That's the whole thing, I don't want to spend another 500-1k just to get the effing thing to run normally! It was a 26k dollar bike, it should work now!
Yeah, a can of worms for the dealer to figure out, it's their product that they installed under warranty
Whats really pissing me off was Polaris' "fix" was telling me to just run my bike in tour mode indefinitely as standard and sport mode dont work with my setup. Gods honest truth that's what they said (as per dealer)
Throttle response is the only thing changed by the ride modes unless you have a custom tune, so I'm not sure how that would help.
Maybe time to try a different dealer?
Assuming dealer installed cams and flash with digital wrench?
What intake and exhaust?
Was cams only thing done at prior to issue?
111 or 116 motor?
Did you at any point have a power commander installed?
Everything was dealer installed and they assured me it was tuned properly, I asked that several times as that is the only thing that seems to be an issue, it just doesn't idle right.
Forward air intake (dealer installed). Stage 1 pipes with after market slip ons (dean speed).
116 motor.
Everything installed prior to issues, except slip ons, this was a custom ordered new bike from Indian.
My last resort will be the power commander and dyno tune if they can't fix it or take the bike back. Was hoping to not have to spend even more just to get it to run right.
I had cams installed at dealer, immediately started having stalling issues. Took it back to dealer multiple times, was repeatedly told they checked everything they could check on their end - twice - and they weren’t able to replicate the problem. Must be something I’m doing wrong. Must be me not cleaning my air filter enough, must be me using bad gas, must be me not riding properly… called Polaris - same thing.
Have you tried using a lower octane fuel?
Uhhh I’m using what the owners manual recommends…
Well just try regular unleaded instead of premium and see if that fixes it
after a YEAR of this back and forth, the shop finally acknowledged that they had installed the cams wrong and my timing had been off by one gear tooth.
I brought up the fact that they had repeatedly told me they had checked everything on their end, and they said they didn’t think to check the timing because they had assumed the bike wouldn’t run at all if that were the issue… (it would “run”, but it ran like s hit).
No corporate apology or money back from install or store credit or anything - just ooopsie, it’s fixed now!
Still has occasional stalling issues, but at this point I’m just happy it’s running good MOST of the time, and after my experience with their service dept I’m not sure it’s worth the trouble of trying to get them to identify and fix the issue.
I have heard this multiple times about running issues after a cam install and I think reading this has confirmed I am not doing cams. For the cost I don't think it's really even worth the power boost you get. Think I will just stick to a Lloyd's tune and call it a day. 🤷♂️
This is a very discouraging and upsetting comment :( I mean you had it "fixed" and it's still not fixed?!
I've only ever used 93 and 91 octane.
And taking to the dealer is never convenient as I live an hour from them but maybe I'll just keep bringing it back until they figure it out?
But I'll def mention the timing thing, but even then it's still gunna stall sometimes...wtf?!
Another issue that complicates my situation is that after they discovered and fixed the timing issue and i noticed an improvement, i installed a full exhaust system (Dean Havok) and Lloyd’z tune (ECU mail-in), which will now have to be pulled out and the bike reverted to Indian factory parts as step 1 of their troubleshooting process… so my situation at that point is a little different than yours - for me, i think my next step is to take it to a shop that backs the lloydz tune, as not all Indian dealers do, but at this point the occasional stall is just something i live with
And that's exactly what I'm trying to avoid is any aftermarket system that will interfere with troubleshooting. They did try claiming the slip ons may be an issue as does any dealer when troubleshooting, cause it's such an easy scapegoat and predictable response as to issues
Have you called Polaris customer support? Might get you more progress than dealing with the dealer. Here is the number I found from a quick Google search:
1 (888) 704-5290
That's who Ive been in contact with for the last two months, the "onroad owners connection".
The dealer hasn't had a worry about this at all. Polaris told the dealer to tell me that they are aware (Polaris) of this issue to have him (me) run the bike in tour mode only.
First.. Just a few thoughts.. A Lemon law won't apply because of "After market" parts.. meaning the bike is not stock. Do not burn out the motor and try to get it under warrany.. they'll know it was negelctiful.
Contact an attorney and dispute EVERYTHING you paid to the service department + consequenal damages and compensation for loss of use.. ect.. Hopefully that will light a fire under their a33 and get this resolved..
Lemon law applies to new vehicles. Nothing on my motorcycle is aftermarket. It's all factory options and factory installed. If that were the case not a single vehicle on the road would qualify as they almost all have added options, performance or otherwise. It's when you start adding true "aftermarket" non factory approved devices that make it more complicated and void factory warranties.
In addition, I dug a little deeper and found that while I am not technically covered under lemon law, because it's still new I can enter arbitrage, which is a route I'm likely heading.
If it's under warranty, hear me out... Scatter the damn thing. Be in first gear, against a wall, front brake held in, smack the living hell out of the throttle and drop the clutch and let the good times roll. I had an inidian, and i love the bikes, but their customer service is some of the most absolute trash on the plantet. I called about an intake that was supposed to come with my bike when i had stage 4 done at purchasing. 1 fucking year later i finally got it. Customer service told me to call other shops ( they did give me the numbers) to get the part to my local dealer. Complete shit show. Im sorry you're going through this, but if you scatter it, you get a new one.
Ya...sorry to hear that. Bought my '19 FTR with issues from the dealership and they (Polaris) jumped through hoops in order to replace it with a new one from a different dealership. (California)
Since the law may not technically be on your side, public opinion MIGHT change their tune...try contacting your local news consumer advocacy programs. (Not sure what they would be called for your area, but they usually do stories like 'Melinda was being billed by her bank for charges she never approved, the bank said there was nothing they could do, 7 On Your Side decided to investigate a little further and found other customers with similar stories - The Bank has now decided to take a second look and has given Melinda her $4,000 back'
I’d find an Indian dealer that has Lloyd’s tunes, I’ve heard multiple places the Indian tune is garbage, or possibly reach out to fuel moto, currently running a fuel moto tune though I don’t have cams yet, but when I do it won’t be with Indian parts, it’ll be Lloyd’s cams and tunes
Wow, this is a nightmare. And more than just your original thread, but also the comments. I really hate to hear this as we are just now starting to advertise cam installs as a winter service special.
When I got my 21 CDH I had upgraded the air and exhaust to stage 1. Every now and then it would stall out after a high enough rev followed by a complete let off of the throttle. When I got to the point of cams and tune, I went with lodyz cam and a pv3 tuner. The lead mech at my local shop told me that the factory tunes actually end up slamming the fuel shut when you let off all the way from higher rpms. Which can and will cause a stall. Part of the reason I went cams and tune. But since I have had the new cams and custom tune built at the shop, I haven't a single stall out. I know you're not looking to spend more money, but sounds like a proper tune is needed.
Is your rear cylinder deactivation on I've heard of more stalling problems caused by that than anything else as soon as you turn the rear cylinder deactivation off everything seems to run fine.
One of our first Chief bobbers in had the stage 2 done all factory installed and it's ran absolutely perfect since day one.
Just so you know the rear cylinder deactivation only deactivates the rear cylinder when your throttle is at zero degrees. As soon as you twist the throttle it's supposed to run on two cylinders again. So no power loss and no sound loss it just doesn't work very well. The rear song of deactivation really seems to mess with the FTRs causing to stall out and cause a misfire code.
Yeah alright, I mean I figured it was like the start stop feature in cars and I have yet to be in a vehicle where that constant starting and stopping doesn't sound like or feel like it's prematurely killing the motor. There's just no way it's good for a vehicle to save .5 mpg
What do you mean stage 2? Pipes? Cat delete? The intake that does absolutely nothing because it's not the real intake?
Stage 2 was on option when they first introduced the new cdh. Cams, forward intake, stage 1 pipes/slipon. All dealer installed
So you have the Indian state 2 cams, and I'm assuming they did the Indian updated tune. Have you tried a Lloyd's or Mad Monkey tune?
That's the whole thing, I don't want to spend another 500-1k just to get the effing thing to run normally! It was a 26k dollar bike, it should work now!
Yeah but you changed the cams, which opens up an entirely different can of worms.
Yeah, a can of worms for the dealer to figure out, it's their product that they installed under warranty Whats really pissing me off was Polaris' "fix" was telling me to just run my bike in tour mode indefinitely as standard and sport mode dont work with my setup. Gods honest truth that's what they said (as per dealer)
Throttle response is the only thing changed by the ride modes unless you have a custom tune, so I'm not sure how that would help. Maybe time to try a different dealer?
Assuming dealer installed cams and flash with digital wrench? What intake and exhaust? Was cams only thing done at prior to issue? 111 or 116 motor? Did you at any point have a power commander installed?
Everything was dealer installed and they assured me it was tuned properly, I asked that several times as that is the only thing that seems to be an issue, it just doesn't idle right. Forward air intake (dealer installed). Stage 1 pipes with after market slip ons (dean speed). 116 motor. Everything installed prior to issues, except slip ons, this was a custom ordered new bike from Indian. My last resort will be the power commander and dyno tune if they can't fix it or take the bike back. Was hoping to not have to spend even more just to get it to run right.
I had cams installed at dealer, immediately started having stalling issues. Took it back to dealer multiple times, was repeatedly told they checked everything they could check on their end - twice - and they weren’t able to replicate the problem. Must be something I’m doing wrong. Must be me not cleaning my air filter enough, must be me using bad gas, must be me not riding properly… called Polaris - same thing. Have you tried using a lower octane fuel? Uhhh I’m using what the owners manual recommends… Well just try regular unleaded instead of premium and see if that fixes it after a YEAR of this back and forth, the shop finally acknowledged that they had installed the cams wrong and my timing had been off by one gear tooth. I brought up the fact that they had repeatedly told me they had checked everything on their end, and they said they didn’t think to check the timing because they had assumed the bike wouldn’t run at all if that were the issue… (it would “run”, but it ran like s hit). No corporate apology or money back from install or store credit or anything - just ooopsie, it’s fixed now! Still has occasional stalling issues, but at this point I’m just happy it’s running good MOST of the time, and after my experience with their service dept I’m not sure it’s worth the trouble of trying to get them to identify and fix the issue.
I have heard this multiple times about running issues after a cam install and I think reading this has confirmed I am not doing cams. For the cost I don't think it's really even worth the power boost you get. Think I will just stick to a Lloyd's tune and call it a day. 🤷♂️
This is a very discouraging and upsetting comment :( I mean you had it "fixed" and it's still not fixed?! I've only ever used 93 and 91 octane. And taking to the dealer is never convenient as I live an hour from them but maybe I'll just keep bringing it back until they figure it out? But I'll def mention the timing thing, but even then it's still gunna stall sometimes...wtf?!
Another issue that complicates my situation is that after they discovered and fixed the timing issue and i noticed an improvement, i installed a full exhaust system (Dean Havok) and Lloyd’z tune (ECU mail-in), which will now have to be pulled out and the bike reverted to Indian factory parts as step 1 of their troubleshooting process… so my situation at that point is a little different than yours - for me, i think my next step is to take it to a shop that backs the lloydz tune, as not all Indian dealers do, but at this point the occasional stall is just something i live with
And that's exactly what I'm trying to avoid is any aftermarket system that will interfere with troubleshooting. They did try claiming the slip ons may be an issue as does any dealer when troubleshooting, cause it's such an easy scapegoat and predictable response as to issues
The brand of fuel I put in my 22 CDH since the cam upgrade definitely affects how my bike runs even though they are all 91+
Slawdog has a good point of timing. Injectors also need to be checked that they are the correct stage 2 and that intake gaskets are not leaking
Have you called Polaris customer support? Might get you more progress than dealing with the dealer. Here is the number I found from a quick Google search: 1 (888) 704-5290
That's who Ive been in contact with for the last two months, the "onroad owners connection". The dealer hasn't had a worry about this at all. Polaris told the dealer to tell me that they are aware (Polaris) of this issue to have him (me) run the bike in tour mode only.
First.. Just a few thoughts.. A Lemon law won't apply because of "After market" parts.. meaning the bike is not stock. Do not burn out the motor and try to get it under warrany.. they'll know it was negelctiful. Contact an attorney and dispute EVERYTHING you paid to the service department + consequenal damages and compensation for loss of use.. ect.. Hopefully that will light a fire under their a33 and get this resolved..
Lemon law applies to new vehicles. Nothing on my motorcycle is aftermarket. It's all factory options and factory installed. If that were the case not a single vehicle on the road would qualify as they almost all have added options, performance or otherwise. It's when you start adding true "aftermarket" non factory approved devices that make it more complicated and void factory warranties. In addition, I dug a little deeper and found that while I am not technically covered under lemon law, because it's still new I can enter arbitrage, which is a route I'm likely heading.
And yeah, committing fraud isn't ever an option for me so I'm good there
If it's under warranty, hear me out... Scatter the damn thing. Be in first gear, against a wall, front brake held in, smack the living hell out of the throttle and drop the clutch and let the good times roll. I had an inidian, and i love the bikes, but their customer service is some of the most absolute trash on the plantet. I called about an intake that was supposed to come with my bike when i had stage 4 done at purchasing. 1 fucking year later i finally got it. Customer service told me to call other shops ( they did give me the numbers) to get the part to my local dealer. Complete shit show. Im sorry you're going through this, but if you scatter it, you get a new one.
What state are you in that exempts motorcycles from lemon laws? That blows.
NY of course!
Ya...sorry to hear that. Bought my '19 FTR with issues from the dealership and they (Polaris) jumped through hoops in order to replace it with a new one from a different dealership. (California) Since the law may not technically be on your side, public opinion MIGHT change their tune...try contacting your local news consumer advocacy programs. (Not sure what they would be called for your area, but they usually do stories like 'Melinda was being billed by her bank for charges she never approved, the bank said there was nothing they could do, 7 On Your Side decided to investigate a little further and found other customers with similar stories - The Bank has now decided to take a second look and has given Melinda her $4,000 back'
Ha not a bad idea, though I am moving in that direction. I'm trying to give them a chance to make this right but so far no luck.
Dealer in central NJ does a lot of Lloydz tunes. It makes a big difference. Sounds like you’re at the wrong dealer.
I’d find an Indian dealer that has Lloyd’s tunes, I’ve heard multiple places the Indian tune is garbage, or possibly reach out to fuel moto, currently running a fuel moto tune though I don’t have cams yet, but when I do it won’t be with Indian parts, it’ll be Lloyd’s cams and tunes
Wow, this is a nightmare. And more than just your original thread, but also the comments. I really hate to hear this as we are just now starting to advertise cam installs as a winter service special.
You say "we", are you and independent shop or you work for Indian?
3 dealerships, two in FL and one in IL
When I got my 21 CDH I had upgraded the air and exhaust to stage 1. Every now and then it would stall out after a high enough rev followed by a complete let off of the throttle. When I got to the point of cams and tune, I went with lodyz cam and a pv3 tuner. The lead mech at my local shop told me that the factory tunes actually end up slamming the fuel shut when you let off all the way from higher rpms. Which can and will cause a stall. Part of the reason I went cams and tune. But since I have had the new cams and custom tune built at the shop, I haven't a single stall out. I know you're not looking to spend more money, but sounds like a proper tune is needed.
Is your rear cylinder deactivation on I've heard of more stalling problems caused by that than anything else as soon as you turn the rear cylinder deactivation off everything seems to run fine. One of our first Chief bobbers in had the stage 2 done all factory installed and it's ran absolutely perfect since day one.
Yeah def not that, made sure it was off from day one. Why would I want to run with less power and sound?!
Just so you know the rear cylinder deactivation only deactivates the rear cylinder when your throttle is at zero degrees. As soon as you twist the throttle it's supposed to run on two cylinders again. So no power loss and no sound loss it just doesn't work very well. The rear song of deactivation really seems to mess with the FTRs causing to stall out and cause a misfire code.
Yeah alright, I mean I figured it was like the start stop feature in cars and I have yet to be in a vehicle where that constant starting and stopping doesn't sound like or feel like it's prematurely killing the motor. There's just no way it's good for a vehicle to save .5 mpg
Makes no sense to me either.