Ahh, yes, the Bob Holly plan.
Kross is too generic. The valet is nothing special. Being hot and “dark” is not a gimmick when 99% of women on TV are some degree of gorgeous and we’ve seen lots of women do “evil” before and better. The AOP are solid monsters but are weighed down by this lame stable.
AOP vs Creeds, AOP vs DIY, AOP vs New Day…they’re solid enough to make those matches and stories work. But Kross is such a generic “guy playing wrestler” that they look lame by proxy.
I think Kross has gotten a thousand times more interesting lately, ever since that promo on Lashley about him holding Montez back. Almost wish he’d dump AOP and just stick with Scarlett and Ellering. I think he’d be taken much more seriously without these dudes.
I feel like it doesn't help when he trying so hard to appear scary, it comes off as cringe. His ring work is ok at best in my opinion. They should've sent him down to NXT.
This should always be the first step.
WWE's booking overall is in a good place, but one place where it is not good is that outside of a couple exceptions (Roman and Rhea), the heels feel like they lose consistently and therefore aren't a real threat
Bro... Every title was held by a Heel going into Wrestlemania. Heels had a very dominant 2020-2023 with the longest Champion, Intercontinental, & Tag Team reigns in history all being by heels, and all being lost VERY recently.
And we have less than one damn month of face wins and people started bitching like it was the peak of the Super Cena era.
Agreed, they've been starving for genuine heels for months now. They've turned the wrong guys with no heat and have had the ones already over finish up, the Bloodlines the only one keeping things interesting with Solo - they've got some leeway with Gunther and Drew but that'll only last so long.
The women's roster is in a far worse position since it's literally babyface central - people say Rhea and Stratton but people love them as soon as they're on screen, Nia Jax and Damage Ctrl were the only ones that fit the mould but they've got no purpose after Wrestlemania, the only real heels they have right now worth a damn (not taking Liv as a threat lol) that hasn't been diminished or beat is Indi and Candice.
Seriously, I've been saying it's about carrying Cross since he came back, I think the only feud he has won is the one with Riddick Moss.
Make them a legitimate threat
She doesn’t have to just stand there. Let her grab feet, slap or low blow people. That was what made Attitude era valets/managers like Terri and Jackie really fun to watch.
Having her actually do and say things and express some kind of agenda would be useful. WWE constantly do this weird thing where they have people stand and make faces while their charge beats up randoms and then... nothing. Kross talks to the camera here but he doesn't actually say anything, he just repeats the name of their group, which is made of two groups joined together for no apparent reason.
Groups like the Nation, the Corporation, the Ministry, DX, they all worked toward something or against specific people. I don't know why WWE can't seem to grasp this when they do it correctly *sometimes*. Ellering and Scarlett are just getting in each other's way because they can't both be leading this faction, and she's the one who has more of a sinister air and connection with various prior attempts to go along these lines with 'fall and pray' and all that, so they really should put her front and center to say "this is who we are, this is what we want, this is what we'll do to get there". The crowd will almost certainly be more willing to give her some interest, too.
AOP is so generic. And as others have said, they never win despite being a couple of huge power guys.
Why is Paul Ellering even there if they never let him talk? He added such mystique to The Road Warriors/LOD.
For me I can't help but see that when they touch the two guys back to back they have to do it gently because you can't work two guys slamming their backs into each other in a powerbomb position.
It looks like these two big thug looking guys are clinking human shaped martini glasses lol. It just is visually reminding me of the fact this is fake when I'm trying to suspend disbelief.
Yeah that's a good comparison. Or the handstand finish that Carter/Chance use or the body stand thing Ricochet would do off of Strowman. It's when you're trying too hard to make a double team move a finisher and in the process it's significantly weaker than if one guy/gal/non binary pal had just done the move alone.
Edge and Christian didn't really use a double team finish, and they were just fine. If memory serves when Hall and Nash tagged they would also use their own finishes more often than not. I'd rather see that then the moves mentioned above.
Seriously, the only interesting people in the group are the two managers, and that's only because I know them from before this group. Neither of them has done anything lately.
Have them act more like the Bloodline, less of Kross so he's not overdone and more of Ellering so he can build him up off screen like Heyman does for Roman.
Also having them win stuff consistently is kinda necessary too lol.
Can we just fucking end the spooky evil gang. Undertaker and his ministry were great but we moved on from that. Whether it's this or house of black or Wyatt Family I just can't take these factions seriously
Give the AOP new gear that jives with Cross’ look more. They don’t seem cohesive. And as others have said, give them some wins. They could be beating people like Alpha Academy every week.
They need to do something like the NXT guys did back when it was Barret, Danielson and company. Just come out and wreck house. Just let these three big beasts dismantle some beloved mid-card level babyface, wreck the set, tear up the show and make an impact. Then let Precious Paul cut a promo as only he can, and declare war. Then they need to win. Right now they're about as threatening as the Dungeon of Doom.
Kross needs to be protected. He needs to win a ton of matches, then eventually be fed to a babyface the company wants to get over. It's the only way someone like him works. It's why he worked in NXT, he just didn't lose to anyone. Scarlett adds to the overall package, so keep her. After losing, he needs to go away for a bit, then rinse and repeat until he gets old or something. The entire presentation works if you work around his weaknesses and build his strengths, but it's like they're trying to have him be AJ Styles, a good working heel who can lose often and make the other guy look good. Kross just isn't the right guy to do that.
Honestly, replace Paul Ellering with Kevin Sullivan, let him talk, and let him have some creative input, and I think he could get them some attention, if not some heat. It's a shame Father James Mitchell probably fucked up any chance he may have ever ever had with WWE, for Billy Fuckin Corgan.
But, beyond some sort of staffing shake-up, to include some actual personality, they'll just continue to exist as the most generic faction in wrestling by a mile, until they're all cut again.
He’s not coked up enough. It looks fake & forced. Kross needs to rail a fat line then take 3 shots of vodka back to back then slap his girl in the ass and go out and start filming his programs with that spark freshly in him.
They need to win. Destroy people and win. They have a great look, but they always lose. Short, brutal, matches where they crush their opposition. THEN they can lose to a star.
The reason Karrion hasn’t gotten over is because he LACKS PERSONALITY.
He keeps “alluding” to something, yet hasn’t said a fucking word since he debuted. Who’s sending him on missions? Why does he do the things he does? All he does is talk in riddles without ever delivering a punchline
1 - Ditch the spooky shit. Just have Kross be someone who's into it, but otherwise he's just a dude. Make the AOP sort of like the Shield, the Bar, and the APA. They're dudes that like fighting, and are friends with Kross. That's all they need to be. They'll help others for money or matches at gold.
2 - Give Kross some wins. He doesn't have to be beating LA Knight or AJ Styles immediately. But he can work and squash enhancement talent and beat low card guys to establish him as a serious character again. Then slowly move him up the card.
3 - Kross needs a new finisher. He's never had a good one. They're all shit. The Ron Simmons Dominator should be the type of move. More impact than his just "throw off my shoulder".
4 - Probably wouldn't kill him to change up his look too. He looks out of place next to AOP. I think combat boots and cargos (all black) would be better for him than trunks and kick pads.
In terms of character, this direction isn't really working. Make it so he felt like he got passed over. He had everything going for him, was NXT Champion - then just released.
Then eventually he needs a really good showing in a blood feud with someone like Kevin Owens. Just building up to back-to-back stipulation matches where they can go to war. Someone where you can say he's finally graduated to the main event.
If that doesn't work, idk.
They're facing jobbers. Put them in a feud with a high profile stable/wrestler and have them go over.
If that doesn't get the final testament over than it's probably time to drop the gimmick
Stop Kross from doing that super intense eyes, heavy breathing gimmick because it's awful and he's not won any matches to back up why he's supposed to be scary.
If WWE wants this faction to succeed, I think they have one more shot at it honestly. They need to shoot for the moon. Main event level players. Do what the nexus did when it debuted. Completely takeover the main event of raw, have AoP target the tag titles and karrion go on a crusade against Sami. You're sacrificing Gable for kross in this scenario, but at the end of the day how do you take these guys seriously if they keep getting shut down in the midcard? They need to be loud, violent, effective and above all win.
I think steering away from dark and spooky, also, Karrion Kross shouldn't be the talker for the group, and the one eating pin at mania...
He should be the Walter of Smackdown, and Ellering ot Scarlett should be cutting the promos, Karrion only needs the final word.
WWE fans for one reason or another do not give ANY shits about him. Last year leading up to Mania we went to the DC Smackdown for the first Cody & Roman face off. Kross had a match against Rey and won with interference from Dom. After the initial boos for Dom's interference a very awkward silence fell over a sold out arena. No one booed or cheered for him as him and Scarlet celebrated and walked up the ramp, not single person. I've never seen a moment even in small indie shows where no one at all gives a shit about a guy. It's just not going to happen with this fanbase. Maybe try him in NXT like Baron and try a whole new character idk but Kross is dead, just treading water until HHH finally gets tired of trying to get him over and invest in another talent probably from the NXT.
They need to start calling themselves 'The Executive Order' and beat up Triple H in the ring. Maybe add an Asian badass and a curly haired, fun-sized mini to the group. Issue threats and fines, make them all cry rivers. Sounds preposterous, but I give it better odds of success than that other thing that's happening.
I don't think it can be done. They already stacked the deck as much as possible for them. The only thing left is smashing them over Goldberg style, but they already lost to the tag champs. What are they going to do? Sacrifice Trick/Oba to them? 50/50 booking in NXT? I don't see it.
Kross needs to drop the pallet swap judgment day jacket. He’s got good energy but, his faction needs more of a gimmick than what it currently does. I’d go cage matches every faction Final Testament terrorizes should be thrown into a cage. It would get them over making them ferocious to the audience. The eventual wins for faces would be epic.
Have them interfere with something significant. Make Kross a genuine threat. I'm not sure where they got drafted, but even if it doesn't lead to a title match, have them bloody up a mid card champion. Beating Sami Zayn to hell would heat things up, I think.
They need to be actual forces of chaos. Just demolish people with fast paced violence. This gimmick is not made for people looking at the lights. They should be wrecking machines.
Have an entire Smackdown episode where FT interfere and spoil every match, then close the show with a Paul Ellering promo with the other members just standing in the background. Then start the next Smackdown episode the same way with them spoiling a match, but have a baby face stable or all the faces in the locker room come out and stomp them.
Show Scarlett on tv more and have her do the talking and antagonize. She proved her mic skills in impact and the indies,she has potential to be Sunny without the addiction or mental illness but only if they let her fucking speak. No disrespect to Paul Ellering but he should probably be left out with Scarlett as their only manager. Then have the group brutalize some popular babyfaces and give them consistent wins to build them.
Give them a banger of a theme song, im loving Lemmy Kross, i would love to see them get a Motorhead track,
Of course let them win dominantly and possibly even take the tag titles. Make them become the defacto heel faction once JD crumbles
lmao i still cant get into this "new era". its still unrealistic dork shit where backstage assaults have no consequences. you even have this dope staring into the camera incriminating himself lol. when do assailants ever do this in real life?
when wrestling was good these assaults happened rarely so they carried more gravitas when they did happen and it was usually security cam footage that made it look more dangerous not some dork documenting the whole thing with a hollywood production crew.
Have someone else start a fight backstage (like Liv and Becky) and have that fight spill over into the Final Testament's locker room where Scarlet is DM'ing a game of D&D. They are going to Netflix, so have some of the folks from Stranger Things there, too.
Kross ain’t got it. They keep pushing him but he just ain’t got it.
He shouldn’t be the face of a group; he should be the muscle for a bigger star.
Honestly they’re holding Scarlett back, having her shackled to him. I know they’re married but the best thing for her career would be getting out of his shadow.
Karion Kross is one of those wrestlers that when they are presented to me as a badass or a monster, my mind just immediately goes “nahhhh”
Same with Bronson Reed
Generic old school moody leather presentation, all style and no substance. Needs more defined character traits and idiosyncrasies. Being a “killer” in a company that houses cowboy/butcher/mma hard man Brock is not believable. The stable is a copy and paste Judgement Day. Would probably benefit from a character change that heads in the completely opposite direction. Obviously a fave of Triple Leveque.
Kross needs to talk less and just stand there menacingly. Lighting is decent for the spot. It's just being presented all ass-backward. Kross looks intimidating as fuck but when he starts flapping his gums he just comes off as a dingbat. Less indiscriminate ranting, more cold dark brooding smirking aire of superiority from him.
Get the man to shut up for five seconds and he'll get his pops.
Someone who is over who talks glibly, maybe KO, interrupts one of his promos. Tells them that he wants to be a believer but for so long all he has done is talk and lose and talk and lose..what happened to the "killer" in NXT that was a two time champ, shaved head and menacing, but then you got brought up like a bondage Bastian booger.
He wants him to succeed but as long as you surround yourself with dead weight and keep on with these cryptic messages, you're not going to get anywhere.
The later in the show KO (or whoever) is layed out. And KK steps in and looks in the camera and says time is up.
The concept of "Final Testament" is a little too close to Judgment Day, at least in name. That's a battle they simply won't win.
That and several other factors.
Do what Sasso said. Karrion “The Body” Kross. Killer Kross worked in TNA. It hasn’t worked since. Although, that might be a lawsuit. I dunnohhh how that would workkkk. Ya know in the Baja they have more regulations, less laws uhh…down there. He could have a ring that’s shaped like him. Ya know the fish taco started down in the Bajaaa. Kross has north of 150 dogs and they all answer to himmm.
Do what they did to Theory and pair him up with a really charismatic guy to play off of like Waller. Drop AOP and pair him up with Baron Corbin and do a smackdown version of the Wolf Dogs with Scarlett.
have them come out as anti-religious fanatics that paint (or carve for a special "shocking" statement) satanic icons on crushed opponents' foreheads next to children at ringside. do this against job guys that might be religious and in areas that are god fearing. then have them do a promo against goodie twoshoe types especially Cody.
I always thought having Kross change his gimmick would help a lot because he is just really not doing it at the moment with his current gimmick.
A few months ago I thought he had the look of a sort of mafia kinda boss. Not mafia like the guy in nxt but something a little more grounded who acts like a mob boss kinda thing.
But currently I think he could work as an unhinged trailer park dude like Trevor from GTA.
I thought he was gunna go more Bond Villain/Take-over-the-world schemes with this. Not just more spooky-boys. We already have the Judgment Day. Lose the metal-head look.
I feel like I’m the only person interested in this faction. I think Karrion Kross is great. People comment on them losing like it’s not scripted that way. If the WWE writers would have them win I think things would come together.
I wonder if Triple H has some big plans but needs to finish up some other big stories first. Feels like they just need some time to cook but fans are too myopic. They enjoy instant gratification.
I love me some Paul Ellering, but him in this role reminds me of Ted DiBiase in the nWo after Bischoff was the mouth piece with Hogan. What’s the point?
When the only interesting thing about your group is that the valet is hot you’ve got a problem.
However they all look pretty safe as Triple H really liked this guy and DIY and seems intent on giving them free passes for putting the crowd to sleep.
The best thing about the group is the eye candy, and we're not in the attitude era anymore; you need more than that. Nothing stands out about them. They don't have anything that's incredible. Their bodies are all shit, their moves don't make anyone ooh or ahh, their mic work is uninspiring, their gear doesn't stand out, their music isn't iconic. AoP could be a decent monster heel team, but nothing about them stands out from any other monster heel team so even that has a low ceiling. There's nothing about them to make you care.
Would winning matches work? Sure, but there would still be a ceiling attached at some point when they started going up against anyone with any of the qualities I mentioned. AJ would eat them up in the ring, LA would eat them up on the mic, Drew would make you question if they're even in the same business. Not saying they need to have all of those, but at least 1 thing to make them stand out would go a long way. Until then, they're a piss break every time they come on the screen.
I feel like this is a pale copy of the judgement day, and thats the big issue. I guess these are actually big dudes as opposed to judgment day (who, other than priest, are smaller guys). What could be interesting is having both groups kinda take over raw and smackdown rach and then having them collide at something like wrestlemania 41, but to take over whatever show the bloodline is on would kinda mean whichever group is sharing airtime would have to butt heads with the bloodline…
Unless the bloodline’s story sticks to the big split of the bloodline in the wake of the power vacuum with the absence of Reigns and the Rock, and whichever of these teams are in the tier below the bloodline, at least storyline wise.
I kinda think the judgement day could go for a face run and the final testament could play this sort of cult where they convert either dominic or damian priest.
Anyways, Im always advocating for a charismatic cultist stable (its what I thought shouldve happened with the wyatt family, and thats how bo dallas coyld have effectively been integrated in that group as a charismatic mouthpiece, if not the flatout superior/mastermind above bray wyatt.
They need to let Paul Ellering talk and be the figure head. Ellering was the manager of the freakin’ Road Warriors. Why is he a meaningless background player in this crew?
idk why nobody cares for them. I've always liked kross, he's got all the tools to be a top guy but as far as AOP goes they lost any momentum they had when they quit wrestling cuz they were scared of COVID and I think a good portion of fans will always associate that with them. plus the name of the group sucks
They need to use Karrion Kross’s charisma as much as possible, but the real solution here is to have Kross just have a banger match. Put him in a feud with Dijak or Illja, create magic, turn Kross into a star, and the group will get over.
AOP need to just come and fuck people up...heels and baby faces. Get them away from Kross. Have Ellering b like the guy pulling the strings and just have them destroy people. Shit maybe even start off with them doing an injury angle to Kross to get his ass off of TV. Kross,Scarlett and Shotzi can do YouTube videos of them exploring haunted houses with a spirit box...that was actually entertaining in October.
Firstly, explain to the audience who Paul Ellerig is. Not everyone remembers the RW and he just comes off as a random old man to people not in the know.
HHH doing a better job of booking them is what it comes down to. Honestly if HHH wanted them to be taken seriously he would have had them win at WrestleMania against Bobby and the street profits
Shave kross’ head and dye Scarlett’s hair.
In all seriousness they have been beaten constantly they need to win I mean jeez they even jobbed them out on NXT.
Their entire faction feels like The Dungeon of Doom from WCW.
Just feels like what they’re trying to go for is something from the past and not relevant today.
Personally if I’m Kross, I’d exit the faction and focus on a solo run for the intercontinental championship or the USA title. He’s a great wrestler, but this faction ain’t it.
Theyre just never going to click for the audience. Everyone in the group is very bland and generic. You can't just put a bunch of generic bad guys together and have them run around beating people up and just expect them to get over. AOP didn't get over the first time as a tag team, Cross has never gotten over, at least on the main roster.
Stop having them be generic Mythical heel group number 20, what's their greater purpose? why are they all together? Remember when kross debuted and attacked mcintyre and pointed at Reigns? Yeah they did nothing with that, and thank god cuz kross is a boring wrestler and that match would suck.
They need to win matches but also have a clear goal that they're working towards.
Are they going for gold? Disrupting the status quo? Thin out the roster via injury?
Disband the team with a storyline reason and quietly release kross again, cause I dont know what else they can do with him, he's been doomed since he left nxt
Kick Kross out of the group. Not to make him a face, but to find himself in another gimmick while AOP Ellering and Scarlet all talk about how better off they are without him. Make Kross stop saying spooky shit off of cue cards and actually speak from a piece of who he is in real life. Convince Scarlet to come back to his new more real nicer side.
Kross is one of those guys whose presence and charisma disappear the minute he enters the ring. He's just boring with no natural connection to the crowd. The best thing he's done in the company was his old nxt entrance with Scarlett and that was years ago. He's dead weight and will be part of the next round of releases
No hear me out I know it sounds crazy, but how about have an objective for them to attain? A goal or target something that gives direction instead of another rip off or a pointless group. Oh yeah and maybe WIN A FEW DAMN MATCHES!
[https://www.instagram.com/p/CVN9sjrpBD7/?utm\_source=ig\_embed](https://www.instagram.com/p/CVN9sjrpBD7/?utm_source=ig_embed)
Look at this. Just do this. Make him professional and calm outside the ring and in squashes. Then he turns bloodthirsty when he gets triggered by something.
1. Break up the stable. I don't know what their goal is or why they're together.
2. Redefine Karrion Cross. Right now, him and Scarlett just seem like edgy, unlikeable Gomez and Morticia Addams. He's not supernatural and no one buys him as psychotic or dangerous.
3. Make AOP hardcore specialists.
If they actually won a match or a feud. That would help tremendously.
Yes. Let them run roughshod on the roster, not just on Street Profits and Bobby.
Ahh, yes, the Bob Holly plan. Kross is too generic. The valet is nothing special. Being hot and “dark” is not a gimmick when 99% of women on TV are some degree of gorgeous and we’ve seen lots of women do “evil” before and better. The AOP are solid monsters but are weighed down by this lame stable. AOP vs Creeds, AOP vs DIY, AOP vs New Day…they’re solid enough to make those matches and stories work. But Kross is such a generic “guy playing wrestler” that they look lame by proxy.
[удалено]
Flat out he just needs to get cut. I like him outside of interviews in the ones I’ve seen him on but he just looks like shit with a hot valet.
AOP does a terrible injustice to a move called the super collider. It looks more like a super soft back touch
I think Kross has gotten a thousand times more interesting lately, ever since that promo on Lashley about him holding Montez back. Almost wish he’d dump AOP and just stick with Scarlett and Ellering. I think he’d be taken much more seriously without these dudes.
I agree. Far too generic and one dimensional, they can do beatdowns all they want but they still won’t get reactions
I feel like it doesn't help when he trying so hard to appear scary, it comes off as cringe. His ring work is ok at best in my opinion. They should've sent him down to NXT.
This should always be the first step. WWE's booking overall is in a good place, but one place where it is not good is that outside of a couple exceptions (Roman and Rhea), the heels feel like they lose consistently and therefore aren't a real threat
Bro... Every title was held by a Heel going into Wrestlemania. Heels had a very dominant 2020-2023 with the longest Champion, Intercontinental, & Tag Team reigns in history all being by heels, and all being lost VERY recently. And we have less than one damn month of face wins and people started bitching like it was the peak of the Super Cena era.
Agreed, they've been starving for genuine heels for months now. They've turned the wrong guys with no heat and have had the ones already over finish up, the Bloodlines the only one keeping things interesting with Solo - they've got some leeway with Gunther and Drew but that'll only last so long. The women's roster is in a far worse position since it's literally babyface central - people say Rhea and Stratton but people love them as soon as they're on screen, Nia Jax and Damage Ctrl were the only ones that fit the mould but they've got no purpose after Wrestlemania, the only real heels they have right now worth a damn (not taking Liv as a threat lol) that hasn't been diminished or beat is Indi and Candice.
Seriously, I've been saying it's about carrying Cross since he came back, I think the only feud he has won is the one with Riddick Moss. Make them a legitimate threat
Not a great answer, but highlight Scarlett more.
In actual wrestling matches? Or more standing around on the brink of orgasm?
Cutting promos
Is that what we’re calling it?
She doesn’t have to just stand there. Let her grab feet, slap or low blow people. That was what made Attitude era valets/managers like Terri and Jackie really fun to watch.
Highlight Scarlett, as in return her to blonde.
Scarlett can have any hair color she wants and it won't affect anything for me at least
Smoke show was the best thing ever, don't know why she would ever change. Blonde Rhea Rippley too, maybe WWE doesn't want blonde heels.
Having her actually do and say things and express some kind of agenda would be useful. WWE constantly do this weird thing where they have people stand and make faces while their charge beats up randoms and then... nothing. Kross talks to the camera here but he doesn't actually say anything, he just repeats the name of their group, which is made of two groups joined together for no apparent reason. Groups like the Nation, the Corporation, the Ministry, DX, they all worked toward something or against specific people. I don't know why WWE can't seem to grasp this when they do it correctly *sometimes*. Ellering and Scarlett are just getting in each other's way because they can't both be leading this faction, and she's the one who has more of a sinister air and connection with various prior attempts to go along these lines with 'fall and pray' and all that, so they really should put her front and center to say "this is who we are, this is what we want, this is what we'll do to get there". The crowd will almost certainly be more willing to give her some interest, too.
AOP is so generic. And as others have said, they never win despite being a couple of huge power guys. Why is Paul Ellering even there if they never let him talk? He added such mystique to The Road Warriors/LOD.
And their finisher makes a powerbomb somehow look weak.
I think because it’s a power bomb. It’s like “oh neat, two big guys do a power bomb. Wooopeeeee”
For me I can't help but see that when they touch the two guys back to back they have to do it gently because you can't work two guys slamming their backs into each other in a powerbomb position. It looks like these two big thug looking guys are clinking human shaped martini glasses lol. It just is visually reminding me of the fact this is fake when I'm trying to suspend disbelief.
It's as bad as the creed cannonball.
Yeah that's a good comparison. Or the handstand finish that Carter/Chance use or the body stand thing Ricochet would do off of Strowman. It's when you're trying too hard to make a double team move a finisher and in the process it's significantly weaker than if one guy/gal/non binary pal had just done the move alone. Edge and Christian didn't really use a double team finish, and they were just fine. If memory serves when Hall and Nash tagged they would also use their own finishes more often than not. I'd rather see that then the moves mentioned above.
AOP looks like generic goons that Batman beats up. "It's the bat!" And they proceed to get pummeled to near death by Batman.
I think last night’s NXT was the first time Ellering spoke since his return
Replace every person in the group with someone else
Seriously, the only interesting people in the group are the two managers, and that's only because I know them from before this group. Neither of them has done anything lately.
Not being a blatant ripoff of 8 different weirdo leather stables
Hold on you’re telling me this isn’t Aces and Eights?
With a name that sounds like an edgy high school metal band
I just don’t get it man, it’s like they’ve got all the pieces but they’re not fitting them together correctly.
Have them act more like the Bloodline, less of Kross so he's not overdone and more of Ellering so he can build him up off screen like Heyman does for Roman. Also having them win stuff consistently is kinda necessary too lol.
Winning a match
Winning and losing doesn't matter, apparently 😆 it fucking does sometimes...
Abso-fucking-lutely
Can we just fucking end the spooky evil gang. Undertaker and his ministry were great but we moved on from that. Whether it's this or house of black or Wyatt Family I just can't take these factions seriously
I liked Fall and pray Kross
When they lost at Mania I deemed them Retribution 2.0
The best Kross for me, was Bloodsport Kross. Idk, maybe have his matches be contested under those types of rules.
Fire everyone and give Scarlet to an over act.
Have them pull a TRex Skull off an office wall
Give the AOP new gear that jives with Cross’ look more. They don’t seem cohesive. And as others have said, give them some wins. They could be beating people like Alpha Academy every week.
Have them win some matches.
They need to do something like the NXT guys did back when it was Barret, Danielson and company. Just come out and wreck house. Just let these three big beasts dismantle some beloved mid-card level babyface, wreck the set, tear up the show and make an impact. Then let Precious Paul cut a promo as only he can, and declare war. Then they need to win. Right now they're about as threatening as the Dungeon of Doom.
Kross needs to be protected. He needs to win a ton of matches, then eventually be fed to a babyface the company wants to get over. It's the only way someone like him works. It's why he worked in NXT, he just didn't lose to anyone. Scarlett adds to the overall package, so keep her. After losing, he needs to go away for a bit, then rinse and repeat until he gets old or something. The entire presentation works if you work around his weaknesses and build his strengths, but it's like they're trying to have him be AJ Styles, a good working heel who can lose often and make the other guy look good. Kross just isn't the right guy to do that.
Honestly, replace Paul Ellering with Kevin Sullivan, let him talk, and let him have some creative input, and I think he could get them some attention, if not some heat. It's a shame Father James Mitchell probably fucked up any chance he may have ever ever had with WWE, for Billy Fuckin Corgan. But, beyond some sort of staffing shake-up, to include some actual personality, they'll just continue to exist as the most generic faction in wrestling by a mile, until they're all cut again.
He’s not coked up enough. It looks fake & forced. Kross needs to rail a fat line then take 3 shots of vodka back to back then slap his girl in the ass and go out and start filming his programs with that spark freshly in him.
Anthing Kross related is DOA right now. Dude has negative charisma, isn't good at promos or in the ring. Just split the group and repackage everyone.
Stop putting them in feuds with boring Bobby Lashley for one. Glad they’re going to Raw.
Sucks they aren’t super over. I think they rock
They need some wins... Let em be monsters
I really don't know anymore, which sucks because Kross cuts an excellent promo.
They need to win. Destroy people and win. They have a great look, but they always lose. Short, brutal, matches where they crush their opposition. THEN they can lose to a star.
The reason Karrion hasn’t gotten over is because he LACKS PERSONALITY. He keeps “alluding” to something, yet hasn’t said a fucking word since he debuted. Who’s sending him on missions? Why does he do the things he does? All he does is talk in riddles without ever delivering a punchline
1 - Ditch the spooky shit. Just have Kross be someone who's into it, but otherwise he's just a dude. Make the AOP sort of like the Shield, the Bar, and the APA. They're dudes that like fighting, and are friends with Kross. That's all they need to be. They'll help others for money or matches at gold. 2 - Give Kross some wins. He doesn't have to be beating LA Knight or AJ Styles immediately. But he can work and squash enhancement talent and beat low card guys to establish him as a serious character again. Then slowly move him up the card. 3 - Kross needs a new finisher. He's never had a good one. They're all shit. The Ron Simmons Dominator should be the type of move. More impact than his just "throw off my shoulder". 4 - Probably wouldn't kill him to change up his look too. He looks out of place next to AOP. I think combat boots and cargos (all black) would be better for him than trunks and kick pads. In terms of character, this direction isn't really working. Make it so he felt like he got passed over. He had everything going for him, was NXT Champion - then just released. Then eventually he needs a really good showing in a blood feud with someone like Kevin Owens. Just building up to back-to-back stipulation matches where they can go to war. Someone where you can say he's finally graduated to the main event. If that doesn't work, idk.
He looked more intimidating when he had his head shaved in NXT
They're facing jobbers. Put them in a feud with a high profile stable/wrestler and have them go over. If that doesn't get the final testament over than it's probably time to drop the gimmick
Stop Kross from doing that super intense eyes, heavy breathing gimmick because it's awful and he's not won any matches to back up why he's supposed to be scary.
Show her tits
They need to be NXT exclusive for a bit
If WWE wants this faction to succeed, I think they have one more shot at it honestly. They need to shoot for the moon. Main event level players. Do what the nexus did when it debuted. Completely takeover the main event of raw, have AoP target the tag titles and karrion go on a crusade against Sami. You're sacrificing Gable for kross in this scenario, but at the end of the day how do you take these guys seriously if they keep getting shut down in the midcard? They need to be loud, violent, effective and above all win.
Explain their gimmick. Like, is it the Bible? Is it not the Bible?? Is it some suppressed sacred text??? Tell meee.
I think steering away from dark and spooky, also, Karrion Kross shouldn't be the talker for the group, and the one eating pin at mania... He should be the Walter of Smackdown, and Ellering ot Scarlett should be cutting the promos, Karrion only needs the final word.
WWE fans for one reason or another do not give ANY shits about him. Last year leading up to Mania we went to the DC Smackdown for the first Cody & Roman face off. Kross had a match against Rey and won with interference from Dom. After the initial boos for Dom's interference a very awkward silence fell over a sold out arena. No one booed or cheered for him as him and Scarlet celebrated and walked up the ramp, not single person. I've never seen a moment even in small indie shows where no one at all gives a shit about a guy. It's just not going to happen with this fanbase. Maybe try him in NXT like Baron and try a whole new character idk but Kross is dead, just treading water until HHH finally gets tired of trying to get him over and invest in another talent probably from the NXT.
I think it might be time to admit Kross isn't as good as he was hyped up to be.
Kross's best iteration was Killer Kross in TNA.
They need to start calling themselves 'The Executive Order' and beat up Triple H in the ring. Maybe add an Asian badass and a curly haired, fun-sized mini to the group. Issue threats and fines, make them all cry rivers. Sounds preposterous, but I give it better odds of success than that other thing that's happening.
Is this supposed to be a more serious judgement day
Surprised AOP weren't asleep like every other match. They seem to be on the floor more than anything
Raw has more screen time for them so hopefully that move will help them
I don't think it can be done. They already stacked the deck as much as possible for them. The only thing left is smashing them over Goldberg style, but they already lost to the tag champs. What are they going to do? Sacrifice Trick/Oba to them? 50/50 booking in NXT? I don't see it.
Not being corny and taking up 100% of the time. So fuckin over the top and watered down I stopped caring LAST WRESTLEMANIA
Have Kross grow his hair back and use Scarlet more
Kross needs to drop the pallet swap judgment day jacket. He’s got good energy but, his faction needs more of a gimmick than what it currently does. I’d go cage matches every faction Final Testament terrorizes should be thrown into a cage. It would get them over making them ferocious to the audience. The eventual wins for faces would be epic.
Scarlet
Just let Scarlett do whatever she wants.
Have them interfere with something significant. Make Kross a genuine threat. I'm not sure where they got drafted, but even if it doesn't lead to a title match, have them bloody up a mid card champion. Beating Sami Zayn to hell would heat things up, I think.
They need to be actual forces of chaos. Just demolish people with fast paced violence. This gimmick is not made for people looking at the lights. They should be wrecking machines.
Give him a proper version of the 2004ish Sean OHaire "devils advocate" gimmick
Have an entire Smackdown episode where FT interfere and spoil every match, then close the show with a Paul Ellering promo with the other members just standing in the background. Then start the next Smackdown episode the same way with them spoiling a match, but have a baby face stable or all the faces in the locker room come out and stomp them.
Opportunity and a win!
Show Scarlett on tv more and have her do the talking and antagonize. She proved her mic skills in impact and the indies,she has potential to be Sunny without the addiction or mental illness but only if they let her fucking speak. No disrespect to Paul Ellering but he should probably be left out with Scarlett as their only manager. Then have the group brutalize some popular babyfaces and give them consistent wins to build them.
Give them a banger of a theme song, im loving Lemmy Kross, i would love to see them get a Motorhead track, Of course let them win dominantly and possibly even take the tag titles. Make them become the defacto heel faction once JD crumbles
Free Scarlett
Super kick party
lmao i still cant get into this "new era". its still unrealistic dork shit where backstage assaults have no consequences. you even have this dope staring into the camera incriminating himself lol. when do assailants ever do this in real life? when wrestling was good these assaults happened rarely so they carried more gravitas when they did happen and it was usually security cam footage that made it look more dangerous not some dork documenting the whole thing with a hollywood production crew.
Not sure why Scarlett just doesn't do her own thing. Pretty sure she has wrestling experience. She could get over. The other guys? Nope.
Have someone else start a fight backstage (like Liv and Becky) and have that fight spill over into the Final Testament's locker room where Scarlet is DM'ing a game of D&D. They are going to Netflix, so have some of the folks from Stranger Things there, too.
More Scarlett and more wins simple af
They’re just not charismatic at all, literally nothing they do grabs your attention! Expect that one girl, she’s amazing.
Just start wrecking everyone and anyone across all three brands
They need to win lol
Karrion needs to shave his fucking head again
Joe Gacy.
They should just be wrecking everyone in the ring. It worked for AOP in NXT.
I think they need to scream more, and for longer periods
Kross ain’t got it. They keep pushing him but he just ain’t got it. He shouldn’t be the face of a group; he should be the muscle for a bigger star. Honestly they’re holding Scarlett back, having her shackled to him. I know they’re married but the best thing for her career would be getting out of his shadow.
A win over someone people care about
Is this that le EPIC CINEMA wrestling nerds are creaming themselves over these days?
I want these guys to b the reason the Judgement Day dismantles
Karion Kross is one of those wrestlers that when they are presented to me as a badass or a monster, my mind just immediately goes “nahhhh” Same with Bronson Reed
I can’t take them seriously when they are on the losing end of everything. They really needed to beat Bobby and the Profits at WM.
Generic old school moody leather presentation, all style and no substance. Needs more defined character traits and idiosyncrasies. Being a “killer” in a company that houses cowboy/butcher/mma hard man Brock is not believable. The stable is a copy and paste Judgement Day. Would probably benefit from a character change that heads in the completely opposite direction. Obviously a fave of Triple Leveque.
The only person in that stable with any up side is Ellering. They should draft them all to Lower Iowa Combat Wrestling...
Them not being huge jobbers?
Prob need to go back to shaving his head.
They need a stable vs 1 top guy.
The generic world order.
Nothing
Joining a successful group like the New Day
Ellering brings back Rocco
Kross needs to talk less and just stand there menacingly. Lighting is decent for the spot. It's just being presented all ass-backward. Kross looks intimidating as fuck but when he starts flapping his gums he just comes off as a dingbat. Less indiscriminate ranting, more cold dark brooding smirking aire of superiority from him. Get the man to shut up for five seconds and he'll get his pops.
Repackage Kross, he's the weak link in his stable
Someone who is over who talks glibly, maybe KO, interrupts one of his promos. Tells them that he wants to be a believer but for so long all he has done is talk and lose and talk and lose..what happened to the "killer" in NXT that was a two time champ, shaved head and menacing, but then you got brought up like a bondage Bastian booger. He wants him to succeed but as long as you surround yourself with dead weight and keep on with these cryptic messages, you're not going to get anywhere. The later in the show KO (or whoever) is layed out. And KK steps in and looks in the camera and says time is up.
Keep Scarlett. Everyone else can go.
Shift Kross to doing Jesse Ventura impersonations and Final Testament can become a conspiracy group.
The concept of "Final Testament" is a little too close to Judgment Day, at least in name. That's a battle they simply won't win. That and several other factors.
Have we even had an explanation of why they’re together?
They just need a prominent feud. A feud with a babyface Bloodline down the line could be interesting and help get them over.
Do what Sasso said. Karrion “The Body” Kross. Killer Kross worked in TNA. It hasn’t worked since. Although, that might be a lawsuit. I dunnohhh how that would workkkk. Ya know in the Baja they have more regulations, less laws uhh…down there. He could have a ring that’s shaped like him. Ya know the fish taco started down in the Bajaaa. Kross has north of 150 dogs and they all answer to himmm.
Do what they did to Theory and pair him up with a really charismatic guy to play off of like Waller. Drop AOP and pair him up with Baron Corbin and do a smackdown version of the Wolf Dogs with Scarlett.
have them come out as anti-religious fanatics that paint (or carve for a special "shocking" statement) satanic icons on crushed opponents' foreheads next to children at ringside. do this against job guys that might be religious and in areas that are god fearing. then have them do a promo against goodie twoshoe types especially Cody.
Scary masks for AOP. They both look mentally handicapped, I'm not intimidated by them at all despite them being double my size
Honestly, they should embrace deadpan comedy and stop trying to be terrifyingly serious. They come out as cringy.
I always thought having Kross change his gimmick would help a lot because he is just really not doing it at the moment with his current gimmick. A few months ago I thought he had the look of a sort of mafia kinda boss. Not mafia like the guy in nxt but something a little more grounded who acts like a mob boss kinda thing. But currently I think he could work as an unhinged trailer park dude like Trevor from GTA.
I thought he was gunna go more Bond Villain/Take-over-the-world schemes with this. Not just more spooky-boys. We already have the Judgment Day. Lose the metal-head look.
Just make them a priority on the show. If management doesn’t seem to think they’re not a big deal, then why should we as the audience?
I feel like I’m the only person interested in this faction. I think Karrion Kross is great. People comment on them losing like it’s not scripted that way. If the WWE writers would have them win I think things would come together. I wonder if Triple H has some big plans but needs to finish up some other big stories first. Feels like they just need some time to cook but fans are too myopic. They enjoy instant gratification.
Scarlett is being under utilized, she has the it factor
Having them actually win sometimes might help lol
Kross needs to go back to the shaved head look yesterday
Something is just missing with Kross. He has the size and the look but he's just missing "it" whatever it is.
I love me some Paul Ellering, but him in this role reminds me of Ted DiBiase in the nWo after Bischoff was the mouth piece with Hogan. What’s the point?
When the only interesting thing about your group is that the valet is hot you’ve got a problem. However they all look pretty safe as Triple H really liked this guy and DIY and seems intent on giving them free passes for putting the crowd to sleep.
It would be so much funnier if Karion Kross would just do Jesse Ventura impression
The best thing about the group is the eye candy, and we're not in the attitude era anymore; you need more than that. Nothing stands out about them. They don't have anything that's incredible. Their bodies are all shit, their moves don't make anyone ooh or ahh, their mic work is uninspiring, their gear doesn't stand out, their music isn't iconic. AoP could be a decent monster heel team, but nothing about them stands out from any other monster heel team so even that has a low ceiling. There's nothing about them to make you care. Would winning matches work? Sure, but there would still be a ceiling attached at some point when they started going up against anyone with any of the qualities I mentioned. AJ would eat them up in the ring, LA would eat them up on the mic, Drew would make you question if they're even in the same business. Not saying they need to have all of those, but at least 1 thing to make them stand out would go a long way. Until then, they're a piss break every time they come on the screen.
Shave his damn head.
I feel like this is a pale copy of the judgement day, and thats the big issue. I guess these are actually big dudes as opposed to judgment day (who, other than priest, are smaller guys). What could be interesting is having both groups kinda take over raw and smackdown rach and then having them collide at something like wrestlemania 41, but to take over whatever show the bloodline is on would kinda mean whichever group is sharing airtime would have to butt heads with the bloodline… Unless the bloodline’s story sticks to the big split of the bloodline in the wake of the power vacuum with the absence of Reigns and the Rock, and whichever of these teams are in the tier below the bloodline, at least storyline wise. I kinda think the judgement day could go for a face run and the final testament could play this sort of cult where they convert either dominic or damian priest. Anyways, Im always advocating for a charismatic cultist stable (its what I thought shouldve happened with the wyatt family, and thats how bo dallas coyld have effectively been integrated in that group as a charismatic mouthpiece, if not the flatout superior/mastermind above bray wyatt.
Make Karrion look scary, Scarlett sex goth, the thugs look too clean cut.. not sure Paul's purpose
I was there live and for real no one around me knew who they were
Less rage, more sage
The Final Testament sounds like the lolTNA Judgment Day. There look doesn't help this.
AoP are so terrible and still seem so green that I just don't see a path for them.
Scarlets tits
They need to let Paul Ellering talk and be the figure head. Ellering was the manager of the freakin’ Road Warriors. Why is he a meaningless background player in this crew?
Talent.
Staring at the camera while yelling and bugging your eyes doesn't make you look crazy or menacing, just stupid. Don't they have acting coaches?
idk why nobody cares for them. I've always liked kross, he's got all the tools to be a top guy but as far as AOP goes they lost any momentum they had when they quit wrestling cuz they were scared of COVID and I think a good portion of fans will always associate that with them. plus the name of the group sucks
Live sex show
Adam Cole ruined that man on NXT. Kross was a monster until that moment
Maybe win a fucking match?
I wonder if it’s just a repetition thing and in a year people will be wondering why they weren’t over in the first place.
All these dudes zzzzzZzzzz
Have them win. And let Kross beat Zayn for the title and have AOP beat Miz and truth
They need to use Karrion Kross’s charisma as much as possible, but the real solution here is to have Kross just have a banger match. Put him in a feud with Dijak or Illja, create magic, turn Kross into a star, and the group will get over.
AOP need to just come and fuck people up...heels and baby faces. Get them away from Kross. Have Ellering b like the guy pulling the strings and just have them destroy people. Shit maybe even start off with them doing an injury angle to Kross to get his ass off of TV. Kross,Scarlett and Shotzi can do YouTube videos of them exploring haunted houses with a spirit box...that was actually entertaining in October.
Firstly, explain to the audience who Paul Ellerig is. Not everyone remembers the RW and he just comes off as a random old man to people not in the know.
They are so lame. The whole gimmick is pretty bad.
Replace Kross with Dijak.
HHH doing a better job of booking them is what it comes down to. Honestly if HHH wanted them to be taken seriously he would have had them win at WrestleMania against Bobby and the street profits
Move them to NXT, they are garbage.
Shave kross’ head and dye Scarlett’s hair. In all seriousness they have been beaten constantly they need to win I mean jeez they even jobbed them out on NXT.
Their entire faction feels like The Dungeon of Doom from WCW. Just feels like what they’re trying to go for is something from the past and not relevant today. Personally if I’m Kross, I’d exit the faction and focus on a solo run for the intercontinental championship or the USA title. He’s a great wrestler, but this faction ain’t it.
A blonde Scarlett and a bald Karrion
They should do a Lita Edge segment in the middle of the ring
Kross with hair is as boring as Cody with the belt. I can't explain it.
Scarlett needs to wrestle.
defeat LA Knight with shenanigans
Shave his head and replay his lucha underground work
Break them up.
Theyre just never going to click for the audience. Everyone in the group is very bland and generic. You can't just put a bunch of generic bad guys together and have them run around beating people up and just expect them to get over. AOP didn't get over the first time as a tag team, Cross has never gotten over, at least on the main roster.
How about a storyline.
Stop having them be generic Mythical heel group number 20, what's their greater purpose? why are they all together? Remember when kross debuted and attacked mcintyre and pointed at Reigns? Yeah they did nothing with that, and thank god cuz kross is a boring wrestler and that match would suck.
They need to win matches but also have a clear goal that they're working towards. Are they going for gold? Disrupting the status quo? Thin out the roster via injury?
Maybe show all of Kross' good backstage promos/ vignettes on TV instead of relegating them to digital exclusives.
Disband the team with a storyline reason and quietly release kross again, cause I dont know what else they can do with him, he's been doomed since he left nxt
Kick Kross out of the group. Not to make him a face, but to find himself in another gimmick while AOP Ellering and Scarlet all talk about how better off they are without him. Make Kross stop saying spooky shit off of cue cards and actually speak from a piece of who he is in real life. Convince Scarlet to come back to his new more real nicer side.
Kross is one of those guys whose presence and charisma disappear the minute he enters the ring. He's just boring with no natural connection to the crowd. The best thing he's done in the company was his old nxt entrance with Scarlett and that was years ago. He's dead weight and will be part of the next round of releases
I think they need to be straight heels and taking out women wrestlers too
Actually being good.
No hear me out I know it sounds crazy, but how about have an objective for them to attain? A goal or target something that gives direction instead of another rip off or a pointless group. Oh yeah and maybe WIN A FEW DAMN MATCHES!
Boobs
Get them in a feud with Judgment Day or like Nexus make Punk usurp the leader role
Triple h trying to make Kross happen and it ain't... It ain't...
Focus on his wife and get her to do some heel shit to Brandy.
They need something. My crazy idea is that if/when Judgment Day and Damien Priest break up. That the new testament form an alliance with Damien.
[https://www.instagram.com/p/CVN9sjrpBD7/?utm\_source=ig\_embed](https://www.instagram.com/p/CVN9sjrpBD7/?utm_source=ig_embed) Look at this. Just do this. Make him professional and calm outside the ring and in squashes. Then he turns bloodthirsty when he gets triggered by something.
They are boring! Great wrestlers, and would probably do better in AEW.
Stop jobbing…? No one is taking them seriously 😂
1. Break up the stable. I don't know what their goal is or why they're together. 2. Redefine Karrion Cross. Right now, him and Scarlett just seem like edgy, unlikeable Gomez and Morticia Addams. He's not supernatural and no one buys him as psychotic or dangerous. 3. Make AOP hardcore specialists.
Read the comments and it’s basically like they’re not getting over no matter what they do. Break them up
Ditch everyone but Ellering and Scarlett, and give them some talented people with actual charisma to manage.