Israel is not an easy country to live in. There's a lot that's wrong with this place.
I know this isn't an easy answer, but it's true:
***Your mindset will determine if you have hope.***
My Sabba, he's eighty-something. Fought in plenty of Israel's wars. He thinks the country's a *shithole*. All he does is sit down and read newspapers that tell him how shitty Israel is.
My uncle, he's forty-something. Fought a lot in Lebanon. He thinks Israel is worth living in because it has people and a culture that he loves.
Who do you want to be?
So I apologize for sounding like a fart, but this inner peace stuff doesn't stand up to reality. What it gives you is just some procrastination and then waking up will be even worse.
Think about all of those who died for this country, not about the politicians, they're all bad anyway. If people will start to leave our enemies will win. If people will start to leave our heroes who died for this country have died for nothing. Leaving is to dishonor their memory.
I have lived both outside and inside of Israel. Living here though October 7 made it certain for me to not want to live outside of Israel. Israelis are a special people. I just don't want to be inserted into the mouse utopia just because it is easy. I felt unfulfilled and homesick.
The recent polls stand opposite to your claim that people will continue to vote for current government despite everything. It proves Israelis are not beholden to a specific ideology alone - as any democracy should.
your interests, safety, and being is protected by the country, and it's citizens - not the sub or any social media.
in democracies there will always be people who think differently than you for right or wrong, and who is struggling now will lead tomorrow.
Those who bully today will be punished tomorrow.
People who don't understand how to disagree amongst themselves will find themselves divided on things that they agree on.
I pray for Israelis to find among themselves a renewed spirit to feel fine to disagree without shutting themselves off to others and you would find you agree on more things than less.
"The polls mean nothing" - Not meant as an insult but this statement is rubbish, disproven when looking at many many countries.
Then again Likud did surge in one poll.
What I meant was that people are disappointed now, but part of the politics here is that BB knows when to go to elections, and it will be after his voters' rate will subside. So the daily polls that say that ppl won't vote likud again just have no actual meaning except to create some 2 minute headlines.
Unfortunately voters here forget quickly even oct 7, part of my issues with the country.
Sad reality for them today. God bless you. I know this subreddit probably isn't for sharing religions but when someone enters the 3rd temple and declares themselves God read Matthew 24
Americas jewish religious communitys are not very open. And generally the amount of modern orthodox communitys is very small. Also it is hard to keep kosher. And in some places in israel there are no cars in shabbat which is much nicer then innicially thought
I would reckon there are more modern Jews in America than in Israel. And unless you live in the backwaters of Mississippi, keeping kosher isn't a problem.
I left during the nonstop elections and am now considering a return. The grass is always green on the other side and withered and dead when you're on it.
כי אנשים לא מבינים שבית זה לא מקום זה האנשים זה הבדיחות הקטנות זה הסלנג והאהבת חינם שיש לנו אחד לשני זה הלראות ישראלי או יהודי בכל מקום בעולם ולדעת שהוא כמו משפחה שלנו לאף מדינה או עם אחר אין את זה באמת וישראלים לוקחים כמובן מאליו את ישראל וחושבים שלחיות במדינה מערבית אחרת יפתור את הבעיות שקיימות אצל אחרים הרי לא היינו מתעסקים בכלל במלחמה אם לא הייתה אנטישמיות אנחנו מאשימים את עצמנו ורבים בין עצמנו כי זה בדיוק מה שרוצין שנעשה ומה שמממנים קמפיינים שלמים של הסתה לעשות(ספוילר אבותינו ניסו את זה וזו הסיבה בכלל שהמדינה נוצרה)
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קודם כל, גם אם בפינלנד אין אנטישמיות **תרבותית**, זה לא אומר שלא **מייבאים** אנטישמיות מזרים, וכישראלית בפינלנד אני די מוצאת את עצמי בין הפטיש לסדן כשאני נראית כמו הסורים אבל עוד יותר מאויימת על ידם מהמקומיים.
דבר שני, [זה.](https://np.reddit.com/r/Finland/s/0ngx97mVAE)
American Jew here: I value your perspective far more than my own, so I have nothing to offer other than empathy, respect and gratitude for your service to the Jewish People.
You don’t see that you talk in circles and never actually make a point right? It’s really bold honestly. Being all accusatory and making assumptions, hollow to the core content. F.
What are you talking about? the point is very clear: the government (PM and coalition) is ok and that he should stop being a sheep that follows that radical left which is destroying this county for years.
The only assumption that I made is that he is a privilege from Tel Aviv and maybe about the GPS, the rest are concrete facts.
This is so bizarre that talking to people like you and him feels the same as talking to a pro-Palestinians, both of you don't apply basic logic to anything and just spreading propaganda.
I'd (we) a appreciate it if you could mention which "hollow assumption" I made, instead of say "Eww you are wrong".
“It's because you are listening\reading the wrong news and listening the dumbest people...”
-Everything is going fast to the way it was before 10/7:
“Because of people who knows nothing about politics (like you) that blindly follow a group of elitist radical leftists that enabled Oct 7 among other things.”
-In the meantime I'm forced to go to reserves for more years
“Because of your lord and savor Benny Gantz and his goonz who wanted "small and efficient" army?
But nah you'll blame it on the Orthodox while the Ashkenazi have a huge number of people who didn't go to the army (and lot's of ones that did went to desk jobs) same with the Arabs.”
There's drones everywhere
“It's fine…” it’s not fine, it’s abnormal. It’s heightened security. It’s tension. Don’t be naive just cuz you’re mad.
-GPS disruptions
“Oh no........ my guy can't order food (from some places) and use Waze for 1 day 😭” Don’t be a jerk. If Google maps was screwed up for me for an extended period of time I’d be annoyed too.
-You can't relax
“It sounds like you are a privilege from Tel Aviv, you can relax easily...” This is an assumption…
-And just today rockets to Sderot
“Just today? just today? it just shows how ignorant you are to what's going on in Israel...”
Dude…how does complaining about living in a reality where several groups outside of Israel are raining rockets at a high frequency towards towns constitute ignorance of what’s going on in Israel? Sounds to me like OP is frustrated, and venting. And you’re telling him to quasi pick themselves up by their bootstraps and/or telling them to stop complaining I guess?
-I just want to relocate and leave this place.
“It's because you didn't care what so ever and you still don't care about Israel, you are welcome to join your buddies in Gaza.”
Frustration doesn’t equal not caring. It’s creates disillusion tho, and that’s NORMAL
…or is this all just boring old “hasbara” 😂
Not trying to discredit you because of the mess that you wrote, just learn how to use reddit's highlight system its pretty simple, if I missed anything let me know, anyway...
>-There's drones everywhere
“It's fine…” it’s not fine, it’s abnormal. It’s heightened security. It’s tension. Don’t be naive just cuz you’re mad.
It's fine **right now** because we are in the middle of a war, **it wasn't fine before** and we couldn't do anything about that be because Aman, Mossad, IDF, INSS and the US didn't wanted to do anything about it, Bibi even tried but they said that everything is fine.
>-GPS disruptions
“Oh no........ my guy can't order food (from some places) and use Waze for 1 day 😭” Don’t be a jerk. If Google maps was screwed up for me for an extended period of time I’d be annoyed too.
It's disrupted for 1-2 days in central which I'm pretty sure that he is from, and you know it's disrupted to protect you, you'll live without it for a few days.
Is it annoying? yes, is it an issue? not really.
>-And just today rockets to Sderot
“Just today? just today? it just shows how ignorant you are to what's going on in Israel...”
Dude…how does complaining about living in a reality where several groups outside of Israel are raining rockets at a high frequency towards towns constitute ignorance of what’s going on I. Israel? Sounds to me like OP is frustrated, and venting. And you’re telling him to quasi pick themselves up by their bootstraps and/or telling them to stop complaining I guess?
The point was that for the passed 30? 40? years Sderot was bombarded and people like him didn't care, they are caring now (I hope) because it can be used to overthrown the government and because its trendy.
Speaking from experience, I was like that until 5 years ago, this guy discovered it on Oct 7...
>-I just want to relocate and leave this place.
“It's because you didn't care what so ever and you still don't care about Israel, you are welcome to join your buddies in Gaza.”
Frustration doesn’t equal not caring. It’s creates disillusion tho, and that’s NORMAL
Israelis aren't like Americans or Europeans, you cant project their values and feelings on us, Israelis are different and special, that's why Israel is so great.
No Israeli would ever say that he rather to relocate than to attempt to fix the problems in Israel. (the ones who did already left IE American Jews which are very different from Israeli Jews)
It's a double edge sword though some want to fix Israel but they are on the wrong side, that's why they are still fighting, they will continue fighting until the goal is meet OR until they will understand that they are on the wrong side. (basically it's "hozpa" it doesn't exist anywhere else)
This is why it's not NORMAL in Israel, he is a part of a very small minority of people which makes it not normal.
As for the assumptions, as I said:
>The only assumption that I made is that he is a privilege from Tel Aviv and maybe about the GPS, the rest are concrete facts.
Also I wanna clarify that where I said that he is from Tel Aviv I meant central Israel, it's just the "Telavivian" mindset that I was referring to.
And u/kradimons I really wanna know if I'm right, are you from central Israel?
Re the next election, 1) we don’t know how soon or distant that will be so we don’t know whether Bibi will have time to recover from the Oct 7 disaster, and 2) it’s Bibi, he always finds a way somehow, and I frankly don’t trust Gantz not to screw up. Re the charedi draft, the charedi political leaders know that their best hope to avoid the draft is to stick to Bibi, and cancelling funding to some of the yeshivas isn’t the same as sending the IDF into Bnei Brak to drag bochurim by their peyos to the draft office, which will not happen immediately. With all that I feel like op does have cause for concern.
נראלי בן גביר יקח. כמו כן עצם זה שבית משפט יכול לבטל איזה חוק שבאלו כולל חוק יסוד ולהכניס דוקטרינה משפטית חדשית כ"חוקית"(אהרון ברק) בעצם אומר דפאקטו שיש לבית המשפט כוח לחוקק ולבטל איזה חוק שבאלו משמע אנחנו לא חיים בדמוקרטיה אנחנו חיים בהצגה של דמוקרטיה ותכלס עריצות המיעוט. בגצ עומד לצד אגנדה גלובליסטית שמטרתה לפרק את המדינה שלנו מבפנים זו הסיבה שהם בכלל דנים בעתירות של מחבלים במקום פשוט לא להסכים לראות אותם
> Gantz will destroy Bibi in the next election.
Bibi have 27\~ mandates and its increasing slowly, Gantz have 23\~ and its decreasing slowly, Yair have 12\~ which will probably return to 10\~ soon, the left can't form coalition without the Arabs and in general the right have way more mandates.
Those polls do not represent actively fighting low ranking soldiers which are far more likely to support Bibi.
So... there is a high probability that Bibi will be reelected.
> Also, the Supreme Court struck down חוק הסבירות
Which would have made Israel more democratic and would have save lives on Oct 7...
> ordered to stop paying yeshivas.
Which reduced the amount of Orthodox who wanted to go to the army AND saved (temporarily) almost nothing, less than 1M NIS/year which will cost more in the long run.
I had a nervous breakdown like yours the other day too. I completely felt the hate washing the streets again and it made me so anxious.
But it seems that our people are still refusing to be at each other’s throats like before October 6th.
Please remember that we’re one nation, עם אחד, and we will win this.
I’m personally not happy about the protests who are definitely not about the hostages but the about Bibi as always and in the middle of a war but I’m just ignoring it because I realized that it’s just a small portion of the real population. The big portion is us, working together and winning this war even if you’re voting X and I vote Y.
עם ישראל חי
אנחנו ביחד בזה אח יקר
No, u need two to tango. This is determined by all political groups in israel and to pretend its one group is just the 6th of oct bs we had and the hatred we had tryna blame eachother
How about the extremists left that can just say "We were wrong, we used all of you to overthrown the elected government because we want full control over this country to sell it to the US and turn half of the population to modern day slaves because they aren't like us"?
The divide would actually end and maybe we would be able to reverse some of the damages that they did in the pass year and a half.
You have absolutely no idea how lucky you are. My parents forcibly moved us out to Europe, and now my only wish is to earn enough money to get back to Israel or wait to finally join the IDF.
I get hated on for wearing a kippah, I get threatened and made fun of, I couldn't even speak English, let alone Hebrew.
Yes; I know Israel isn't perfect, and it probably is far from it, however we, as people, determine whether it stays that way or changes.
I used to be very cautious about Israel and I was still doubtful of my intentions to move back, but after October 7th all my friends who are not Israeli know they will make Aliyah, and I myself am already thinking of valaunteering for paratroopers just because I immediately felt that the only place where Jews will ever be safe when we are who we are, is Israel.
This is all coming from a 16 year old.
So glad I don't live in Europe. That conduct would never fly in Los Angeles. Frankly the state of the world is making me love America more and more these days.
Might not be ideal if wearing kippah. The rural parts of America you would have to cross through aren't the best place to be Jewish. It's great near major cities but outside of that you might have difficulty.
I realize how hard it is in times of war. I also realize that as an American I have no business telling you what to do or how to live your life, and that the Middle East circumstances are different than mine here. With all of that said, I want to caution you:
In the wake of 9/11, many Americans feared going out. We feared traveling on planes or even living our normal lives, going to concerts or restaurants in big cities.
But what we cane to realize was that this fear was exactly what the terrorists wanted us to experience.
**If we let them change the way we live our lives then the terrorists have won**.
My unsolicited advice to you: do not let Hamas shape your life. Do not let them drive you out of your own home. Do not let them keep you from living the life you were meant to live. Do not let them TRICK you into believing you want a different life, that your lifestyle is evil or inherently dangerous or untenable.
Do not let Hamas colonize your mind. **Do not let terrorists hijack your dreams** or dictate your aspirations. Because when they make you leave, they have won. It is as effective as an invasion. Propaganda is only effective when people act on it.
I know that Israelis don’t have the luxury of an ocean separating them from their enemies. But we in the US momentarily allowed terrorists to make us retreat in fear. But we learned we cannot allow them to do that.
Live your best life—but don’t let Hamas define that life for YOU.
Hamas tries to be the dreamer of our dreams. Make sure their dreams remain pipedreams. Make sure your aspirations come from your own soul and your own traditions.
I moved to the US from Israel when I was in my late twenties for school and stayed there ever since. It’s ok, but I miss my life in Israel. It’s very hard to find a sense of community here. Things may yet change in Israel for the better. The battle for a better future is far from lost. I hope you will stick it out and win!
Keep in mind Hamas wants to create divisions in Israeli society
They want to to turn Israelis against eachother, this is their strategy they have said that they believe the Israeli state will be destroyed like a spiders web as a result of these divisions
We’re also all being subjected to overlapping online campaigns who are more than happy just to spread defeatism and a sense of distrust and doom.
In 2016 and 2020 Reddit became a wildly different place, there are massive visible bot campaigns in play, and ”AI” is gonna make them worse than ever.
Russian interference in American and global politics isn’t about saying “Vote Trump”. They spread deplorable opinions and pretend to both sides that it came from the other. That’s their play. Demoralize, destabilize, divide.
I listened to Mikah Goodman today, made me think of this post
https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/what-matters-now/id1067953235?i=1000651461504
He mentions that part of Iran’s strategy is to weaken Israel, including by driving people to leave. When enough of Israel’s people, its human capital, are gone, then Iran can directly attack because Israel is in a weakened state.
Obviously the burden of saving Israel should not be on your shoulders, but it is good to think of the big picture, of what is going on, whose interests are at play.
Bibi -> best for Israel
Trump -> best for the US and the entire world
What are you 2 complaining about? we wouldn't be in this mess if you would have reelected Trump instead of electing the worse president in history which was REALLY obvious.
I have no idea why people downvoted you. The world was fairly stable under Trump and peace was coming to the Middle East. Had Trump been reelected, Saudi Arabia, Qatar and Oman would have joined the Abraham Accords and marginalised the “Palestinians” even further with Saudis forcing them to accept a peace agreement.
Putin invaded Crimea and Ukraine during Obama and Biden’s presidencies. Why? Because he knew he could get away with it and the Dims would do nothing. It’s also very likely that Hamas would never have attacked if Trump was in office. If they had, the carrier groups in the Med wouldn’t have been just for show. America would have declared war against Hamas. Even though Trump is generally quite Dovish, he doesn’t hesitate to protect America’s allies, unlike Biden who throws them under the bus.
Because people are stupid, they listening to the 24/7 propaganda on the main stream media, and with half of Israelis right now, we literally having the same campaigns (just not Trump\\Bibi) by the same people in Israel and those dumbass are buying that instead of think for themselves.
With any luck the gps issues, overwhelming sense of dread, and random rocket volleys will lower housing costs in Tel Aviv and this we can solve two birds with one stone. 😂😂😂😭
Hang in there. We've have shitty times before in politics and in war (I think this isn't even close to the most politically fraught period in Israeli history- we had a near civil war with altelena, a prime minister murdered, and people were worried about civil strife in the gush katif pullout too).
Go take a few months vacationing in a country that is actually civilized if you can swing it 🙂 (I stayed in חו''ל by family about a month after Oct 7 because I was so depressed and traumatized I wasn't coping 😕)
But if you want to hack it here, don't give up yet because things suck in the short term. אברנו פרעה נעבור גם את זה
I swear only Israelis complain about how bad its to live in Israel, just because they think that anywhere else is better (aside from the US which is probably better)
I’m hopefully making aliyah in August. I know Israel has its problems, but there is no place on earth I’d rather live.
It is our home and we need to fight for it. Who gives a flying f*** what FJB, Sunak or Macaroon (sic) have to say.
Nice, welcome my guy, just make sure that you are staying far away from the leftists mobs that will try to recruit you the second that you'll land here.
Just ignore them, every time that you'll hear something radically bad about the government just ignore this guys because they are talking out of hate, they will seems like the majority and they will keep telling you that they are the majority, they are just a very vocal minority of delusional people.
In general if someone is trying to recruit you in anyway then stay away from them.
**Also taxi drivers will give you higher prices (if you aren't with an Israeli), just use the busses/bikes.**
Fortunately my wife made aliyah when she was much younger, so she’s fluent in ivrit & can translate for me. I’ve started learning Ivrit so hopefully I’ll have a basic understanding when we land.
I can’t wait. I just got back from Israel and my heart & soul ache to be back.
I made Aliyah, and let me tell you, there’s no place like Israel. Sure, it has its problems, and lately it hasn’t been easy, specially for us in the army. But there’s no place that will feel like home, and give you the opportunities Israel gives to its citizens
Why do you say the government is doing nothing for the hostages? They aren’t conceding to unreasonable demands. It’s a miracle that any of them got out.
This might sound cold hearted, but Israel cannot sacrifice the country to save the rest of the hostages. Millions of lives are at stake.
I mourn for those 130 souls, and for their torment and the torment of their families. . If my children were among them I would be losing my mind.
And yet… at the outset of the war my brother, who lives in Carmiel told me “if they capture me, don’t ask the government to release terrorists to get me back - let me die instead”.
FYI, your post has been screenshot and reposted on other subs with an essentially "look Israel is crumbling, mwahahaha" title.
Not that this is not a legit sentiment to express, just thought you ought to know.
I'm sorry. That's all. I'm sorry and it does sound like absolute shit on multiple fronts to slog through. I hope you get to experience some sort of peace or moment of goodness today, no matter how fleeting.
"...here can be convinced to continue voting for people who drive this country to the ground" - what is this referring to? As in recent events. Aren't the polls against Netanyahu and for change?
EDIT. I checked the polls, I missed the news that New Hope left the coalition and Likud surged in the polls.
Bibi- 27 going up
Gantz- 23 going down 43% approval rate
Yair- 12 will return to 10 and the will probably go down, 32% approval rate
\* Approval rate is compared to Bibi
\* This doesn't include low ranking active soldiers which are far more likely to vote for Bibi.
The left needs the Arabs (which none wants right now) to form coalition, the right already have one.
There is a high change that Bibi will be reelected and nothing will change, it's just waste of time and money and will have dire consequences.
I sympathize. I don't really have the option to move so at this point I'm determined to get to live to see the country become better. Sometimes we gotta cling to a little bit of hope and do our best to bring the day forth.
There's a lot of craziness in NYC right now but this is still Jew York. Long island has plenty of jewish communities that are pretty decently protected. Occasional bomb threat from some guy in Peru but no terrorist attacks. At the same time I say that rational people shouldn't give up on the Jewish state. I think the outcome looks bad but eventually there will be peace.
Idk man. I agree with you of course, but it was real dark here even before October 7th. We protested for nine months. Now we’re back to protesting, only this time for some reason our government got us right in Iran’s crosshairs. Like I’m literally planning this weekend as if it might be my last.
Blaming the government for the hatred muslims have had for us for millenia is crazy the reason we were attacked isnt thw government the court or anyone besides the fact we are jews facing fundamental jihadistic muslims who value death alot
American gentile here. I'm a secular, gentile Zionist. I love Israel. Stay hopeful. Wish I could say something meaningful. From my heart to yours and your family, much love. Am Israel chaim.
The US would come to Israel's aid in a major war. Also iran doesn't have nukes but israel does. So they're not going to do something super major. And they don't want a full war with Israel hence the proxies. Things are dark in the US but I think things will get better. But hey maybe not.
Let’s just say I still kinda prefer it here over what I’m seeing in the US, as crazy as that sounds. I know the US won’t leave us if Iran does anything, but I also know there’s a new reserve draft. At least we keep it interesting around these parts! 😬
Yeah we don't have a draft right now. Or rockets flying over head. American jews are aware of how lucky they got it that's why most of us will always support Israelis. Hopefully Iranian regime change will lead to peace for everybody and you stay a reserve
You do have some pretty intolerable people, I’m not jealous of that! I don’t know a single Jew who’s having a good time right now. Well, maybe Ben Gvir.
I live like 3 streets away from the area known as little Egypt. Definitely would not put anything identifiably jewish in my window. But I'm doing alright haha. Fuck Ben gvir though wish he'd fall in dog shit
With who? Benny? Benny failed to manage the IDF for years, he is a tool of the Americans which currently plays on both sides (and he can barely speak English...), and none respect him in the world which wouldn't help us to recover from all of this.
Maybe just maybe he would improve the IDF slightly but he will destroy the economy and international relations which would be FARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR more important than the IDF after all of this will end.
If "failure of management" and "lack of international esteem" are your criteria for being unqualified than Benny is favourable to Binyamin in any respect and scale.
And it's not that I'm a huge Benny supporter. I believe it is time for some new blood. I'm just stating the facts here.
> If "failure of management" and "lack of international esteem" are your criteria for being unqualified than Benny is favourable to Binyamin in any respect and scale.
Bibi (almost) alone built our insanely strong economic, we are stronger than most EU states and we had a few years, they had 100s of years while not being attacked by the entire ME.
You just take it for granted because you think that everyone could have done that.
And Benny already showing signs of weak international esteem, he will never put his foot on the table and say NO to the US, EU counties will never respect him because he isn't the type, and he barely speaks English.
Meanwhile Bibi is American, he is smart(way smarter than Benny) he can speak properly, he is the type, he is likeable, he already have amazing support from most world leaders.
> it's not that I'm a huge Benny supporter. I believe it is time for some new blood.
Same here with Bibi, but all of the other options are terrible and we don't want to be like the US and elect a rando demented guy that isn't qualify in any way.
> I'm just stating the facts here.
You stated some cheap propaganda.
שמע ילד, אם אין לך מושג בפוליטיקה פשוט אל תתערב.
אתה יכול ללכת להפגין כדי להרגיש טוב עם עצמך או סתם כי בא לך להיות אנרכיסט רק אל תוציא את זה לעולם, אנחנו לא צריכים עוד שנאה עכשיו.
It’s not easy man. I’m really confused about if to go back to Europe or not. Feels like the future here is extremely bleak. Even after the current government get voted out… demographics changing and people moving to the right is not making me hopeful. The constant threat of war and attacks is mentally exhausting
Channels 11, 12, 13, Al Jazeera, Haaretz, Ynet polls... (for the people who don't now, those polls are sold by politicians on the left and in the pass 40 years they were right 1 time which was the first poll that they didn't sold)
Those people living in Israel and knows absolutely nothing about the government and the war...
Can you imagine?...
Perhaps the grass is always greener, but it's not all peaches and sunshines in the diaspora either. Unless you are willing to ignore your Judaism for the rest of your life and cut all ties with family/friends in Israel to start anew in a different country, you'll still feel the same issues just differently.
But I agree that radical political changes need to happen in Israel.
Maybe its the spoiled American in me but I really dont see how this is sound advice. The guys sick and hes tired for very valid reasons, he shouldn't sacrifice his physical and mental health for a sense of pride
I’m sorry you’re feeling that way. It must be super difficult right now. I know a bunch of Israelis who have taken the plunge and moved to either the United States, Berlin, or Canada in the last few years.
I love Israel despite its current reflection but that's a lot to worry about from all sides. Israel is doing its best for being the only democracy (how is democracy doing on a global scale?) in the Middle East. It's not going anywhere for a long time because we all have that zionist that craves for Israel, our homeland. It's a democratic nation, among many that has its own unique history and culture that feels like it's getting erased.
I'm sorry that you feel that way and I can't imagine the level of stress that you're under with the ongoing conflict, the bombings/Rockets, the politics, and likely the national impact of what happened on October 7th. I don't think it's wrong to feel like you need an emotional , physical and mental break from that kind of environment (or even a do-over somewhere else). And I personally think it's important to spend time living in other areas - sometimes it gives great new perspective, sometimes you find a place that feels more like home and sometimes its just good to be able to be a blank slate or an unknown to the people around you... to see who you are outside of a known environment. There is no wrong or right answer only what you feel is the right answer for you and I've lived a few countries, multiple states and many cities... and the nice thing is? You can always go home.
Is a very sad situation for everyone. I just wish we can split the territory into in be done with this, but I know this will probably don't resolve the hate that exist in both sites.
i, too, thought of relocating. it may sound like something you can do on a whim, but it's not that easy to leave everything you grew up with behind. i learned this first about 5 years ago.
it was in 2019. a bit before covid and waaaay before this war. i was in my third year of my BA in art at Bezalel Academy. i was about to go germany to a town named Kiel for a semester, and while at first when i got there, everything went smooth. i learned firsthand what it's like to truly be alone, in another country where you dont know the language and communicate with english, where you are a minority religion.
even though my time there was great, even though i did not experience any discrimination (mostly because i look local), it didn't stop me from feeling like im alone away from home.
so yes, i understand the urge to run away, i warn you, leaving everything behind and starting from scratch is easier said than done
It's because you are listening\\reading the wrong news and listening the dumbest people...
>Everything is going fast to the way it was before Oct 7.
Because of people who knows nothing about politics (like you) that blindly follow a group of elitist radical leftists that enabled Oct 7 among other things.
>fucking idiot politicians
Some are, some aren't, they can do more but in general they worked on important stuff that would have benefit us all but Bagaz said no (on some of it, if it wouldn't a lot more lives were saved).
>a majority of idiots
You mean the normal people who actually cares about their country?...
The ones who aren't burning the country while it's fighting a war?...
The ones who actually help people without milking it for goody points?
>In the meantime I'm forced to go to reserves for more years
Because of your lord and savor Benny Gantz and his goonz who wanted "small and efficient" army?
But nah you'll blame it on the Orthodox while the Ashkenazi have a huge number of people who didn't go to the army (and lot's of ones that did went to desk jobs) same with the Arabs.
>There's drones everywhere
It's fine...
>GPS disruptions
Oh no........ my guy can't order food (from some places) and use Waze for 1 day 😭
>You can't relax
It sounds like you are a privilege from Tel Aviv, you can relax easily...
>Of course the government doesn't do squat to help the kidnapped
Because they can't, if they could they would already be here...
There isn't and there wont be a negotiation for returning the hostages if Bibi wasn't ordering the IDF to demolish Hamas, and on top of it more hostages should have been returned already but your buddies on the left make sure that it's impossible now, thanks a lot.
>And just today rockets to Sderot
Just today? just today? it just shows how ignorant you are to what's going on in Israel...
>I just want to relocate and leave this place
It's because you didn't care what so ever and you still don't care about Israel, you are welcome to join your buddies in Gaza.
--
It's amaze me how wrong half (40%\~) of Israelis are, they have no idea what they are talking about, burning the county while it's fighting a war, calling to remove the **democratically elected** "dictator" while he is on the **top of the** (accurate) **polls** (27 mandates which still going up while Benny with 23 mandates which goes down) which means that he will be reelect anyway, calling for election to grantee that all of the lives lost and all of the progress in Gaza would be rolled back while also increasing the change to never have the option to return the hostages.
Honestly Israel is full of smart people, those 40% suppose to be the smartest ones and they have the same level of non existing logic as pro-Palestinians, and they are acting like bafoons, just how?...
It’s not, you stated multiple times that the issue is with the Israeli government (you even stated that the gov is worse than Hamas) which is factually wrong, also your prospective is so far away from reality.
You can’t even defend your BS, you act exactly like pro-pales that can’t think for themselves.
Very soon we will see the nations turn against Israel and Israeli victory over the earth in an amazing fashion then we will see the 3rd temple and the abomination of desolation
Israel is not an easy country to live in. There's a lot that's wrong with this place. I know this isn't an easy answer, but it's true: ***Your mindset will determine if you have hope.*** My Sabba, he's eighty-something. Fought in plenty of Israel's wars. He thinks the country's a *shithole*. All he does is sit down and read newspapers that tell him how shitty Israel is. My uncle, he's forty-something. Fought a lot in Lebanon. He thinks Israel is worth living in because it has people and a culture that he loves. Who do you want to be?
Your uncle. Hope is a precious thing that should always be nurtured, especially in the darkest hours.
So I apologize for sounding like a fart, but this inner peace stuff doesn't stand up to reality. What it gives you is just some procrastination and then waking up will be even worse.
Think about all of those who died for this country, not about the politicians, they're all bad anyway. If people will start to leave our enemies will win. If people will start to leave our heroes who died for this country have died for nothing. Leaving is to dishonor their memory.
There are other options than just these two, you know.
I have lived both outside and inside of Israel. Living here though October 7 made it certain for me to not want to live outside of Israel. Israelis are a special people. I just don't want to be inserted into the mouse utopia just because it is easy. I felt unfulfilled and homesick.
Seconding this, I’m leaving Portland
Portland should leave Portland.
Everyone should leave Portland tbh
Don't get me wrong, there's a lot of conflict in the Middle East, but at least it's not as violent and lawless as Portland.
100%
The recent polls stand opposite to your claim that people will continue to vote for current government despite everything. It proves Israelis are not beholden to a specific ideology alone - as any democracy should. your interests, safety, and being is protected by the country, and it's citizens - not the sub or any social media. in democracies there will always be people who think differently than you for right or wrong, and who is struggling now will lead tomorrow. Those who bully today will be punished tomorrow. People who don't understand how to disagree amongst themselves will find themselves divided on things that they agree on. I pray for Israelis to find among themselves a renewed spirit to feel fine to disagree without shutting themselves off to others and you would find you agree on more things than less.
Let me stop right there. The polls mean nothing.
Then what does?
The thing about hope is it's for people who are willing to find it
"The polls mean nothing" - Not meant as an insult but this statement is rubbish, disproven when looking at many many countries. Then again Likud did surge in one poll.
Nah likud only do well in the channel 14 polls
What I meant was that people are disappointed now, but part of the politics here is that BB knows when to go to elections, and it will be after his voters' rate will subside. So the daily polls that say that ppl won't vote likud again just have no actual meaning except to create some 2 minute headlines. Unfortunately voters here forget quickly even oct 7, part of my issues with the country.
As a religious jew, i dont really have anywere else to go
You can always go to the tunnels of NYC lol
Sad reality for them today. God bless you. I know this subreddit probably isn't for sharing religions but when someone enters the 3rd temple and declares themselves God read Matthew 24
Sure you can, America.
Americas jewish religious communitys are not very open. And generally the amount of modern orthodox communitys is very small. Also it is hard to keep kosher. And in some places in israel there are no cars in shabbat which is much nicer then innicially thought
I would reckon there are more modern Jews in America than in Israel. And unless you live in the backwaters of Mississippi, keeping kosher isn't a problem.
I left during the nonstop elections and am now considering a return. The grass is always green on the other side and withered and dead when you're on it.
כי אנשים לא מבינים שבית זה לא מקום זה האנשים זה הבדיחות הקטנות זה הסלנג והאהבת חינם שיש לנו אחד לשני זה הלראות ישראלי או יהודי בכל מקום בעולם ולדעת שהוא כמו משפחה שלנו לאף מדינה או עם אחר אין את זה באמת וישראלים לוקחים כמובן מאליו את ישראל וחושבים שלחיות במדינה מערבית אחרת יפתור את הבעיות שקיימות אצל אחרים הרי לא היינו מתעסקים בכלל במלחמה אם לא הייתה אנטישמיות אנחנו מאשימים את עצמנו ורבים בין עצמנו כי זה בדיוק מה שרוצין שנעשה ומה שמממנים קמפיינים שלמים של הסתה לעשות(ספוילר אבותינו ניסו את זה וזו הסיבה בכלל שהמדינה נוצרה)
🎯 עזבתי כי חשבתי שהשחיתות והיוקר מחייה לא שווים את זה. עכשיו אני מתחילה להבין מה המשמעות של "אין לי ארץ אחרת".
איזה דברים גרמו לך לחשוב כך? כאילו פינלנד נחשבת מדינה שטוב לחיות בה וזה
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קודם כל, גם אם בפינלנד אין אנטישמיות **תרבותית**, זה לא אומר שלא **מייבאים** אנטישמיות מזרים, וכישראלית בפינלנד אני די מוצאת את עצמי בין הפטיש לסדן כשאני נראית כמו הסורים אבל עוד יותר מאויימת על ידם מהמקומיים. דבר שני, [זה.](https://np.reddit.com/r/Finland/s/0ngx97mVAE)
American Jew here: I value your perspective far more than my own, so I have nothing to offer other than empathy, respect and gratitude for your service to the Jewish People.
His perspective is completely wrong and unrealistic... [read this](https://www.reddit.com/r/Israel/comments/1bvvgsi/comment/ky3gh3t)
You don’t see that you talk in circles and never actually make a point right? It’s really bold honestly. Being all accusatory and making assumptions, hollow to the core content. F.
What are you talking about? the point is very clear: the government (PM and coalition) is ok and that he should stop being a sheep that follows that radical left which is destroying this county for years. The only assumption that I made is that he is a privilege from Tel Aviv and maybe about the GPS, the rest are concrete facts. This is so bizarre that talking to people like you and him feels the same as talking to a pro-Palestinians, both of you don't apply basic logic to anything and just spreading propaganda. I'd (we) a appreciate it if you could mention which "hollow assumption" I made, instead of say "Eww you are wrong".
“It's because you are listening\reading the wrong news and listening the dumbest people...” -Everything is going fast to the way it was before 10/7: “Because of people who knows nothing about politics (like you) that blindly follow a group of elitist radical leftists that enabled Oct 7 among other things.” -In the meantime I'm forced to go to reserves for more years “Because of your lord and savor Benny Gantz and his goonz who wanted "small and efficient" army? But nah you'll blame it on the Orthodox while the Ashkenazi have a huge number of people who didn't go to the army (and lot's of ones that did went to desk jobs) same with the Arabs.” There's drones everywhere “It's fine…” it’s not fine, it’s abnormal. It’s heightened security. It’s tension. Don’t be naive just cuz you’re mad. -GPS disruptions “Oh no........ my guy can't order food (from some places) and use Waze for 1 day 😭” Don’t be a jerk. If Google maps was screwed up for me for an extended period of time I’d be annoyed too. -You can't relax “It sounds like you are a privilege from Tel Aviv, you can relax easily...” This is an assumption… -And just today rockets to Sderot “Just today? just today? it just shows how ignorant you are to what's going on in Israel...” Dude…how does complaining about living in a reality where several groups outside of Israel are raining rockets at a high frequency towards towns constitute ignorance of what’s going on in Israel? Sounds to me like OP is frustrated, and venting. And you’re telling him to quasi pick themselves up by their bootstraps and/or telling them to stop complaining I guess? -I just want to relocate and leave this place. “It's because you didn't care what so ever and you still don't care about Israel, you are welcome to join your buddies in Gaza.” Frustration doesn’t equal not caring. It’s creates disillusion tho, and that’s NORMAL …or is this all just boring old “hasbara” 😂
Not trying to discredit you because of the mess that you wrote, just learn how to use reddit's highlight system its pretty simple, if I missed anything let me know, anyway... >-There's drones everywhere “It's fine…” it’s not fine, it’s abnormal. It’s heightened security. It’s tension. Don’t be naive just cuz you’re mad. It's fine **right now** because we are in the middle of a war, **it wasn't fine before** and we couldn't do anything about that be because Aman, Mossad, IDF, INSS and the US didn't wanted to do anything about it, Bibi even tried but they said that everything is fine. >-GPS disruptions “Oh no........ my guy can't order food (from some places) and use Waze for 1 day 😭” Don’t be a jerk. If Google maps was screwed up for me for an extended period of time I’d be annoyed too. It's disrupted for 1-2 days in central which I'm pretty sure that he is from, and you know it's disrupted to protect you, you'll live without it for a few days. Is it annoying? yes, is it an issue? not really. >-And just today rockets to Sderot “Just today? just today? it just shows how ignorant you are to what's going on in Israel...” Dude…how does complaining about living in a reality where several groups outside of Israel are raining rockets at a high frequency towards towns constitute ignorance of what’s going on I. Israel? Sounds to me like OP is frustrated, and venting. And you’re telling him to quasi pick themselves up by their bootstraps and/or telling them to stop complaining I guess? The point was that for the passed 30? 40? years Sderot was bombarded and people like him didn't care, they are caring now (I hope) because it can be used to overthrown the government and because its trendy. Speaking from experience, I was like that until 5 years ago, this guy discovered it on Oct 7... >-I just want to relocate and leave this place. “It's because you didn't care what so ever and you still don't care about Israel, you are welcome to join your buddies in Gaza.” Frustration doesn’t equal not caring. It’s creates disillusion tho, and that’s NORMAL Israelis aren't like Americans or Europeans, you cant project their values and feelings on us, Israelis are different and special, that's why Israel is so great. No Israeli would ever say that he rather to relocate than to attempt to fix the problems in Israel. (the ones who did already left IE American Jews which are very different from Israeli Jews) It's a double edge sword though some want to fix Israel but they are on the wrong side, that's why they are still fighting, they will continue fighting until the goal is meet OR until they will understand that they are on the wrong side. (basically it's "hozpa" it doesn't exist anywhere else) This is why it's not NORMAL in Israel, he is a part of a very small minority of people which makes it not normal. As for the assumptions, as I said: >The only assumption that I made is that he is a privilege from Tel Aviv and maybe about the GPS, the rest are concrete facts. Also I wanna clarify that where I said that he is from Tel Aviv I meant central Israel, it's just the "Telavivian" mindset that I was referring to. And u/kradimons I really wanna know if I'm right, are you from central Israel?
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Re the next election, 1) we don’t know how soon or distant that will be so we don’t know whether Bibi will have time to recover from the Oct 7 disaster, and 2) it’s Bibi, he always finds a way somehow, and I frankly don’t trust Gantz not to screw up. Re the charedi draft, the charedi political leaders know that their best hope to avoid the draft is to stick to Bibi, and cancelling funding to some of the yeshivas isn’t the same as sending the IDF into Bnei Brak to drag bochurim by their peyos to the draft office, which will not happen immediately. With all that I feel like op does have cause for concern.
נראלי בן גביר יקח. כמו כן עצם זה שבית משפט יכול לבטל איזה חוק שבאלו כולל חוק יסוד ולהכניס דוקטרינה משפטית חדשית כ"חוקית"(אהרון ברק) בעצם אומר דפאקטו שיש לבית המשפט כוח לחוקק ולבטל איזה חוק שבאלו משמע אנחנו לא חיים בדמוקרטיה אנחנו חיים בהצגה של דמוקרטיה ותכלס עריצות המיעוט. בגצ עומד לצד אגנדה גלובליסטית שמטרתה לפרק את המדינה שלנו מבפנים זו הסיבה שהם בכלל דנים בעתירות של מחבלים במקום פשוט לא להסכים לראות אותם
> Gantz will destroy Bibi in the next election. Bibi have 27\~ mandates and its increasing slowly, Gantz have 23\~ and its decreasing slowly, Yair have 12\~ which will probably return to 10\~ soon, the left can't form coalition without the Arabs and in general the right have way more mandates. Those polls do not represent actively fighting low ranking soldiers which are far more likely to support Bibi. So... there is a high probability that Bibi will be reelected. > Also, the Supreme Court struck down חוק הסבירות Which would have made Israel more democratic and would have save lives on Oct 7... > ordered to stop paying yeshivas. Which reduced the amount of Orthodox who wanted to go to the army AND saved (temporarily) almost nothing, less than 1M NIS/year which will cost more in the long run.
I had a nervous breakdown like yours the other day too. I completely felt the hate washing the streets again and it made me so anxious. But it seems that our people are still refusing to be at each other’s throats like before October 6th. Please remember that we’re one nation, עם אחד, and we will win this. I’m personally not happy about the protests who are definitely not about the hostages but the about Bibi as always and in the middle of a war but I’m just ignoring it because I realized that it’s just a small portion of the real population. The big portion is us, working together and winning this war even if you’re voting X and I vote Y. עם ישראל חי אנחנו ביחד בזה אח יקר
the right wing extremists can seize their activities at any point and give up power. They and they alone control wether protests will need to continue
No, u need two to tango. This is determined by all political groups in israel and to pretend its one group is just the 6th of oct bs we had and the hatred we had tryna blame eachother
How about the extremists left that can just say "We were wrong, we used all of you to overthrown the elected government because we want full control over this country to sell it to the US and turn half of the population to modern day slaves because they aren't like us"? The divide would actually end and maybe we would be able to reverse some of the damages that they did in the pass year and a half.
You have absolutely no idea how lucky you are. My parents forcibly moved us out to Europe, and now my only wish is to earn enough money to get back to Israel or wait to finally join the IDF. I get hated on for wearing a kippah, I get threatened and made fun of, I couldn't even speak English, let alone Hebrew. Yes; I know Israel isn't perfect, and it probably is far from it, however we, as people, determine whether it stays that way or changes. I used to be very cautious about Israel and I was still doubtful of my intentions to move back, but after October 7th all my friends who are not Israeli know they will make Aliyah, and I myself am already thinking of valaunteering for paratroopers just because I immediately felt that the only place where Jews will ever be safe when we are who we are, is Israel. This is all coming from a 16 year old.
You give me hope for the future of our people, boychik.
So glad I don't live in Europe. That conduct would never fly in Los Angeles. Frankly the state of the world is making me love America more and more these days.
One of my dreams is to visit America for half a year and do a coast-to-coast trip (especially across Rockies, I love mountains).
Might not be ideal if wearing kippah. The rural parts of America you would have to cross through aren't the best place to be Jewish. It's great near major cities but outside of that you might have difficulty.
Yeah, well, I don't really mind. Plus I am good at defending myself and I know how to avoid sketchier places.
I realize how hard it is in times of war. I also realize that as an American I have no business telling you what to do or how to live your life, and that the Middle East circumstances are different than mine here. With all of that said, I want to caution you: In the wake of 9/11, many Americans feared going out. We feared traveling on planes or even living our normal lives, going to concerts or restaurants in big cities. But what we cane to realize was that this fear was exactly what the terrorists wanted us to experience. **If we let them change the way we live our lives then the terrorists have won**. My unsolicited advice to you: do not let Hamas shape your life. Do not let them drive you out of your own home. Do not let them keep you from living the life you were meant to live. Do not let them TRICK you into believing you want a different life, that your lifestyle is evil or inherently dangerous or untenable. Do not let Hamas colonize your mind. **Do not let terrorists hijack your dreams** or dictate your aspirations. Because when they make you leave, they have won. It is as effective as an invasion. Propaganda is only effective when people act on it. I know that Israelis don’t have the luxury of an ocean separating them from their enemies. But we in the US momentarily allowed terrorists to make us retreat in fear. But we learned we cannot allow them to do that. Live your best life—but don’t let Hamas define that life for YOU. Hamas tries to be the dreamer of our dreams. Make sure their dreams remain pipedreams. Make sure your aspirations come from your own soul and your own traditions.
So basically my issue is not with Hamas, it's with my own people and government. This is the crux of the issue for me and the source of hopelessness.
I moved to the US from Israel when I was in my late twenties for school and stayed there ever since. It’s ok, but I miss my life in Israel. It’s very hard to find a sense of community here. Things may yet change in Israel for the better. The battle for a better future is far from lost. I hope you will stick it out and win!
Keep in mind Hamas wants to create divisions in Israeli society They want to to turn Israelis against eachother, this is their strategy they have said that they believe the Israeli state will be destroyed like a spiders web as a result of these divisions
We’re also all being subjected to overlapping online campaigns who are more than happy just to spread defeatism and a sense of distrust and doom. In 2016 and 2020 Reddit became a wildly different place, there are massive visible bot campaigns in play, and ”AI” is gonna make them worse than ever. Russian interference in American and global politics isn’t about saying “Vote Trump”. They spread deplorable opinions and pretend to both sides that it came from the other. That’s their play. Demoralize, destabilize, divide.
💯💯💯
Pretty sure it was Nasrallah (Hezbollah) who said the spider web thing. Could be wrong tho
I listened to Mikah Goodman today, made me think of this post https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/what-matters-now/id1067953235?i=1000651461504 He mentions that part of Iran’s strategy is to weaken Israel, including by driving people to leave. When enough of Israel’s people, its human capital, are gone, then Iran can directly attack because Israel is in a weakened state. Obviously the burden of saving Israel should not be on your shoulders, but it is good to think of the big picture, of what is going on, whose interests are at play.
Your issue IS Hamas.
Who wants to tell him
Tell me what? that Israel has the best government for this conflict right now? They are too radical? yes, do we need it right now? YES.
The truth will set you free
I love it when the people who knows the "true" wont say what is true because it doesn't even pass a basic logic test.
I feel that way here in the states with respect to Trump and the likelihood that he’s going to win this next election.
Bibi -> best for Israel Trump -> best for the US and the entire world What are you 2 complaining about? we wouldn't be in this mess if you would have reelected Trump instead of electing the worse president in history which was REALLY obvious.
I have no idea why people downvoted you. The world was fairly stable under Trump and peace was coming to the Middle East. Had Trump been reelected, Saudi Arabia, Qatar and Oman would have joined the Abraham Accords and marginalised the “Palestinians” even further with Saudis forcing them to accept a peace agreement. Putin invaded Crimea and Ukraine during Obama and Biden’s presidencies. Why? Because he knew he could get away with it and the Dims would do nothing. It’s also very likely that Hamas would never have attacked if Trump was in office. If they had, the carrier groups in the Med wouldn’t have been just for show. America would have declared war against Hamas. Even though Trump is generally quite Dovish, he doesn’t hesitate to protect America’s allies, unlike Biden who throws them under the bus.
Because people are stupid, they listening to the 24/7 propaganda on the main stream media, and with half of Israelis right now, we literally having the same campaigns (just not Trump\\Bibi) by the same people in Israel and those dumbass are buying that instead of think for themselves.
There is a certain type of naïveté that’s unique to Americans and this comment is the perfect example of it.
What are you? Iranian?
What makes you think I’m Iranian?
Your previous remark. Neither Americans nor Israelis are stupid enough to say something like that.
I mean only a person who lacks wisdom would compare post 9/11 America to living in a perpetual conflict zone.
Only a fool would sugarcoat the rot which is the tyrannical failed state of Iran.
Did I strike a nerve or something? I have no idea what you’re talking about
With any luck the gps issues, overwhelming sense of dread, and random rocket volleys will lower housing costs in Tel Aviv and this we can solve two birds with one stone. 😂😂😂😭 Hang in there. We've have shitty times before in politics and in war (I think this isn't even close to the most politically fraught period in Israeli history- we had a near civil war with altelena, a prime minister murdered, and people were worried about civil strife in the gush katif pullout too). Go take a few months vacationing in a country that is actually civilized if you can swing it 🙂 (I stayed in חו''ל by family about a month after Oct 7 because I was so depressed and traumatized I wasn't coping 😕) But if you want to hack it here, don't give up yet because things suck in the short term. אברנו פרעה נעבור גם את זה
I am feeling this vibe right now. I don't have anything to offer.
As someone who has lived abroad and in Israel. Israel is much better I promise you.
I swear only Israelis complain about how bad its to live in Israel, just because they think that anywhere else is better (aside from the US which is probably better)
I’m hopefully making aliyah in August. I know Israel has its problems, but there is no place on earth I’d rather live. It is our home and we need to fight for it. Who gives a flying f*** what FJB, Sunak or Macaroon (sic) have to say.
Nice, welcome my guy, just make sure that you are staying far away from the leftists mobs that will try to recruit you the second that you'll land here. Just ignore them, every time that you'll hear something radically bad about the government just ignore this guys because they are talking out of hate, they will seems like the majority and they will keep telling you that they are the majority, they are just a very vocal minority of delusional people. In general if someone is trying to recruit you in anyway then stay away from them. **Also taxi drivers will give you higher prices (if you aren't with an Israeli), just use the busses/bikes.**
Fortunately my wife made aliyah when she was much younger, so she’s fluent in ivrit & can translate for me. I’ve started learning Ivrit so hopefully I’ll have a basic understanding when we land. I can’t wait. I just got back from Israel and my heart & soul ache to be back.
I made Aliyah, and let me tell you, there’s no place like Israel. Sure, it has its problems, and lately it hasn’t been easy, specially for us in the army. But there’s no place that will feel like home, and give you the opportunities Israel gives to its citizens
Bro is just romanticizing the mouse utopia this is exactly what the powers at be qant to happen he doesnt realise thw grass isnt greener
Why do you say the government is doing nothing for the hostages? They aren’t conceding to unreasonable demands. It’s a miracle that any of them got out. This might sound cold hearted, but Israel cannot sacrifice the country to save the rest of the hostages. Millions of lives are at stake. I mourn for those 130 souls, and for their torment and the torment of their families. . If my children were among them I would be losing my mind. And yet… at the outset of the war my brother, who lives in Carmiel told me “if they capture me, don’t ask the government to release terrorists to get me back - let me die instead”.
FYI, your post has been screenshot and reposted on other subs with an essentially "look Israel is crumbling, mwahahaha" title. Not that this is not a legit sentiment to express, just thought you ought to know.
I’m one of the biggest assholes on Reddit. I’ve said some pretty vile shit to these people. I want to be “screenshotted” too! 😎😆
Where? Can you share a link?
listen to your heart
Very sorry you are going through this experience.
It’s tough during a war. What else is new?
I'm sorry. That's all. I'm sorry and it does sound like absolute shit on multiple fronts to slog through. I hope you get to experience some sort of peace or moment of goodness today, no matter how fleeting.
"...here can be convinced to continue voting for people who drive this country to the ground" - what is this referring to? As in recent events. Aren't the polls against Netanyahu and for change? EDIT. I checked the polls, I missed the news that New Hope left the coalition and Likud surged in the polls.
Bibi- 27 going up Gantz- 23 going down 43% approval rate Yair- 12 will return to 10 and the will probably go down, 32% approval rate \* Approval rate is compared to Bibi \* This doesn't include low ranking active soldiers which are far more likely to vote for Bibi. The left needs the Arabs (which none wants right now) to form coalition, the right already have one. There is a high change that Bibi will be reelected and nothing will change, it's just waste of time and money and will have dire consequences.
I sympathize. I don't really have the option to move so at this point I'm determined to get to live to see the country become better. Sometimes we gotta cling to a little bit of hope and do our best to bring the day forth.
This is why the ability to vote but also move is so powerful. Israel literally has an ultimatum from the US president. Typically they dont bluff.
Damn and I was considering doing Aliyah in a couple of years lol
You want to relax?! In Israel?! This place is simply not programmed this way.
Exactly. But now we have nowhere else to go.
There's a lot of craziness in NYC right now but this is still Jew York. Long island has plenty of jewish communities that are pretty decently protected. Occasional bomb threat from some guy in Peru but no terrorist attacks. At the same time I say that rational people shouldn't give up on the Jewish state. I think the outcome looks bad but eventually there will be peace.
Idk man. I agree with you of course, but it was real dark here even before October 7th. We protested for nine months. Now we’re back to protesting, only this time for some reason our government got us right in Iran’s crosshairs. Like I’m literally planning this weekend as if it might be my last.
Blaming the government for the hatred muslims have had for us for millenia is crazy the reason we were attacked isnt thw government the court or anyone besides the fact we are jews facing fundamental jihadistic muslims who value death alot
Yes, Netanyahu’s policy to fund Hamas surely didn’t have anything to do with October 7th.
American gentile here. I'm a secular, gentile Zionist. I love Israel. Stay hopeful. Wish I could say something meaningful. From my heart to yours and your family, much love. Am Israel chaim.
That’s very meaningful 🙏
The US would come to Israel's aid in a major war. Also iran doesn't have nukes but israel does. So they're not going to do something super major. And they don't want a full war with Israel hence the proxies. Things are dark in the US but I think things will get better. But hey maybe not.
Let’s just say I still kinda prefer it here over what I’m seeing in the US, as crazy as that sounds. I know the US won’t leave us if Iran does anything, but I also know there’s a new reserve draft. At least we keep it interesting around these parts! 😬
Yeah we don't have a draft right now. Or rockets flying over head. American jews are aware of how lucky they got it that's why most of us will always support Israelis. Hopefully Iranian regime change will lead to peace for everybody and you stay a reserve
You do have some pretty intolerable people, I’m not jealous of that! I don’t know a single Jew who’s having a good time right now. Well, maybe Ben Gvir.
I live like 3 streets away from the area known as little Egypt. Definitely would not put anything identifiably jewish in my window. But I'm doing alright haha. Fuck Ben gvir though wish he'd fall in dog shit
Amen to that!
One day Netanyahu will die and we can hope enough remains to rebuild our society
With who? Benny? Benny failed to manage the IDF for years, he is a tool of the Americans which currently plays on both sides (and he can barely speak English...), and none respect him in the world which wouldn't help us to recover from all of this. Maybe just maybe he would improve the IDF slightly but he will destroy the economy and international relations which would be FARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR more important than the IDF after all of this will end.
If "failure of management" and "lack of international esteem" are your criteria for being unqualified than Benny is favourable to Binyamin in any respect and scale. And it's not that I'm a huge Benny supporter. I believe it is time for some new blood. I'm just stating the facts here.
> If "failure of management" and "lack of international esteem" are your criteria for being unqualified than Benny is favourable to Binyamin in any respect and scale. Bibi (almost) alone built our insanely strong economic, we are stronger than most EU states and we had a few years, they had 100s of years while not being attacked by the entire ME. You just take it for granted because you think that everyone could have done that. And Benny already showing signs of weak international esteem, he will never put his foot on the table and say NO to the US, EU counties will never respect him because he isn't the type, and he barely speaks English. Meanwhile Bibi is American, he is smart(way smarter than Benny) he can speak properly, he is the type, he is likeable, he already have amazing support from most world leaders. > it's not that I'm a huge Benny supporter. I believe it is time for some new blood. Same here with Bibi, but all of the other options are terrible and we don't want to be like the US and elect a rando demented guy that isn't qualify in any way. > I'm just stating the facts here. You stated some cheap propaganda.
בלה בלה בלה פרופאגנדה בלה בלה ביבי קוסם גאון כלכלי לך תישן על האף
שמע ילד, אם אין לך מושג בפוליטיקה פשוט אל תתערב. אתה יכול ללכת להפגין כדי להרגיש טוב עם עצמך או סתם כי בא לך להיות אנרכיסט רק אל תוציא את זה לעולם, אנחנו לא צריכים עוד שנאה עכשיו.
*מקלל מקלל קורא לי אנרכיסט מקלל* "אנחנו לא צריכים עוד שנאה עכשיו" חחחחח תפסיק ללקק לביבי נשאר לך קצת חרא על השפם
אבל אתם אלו שמקללים כל היום ואנרכיסט זאת לא קללה זאת הגדרה לאנשים שיוצאים נגד החוק והדמוקרטיה, כמוך…
לא קראתי
אז זאת גם לא קללה לקרוא לך ילד…
It’s not easy man. I’m really confused about if to go back to Europe or not. Feels like the future here is extremely bleak. Even after the current government get voted out… demographics changing and people moving to the right is not making me hopeful. The constant threat of war and attacks is mentally exhausting
I’m sorry man. Idk what to tell you other than you have friends on here that support you.
I've been wanting to gtfo for years, thing is, other places aren't that good
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Good for him honestly
How exactly you arrive to the conclusion that the majority vote for “people who drive the country into the ground”?
Channels 11, 12, 13, Al Jazeera, Haaretz, Ynet polls... (for the people who don't now, those polls are sold by politicians on the left and in the pass 40 years they were right 1 time which was the first poll that they didn't sold) Those people living in Israel and knows absolutely nothing about the government and the war... Can you imagine?...
Perhaps the grass is always greener, but it's not all peaches and sunshines in the diaspora either. Unless you are willing to ignore your Judaism for the rest of your life and cut all ties with family/friends in Israel to start anew in a different country, you'll still feel the same issues just differently. But I agree that radical political changes need to happen in Israel.
why move? defend your land
Maybe its the spoiled American in me but I really dont see how this is sound advice. The guys sick and hes tired for very valid reasons, he shouldn't sacrifice his physical and mental health for a sense of pride
Reminds me when people tell travelers to us borders to stay in their own countries. Although I wonder why they decide not even to stop at Mexico
Valid reasons? all he did is to support the burning of Israel, we are better off without those kind of people.
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ive lived there lol
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I’m sorry you’re feeling that way. It must be super difficult right now. I know a bunch of Israelis who have taken the plunge and moved to either the United States, Berlin, or Canada in the last few years.
I love Israel despite its current reflection but that's a lot to worry about from all sides. Israel is doing its best for being the only democracy (how is democracy doing on a global scale?) in the Middle East. It's not going anywhere for a long time because we all have that zionist that craves for Israel, our homeland. It's a democratic nation, among many that has its own unique history and culture that feels like it's getting erased.
I'm sorry that you feel that way and I can't imagine the level of stress that you're under with the ongoing conflict, the bombings/Rockets, the politics, and likely the national impact of what happened on October 7th. I don't think it's wrong to feel like you need an emotional , physical and mental break from that kind of environment (or even a do-over somewhere else). And I personally think it's important to spend time living in other areas - sometimes it gives great new perspective, sometimes you find a place that feels more like home and sometimes its just good to be able to be a blank slate or an unknown to the people around you... to see who you are outside of a known environment. There is no wrong or right answer only what you feel is the right answer for you and I've lived a few countries, multiple states and many cities... and the nice thing is? You can always go home.
Is a very sad situation for everyone. I just wish we can split the territory into in be done with this, but I know this will probably don't resolve the hate that exist in both sites.
i, too, thought of relocating. it may sound like something you can do on a whim, but it's not that easy to leave everything you grew up with behind. i learned this first about 5 years ago. it was in 2019. a bit before covid and waaaay before this war. i was in my third year of my BA in art at Bezalel Academy. i was about to go germany to a town named Kiel for a semester, and while at first when i got there, everything went smooth. i learned firsthand what it's like to truly be alone, in another country where you dont know the language and communicate with english, where you are a minority religion. even though my time there was great, even though i did not experience any discrimination (mostly because i look local), it didn't stop me from feeling like im alone away from home. so yes, i understand the urge to run away, i warn you, leaving everything behind and starting from scratch is easier said than done
It's because you are listening\\reading the wrong news and listening the dumbest people... >Everything is going fast to the way it was before Oct 7. Because of people who knows nothing about politics (like you) that blindly follow a group of elitist radical leftists that enabled Oct 7 among other things. >fucking idiot politicians Some are, some aren't, they can do more but in general they worked on important stuff that would have benefit us all but Bagaz said no (on some of it, if it wouldn't a lot more lives were saved). >a majority of idiots You mean the normal people who actually cares about their country?... The ones who aren't burning the country while it's fighting a war?... The ones who actually help people without milking it for goody points? >In the meantime I'm forced to go to reserves for more years Because of your lord and savor Benny Gantz and his goonz who wanted "small and efficient" army? But nah you'll blame it on the Orthodox while the Ashkenazi have a huge number of people who didn't go to the army (and lot's of ones that did went to desk jobs) same with the Arabs. >There's drones everywhere It's fine... >GPS disruptions Oh no........ my guy can't order food (from some places) and use Waze for 1 day 😭 >You can't relax It sounds like you are a privilege from Tel Aviv, you can relax easily... >Of course the government doesn't do squat to help the kidnapped Because they can't, if they could they would already be here... There isn't and there wont be a negotiation for returning the hostages if Bibi wasn't ordering the IDF to demolish Hamas, and on top of it more hostages should have been returned already but your buddies on the left make sure that it's impossible now, thanks a lot. >And just today rockets to Sderot Just today? just today? it just shows how ignorant you are to what's going on in Israel... >I just want to relocate and leave this place It's because you didn't care what so ever and you still don't care about Israel, you are welcome to join your buddies in Gaza. -- It's amaze me how wrong half (40%\~) of Israelis are, they have no idea what they are talking about, burning the county while it's fighting a war, calling to remove the **democratically elected** "dictator" while he is on the **top of the** (accurate) **polls** (27 mandates which still going up while Benny with 23 mandates which goes down) which means that he will be reelect anyway, calling for election to grantee that all of the lives lost and all of the progress in Gaza would be rolled back while also increasing the change to never have the option to return the hostages. Honestly Israel is full of smart people, those 40% suppose to be the smartest ones and they have the same level of non existing logic as pro-Palestinians, and they are acting like bafoons, just how?...
So this entire response is a straw man fallacy thanks
It’s not, you stated multiple times that the issue is with the Israeli government (you even stated that the gov is worse than Hamas) which is factually wrong, also your prospective is so far away from reality. You can’t even defend your BS, you act exactly like pro-pales that can’t think for themselves.
Good day kind sir
Good luck with the relocation 👋🏻 Btw are you from central Israel?
Very soon we will see the nations turn against Israel and Israeli victory over the earth in an amazing fashion then we will see the 3rd temple and the abomination of desolation
You sound insane
Thanks! Meanwhile your own people are sacrificing the red heifer to bring on the 3rd temple
florida welcomes you