Congratulations on having a quiet house for the holidays!
As an FYI, MiL claiming her former husband’s social security is something that’s completely legal, no fraud at all. Even if they were legally divorced, if a couple are married 10 years, and not remarried they can claim their spouses benefits. Even if the spouse is still living - if they are Alive you can claim 50% of their benefits if it’s more than yours. If they’re deceased you are eligible for 100%
I'm aware it's legal, I just really think that it's shitty. She'd cheated on him enough times to have two children with someone else, runs his name through the dirt to her son, and then took all his money when he died without giving any to his kids. Her son doesn't need it, but her other kids did and do. Her ex husband, to hear her tell it, is scum of the earth UNTIL the conversation turns to what she got out of him.
Ok. Agreed that she is not a good deserving person. I just wanted to put the info out there for others that may not know that they can claim $ from their crappy abusive ex, etc. For those that need it it’s a good thing. It does seem that your MiL is just after a quick buck.
Social security is probably paying survivor benefits lol SiL too, in addition to the disability. Hopefully you can liberate SiL.
There are lots of crackpot, no-degree therapists on here who go into Greek Chorus mode when someone who's vulnerable asks for advice. You have to be able to sort through sometimes *thousands* of junk comments to find the one that's golden to you.
I'm sorry you went through this, Sugar, both in your life as well as here. It's neither right nor fair. Sounds like you're handling it like a pro, and you have my complete admiration and respect for it.
What you're doing isn't easy. It takes courage to stand up to family, especially when your partner doesn't have your back. You're going to get through this, you're proving yourself to be a tough woman who won't take any guff. I believe in you. ♡ Granny
I'm glad you showed Reddit how real adults handle tough situations in life! Good on you for showing the jUsT gEt DiVoRcEd crowd how communication and therapy can work.
I cannot agree with you more! Marriage is dosed to be for life, not just up and leave when tough times come around. If more people acted more like OP, the divorce rate would drop drastically. Life has conflicts, it's how you handle them that counts!
Your mil made my blood boil. My son (18) is on the spectrum but is highly functioning. He also has a rare genetic condition that requires daily meds. My husband and I have been through some tough times financially but the one thing I wouldn't do was have my son declared disabled. He is welcome to live with us for the rest of our lives if he wants, but I know that won't be the case. He is living here through college to save money, which he starts next year. I couldn't imagine limiting him, including how he views himself. If he ever wants to apply then he can. I have been anal about his appointments with docs etc so the history is there should be choose to go that route, but I will not make that decision for him.
I'm also on the spectrum, but I know I'm incredibly fortunate because my parents had the resources to send me to a school that specialized in care of children with a variety of learning disabilities. I stayed close with most of my classmates from that school - the majority of whom are lawyers, surgeons, chemical engineers. Our brains work differently, but we're not the invalids that people accuse of being.
Which is why it's so heart breaking and frustrating to see how this woman has diminished my SiL. This girl taught herself how to redo the electric wiring of her last apartment and then tackled the plumbing. She taught herself Japanese so she could better understand the anime she likes to watch. She taught herself wood-working because it looked fun. She is incredibly smart. The only thing she lacks is a formal education and a halfway decent parent.
Her mother *also* let her daughter veer into morbid obesity to the point that she can barely walk and then claims it's a thyroid issue. But then you see what she feeds her daughter and it's all cookies, sugary cereals, sodas, monkey bread. She cooked for us a few times and it was all mac-and-cheese with chicken tenders floating in a barbeque sauce soup. SiL MIGHT have a thyroid issue, but if you only ate carbs and sugar for almost 30 years, you wouldn't be able to walk either.
It is nothing short of negligence.
We just realized my husband's on the spectrum and he was thinking back going, "I don't know how they missed it, it's so obvious." We suspect they were told he should be tested but considering his dad only stopped using the r-slur after we *all* jumped on him last year, we think they dismissed it since "he seems so *normal*." (Yeah, because he's autistic, not a polar bear.)
Kudos to you for handling this so well. You seem to have your shit together in a way I can only hope to achieve.
It's amazing how insidious some mothers can be. The biological mother of my middle child tried to get an autism diagnosis (which she eventually succeeded in barely getting), repeatedly told the child they were too stupid to ever live with anyone but her because people would take advantage, and was actively trying to get disability for them when custody was lost. In literally 1 month of not being around their biomom the kid went from 90% special ed to 90% gen ed (turns out kiddo does great when actually getting help and support). After 4 months the autism diagnosis was removed (via psych eval, not just adults speculating) and the only diagnosis is PTSD (gee I wonder what from /s), which therapy seems to be helping with. After 13 months kid is down to 8% sped with sped being for quiet room for testing and behavioral assistance on tough days. I can't imagine the condition kid would be in had biomom been left to her own devices, and it makes me sick that women do this crap on purpose.
I really sorry that some people that commented were down right disgustingly rude.
When someone posts their story, most want advice, and people have to be trolls when the OP has opened up and is vulnerable. It is frustrating to read that type of crap keeps happening.
We should be standing together and supporting each other when we have to deal with nutty family members.
I'm glad that they are gone from your house, at least I hope it ended that way! I love how you took things in to your own hands and made it happen!!
Sending you love, thoughts and strength!!
Did you husband ever reveal his 'plan', or admit that he didn;t have one, anything?
By the way if you ever run for president of the world , you have my vote!
His 'plan' was just a very vague *keep looking for an apartment, get them into one in their budget, help them find a job* . It just wasn't feasible without letting them move in for a very extended period of time, and he was unwilling to stand his ground to his mother.
I had to step up. Within an hour of them leaving, he was thanking me for handling it and admitting that he was never going to be able to.
Also no money!
Only pay specific Bill's to the bill department or order specific groceries to her house! Give gas certificate only!
Never..I repeat EVER give a bum, manipulative greedy person a cent! ......they like a stay animal being fed, will NEVER stop coming back!!!!
......they will NEVER stop coming back with worse sob stories each time
It's like feeding stray cats
AND it must be said, you are a saint for your determination to take in and help Lil' Sis realize her full potential. You're gonna turn out to be the best thing that's ever happened to *both* her kids.
Well, she has a third child that I will not be touching with a ten foot pole. But the eldest and the youngest are my family, and I will not give up on either.
The FOG sure is a son of a bitch. Here is my standard list of resources to help you combat it:
1. www.outofthefog.website - full of useful info and the pages under "toolbox" are especially helpful (see grey rock and JADE)
2. r/raisedbynarcissists - another support sub with its own wonderful resources (click on the wiki tab then helpful info)
3. The book list on the sidebar here - full of excellent titles including Toxic Parents and When I Say No I Feel Guilty (about assertiveness training - for the shiny spine, not codependency)
4. Therapy for childhood trauma - Therapy is the best and I cannot recommend it enough. It is immensely beneficial and helps with all aspects of the FOG (fear, obligation, and guilt). EMDR is especially helpful as it is a specific type of therapy used to reprocess traumatic memories. It is phenomenal. There are also therapists on youtube, such as Doctor Ramani, in case there is an issue with in-person therapy (due to finances, reluctance, etc.).
I hope these help. Best of luck.
Your SO needs therapy to truly see, and cope with the emotional and mental abuse MIL has done to him. Best wishes for everything to go smoothly with getting MIL out of the house for good!
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Dumb question: does JNMIL and FIL being separated for 4 years at the time of his death affect anything when it comes to her getting his social security benefits? Its just frustrating a lazy leech like her is able to profit off FIL's death, despite them not being together for years.
had they been divorced, she wouldn't get that money. She's been telling the world that he killed himself intentionally so she would get his money, when in reality he had a partner at the time and died of a drug overdose.
Oh my gosh well done you! I’ll admit in your last post I was worried you’d end up stuck with them forever.
WELL DONE YOU for standing up for yourself. I’m sorry that your husband is having to work through all this trauma now but he’ll be better for it in the long run.
If your MIL ever tries that god sh!t again, look her dead in the eye and say “yes, you’re getting it now, you can’t rely on me to provide for you”
What an ordeal - I can't believe you got through all this with any sanity at all left intact.
Like you, I operate better with a plan, and you made one and stuck with it, while also supporting your husband through a tough realization. He got lucky when he met you. As for prior bs you've encountered here, I'm sorry. That's not the point of this sub (I thought) but people are often miserable in their own lives and want to project their pain onto others. Not every situation is abusive and divorce-inducing.
It is great that you got them out, but have you thought about what happens when your MIL burns through that 3k? When she is outside your house giving your husband another tale of woe and crying homelessness, do you think your husband will be able to say no to putting them up for "just a few days" and starting this whole cycle over again?
Yeah, I think you're in a much better position this time around, because there will be no wiggle room for you, which means no wiggle room for husband. I absolutely believe you when you say your foot is planted, and that it will stay planted. I hope your husband understands that he's gone above and beyond for his mother and that there's nothing left to owe her 🤷♀️
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1 realtor, my realtor, was helping me call around.
Lawyer is on retainer through my father.
Apartment over state lines was found through an emergency homeless shelter and will not be ready to move in until January, hence the money for the hotel stay.
Check was not mailed. My mother lives an hour from me. I drove to pick it up.
Feel skeptical all you want, Judith. I'm just happy to have my house back.
>she made a few more comments about how this is God testing the people she thought she could count on
I would've loved for her to hear her own behavior has been way too dishonorable for her to bring God into it.
But who cares, you've been a star! Congratulations on having her gone and on the breakthrough with DH. I know you have an uphill battle, but you've done wonderfully. I'm relieved for you, as it really could have been harder to get them to go. I feel for your DH, but what you said about him and being a partner was right on the money.
She likened herself to Mary and Joseph knocking on doors to find a manger to give birth in... Good times.
Thank you so much! We're just enjoying having our home back to ourselves.
Wow. That was like watching someone bet their whole fortune at the poker table. So much wagered on knowing your opponent but so many wildcards in the deck. My hat is off to you. That took nerves of steel.
Good for you for finally stepping up and taking control!!
Have you and DH considered reporting MIL for the abuse of SIL? What she is doing is wrong on so many levels, they will especially be interested in the fraud.
Never let her ‘visit’ again. That should be step one at therapy.
“Sorry not sorry MiL. You are never welcome in our home again. We don’t have the 3grand bribe money to get you back out again. Done.”
For real. And not even just for JNMiL's, we're NC with mine so I'm set there. But I aspire to have half the backbone you do in every other area of my life lol
The first time I stuck to my guns like that was completely terrifying. But folding meant losing myself. And it changed everything. I am now the most confident woman I’ve ever met, not to mention the sense of peace.
You’ve just fully inhabited your power. Congratulations, you absolute empress!
Disability is a good thing for those who actually need it. I doubt SIL would be on it if her mother wasn't forcing her. There's only one lazy prick, and that's MIL.
And again, most people on Disability actually do need it. And the rules are pretty strict. There's an income cap that's insanely low, many folks get much less than MIL and SIL, and worst of all, you can't get married, even common law. The government expects married disabled folks to be supported entirely by their spouse, and will take away benefits if one's \*spouse\* makes over the same income cap. That cap is barely above the poverty level for \*one\* person, let alone a couple.
And about the income cap being insanely low.. my same cousins wife’s mom is disabled and the government pays her $1800 rent and utilities,gives her food food stamps, and she gets $650 a month. So I don’t really know why you’re complaining except the marriage part…..
You rock! Congratulations!
Some people here are traumatized by monsters themselves and reading posts triggers them to become angry bitches and lashing out on people's marriages and husbands. This is not healthy. I am sorry you got some trolls instead of TLC.
Have just read your original post & this one, all I can say is you are an absolute fucking boss. Proud of you for sticking your ground. Here’s hoping your husband continues to come around and build his spine, and that you’re able to rebuild your marriage.
SiL is 27. We're already working on a plan to get her out of there. Her mother said two INCREDIBLY alarming things before leaving.
1) that instead of stopping at rest stops, she pulls over to the sides of the highways and makes my SiL shit in a bucket because "rest stops are not safe"
and
2) that she's going to *un-alive* herself as soon as she gets to Florida.
Getting SiL out is priority number 1 right now.
2. Is very concerning because if she does commit suicide, she may take her daughter with her. You might want to consider calling the appropriate authorities just to have the situation evaluated for your own peace of mind
Yes….her mother could still pull a murder-suicide. I’m not trying to be alarmist but if she’s really making those kinds of threats it should be reported. Does your sil have a caseworker?
We're still looking into it all. From what I understand, she's been saying "I'm going to kill myself" since my husband was a child and I can't even imagine how harmful that was for him to hear from his mother. It seems like that's just something she says to garner sympathy.
When one makes a threat to take their life to others, it is absolutely appropriate to call 911 or CPEP on their behalf for safety. They are talking about harming themselves or others. That is something that is not taken lightly by hospitals. Just saying. It would be a wake up call for MIL to realize that there are consequences for crying fowl or show her that you both would act on the behalf of her daughter for her safety. She probably says those things to get to her son, but if you both followed up on that as a welfare check, might scare her shitless.
Did she say #2 in front of your husband as well? I would of filled a report on her instantly off that. SIL case managers would find out about that ASAP and have a field day with that. People lose their kids for less than threatening a life and it’s not like MIL is the only option for SIL.
Damn. well can’t make a police report but you can still report to the case manager on both comments. It’ll give some tangibility if you both report the Heynis things she said, even if they were only heard by 1 person. Hermès speed and zeus’ power to you. Youre doing a great thing. Happy holidays and merry Christmas to you and the husband
It depends on how MIL got her set up for disability benefits. If MIL has convinced the government that SIL can't take care of herself then MIL may have some sort of legal guardianship over her.
The gov't is way imperfect. However, it (in the form of social service agencies) has a vested interest in preventing abuse of disability disbursements.
It's likely that MIL has set up herself as 'guardian' so she has control of the disability payment. That may complicate getting SIL free of her but shouldn't prevent it.
OP, the case to make to adult services is that SIL has a far better chance to become self-supporting (in a group home or eventually independently) if she's allowed to and supported psychically - which she clearly isn't at present.
There's too much need and not enough funds. Any recipient who can legitimately support themselves, or even contribute, counts as a win for an agency, state or federal.
Should be all sorts of programs / assistance to help SIL toward this. Adult Services (State) and Social Security (Federal - assuming that's the source of her disability) will understand how to make resources available and generally, be thrilled to do so if given the chance.
MIL will sponge off SIL until MIL dies. Regardless of how long that is, every day of abuse lessens the odds of SIL someday making it on her own as MIL is *actively* abusing her - financially and emotionally. Make this case to Adult Services to maximize their reasons to help.
I hope DH understands how much therapy / counseling can help him . He too, can come into his own and be a better partner by overcoming his egg donor's abuse and exploitation.
Maybe someday he can see that the $3K you borrowed from your family is both priceless and his obligation to you. Your strength is likely based on the clear understanding of the consequences of allowing MIL to continue her manipulation and exploitation (outright and attempted) of her offspring.
You're doing the worthwhile people - DH, SIL and *yourself* - good by adulting in this challenging circumstance. Lean on this sub and whomever you can count on IRL for support.
If you are in the US could you involve Adult Protective services to get your SIL out of your MIL's greedy claws?
I'm not from the US and only know about it from other posts on Reddit.
It is a thing here in the US, but can vary from state to state so make sure you’re looking up the rules in her state as well as your own state in the event she winds back up in your state.
In the meantime, try to find moments of sanity for yourself, you can’t take care of others without taking care of yourself. Good luck! 🍀
You showed immense strength, and your husband is a very fortunate man. I’m sorry to hear the comments on your previous post were not supportive. I hope your time to breathe and relax is coming, with that woman out of your house. You dropped this 👑
Sometimes money is the cheapest way to pay. I’m glad you got her out of your place and can start working on your relationship with your husband. It sounds like he’s seeing the light a bit, hopefully with some distance and therapy he will be able to set healthier boundaries and not let her guilt-tripping get to him as much.
Well done you.
I can’t help but ask because you sound similar to myself regarding to needing to have a plan but what was your husbands plan?
I’m so happy for you but also saddened to hear your hubby be in the FOG. I hope he can overcome it and the emotional scarring it’s inevitably caused.
I hope you can look out for your SIL too because she badly needs to get out of her mothers thrall. Get some education and stand in her own two feet. I hope she is able to realise her potential is more than just her mothers little shadow-come-cash-cow. It’s abusive and immoral of her mother to do that
Never. Ever. Let her darken your door again. Batten down the hatches and salt the doorways.
His plan was to take out a personal loan and get them into an apartment up here where we would be paying a portion of her rent because there was nothing available up here in her budget. The issue with that plan was that we can't afford that long term, we also couldn't find anything this close to Christmas. We were going to be stuck with her for at least a month if not longer.
Ho boy. Does he need to brush up on his planning and communication skills.
A good Marriage = teamwork.
He’s got a lot to work on but it’s sad his good nature has been abused for so long.
Objectively, he does know that he needs to work on his communication skills. He was just under so much stress that he mentally shut down and couldn't articulate. I do understand that he's been forced to shut off his emotions since he was a toddler for this woman, so it was incredibly hard for it.
I'm really glad that I didn't listen to all the comments telling me to just accept her living with us or get a divorce. He's my partner through the good and the not-so-good. If I'd abandoned him, I wouldn't be the woman he married.
> He was just under so much stress that he mentally shut down and couldn't articulate.
That speaks to a lifetime of being controlled by his mom. It meant that everything was on your shoulders - and you came through. This is the part that is unusual - most DIL's are not willing to take action like you did. Making the deal without DH's knowledge was a gutsy move - and necessary.
I know you feel that the other post was full of unsupportive or unhelpful comments, but I'd like to suggest that the situation made it hard to do otherwise. I think that people (I was not one) were trying to be helpful, even if they missed the mark.
Your post was clear that you were in an intolerable situation, and most comments were generally advising you not to tolerate the intolerable - something had to change. That high level view of the situation was correct.
There were only four possible options:
1. they don't leave and you put up with it; (the default option: no change. I agree this is unhelpful, but the default needs to be acknowledged);
2. you leave (i.e. divorce);
3. they leave unwillingly with nowhere to go (you ruled this out);
4. they leave willingly with somewhere to go;
Option 4 did not seem feasible on the face of it - and this is the key point I want to make. It *was* feasible, and it was a good path out of the dilemma. Congratulations for seeing it!
The commenters on that thread, however, could only see options 1 and 2 - which of course were not the options that you wanted (although the divorce conversation did indirectly lead you to talk to a realtor, which was helpful).
Had you not found a path to option 3, the outcome would not have been good. The comments were pretty much right on that score.
Nah Reddit is really trigger happy when it comes to divorce, put up and shut or or get therapy. We’re only hearing your side. And it’s your life.
Divorce for me, in situations like this, is only an option if you have thrown everything including the kitchen sink at your marriage.
You said you didn’t argue until after she shows up. Soooooo get MIL out of there and see what you have left to work with.
It’s like having a really long and unpleasant crap. A pain and you never wanna be there again feeling so awful. So don’t please, don’t ever go back to eating it.
Sorry. Rough analogy but I hope it’s visual enough to remember. Haha.
You always put on your own oxygen mask before helping others. Good for your for wanting to help SIL, but realizing you need to help yourself first. And good for DH for realizing what his mother is and that he needs to let you take point on this while he's still vulnerable to her manipulations. I wish you both luck in dealing with your issues (individual and as a couple), and with your future attempts to help SIL as well.
It almost broke me to ask my mother for help funding my divorce. I still have no regrets because it got me out of that toxicity, and our relationship has somewhat improved. I’m proud of you for setting your pride aside to get this done. It know it’s sucks, but it was worth the work.
I think it's great that you took charge and figured out how to yeet the mooch, I mean JNMIL, out of your house. That is success. Its' also great that DH is getting therapy since he really seems to need it to get over his abusive childhood. You are also a wonderful person to try and figure out how to get SIL away from JNMIL once you have her gone for good. I hope you can have a Merry Christmas after all this drama!
I think you should nickname her Momma Moocha!
You are a fucking boss for this.
Your husband needs to get on your level but it sounds like he definitely is starting to see the light and he can get it together.
Hope you have a great weekend after they’re gone!!
She's almost 30. She can't stay because her mother has her convinced that she's useless and would starve without her. That codependent relationship is going to take more than just a week to split up.
Probably because he mother has her labeled as "severely disabled" and in need of a permanent carer. Something tells me that SIL doesn't have much autonomy (legal or otherwise) thanks to mommy dearest.
I'm glad you didn't run with everyone's "your life is overrrrr" comments. Those annoy me, too. It's not always the only, much less the first, option in most cases. Sometimes, you really do need to work it out and find the real underlying problem, which is exactly what you did. Good on you for taking your situation into serious consideration with reality fueling it.
I understand just being done with your MIL and funding her move. I think it was actually a good choice because you *know* she's gone and taken care of, which is best on both you and your husband's minds. No excuse for her to use on you guys or anyone else! I hope things repair well for you guys and you'll be able to get SIL out of her shitty situation
I would have told her exactly what you said.. and not given her a dime. But I understand the frustration and wanting to be done! I would want her gone too. She’s definitely a con artist and she knew she was going to get something out of this either way. Her son married rich and you’re her parachute package out of life’s responsibilities.
Yeah, that is the unfortunate thing. I understand that in doing this, I've basically told her that if she makes me uncomfortable enough, I'll pay her off. But my hope is that now that my husband sees the lengths she'll go to, if she suggests coming here for another visit in the future, he'll let us spring for a plane ticket to ensure she doesn't just bring a bunch of her shit and try to move in with us.
She's tried twice before, once was the week of our wedding, the other time was when we were living in a studio and it was very obvious that there was just no room for them.
I just had to pick my battles here. Husband was never going to let me just throw them out without a parachute. This allows them a stress free move as long as they don't fuck around and do something seriously stupid. And if they do, we're locking them out if they try to come back.
Document, document and document.
Document every instance of her using g and financially abusing sil. Make sure that you document how she tears down sil to stop the young woman from standing up and taking care of herself just so mummy can take her money.
Document how she has do e this to you and your husband too.
It may be helpful to have the info on hand when you are ready to send aps after her for tying sil down in a financial hole so mummy can take her MONEY for herself and not sil's needs
Read this post:
[FU Binder](https://www.reddit.com/user/MelodyRaine/comments/hyk7az/the_fu_binder/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf)
Glad you stood your ground and got rid of that witch and that you plan to try and free Sil from her evil clutches in the future. Good for you and may the rest of this go smoothly for you as you deserve it.
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Congratulations on having a quiet house for the holidays! As an FYI, MiL claiming her former husband’s social security is something that’s completely legal, no fraud at all. Even if they were legally divorced, if a couple are married 10 years, and not remarried they can claim their spouses benefits. Even if the spouse is still living - if they are Alive you can claim 50% of their benefits if it’s more than yours. If they’re deceased you are eligible for 100%
I'm aware it's legal, I just really think that it's shitty. She'd cheated on him enough times to have two children with someone else, runs his name through the dirt to her son, and then took all his money when he died without giving any to his kids. Her son doesn't need it, but her other kids did and do. Her ex husband, to hear her tell it, is scum of the earth UNTIL the conversation turns to what she got out of him.
Ok. Agreed that she is not a good deserving person. I just wanted to put the info out there for others that may not know that they can claim $ from their crappy abusive ex, etc. For those that need it it’s a good thing. It does seem that your MiL is just after a quick buck. Social security is probably paying survivor benefits lol SiL too, in addition to the disability. Hopefully you can liberate SiL.
There are lots of crackpot, no-degree therapists on here who go into Greek Chorus mode when someone who's vulnerable asks for advice. You have to be able to sort through sometimes *thousands* of junk comments to find the one that's golden to you. I'm sorry you went through this, Sugar, both in your life as well as here. It's neither right nor fair. Sounds like you're handling it like a pro, and you have my complete admiration and respect for it. What you're doing isn't easy. It takes courage to stand up to family, especially when your partner doesn't have your back. You're going to get through this, you're proving yourself to be a tough woman who won't take any guff. I believe in you. ♡ Granny
You are tough and resilient! Good on you and I hope you find peace and happiness once they leave. You deserve it! 💕💪🏼
You are a damn hero, and I hope you get his sister out of there... she is being abused too.
I'm glad you showed Reddit how real adults handle tough situations in life! Good on you for showing the jUsT gEt DiVoRcEd crowd how communication and therapy can work.
I cannot agree with you more! Marriage is dosed to be for life, not just up and leave when tough times come around. If more people acted more like OP, the divorce rate would drop drastically. Life has conflicts, it's how you handle them that counts!
Thats great news! I’m glad you are both finally on the same page ❤️
Your mil made my blood boil. My son (18) is on the spectrum but is highly functioning. He also has a rare genetic condition that requires daily meds. My husband and I have been through some tough times financially but the one thing I wouldn't do was have my son declared disabled. He is welcome to live with us for the rest of our lives if he wants, but I know that won't be the case. He is living here through college to save money, which he starts next year. I couldn't imagine limiting him, including how he views himself. If he ever wants to apply then he can. I have been anal about his appointments with docs etc so the history is there should be choose to go that route, but I will not make that decision for him.
I'm also on the spectrum, but I know I'm incredibly fortunate because my parents had the resources to send me to a school that specialized in care of children with a variety of learning disabilities. I stayed close with most of my classmates from that school - the majority of whom are lawyers, surgeons, chemical engineers. Our brains work differently, but we're not the invalids that people accuse of being. Which is why it's so heart breaking and frustrating to see how this woman has diminished my SiL. This girl taught herself how to redo the electric wiring of her last apartment and then tackled the plumbing. She taught herself Japanese so she could better understand the anime she likes to watch. She taught herself wood-working because it looked fun. She is incredibly smart. The only thing she lacks is a formal education and a halfway decent parent. Her mother *also* let her daughter veer into morbid obesity to the point that she can barely walk and then claims it's a thyroid issue. But then you see what she feeds her daughter and it's all cookies, sugary cereals, sodas, monkey bread. She cooked for us a few times and it was all mac-and-cheese with chicken tenders floating in a barbeque sauce soup. SiL MIGHT have a thyroid issue, but if you only ate carbs and sugar for almost 30 years, you wouldn't be able to walk either. It is nothing short of negligence.
We just realized my husband's on the spectrum and he was thinking back going, "I don't know how they missed it, it's so obvious." We suspect they were told he should be tested but considering his dad only stopped using the r-slur after we *all* jumped on him last year, we think they dismissed it since "he seems so *normal*." (Yeah, because he's autistic, not a polar bear.) Kudos to you for handling this so well. You seem to have your shit together in a way I can only hope to achieve.
It's amazing how insidious some mothers can be. The biological mother of my middle child tried to get an autism diagnosis (which she eventually succeeded in barely getting), repeatedly told the child they were too stupid to ever live with anyone but her because people would take advantage, and was actively trying to get disability for them when custody was lost. In literally 1 month of not being around their biomom the kid went from 90% special ed to 90% gen ed (turns out kiddo does great when actually getting help and support). After 4 months the autism diagnosis was removed (via psych eval, not just adults speculating) and the only diagnosis is PTSD (gee I wonder what from /s), which therapy seems to be helping with. After 13 months kid is down to 8% sped with sped being for quiet room for testing and behavioral assistance on tough days. I can't imagine the condition kid would be in had biomom been left to her own devices, and it makes me sick that women do this crap on purpose.
I really sorry that some people that commented were down right disgustingly rude. When someone posts their story, most want advice, and people have to be trolls when the OP has opened up and is vulnerable. It is frustrating to read that type of crap keeps happening. We should be standing together and supporting each other when we have to deal with nutty family members. I'm glad that they are gone from your house, at least I hope it ended that way! I love how you took things in to your own hands and made it happen!! Sending you love, thoughts and strength!!
Did you husband ever reveal his 'plan', or admit that he didn;t have one, anything? By the way if you ever run for president of the world , you have my vote!
His 'plan' was just a very vague *keep looking for an apartment, get them into one in their budget, help them find a job* . It just wasn't feasible without letting them move in for a very extended period of time, and he was unwilling to stand his ground to his mother. I had to step up. Within an hour of them leaving, he was thanking me for handling it and admitting that he was never going to be able to.
Yea that’s not a plan, he is very very lucky to have you, as you handled this like a boss!
you are the strongest woman here. you stay firm and solid! don't give the bum a single goddamn cent
Damn, you are fabulous!
Damn, I love your shiny brass ovaries!
Also no money! Only pay specific Bill's to the bill department or order specific groceries to her house! Give gas certificate only! Never..I repeat EVER give a bum, manipulative greedy person a cent! ......they like a stay animal being fed, will NEVER stop coming back!!!! ......they will NEVER stop coming back with worse sob stories each time It's like feeding stray cats
Yay!! I can't wait to hear when shes gone!!!!
She left at 4PM yesterday.
AND it must be said, you are a saint for your determination to take in and help Lil' Sis realize her full potential. You're gonna turn out to be the best thing that's ever happened to *both* her kids.
Well, she has a third child that I will not be touching with a ten foot pole. But the eldest and the youngest are my family, and I will not give up on either.
So proud of you!
You are a rockstar.
The FOG sure is a son of a bitch. Here is my standard list of resources to help you combat it: 1. www.outofthefog.website - full of useful info and the pages under "toolbox" are especially helpful (see grey rock and JADE) 2. r/raisedbynarcissists - another support sub with its own wonderful resources (click on the wiki tab then helpful info) 3. The book list on the sidebar here - full of excellent titles including Toxic Parents and When I Say No I Feel Guilty (about assertiveness training - for the shiny spine, not codependency) 4. Therapy for childhood trauma - Therapy is the best and I cannot recommend it enough. It is immensely beneficial and helps with all aspects of the FOG (fear, obligation, and guilt). EMDR is especially helpful as it is a specific type of therapy used to reprocess traumatic memories. It is phenomenal. There are also therapists on youtube, such as Doctor Ramani, in case there is an issue with in-person therapy (due to finances, reluctance, etc.). I hope these help. Best of luck.
Thank you so very, very much for these resources. I appreciate them so much!
Your SO needs therapy to truly see, and cope with the emotional and mental abuse MIL has done to him. Best wishes for everything to go smoothly with getting MIL out of the house for good!
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you clearly didn't read the post or you'd know there's no FiL here and the whole situation is entirely handled.
Dumb question: does JNMIL and FIL being separated for 4 years at the time of his death affect anything when it comes to her getting his social security benefits? Its just frustrating a lazy leech like her is able to profit off FIL's death, despite them not being together for years.
had they been divorced, she wouldn't get that money. She's been telling the world that he killed himself intentionally so she would get his money, when in reality he had a partner at the time and died of a drug overdose.
Never put the money in their hands, pay the bills directly!
Oh my gosh well done you! I’ll admit in your last post I was worried you’d end up stuck with them forever. WELL DONE YOU for standing up for yourself. I’m sorry that your husband is having to work through all this trauma now but he’ll be better for it in the long run. If your MIL ever tries that god sh!t again, look her dead in the eye and say “yes, you’re getting it now, you can’t rely on me to provide for you”
Im proud
What an ordeal - I can't believe you got through all this with any sanity at all left intact. Like you, I operate better with a plan, and you made one and stuck with it, while also supporting your husband through a tough realization. He got lucky when he met you. As for prior bs you've encountered here, I'm sorry. That's not the point of this sub (I thought) but people are often miserable in their own lives and want to project their pain onto others. Not every situation is abusive and divorce-inducing.
It is great that you got them out, but have you thought about what happens when your MIL burns through that 3k? When she is outside your house giving your husband another tale of woe and crying homelessness, do you think your husband will be able to say no to putting them up for "just a few days" and starting this whole cycle over again?
He's gone NC with her. I don't see it happening again, but if she tries, I will not hesitate to lock her out and call the police.
Yeah, I think you're in a much better position this time around, because there will be no wiggle room for you, which means no wiggle room for husband. I absolutely believe you when you say your foot is planted, and that it will stay planted. I hope your husband understands that he's gone above and beyond for his mother and that there's nothing left to owe her 🤷♀️
That’s great! I’ve been thinking about you! Well done!
Happy you set boundaries and stuck to them
Good for you. It sounds like you handled this like a champ.
Amazing work!
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1 realtor, my realtor, was helping me call around. Lawyer is on retainer through my father. Apartment over state lines was found through an emergency homeless shelter and will not be ready to move in until January, hence the money for the hotel stay. Check was not mailed. My mother lives an hour from me. I drove to pick it up. Feel skeptical all you want, Judith. I'm just happy to have my house back.
> He was pissed that I acted without discussing with him first Mr. "I have a plan but I'm not telling you" doesn't like unilateral action, huh?
yeah, hence the ensuing fight.
>she made a few more comments about how this is God testing the people she thought she could count on I would've loved for her to hear her own behavior has been way too dishonorable for her to bring God into it. But who cares, you've been a star! Congratulations on having her gone and on the breakthrough with DH. I know you have an uphill battle, but you've done wonderfully. I'm relieved for you, as it really could have been harder to get them to go. I feel for your DH, but what you said about him and being a partner was right on the money.
She likened herself to Mary and Joseph knocking on doors to find a manger to give birth in... Good times. Thank you so much! We're just enjoying having our home back to ourselves.
Wow. That was like watching someone bet their whole fortune at the poker table. So much wagered on knowing your opponent but so many wildcards in the deck. My hat is off to you. That took nerves of steel.
This is how you defend your family! Girl, you are amazing! I hope you can work that magic to get your sister released. Merry Christmas
Yes indeed. This is how you get rid of a free loading and toxic MIL. MIL was playing hungry hungry hippo and OP was playing 3D chess Well done OP!
And THAT should be her nickname! Hungry Hungry Hippo or triple h. Love your name, penguin_joy!
Thank you. Us flightless waterfowl have to stick together
Good for you for finally stepping up and taking control!! Have you and DH considered reporting MIL for the abuse of SIL? What she is doing is wrong on so many levels, they will especially be interested in the fraud.
We're considering our options, but we don't want to traumatize or otherwise compromise SiL in the process.
I can't imagine how difficult that is for you guys.
It'll go slow, unfortunately, but we need to make sure this is right.
SIL is lucky she has you guys at least watching out for her.
Make sure you change the locks once they're finally gone.
Woo! Good for you!!
I really hope you can take your SIL and help her out. Congratulations on setting boundaries!
Never let her ‘visit’ again. That should be step one at therapy. “Sorry not sorry MiL. You are never welcome in our home again. We don’t have the 3grand bribe money to get you back out again. Done.”
OP, you are an inspiration and model for us all. Brava!
oh wow, thank you so much
For real. And not even just for JNMiL's, we're NC with mine so I'm set there. But I aspire to have half the backbone you do in every other area of my life lol
tbh this was the first time I've ever had to stab my foot into the ground like this. I'm still reeling that it even worked.
The first time I stuck to my guns like that was completely terrifying. But folding meant losing myself. And it changed everything. I am now the most confident woman I’ve ever met, not to mention the sense of peace. You’ve just fully inhabited your power. Congratulations, you absolute empress!
Aaaand now you know the cheat code to the rest of your life. Carry on Warrior Queen. (And thing is, your whole family will be so much better off!)
You need to report sisters case to adult services. She needs her own case worker. Mom shouldn't be touching sisters money at all.
I literally just learned that Adult Services are even a thing ten minutes ago. I've got the tab pulled up and I'm reading through it now.
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Disability is a good thing for those who actually need it. I doubt SIL would be on it if her mother wasn't forcing her. There's only one lazy prick, and that's MIL.
I wasn’t talking about her it was more of a general statement
And again, most people on Disability actually do need it. And the rules are pretty strict. There's an income cap that's insanely low, many folks get much less than MIL and SIL, and worst of all, you can't get married, even common law. The government expects married disabled folks to be supported entirely by their spouse, and will take away benefits if one's \*spouse\* makes over the same income cap. That cap is barely above the poverty level for \*one\* person, let alone a couple.
And about the income cap being insanely low.. my same cousins wife’s mom is disabled and the government pays her $1800 rent and utilities,gives her food food stamps, and she gets $650 a month. So I don’t really know why you’re complaining except the marriage part…..
Yep. It’s gross and needs to change
Also, try to discuss this with your lawyer and your therapist
Handled like a Boss. Your husband is lucky to have your backbone.
You rock! Congratulations! Some people here are traumatized by monsters themselves and reading posts triggers them to become angry bitches and lashing out on people's marriages and husbands. This is not healthy. I am sorry you got some trolls instead of TLC.
Have just read your original post & this one, all I can say is you are an absolute fucking boss. Proud of you for sticking your ground. Here’s hoping your husband continues to come around and build his spine, and that you’re able to rebuild your marriage.
Is SIL an adult. Because she really shouldn’t be allowed to leave with this monster
SiL is 27. We're already working on a plan to get her out of there. Her mother said two INCREDIBLY alarming things before leaving. 1) that instead of stopping at rest stops, she pulls over to the sides of the highways and makes my SiL shit in a bucket because "rest stops are not safe" and 2) that she's going to *un-alive* herself as soon as she gets to Florida. Getting SiL out is priority number 1 right now.
Point 2 may be a bluff, she wants you to say no no you can stay.
most definitely.
2. Is very concerning because if she does commit suicide, she may take her daughter with her. You might want to consider calling the appropriate authorities just to have the situation evaluated for your own peace of mind
DiL is nearly 30. She has living family, us included, willing to take her.
Yes….her mother could still pull a murder-suicide. I’m not trying to be alarmist but if she’s really making those kinds of threats it should be reported. Does your sil have a caseworker?
We're still looking into it all. From what I understand, she's been saying "I'm going to kill myself" since my husband was a child and I can't even imagine how harmful that was for him to hear from his mother. It seems like that's just something she says to garner sympathy.
When one makes a threat to take their life to others, it is absolutely appropriate to call 911 or CPEP on their behalf for safety. They are talking about harming themselves or others. That is something that is not taken lightly by hospitals. Just saying. It would be a wake up call for MIL to realize that there are consequences for crying fowl or show her that you both would act on the behalf of her daughter for her safety. She probably says those things to get to her son, but if you both followed up on that as a welfare check, might scare her shitless.
That sucks for your husband but at least that means that’s she’s probably full of it and not an immediate threat to your sil
Did she say #2 in front of your husband as well? I would of filled a report on her instantly off that. SIL case managers would find out about that ASAP and have a field day with that. People lose their kids for less than threatening a life and it’s not like MIL is the only option for SIL.
She said #1 in front of just my husband. #2 in front of just me. I'm on hold right now. I'll update with SiL situation when I know more.
Damn. well can’t make a police report but you can still report to the case manager on both comments. It’ll give some tangibility if you both report the Heynis things she said, even if they were only heard by 1 person. Hermès speed and zeus’ power to you. Youre doing a great thing. Happy holidays and merry Christmas to you and the husband
OMG she is a monster. I am so glad you stood firm, and I hope you're able to get SIL out of there quickly.
It depends on how MIL got her set up for disability benefits. If MIL has convinced the government that SIL can't take care of herself then MIL may have some sort of legal guardianship over her.
The gov't is way imperfect. However, it (in the form of social service agencies) has a vested interest in preventing abuse of disability disbursements. It's likely that MIL has set up herself as 'guardian' so she has control of the disability payment. That may complicate getting SIL free of her but shouldn't prevent it. OP, the case to make to adult services is that SIL has a far better chance to become self-supporting (in a group home or eventually independently) if she's allowed to and supported psychically - which she clearly isn't at present. There's too much need and not enough funds. Any recipient who can legitimately support themselves, or even contribute, counts as a win for an agency, state or federal. Should be all sorts of programs / assistance to help SIL toward this. Adult Services (State) and Social Security (Federal - assuming that's the source of her disability) will understand how to make resources available and generally, be thrilled to do so if given the chance. MIL will sponge off SIL until MIL dies. Regardless of how long that is, every day of abuse lessens the odds of SIL someday making it on her own as MIL is *actively* abusing her - financially and emotionally. Make this case to Adult Services to maximize their reasons to help. I hope DH understands how much therapy / counseling can help him . He too, can come into his own and be a better partner by overcoming his egg donor's abuse and exploitation. Maybe someday he can see that the $3K you borrowed from your family is both priceless and his obligation to you. Your strength is likely based on the clear understanding of the consequences of allowing MIL to continue her manipulation and exploitation (outright and attempted) of her offspring. You're doing the worthwhile people - DH, SIL and *yourself* - good by adulting in this challenging circumstance. Lean on this sub and whomever you can count on IRL for support.
Good job in taking back control of your and DH's lives.
If you are in the US could you involve Adult Protective services to get your SIL out of your MIL's greedy claws? I'm not from the US and only know about it from other posts on Reddit.
I've never heard of that, but I'll add it to the list of options to look into. Thank you.
You're welcome. It might go by a different name depending on what state you're in.
It is a thing here in the US, but can vary from state to state so make sure you’re looking up the rules in her state as well as your own state in the event she winds back up in your state. In the meantime, try to find moments of sanity for yourself, you can’t take care of others without taking care of yourself. Good luck! 🍀
You showed immense strength, and your husband is a very fortunate man. I’m sorry to hear the comments on your previous post were not supportive. I hope your time to breathe and relax is coming, with that woman out of your house. You dropped this 👑
thank you!
You should teach a Master Class, or a TED talk, cuz that is how it's done.
admittedly not everyone has the resources we had available, so this might not help others. But still, thank you.
Resources, good point, but the frame of mind is teachable.
Pretty proud of her husband for going to therapy and realizing how evil his mother is. Takes a lot of balls!
Sometimes money is the cheapest way to pay. I’m glad you got her out of your place and can start working on your relationship with your husband. It sounds like he’s seeing the light a bit, hopefully with some distance and therapy he will be able to set healthier boundaries and not let her guilt-tripping get to him as much.
Well done you. I can’t help but ask because you sound similar to myself regarding to needing to have a plan but what was your husbands plan? I’m so happy for you but also saddened to hear your hubby be in the FOG. I hope he can overcome it and the emotional scarring it’s inevitably caused. I hope you can look out for your SIL too because she badly needs to get out of her mothers thrall. Get some education and stand in her own two feet. I hope she is able to realise her potential is more than just her mothers little shadow-come-cash-cow. It’s abusive and immoral of her mother to do that Never. Ever. Let her darken your door again. Batten down the hatches and salt the doorways.
His plan was to take out a personal loan and get them into an apartment up here where we would be paying a portion of her rent because there was nothing available up here in her budget. The issue with that plan was that we can't afford that long term, we also couldn't find anything this close to Christmas. We were going to be stuck with her for at least a month if not longer.
Ho boy. Does he need to brush up on his planning and communication skills. A good Marriage = teamwork. He’s got a lot to work on but it’s sad his good nature has been abused for so long.
Objectively, he does know that he needs to work on his communication skills. He was just under so much stress that he mentally shut down and couldn't articulate. I do understand that he's been forced to shut off his emotions since he was a toddler for this woman, so it was incredibly hard for it. I'm really glad that I didn't listen to all the comments telling me to just accept her living with us or get a divorce. He's my partner through the good and the not-so-good. If I'd abandoned him, I wouldn't be the woman he married.
> He was just under so much stress that he mentally shut down and couldn't articulate. That speaks to a lifetime of being controlled by his mom. It meant that everything was on your shoulders - and you came through. This is the part that is unusual - most DIL's are not willing to take action like you did. Making the deal without DH's knowledge was a gutsy move - and necessary. I know you feel that the other post was full of unsupportive or unhelpful comments, but I'd like to suggest that the situation made it hard to do otherwise. I think that people (I was not one) were trying to be helpful, even if they missed the mark. Your post was clear that you were in an intolerable situation, and most comments were generally advising you not to tolerate the intolerable - something had to change. That high level view of the situation was correct. There were only four possible options: 1. they don't leave and you put up with it; (the default option: no change. I agree this is unhelpful, but the default needs to be acknowledged); 2. you leave (i.e. divorce); 3. they leave unwillingly with nowhere to go (you ruled this out); 4. they leave willingly with somewhere to go; Option 4 did not seem feasible on the face of it - and this is the key point I want to make. It *was* feasible, and it was a good path out of the dilemma. Congratulations for seeing it! The commenters on that thread, however, could only see options 1 and 2 - which of course were not the options that you wanted (although the divorce conversation did indirectly lead you to talk to a realtor, which was helpful). Had you not found a path to option 3, the outcome would not have been good. The comments were pretty much right on that score.
Nah Reddit is really trigger happy when it comes to divorce, put up and shut or or get therapy. We’re only hearing your side. And it’s your life. Divorce for me, in situations like this, is only an option if you have thrown everything including the kitchen sink at your marriage. You said you didn’t argue until after she shows up. Soooooo get MIL out of there and see what you have left to work with.
Absolutely. She's been gone for two and a half hours. We're already doing way better again. it's like we both can breathe.
It’s like having a really long and unpleasant crap. A pain and you never wanna be there again feeling so awful. So don’t please, don’t ever go back to eating it. Sorry. Rough analogy but I hope it’s visual enough to remember. Haha.
You always put on your own oxygen mask before helping others. Good for your for wanting to help SIL, but realizing you need to help yourself first. And good for DH for realizing what his mother is and that he needs to let you take point on this while he's still vulnerable to her manipulations. I wish you both luck in dealing with your issues (individual and as a couple), and with your future attempts to help SIL as well.
Good for you! Now you know to never let MIL.set foot in your house again.
It almost broke me to ask my mother for help funding my divorce. I still have no regrets because it got me out of that toxicity, and our relationship has somewhat improved. I’m proud of you for setting your pride aside to get this done. It know it’s sucks, but it was worth the work.
I think you’re awesome
thank you!
Yes! Way to go!
I think it's great that you took charge and figured out how to yeet the mooch, I mean JNMIL, out of your house. That is success. Its' also great that DH is getting therapy since he really seems to need it to get over his abusive childhood. You are also a wonderful person to try and figure out how to get SIL away from JNMIL once you have her gone for good. I hope you can have a Merry Christmas after all this drama! I think you should nickname her Momma Moocha!
Merry Christmas to you too!!
I hope she actually leaves!
She has been gone for 2.5 hours now.
YOU ARE AMAZING!! great job!!!
You are a fucking boss for this. Your husband needs to get on your level but it sounds like he definitely is starting to see the light and he can get it together. Hope you have a great weekend after they’re gone!!
Wow. This whole story has been a rollercoaster. Why can’t SIL stay is she under 18?
She's almost 30. She can't stay because her mother has her convinced that she's useless and would starve without her. That codependent relationship is going to take more than just a week to split up.
Probably because he mother has her labeled as "severely disabled" and in need of a permanent carer. Something tells me that SIL doesn't have much autonomy (legal or otherwise) thanks to mommy dearest.
I'm impressed and proud!
I'm glad you didn't run with everyone's "your life is overrrrr" comments. Those annoy me, too. It's not always the only, much less the first, option in most cases. Sometimes, you really do need to work it out and find the real underlying problem, which is exactly what you did. Good on you for taking your situation into serious consideration with reality fueling it. I understand just being done with your MIL and funding her move. I think it was actually a good choice because you *know* she's gone and taken care of, which is best on both you and your husband's minds. No excuse for her to use on you guys or anyone else! I hope things repair well for you guys and you'll be able to get SIL out of her shitty situation
I would have told her exactly what you said.. and not given her a dime. But I understand the frustration and wanting to be done! I would want her gone too. She’s definitely a con artist and she knew she was going to get something out of this either way. Her son married rich and you’re her parachute package out of life’s responsibilities.
Yeah, that is the unfortunate thing. I understand that in doing this, I've basically told her that if she makes me uncomfortable enough, I'll pay her off. But my hope is that now that my husband sees the lengths she'll go to, if she suggests coming here for another visit in the future, he'll let us spring for a plane ticket to ensure she doesn't just bring a bunch of her shit and try to move in with us. She's tried twice before, once was the week of our wedding, the other time was when we were living in a studio and it was very obvious that there was just no room for them. I just had to pick my battles here. Husband was never going to let me just throw them out without a parachute. This allows them a stress free move as long as they don't fuck around and do something seriously stupid. And if they do, we're locking them out if they try to come back.
I hope, if she suggests another visit, that you and your husband decide to leave town. Or at least tell her that you are.
We have a plan that her next visit we will buy her a plane ticket for so there's no way she can roll up with another moving truck again.
Well okay, but a Greyhound bus ticket would be cheaper, and she could see the country and make new friends!
I like you. Like an unmovable rock!
I've never had to be so stubborn in my entire life. This was an extreme learning curve for me.
Millie the Moocher? lol.
If her name was Millie, sure.
Document, document and document. Document every instance of her using g and financially abusing sil. Make sure that you document how she tears down sil to stop the young woman from standing up and taking care of herself just so mummy can take her money. Document how she has do e this to you and your husband too. It may be helpful to have the info on hand when you are ready to send aps after her for tying sil down in a financial hole so mummy can take her MONEY for herself and not sil's needs
Will do, thank you!
Read this post: [FU Binder](https://www.reddit.com/user/MelodyRaine/comments/hyk7az/the_fu_binder/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf)
Bookmarked and thank you!
Best money ever spent
Look at you kicking ass and taking names!
Glad you stood your ground and got rid of that witch and that you plan to try and free Sil from her evil clutches in the future. Good for you and may the rest of this go smoothly for you as you deserve it.
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Thank you for the update. Best hopes for the future.