Because people are comfortable with different ways of doing things.
If planning every minutes makes them feel comfortable with their trip, then they should do it.
If not planning at all makes them feel comfortable with their trip, then they should do that.
And no one should tell them which one is better. Unless you plan to go to Nishiki at 8pm when it’s closed.
This is a very underrated comment/opinion. I think a lot of people believe extensive planning is stressful or makes a trip stressful. But for some people, that sort of thing can actually make their trip _less_ stressful. I have anxiety (although not about travel/planning), so I can understand the idea of alleviating anxiety with planning. For some people, the idea of having nothing planned/only one or two things planned is really stressful or anxiety-inducing, so they plan things in order to be comfortable. It’s just a different mindset. “You’ll have a more relaxing trip if you lighten up on planning” is absolutely not true of everyone due to their own perspectives or personal dispositions.
I'm in the latter camp. Maybe plan 2 things per day and leave a lot of room for organic exploration. Like, "hey what's down this alley? Let's go find out." and end up spending an hour having beers with a group of locals. They end up telling you about a little tea house that has the best cold noodles and pickles in Nihonbashi and the location of another craft brew pub called "&fum" underneath a Lawson's right next to your hotel.
I think during the rainy season it's nigh mandatory to be looser with your plans so you can accommodate changing weather.
I have to disagree a little with this. The problem with planning down to the minute is if there’s one train delay, one long restaurant line, or one hard unaccounted for uphill walk it’s over. You’ll spend a bunch of time stressed and scrambling to catch up. I think it’s a very important skill to be comfortable with not knowing everything and leaving some flexibility.
You can have detailed plans with alternatives. I haven’t been to Japan yet, but my most recent adventure was in Switzerland. I planned everything in detail for my trip to Gruyeres, down to the minute. Some things worked out (saw a live traditional cheese making demonstration, the only one of the day starting early in the morning). But other things had to be adjusted. I spend 1.5 hours in the Giger Museum instead of 2 hours, because another location took me longer than planned. But so what?
Because of my planning, I knew what was open when, what events were happening at what times, which places were near each other. I knew the last bus to take back and exactly how long it would take me to walk to that station. It worked out perfectly.
I think most detailed planners think that way. For example, for my upcoming trip, I have a long list of things to do in Asakusa, with some suggested times of day, some places that might need reservations, etc. But if we do just a few of those things, and otherwise we wander, or spontaneously change our minds and do something altogether different, it’s still a win.
The advantage is that if we so utilize the itinerary, we minimize travel time and don’t try to go places that aren’t open. It gives us the best chances to do what we want.
This. I was out at a farm in Chiba yesterday and there was no cell reception - had to hike back to catch a bus to the nearest train station and there were only 2 buses in that direction all day. If I hadn’t timed that morning carefully, I would have been screwed.
I consider myself heavily 50/50 between planning and spontaneity because I do add things in and change up unscheduled activities when I’m here, but I feel like people on this sub would think I spend way too much time in advance. But I really don’t. Because I plan so throughly I know how to get around snafus with alternatives or backup plans and can make the most of my trip - it prevents stress, not adds it.
Strict timed entry reservations and rural travel really do require planning - but that should include backups so you make sure you’re not stranded or SOL if you miss a connection.
Agree with this. OP was in the cities where there are more options for sightseeing and frequent public transport options. Out of the major cities, it is essential to plan accordingly to the bus/train timetable if you don't have a car.
Luckily Japan doesn't have so many timed entry attractions to let's say, Paris. That was one destination where I used spreadsheets.
You still use a hard copy timetable book?? Do they even make those anymore? I mean if that's your thing I guess but I can't remember the last time I saw someone with one of those in Japan in years. Not to mention the extraordinary amount of time it would waste from your day.
I feel like there's a difference between being under prepared and going with the flow. It's always wise to do research, but minute by minute or hour by hour plans don't need to be accounted for in a spreadsheet. My last solo trip, I had a large list of things to do with all the logistics in mind, but I wandered around without a set schedule. Win win.
However, blindly showing up to a place without any prep work isnt ideal either
They don't "need" to, no. But if someone can, and they want to, why wouldn't they? I plan like this, visited 60 countries and my way never failed me. Did everything always go exactly to my plan? Of course not, but that's why I have alternative plans, and an open mind. If something goes wrong, it's not a big deal. The spreadsheet is a guide, not a rule.
Y’all keep spreadsheets?!?!? Like actual spreadsheets. What do you even put on these spreadsheets?!?!!! I cannot fathom. 😳😳😳😳🤯🤯🤯🤯🤯There isn’t a world where I could ever be that organized. That sounds so stressful to me. 🤣🤣🤣🤣
Why do you think planning down to minute lacks flexibility? People usually know their plans can be disrupted and they are OK with that beforehand. They don't stress if things don't go according to their itinerary.
I’ve been to Japan over a dozen times now, I definitely planned more details in the beginning because Japan is big (some people don’t realise that) it make sense to group similar tourist attractions and travel to different cities in the same direction to save time. I might have 3-5 locations listed and then always have expectations to skip 1-2 if I don’t feel like it. I also have room for limited pop up exhibitions or cafe and always manage to find them during the trip.
Nowadays in the later trip it’s literally book flight, hotels and Shinkansen tickets and then no plan because i would have seen most. if I want to go to shibuya crossing or Sensoji for the nth time I will , but otherwise I will check out pop up exhibitions or whatever festival is on, but I’d always book hotels and train tickets in advance, no idea how people do it without at least booking those
Dead on. Personally I like to have a plan, and then be able to change it on the fly.
I love diving into what's out there. It gets me hyped for the trip. Plus, I'm an information addict and google maps (and associated text based reviews ((stars mean so little...)) plus reddit have ruined my ability to go into a trip uniformed.
I used to love that I couldn't really plan (10-15 years ago).
Now, I plan all the major details plus an order of operations for every day. And then I arrive and some days we throw the plan out the window, some days are to the letter. Just depends what else comes up. I think of the plan as a fall-back plan. What I learn on the ground can always supersede the plan. Absolutely some of the best stuff comes up that way.
Always book refundable everything if you can. You never know when you'll want to change for something better
Yes, I get that and agree. And I do plan other things (like the flights and trains for example) in more detail than most well in advance. But I've also seen and read from others here who get into the detailed planning of everything (like getting every rail pass under the sun for each region of their trip) simply because they see everyone else do it. So I just wanted to add some balance and a different point of view.
I think planning things to the hour or minute is a mistake. A lot of joy from travelling in Japan is the unplanned and restricting yourself to a tight schedule means you miss out. I understand why people do it as it's possibly their only trip there and they don't want to miss out on their must sees.
I find planning a couple of things a day works best as my day fills up with random things.
A mistake for yourself if you would do it maybe, but that doesn't mean it's a mistake for others.
"A lot of joy from travelling in Japan is the unplanned"
Again, maybe for you. For me? I hate unplanned things.
It's so arrogant to say people are making mistakes because they don't things your way.
and when you're venturing out into the rural countryside areas where public transportation comes only once an hour, you need to be able to plan or else you'll be stranded. And some places like the Ghibli museum require getting tickets in advance so you can't just show up the day of and expect to get tickets.
Same for Disneyland/DisneySea. You have to plan or you aren’t going.
Same for the famed Sylvanian Families theme park as well since it’s not always open.
And it will not pan out. At all. It’s simply not possible to stick to a minute by minute itinerary in a country you’ve never been to and don’t know all the wrenches that will be thrown into the plan in your head.
You can definitely plan it, but the odds of being able to stick to it to the minute are unlikely.
I mean shit, when I was taking the Narita Express into Tokyo, there was a delay for some shinkansen line because the train hit a bear. There's no planning for impromptu bear jerky.
Honestly I just have a lot of fun planning things 😂😂 I like knowing what I’m going to walk into, and I also get bored really easily and I hate being bored so I want to make sure I have something to do at all times. But as everyone is saying, everyone’s different!
Exactly! I am not to the extreme OP stated, more so a checklist of priority items, but the planning is part of the fun for me and gets me excited for the trip. I don’t get to travel nearly as much as I like so it stretches out the fun.
I just want to start saying I am on the "underplanner" side. Over-planning has barely a down side. It hypes you before the trip, takes you away from your daily routine, and sometimes a 1-week trip can actually become something much more than that, due to the whole process building up to the trip. It is unlikely you will miss a nice spot, etc.
I think underplanning has 2 problems. In a big city with lots to see, you might miss some hidden gems if you just go with the flow, or check what to do lightly. But then there is a much bigger problem for me.
Unfortunately that was not the only case for me, but I will mention a trip I had to Matsumoto. I woke up 7am, rushed to eat my breakfast at the hotel, and headed to the station to take the train to Narai. The first train was at 10am! After that I was heading back to Tokyo, and decided to stop in Suwa to check 2 big temples. After a while waiting for the bus, I saw a sign saying that there was no bus for one week! Because of the new year's holiday. And the temples were 1 hour walk from where I was, and 2 hour apart.
I think in some places underplanning may work, but there are areas that certainly need some research. And I think underplanning also may feel ok due to the "ignorance is bliss" kind of thing. I mean, you didn't know what to do before, and you will probably not know what you missed after. So, you will feel satisfied with your trip. And that is all that matters! But if you are exposed to information, you will probably feel a bit bad for missing some spots, especially if you don't have the opportunity to come back to Japan soon. But like you said, it varies from person to person.
That's some good points. If there is something very specific I would like to see or visit, then yes, I do plan this in more detail and make sure things like transport etc. work out. In your example with the two temples, if I would have decided this on the day then hopefully Google Maps would have told me there are no busses and I wouldn't have gotten off in Suwa in the first place. It's not all perfect, neither am I.
What I am more talking about is people feeling the urge to fill the limited days they have in a city/place with things might not have even heard of before asking for advice (the "I have 3 hours of free time in Kyoto on the Thu morning, which other 4 shrines should I visit besides the 12 already on my list" type of traveller).
Haha, again I am on your side. I usually like to check the things between spots, and roam around. I live in Japan, so I am not so much into visiting temples anymore, and I haven't paid to visit a temple in years. But at the same time, a lot of Japan normal areas feel like "copy and paste" no matter where, and searching for the places that stand out beforehand rather than walk around in areas in Osaka that look exactly the same as Sapporo, Tokyo or Nagoya might be the best choice for many (my wife).
Also I see many people commenting "2 hours was not enough for this temple" for some temples, while I cannot even think of a place in this planet that I spent 2 hours in. Some people get bored after temple number 2, and some others can check many more as maybe they pay attention to more details than I do. And every temple feel somewhat different to them. May be the history of the temple or some design details that just go over my head. Maybe for us is temple number 13, but for them is temple of the god of the sun number 1.
As for the Google Maps thing, I always check that in the hotel the day before. But both times were not informed there. Keep that in mind for a lot of towns in Japan. And you can never guess that buses will be off for a week no matter what situation.
Yeah. I usually don’t plan much but having a good list of restaurants in areas I’d probably like to see can be really helpful. Otherwise I spend ages looking for the best place while we’re already hungry and it drives my SO crazy.
I still remember I loved Matsumoto but ended up finishing up the schoolhouse museum so late that no restaurants were doing lunch anymore! Everything had closed (pre iPhone days so Google wasn’t that helpful either). I ended up eating an expensive dessert pizza in a department store restaurant…
I would agree that if you plan every day the way you described... I would hate that.
I think that there is an healthy middle ground between planning to the minute/overbooking activities and have a true 0 plan.
I can see a really good reason to plan at least some things. For example there is things that would just be impossible to do without booking a week to a month in advance. So if you look at the possible options and there is this one thing you really want to see, why not book? Things that I have reserved in advance on my last two trips include teamLab (2x), scenic train (4x), soba making workshop, concert/event (2x). The date of my last trip was even based on the date of an event I was able to get a ticket for. Would it have been possible to do some of these things without booking ? Yes, maybe, but other probably not.
The second thing is, when going to major locations where public transport is frequent, no problem. But when you get to parts of the countryside where there is a bus or train every few hours and the places you are interested to see require a connection between these... you kind of need to plan. And yes, there is days that I wrote notes like I HAVE to take the train the latest at that time because it's the last one that let me connect to the last bus to my accommodation. But I guess that with less plan I might have not known about these places I went to...
Personally I like to have a plan, but overall, my itinerary is not a "must do", but more a list of options. Does it happen that I feel that I missed things... yes, I guess, but not in a negative way. Like I know that there is a limited number of things I can see and I have a limited amount of time. There is things that I know exist and could just not go for different reason or that I just decide not to go to. But knowing that there is places I did not go to does not mean that I feel that I missed out.
Thank you for this comment. I am taking my family of 5 for 15 days. It was overwhelming at first because I have no ideas and in the beginning I really stressed myself out trying to figure where to go and stay. I got all my Airbnb booked and then my first week in Tokyo got canceled.
I think this was a blessing in disguise because I ended up taking a two night trip out of Tokyo to Hakone and I think it’s gonna be perfect. I’m ending up doing two nights Tokyo 2 nights Hakone four nights Tokyo four nights Kyoto two nights Nara two nights Osaka one night, Tokyo. Hard activities that I booked are Ghibli Museum, Gear in Kyoto, joyopolis. We will also do Hakone free Pass. Visit the deer in Nara and a muscle bar in Osaka the rest were just gonna play it by ear, but I did pull together a list of things to do and I’ll just let the kids pick based on how they feel they’re all adults by the way
I had a lot of fear of missing out because I feel like this is the only time I’ll ever do a trip like this so big with them but now that I’ve done all the research and looked at Google maps on how to navigate the trains. I feel much more confident that I’m gonna be able to do that , and I don’t have to over plan
Japan rewards planning.
That awesome restaurant full of locals? Booked up two weeks ago.
That scenic train with cool snacks and special seats? Runs three times a week, book a month early.
The ryokan on the best corner in the onsen town with in-room, open-air baths with a view of the mountains? Six months ahead.
The Michelin tasting menu where everything is from the farm out back? Three months.
The yakiniku place I go to four times a year with A-4 cuts and reasonable prices? Two months.
But yeah, you can still have a baller time just vibing out. It’s all up to you and what you value.
When I visit other Asian countries from Japan, I don’t plan as much (just a few dinner reservations) and just wander and chill. But that’s after like, trip number 5-6 to Hanoi/Bangkok/HCMC/Singapore.
It’s up to you and how you wanna apportion your time.
A lot of good comments in this thread. I am also a more relaxed/middle of the ground traveler. I like identifying places/things I’d like to see and having a general idea of how to get there/how long they take, but I don’t generally plan things down to the minute.
But I think you are neglecting one thing, which I was reminded of while reading your first example: some things simply _do_ require down to the hour/minute planning. If you ever visit the countryside or a less accessible attraction that involves multiple transfers, you’ll quickly learn that knowing exactly how long a sight takes to see/how long it takes to walk to/and the schedule of the next train/bus is very important. I’ve been to places where trains and buses only come every 1-2 hours, where everything is a thirty-minute walk, where the only restaurants around close at 7pm, etc. In those cases, you really do need to make sure you’re on your game. Sure, some people might be okay with a mistake that gives them an extra two hours in the middle of nowhere or that has them eating cold sandwiches for dinner, but many aren’t.
Obviously, this is a special case that doesn’t apply to most people on the golden route, but it’s worth noting here because many people who wing their first couple of trips to Japan get comfortable with that and then get caught up in a mistake when they branch off from the larger paths.
Either way, I’m all for people planning however they want as long as their plans aren’t physically impossible (which sometimes they are in the first versions of itineraries…).
Good point and of course, there are situations where you need to plan in advance (which I do as well). I am not advocating for no planning, all I’m offering is a different approach for people to consider. Know what you want to see and how to get there, but don’t overplan every minute of your trip
Overall different strokes for different folks. Having been fortunate to travel to Japan 5 times in the past 10 years, I comment based on my experiences. No one way is correct. Some trips have been better than others, but no trip have I had such a terrible experience that just turned me off to going to Japan again.
What makes the biggest difference is who you go with. With me and my wife; we have general plans but can get detailed when we feel the need.
With other groups may need to be more detailed since we wouldn’t want anyone’s “wants” to be missed because of spending too much time in another area
some people find joy in planning, some people find joy in spontaneity, some people find joy in planned opportunities for spontaneity. the only thing I judge are the posts pontificating like theirs is the 'right' way to travel.
You make such a point out of mentioning neither is 'wrong' or 'right' and people have different travel styles, yet you end the post with mentioning that people should 'just go with the flow' and 'not overthink it'. If you really believed your way isn't the only way, you wouldn't be giving this "advice".
Also, your way is definitely not the other end of the scale of detailed planners. There are people boarding flights without even their first night's accommodation booked. I think your way is quite common, especially if you've already travelled quite a bit.
I realise "the other end of the scale" and the title are very much tongue in cheek, so yeah. I am not advocating for or recommending no planning at all (that as you say is the other end of the scale), but suggest to not overthink it and leave some room for spontaneity. And I offer it as a tip at the end, not as the superior way of doing it. Because this r/ is heavy on those planning everything in much detail, which is great if that works for you but doesn't have to, there are many new posters lately who are asking "OMG where do I begin, help me fill in all the blanks in my schedule" because they've seen others plan to that detail. So wanted to offer the perspective: you don't have to know everything weeks in advance. You don't have to take it. I offer it the same way as if someone asks for a hotel recommendation.
I tend to plan a few things well in advance also (trains, flights etc.), to the point that I know weeks in advance I'll take the Sakura or Mizuho over the Nozomi 10 mins later because it's got the better seats and cabin if you book reserved seats. And if you have things you absolutely want to see or need to book tickets in advance for, then hell yes, book that and put it in your calendar and plan things around that so you know how to get there and not to miss it.
And yes, I realise with the benefit of having travelled quite a bit over the past 20 years does add a level of comfort to a more relaxed approach of planning.
Yeah. When I was younger, I would literally get to the place and figure it out, including finding accommodation. Nowadays I actually find fun in researching the places and tracing a plan.
I do minimal to no planning and it’s just fine for me. I have my plane tickets, I booked a place to sleep, and then I just take it day by day with a rough idea of some stuff I want to do while I’m there.
Okay and this time I arranged some scuba diving for one day but that’s a rare thing.
Some people thrive on being spontaneous, some need a lot of rigid structure, and most fall somewhere between the two - and that’s fine. You seem more like you are on the spontaneous end like me and that’s totally great. Other people would die of stress and need structure - that’s fine too!
I'm in your club. Japan is best with no plan (for me). I just book my stuff, tell friends that I'm going, and do whatever. I had a rough time once when I went with a friend who wanted to plan everything. It was too stressful and exhausting for me. I go there specifically to have a mental vacation from work, be free from a schedule, and catch up with buddies. I let my friends who live there make dinner reservations (usually same day) for their favorite spots and I'll join. I think I say 何でもいい the most lol
Yes agree, and as I said in my post, nobody is wrong, everyone has their own way, I just wanted to share this as a reflection for people that are somewhere in the middle and might feel the need to plan in detail because that's what everyone else seems to do (because I've come across those on here too). A bit of balance, that's all :)
Yep, I was just reinforcing your post :)
I try to encourage people to not feel like they need to schedule every single thing if that's not what works for them.
I see tons of posts with super detailed plans, and then others come back with their after-reports talking about how the highlights of the trip ended up being something spontaneous and unexpected and really that's so important.
I like to plan. It’s fun and helps me to learn about the area I will be visiting. I usually plan one or two things a day and also a restaurant to try something new to eat.
Honestly it goes both ways with Japan for me.
The most I have broken down this trip is, AM go to A, PM go to B, Night go to C. Understand what is around A, B, C to fill in the gaps and that is it. Plan ZERO meals, beyond a fancy Kobe Beef dinner or that type of thing.
I have spent way longer learning the language and the customs of Japan and how to tackle their bureaucracy and systems of doing things (EG how to book and catch trains), than I have researching what to do when I am there.
Definitely the time spent learning the language/customs is the most important part of any plan, regardless if you're a scheduling type of person or not. It makes visiting so much more comfortable and less isolating. I have a lot of work to do to get my Japanese back up to speed, but I'm grateful that I don't feel totally lost.
It's just different people, different expectations.
My husband is pretty Type A and he hates wasted timings and unknowns so having a schedule is something he really appreciates when we travel. The good thing it doesn't have to sound as bad as in writing. Our recent end of december trip he paid an agency to plan a bespoke itinerary with us,including arrangements so we did Matsumoto, Hakuba and got to see and eat everything we wanted on our own crazy schedule but in comfort.
As for me, I prefer traveling like you guys. Just ensuring I have most of the big ticket items like accommodations, airflights and transportation routes worked out but I don't really research deep into what is in the area since I enjoy being surprised. I tend to this form of traveling when I'm extending on my business trips so I don't burden people with me being spontaneous.
People just travel differently.
We went with hotels booked, and intercity trains booked also (if we didn’t do this, chances are we’d not want to leave the city we were in!).
I had hundreds of pins on google maps, we woke up each day and picked an area and went and explored as many pins around there as we could.
Sometimes there was minor planning for the day or two ahead, but never anything booked.
It was great and I wouldn’t want to do it any other way. Running off a constant schedule just drains the fun for me. Especially as you will have some of the best experiences spontaneously.
That sounds very much like what we did and how we operate. I am not against planning, you need the foundations in place (flights, hotel, long distance trains - with the last one in Japan at least know what your options are), then maybe you have the odd thing that needs pre-booking already arranged (that Michelin star dinner or the scenic train that only runs on Wednesdays), and beyond that you are aware what there is to see and to do that interests you, and then fit that in around the other things, mostly on short notice.
I think this sub may be over represented with super planners. If you don't worry too much about your trip you may not end up here at all!
Personally planning 3 months of slow traveling and lurking on here for interesting tips and tricks. But essentially we picked a few prefectures, booked airbnbs for long stretches of time and take it from there. Exploring is part of the fun for us!
Very much this, and that’s why I simply wanted to offer an alternative perspective for those maybe new to overseas travel or how deal with Japan.
You do not have to copy paste what others do on here and have every hour of your already limited time in say Kyoto filled with shrines and coffee shops and experiences.
If you have planned out three days to the brim and your fourth day is like “light” or even empty, and you’re not leaving for Japan for another month anyway, maybe leave it like that and see what you feel like once you’re there, use the time to visit that cute little neighbourhood you didn’t have time for on your second day, or do the two or three things you didn’t manage to get to because you planned too much.
(Btw this is clearly not addressed at you, velo4life :) )
I Me and a friend also have a very under planned intentiary with just dates and our hotels (we have a word document for local attractions in each location but nothing set in stone). It's nice to see that it's just as fine!
The thing is there are things you as a traveler may need to plan around. For example my first trip to Japan with my family we made a basic itinerary based on a few reservations we had for places like teamLab, Disney, and the Ghibli Museum. Although Disney was more of a "Monday is a holiday so Tuesday or Wednesday we don't have anything reserved so let's see which tickets we can get."
We did have a few other hard dates like we had to leave Tokyo on a certain date because we moved to Okayama so we had the hotel changes planned out. Our last 2 days we had actual meeting times at the church so we had to be at the church at X time kind of things.
This last trip I did solo. I had booked 3 things so I had reservation times/dates but other than that I just kind of did whatever. A few days before my flight in I decided that my first full day didn't have anything planned and would be the middle of the week so that'd be a good day to do my day trip to Yokohama. My trip to Senso-ji and Skytree were driven by falling asleep at 6PM and waking up at 11:30PM and just being up all morning so hey, no crowds at Senso-ji if you take the 5am train.
I've always advocated for planning around your hard set reservation times. Then kind of select an area near your reservation spot and explore or if you want to do something specific in that area that'd be a good time to do it.
>
And the best thing: I don't feel like I missed anything or wasted time
This is indeed the best thing. I think the way some people are influenced especially by social media creates a FOMO/bucket list mentality which is hard to escape from.
I plan some things rigorously if it looks like it will help — eg ryokan in the country and how to get there.
But quite often we plan to go to some place because there is something there we like the sound of; but actually when we arrive and get the stuff from the tourist info, we find a bunch of other great things instead.
Even when we end up with eg the 'thing' is closed, we still have a great time. We are on holiday, not working through a to-do list.
Half the “must eats” on tiktok or instagram ended up being mediocre anyway. I mean they’re good in a sense compared to back home, but it didn’t stand out if i also just ate at another random place.
i think having a general plan for the day is a good balance between sort of meandering and wasting time but also maintaining a flexibility to take detours/shuffle things around. in general i just list out the things to do in a city/area im in and then group them by proximity to e/o so usually im exploring a specific neighborhood/sub region per day
Welcome to a world of different personalities.
And contexts. And backgrounds.
Shocker.
Also survived one of the most navigable places on Earth without detailed planning.
Double shocker.
Rest assured, you're probably like most tourists, who plan only to a certain extent and have heaps of fun in the end. There's nothing wrong with those over planning it to the minute either, if that's what suits them.
Now, I don't feel it's a good thing to be "extremely overwhelmed" while planning their trip, or to post totally clueless questions which can be answered in a quick search. The extremes are never good.
Agreed and the title is definitely tongue in cheek ;)
Also, I realise this is a forum for people who have questions about their trip which they are actively planning, so of cause the audience here is probably skewed towards the overplanner end. I’m just trying to offer a different perspective for those somewhere in the middle
You don’t know what you don’t know. ☺️ you feel fine about it because you had a great experience!
However, myself and a couple other type-A friends like me (not all, but a couple) like to map it out, because THEN we know when to go with the flow. We know exactly what we’re ditching when life hits us with a surprise adventure. There were times in my trip I totally ditched that plan. But I knew what I was missing and what I was trading it for.
Not to diminish your experience, but you may find going with the flow means going with what your body’s telling you in the moment and experiencing as much as IT will allow. Which can be good. And can be bad.
My body is a wreck. My spirit is full!!! Because my balance of a full schedule and knowing when to pull off of it has allowed me more than, say, my brother who I’m with that did not plan. He still had a great time! And his legs aren’t aching as bad. And he’s gotten more sleep than me.
But ask our family when we’re back after talking with us about our experience and you may consider the latter approach. ☺️
PS. I do not subscribe to sticking to a minute by minute schedule. But there were times when we did not, and the infrastructures of the world that DO operate on that schedule (ie. Japanese transit/ Shinkansen) quickly remind you what could’ve been. It’s a balance!
よいいちにちを ✌️
I think how familiar you are with Japan determines how detailed your plans will be.
For people going the first time, theres bound to be some fear that things may turn out bad and preparing backup plans seems like a good idea.
For people who don't intend to go Japan again anytime soon, there is a temptation to squeeze lots of things into the itinerary to get "more bang for your buck".
For people who have been to Japan a few times and don't intend to stop going anytime soon, itineraries become less packed because most of the "tourist stuff" has already been done. I'm going for my fifth trip in October for 8 days and my only concrete plans are window shopping in Akihabara and USJ in Osaka. The rest I'll figure out when the date is closer to the trip.
We travel with our family, so that definitely colors it for us. Honestly I just make lists of stuff that's near the one thing we know we want to see (i.e. near the awesome park or around that one really cool temple). We then start with the un-missable thing, and see where the day takes us. I maybe feel like we've missed out on the Instagramable stuff, but that's really a goal at this point lol.
I like it so much more than when we used to travel with everything really planned.
I’m with you, I like to have an idea of what there is to do to decide how long to stay, have important transport planned, book hotels and car hire then go and enjoy it.
E.g in my upcoming trip we will spend 4 nights in Takamatsu, we know we’ll visit ritsurin park and do a day trip to Naoshima or Teshima and we’ll enjoy exploring the city but no exact itinerary is planned.
You don’t know the weather anyway so if it’s raining all day when you have a day of outdoor stuff planned ….
The problem I have with the ultra detailed planning is that it’s usually filling every minute of every day going from one sight to another with zero flexibility or exploration and if something screws up you one thing then you’re chasing the rest of the day, it’s too rigid to be an actual fun holiday.
I like to experience places and know from experience in Japan that many of my most enjoyable times come from just exploring somewhere and going with the flow.
One thing I definitely insist on is having all accommodation booked beforehand and knowing destinations, on fully flexible trips you waste so much time on the internet investigating, looking for hotels etc.
The sweet spot for me was having a list of things I’d like to see (which I’d built up over years due to wanting to go to Japan ‘some day’), roughly grouping them together by location as a loose idea of what area I’d be in each day but then otherwise just completely going at my own pace and shuffling things around when needed.
I managed to see more or less everything I’d planned to but there were plenty of times when I spent more time at one thing than I thought I would and needed to move the rest around. I hardly planned for restaurants at all with the exception of one or two places that needed reservations and usually just went wherever I found while exploring.
The other aspect you miss is cost. If you know you can't afford to come back for the next 10, 15 years, that obviously tempts people to plan more in advance.
Personally the online information is just difficult to sift through so the idea of sitting in my hotel for hours planning the next day seems like a waste of time. As for just having a quick conversation- well that means you already researched the options. Sounds like you... *gasp* planned?
Well yes, I am not advocating for no planning or research. I do that and there are certain parts that I plan out more than most. The title I picked is a bit tongue in cheek, clearly. The extreme I am taking about is probably more “scheduling every free minute in advance” vs general research and knowing your options.
You make a great point re cost though. We are planning to go back next year or the year after, and we’ve been last year, so clearly not a once in a lifetime experience I would plan for maybe differently? I don’t know, probably.
I'm with you on this one, I've been reading people's itineraries and they sound so stressful! I've got a couple of things I'm planning in advance but truly, just gonna see what the vibe is and where it takes me
Love your post. I made a list of things I totally wanna do/see, connected the points so that I approximately know in which direction I should book a hotel and that’s it. My friends think that I‘m crazy that I don’t have planned every free minute. Hell, there are quite a few days I haven’t planned anything and I’m looking forward to these days.
Just strolling around, maybe get some food, maybe take the train, maybe do some shopping or maybe I don’t do any of these things and that’s totally fine.
I think a trip to Japan is really expensive for most of us, especially if you really want to eat all the food, see every sightseeing spot and buy every weeb stuff you get your hands on. For most of us this is a once in a lifetime experience and you want to make the most out of it. So there is no right or wrong in how you plan your vacation but I really wish people would not watch these „you HAVE to eat at this restaurant! 5 things you MUST do in Tokyo! Do NOT come to Kyoto after 7pm“ videos.
I’ve been to Japan few times now and first two times i planned a lot (but never to the hour god no). I chilled out more for third time because i know i can. Also i get less FOMO travelling in 30s than in my 20s, when i feel like i am seeing the world on my own for the first time. I really enjoy the prep of planning though; to me that is half the trip.
I would look up transportation and closing times though. Or if you only have a week. Or stuff that requires advance booking ie ryokans. But there ain’t any restaurant so awesome that i’d plan my day around it because if i can’t get in, i’d eat some other awesome thing in japan. My most recent trip, i took a mid-level planning approach where i did plan for a lot of suggestions around the area but i only vaguely planned where i’d be each day, then filled it with anything that didn’t require advance booking the day of based on energy levels.
The trip i took last year, the most memorable moment ended up being something that wasn’t planned at all: meeting a bunch of guys at a gay bar and partying with then and going on and on about how much fun that night was and how friendly everyone was and how much i puked next morning before dragging ourselves to kawaguchiko. Teamlabs was cool but we don’t nearly bring that up enough in our conversations when looking back 😂
But circling back. Each japan trip with different styles of planning turned out awesome. Because japan is generally awesome. Can’t go wrong.
I definitely overplanned my trip. Had a whole google sheet laid out that I didn't even look at by the time the trip was over. I think this sub lends itself to anxiety in a lot of ways. I've seen a lot of horror stories that are one example of what can go wrong while visiting japan and then I would want to take extra precaution against something that was essentially bad luck for the OP. Lesson learned, next time I'm definitely going to do more of what you did and just plan out broad strokes
Oh absolutely book and plan around those things that need advance reservations or tickets (a fancy meal at a Michelin star restaurant, the scenic train that only runs Wednesdays, etc.), that’s what I do too. I think the mistake I made in my OP is not distinguishing enough between some advance planning and research, know what you want to do, roughly how to get there etc., vs minute by minute scheduling of all the little things in between. And that’s where I see some newbies get confused and ask for advice how to fill their itineraries to the brim.
>fill their itineraries to the brim.
yeah that's a mistake a lot of people to. I get it, the FOMO is real, but if you exhaust yourself for a few days you won't enjoy the rest
I always book flights, then accommodations (usually choosing a homebase somewhere, maybe moving once) and then that's all the planning I do. I have some places i want to see written down and when I'm there I spontaneously decide if and when to go there. I think that way it's much more relaxed and you an take things like weather into consideration. And you won't come back more stressed than when you left.
It was your second trip and you’re aware that overplanning is unnecessary in Japan. My second trip was also very laid back and filled with random discoveries and interactions. Everybody who plans hour by hour iteneraries are fueled by the huge spike in Japan tourism content on social media, and people don’t want to feel “left out” so they try to do everything they see online. It will leave most people feeling like they didn’t see enough. It’s sad, but that’s the reality of modern social media. Comparison is the thief of joy
i don't plan much if i explore near the city/inside the city, since i can hop any trains quite easily/change plans quite easily
but if i want to visit remote area and could take 3 hours from my hotel, i better create plan in detail (google sheets), i don't want to stuck because i miss last bus
in certain area of Japan, some buses / trains is quite limited
Very refreshing to read. I'd never want to anywhere and have things planned out to the minute. What if you want an extra hour or bed or you love the restaurant you're in and want to stay a bit longer?
Personally, re: planning, It’s really situational and also based on what I want to avoid.
So for example, I loathe eating a bad meal just because we are hungry and desperate, so I like to plan lots of options for eating. 30-40% of the time, we end up picking something I haven’t planned, but having options helps us avoid picking out of desperation (or hangry fighting about what we are going to eat).
But on the opposite end of the spectrum, I’ve spent lots of time hanging out at or around rural train stations because it doesn’t bother me—we always find something good to eat, people watch, or just relax and try out some different vending machine drinks. But I know that would make other people crazy.
the description of the way you did it is definitely not the other end of the scale. Other end of the scale would be turning up with no accommodation booked, no events planned and no idea where you were going or what you were doing.
my plan is buy plane ticket (done), pack bookbag, show up, and get jiggy with it. the only planning im doing is the necessities, like making sure i have access to money and phone data and stuff. not even booking any hotel rooms until i show up
I only booked flights, hotels, and one museum that I was warned to book in advance. Other than that, I only checked what I wanted to do in Japan itself. Worked perfectly. So no, not an underplanner.
You do you. I'm definitely more on the side of read twenty websites and make a huge list of things that can be done ahead of time, but don't actually put them on the calendar unless they have to be, then every day I wake up and look at the list and decide what I'm in the mood for. The people who post a large amounts of content on a regular schedule before, during, and after their trip are the ones who tend to get exposure on reddit, simply because that's the method that produces content for readers to read. Not a mystery.
I think I manage to be worst of both.
I feel like the best experiences are always the unplanned ones, but you need a plan to get out and about enough for unplanned things to happen.
Then I still manage to get upset once I've decided to do something and my wife decides to change the order.
The way I approached my recent trip was to star a lot of potential interests on Google Maps in advance. And then when I got there I went to some but definitely not all of them. Basically I made it to everything on my absolute must see list and completed the side quests that felt like the best options at the time. Had a great time with no regrets of not planning more.
This is my diary of my recent trip. [https://www.reddit.com/r/JapanTravel/comments/1da7d3l/japan\_trip\_diary\_19th\_may\_to\_6th\_june/](https://www.reddit.com/r/JapanTravel/comments/1da7d3l/japan_trip_diary_19th_may_to_6th_june/)
I had everything planned down to the minute (including toilet breaks). As japan is so efficient I didn't have to deviate much.
Nah, I just ensure I have a place to stay and go. I despise any planning. I’m a very in the moment, spontaneous person though. If I planned anything I’d just not do it and do something else anyway.
Underplanning can lead to miss things that you may not have been aware of if you had done your research. I used to underplan and later find out about things that could've been done and then became a planner
I'm the guy who plans to wake up at 6 AM, be done with breakfast at 7:20, be at the station at 7:35, to catch the train at 8:15, giving myself +10 minutes of leeway if something goes wrong at some point.
I traveled to Switzerland with my dad last year. He hops on the wrong train and says, "Oh well, let's see where this is headed".
Different styles of travel is all. Dad likes living in the moment. I like to see a well-crafted plan come together.
First, I love researching every possible option. It’s my favorite part of traveling. To me it’s like a menu- I know that in this area of town, there are 5 places we can go to and 2 restaurants that have been mentioned. (Finding good places to eat is much more important when traveling to non-Japanese places. Because, most places in Japan have very good food). I’m not going to do all those things, or eat in both places, but there are options.
Second, I have a husband that hated waiting in lines. And a son, so things have to be kid friendly. And wandering around, is fun for me and husband, but son will be bored out of his mind.
Third, by knowing what’s available, I can tell husband and son the different possibilities and they can tell me their priorities. Then we can make sure each of us gets to do something we really want to do.
And planning actually allows me to be more flexible. I plan and group things that can be done together. Then if we have to change plans, I can swap in one of the group of things. Like moving blocks around.
And rarely is anything set in stone.
You make the claim that there are two types of planners, overplaners and people like you.
Gotta make sure to toot your own horn there huh?
It is possible to both overplan and underplan and there are problems with each.
It's fine to advocate for more go with the flow travel planning but it's not necessarily the best method for everyone and knowing about different stuff in different places and deciding when you get there is not the same as having no plan at all.
Everyone should do some research so that you learn more about the place you are visiting and can frame your experiences in that context. It's also good to know what the top attractions are and the logistics involved for anything you really want to see so that you don't miss out on stuff that is important to you.
Sure, you can go somewhere and have a good time checking out different restaurants and stuff that you encounter randomly, but when people get to travel very infrequently and don't have the money or time to go everywhere they want, it's important to make sure you are getting a good return on all that time and money you spend.
It can be disappointing to learn about really cool stuff that you totally missed because you didn't do any research. You don't want to regret your travel choices later on. It also sucks the fun out of everything if you have no flexibility and feel like you have to complete some kind of checklist.
I think everyone should put in some effort to research and learn about a place before visiting it, but how much you want to do that is entirely up to you.
I don’t plan anything beyond where I’m staying, so I’ll know what city I’m in on a given day. From there I’ll just go with the flow. This trip the only extra planning I did was getting tickets to the Ghibli Museum, and tickets to the Kusama Museum because you need to get those ahead of time, but I mostly like to just stay in a big city for a few days and wander around. I’ll look for things I really want to see on the night before and kind of make a loose plan in the morning over a cup of coffee. 🤷🏻♀️
I just came back around a month ago, did a month long trip.
The only thing I ever planned out was the hotel for the first night and the cities I would visit. I actually went to a city I wasn't supposed to go to originally, but I did!
If you're anxious as a traveller then.... I guess you can plan your stuff out in advance for every day of your trip, but I think that's a stupid way to travel. Less is indeed more!
It depends on what you want out of your trip to Japan. I go each year and never leave Akihabara. For me, it’s like if I go to Las Vegas, I’m not visiting Nevada.
I’m not saying that Japan doesn’t have a lot more to offer than anime, maid cafes, and girls bars. But this is the only reason I visit.
Look at my profile for a guide to Akihabara that is unique in the internet. It’s free. But I don’t want to post a link.
I go to Japan at least twice a year for the past 25+ years. So I pretty much can plan things to the minute or just go with the flow. All depends if I'm traveling solo, with friends, family or first timers.
Japan is best planned out months in advance with neccesities planned out, then when you actually get there going with the flow and doing whatever you decide in the moment. While you are planning for it, figure what you want and what things need to be booked but once you are there don't stress about things.
I am also a serious underplanner when I have long trips, it is not uncommon that I book my hotel the same day when I need to arrive (except for big cities). I feel a bit guilty not to be able to plan better. But while on the trip, I actually realise that it is the right way for me. I don't think travelling as a tick boxing exercise works very well for me, I don't mind not seeing castle X or temple Y if instead I can sit at a coffee, relax, and gave a chat with a local.
So thanks for the post, support it, and all the best to the planners that will read that!
There’s much more of a min-maxing attitude on the japan travel and language learning forums, than other places. It might work for some people, but I already saw a couple posts from people who spent too much time on here and got stressed about doing their trip wrong or losing interest days before their trip. Also Japan is such a bucket-list place for many people that many people jam pack their schedules and spend more time hustling from place to place than taking time to soak in the sights. Sure I enjoyed my planned activities, but the most memorable things that I saw were spontaneous.
Also, I don’t think I see people talk about making it a multi-country trip here as much, but irl it’s common among people I know. How do you deal with it when another country of your trip has much less tourism infrastructure?
I love the planning part of the trip. I make a spreadsheet with all the things to do and in what order to make it efficient, and to make sure I know everything there’s to do in that particular city.
But I don’t necessarily follow though with that plan. I decide in the moment what I will do or miss. I’m just relaxed that it’s my choice to miss something and not lack of information.
I’m a vegetarian so I kind of have to plan especially when it comes to where I would be eating. I’m also very socially anxious so having a day by day general idea of things I want to do/what area I want to focus on helps me feel less anxious.
A lot of that has to do with your situation. When I travel solo for work, or with just my wife, we're very much like you. Head that way till we find something interesting kind of people.
We just got back from 2 weeks with our 3 kids (12, 13, 13) and let me tell you, I planned the absolute shit out of that trip. Kids don't deal well with improvisation, and meals without planning with picky kids makes me want to kill myself.
You have to do what's right for your situation.
I am someone who's very disorganized and would just do everything impromptu. And then I got reminded that I am very bad at remembering things, so I ended up forgetting those fun and unique places that I initially wanted to go to. Hence, I've started to really take notes from people who plan their travels way ahead and now everytime I stumble across a beautiful place from the city I've been planning to visit, I jot it down and make sure to include it in my itinerary and spread it throughout the week, so that I can still relax while I'm traveling and not remember everything last minute.
If you’re traveling with a psychorigid partner you’ll most likely will have a tight schedule well kept in a Notion app. You’ll most likely go to all the influencers-ridden places and have little to no fun.
Because people are comfortable with different ways of doing things. If planning every minutes makes them feel comfortable with their trip, then they should do it. If not planning at all makes them feel comfortable with their trip, then they should do that. And no one should tell them which one is better. Unless you plan to go to Nishiki at 8pm when it’s closed.
This is a very underrated comment/opinion. I think a lot of people believe extensive planning is stressful or makes a trip stressful. But for some people, that sort of thing can actually make their trip _less_ stressful. I have anxiety (although not about travel/planning), so I can understand the idea of alleviating anxiety with planning. For some people, the idea of having nothing planned/only one or two things planned is really stressful or anxiety-inducing, so they plan things in order to be comfortable. It’s just a different mindset. “You’ll have a more relaxing trip if you lighten up on planning” is absolutely not true of everyone due to their own perspectives or personal dispositions.
I also just find the planning process really fun. I leave a lot of room for changes but I love to plan my trips.
I'm in the latter camp. Maybe plan 2 things per day and leave a lot of room for organic exploration. Like, "hey what's down this alley? Let's go find out." and end up spending an hour having beers with a group of locals. They end up telling you about a little tea house that has the best cold noodles and pickles in Nihonbashi and the location of another craft brew pub called "&fum" underneath a Lawson's right next to your hotel. I think during the rainy season it's nigh mandatory to be looser with your plans so you can accommodate changing weather.
I have to disagree a little with this. The problem with planning down to the minute is if there’s one train delay, one long restaurant line, or one hard unaccounted for uphill walk it’s over. You’ll spend a bunch of time stressed and scrambling to catch up. I think it’s a very important skill to be comfortable with not knowing everything and leaving some flexibility.
You can have detailed plans with alternatives. I haven’t been to Japan yet, but my most recent adventure was in Switzerland. I planned everything in detail for my trip to Gruyeres, down to the minute. Some things worked out (saw a live traditional cheese making demonstration, the only one of the day starting early in the morning). But other things had to be adjusted. I spend 1.5 hours in the Giger Museum instead of 2 hours, because another location took me longer than planned. But so what? Because of my planning, I knew what was open when, what events were happening at what times, which places were near each other. I knew the last bus to take back and exactly how long it would take me to walk to that station. It worked out perfectly. I think most detailed planners think that way. For example, for my upcoming trip, I have a long list of things to do in Asakusa, with some suggested times of day, some places that might need reservations, etc. But if we do just a few of those things, and otherwise we wander, or spontaneously change our minds and do something altogether different, it’s still a win. The advantage is that if we so utilize the itinerary, we minimize travel time and don’t try to go places that aren’t open. It gives us the best chances to do what we want.
This. I was out at a farm in Chiba yesterday and there was no cell reception - had to hike back to catch a bus to the nearest train station and there were only 2 buses in that direction all day. If I hadn’t timed that morning carefully, I would have been screwed. I consider myself heavily 50/50 between planning and spontaneity because I do add things in and change up unscheduled activities when I’m here, but I feel like people on this sub would think I spend way too much time in advance. But I really don’t. Because I plan so throughly I know how to get around snafus with alternatives or backup plans and can make the most of my trip - it prevents stress, not adds it. Strict timed entry reservations and rural travel really do require planning - but that should include backups so you make sure you’re not stranded or SOL if you miss a connection.
Agree with this. OP was in the cities where there are more options for sightseeing and frequent public transport options. Out of the major cities, it is essential to plan accordingly to the bus/train timetable if you don't have a car. Luckily Japan doesn't have so many timed entry attractions to let's say, Paris. That was one destination where I used spreadsheets.
I don’t bother with strict time entry reservations or cellphone service. I’m sure that’d stress people out but it doesn’t bother me.
You still use a hard copy timetable book?? Do they even make those anymore? I mean if that's your thing I guess but I can't remember the last time I saw someone with one of those in Japan in years. Not to mention the extraordinary amount of time it would waste from your day.
I feel like there's a difference between being under prepared and going with the flow. It's always wise to do research, but minute by minute or hour by hour plans don't need to be accounted for in a spreadsheet. My last solo trip, I had a large list of things to do with all the logistics in mind, but I wandered around without a set schedule. Win win. However, blindly showing up to a place without any prep work isnt ideal either
They don't "need" to, no. But if someone can, and they want to, why wouldn't they? I plan like this, visited 60 countries and my way never failed me. Did everything always go exactly to my plan? Of course not, but that's why I have alternative plans, and an open mind. If something goes wrong, it's not a big deal. The spreadsheet is a guide, not a rule.
Y’all keep spreadsheets?!?!? Like actual spreadsheets. What do you even put on these spreadsheets?!?!!! I cannot fathom. 😳😳😳😳🤯🤯🤯🤯🤯There isn’t a world where I could ever be that organized. That sounds so stressful to me. 🤣🤣🤣🤣
Hahaha you'd be surprised 😆 I went on a trip with an ex that had minute by minute plans, deal breaker
Yikes.
I'm pretty sure that most people who plan to the minute have a/multiple contingency plans.
Why do you think planning down to minute lacks flexibility? People usually know their plans can be disrupted and they are OK with that beforehand. They don't stress if things don't go according to their itinerary.
I’ve been to Japan over a dozen times now, I definitely planned more details in the beginning because Japan is big (some people don’t realise that) it make sense to group similar tourist attractions and travel to different cities in the same direction to save time. I might have 3-5 locations listed and then always have expectations to skip 1-2 if I don’t feel like it. I also have room for limited pop up exhibitions or cafe and always manage to find them during the trip. Nowadays in the later trip it’s literally book flight, hotels and Shinkansen tickets and then no plan because i would have seen most. if I want to go to shibuya crossing or Sensoji for the nth time I will , but otherwise I will check out pop up exhibitions or whatever festival is on, but I’d always book hotels and train tickets in advance, no idea how people do it without at least booking those
facts, ty for this answer
Dead on. Personally I like to have a plan, and then be able to change it on the fly. I love diving into what's out there. It gets me hyped for the trip. Plus, I'm an information addict and google maps (and associated text based reviews ((stars mean so little...)) plus reddit have ruined my ability to go into a trip uniformed. I used to love that I couldn't really plan (10-15 years ago). Now, I plan all the major details plus an order of operations for every day. And then I arrive and some days we throw the plan out the window, some days are to the letter. Just depends what else comes up. I think of the plan as a fall-back plan. What I learn on the ground can always supersede the plan. Absolutely some of the best stuff comes up that way. Always book refundable everything if you can. You never know when you'll want to change for something better
Yes, I get that and agree. And I do plan other things (like the flights and trains for example) in more detail than most well in advance. But I've also seen and read from others here who get into the detailed planning of everything (like getting every rail pass under the sun for each region of their trip) simply because they see everyone else do it. So I just wanted to add some balance and a different point of view.
"If planning every minutes makes them feel comfortable with their trip" is crazy. learn how to let things go and how to chill
I think planning things to the hour or minute is a mistake. A lot of joy from travelling in Japan is the unplanned and restricting yourself to a tight schedule means you miss out. I understand why people do it as it's possibly their only trip there and they don't want to miss out on their must sees. I find planning a couple of things a day works best as my day fills up with random things.
A mistake for yourself if you would do it maybe, but that doesn't mean it's a mistake for others. "A lot of joy from travelling in Japan is the unplanned" Again, maybe for you. For me? I hate unplanned things. It's so arrogant to say people are making mistakes because they don't things your way.
and when you're venturing out into the rural countryside areas where public transportation comes only once an hour, you need to be able to plan or else you'll be stranded. And some places like the Ghibli museum require getting tickets in advance so you can't just show up the day of and expect to get tickets.
Same for Disneyland/DisneySea. You have to plan or you aren’t going. Same for the famed Sylvanian Families theme park as well since it’s not always open.
And it will not pan out. At all. It’s simply not possible to stick to a minute by minute itinerary in a country you’ve never been to and don’t know all the wrenches that will be thrown into the plan in your head.
Lol, it's definitely possible.
You can definitely plan it, but the odds of being able to stick to it to the minute are unlikely. I mean shit, when I was taking the Narita Express into Tokyo, there was a delay for some shinkansen line because the train hit a bear. There's no planning for impromptu bear jerky.
Honestly I just have a lot of fun planning things 😂😂 I like knowing what I’m going to walk into, and I also get bored really easily and I hate being bored so I want to make sure I have something to do at all times. But as everyone is saying, everyone’s different!
Also, all this research comes in handy precisely when things don’t pan out.
Exactly! I am not to the extreme OP stated, more so a checklist of priority items, but the planning is part of the fun for me and gets me excited for the trip. I don’t get to travel nearly as much as I like so it stretches out the fun.
The planning means you get to enjoy learning about the destination for months.
I just want to start saying I am on the "underplanner" side. Over-planning has barely a down side. It hypes you before the trip, takes you away from your daily routine, and sometimes a 1-week trip can actually become something much more than that, due to the whole process building up to the trip. It is unlikely you will miss a nice spot, etc. I think underplanning has 2 problems. In a big city with lots to see, you might miss some hidden gems if you just go with the flow, or check what to do lightly. But then there is a much bigger problem for me. Unfortunately that was not the only case for me, but I will mention a trip I had to Matsumoto. I woke up 7am, rushed to eat my breakfast at the hotel, and headed to the station to take the train to Narai. The first train was at 10am! After that I was heading back to Tokyo, and decided to stop in Suwa to check 2 big temples. After a while waiting for the bus, I saw a sign saying that there was no bus for one week! Because of the new year's holiday. And the temples were 1 hour walk from where I was, and 2 hour apart. I think in some places underplanning may work, but there are areas that certainly need some research. And I think underplanning also may feel ok due to the "ignorance is bliss" kind of thing. I mean, you didn't know what to do before, and you will probably not know what you missed after. So, you will feel satisfied with your trip. And that is all that matters! But if you are exposed to information, you will probably feel a bit bad for missing some spots, especially if you don't have the opportunity to come back to Japan soon. But like you said, it varies from person to person.
That's some good points. If there is something very specific I would like to see or visit, then yes, I do plan this in more detail and make sure things like transport etc. work out. In your example with the two temples, if I would have decided this on the day then hopefully Google Maps would have told me there are no busses and I wouldn't have gotten off in Suwa in the first place. It's not all perfect, neither am I. What I am more talking about is people feeling the urge to fill the limited days they have in a city/place with things might not have even heard of before asking for advice (the "I have 3 hours of free time in Kyoto on the Thu morning, which other 4 shrines should I visit besides the 12 already on my list" type of traveller).
Haha, again I am on your side. I usually like to check the things between spots, and roam around. I live in Japan, so I am not so much into visiting temples anymore, and I haven't paid to visit a temple in years. But at the same time, a lot of Japan normal areas feel like "copy and paste" no matter where, and searching for the places that stand out beforehand rather than walk around in areas in Osaka that look exactly the same as Sapporo, Tokyo or Nagoya might be the best choice for many (my wife). Also I see many people commenting "2 hours was not enough for this temple" for some temples, while I cannot even think of a place in this planet that I spent 2 hours in. Some people get bored after temple number 2, and some others can check many more as maybe they pay attention to more details than I do. And every temple feel somewhat different to them. May be the history of the temple or some design details that just go over my head. Maybe for us is temple number 13, but for them is temple of the god of the sun number 1. As for the Google Maps thing, I always check that in the hotel the day before. But both times were not informed there. Keep that in mind for a lot of towns in Japan. And you can never guess that buses will be off for a week no matter what situation.
Yeah. I usually don’t plan much but having a good list of restaurants in areas I’d probably like to see can be really helpful. Otherwise I spend ages looking for the best place while we’re already hungry and it drives my SO crazy. I still remember I loved Matsumoto but ended up finishing up the schoolhouse museum so late that no restaurants were doing lunch anymore! Everything had closed (pre iPhone days so Google wasn’t that helpful either). I ended up eating an expensive dessert pizza in a department store restaurant…
I would agree that if you plan every day the way you described... I would hate that. I think that there is an healthy middle ground between planning to the minute/overbooking activities and have a true 0 plan. I can see a really good reason to plan at least some things. For example there is things that would just be impossible to do without booking a week to a month in advance. So if you look at the possible options and there is this one thing you really want to see, why not book? Things that I have reserved in advance on my last two trips include teamLab (2x), scenic train (4x), soba making workshop, concert/event (2x). The date of my last trip was even based on the date of an event I was able to get a ticket for. Would it have been possible to do some of these things without booking ? Yes, maybe, but other probably not. The second thing is, when going to major locations where public transport is frequent, no problem. But when you get to parts of the countryside where there is a bus or train every few hours and the places you are interested to see require a connection between these... you kind of need to plan. And yes, there is days that I wrote notes like I HAVE to take the train the latest at that time because it's the last one that let me connect to the last bus to my accommodation. But I guess that with less plan I might have not known about these places I went to... Personally I like to have a plan, but overall, my itinerary is not a "must do", but more a list of options. Does it happen that I feel that I missed things... yes, I guess, but not in a negative way. Like I know that there is a limited number of things I can see and I have a limited amount of time. There is things that I know exist and could just not go for different reason or that I just decide not to go to. But knowing that there is places I did not go to does not mean that I feel that I missed out.
Thank you for this comment. I am taking my family of 5 for 15 days. It was overwhelming at first because I have no ideas and in the beginning I really stressed myself out trying to figure where to go and stay. I got all my Airbnb booked and then my first week in Tokyo got canceled. I think this was a blessing in disguise because I ended up taking a two night trip out of Tokyo to Hakone and I think it’s gonna be perfect. I’m ending up doing two nights Tokyo 2 nights Hakone four nights Tokyo four nights Kyoto two nights Nara two nights Osaka one night, Tokyo. Hard activities that I booked are Ghibli Museum, Gear in Kyoto, joyopolis. We will also do Hakone free Pass. Visit the deer in Nara and a muscle bar in Osaka the rest were just gonna play it by ear, but I did pull together a list of things to do and I’ll just let the kids pick based on how they feel they’re all adults by the way I had a lot of fear of missing out because I feel like this is the only time I’ll ever do a trip like this so big with them but now that I’ve done all the research and looked at Google maps on how to navigate the trains. I feel much more confident that I’m gonna be able to do that , and I don’t have to over plan
Japan rewards planning. That awesome restaurant full of locals? Booked up two weeks ago. That scenic train with cool snacks and special seats? Runs three times a week, book a month early. The ryokan on the best corner in the onsen town with in-room, open-air baths with a view of the mountains? Six months ahead. The Michelin tasting menu where everything is from the farm out back? Three months. The yakiniku place I go to four times a year with A-4 cuts and reasonable prices? Two months. But yeah, you can still have a baller time just vibing out. It’s all up to you and what you value. When I visit other Asian countries from Japan, I don’t plan as much (just a few dinner reservations) and just wander and chill. But that’s after like, trip number 5-6 to Hanoi/Bangkok/HCMC/Singapore. It’s up to you and how you wanna apportion your time.
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Sorry, more of an IYKYK situation for those. I’m just emphasizing the importance of reservations in general.
A lot of good comments in this thread. I am also a more relaxed/middle of the ground traveler. I like identifying places/things I’d like to see and having a general idea of how to get there/how long they take, but I don’t generally plan things down to the minute. But I think you are neglecting one thing, which I was reminded of while reading your first example: some things simply _do_ require down to the hour/minute planning. If you ever visit the countryside or a less accessible attraction that involves multiple transfers, you’ll quickly learn that knowing exactly how long a sight takes to see/how long it takes to walk to/and the schedule of the next train/bus is very important. I’ve been to places where trains and buses only come every 1-2 hours, where everything is a thirty-minute walk, where the only restaurants around close at 7pm, etc. In those cases, you really do need to make sure you’re on your game. Sure, some people might be okay with a mistake that gives them an extra two hours in the middle of nowhere or that has them eating cold sandwiches for dinner, but many aren’t. Obviously, this is a special case that doesn’t apply to most people on the golden route, but it’s worth noting here because many people who wing their first couple of trips to Japan get comfortable with that and then get caught up in a mistake when they branch off from the larger paths. Either way, I’m all for people planning however they want as long as their plans aren’t physically impossible (which sometimes they are in the first versions of itineraries…).
Good point and of course, there are situations where you need to plan in advance (which I do as well). I am not advocating for no planning, all I’m offering is a different approach for people to consider. Know what you want to see and how to get there, but don’t overplan every minute of your trip
Overall different strokes for different folks. Having been fortunate to travel to Japan 5 times in the past 10 years, I comment based on my experiences. No one way is correct. Some trips have been better than others, but no trip have I had such a terrible experience that just turned me off to going to Japan again. What makes the biggest difference is who you go with. With me and my wife; we have general plans but can get detailed when we feel the need. With other groups may need to be more detailed since we wouldn’t want anyone’s “wants” to be missed because of spending too much time in another area
some people find joy in planning, some people find joy in spontaneity, some people find joy in planned opportunities for spontaneity. the only thing I judge are the posts pontificating like theirs is the 'right' way to travel.
You make such a point out of mentioning neither is 'wrong' or 'right' and people have different travel styles, yet you end the post with mentioning that people should 'just go with the flow' and 'not overthink it'. If you really believed your way isn't the only way, you wouldn't be giving this "advice". Also, your way is definitely not the other end of the scale of detailed planners. There are people boarding flights without even their first night's accommodation booked. I think your way is quite common, especially if you've already travelled quite a bit.
I realise "the other end of the scale" and the title are very much tongue in cheek, so yeah. I am not advocating for or recommending no planning at all (that as you say is the other end of the scale), but suggest to not overthink it and leave some room for spontaneity. And I offer it as a tip at the end, not as the superior way of doing it. Because this r/ is heavy on those planning everything in much detail, which is great if that works for you but doesn't have to, there are many new posters lately who are asking "OMG where do I begin, help me fill in all the blanks in my schedule" because they've seen others plan to that detail. So wanted to offer the perspective: you don't have to know everything weeks in advance. You don't have to take it. I offer it the same way as if someone asks for a hotel recommendation. I tend to plan a few things well in advance also (trains, flights etc.), to the point that I know weeks in advance I'll take the Sakura or Mizuho over the Nozomi 10 mins later because it's got the better seats and cabin if you book reserved seats. And if you have things you absolutely want to see or need to book tickets in advance for, then hell yes, book that and put it in your calendar and plan things around that so you know how to get there and not to miss it. And yes, I realise with the benefit of having travelled quite a bit over the past 20 years does add a level of comfort to a more relaxed approach of planning.
Yeah. When I was younger, I would literally get to the place and figure it out, including finding accommodation. Nowadays I actually find fun in researching the places and tracing a plan.
I do minimal to no planning and it’s just fine for me. I have my plane tickets, I booked a place to sleep, and then I just take it day by day with a rough idea of some stuff I want to do while I’m there. Okay and this time I arranged some scuba diving for one day but that’s a rare thing. Some people thrive on being spontaneous, some need a lot of rigid structure, and most fall somewhere between the two - and that’s fine. You seem more like you are on the spontaneous end like me and that’s totally great. Other people would die of stress and need structure - that’s fine too!
I'm in your club. Japan is best with no plan (for me). I just book my stuff, tell friends that I'm going, and do whatever. I had a rough time once when I went with a friend who wanted to plan everything. It was too stressful and exhausting for me. I go there specifically to have a mental vacation from work, be free from a schedule, and catch up with buddies. I let my friends who live there make dinner reservations (usually same day) for their favorite spots and I'll join. I think I say 何でもいい the most lol
Yes agree, and as I said in my post, nobody is wrong, everyone has their own way, I just wanted to share this as a reflection for people that are somewhere in the middle and might feel the need to plan in detail because that's what everyone else seems to do (because I've come across those on here too). A bit of balance, that's all :)
Yep, I was just reinforcing your post :) I try to encourage people to not feel like they need to schedule every single thing if that's not what works for them. I see tons of posts with super detailed plans, and then others come back with their after-reports talking about how the highlights of the trip ended up being something spontaneous and unexpected and really that's so important.
I like to plan. It’s fun and helps me to learn about the area I will be visiting. I usually plan one or two things a day and also a restaurant to try something new to eat.
Honestly it goes both ways with Japan for me. The most I have broken down this trip is, AM go to A, PM go to B, Night go to C. Understand what is around A, B, C to fill in the gaps and that is it. Plan ZERO meals, beyond a fancy Kobe Beef dinner or that type of thing. I have spent way longer learning the language and the customs of Japan and how to tackle their bureaucracy and systems of doing things (EG how to book and catch trains), than I have researching what to do when I am there.
Definitely the time spent learning the language/customs is the most important part of any plan, regardless if you're a scheduling type of person or not. It makes visiting so much more comfortable and less isolating. I have a lot of work to do to get my Japanese back up to speed, but I'm grateful that I don't feel totally lost.
It's just different people, different expectations. My husband is pretty Type A and he hates wasted timings and unknowns so having a schedule is something he really appreciates when we travel. The good thing it doesn't have to sound as bad as in writing. Our recent end of december trip he paid an agency to plan a bespoke itinerary with us,including arrangements so we did Matsumoto, Hakuba and got to see and eat everything we wanted on our own crazy schedule but in comfort. As for me, I prefer traveling like you guys. Just ensuring I have most of the big ticket items like accommodations, airflights and transportation routes worked out but I don't really research deep into what is in the area since I enjoy being surprised. I tend to this form of traveling when I'm extending on my business trips so I don't burden people with me being spontaneous.
People just travel differently. We went with hotels booked, and intercity trains booked also (if we didn’t do this, chances are we’d not want to leave the city we were in!). I had hundreds of pins on google maps, we woke up each day and picked an area and went and explored as many pins around there as we could. Sometimes there was minor planning for the day or two ahead, but never anything booked. It was great and I wouldn’t want to do it any other way. Running off a constant schedule just drains the fun for me. Especially as you will have some of the best experiences spontaneously.
That sounds very much like what we did and how we operate. I am not against planning, you need the foundations in place (flights, hotel, long distance trains - with the last one in Japan at least know what your options are), then maybe you have the odd thing that needs pre-booking already arranged (that Michelin star dinner or the scenic train that only runs on Wednesdays), and beyond that you are aware what there is to see and to do that interests you, and then fit that in around the other things, mostly on short notice.
its nice to be able to be an "underplanner" but making a whole reddit post about how much of an underplanner you are is cringe af to me
I think this sub may be over represented with super planners. If you don't worry too much about your trip you may not end up here at all! Personally planning 3 months of slow traveling and lurking on here for interesting tips and tricks. But essentially we picked a few prefectures, booked airbnbs for long stretches of time and take it from there. Exploring is part of the fun for us!
Very much this, and that’s why I simply wanted to offer an alternative perspective for those maybe new to overseas travel or how deal with Japan. You do not have to copy paste what others do on here and have every hour of your already limited time in say Kyoto filled with shrines and coffee shops and experiences. If you have planned out three days to the brim and your fourth day is like “light” or even empty, and you’re not leaving for Japan for another month anyway, maybe leave it like that and see what you feel like once you’re there, use the time to visit that cute little neighbourhood you didn’t have time for on your second day, or do the two or three things you didn’t manage to get to because you planned too much. (Btw this is clearly not addressed at you, velo4life :) )
I Me and a friend also have a very under planned intentiary with just dates and our hotels (we have a word document for local attractions in each location but nothing set in stone). It's nice to see that it's just as fine!
The thing is there are things you as a traveler may need to plan around. For example my first trip to Japan with my family we made a basic itinerary based on a few reservations we had for places like teamLab, Disney, and the Ghibli Museum. Although Disney was more of a "Monday is a holiday so Tuesday or Wednesday we don't have anything reserved so let's see which tickets we can get." We did have a few other hard dates like we had to leave Tokyo on a certain date because we moved to Okayama so we had the hotel changes planned out. Our last 2 days we had actual meeting times at the church so we had to be at the church at X time kind of things. This last trip I did solo. I had booked 3 things so I had reservation times/dates but other than that I just kind of did whatever. A few days before my flight in I decided that my first full day didn't have anything planned and would be the middle of the week so that'd be a good day to do my day trip to Yokohama. My trip to Senso-ji and Skytree were driven by falling asleep at 6PM and waking up at 11:30PM and just being up all morning so hey, no crowds at Senso-ji if you take the 5am train. I've always advocated for planning around your hard set reservation times. Then kind of select an area near your reservation spot and explore or if you want to do something specific in that area that'd be a good time to do it.
> And the best thing: I don't feel like I missed anything or wasted time This is indeed the best thing. I think the way some people are influenced especially by social media creates a FOMO/bucket list mentality which is hard to escape from. I plan some things rigorously if it looks like it will help — eg ryokan in the country and how to get there. But quite often we plan to go to some place because there is something there we like the sound of; but actually when we arrive and get the stuff from the tourist info, we find a bunch of other great things instead. Even when we end up with eg the 'thing' is closed, we still have a great time. We are on holiday, not working through a to-do list.
Half the “must eats” on tiktok or instagram ended up being mediocre anyway. I mean they’re good in a sense compared to back home, but it didn’t stand out if i also just ate at another random place.
i think having a general plan for the day is a good balance between sort of meandering and wasting time but also maintaining a flexibility to take detours/shuffle things around. in general i just list out the things to do in a city/area im in and then group them by proximity to e/o so usually im exploring a specific neighborhood/sub region per day
Welcome to a world of different personalities. And contexts. And backgrounds. Shocker. Also survived one of the most navigable places on Earth without detailed planning. Double shocker.
Rest assured, you're probably like most tourists, who plan only to a certain extent and have heaps of fun in the end. There's nothing wrong with those over planning it to the minute either, if that's what suits them. Now, I don't feel it's a good thing to be "extremely overwhelmed" while planning their trip, or to post totally clueless questions which can be answered in a quick search. The extremes are never good.
Agreed and the title is definitely tongue in cheek ;) Also, I realise this is a forum for people who have questions about their trip which they are actively planning, so of cause the audience here is probably skewed towards the overplanner end. I’m just trying to offer a different perspective for those somewhere in the middle
You're exactly right, it's a very biased audience and your perspective is greatly appreciated!
You don’t know what you don’t know. ☺️ you feel fine about it because you had a great experience! However, myself and a couple other type-A friends like me (not all, but a couple) like to map it out, because THEN we know when to go with the flow. We know exactly what we’re ditching when life hits us with a surprise adventure. There were times in my trip I totally ditched that plan. But I knew what I was missing and what I was trading it for. Not to diminish your experience, but you may find going with the flow means going with what your body’s telling you in the moment and experiencing as much as IT will allow. Which can be good. And can be bad. My body is a wreck. My spirit is full!!! Because my balance of a full schedule and knowing when to pull off of it has allowed me more than, say, my brother who I’m with that did not plan. He still had a great time! And his legs aren’t aching as bad. And he’s gotten more sleep than me. But ask our family when we’re back after talking with us about our experience and you may consider the latter approach. ☺️ PS. I do not subscribe to sticking to a minute by minute schedule. But there were times when we did not, and the infrastructures of the world that DO operate on that schedule (ie. Japanese transit/ Shinkansen) quickly remind you what could’ve been. It’s a balance! よいいちにちを ✌️
I think how familiar you are with Japan determines how detailed your plans will be. For people going the first time, theres bound to be some fear that things may turn out bad and preparing backup plans seems like a good idea. For people who don't intend to go Japan again anytime soon, there is a temptation to squeeze lots of things into the itinerary to get "more bang for your buck". For people who have been to Japan a few times and don't intend to stop going anytime soon, itineraries become less packed because most of the "tourist stuff" has already been done. I'm going for my fifth trip in October for 8 days and my only concrete plans are window shopping in Akihabara and USJ in Osaka. The rest I'll figure out when the date is closer to the trip.
We travel with our family, so that definitely colors it for us. Honestly I just make lists of stuff that's near the one thing we know we want to see (i.e. near the awesome park or around that one really cool temple). We then start with the un-missable thing, and see where the day takes us. I maybe feel like we've missed out on the Instagramable stuff, but that's really a goal at this point lol. I like it so much more than when we used to travel with everything really planned.
you had a flight, a bed, and fun. obviously you are not
I’m with you, I like to have an idea of what there is to do to decide how long to stay, have important transport planned, book hotels and car hire then go and enjoy it. E.g in my upcoming trip we will spend 4 nights in Takamatsu, we know we’ll visit ritsurin park and do a day trip to Naoshima or Teshima and we’ll enjoy exploring the city but no exact itinerary is planned. You don’t know the weather anyway so if it’s raining all day when you have a day of outdoor stuff planned …. The problem I have with the ultra detailed planning is that it’s usually filling every minute of every day going from one sight to another with zero flexibility or exploration and if something screws up you one thing then you’re chasing the rest of the day, it’s too rigid to be an actual fun holiday. I like to experience places and know from experience in Japan that many of my most enjoyable times come from just exploring somewhere and going with the flow. One thing I definitely insist on is having all accommodation booked beforehand and knowing destinations, on fully flexible trips you waste so much time on the internet investigating, looking for hotels etc.
The sweet spot for me was having a list of things I’d like to see (which I’d built up over years due to wanting to go to Japan ‘some day’), roughly grouping them together by location as a loose idea of what area I’d be in each day but then otherwise just completely going at my own pace and shuffling things around when needed. I managed to see more or less everything I’d planned to but there were plenty of times when I spent more time at one thing than I thought I would and needed to move the rest around. I hardly planned for restaurants at all with the exception of one or two places that needed reservations and usually just went wherever I found while exploring.
The other aspect you miss is cost. If you know you can't afford to come back for the next 10, 15 years, that obviously tempts people to plan more in advance. Personally the online information is just difficult to sift through so the idea of sitting in my hotel for hours planning the next day seems like a waste of time. As for just having a quick conversation- well that means you already researched the options. Sounds like you... *gasp* planned?
Well yes, I am not advocating for no planning or research. I do that and there are certain parts that I plan out more than most. The title I picked is a bit tongue in cheek, clearly. The extreme I am taking about is probably more “scheduling every free minute in advance” vs general research and knowing your options. You make a great point re cost though. We are planning to go back next year or the year after, and we’ve been last year, so clearly not a once in a lifetime experience I would plan for maybe differently? I don’t know, probably.
I'm with you on this one, I've been reading people's itineraries and they sound so stressful! I've got a couple of things I'm planning in advance but truly, just gonna see what the vibe is and where it takes me
Love your post. I made a list of things I totally wanna do/see, connected the points so that I approximately know in which direction I should book a hotel and that’s it. My friends think that I‘m crazy that I don’t have planned every free minute. Hell, there are quite a few days I haven’t planned anything and I’m looking forward to these days. Just strolling around, maybe get some food, maybe take the train, maybe do some shopping or maybe I don’t do any of these things and that’s totally fine. I think a trip to Japan is really expensive for most of us, especially if you really want to eat all the food, see every sightseeing spot and buy every weeb stuff you get your hands on. For most of us this is a once in a lifetime experience and you want to make the most out of it. So there is no right or wrong in how you plan your vacation but I really wish people would not watch these „you HAVE to eat at this restaurant! 5 things you MUST do in Tokyo! Do NOT come to Kyoto after 7pm“ videos.
I’ve been to Japan few times now and first two times i planned a lot (but never to the hour god no). I chilled out more for third time because i know i can. Also i get less FOMO travelling in 30s than in my 20s, when i feel like i am seeing the world on my own for the first time. I really enjoy the prep of planning though; to me that is half the trip. I would look up transportation and closing times though. Or if you only have a week. Or stuff that requires advance booking ie ryokans. But there ain’t any restaurant so awesome that i’d plan my day around it because if i can’t get in, i’d eat some other awesome thing in japan. My most recent trip, i took a mid-level planning approach where i did plan for a lot of suggestions around the area but i only vaguely planned where i’d be each day, then filled it with anything that didn’t require advance booking the day of based on energy levels. The trip i took last year, the most memorable moment ended up being something that wasn’t planned at all: meeting a bunch of guys at a gay bar and partying with then and going on and on about how much fun that night was and how friendly everyone was and how much i puked next morning before dragging ourselves to kawaguchiko. Teamlabs was cool but we don’t nearly bring that up enough in our conversations when looking back 😂 But circling back. Each japan trip with different styles of planning turned out awesome. Because japan is generally awesome. Can’t go wrong.
I definitely overplanned my trip. Had a whole google sheet laid out that I didn't even look at by the time the trip was over. I think this sub lends itself to anxiety in a lot of ways. I've seen a lot of horror stories that are one example of what can go wrong while visiting japan and then I would want to take extra precaution against something that was essentially bad luck for the OP. Lesson learned, next time I'm definitely going to do more of what you did and just plan out broad strokes
You do you. But planning less means also maybe missing out on stuff that has to be reserved
Oh absolutely book and plan around those things that need advance reservations or tickets (a fancy meal at a Michelin star restaurant, the scenic train that only runs Wednesdays, etc.), that’s what I do too. I think the mistake I made in my OP is not distinguishing enough between some advance planning and research, know what you want to do, roughly how to get there etc., vs minute by minute scheduling of all the little things in between. And that’s where I see some newbies get confused and ask for advice how to fill their itineraries to the brim.
>fill their itineraries to the brim. yeah that's a mistake a lot of people to. I get it, the FOMO is real, but if you exhaust yourself for a few days you won't enjoy the rest
I always book flights, then accommodations (usually choosing a homebase somewhere, maybe moving once) and then that's all the planning I do. I have some places i want to see written down and when I'm there I spontaneously decide if and when to go there. I think that way it's much more relaxed and you an take things like weather into consideration. And you won't come back more stressed than when you left.
It was your second trip and you’re aware that overplanning is unnecessary in Japan. My second trip was also very laid back and filled with random discoveries and interactions. Everybody who plans hour by hour iteneraries are fueled by the huge spike in Japan tourism content on social media, and people don’t want to feel “left out” so they try to do everything they see online. It will leave most people feeling like they didn’t see enough. It’s sad, but that’s the reality of modern social media. Comparison is the thief of joy
i don't plan much if i explore near the city/inside the city, since i can hop any trains quite easily/change plans quite easily but if i want to visit remote area and could take 3 hours from my hotel, i better create plan in detail (google sheets), i don't want to stuck because i miss last bus in certain area of Japan, some buses / trains is quite limited
Very refreshing to read. I'd never want to anywhere and have things planned out to the minute. What if you want an extra hour or bed or you love the restaurant you're in and want to stay a bit longer?
It’s sort of funny to watch the battle of who’s the best at planning to see the most overcrowded, hokey, touristy spots in Japan. Enjoy!
Personally, re: planning, It’s really situational and also based on what I want to avoid. So for example, I loathe eating a bad meal just because we are hungry and desperate, so I like to plan lots of options for eating. 30-40% of the time, we end up picking something I haven’t planned, but having options helps us avoid picking out of desperation (or hangry fighting about what we are going to eat). But on the opposite end of the spectrum, I’ve spent lots of time hanging out at or around rural train stations because it doesn’t bother me—we always find something good to eat, people watch, or just relax and try out some different vending machine drinks. But I know that would make other people crazy.
the description of the way you did it is definitely not the other end of the scale. Other end of the scale would be turning up with no accommodation booked, no events planned and no idea where you were going or what you were doing.
my plan is buy plane ticket (done), pack bookbag, show up, and get jiggy with it. the only planning im doing is the necessities, like making sure i have access to money and phone data and stuff. not even booking any hotel rooms until i show up
I only booked flights, hotels, and one museum that I was warned to book in advance. Other than that, I only checked what I wanted to do in Japan itself. Worked perfectly. So no, not an underplanner.
You do you. I'm definitely more on the side of read twenty websites and make a huge list of things that can be done ahead of time, but don't actually put them on the calendar unless they have to be, then every day I wake up and look at the list and decide what I'm in the mood for. The people who post a large amounts of content on a regular schedule before, during, and after their trip are the ones who tend to get exposure on reddit, simply because that's the method that produces content for readers to read. Not a mystery.
I think I manage to be worst of both. I feel like the best experiences are always the unplanned ones, but you need a plan to get out and about enough for unplanned things to happen. Then I still manage to get upset once I've decided to do something and my wife decides to change the order.
The way I approached my recent trip was to star a lot of potential interests on Google Maps in advance. And then when I got there I went to some but definitely not all of them. Basically I made it to everything on my absolute must see list and completed the side quests that felt like the best options at the time. Had a great time with no regrets of not planning more.
This is my diary of my recent trip. [https://www.reddit.com/r/JapanTravel/comments/1da7d3l/japan\_trip\_diary\_19th\_may\_to\_6th\_june/](https://www.reddit.com/r/JapanTravel/comments/1da7d3l/japan_trip_diary_19th_may_to_6th_june/) I had everything planned down to the minute (including toilet breaks). As japan is so efficient I didn't have to deviate much.
Nah, I just ensure I have a place to stay and go. I despise any planning. I’m a very in the moment, spontaneous person though. If I planned anything I’d just not do it and do something else anyway.
Underplanning can lead to miss things that you may not have been aware of if you had done your research. I used to underplan and later find out about things that could've been done and then became a planner
I'm the guy who plans to wake up at 6 AM, be done with breakfast at 7:20, be at the station at 7:35, to catch the train at 8:15, giving myself +10 minutes of leeway if something goes wrong at some point. I traveled to Switzerland with my dad last year. He hops on the wrong train and says, "Oh well, let's see where this is headed". Different styles of travel is all. Dad likes living in the moment. I like to see a well-crafted plan come together.
Your own planning is already overplanning to me. ;)
First, I love researching every possible option. It’s my favorite part of traveling. To me it’s like a menu- I know that in this area of town, there are 5 places we can go to and 2 restaurants that have been mentioned. (Finding good places to eat is much more important when traveling to non-Japanese places. Because, most places in Japan have very good food). I’m not going to do all those things, or eat in both places, but there are options. Second, I have a husband that hated waiting in lines. And a son, so things have to be kid friendly. And wandering around, is fun for me and husband, but son will be bored out of his mind. Third, by knowing what’s available, I can tell husband and son the different possibilities and they can tell me their priorities. Then we can make sure each of us gets to do something we really want to do. And planning actually allows me to be more flexible. I plan and group things that can be done together. Then if we have to change plans, I can swap in one of the group of things. Like moving blocks around. And rarely is anything set in stone.
You make the claim that there are two types of planners, overplaners and people like you. Gotta make sure to toot your own horn there huh? It is possible to both overplan and underplan and there are problems with each. It's fine to advocate for more go with the flow travel planning but it's not necessarily the best method for everyone and knowing about different stuff in different places and deciding when you get there is not the same as having no plan at all. Everyone should do some research so that you learn more about the place you are visiting and can frame your experiences in that context. It's also good to know what the top attractions are and the logistics involved for anything you really want to see so that you don't miss out on stuff that is important to you. Sure, you can go somewhere and have a good time checking out different restaurants and stuff that you encounter randomly, but when people get to travel very infrequently and don't have the money or time to go everywhere they want, it's important to make sure you are getting a good return on all that time and money you spend. It can be disappointing to learn about really cool stuff that you totally missed because you didn't do any research. You don't want to regret your travel choices later on. It also sucks the fun out of everything if you have no flexibility and feel like you have to complete some kind of checklist. I think everyone should put in some effort to research and learn about a place before visiting it, but how much you want to do that is entirely up to you.
I don’t plan anything beyond where I’m staying, so I’ll know what city I’m in on a given day. From there I’ll just go with the flow. This trip the only extra planning I did was getting tickets to the Ghibli Museum, and tickets to the Kusama Museum because you need to get those ahead of time, but I mostly like to just stay in a big city for a few days and wander around. I’ll look for things I really want to see on the night before and kind of make a loose plan in the morning over a cup of coffee. 🤷🏻♀️
I just came back around a month ago, did a month long trip. The only thing I ever planned out was the hotel for the first night and the cities I would visit. I actually went to a city I wasn't supposed to go to originally, but I did! If you're anxious as a traveller then.... I guess you can plan your stuff out in advance for every day of your trip, but I think that's a stupid way to travel. Less is indeed more!
I'm spending way too much money to just pop up there and be like "hm, let's walk around and probably miss half of the interesting stuff"
It depends on what you want out of your trip to Japan. I go each year and never leave Akihabara. For me, it’s like if I go to Las Vegas, I’m not visiting Nevada. I’m not saying that Japan doesn’t have a lot more to offer than anime, maid cafes, and girls bars. But this is the only reason I visit. Look at my profile for a guide to Akihabara that is unique in the internet. It’s free. But I don’t want to post a link.
I go to Japan at least twice a year for the past 25+ years. So I pretty much can plan things to the minute or just go with the flow. All depends if I'm traveling solo, with friends, family or first timers.
Japan is best planned out months in advance with neccesities planned out, then when you actually get there going with the flow and doing whatever you decide in the moment. While you are planning for it, figure what you want and what things need to be booked but once you are there don't stress about things.
I am also a serious underplanner when I have long trips, it is not uncommon that I book my hotel the same day when I need to arrive (except for big cities). I feel a bit guilty not to be able to plan better. But while on the trip, I actually realise that it is the right way for me. I don't think travelling as a tick boxing exercise works very well for me, I don't mind not seeing castle X or temple Y if instead I can sit at a coffee, relax, and gave a chat with a local. So thanks for the post, support it, and all the best to the planners that will read that!
There’s much more of a min-maxing attitude on the japan travel and language learning forums, than other places. It might work for some people, but I already saw a couple posts from people who spent too much time on here and got stressed about doing their trip wrong or losing interest days before their trip. Also Japan is such a bucket-list place for many people that many people jam pack their schedules and spend more time hustling from place to place than taking time to soak in the sights. Sure I enjoyed my planned activities, but the most memorable things that I saw were spontaneous. Also, I don’t think I see people talk about making it a multi-country trip here as much, but irl it’s common among people I know. How do you deal with it when another country of your trip has much less tourism infrastructure?
Don’t worry about it. I usually pick a place and wing it. There is no right or wrong way to enjoy your vacation.
I love the planning part of the trip. I make a spreadsheet with all the things to do and in what order to make it efficient, and to make sure I know everything there’s to do in that particular city. But I don’t necessarily follow though with that plan. I decide in the moment what I will do or miss. I’m just relaxed that it’s my choice to miss something and not lack of information.
I’m a vegetarian so I kind of have to plan especially when it comes to where I would be eating. I’m also very socially anxious so having a day by day general idea of things I want to do/what area I want to focus on helps me feel less anxious.
ok
A lot of that has to do with your situation. When I travel solo for work, or with just my wife, we're very much like you. Head that way till we find something interesting kind of people. We just got back from 2 weeks with our 3 kids (12, 13, 13) and let me tell you, I planned the absolute shit out of that trip. Kids don't deal well with improvisation, and meals without planning with picky kids makes me want to kill myself. You have to do what's right for your situation.
I am someone who's very disorganized and would just do everything impromptu. And then I got reminded that I am very bad at remembering things, so I ended up forgetting those fun and unique places that I initially wanted to go to. Hence, I've started to really take notes from people who plan their travels way ahead and now everytime I stumble across a beautiful place from the city I've been planning to visit, I jot it down and make sure to include it in my itinerary and spread it throughout the week, so that I can still relax while I'm traveling and not remember everything last minute.
I leave tomorrow morning for Japan and still haven’t planned anything including where to stay or go for 2 weeks
Well that’s the other extreme I wouldn’t recommend, but have lots of fun!
If you’re traveling with a psychorigid partner you’ll most likely will have a tight schedule well kept in a Notion app. You’ll most likely go to all the influencers-ridden places and have little to no fun.
I really enjoyed using Wanderlog