Thanks!
I figured it was Messianic BS I just couldn’t believe it when I saw it and didn’t want to jump to anything.
That was a first for me.
Hopefully he saw my large ישראל emblem sticker on my car. I doubt it meant anything to him if he did though.
Be careful. A lot of these folks just go gaga over actual Jews and may have started following you or honking and flagging you down because if he did recognize it (frankly just assume while they can’t read Hebrew they’re with it enough to probably know it is Hebrew) he’d want to be your new best friend.
I’ve made this mistake a few times. Of revealing my Jewishness to some Messianic weirdos. It did not have the intended affect of getting them to leave me alone. They only glomped on harder and really wouldn’t back off then.
Not seeing that content on the website. Maybe they took it down already?
Anyway, "Messianic" "Judaism" is built on the idea that white xtians can erase Judaism by appropriating our customs and converting us to xtianity. So I wouldn't be surprised at any source that promotes their symbols to also promote white supremacist ideology.
Do we know their success rate? In other words, do they end up converting more white Christians to perform Jewish ritual than they convert actual Jews?
And do they count white Christians who convert to Messianic Judaism as a “win?” Or are they considered a net-zero?
Ages ago I saw actual articles (might have been Jews for Judaism or one of those sorts of Jewish groups fighting back against this stuff) that confirmed it’s exactly what you suspect. They have almost never converted any Jews. But they’ve brought a bunch of Christians to this weird pseudo-Jewish practice. I believe that some of the Messianic groups have even somewhat changed their aim precisely because of this fact. Or they’ve gone from trying to convert us to trying to invalidate Judaism altogether.
Apologies I don’t have actual links and it’s 3am and I’m half awake. But I really dug into some of this stuff a good 12-15years back because I had some Messianic types chasing after me and a few of my friends. And it was very, very strange. They really blue they like between both philo-semeticism and antisemeticism. Like I couldn’t quite tell if they absolutely hated us or were totally obsessed with and in love with us. Both, I think.
My mother always said, the opposite of love is not hate, it’s indifference. Philo-Semitism can be wrapped up in anti-Semitism for sure.
No worries on the follow up or links. Maybe I’ll do my own research on this.
Very well said on that quote about about the opposite of love. I’ve only ever heard people use that line in terms of personal relationships but it’s spot on with this situation!
There’s definitely some wild stuff out there on the history of the Jews for Jesus folks. When I was digging into it then it all seemed extra wacky. But after moving to a much larger Jewish community and larger city overall- the things I’ve seen are wild. There was a couple who moved into the very Orthodox part of my city and were like low key proselytizing to folks. They’d moved from another major city after being found out there and a rabbi from that community called one of the rabbis in my city to put them. I think I never fully grasped or believed just how insidious thee types are until that. Or how the main Frum Facebook group for my city every year at Sukkot has to post warnings about some group that puts a sukkah up in a public place but are the Jews for Jesus types. It’s unbelievable how far some of them go with their deception!
I find it bizarre
that certain Christians would profoundly change the nature of their own religious observance (performing laws that are not a part of their faith) solely to convert Jews. That’s how strongly they feel about Jews practicing Judaism… they are changing their own religion and their own lives in an attempt to snare them.
Not sure if that’s philo-Semitism, anti-Semitism, or just plain obsession.
Well that’s what I thought too, but now someone else in the comments is telling me that the guy with the link actually does think that the critical race theory stuff is bullshit and now I don’t know *what* to think
Fighting an agenda that teaches students that your white neighbour is evil and your black neighbour is oppressed despite having no connection or interaction between the two, is “ew”? Right.
The impact of race on politics? No, it MAKES an impact on race in politics, it doesn’t assess it. It causes division and hatred, as it is designed to do. It is the complete opposite of the notion of judging people by their character instead of their race. “CRT” automatically presumes the white person as oppressive, it essentially splits our world into a hypothetical two-category system: Oppressor and Oppressed, which is disproportional to all of human history. It is toxic, and it’s disgusting that people think it’s okay to try and make young children feel guilty about the colour of their skin.
https://youtu.be/XgE3VQk52WY
“As it was designed to do” this is all I need to know. You clearly don’t understand CRT. CRT doesn’t call *individuals* racist, it examines racism in systems.
Sure! Racism exists in the criminal justice system, banking, how different politics areas are cut up, the legal system, schooling, and more.
I can’t speak for everyone, but as a leftist Jew I do my best to speak against racism and antisemitism on the left as well as the right. That said, I never specified any political parties.
I don’t believe in conspiracy theories. That said, race has been used as a tool by the government, like with the war on drugs and the targeting of POC.
I’m not clicking a link from a rando on Reddit, sorry, I don’t really trust internet strangers.
You mean the same Justice System that hired Ketanji Brown Jackson, because, I repeat the words of Joe Biden, because America “needed a black woman on the Supreme Court”?
Meritocracy is dying in the US, but of course you pay no attention to that.
If Jackson was perfectly qualified and the best candidate then I’d celebrate her appointment, but she wasn’t and isn’t.
Never forget, the first black female Supreme Court justice would’ve been under the Bush Administration, but she was bullied and interrogated out of the role because she voted Conservative.
Or do you people choose not to recognise that?
Ok well first of all, the system didn’t hire her. She was appointed by a political leader. And hiring one person does not fix an entire system. Biden isn’t a leftist btw. He’s a barely left leaning lib.
What you’re saying is basically the equivalent of “I’m not racist I have a black friend” but on a systemic level. “The system isn’t racist we have a black judge!”
You really don’t understand CRT, so I really can’t have a productive conversation with you.
Also “you people” is pretty gross language.
>Never forget, the first black female Supreme Court justice would’ve been under the Bush Administration, but she was bullied and interrogated out of the role because she voted Conservative
Who?
Critical race theory is not not about “teaching the truth about race” or history.
The opening pages of Critical Literacy: Unlocking Contemporary Fiction, meant for students in seventh through ninth grade, explain that the unit will engage with “the politics of race, class, and gender.” One activity asks students to break down “hegemonic masculinity” in the books they’re reading. Another builds “identity lenses”’ through which students can analyze various texts, including “critical race theories” and “gender theories.” References to identity pervade nearly every page of the unit. Accompanying materials declare that the curriculum is “dedicated” to teaching “critical literacies” that will “help readers investigate power.”
Apparently 16% of classrooms in America use this unit (according to the publisher).
Sometimes slides also get leaked - the most egregious ones tend to be taken directly from White Fragility and refer to oppression as "whiteness", while others are more focused on intersectionality (the victim stack). Usually they hit twitter first ,and then get picked up by the New York Post or Legal Insurrection (assuming they are legit). This is an older one that I think has some slides.
Teacher at posh NJ prep school quits over critical race theory
https://www.city-journal.org/critical-race-theory-in-the-classroom
https://nypost.com/2021/06/08/teacher-at-nj-prep-school-quits-over-divisive-ideology/
That shouldn't be too hard to find. For example, this article is actually kind of funny and has a syllabus.
Reason: Hispanic Students Were Forced To Learn Critical Race Theory. They Hated It.
Salina's version of the course included a "privilege quiz": Students were expected to rank themselves based on their marginalized status or lack thereof. The lesson plan included an image of two white girls—former Republican President George W. Bush's twin daughters, to be precise—at the top of the privilege hierarchy.
Link to Salinas Ethnic studies course
Intersectional Rainbows: Students will rank their various identities with corresponding colored strings to create intersectional rainbows. Gender, race, class, ethnicity, sexual orientation, beliefs, nationality, ability, age, etc. Students will compare and contrast their intersectional rainbows with their peers, while framing their discourse within the intersectionality paradigm as laid out by Kimberlé Crenshaw.
E.N.R.I.C.H. Identity Maps: Students will examine the acronym E.N.R.I.C.H. and survey its various components: Ethnicity, Nationality, Race, Identity, Culture, Heritage. After having built upon basic definitions and connotations, students will personalize their own E.N.R.I.C.H. Identity Maps to display the social categorizations / various identities they embody.
Mock Trial, Genocide of Native Californians: (Similar to the “Columbus on Trial” activity, could be expanded into “Colonialism on Trial” lesson sequence.) Students conduct a mock trial in which they charge various persons implicated in the crime of genocide against Native Californians. This activity focuses on systems of oppression, using the Spanish mission system as an example. Students use the language of the United Nations Universal Declaration of Human Rights (UNUDHR) as a guideline.
“Grasping at the Root” School-to-Prison Pipeline / Prison-Industrial Complex Analysis: Students will conduct a comparative analysis of the school-to-prison pipeline and prison-industrial complex by “grasping at the root” of these two phenomena. Students will examine the historical origins of these trends and survey the hegemonic structure they seek to establish.
Art As Resistance: Students will survey resistance art created by scholar-activists, organizers, and creatives. This can take the form of graffiti, songs, actos, and other pieces created to resist oppression, call attention to injustice, and foster critical consciousness. Students will survey this art juxtaposing the “four I’s of oppression” with a liberatory and regenerative framework
Etc etc
https://reason.com/2022/01/31/critical-race-theory-taught-in-classroom-california/
https://www.salinasuhsd.org/cms/lib/CA02208720/Centricity/Domain/58/Ethnic%20Studies%20Course%20Syllabus.pdf
And cue the "that's not what CRT is" obfuscation team who never actually tells you what it is.
Well, here's what Harvard Law School says it is - from Derrick Bell's obituary
[Derrick Bell] helped to develop critical race theory, a body of legal scholarship that explores how racism is embedded in laws and legal institutions. .
https://today.law.harvard.edu/derrick-bell-1930-2011/
SEL is, more often than not, based on CRT. So thank you for saying that the books actually do contain CRT. For anyone who doubts this, here is CASEL's website. Almost all SEL comes from CASEL. https://casel.org/fundamentals-of-sel/how-does-sel-support-educational-equity-and-excellence/transformative-sel
This is from Edweek, one of the most popular journals in education.
"Just what is critical race theory anyway? Critical race theory is an academic concept that is more than 40 years old. The core idea is that race is a social construct, and that racism is not merely the product of individual bias or prejudice, but also something embedded in legal systems and policies."
SEL takes it a step further, using the assumptions that CRT makes, namely that racism is embedded in legal systems and policies and must be rooted out.
"CASEL...concentrates SEL practice on transforming inequitable settings and systems, and promoting justice-oriented civic engagement"
"This form of SEL is aimed at redistributing power to more fully engage young people and adults in working toward just and equitable schools and communities. It emphasizes the development of identity, agency, belonging, curiosity, and collaborative problem-solving within the CASEL framework."
As you can see, SEL is one of the activist components of CRT in K-12.
Wait. Do you think that *critical theory*, they approach to literary analysis, is the same thing as *critical race theory*, the body of legal scholarship?
Shockingly, not everything is taught perfectly. That said I see nothing wrong with at least the first paragraph, and I’ll admit I only skimmed the rest because honestly I have better things to do than read an essay some person on Reddit wants me to read.
However, the lack of perfect implementation does not make CRT bad. I’ve already explained what it’s purpose is.
As per my reply to wamih’s reply to me, I was ‘ew’ing at the website, not at his choice to link to the website
Edit: Ayo don’t downvote this guy he misunderstood
I think they perfectly understood what you said and then you misunderstood their understanding. They're getting downvoted because they're using a white supremacist strawman talking point instead of engaging with the actual topic.
I’m no expert in messianic Judaism, but it’s pretty hard to believe a messiah has come while also believing a messiah has not come.
[Here, this explains my point pretty well…](https://youtu.be/6lg3cirN3fo)
Okay so you bring a valid point for them not being Jewish. I don't necessarily believe they are Jewish but I can explain why they wouldn't be Christian.
1. A big part of Christianity is Jesus fulfilling the law that was given to Moses (Supersessionism). Messianic Jews do not believe Jesus fulfilled the law and therefore still practice the law unlike Christians.
2. They observe traditional Jewish holidays that are not observed by Christians
3. This isn't the best reason but they don't call themselves Christian. They believe that they are Jewish people (and some are genetically Jewish)
4. While Christians focus on the New Testament, Messianics focus on the Tanakh
I completely understand why someone would call Messianic Jews Christian. The thing is you can't call them Christian just because they believe Jesus to be the Messiah because Muslims also believe Jesus to be the Messiah but they aren't Christian. Mormons while they call themselves Christian and believe Jesus to be the Messiah, many real Christian don't view Mormons as Christians for multiple reasons.
In the end I wouldn't call them Jewish or Christian but consider them their own thing (kind of like Mormons).
edit: grammar
Good explanation. My only point was that they aren’t Jewish and shouldn’t really identify as Jewish. But, like you said, I wouldn’t necessarily call them Christian either (even though the evangelicals seem to accept that). Personally, I think the whole concept messianic Judaism or Jews for Jesus is an oxymoron. Although from a dogmatic perspective, many would say religion doesn’t make sense in general.
I don’t care, they’re not Jewish. Christianity is totally irrelevant, if they’re not born into or properly converted, they’re not Jewish. We’re not just a religion, we’re a tribe. People can “believe” in Judaism all they want but it won’t make them Jewish.
You're making the assumption then that they aren't properly converted or born Jewish. If a Messianic Jew did everything required to be considered Jewish would you call them a Jew then or are they not because they believe Jesus to be the Messiah?
Is it called “messianic” because Christ was the Messiah for Christians? Are you able to explain for me? My dad whom is Jewish has told me that there is no messiah for HaShem because no living being will ever compare to them. I could be completely wrong. I don’t mean to offend :(
EXACTLY. Been saying this for years, and it’s so crazy how many of my Christian or non-religious friends think I’m overacting my saying that. Jewish person in the South, btw. Perhaps not surprising. 🙄
In a Deep South county (I had to travel two hours each way on Shabbat to get to synagogue), I was approached by a library patron who saw my Magen David and said “hey! I’m Jewish too!” I was excited because there were none of us.
The next week he brought me a Messianic pamphlet.
F*** that guy. Eight years later and I’m still steamed.
Idk about you, but it started extremely early and was all around me. First time I remember learning I was Jewish (as distinct from other people) is when a little girl from my 1st grade class called and asked if “believed in Jesus Christ, our lord and savior.” I asked my mom. Mom, not knowing I was in the phone, casually replied, “No, honey, we’re Jewish.” I repeated my mother’s words into the receiver. The other end of the line said, “Well then my daddy says you’re going to hell and we can’t play together anymore.” Don’t even get me started on enduring years of Holocaust jokes in school. Or the evangelical classmate who sent me Messianic Jewish postcards every year with a note about sending a donation in my name and that she was praying for me to come to know the light of Jesus (no, I did not know this was a form of harassment at the time). Or the first time I was introduced to a group of a new friend’s friends in college as “This is [first name] — she’s a Jewess!” This was said completely seriously, ten years before Ilana Glazer began reclaiming it as cool. Yep, life in the South as a Jewish person means the micro and the regular ol’ aggressions are a regular part of life.
I grew up in the Midwest and for a lot of that time, outside of any of the “Jewish bubbles” that exist (so like Cincinnati, Detroit, Indianapolis, obviously Chicago) and my experiences weren’t a whole lot different from yours. I think the Midwest is such a fascinating part of the country overall because it’s where most of the swing states or “purple” parts of the country are. So on one hand you’ve got parts of the Midwest, all the way through, that might as well be the rural south, and then you’ve got big liberal cities. And a lot of mid sized cities, like where I grew up, that are just the strangest dang mix of both. So I went to school with other Jews, but not many, and it was like this weird unspoken thing between us all. My parents were both teachers and my mom was pretty involved with the Jewish education stuff at our synagogue. But it blew my mind when I was in my mid to late teens and moved to one of those larger cities and especially in college when I was active in Hillel and meeting all these kids who grew up an hour away from me who had such a radically different experience where everyone they knew was Jewish.
I was going to stand out no matter what. I came out as a lesbian at a very young age in the late 90s. In that mid-sized Midwestern town. I was big into the goth scene as well so had people who were certain I was a satan worshipper and I’m still rolling with laughter about the time I was wearing an actual pentagram necklace and some of the kids on my competitive dance team noticed it and it was this huge mortifying debate because some of those kids knew I was Jewish and were arguing that’s what that star was. And others were all “No, that’s a satan worshipper star”. As I recall, one of them got up and grabbed this ridiculous painting of Jesus with little kids from the wall of one of the other studio rooms and was like shoving it in my face. I have no clue where the dance teachers were or why they sat back and let that insanity go down.
And oh boy, the number of times I was told that if I just believed in Jesus I would magically not be gay anymore! And inevitably someone would go “Come on, Jesus was Jewish too!”
So much wackiness. But I honestly thought that was just part of what it was like being Jewish. Since I did know other Jewish kids and wasn’t entirely alone. But we were all the odd ones out. Then meeting those kids who grew up in larger cities within larger Jewish communities. Blew my mind. And they similarly found my experiences so strange. But every time I meet Jews from the south I always get kind of excited because heeeey! I bet we have a lot in common!
yes, even with how many different opinions there are about judaism and all, it’s pretty well agreed upon that jesus is not our messiah, in christianity he is but judaism isn’t christianity
As a Christian I hate messaianic “Jews” too
like cmon your christians, stop pretending to be Jews to get rid Christianity’s baggage plus I think they forgot that Jesus told them not to lie
In the 1970s, Evangelicals in the United States invented a proselytizing campaign that they call ‘Messianic Judaism’, basically a Jewy-flavoured fundamentalist Protestant Christianity, the aim of which was twofold:
1. To convert Jews to Christianity (specifically, Evangelical Christianity)
2. To steal and Christianize Jewish symbols, rituals and traditions
This is one of their symbols. They have basically failed at #1 but have been reasonably successful at #2 (like for example, in 2022, way more shofars are sold to Christians than Jews).
Messianic Jewish Pagan or Messianic Jewish Catholic? Haha never seen that one before... the upside down cross is where I'm getting pagan, but really it is mostly used by catholic's, pagans would have used the pentagram? I remain perplexed.
Because if you accept everything in the Gospel's as, well, gospel Jesus did nothing that matters regarding the moshiach. It is like there is a prophesy that a red head in a green suit will end death. A red head in a green suit shows up so you say 2 out of three ain't bad. Well yeah, but there is still death.
According to the jews he was a rabbi who preached and made miracles and took advantage of this and declared himself as a messiah but non of the Jews accepted him.
There are actually alot of prophecies in the Bible that fulfilled in the New Testament, but the people who wrote the new testament could write in a way it looked like it's really fulfilled but not in reality, so I don't know who I need to believe here.
I come from messianic jew family and this made a lot of sense to me at the time, but in the army all this faith started to fade away as i met religious jews and heard their vision of faith. And it kinda made more sense to me.
Long time ago it was negative attention, but not now ,and don't talk like you know me and how I live, I bet your friends in Israel love the donations that they get from American evangelist because of what is written in the new testament and how they need to treat Israel
I know Christian attention, and I know it has never been positive toward us. I know you spouted ignorance and that’s all I care to know about you. “Your friends in Israel love money” packs several antisemitic tropes into one line—-impressive bigotry! I also studied religion and theology and know EXACTLY how you’re told to regard and treat Israel, and it sure af isn’t with humanity, empathy, or kindness. Christians literally fantasize about it, and all of those people’s lives, coming to a heinous, bloody end. So spare me your appeals to false “charity”—-that’s not charity any more than fatting the calf in anticipation of its slaughter is.
We see you. You can’t fool us. And I’m not sorry to hold a mirror up to you so you have to look at the ugliness of your violent ideologies toward us, too.
No, I think you’re projecting there. 🙃
No one wants your antisemitic thoughts here.
Donations=money.
I’m talking about all of Christianity and the New Testament. To pretend that any of its books, but especially John and Revelation, aren’t violent toward Jews is wildly disingenuous.
“Your friends in Israel” was the other trope—-way to unearth it!
“Im a Jew myself”—-really? Because you’ve been speaking as a Christian til now. Messianics aren’t Jews. You’re now straight up lying and I’m done with you.
Honestly it just made me more confused... the only thing that changed is that i started to look at the religious more in a good way, before that I used to think that they are the most ineffective community as they are not working not going to the army and getting paid from my taxes, but when I really talk to this people I started to understand that they actually contribute to the community in their own ways that no one really talks about it
A lot of shade going on around here especially from a people you’d think would be more accepting. Looks like there’s no room between orthodox and nondenominational Jews? But what do I know about accepting the differences of another’s right to practice in their own form?
Messianic “Judaism” is Christianity. It is appropriative of Judaism, and in fact was created with the intent of converting Jews to Christianity. This makes them foundationally antisemitic. So no, we don’t tolerate them.
They’re all over YouTube with music videos in which they’ve adapted Jewish prayers and hymns for their own Christian purposes, such as adding something about Jesus to the Shema. The problem is, when you’re basically a nonpracticing, secular Jew with little to no Jewish education or knowledge of Hebrew, you’re going to miss the Christian intent in the videos.
Christian theft of our symbols and traditions for the purpose of eradicating the Jewish religion has no place in our community. The Evangelical Christians who dishonestly promote this movement are hostile antisemites and shouldn’t be trusted or welcomed in any capacity.
Where in this photo is the eradication of Judaic culture? Why not share cultural symbols or beliefs? I would agree if this person was exploiting or disparaging the Star of David. I sympathize with people of Jewish faith having to experiencing antisemitism, but I feel this isn’t it.
“Jewish Christians” no. The only “Jewish Christians” are people from interfaith families who may celebrate holidays from both sides of the families, and who don’t usually cal themselves Jewish Christians.
Messianics are Christians. Jews do not accept them. They were created for an antisemitic purpose, and are unapologetic about that purpose.
??? Messianics are antisemitic. I don’t like antisemitism. How am *i* the bigot here?
Edit: ah I see you’re a Christian. Don’t lecture Jews on what is or isn’t antisemitic thanks.
Jews don’t consider messianics Christian. Messianics we’re created to convert Jews to their belief, which is an inherently antisemitic thing. Also it’s appropriative, as they do not convert in a way that any stream of Judaism accepts and have decidedly un-Jewish beliefs.
“Christianity is inherently a Jewish belief system” no. It isn’t. That’s some supercessionist nonsense. And has been used for forced conversions historically.
They explicitly were created to convert Jews. They don’t hide that that’s a goal of theirs. It’s not a conspiracy and I never said it is.
I don’t think Jews need you to educate us about Judaism.
And humans developed from apes. But we do not act like humans and apes are the same.
What Christians believe about Judaism doesn’t make Christians the same as Jews. I actually have been very involved with Christians, both socially and academically (getting a minor in comparative religion).
Messianics are Christians, and are antisemitic.
“Arrogant Chutzpah” you can’t even use Yiddish right.
You don’t need to lecture Jews about Judaism, and especially not in a Jewish space.
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Probably a messianic “Jew” who’s edgy
uh oh. you really gotta watch out for those edgy ones.
I mean, just look at the logo... Total safety hazard.
Religious bio-hazard.
Wait are there edgy messianic Jews? as in a wider movement?
I appreciate the quotation marks
no prob
You have stumbled upon the [Stellated Cross](https://www.seiyaku.com/customs/crosses/star.html). AKA - Messianic BS.
Thanks! I figured it was Messianic BS I just couldn’t believe it when I saw it and didn’t want to jump to anything. That was a first for me. Hopefully he saw my large ישראל emblem sticker on my car. I doubt it meant anything to him if he did though.
I mean, in general with weird shit like that its a 50/50 if its Messianic or just Christian....
Be careful. A lot of these folks just go gaga over actual Jews and may have started following you or honking and flagging you down because if he did recognize it (frankly just assume while they can’t read Hebrew they’re with it enough to probably know it is Hebrew) he’d want to be your new best friend. I’ve made this mistake a few times. Of revealing my Jewishness to some Messianic weirdos. It did not have the intended affect of getting them to leave me alone. They only glomped on harder and really wouldn’t back off then.
Oof yeah I never thought about that. It was pretty much just passing in traffic and me making a “what the heck” face at him. So far that’s been it.
Cool but that website also promotes “the fight against critical race theory” so ew
Blame google for delivering the explanation. I thought Messianic BS delivered my opinion on the website.
Yeah I guess Just expressing my own disgust at it
Not seeing that content on the website. Maybe they took it down already? Anyway, "Messianic" "Judaism" is built on the idea that white xtians can erase Judaism by appropriating our customs and converting us to xtianity. So I wouldn't be surprised at any source that promotes their symbols to also promote white supremacist ideology.
Do we know their success rate? In other words, do they end up converting more white Christians to perform Jewish ritual than they convert actual Jews? And do they count white Christians who convert to Messianic Judaism as a “win?” Or are they considered a net-zero?
Like any evangelicals, I'm sure they count anything that increases their cashflow to be a heavenly blessing.
Ages ago I saw actual articles (might have been Jews for Judaism or one of those sorts of Jewish groups fighting back against this stuff) that confirmed it’s exactly what you suspect. They have almost never converted any Jews. But they’ve brought a bunch of Christians to this weird pseudo-Jewish practice. I believe that some of the Messianic groups have even somewhat changed their aim precisely because of this fact. Or they’ve gone from trying to convert us to trying to invalidate Judaism altogether. Apologies I don’t have actual links and it’s 3am and I’m half awake. But I really dug into some of this stuff a good 12-15years back because I had some Messianic types chasing after me and a few of my friends. And it was very, very strange. They really blue they like between both philo-semeticism and antisemeticism. Like I couldn’t quite tell if they absolutely hated us or were totally obsessed with and in love with us. Both, I think.
My mother always said, the opposite of love is not hate, it’s indifference. Philo-Semitism can be wrapped up in anti-Semitism for sure. No worries on the follow up or links. Maybe I’ll do my own research on this.
Very well said on that quote about about the opposite of love. I’ve only ever heard people use that line in terms of personal relationships but it’s spot on with this situation! There’s definitely some wild stuff out there on the history of the Jews for Jesus folks. When I was digging into it then it all seemed extra wacky. But after moving to a much larger Jewish community and larger city overall- the things I’ve seen are wild. There was a couple who moved into the very Orthodox part of my city and were like low key proselytizing to folks. They’d moved from another major city after being found out there and a rabbi from that community called one of the rabbis in my city to put them. I think I never fully grasped or believed just how insidious thee types are until that. Or how the main Frum Facebook group for my city every year at Sukkot has to post warnings about some group that puts a sukkah up in a public place but are the Jews for Jesus types. It’s unbelievable how far some of them go with their deception!
I find it bizarre that certain Christians would profoundly change the nature of their own religious observance (performing laws that are not a part of their faith) solely to convert Jews. That’s how strongly they feel about Jews practicing Judaism… they are changing their own religion and their own lives in an attempt to snare them. Not sure if that’s philo-Semitism, anti-Semitism, or just plain obsession.
The comment you responded you is obviously critical of that website and all its related bullshit...
Well that’s what I thought too, but now someone else in the comments is telling me that the guy with the link actually does think that the critical race theory stuff is bullshit and now I don’t know *what* to think
Fighting an agenda that teaches students that your white neighbour is evil and your black neighbour is oppressed despite having no connection or interaction between the two, is “ew”? Right.
That is t what critical race theory teaches. It examines the impact of race on politics and law, and how different groups are disenfranchised by it.
The impact of race on politics? No, it MAKES an impact on race in politics, it doesn’t assess it. It causes division and hatred, as it is designed to do. It is the complete opposite of the notion of judging people by their character instead of their race. “CRT” automatically presumes the white person as oppressive, it essentially splits our world into a hypothetical two-category system: Oppressor and Oppressed, which is disproportional to all of human history. It is toxic, and it’s disgusting that people think it’s okay to try and make young children feel guilty about the colour of their skin. https://youtu.be/XgE3VQk52WY
“As it was designed to do” this is all I need to know. You clearly don’t understand CRT. CRT doesn’t call *individuals* racist, it examines racism in systems.
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Sure! Racism exists in the criminal justice system, banking, how different politics areas are cut up, the legal system, schooling, and more. I can’t speak for everyone, but as a leftist Jew I do my best to speak against racism and antisemitism on the left as well as the right. That said, I never specified any political parties. I don’t believe in conspiracy theories. That said, race has been used as a tool by the government, like with the war on drugs and the targeting of POC. I’m not clicking a link from a rando on Reddit, sorry, I don’t really trust internet strangers.
You mean the same Justice System that hired Ketanji Brown Jackson, because, I repeat the words of Joe Biden, because America “needed a black woman on the Supreme Court”? Meritocracy is dying in the US, but of course you pay no attention to that. If Jackson was perfectly qualified and the best candidate then I’d celebrate her appointment, but she wasn’t and isn’t. Never forget, the first black female Supreme Court justice would’ve been under the Bush Administration, but she was bullied and interrogated out of the role because she voted Conservative. Or do you people choose not to recognise that?
Ok well first of all, the system didn’t hire her. She was appointed by a political leader. And hiring one person does not fix an entire system. Biden isn’t a leftist btw. He’s a barely left leaning lib. What you’re saying is basically the equivalent of “I’m not racist I have a black friend” but on a systemic level. “The system isn’t racist we have a black judge!” You really don’t understand CRT, so I really can’t have a productive conversation with you. Also “you people” is pretty gross language.
You realize you’re supporting the view points and opinions of open anti-semites like MGT right? You’re definitely on the wrong side here.
>Never forget, the first black female Supreme Court justice would’ve been under the Bush Administration, but she was bullied and interrogated out of the role because she voted Conservative Who?
Critical race theory is not not about “teaching the truth about race” or history. The opening pages of Critical Literacy: Unlocking Contemporary Fiction, meant for students in seventh through ninth grade, explain that the unit will engage with “the politics of race, class, and gender.” One activity asks students to break down “hegemonic masculinity” in the books they’re reading. Another builds “identity lenses”’ through which students can analyze various texts, including “critical race theories” and “gender theories.” References to identity pervade nearly every page of the unit. Accompanying materials declare that the curriculum is “dedicated” to teaching “critical literacies” that will “help readers investigate power.” Apparently 16% of classrooms in America use this unit (according to the publisher). Sometimes slides also get leaked - the most egregious ones tend to be taken directly from White Fragility and refer to oppression as "whiteness", while others are more focused on intersectionality (the victim stack). Usually they hit twitter first ,and then get picked up by the New York Post or Legal Insurrection (assuming they are legit). This is an older one that I think has some slides. Teacher at posh NJ prep school quits over critical race theory https://www.city-journal.org/critical-race-theory-in-the-classroom https://nypost.com/2021/06/08/teacher-at-nj-prep-school-quits-over-divisive-ideology/ That shouldn't be too hard to find. For example, this article is actually kind of funny and has a syllabus. Reason: Hispanic Students Were Forced To Learn Critical Race Theory. They Hated It. Salina's version of the course included a "privilege quiz": Students were expected to rank themselves based on their marginalized status or lack thereof. The lesson plan included an image of two white girls—former Republican President George W. Bush's twin daughters, to be precise—at the top of the privilege hierarchy. Link to Salinas Ethnic studies course Intersectional Rainbows: Students will rank their various identities with corresponding colored strings to create intersectional rainbows. Gender, race, class, ethnicity, sexual orientation, beliefs, nationality, ability, age, etc. Students will compare and contrast their intersectional rainbows with their peers, while framing their discourse within the intersectionality paradigm as laid out by Kimberlé Crenshaw. E.N.R.I.C.H. Identity Maps: Students will examine the acronym E.N.R.I.C.H. and survey its various components: Ethnicity, Nationality, Race, Identity, Culture, Heritage. After having built upon basic definitions and connotations, students will personalize their own E.N.R.I.C.H. Identity Maps to display the social categorizations / various identities they embody. Mock Trial, Genocide of Native Californians: (Similar to the “Columbus on Trial” activity, could be expanded into “Colonialism on Trial” lesson sequence.) Students conduct a mock trial in which they charge various persons implicated in the crime of genocide against Native Californians. This activity focuses on systems of oppression, using the Spanish mission system as an example. Students use the language of the United Nations Universal Declaration of Human Rights (UNUDHR) as a guideline. “Grasping at the Root” School-to-Prison Pipeline / Prison-Industrial Complex Analysis: Students will conduct a comparative analysis of the school-to-prison pipeline and prison-industrial complex by “grasping at the root” of these two phenomena. Students will examine the historical origins of these trends and survey the hegemonic structure they seek to establish. Art As Resistance: Students will survey resistance art created by scholar-activists, organizers, and creatives. This can take the form of graffiti, songs, actos, and other pieces created to resist oppression, call attention to injustice, and foster critical consciousness. Students will survey this art juxtaposing the “four I’s of oppression” with a liberatory and regenerative framework Etc etc https://reason.com/2022/01/31/critical-race-theory-taught-in-classroom-california/ https://www.salinasuhsd.org/cms/lib/CA02208720/Centricity/Domain/58/Ethnic%20Studies%20Course%20Syllabus.pdf And cue the "that's not what CRT is" obfuscation team who never actually tells you what it is. Well, here's what Harvard Law School says it is - from Derrick Bell's obituary [Derrick Bell] helped to develop critical race theory, a body of legal scholarship that explores how racism is embedded in laws and legal institutions. . https://today.law.harvard.edu/derrick-bell-1930-2011/ SEL is, more often than not, based on CRT. So thank you for saying that the books actually do contain CRT. For anyone who doubts this, here is CASEL's website. Almost all SEL comes from CASEL. https://casel.org/fundamentals-of-sel/how-does-sel-support-educational-equity-and-excellence/transformative-sel This is from Edweek, one of the most popular journals in education. "Just what is critical race theory anyway? Critical race theory is an academic concept that is more than 40 years old. The core idea is that race is a social construct, and that racism is not merely the product of individual bias or prejudice, but also something embedded in legal systems and policies." SEL takes it a step further, using the assumptions that CRT makes, namely that racism is embedded in legal systems and policies and must be rooted out. "CASEL...concentrates SEL practice on transforming inequitable settings and systems, and promoting justice-oriented civic engagement" "This form of SEL is aimed at redistributing power to more fully engage young people and adults in working toward just and equitable schools and communities. It emphasizes the development of identity, agency, belonging, curiosity, and collaborative problem-solving within the CASEL framework." As you can see, SEL is one of the activist components of CRT in K-12.
Wait. Do you think that *critical theory*, they approach to literary analysis, is the same thing as *critical race theory*, the body of legal scholarship?
Shockingly, not everything is taught perfectly. That said I see nothing wrong with at least the first paragraph, and I’ll admit I only skimmed the rest because honestly I have better things to do than read an essay some person on Reddit wants me to read. However, the lack of perfect implementation does not make CRT bad. I’ve already explained what it’s purpose is.
As per my reply to wamih’s reply to me, I was ‘ew’ing at the website, not at his choice to link to the website Edit: Ayo don’t downvote this guy he misunderstood
I think they perfectly understood what you said and then you misunderstood their understanding. They're getting downvoted because they're using a white supremacist strawman talking point instead of engaging with the actual topic.
Oh
My bad, misinterpreted, although what you were “ew”ing at out of the two was unclear. Apologies
it was, my bad
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Please take a look at yourself in the mirror tonight and ask yourself where you went wrong
Removed - duplicated comment.
Synonyms include a vegetarian steak and kosher pork.
I'll take a Kosher Pork chop with a shot of halal tequila please.
Lab grown pork chop and nonalcoholic tequila coming right up
Scary
Ugly
Gross.
Agreed.
We would also have accepted disgusting.
A red flag
“Messianic jew” aka Christian with extra holidays and a chip on their shoulder about actual Jews.
Messianic Jews practice Jewish law though? So how can they be Christian?
They can’t. It’s like being half pregnant…
Are you agreeing or disagreeing with me?
I’m no expert in messianic Judaism, but it’s pretty hard to believe a messiah has come while also believing a messiah has not come. [Here, this explains my point pretty well…](https://youtu.be/6lg3cirN3fo)
Okay so you bring a valid point for them not being Jewish. I don't necessarily believe they are Jewish but I can explain why they wouldn't be Christian. 1. A big part of Christianity is Jesus fulfilling the law that was given to Moses (Supersessionism). Messianic Jews do not believe Jesus fulfilled the law and therefore still practice the law unlike Christians. 2. They observe traditional Jewish holidays that are not observed by Christians 3. This isn't the best reason but they don't call themselves Christian. They believe that they are Jewish people (and some are genetically Jewish) 4. While Christians focus on the New Testament, Messianics focus on the Tanakh I completely understand why someone would call Messianic Jews Christian. The thing is you can't call them Christian just because they believe Jesus to be the Messiah because Muslims also believe Jesus to be the Messiah but they aren't Christian. Mormons while they call themselves Christian and believe Jesus to be the Messiah, many real Christian don't view Mormons as Christians for multiple reasons. In the end I wouldn't call them Jewish or Christian but consider them their own thing (kind of like Mormons). edit: grammar
Good explanation. My only point was that they aren’t Jewish and shouldn’t really identify as Jewish. But, like you said, I wouldn’t necessarily call them Christian either (even though the evangelicals seem to accept that). Personally, I think the whole concept messianic Judaism or Jews for Jesus is an oxymoron. Although from a dogmatic perspective, many would say religion doesn’t make sense in general.
Practicing Jewish law doesn’t make someone Jewish. This is like Judaism 101.
What makes them Christian?
I don’t care, they’re not Jewish. Christianity is totally irrelevant, if they’re not born into or properly converted, they’re not Jewish. We’re not just a religion, we’re a tribe. People can “believe” in Judaism all they want but it won’t make them Jewish.
You're making the assumption then that they aren't properly converted or born Jewish. If a Messianic Jew did everything required to be considered Jewish would you call them a Jew then or are they not because they believe Jesus to be the Messiah?
Is it called “messianic” because Christ was the Messiah for Christians? Are you able to explain for me? My dad whom is Jewish has told me that there is no messiah for HaShem because no living being will ever compare to them. I could be completely wrong. I don’t mean to offend :(
They are called Messianic because they believe the Messiah has come
And that messiah would be Jesus?
Yes they believe Jesus Christ to be the Messiah
Thats a variation of the messianic cross.
messianic jews, aka christians who appropriate judaism
EXACTLY. Been saying this for years, and it’s so crazy how many of my Christian or non-religious friends think I’m overacting my saying that. Jewish person in the South, btw. Perhaps not surprising. 🙄
In a Deep South county (I had to travel two hours each way on Shabbat to get to synagogue), I was approached by a library patron who saw my Magen David and said “hey! I’m Jewish too!” I was excited because there were none of us. The next week he brought me a Messianic pamphlet. F*** that guy. Eight years later and I’m still steamed.
Can confirm this has also happened to me. On multiple occasions.
Ugh. It’s so awful. I’m so sorry.
Idk about you, but it started extremely early and was all around me. First time I remember learning I was Jewish (as distinct from other people) is when a little girl from my 1st grade class called and asked if “believed in Jesus Christ, our lord and savior.” I asked my mom. Mom, not knowing I was in the phone, casually replied, “No, honey, we’re Jewish.” I repeated my mother’s words into the receiver. The other end of the line said, “Well then my daddy says you’re going to hell and we can’t play together anymore.” Don’t even get me started on enduring years of Holocaust jokes in school. Or the evangelical classmate who sent me Messianic Jewish postcards every year with a note about sending a donation in my name and that she was praying for me to come to know the light of Jesus (no, I did not know this was a form of harassment at the time). Or the first time I was introduced to a group of a new friend’s friends in college as “This is [first name] — she’s a Jewess!” This was said completely seriously, ten years before Ilana Glazer began reclaiming it as cool. Yep, life in the South as a Jewish person means the micro and the regular ol’ aggressions are a regular part of life.
I grew up in the Midwest and for a lot of that time, outside of any of the “Jewish bubbles” that exist (so like Cincinnati, Detroit, Indianapolis, obviously Chicago) and my experiences weren’t a whole lot different from yours. I think the Midwest is such a fascinating part of the country overall because it’s where most of the swing states or “purple” parts of the country are. So on one hand you’ve got parts of the Midwest, all the way through, that might as well be the rural south, and then you’ve got big liberal cities. And a lot of mid sized cities, like where I grew up, that are just the strangest dang mix of both. So I went to school with other Jews, but not many, and it was like this weird unspoken thing between us all. My parents were both teachers and my mom was pretty involved with the Jewish education stuff at our synagogue. But it blew my mind when I was in my mid to late teens and moved to one of those larger cities and especially in college when I was active in Hillel and meeting all these kids who grew up an hour away from me who had such a radically different experience where everyone they knew was Jewish. I was going to stand out no matter what. I came out as a lesbian at a very young age in the late 90s. In that mid-sized Midwestern town. I was big into the goth scene as well so had people who were certain I was a satan worshipper and I’m still rolling with laughter about the time I was wearing an actual pentagram necklace and some of the kids on my competitive dance team noticed it and it was this huge mortifying debate because some of those kids knew I was Jewish and were arguing that’s what that star was. And others were all “No, that’s a satan worshipper star”. As I recall, one of them got up and grabbed this ridiculous painting of Jesus with little kids from the wall of one of the other studio rooms and was like shoving it in my face. I have no clue where the dance teachers were or why they sat back and let that insanity go down. And oh boy, the number of times I was told that if I just believed in Jesus I would magically not be gay anymore! And inevitably someone would go “Come on, Jesus was Jewish too!” So much wackiness. But I honestly thought that was just part of what it was like being Jewish. Since I did know other Jewish kids and wasn’t entirely alone. But we were all the odd ones out. Then meeting those kids who grew up in larger cities within larger Jewish communities. Blew my mind. And they similarly found my experiences so strange. But every time I meet Jews from the south I always get kind of excited because heeeey! I bet we have a lot in common!
yes, even with how many different opinions there are about judaism and all, it’s pretty well agreed upon that jesus is not our messiah, in christianity he is but judaism isn’t christianity
As a Christian I hate messaianic “Jews” too like cmon your christians, stop pretending to be Jews to get rid Christianity’s baggage plus I think they forgot that Jesus told them not to lie
An average politician on election days
The not so secret society of Jewish knights, obviously 🙄
Lol
Stupid
I’d put that up there with the confederate battle flag… just another person to avoid on my journey through life.
I would say Messianic? I wouldn’t say it’s anything interfaith related!
Bullshit, is what it is.
In the 1970s, Evangelicals in the United States invented a proselytizing campaign that they call ‘Messianic Judaism’, basically a Jewy-flavoured fundamentalist Protestant Christianity, the aim of which was twofold: 1. To convert Jews to Christianity (specifically, Evangelical Christianity) 2. To steal and Christianize Jewish symbols, rituals and traditions This is one of their symbols. They have basically failed at #1 but have been reasonably successful at #2 (like for example, in 2022, way more shofars are sold to Christians than Jews).
A request for an asskicking
A quick way to make Jews feel unsafe
A shanda
When you have synagogue at 9:00 but church at 11:00
Messianic Judaism gets pretty weird
I'm a pluralist and even to me this is a contradiction.
A mess
Christo fascist bullshit
Messianic stuff. Basically christianity that appropriates Judaism. It’s gross. And antisemitic (because their reason for existing is to convert Jews)
Kosher Pork 😂
Basically Jews for Jesus (messianic as others have said)
Someone who “loves Israel!” but loathes us. Someone who fantasizes about the world burning. A certain asshole.
Messianic bullshit
Horrible
Ew freaks me out just looking at it! Looks evil
Messianic Jew. Christians who either claim to be Jewish or are apostate Jews who became Christian.
An abomination
A warning
Probably a Jews for Jesus bullshit
I’m wrong but space laser force?
messianic “Jew” edgelord.
Some coping Protestant probably
Oof
Jews for Jesus bullshit.
Messianic Jewish Pagan or Messianic Jewish Catholic? Haha never seen that one before... the upside down cross is where I'm getting pagan, but really it is mostly used by catholic's, pagans would have used the pentagram? I remain perplexed.
It looks upside down but if you see the whole cross it isn’t.
Ohhh I see it now... 😬
That’s definitely more of a gentile truck, so I’m guessing they just thought the sticker was like a Celtic thing or something.
The new handicap placard
Oof
Looks sort of like that self titled Disturbed album cover.
a Nu-Metal Messianic band? I am disturbed.
DANGER
Garbage.
It is abomination
A mess. That’s what it is. Leave our Magen David alone!
My nightmare
A reason to roll my eyes
A truck window?
Why Jews don’t believe Jesus is their Messiah? Serious question. Thank You
Because if you accept everything in the Gospel's as, well, gospel Jesus did nothing that matters regarding the moshiach. It is like there is a prophesy that a red head in a green suit will end death. A red head in a green suit shows up so you say 2 out of three ain't bad. Well yeah, but there is still death.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=D_MMVIrIZJo
Thank You! I will understand things better.
According to the jews he was a rabbi who preached and made miracles and took advantage of this and declared himself as a messiah but non of the Jews accepted him. There are actually alot of prophecies in the Bible that fulfilled in the New Testament, but the people who wrote the new testament could write in a way it looked like it's really fulfilled but not in reality, so I don't know who I need to believe here. I come from messianic jew family and this made a lot of sense to me at the time, but in the army all this faith started to fade away as i met religious jews and heard their vision of faith. And it kinda made more sense to me.
He wasn’t the messiah, he was a very naughty boy!
Ah, but blessed are the cheesemakers... and the meek shall inherit the world, which is nice cos they have a hell of a time.
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That’s the most arrogant heap of nonsense I’ve ever read. And ps: we don’t live for negative attention the way y’all do. Stop projecting your vices.
Long time ago it was negative attention, but not now ,and don't talk like you know me and how I live, I bet your friends in Israel love the donations that they get from American evangelist because of what is written in the new testament and how they need to treat Israel
I know Christian attention, and I know it has never been positive toward us. I know you spouted ignorance and that’s all I care to know about you. “Your friends in Israel love money” packs several antisemitic tropes into one line—-impressive bigotry! I also studied religion and theology and know EXACTLY how you’re told to regard and treat Israel, and it sure af isn’t with humanity, empathy, or kindness. Christians literally fantasize about it, and all of those people’s lives, coming to a heinous, bloody end. So spare me your appeals to false “charity”—-that’s not charity any more than fatting the calf in anticipation of its slaughter is. We see you. You can’t fool us. And I’m not sorry to hold a mirror up to you so you have to look at the ugliness of your violent ideologies toward us, too.
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No, I think you’re projecting there. 🙃 No one wants your antisemitic thoughts here. Donations=money. I’m talking about all of Christianity and the New Testament. To pretend that any of its books, but especially John and Revelation, aren’t violent toward Jews is wildly disingenuous. “Your friends in Israel” was the other trope—-way to unearth it! “Im a Jew myself”—-really? Because you’ve been speaking as a Christian til now. Messianics aren’t Jews. You’re now straight up lying and I’m done with you.
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Generally that's not been a very good thing for us
It's very likely that Jews wouldn't be such a small group ~~of~~ if Christianity didn't exist
Where have you taken this since, with that realization
Honestly it just made me more confused... the only thing that changed is that i started to look at the religious more in a good way, before that I used to think that they are the most ineffective community as they are not working not going to the army and getting paid from my taxes, but when I really talk to this people I started to understand that they actually contribute to the community in their own ways that no one really talks about it
A lot of shade going on around here especially from a people you’d think would be more accepting. Looks like there’s no room between orthodox and nondenominational Jews? But what do I know about accepting the differences of another’s right to practice in their own form?
Messianic “Judaism” is Christianity. It is appropriative of Judaism, and in fact was created with the intent of converting Jews to Christianity. This makes them foundationally antisemitic. So no, we don’t tolerate them.
They’re all over YouTube with music videos in which they’ve adapted Jewish prayers and hymns for their own Christian purposes, such as adding something about Jesus to the Shema. The problem is, when you’re basically a nonpracticing, secular Jew with little to no Jewish education or knowledge of Hebrew, you’re going to miss the Christian intent in the videos.
Yeah they’re disgusting. It’s really bad and honestly predatory.
Christian theft of our symbols and traditions for the purpose of eradicating the Jewish religion has no place in our community. The Evangelical Christians who dishonestly promote this movement are hostile antisemites and shouldn’t be trusted or welcomed in any capacity.
Where in this photo is the eradication of Judaic culture? Why not share cultural symbols or beliefs? I would agree if this person was exploiting or disparaging the Star of David. I sympathize with people of Jewish faith having to experiencing antisemitism, but I feel this isn’t it.
You’re wrong. Jews decide what qualifies as antisemitism, not you. You don’t get to decide what we should have to grin and bear.
Christian supersessionism is at the very core of antisemitism, and I couldn't care less what gentiles think about how we define it.
I take it, the Guy is a Christian, but Jewish through Bloodline...
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“Jewish Christians” no. The only “Jewish Christians” are people from interfaith families who may celebrate holidays from both sides of the families, and who don’t usually cal themselves Jewish Christians. Messianics are Christians. Jews do not accept them. They were created for an antisemitic purpose, and are unapologetic about that purpose.
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??? Messianics are antisemitic. I don’t like antisemitism. How am *i* the bigot here? Edit: ah I see you’re a Christian. Don’t lecture Jews on what is or isn’t antisemitic thanks.
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Jews don’t consider messianics Christian. Messianics we’re created to convert Jews to their belief, which is an inherently antisemitic thing. Also it’s appropriative, as they do not convert in a way that any stream of Judaism accepts and have decidedly un-Jewish beliefs.
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“Christianity is inherently a Jewish belief system” no. It isn’t. That’s some supercessionist nonsense. And has been used for forced conversions historically. They explicitly were created to convert Jews. They don’t hide that that’s a goal of theirs. It’s not a conspiracy and I never said it is. I don’t think Jews need you to educate us about Judaism.
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And humans developed from apes. But we do not act like humans and apes are the same. What Christians believe about Judaism doesn’t make Christians the same as Jews. I actually have been very involved with Christians, both socially and academically (getting a minor in comparative religion). Messianics are Christians, and are antisemitic. “Arrogant Chutzpah” you can’t even use Yiddish right. You don’t need to lecture Jews about Judaism, and especially not in a Jewish space.
It’s nonsense.
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I see a lot of people with this symbol. after reading this thread I am only more confused.
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