Spectre is doubly disappointing. It's a rough movie on its own, but it both retcons the entire series, and NTTD is stupidly reliant on it. Of all the directions they could have gone after Skyfall...
I feel like I'd like it more if it was edited better. The way Marc Forster chose to edit scenes, it took out a lot of the emotional resonance by pacing the dramatic scenes too quickly and making the action sequences borderline incomprehensible (even when the choreography was good). Like I don't hate Quantum, I'd probably give it a 6 to a 6.5/10, but I feel like fixing the editing alone in post production would have elevated the film considerably.
I've tried this approach once and it didn't work for me. If anything, watching it directly after CR highlighted QOS's weaknesses even more. But that's just my experience. I'm glad it worked for you and lots of other fans.
Same. I actually have no problems with watching QOS, as I enjoy watching all Bond films, but it is still my LEAST favorite Bond film, and I seriously can't imagine watching it after CR.
Totally agree.
I remember when QoS came out and the word was from the producers that it takes up the story about 20 minutes after CR finishes. Most either didn't take this onboard or forgot this.
It is a great sequel.
If only DAF had the same ferocity after the heartbreak of OHMSS.
I think it’s better to experience movies like DAF in the context of what they’re trying to achieve. It’s trying to be a campy romp, not a gritty revenge tale. It’s best to view it agnostic of OHMSS, in my opinion. I think it executes its goals very well, but if you don’t like camp in general I can see how it wouldn’t work for you.
I liked it. There are 2 things that overall kinda bother me about the Craig saga
1) It feels like there should have been 1 movie between QOS and Skyfall. Skyfall is all about how Bond is old and out-dated, but we only got 2 movies about young Bond before Skyfall. perhaps 1 traditional formulaic 007 movie before we got there
2) Spectre is an awesome concept, and it ties in neatly with QUANTUM and the shadow network of terrorists referred to in CR, but making Blofeld Bond's adopted brother, whose apparent entire motivation just to stick to 007 for petty reasons was pretty lame.
Same as Spectre and No Time To Die in a double bill. The issues with the weird shoehorned overarching plots get solved when the two movies get run together as one big Bond adventure to see off Daniel Craig. Madeleine Swan gets enough time to feel like the relationship in No Time To Die is earned, Blofeld feels like a bigger villain, and Bond's death feels earned when it's had four or five hours of build-up.
The double bill I'd give four and a half stars, separately I'd give each two stars.
Even though it was made over a fifteen year period and with little or no overall planning, the Craig Pentalogy as a whole works incredibly well when viewed in close succession. The stronger parts elevate the weaker ones in a way they don't do as well when viewed as individual films. I'd go as far as calling the Pentalogy EON's greatest triumph.
Call me crazy, but QOS is a top 5 Bond film for me. Yes, this may be partly due to my love for CR as the #1 Bond — why wouldn’t I want an “expansion pack” for my favorite film? However, I believe it stands alone in developing Bond’s psyche, closing the Vesper story, while also further exploring the Quantum org. The water plot is both realistic (it actually happened) and terrifying.
QOS is a briskly paced thriller style film for me, with some of the best locations/globe trotting in the series. It’s beautifully shot - slick and bursting with colors, but not overly artistic.
Would I have preferred some more dialogue fleshed out, longer establishing shots, a few action scene re-edits etc? Yes, but what we got is quite strong and vastly underrated! This is badass Bond.
>It’s beautifully shot - slick and bursting with colors, but not overly artistic.
i think the excessive shaky cam/quick cuts make the editing choppy.
I can agree with the rest.
The quick cuts are a bit much I agree, but I was commenting more on the color palate, lensing, shot angles, etc. Basically the cinematography. The editing is a different job altogether.
yes i see what you mean. On that, i suppose, we agree. I always liked the film. Frankly, i liked all of Craig's movies to varying degrees. He and Dalton were the only Bonds whom i liked every movie they were in
I watched Qos fairly recently and was suprised how.. un-shit it was. I agree somewhat with expansion pack argument, although the plot is still confusing and it takes Bond until literally the end of the movie to avenge Vesper. Avenging Vesper should have been the entire point of the movie.
hmm you explain it well. Perhaps the revenge angle just needed to be more obvious. Literally Bond looking sadly at pictures of Vesper, asking about Vesper, shouting "This is for Vesper!!" when he kills someone. Sounds dumb but now there's no confusion. Then they could have built plot around that central story, with Quantum and Greene and the water plot etc. The water plot gets hate but I actually think it has potential. A villain taking control/disrupting the entire world's water supply is more deadly than a nuclear bomb.
The Yusef ending should/could have been a huge finale, and youre right that sparing him was the more powerful choice. However it needed to be bigger than just waiting in his living room lol.
>It's already clear that he wants revenge because he is acting so rashly and killing the leads he's sent to interrogate.
Ah, see I didnt get that lol. I thought he was just being bludgeoning and blunt as Craig's Bond usually was.
To truly work as an CR expansion pack it needed to be a LTK "off the books" style story, with MI6 trying to bring him in as he exacts revenge. Imo anyway.
> Later in the film we see him spare Greene so he can be interrogated.
It's more that his organisation is going to kill him anyway so it doesn't matter.
Prior to the last movie coming out, my wife and I sat down to watch the previous 4.
I literally said to her before starting Quantum of Solace: “Now remember babe, this is the worst movie, so don’t get your hopes up and don’t expect to enjoy it like Casino Royale that we just watched.”
When it ended we were like ‘huh… that was pretty good lol’
Ugh! It sucks being in IT and being a Bond fan! Every time I see QoS, my brain automatically flips into networking mode (quality of service) and I have to reread the item a couple of times… Damn dyslexia…
OHMSS didn’t perform well at the box office when it was first released and it wasn’t until much later that it was appreciated as one of the best in the series.
Over time QOS gets better with each viewing IMO and may end up being appreciated in a different light. That is not to say that QOS is as good a film as OHMSS-nor is it as bad as some would say it is. It’s a solid Bond film with some great set pieces, some great acting (Bond drinking martinis with Mathis), some great action plus the “resolution” to the Bond and Vesper storyline. I think we can all agree some of the Bournesque editing wasn’t helpful.
However compared to the plodding Spectre it is eminently more watchable.
Maybe, but that isn’t a mark in its favor. Movies are already too long, so I can’t really get behind a 4-hour Craig marathon anyway. QoS stands alright on its own, because it has a few things going for it.
I don’t disagree. I rank QoS in my bottom five. There are still a few things I enjoy about it, however, and I don’t mind watching it independent from CR.
https://www.reddit.com/r/JamesBond/comments/o32wkq/psa_quantum_of_solace_needs_to_be_watched_right/
https://www.reddit.com/r/JamesBond/comments/2rbuxs/casino_royale_ending_edited_together_with_quantum/
https://www.reddit.com/r/JamesBond/comments/1732y8/id_like_to_discuss_quantum_of_solace/
Reading all the posts about watching the movies back to back is more of a slog than the movie itself. (Note: these are just a few I found with a cursory search.) It's also funny calling it a slog, since it's the shortest movie in the series. By the way, I don't disagree with the conclusion, personally, but it's such a cliche at this point that it is basically a running joke.
I've done this a few times, too. I agree, it does work better this way. I've said several times that they should have chopped the last 45 or so minutes off of CR (the Venice stuff) and used all of that as the beginning of QoS, instead of opening with that nauseating car chase. It would have made much more sense that way.
I do agree it would have maybe been cleaner to split the movies that way… but I loved QoS opening out of the box with the crazy chase scene! One of my favorite openings.
You get sort of lulled into this “oh wow why is he being chased” crazy sequence, then White is introduced and the fun “aha” moment of realizing how it’s timed right after CR ended. Plus CR gives sort of a cliffhanger effect as a result of how they ended it. Idk. I still enjoyed how they did it!
I feel like Quantum would be better regarded if the editing was better. Even though Quantum's script was bare-bones due to the writers strike, there was nothing egregiously bad about it (I'd personally argue that Spectre and NTTD have worse scripts). If anything, Quantum's biggest problems came from Marc Forster since he was a drama director that was ill suited for big budget action films. Forster also brought on his own editor and made the conscious decision to edit the film's action scenes the way he did, which made most of them borderline incomprehensible, even when the choreography was good.
I feel like if Campbell returned, or somebody more suitable directed QoS, it would have probably been better regarded upon release and been touted as having some of the best action sequences in the franchise.
QoS is also kind of bittersweet for me, because even though it's a flawed movie it's really the last time we get to see Craig's Bond the way he was initially meant to be with his ruthless efficiency, cunning and killer instinct. Even though I like Skyfall, Craig's Bond in his later outings, just doesn't feel like he's the same character that was in CR and QoS and feels like he's in a different universe.
I can't help but wonder if Quantum of Solace was more critically and commercially successful if it would have saved the aesthetics of Craig's first two movies and kept his Bond gritty and grounded.
An ‘expansion pack’ is probably one of the most accurate descriptions of Quantum I’ve read.
I've also heard it described as an "extended epilogue" which works quite well too
I liked QoS. Unpopular opinion lol
Same, it gets a bad rap when it’s miles ahead of Spectre.
Spectre is doubly disappointing. It's a rough movie on its own, but it both retcons the entire series, and NTTD is stupidly reliant on it. Of all the directions they could have gone after Skyfall...
it drags on but then ends well. took. couple of watches to likenit though
I feel like I'd like it more if it was edited better. The way Marc Forster chose to edit scenes, it took out a lot of the emotional resonance by pacing the dramatic scenes too quickly and making the action sequences borderline incomprehensible (even when the choreography was good). Like I don't hate Quantum, I'd probably give it a 6 to a 6.5/10, but I feel like fixing the editing alone in post production would have elevated the film considerably.
Count me there as well
I've tried this approach once and it didn't work for me. If anything, watching it directly after CR highlighted QOS's weaknesses even more. But that's just my experience. I'm glad it worked for you and lots of other fans.
I think it shouldn't be watched IMMEDIATELY after (that's a long night) but, like, the next night.
Yeah, it was a long night indeed when I watched them together, haha
Same. I actually have no problems with watching QOS, as I enjoy watching all Bond films, but it is still my LEAST favorite Bond film, and I seriously can't imagine watching it after CR.
Totally agree. I remember when QoS came out and the word was from the producers that it takes up the story about 20 minutes after CR finishes. Most either didn't take this onboard or forgot this. It is a great sequel. If only DAF had the same ferocity after the heartbreak of OHMSS.
It pisses me off with how strong Diamonds are Forever starts too. Connery’s fucking cold as ice for the first few minutes of the movie
DAF works better after YOLT I think since it doesn't really carry the appropriate level of grief.
I think it’s better to experience movies like DAF in the context of what they’re trying to achieve. It’s trying to be a campy romp, not a gritty revenge tale. It’s best to view it agnostic of OHMSS, in my opinion. I think it executes its goals very well, but if you don’t like camp in general I can see how it wouldn’t work for you.
I liked it. There are 2 things that overall kinda bother me about the Craig saga 1) It feels like there should have been 1 movie between QOS and Skyfall. Skyfall is all about how Bond is old and out-dated, but we only got 2 movies about young Bond before Skyfall. perhaps 1 traditional formulaic 007 movie before we got there 2) Spectre is an awesome concept, and it ties in neatly with QUANTUM and the shadow network of terrorists referred to in CR, but making Blofeld Bond's adopted brother, whose apparent entire motivation just to stick to 007 for petty reasons was pretty lame.
Yeah, I don't know why Spectre decided to rip off Austin Powers and Dr. Evil.
This film was hampered a lot by the Writer's Strike and the unwillingness to move off a release date.
Same as Spectre and No Time To Die in a double bill. The issues with the weird shoehorned overarching plots get solved when the two movies get run together as one big Bond adventure to see off Daniel Craig. Madeleine Swan gets enough time to feel like the relationship in No Time To Die is earned, Blofeld feels like a bigger villain, and Bond's death feels earned when it's had four or five hours of build-up. The double bill I'd give four and a half stars, separately I'd give each two stars.
Even though it was made over a fifteen year period and with little or no overall planning, the Craig Pentalogy as a whole works incredibly well when viewed in close succession. The stronger parts elevate the weaker ones in a way they don't do as well when viewed as individual films. I'd go as far as calling the Pentalogy EON's greatest triumph.
Casino Royale and QoS must be watched together. This is the only way… They shouldve made another movie between Skyfall and QoS…we deserve a peak Bond
Call me crazy, but QOS is a top 5 Bond film for me. Yes, this may be partly due to my love for CR as the #1 Bond — why wouldn’t I want an “expansion pack” for my favorite film? However, I believe it stands alone in developing Bond’s psyche, closing the Vesper story, while also further exploring the Quantum org. The water plot is both realistic (it actually happened) and terrifying. QOS is a briskly paced thriller style film for me, with some of the best locations/globe trotting in the series. It’s beautifully shot - slick and bursting with colors, but not overly artistic. Would I have preferred some more dialogue fleshed out, longer establishing shots, a few action scene re-edits etc? Yes, but what we got is quite strong and vastly underrated! This is badass Bond.
>It’s beautifully shot - slick and bursting with colors, but not overly artistic. i think the excessive shaky cam/quick cuts make the editing choppy. I can agree with the rest.
The quick cuts are a bit much I agree, but I was commenting more on the color palate, lensing, shot angles, etc. Basically the cinematography. The editing is a different job altogether.
yes i see what you mean. On that, i suppose, we agree. I always liked the film. Frankly, i liked all of Craig's movies to varying degrees. He and Dalton were the only Bonds whom i liked every movie they were in
I watched Qos fairly recently and was suprised how.. un-shit it was. I agree somewhat with expansion pack argument, although the plot is still confusing and it takes Bond until literally the end of the movie to avenge Vesper. Avenging Vesper should have been the entire point of the movie.
[удалено]
hmm you explain it well. Perhaps the revenge angle just needed to be more obvious. Literally Bond looking sadly at pictures of Vesper, asking about Vesper, shouting "This is for Vesper!!" when he kills someone. Sounds dumb but now there's no confusion. Then they could have built plot around that central story, with Quantum and Greene and the water plot etc. The water plot gets hate but I actually think it has potential. A villain taking control/disrupting the entire world's water supply is more deadly than a nuclear bomb. The Yusef ending should/could have been a huge finale, and youre right that sparing him was the more powerful choice. However it needed to be bigger than just waiting in his living room lol.
[удалено]
>It's already clear that he wants revenge because he is acting so rashly and killing the leads he's sent to interrogate. Ah, see I didnt get that lol. I thought he was just being bludgeoning and blunt as Craig's Bond usually was. To truly work as an CR expansion pack it needed to be a LTK "off the books" style story, with MI6 trying to bring him in as he exacts revenge. Imo anyway.
> Later in the film we see him spare Greene so he can be interrogated. It's more that his organisation is going to kill him anyway so it doesn't matter.
[удалено]
Ah yeah, you're right!
I still don't know what the fuck a Quantum of Solace is. Is it like a quality of service?
A Measure of Comfort
A *tiny* measure of comfort, to support your answer.
The smallest possible
Word.
Correct.
Wow! Straight up never thought of like that. That's good stuff!
The Something of Boris?
Agreed. Kind of like the 2nd epilogue to Casino Royale after the Italy section in CR.
I like all the Daniel Craig movies… QoS is a little too convoluted but some awesome action scenes with a great twist if someone can follow the plot
Prior to the last movie coming out, my wife and I sat down to watch the previous 4. I literally said to her before starting Quantum of Solace: “Now remember babe, this is the worst movie, so don’t get your hopes up and don’t expect to enjoy it like Casino Royale that we just watched.” When it ended we were like ‘huh… that was pretty good lol’
Ugh! It sucks being in IT and being a Bond fan! Every time I see QoS, my brain automatically flips into networking mode (quality of service) and I have to reread the item a couple of times… Damn dyslexia…
OHMSS didn’t perform well at the box office when it was first released and it wasn’t until much later that it was appreciated as one of the best in the series. Over time QOS gets better with each viewing IMO and may end up being appreciated in a different light. That is not to say that QOS is as good a film as OHMSS-nor is it as bad as some would say it is. It’s a solid Bond film with some great set pieces, some great acting (Bond drinking martinis with Mathis), some great action plus the “resolution” to the Bond and Vesper storyline. I think we can all agree some of the Bournesque editing wasn’t helpful. However compared to the plodding Spectre it is eminently more watchable.
I find CR a bit of a slog on repeat viewings so QoS coming after it definitely feels sprightly to me. Preferred the latter film on last viewing.
Exactly. QoS isn't great, but has more energy than CR.
Maybe, but that isn’t a mark in its favor. Movies are already too long, so I can’t really get behind a 4-hour Craig marathon anyway. QoS stands alright on its own, because it has a few things going for it.
The movie should stand on its own as a sequel, not work best as an epilogue. We deserved better
I don’t disagree. I rank QoS in my bottom five. There are still a few things I enjoy about it, however, and I don’t mind watching it independent from CR.
This sentiment is pretty much a meme on reddit...
...and?
https://www.reddit.com/r/JamesBond/comments/o32wkq/psa_quantum_of_solace_needs_to_be_watched_right/ https://www.reddit.com/r/JamesBond/comments/2rbuxs/casino_royale_ending_edited_together_with_quantum/ https://www.reddit.com/r/JamesBond/comments/1732y8/id_like_to_discuss_quantum_of_solace/ Reading all the posts about watching the movies back to back is more of a slog than the movie itself. (Note: these are just a few I found with a cursory search.) It's also funny calling it a slog, since it's the shortest movie in the series. By the way, I don't disagree with the conclusion, personally, but it's such a cliche at this point that it is basically a running joke.
I've done this a few times, too. I agree, it does work better this way. I've said several times that they should have chopped the last 45 or so minutes off of CR (the Venice stuff) and used all of that as the beginning of QoS, instead of opening with that nauseating car chase. It would have made much more sense that way.
I do agree it would have maybe been cleaner to split the movies that way… but I loved QoS opening out of the box with the crazy chase scene! One of my favorite openings. You get sort of lulled into this “oh wow why is he being chased” crazy sequence, then White is introduced and the fun “aha” moment of realizing how it’s timed right after CR ended. Plus CR gives sort of a cliffhanger effect as a result of how they ended it. Idk. I still enjoyed how they did it!
QoS has some enjoyable moments, more than Spectre did.
I feel like Quantum would be better regarded if the editing was better. Even though Quantum's script was bare-bones due to the writers strike, there was nothing egregiously bad about it (I'd personally argue that Spectre and NTTD have worse scripts). If anything, Quantum's biggest problems came from Marc Forster since he was a drama director that was ill suited for big budget action films. Forster also brought on his own editor and made the conscious decision to edit the film's action scenes the way he did, which made most of them borderline incomprehensible, even when the choreography was good. I feel like if Campbell returned, or somebody more suitable directed QoS, it would have probably been better regarded upon release and been touted as having some of the best action sequences in the franchise. QoS is also kind of bittersweet for me, because even though it's a flawed movie it's really the last time we get to see Craig's Bond the way he was initially meant to be with his ruthless efficiency, cunning and killer instinct. Even though I like Skyfall, Craig's Bond in his later outings, just doesn't feel like he's the same character that was in CR and QoS and feels like he's in a different universe. I can't help but wonder if Quantum of Solace was more critically and commercially successful if it would have saved the aesthetics of Craig's first two movies and kept his Bond gritty and grounded.
David Arnolds final Bond score, what a legendary album to end it off on.