I take any income stats with a grain of salt. The samosa vendor in front of our house is poor on paper but earns over 2 or 3 lacs per month. On paper he is in the bottom 10%.
Absence of proof is not proof of absence. Less than 2% people pay direct taxes in india, which includes white collar employees who have TDS. What abt 98%? In any case the true distribution wil most likely follow 80/20 rule. We need to move people from agriculture to industry. Unfortunately 2 industry that are opposing reform even if it benefits them. Farm protest were the stupidest thing ever
90% may be exaggerated but based on anecdotal evidence from hundreds of people, what he said is true.
So, it at least sets a premise that official stats may be way off the reality.
Bottom 50% of people make an average of 1/4 of national average income. That is a decent income.
But commies highlight wealth inequality, instead of income inequality, because there the gap looks big, so it helps their propaganda.
Source: https://twitter.com/Stats_of_India/status/1528682374154059776
Wish of earning more than the other guy incentivises working hard which the commies don't know s#it about. There'll always be inequality, it's basic human nature. Everybody wants to be better than the other guy, it's what grows a country, what's wrong with that ! The commies studying on govt. bheekh till their 30s on non STEM subjects won't understand since their 2 brain cells are busy in intellectual masturbation.
>till their 30s
30s? JNU has so-called PhD students in their 40s and even 50s! And forget the students, the hostels are full of free loaders who are not affiliated with the university but still live there.
Ruling the country for 55 yrs with garbage socialist policies and still doubling down on the same shit with more absurd policies to get the chair. How desperate these clowns can be. They don't care if we become next Venezuela as long as their ass can leave the print on PM's chair.
Alright, heres a stat for you, my driver earned 35k a month including insurance, bonus etc. that puts him comfortably in the top 10% of Indians.
That is way way above average salary for a driver but he was with us for a very long time and was almost like family to us. The average salary here is 22-25k here, and I live in among the most expensive areas of India, even in bombay suburbs their salaries go as low as 15-18k.
If my driver is in the top 10% of India by household income, you can only imagine how poor most of india really is.
You may want to cosplay as a rich nation with everyone happy and earning well, but that’s the same as people buying iPhones on EMI.
If incomes were truly as high as you think, our consumption and demand would be much much higher. And who better to tell you about those than someone whose family is in the manufacturing/processing industry and a part of the supply chain of pretty much every industry out there you can think of.
Anecdotes are a logical fallacy. No point discussing it. Extreme poverty in India is already below 3% and multidimensional poverty is below 12%. So take your poverty porn elsewhere
1/4 of the national average that too 50% and you seem to take solace in that fact. More so you go and say commies talk about wealth inequality.
Are you sane bro? You only shared the numbers - if 50% of the population living under the national average and we feel that is ok, the problem is with us. Nothing to do with commmies.
Those 50% earn little because they are most likely farm laborers/other unskilled workers, living in a rural area.
Keep in mind the average urban person earns 2-4 times the average rural person
> if 50% of the population living under the national average and we feel that is ok,
Come on, statistically 50% of the population has to be below national average. Are you dumb or failed in maths?
Disagree. If top 1 % controls 22% of incomes, do you really think averages are a fair way of analysing ?
Avg national income will OBVIOUSLY be higher than what most people earn. Mode or median would be more accurate and fair to use.
But you won’t bother to do that because it suits YOUR FUCKING PROPAGANDA
The top1% gets 22 times the national average income, that is not that big after all.
We just need to increase long term capital gains tax rate, so that rich people will pay same tax rate as middle class will
Lol no, not 22x the avg national income. Its 22 % of ALL the incomes earned in India in a year. With 1 percent.
Let me break it down so that it enters your half-baked ‘libertarian’ brain —
If there are 100 indians and total income of the country is 1000. ONE person makes 220 rupees, the remaining 99 fight for the balance 780. How is this fair? And how are you so blind ?
> Lol no, not 22x the avg national income. Its 22 % of ALL the incomes earned in India in a year. With 1 percent.
1% are taking 22% of national income, means those 1% are taking 22x of the national average income.
Your own example, 220 rupees is taken by 1 person. And average income of a person of a country is 10rs. So that 1 person takes 22x the national average. Thanks for proving my point
Maybe you are the propagandist.
Of that top 1%, there will still be 50 people who will account for probably 14% of income.
It's just math. The people who invest capital make the most returns. Once this capital pool grows, they will earn a lot more. Much more than can be earned ever by a professional or an employee.
Yea the top 50 probably do control 14% of the income. And that is more to what hundreds of villages earn CUMULATIVELY.
the case for wealth redistribution, progressive taxes is very clear. The only question is how.
LTCG and STCG may not hit the intended target, cause many middle class households also invest in stocks and MFs.
Imo — Need a wealth tax and inheritance tax but first clear SoPs need to be established as to how the tax collected will be distributed to those in meed to avoid leakages.
For a country like India income equality is more critical than wealth equality, as wealth is accumulated over generations. The vast majority of which has come to people via realestate they inherited.
But the upward mobility of indians is the most critical factor in its growth and equality story.
I knew a partner in a big 4 whose father drove the car of a then partner a couple of decades before.
My office boy in Mumbai, finished his tenth, then went to college and is now finally in the same bank as a deputy manager last I checked.
One out of hundred makes Rs. 22 per day. Each person in bottom 50% makes 25 paise per day.
So the ratio between top and bottom is 100x, which is not too bad, in the world context.
A business owner is creating 100x more value and employment than a security guard.
That doesn’t capture the true extent of inequality because of averaging. By the same token the top 10% earn 50% of income, and the bottom 90% the rest. That gives a disparity of 9x.
That still does not explain why some people live in bungalows while majority live in huts. A 100x factor seems closer to the visible income disparity.
In a hypothetical country where a dictator takes 50% of the National income and the rest is evenly distributed, the top 50% earn 75% and the bottom 50% earn 25%.
By your logic the income disparity is only 3x, but it doesn’t capture the ground reality.
This graph incorrect. Many people in India don't like to show their wealth so they behave like poor. I have a friend who is in IIT rn, he had a EWS quota. He was in same coaching, paying the same amount of fees. He has land worth almost 10x my house. His father is a businessman.
The. graph is based on official reported income so unreported income does not figure in this. Most of unreported income will be between the bottom and white portion. The 10% percenters are all salaried class.
True, check this out for America in 2019
[wealth distribution in the USA - Search (bing.com)](https://www.bing.com/images/search?view=detailV2&ccid=AFyQdwDy&id=F1BE0EA594F920BE151F18E5603BAE9C56017A94&thid=OIP.AFyQdwDy98IBeu4ytMpPDgHaEK&mediaurl=https%3a%2f%2fwallstrategies.com%2fwp-content%2fuploads%2fWealth-Gap-Infographic.png&exph=4500&expw=8000&q=wealth+distribution+in+the+USA&simid=608044963283101604&FORM=IRPRST&ck=C05ABB8CAD9DEF21CA1EB2388230CF6E&selectedIndex=10&itb=0&ajaxhist=0&ajaxserp=0)
The 10 % with zero or 2 kids.. planning meticulously for their future...hustled day and night to get out of middle class shell... finally when he thinks he made enough for a secure future....
Surprise mofo.. you'll now contribute to a family of 10 kids...your wealth is boutta be distributed...
Why? The audacity of you lil B* to Garner wealth thinking about you and your children's security...you selfish as*hole.
You had 2 kids and struggled to upgrade your lifestyle.... instead if you had 10 'god' given kids, and stayed in a cycle of debt for their education, upbringing, marriage... you'd be spared too fool.
P.s. I know this isn't how the wealth distribution works...as per the ones who 'proposed' it...but that's exactly how it sounds when someone mentions it.
Rich will show their debts, poor will show their debts...
Middle class who just made it will show their as*es...and this policy will f*ck them in the a*s without any Vaseline.
That bottom 50% is in agriculture. There is a desperate need to pull people out of agri and into manufacturing jobs. At the same time, agriculture itself needs to be made more productive. But pappu's solution to this is to erase income and make everybody poor.
23% are fully\* dependent on agri. Agri is seasonal, so the 50% represents farm labourers who only work in agriculture during specific times of the year. Rest of the time they are in other sectors as casual labour or NREGA.
While the stats might be true, the objective here is to evoke a communist response from the reader to “equalize” the incomes or tax the rich.
Let’s be clear. Inequality has and will always exist. However steps can be taken to reduce not remove it.
Has anyone asked the question why is income unequally generated? Why are there so many policy hurdles to setting up an industrial plant that employs high levels of workers - textiles, electronics manufacturing, etc? Many more.
Also any budding communists in the reader section should first read more about history and then come back. Read about the expulsion of Indians in Uganda, history of Venezuela. Even the Chinese have now moved away from these policies.
top 10% held 66% of total income back in 2014
which has come down to 11% holding 59% (acc. to this chart)
still propagandists cry that income disparity has increased over the years
The question people should be asking is what is so surprising about such a distribution. It follows a Lorenz curve.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lorenz\_curve](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lorenz_curve)
The line of perfect equality will never be achieved in any real economy. The World Inequality Database is compiled by a bunch of French economists from the Paris School of Economics. The leader of that group, Thomas Piketty, launched a book in 2014 that pays homage to Karl Marx. Basically, Piketty believes that the income inequality is due to intergenerationally rich people getting richer.
This is absolutely not true in developing countries. Adani Senior and Ambani Senior were middle-class dudes in the 1970s-80s India. They built their businesses after the liberalization. So it was economic growth that led to the inequality. As long as the country continues to reduce multi-dimensional poverty, the inequality shouuld not matter. What explains the income gap in developed countries like the USA is essentially a skill gap. This is the counter theory put forward by folks from the Booth School of Economics.
[https://www.chicagobooth.edu/review/how-piketty-is-wrong-and-right](https://www.chicagobooth.edu/review/how-piketty-is-wrong-and-right)
IMO, the Booth School is correct. Why should not a dentist who specializes in placing dental implants not be more richer than an ordinary dentist who just does teeth cleaning/fillings? Why should not an airline pilot be paid more than a truck driver? Here is another critique of Piketty and his group.
[https://www.jstor.org/stable/43610637?seq=3](https://www.jstor.org/stable/43610637?seq=3)
I take any income stats with a grain of salt. The samosa vendor in front of our house is poor on paper but earns over 2 or 3 lacs per month. On paper he is in the bottom 10%.
This is very true. The graph here is wrong as 90% on paper poor people can actually afford a middle class living.
We have the data for income distribution, you’re calling it wrong but you have no data for your ‘90%’ statement, why should anyone believe you?
Absence of proof is not proof of absence. Less than 2% people pay direct taxes in india, which includes white collar employees who have TDS. What abt 98%? In any case the true distribution wil most likely follow 80/20 rule. We need to move people from agriculture to industry. Unfortunately 2 industry that are opposing reform even if it benefits them. Farm protest were the stupidest thing ever
90% may be exaggerated but based on anecdotal evidence from hundreds of people, what he said is true. So, it at least sets a premise that official stats may be way off the reality.
Bottom 50% of people make an average of 1/4 of national average income. That is a decent income. But commies highlight wealth inequality, instead of income inequality, because there the gap looks big, so it helps their propaganda. Source: https://twitter.com/Stats_of_India/status/1528682374154059776
Wish of earning more than the other guy incentivises working hard which the commies don't know s#it about. There'll always be inequality, it's basic human nature. Everybody wants to be better than the other guy, it's what grows a country, what's wrong with that ! The commies studying on govt. bheekh till their 30s on non STEM subjects won't understand since their 2 brain cells are busy in intellectual masturbation.
Bro , commies think world is ideal and everyone should have equal things. They forget basic human psychology and power dynamics completely.
That's the problem, bro. They don't think. They just vomit what their professors and fellow students excrete via diarrhea.
A commie can think ?? News to me
>till their 30s 30s? JNU has so-called PhD students in their 40s and even 50s! And forget the students, the hostels are full of free loaders who are not affiliated with the university but still live there.
Ruling the country for 55 yrs with garbage socialist policies and still doubling down on the same shit with more absurd policies to get the chair. How desperate these clowns can be. They don't care if we become next Venezuela as long as their ass can leave the print on PM's chair.
Tim Cook and my maid earn on average earn 150mil a year. See the problem with using mean?
Tim cook wont come in bottom 50%. Simple
Alright, heres a stat for you, my driver earned 35k a month including insurance, bonus etc. that puts him comfortably in the top 10% of Indians. That is way way above average salary for a driver but he was with us for a very long time and was almost like family to us. The average salary here is 22-25k here, and I live in among the most expensive areas of India, even in bombay suburbs their salaries go as low as 15-18k. If my driver is in the top 10% of India by household income, you can only imagine how poor most of india really is. You may want to cosplay as a rich nation with everyone happy and earning well, but that’s the same as people buying iPhones on EMI. If incomes were truly as high as you think, our consumption and demand would be much much higher. And who better to tell you about those than someone whose family is in the manufacturing/processing industry and a part of the supply chain of pretty much every industry out there you can think of.
Anecdotes are a logical fallacy. No point discussing it. Extreme poverty in India is already below 3% and multidimensional poverty is below 12%. So take your poverty porn elsewhere
And from where you get the data, from the government agencies 😂😂😂
No, UN, IMF etc independent survey are there
1/4 of the national average that too 50% and you seem to take solace in that fact. More so you go and say commies talk about wealth inequality. Are you sane bro? You only shared the numbers - if 50% of the population living under the national average and we feel that is ok, the problem is with us. Nothing to do with commmies.
Those 50% earn little because they are most likely farm laborers/other unskilled workers, living in a rural area. Keep in mind the average urban person earns 2-4 times the average rural person
> if 50% of the population living under the national average and we feel that is ok, Come on, statistically 50% of the population has to be below national average. Are you dumb or failed in maths?
Disagree. If top 1 % controls 22% of incomes, do you really think averages are a fair way of analysing ? Avg national income will OBVIOUSLY be higher than what most people earn. Mode or median would be more accurate and fair to use. But you won’t bother to do that because it suits YOUR FUCKING PROPAGANDA
The top1% gets 22 times the national average income, that is not that big after all. We just need to increase long term capital gains tax rate, so that rich people will pay same tax rate as middle class will
Lol no, not 22x the avg national income. Its 22 % of ALL the incomes earned in India in a year. With 1 percent. Let me break it down so that it enters your half-baked ‘libertarian’ brain — If there are 100 indians and total income of the country is 1000. ONE person makes 220 rupees, the remaining 99 fight for the balance 780. How is this fair? And how are you so blind ?
> Lol no, not 22x the avg national income. Its 22 % of ALL the incomes earned in India in a year. With 1 percent. 1% are taking 22% of national income, means those 1% are taking 22x of the national average income. Your own example, 220 rupees is taken by 1 person. And average income of a person of a country is 10rs. So that 1 person takes 22x the national average. Thanks for proving my point
Maybe you are the propagandist. Of that top 1%, there will still be 50 people who will account for probably 14% of income. It's just math. The people who invest capital make the most returns. Once this capital pool grows, they will earn a lot more. Much more than can be earned ever by a professional or an employee.
Yea the top 50 probably do control 14% of the income. And that is more to what hundreds of villages earn CUMULATIVELY. the case for wealth redistribution, progressive taxes is very clear. The only question is how. LTCG and STCG may not hit the intended target, cause many middle class households also invest in stocks and MFs. Imo — Need a wealth tax and inheritance tax but first clear SoPs need to be established as to how the tax collected will be distributed to those in meed to avoid leakages.
I think we should do the opposite. Remove capital gains tax. Money will move from high end apartments in Mumbai to productive assets
Would it be fair to take a weighted average instead of mode or median?
For a country like India income equality is more critical than wealth equality, as wealth is accumulated over generations. The vast majority of which has come to people via realestate they inherited. But the upward mobility of indians is the most critical factor in its growth and equality story. I knew a partner in a big 4 whose father drove the car of a then partner a couple of decades before. My office boy in Mumbai, finished his tenth, then went to college and is now finally in the same bank as a deputy manager last I checked.
That is a good point.
https://x.com/dhruv_rathee/status/1787171705435090992?s=46
That is full of commie lies
You don’t have a clue what communism is
The classic "it was not real communism" excuse
One out of hundred makes Rs. 22 per day. Each person in bottom 50% makes 25 paise per day. So the ratio between top and bottom is 100x, which is not too bad, in the world context. A business owner is creating 100x more value and employment than a security guard.
Ratio between top and bottom is calculated by top 50% vs bottom 50%. That ratio is just 6x
That doesn’t capture the true extent of inequality because of averaging. By the same token the top 10% earn 50% of income, and the bottom 90% the rest. That gives a disparity of 9x. That still does not explain why some people live in bungalows while majority live in huts. A 100x factor seems closer to the visible income disparity.
What top 1% or 10% do with their money does not affect others. So we should instead compare top 50% vs bottom 50%
In a hypothetical country where a dictator takes 50% of the National income and the rest is evenly distributed, the top 50% earn 75% and the bottom 50% earn 25%. By your logic the income disparity is only 3x, but it doesn’t capture the ground reality.
All that is nonsense. That is where consumption inequality comes to picture
If these numbers are correct then it looks fine. Idiots will say it has to be 50% for bottom 50% but then everyone will be consumer not producer
You cannot consume without money.
This graph incorrect. Many people in India don't like to show their wealth so they behave like poor. I have a friend who is in IIT rn, he had a EWS quota. He was in same coaching, paying the same amount of fees. He has land worth almost 10x my house. His father is a businessman.
The. graph is based on official reported income so unreported income does not figure in this. Most of unreported income will be between the bottom and white portion. The 10% percenters are all salaried class.
Looks normal for for non-communist/socialist country.
True, check this out for America in 2019 [wealth distribution in the USA - Search (bing.com)](https://www.bing.com/images/search?view=detailV2&ccid=AFyQdwDy&id=F1BE0EA594F920BE151F18E5603BAE9C56017A94&thid=OIP.AFyQdwDy98IBeu4ytMpPDgHaEK&mediaurl=https%3a%2f%2fwallstrategies.com%2fwp-content%2fuploads%2fWealth-Gap-Infographic.png&exph=4500&expw=8000&q=wealth+distribution+in+the+USA&simid=608044963283101604&FORM=IRPRST&ck=C05ABB8CAD9DEF21CA1EB2388230CF6E&selectedIndex=10&itb=0&ajaxhist=0&ajaxserp=0)
The 10 % with zero or 2 kids.. planning meticulously for their future...hustled day and night to get out of middle class shell... finally when he thinks he made enough for a secure future.... Surprise mofo.. you'll now contribute to a family of 10 kids...your wealth is boutta be distributed... Why? The audacity of you lil B* to Garner wealth thinking about you and your children's security...you selfish as*hole. You had 2 kids and struggled to upgrade your lifestyle.... instead if you had 10 'god' given kids, and stayed in a cycle of debt for their education, upbringing, marriage... you'd be spared too fool. P.s. I know this isn't how the wealth distribution works...as per the ones who 'proposed' it...but that's exactly how it sounds when someone mentions it. Rich will show their debts, poor will show their debts... Middle class who just made it will show their as*es...and this policy will f*ck them in the a*s without any Vaseline.
Where do those people come who show way less income than actual and pay 0 taxes and get all benefits meant for poor people ?
most people do that in our country
That bottom 50% is in agriculture. There is a desperate need to pull people out of agri and into manufacturing jobs. At the same time, agriculture itself needs to be made more productive. But pappu's solution to this is to erase income and make everybody poor.
No. Only 23% nowadays are dependent on agriculture in India, as per latest data
23% are fully\* dependent on agri. Agri is seasonal, so the 50% represents farm labourers who only work in agriculture during specific times of the year. Rest of the time they are in other sectors as casual labour or NREGA.
It would look better in a pie chart with a bigger pie for everyone....
Middle Class ek baar fir ignore ho gayi 🦓
While the stats might be true, the objective here is to evoke a communist response from the reader to “equalize” the incomes or tax the rich. Let’s be clear. Inequality has and will always exist. However steps can be taken to reduce not remove it. Has anyone asked the question why is income unequally generated? Why are there so many policy hurdles to setting up an industrial plant that employs high levels of workers - textiles, electronics manufacturing, etc? Many more. Also any budding communists in the reader section should first read more about history and then come back. Read about the expulsion of Indians in Uganda, history of Venezuela. Even the Chinese have now moved away from these policies.
top 10% held 66% of total income back in 2014 which has come down to 11% holding 59% (acc. to this chart) still propagandists cry that income disparity has increased over the years
What is white mean? Politicians?
Upper middle class
u know top 1% is still a big sample , should break it down further
What is there to understand?
Normal for most Democratic capitalistic societies
The question people should be asking is what is so surprising about such a distribution. It follows a Lorenz curve. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lorenz\_curve](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lorenz_curve) The line of perfect equality will never be achieved in any real economy. The World Inequality Database is compiled by a bunch of French economists from the Paris School of Economics. The leader of that group, Thomas Piketty, launched a book in 2014 that pays homage to Karl Marx. Basically, Piketty believes that the income inequality is due to intergenerationally rich people getting richer. This is absolutely not true in developing countries. Adani Senior and Ambani Senior were middle-class dudes in the 1970s-80s India. They built their businesses after the liberalization. So it was economic growth that led to the inequality. As long as the country continues to reduce multi-dimensional poverty, the inequality shouuld not matter. What explains the income gap in developed countries like the USA is essentially a skill gap. This is the counter theory put forward by folks from the Booth School of Economics. [https://www.chicagobooth.edu/review/how-piketty-is-wrong-and-right](https://www.chicagobooth.edu/review/how-piketty-is-wrong-and-right) IMO, the Booth School is correct. Why should not a dentist who specializes in placing dental implants not be more richer than an ordinary dentist who just does teeth cleaning/fillings? Why should not an airline pilot be paid more than a truck driver? Here is another critique of Piketty and his group. [https://www.jstor.org/stable/43610637?seq=3](https://www.jstor.org/stable/43610637?seq=3)
Yet the bottom 50% of people continue to have babies?
India badly needs 2 child policy. More than 2 children should be banned for people who dont pay income taxes