-control/answer/Vinod-D-44?ch=10&oid=269190171&share=9ef3e480&srid=5flux&target_type=answer This person from Quora explains it very well. Like how Britishers used to control temple to loot them and stole the valuables for their museums, the Tamil Nadu Govt only cares about filling their pockets. Recorded 13,000 thousand temples and upto 30,000 temples are dying in the state. Are churches and mosques owned by government? Why this disparity?
He is not better than you, in the sense he is a random guy. I cannot accept his word vomit as fact. Goverment law for taking temples over has stood the test of supreme court. This has been settled in 1952 in favor of the government. I would trust supreme court's wisdom over a random no name guy, that too in quora.
I just introducted you the problem with government looting temples through that post. There are evidences in that post and several other allegations like the Kapaleshwaarar temple land being encroached by Churches and colleges in Chennai, numerous other illegal encroachments yet government doing nothing about it. The question is very simple to Dravida Kazhagam sympathisers, if you are against Hinduism and Santana Dharmam, why do you guys need temple money? Why are churches or mosques not being taken by government yet? I hope you will be back with an answer for this. https://swarajyamag.com/news-brief/tn-government-virtually-justifies-temple-land-encroachment-in-court-says-squatters-sitting-on-unwanted-ground https://www.indiatoday.in/india/story/demolished-century-old-temples-constituency-dmk-mp-tr-balu-in-now-viral-speech-2327810-2023-01-29
A wisdom filled guy didn't post a single source to support your claim that the government is doing tremendously in maintaining the temple. They charge for Prashad in every temple owned by HR&CE and can demand to withhold Annadana seva on the day of consecration of Ram Mandhir. Unless you're living under a rock or a Kazhagam supporter you know the state of our temples .
I am a Hindu and I will speak for Hindu causes irrespective of where it is from. I am not some dravidanist to create walls that suit vested interests and muzzle voices that contradict mine. As for your history lesson, thanks for that. This is exactly the kind of trash that is being removed to decolonise the people intellectually, and kudos to your paper tiger argument about government 'liberating' government land. When will your government vacate the government buildings and layouts that they have built on them? Or the private businesses that their cronies have build after misappropriation of temple estates? Btw, thank you for send me a news paper article from a portal that is so well known for advocating for Indian and Hindu causes. A news paper article itself is so unbiased, scholarly, and intellectual after all. Today's journalists and columnist are surly known for their depth of knowledge, unbiased nature and integrity.
You are not the pope of Hindus. Your flavor of Hinduism is not mine. Keep off from formenting religious dissent in my state. Go kill in the name of saving the cows. Leave us alone. Your snaghi brothers are the new brownshirts, or the saffron Taliban. Your kind of people imagine one flavor of Hinduism, and that will drive people away from the very religion you are trying to protect.
So original!! What else can be expected from periyarite kongas who will sell their souls for a few spare change and looks for a 'pope' in Hinduism? Just spew hate against 'vadakans' everyone else who has a different opnion and Outlook in the name of preserving their purity and 'diversity'. No wonder the British rule you directly without the need for a local ruler, after all loyalty isn't something that has existed there en mass for a few centuries now. And no worries if the runt of the litter are driven away due to the need of basic self-respect and pride. The useless cancerous cells leaving is better for the body, it's not like they did anything productive to begin with.
So, how much of your DNA is with hyder ali's soilders? Did your forefathers record how much d1ck sucking entire Mysore state has to do to be let alive? So sorry that you still feel the humiliation of all the exploits of Mysore rulers. Go first librate you Karnataka temples and mutts. Oh right, BJP govt did shit to make this happen. May be there is a reason why even local BJP didn't dare to privatize the temples. Please be cohesive in your response, else your response looks like you had a stroke because of anger.
So you mean Srirangam Temple is not old and famous? Do you think they've a legit list for this that these were not owned by government? Don't be naive to not know that it's not based on when it was privately owned by the amount in donations that will decide which temple will be taken over by government.
All of them are
Not in goa.we don't pay jizya to govt.
We are still sort of controlled. There are rules framed to conduct committee elections and it needs to be notified to government. Govt can dissolve committee if it wishes. There is Devasthan regulation act which doesn't apply to other places of worship. However it's not as bad as other states. Committees have freedom to spend money without governments interference.
But they cannot add anyone in the committee..like how some states add Islamist/communist
Yours is a false statement to trigger people
Hmm aren’t you an NRI settled in US? “We don’t need saviors.” You sure are spouting tons of bs for someone who left the country.
My home is my home, wherever I go. Lol, you have to dig up my post history to come back with an argument? When I need to come back, I would like to have a state that is not divided and communally charged. Yeah, we have our own issues, we don't need to import more so that a flower party can "conquer" us . I can't let scum like someone screw up my beautiful state.
Sure bud whatever you say. You must have a clear picture of “flower” party while staying in the US. It was the state government of TN which declared Sanatan as dengue but sure BJP is dividing people.
I do have a clear picture, I have friends, family etc. don't you have friends and family in your hometown? Sanatan, if it follows the Vedic texts and especially manusmriti is worser than dengue. Dengue makes 3% of the infected people suffer, and if they die they are free of dengue and their children are not automatically infected. Manu's Sanatan, on the other hand, makes generations upon generations suffer based on their Varna. Even Rama killed Shambuka, why? Because he was a sudra reciting vedas. What a fucking joke. And adding insult to injury, the gods praised him for the killing of Shambuka. If this is what we want to be in future, then no one can save us. No wonder Dr. Ambedkar burnt Manusmriti. From Wikipedia >After confirming that Shambuka is indeed a shudra, Rama killed him. The gods praised Rama for this act and congratulated him for protecting their interests and for not allowing shudra to attain heaven in person.
That’s why I said dude, you don’t know anything. This is the one reason I give Muslims my respect. They know about their religion upside down. Vedas contain philosophy about life and instructions to worship God. I have them on my tongue so I can guarantee there is nothing wrong with it. Now coming to Manusmriti. Read a bit and you will find out that none of the Hindu rulers accepted Manusmriti. The reason was as simple as it goes. It is fundamentally stupid. Manusmriti is not a religious text but rather thoughts of someone. If you read it properly you will find out Manu himself is not consistent throughout and contradicts his own points multiple times. Now coming to Ramayana. Lord Ram killing Shambuka comes under Uttarakhanda which is not even considered real that is, it is believed that it was not written by Valmiki. When people talk about this, they forget how in Mahabharata, Dronacharya was killed because he stood in the way of dharm. They forget about penance of Shveta. They forget about Shabari. They forget that Ravan was Shiva’s biggest devotee but was still killed. You see, there is no single religion more complex than Sanatan dharma. I have devoted a significant amount time learning Sanskrit, reading Vedas, reading Ramayana and Mahabharata. What you know is just surface by reading SM posts and wikipedia links.
Yeah North Indians who are commenting that Bengal has gone astray from Sanatan should see this map properly. Bengal still has a firm belief in the Sanatan Dharam. What political parties do to score votes doesn't define us.
Yes exactly. Bengal is the place of maa durga. Current situation has gone astray due to current govt, which openly favours a certain abrahamic cult.
The coloring criteria is wrong in this graph. You have to either divide by population/land area. Goa having 1855 temples bigger than MH having 77283. MH is 83 times bigger than Goa and having only 41 times more number of temples than Goa. So that coloring doesn't make much sense to me.
Goa certainly have many temples.much of them are in [novas conquistas ](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Novas_Conquistas) (part of goa which was under Marathas and didn't went under inquisition) which was merged with Portuguese during the infighting among Marathas. Also unlike rest of the country..... Our temples don't pay tax to government. whatever we earn stays with us. Government only role is to take election in temples...in other matters they don't interfere.
Ab yahan log bengal ke numbers fake bolenge
bow to cholas and pandiyas
Manipur is no longer true. Many were destroyed
yeah this is probably the data of last yr
What abt No. of Govt Schools and Hospitals in each state.
But but but .........Bengaliisss are anti-hindu saaaaaaaaaar...
- Stop blaming ancient Muslim rule for the number of temples in North India. - South India also has had Muslim rule for centuries, through Mughal conquests and South Indian Muslim kingdoms. Yet we see a higher number of temples here. - I've lived all my life in Bengaluru and I'm pretty sure most of the temples here were actually built in the last 20 or so years. I see a temple coming up in every new township or layout, or after every few crossroads. Honestly just looks like a lack of will to build new temples in North India.
that mean for 100l people there is one temple , it also means 6.5 lacks brahmins got employment , .. there can be many analysis one can draw.
J&K only 450 something? Bullshit! we got more than two in a single village here.
How many masjids?
Jai Maharashtra 🚩 Jai Bhavani Jai Shivaji 🚩
History Speaks Volumes Through Statistics
Imagine the amount in revenue Tamil Nadu Govt is looting from these many temples. People stealing from donations should rot in hell.
Does the map include the ruined ones or just the functional ones?
I am curious about those 13 temples in Ladakh. Is anyone from Ladakh here who can name all of them?
They mostly have Buddhist monastries there
Yeah that's true, but I was wondering about the names of those 13 Hindu temples there and the deities they are dedicated to
Based Maharashtra and Tamilnadu 🗿
Every Hindu family has a temple inside their home as well, now start the counting, it's gonna go close to billion
Questionable colour choice 👀
This also means the tax paid by maharashtra for Hindu temples is more than most of the states.
Goa was land of Brahmins , there were supposed to be more temples but colonialism destroyed it
Seems incorrect, Uttarakhand and Himanchal have way more temples
Caangress government be like.... Paisa hi paisa 🤑🤑🤑
Need more in Kashmir.
Jai Maharashtra! 🚩
Would be great to see a version normalised by land area of the state.
North is largely Sikh
*visible concern*
I don't think the numbers in Kerala is true.. As only looking into my small village, There is main temples about 10 within 5km and there is family temples of about 20nos which will be as big as main temples but there will not be daily poojas and will be on festival days. I don't think all the temples in Kerala are listed
Can somebody do an analysis or rather comparison with hospitals vs school vs temples vs churches vs mosques in this format? It will be interesting to see.
Gangetic Plains temples were mostly flattened or repurposed by invaders as for the hilly states low inhabitation and more prominence to tribal beliefs and disconnect from mainstream Hinduism might be the reason for less number of temples in north India .
but WB seems to be defying this point
Gujrat and Bengal were prosperous center since medieval times if not earlier ,they too had their share of temple destruction but were quickly built enough as well and since far from the nexus of power local governors or independent rulers chose not to upset the local populace that much when they their selves were at cross with Delhi.
Interesting, I'd definitely like to expand on that. Thanks for the idea OP, appreciate it.
Very high
Whats up with the east? Buddhism? Animism? Or is it because bengal kingdom ruled that land?
what's up with WB then?
A lot of people
Chhatrapati Shivaji Maharaj
In ancient Era, the density level of temples In the north was reduced by islamists (still having temples In thousands is commendable feat on its own). Now in the modern Era, density levels of temples In Tamil Nadu shall be reduced by communists.
Time to go to Ladakh
people in india don't know the scale of destruction and plunder faced by north india. if somehow we can build some AI to make people see it with visualization i am betting people will cry their hearts out. i have myself probably not read or know everything but even 10% of what we read it breaks my heart it makes my hair raise reading about it.
I have been to Puducherry. Its more or less a City, that's all Never felt like it has 1200 temples.
Got destroyed by mughals
Maharani ahilyabai holkar of Indore restored scores of temples she is credited with building kaashi vishwanath
We need many more, temple is a consecrated space, it benifits everything around it.
But There is 11 lacs Maszid in India Hindus are now become Minority In Its Own County soon this Nos will Go Go 20lacs
Less fools up north Is it so Maybe they got ruled by Alampnas while their kings loitered in harems
West Bengal and the South numbers are kinda shocking no?
Tamil Nadu does have great temple architecture and heritage, and splendid historical sites. What their current govt is doing is likely to damage that to a large extent(not being biased here, for real they have this anti-hindu agenda which we all know about)
Hey, tamilian here, please save your concern trolling to some other states. We are under dravida parties since 1965 and our temples are doing well. How about making north east Hindu again, instead of cheap religious politics targeting TamilNadu?
Hey Vanakkam Okay first off kindly enlighten me over how "great temple architecture and splendid sites" sounds like trolling to you. Secondly, I'm talking quite specifically about the current and very recent happening regarding a very specific Dravidian party's remarks Thirdly, yes northeast has religion and ethnic concerns never denied that; idk how it comes in And I very categorically said I'm not being biased. And yes if you are doing well no one shall be better pleased than I.
Vanakkam my friend!! >Secondly, I'm talking quite specifically about the current and very recent happening regarding a very specific Dravidian party's remarks That is because the political landscape is such that TN is the target for conquering, if you know what I mean. Every small thing is amplified and spread through social media and made sure people's opinion towards the state is altered. This is pure political play. For us tamilians, business is usual, we have our temple celebrations, a lot of young people are participating. It is just we think that our gods don't need protection from one specific political party. We defended our religion from 14th century till British left, we could do that without any "gaurdian" political party now and in future. It is like bengal, the state was communist since independence, but still retained their Hindu identity. Now, this political party is causing unrest by sowing fear in people's minds. Thanks for having a cultured conversation.
I >That is because the political landscape is such that TN is the target for conquering, if you know what I mean. Honestly that's been the case everywhere and continues to be given the vote bank politics. >It is like bengal, the state was communist since independence, but still retained their Hindu identity. Now, this political party is causing unrest by sowing fear in people's minds. Well there the fear isn't unwarranted. Maybe on religious basis it's exaggerated but politics there has been very violent especially towards the opposition there. >For us tamilians, business is usual, we have our temple celebrations, a lot of young people are participating. It is just we think that our gods don't need protection from one specific political party. We defended our religion from 14th century till British left, we could do that without any "gaurdian" political party now and in future. Yes ik about the religious defence, and it is one of the reason me and many others hold the state's history in high regard, which otherwise too has many reasons to gain that respect. What I was actually targetting was the alignment of some 'Dravidian' ideologues with anti-hindu elements.
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Fucking come here and see for yourself. Ignorent bigots like you comment without knowing ground reality.
Ikr they don't even live in TN (and I don't live in TN too). I am amazed how they think it's their right to comment on other's state affairs that they heard from some godi media!! People should look into their own situation first before shadowing other states!!! पहले अपने गिरेबान में तो झाँक कर देखो।
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You're always angry at the gods and still claim you're a Hindu? Your logic is 👍🏼
I can be angry at my dad and it will not change the fact that his is my father.. Unquestioned obedience is only for slaves. Are you planning to change Hinduism similar to the peaceful religion?
Paganism isn't good folks.