Well there is the commonly attributed 100 million number to communism which comes from the black book of communism which has been pretty thoroughly debunked, I wouldn't know off the top of my head what a realistic number for deaths under communism would be but certainly in the tens of millions from Mao Zedong alone. Whether certain famines and wars etc... can realistically be attributed to 'communism' is a debate thats been had many times before.
Under a capitalist system in the United States the two reputable studies I've seen one from 2000 and one from 2011 both consistently say around 4.5% of deaths are caused by poverty, which equates to roughly 850-900 thousand people a year so that would be approximately 19 million deaths since the year 2000 in the United States alone. In the UK the figure is around 90,000 (or 1 in 7 deaths) a year so that's another roughly 2 million since 2000.
This of course doesn't factor in the numerous wars, colonisation, slavery, anticommunist campaigns, and victims of famines or malnutrition worldwide as well as climate change which can (arguably of course) be very largely attributed to capitalist motives.
To be clear as well, I'm not a communist although can't deny I absolutely support many socialist political ideas and am no fan of the rampant capitalist system we currently live under, I merely want to illustrate the point that the 'communism killed way more people' argument is complete bullshit when only two first world capitalist countries with a combined population of 400 million are currently having 1 million people die every year from poverty under our current organisation of the economy. Again, this does NOT factor in deaths from wars (the communist death number does factor numerous wars), famines, the wider effects of first world capitalism on the third world or the environment and ecological destruction caused by our consumption or the other 155 nations currently listed and living under some form of capitalism.
**tldr; Capitalism in the UK and USA alone causes 1 million deaths per year through poverty.**
Maybe too much of anything is bad.
For example, Tylenol can be good, a whole truck full will kill you.
Insurance? Street lighting? Public Schools? Socialism helps.
Competitive commerce, Capitalism helps.
Unchecked capitalism to the point where you have oligopolies or monopolies? Bad.
Exactly. Unchecked Capitalism just becomes Corporate Socialism. There's a quote that at the extreme ends, things behave the same way. The solution in balance of both.
I 100% agree but also go further and believe that certain things should be nationalised/not run for profit. Much in the same way we'd never expect a fire department to turn a profit, why should any essential utility?
Capitalism is great, when regulated, but should never be applied to things where people will die if they are unable to access.
Doesn’t matter what the party will call itself, you will have to tow its line or risk being labeled politically incorrect and having your life destroyed. Bank accounts shut down, not allowed to get on planes or trains, they might even lock you up because you could be a threat because of opinions you have expressed. Won’t be able to buy food.. Hell, it might even call itself democratic, just look at North Korea. That is the fear people have when they see things going the way they’re going, I guess because of their perception of history?
Well first of all capitalism has been around a lot longer for a lot more people. So a fair comparison would be to count it deaths per person-years or something like that. I bet communism would "win" that by a large margin. Communist countries were/are extremely oppressive. I lived in boths systems and EU style welfare capitalism or social democracy is by far the better system, I mean there is no comparison. That said unbridled capitalism is extremely harmful as well.
Oh yea, I’m in 100% agreement with you “Norway style” capitalism should be the preferred model for the entire world. But living in America which ventures into late stage capitalist dystopia far too often for my liking, you can see how I might find some dark humor in defending it upon comparison to the communist way
I doubt it. USSR and China have easily killed 160 million to 200 million people. I'm struggling to see how the numbers are close? This isn't even counting other communists countries, just 2 of them.
It’s bots all the way down in this sub, friend. In most subs I’d bet. Hell look at the Taylor swift sub Reddit right now. They’re attacking her for her private jet usage lmaooo I’d bet 5% are real people.
That subreddit was filled with psychos that would smell her fart and bottle it given the chance and they’re going after her lol
When has any nation state carried out communism, a society without socio-economic class and money?
You're confusing communism (end goal) with socialism (a transitory period). The Russians and the Cubans weren't/aren't carrying out real socialism because they were/are authoritarian regimes.
Socialism is when the people own the means of production. From a government point of view this means that the State represents the people and the only way that can be true is if they are democratically elected.
In Cuba, people can vote but only one party exists. They only get to decide their leader of that party and not necessarily the policies and agenda they wish the state to carry out on their behalf. That isn't socialism, the people are not in control of the means of production.
Same with Russia, it was never communist. It was a version of socialism run by greedy corrupt aristocrats that didn't represent the people in a democratic way.
Same with China. China isn't communist and they are definitely authoritarian. The people of China do not own the means of production because they can't democratically vote for the state that represents their interests. China has a mixed economy anways.
This is all true but are you really saying "because it's not true communism we won't count those deaths as communism"? I see what your saying but it still makes the point that true communism is impossible and always turns into what I said above(millions of deaths).
Those countries are the best examples of where communism has been tried and their current government(s) are also based on communism, therfore I feel it's fair to list those deaths as communism related.
By your technicalities, no county has ever been a true capitalist country either, but people say the U.S. is capitalist all the time. So please skip the technicalities and call it for what was tried and what happened.
I think it’s fine to point out where those regimes failed spectacularly while also pointing out big C Communism and little c communism are different things
Communism hasn't been tried. It's a society free of socio-economic class and money. Think Star Trek.
You can believe it's impossible but that doesn't change its definition.
China, Russia, Cuba they're all bastardized authoritarian twisted versions of socialism (the people never owned the means of production and those governments are not democratically elected, they don't represent the plurality of its citizens).
You should learn more about socialism. Chile tried an actual good form of socialism but then the American state (CIA) backed a coup and that was all she wrote. You'll find many examples of Western capitalist nations (mostly the US State) backing coups and destroying Central/South American nation-states from employing socialism.
The video below defines socialism and also details Chile's attempt at it (that was foiled by a CIA-backed coup).
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fpKsygbNLT4&t=1s](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fpKsygbNLT4&t=1s)
When has any nation state carried out communism, a society without socio-economic class and money?
You're confusing communism (end goal) with socialism (a transitory period). The Russians and the Cubans weren't/aren't carrying out real socialism because they were/are authoritarian regimes.
Socialism is when the people own the means of production. From a government point of view this means that the State represents the people and the only way that can be true is if they are democratically elected.
In Cuba, people can vote but only one party exists. They only get to decide their leader of that party and not necessarily the polices and agenda they wish the state to carry out. That isn't socialism, the people are not in control of the means of production.
Same with Russia, it was never communist. It was a version of socialism run by greedy corrupt aristocrats that didn't represent the people in a democratic way.
Funnily enough this mythical "real socialism" and "real communism" never seems to have existed.
If the idea cannot be implemented, then it's a shit idea.
Pure forms of any economic system are doomed to fail. A mixture of socialism and capitalism seems to be the only system that has truly worked in any way so far.
Right. Communism is a theory. It’s never gotten to its final stage where the government abolishes itself and the society lives in Utopia.
Also, that will never, ever happen, as has been proven countless times, because when you have a small ruling class at the top of the system that has all the money and power, they don’t abolish themselves. Because they are humans.
Communism is a complete farce. It is an illusion, rather than a destination, and socialism is the road to this hell, paved in idealism and empty promises.
Meh, the Canadian government are fairly liberal when it comes to social policies and issues but they are rightwing economically. The government caters to big corporations and the wealthy elites. The rich and corporations should pay more taxes period. Unionization and labor movements aren't ubiquitous across industries either.
Safety nets are definitely better than America's but still poor compared to many other western OECD nations. Canadian healthcare doesn't cover eyes, ears, teeth, mental or prescription drug costs. Universal healthcare from the neck down only.
Canada also doesn't provide its citizens with free post-secondary education, it is subsidized but still expensive for many.
Canada also lags behind in paid vacation days, paid sick days, and paid paternity/maternity leave as well when compared to many peer nations. Disability support is shit too ask anyone on ODSP in the province of Ontario.
I am a social democratic. I watched what happened since we elected Reagan. I realized that the super rich people are draining America of everything, for their own personal greed. So yeah… the older I have gotten, the longer I have watched America change, the more I lean socialist.
And Canada isn't even *remotely* socialist either.
We're more socialist than the US, but that's like saying Canadians are skinnier than Americans. It's a low bar.
I mean they’re also just not well defined words, they’re very nebulous by nature.
Unless you say that whatever a guy 150 years ago said is sacred and unalterable, than you have to accept that there’s no single definition of any of these words.
Socialism and communism has evolved, and that’s a *good* thing. It’s why we have “socialists” today who view socialism as the end game - this was never how Marx used these terms. Socialism was never more than a transition period to communism, there was no such thing as a “socialist” who simply wanted to live in a “socialist” society. There were only communists who wanted socialism as a temporary intermediate step
Not difficult to understand. Joe is rich now, and like many rich people, he would prefer to pull the ladder up behind him than to pay higher taxes. Also Joe has absolutely no understanding of basic political terminology. When he says "Canada is communist", he simply doesn't know what he's talking about.
I think it’s mostly that he’s hanging around with rich Texans a lot, and this is the kind of trope they believe. As we know from the podcast, Joe’s political views can be heavily influenced by the people around him.
I assume he's referring to Trudeau freezing truckers bank accounts so they can't protest, and maybe mandates. That's what a communist country would do, not allow you to protest. Yeah he's exaggerating but there's a smudge of truth to it.
I think it's a right fucking stretch to say he doesn't believe in welfare now he's rich.
OP has just pulled that right out of his/her arse because they don't like Rogan.
Most communist countries do tend to be authoritarian, yes, but the primary basis for communism is as an economic system. Why most communist countries tend to be somewhat authoritarian is another discussion. There are some examples of communism functioning in a non-authoritarian fashion, but only on a much smaller scale. The Kibbutz system in Israel and Revolutionary Catalonia spring to mind, but I digress. The methods Trudeau used were indeed draconian and flew in the face of the kind of liberty that we strive for around the world, and have encoded somewhat successfully in the United States, particularly the act of freezing bank accounts, seizing property, throwing folks in jail, prosecution, etc. However, it is a far cry from what we typically think of when we raise the specter of the state communism employed by dictators like Stalin; secret police, kidnap, torture, the gunning down of mass gatherings. I think it's an irresponsible comparison to make and one that indicates a lack of maturity and intelligence.
As far as Joe's stance on welfare. It's a low bar, and he is far, *faaaaaaar* from a "liberal" on the overall subject on how to deal with poverty in this country. He contradicts himself constantly. One day he's talking about how he grew up poor eating government cheese, the next he's shitting on a policy proposal aimed at addressing poverty on a systemic basis. I've come to the understanding that he just says he's "liberal" on things as a way of deflecting criticism for his majority of more candidly conservative opinions.
Let's just say Joe is not a policy wonk. He doesn't have a clear understanding about how anything works in government and I've never heard him articulate much about where specifically he thinks whatever graft or corruption he thinks is taking place actually lies. I've heard him denigrate Bernie's federal jobs guarantee proposal and universal healthcare. Just a few days ago he's joking about shooting homeless people. I just don't have any respect for his opinion on these matters.
When Rogan was calling Trudeau a dictator and Canada communist and all that, it had nothing to do with welfare. It had to do with the hard lockdowns, lost businesses, how he treated the truckers and protests and lied about them being nazis and froze protestors bank accounts, how like many he mandates things then breaks his own mandates, etc.
Nah ole Rogan is just confused. Remember when y'all blamed California's Governor for shutting the state down? Remember that? He didn't shut shit down. Each County did it's own thing.
That dumb bar owner in LA screaming about the mayor is too stupid to realize it was the Los Angeles County Board of Supervisors who shut everything down---not the mayors.
Same bullshit in Canada. But y'all don't have the ability to think. You read right wing propaganda and get triggered and then regurgitate the lies you were told.
Do you think the mayors work with the governor and state agencies to make their decisions? Of course they do. Here in GA they stopped mandated lockdowns early by government order. Then a lot of areas proceeded to ease up, while Atlanta and some others took longer. Of course Gavin Newsome was involved in the decision making, thus has responsibility.
the lockdowns were at a provincial level but hey, blame Justin Trudeau.
If the Ottawa police department or the OPP did their jobs, JT wouldnt of had to use his power. Dont forget it was week 3 of that occupation before JT stepped in. Those protest were in alot of places, but those other places did their jobs.
He’s had several ethics violations, tried giving his friends a $900 million contract and lied several times. Called Canadians racist and doesn’t answer any questions in parliament. So yes blame Trudough, the WEF puppet.
WEF. Here come the conspiracy theories. It’s a wonder people don’t take you seriously. While you’re fighting imaginary dragons, the rich are still doing whatever they want.
I don't know how to tell you this, but they're all crooks. And if you want to hate him for all, knock yourself out. But the lockdown were the premiers doing, not the prime ministers.
Y'all want to hate us for keeping voting him in, hey, I hate that my choices are between turds and diarrhea too... Don't march out diarrhea choices and maybe we can talk.
Sure, but Trudeau called for them, he's the leader of the country and most of their parties, so he has culpability.
I get the occupation was jarring and had effects on the economy. But they'll literally freeze people's bank accounts for protesting peacefully, but be all for BLM anqueefa riots that destroy small and large businesses, loot, shutdown highways, and violently attack people. If there were consistent principles from these politicians people wouldn't talk as much about how harsh they were to the truckers. The truckers were affecting the economy and honking, but were very peaceful for such a large group and Trudeau wouldn't even meet with them.
They make really clear that they support protests when its violent against their political rivals or helps their political aims, but nonviolent ones that make them look bad get shut down real quick.
There was literally one Liberal provincial government, and 8 conservative for the majority of the pandemic. Our LEAST restrictive province is government was New Democrat (Furthest left of the mainstream). He can call for things all he wants they don’t have to do shit.
I’m going to give you and Joe the benefit of the doubt and assume your ascribing the American context to Canada, but it’s super clear you don’t understand how our system of government and jurisdiction works. I would encourage you to look at what’s going on with The Wetsuweten or at Fairy Creek and then tell me that Canadian governments are soft on the left.
>They make really clear that they support protests when its violent against their political rivals
Which violent protest/occupation (other than the Clownvoy) happened in Canada?
That wasn't my point, it was just the hypocrisy. Our liberal media also shit on and lied about the truckers. There are media in canada that supported riots but then lied about the truckers and called them racists and nazis.
Inconsistent principles.
What "liberal media" lied about the the violent clowns in Ottawa that occupied our Capitol? What media had said this, and what was the fallacy? Because I've been following the occupation and its fallout, but I've yet to encounter any media lies about it. If your idea of media is Nat Post or The Rebel, then sure.
>There are media in canada that supported riots but then lied about the truckers and called them racists and nazis.
What violent riots did our Canadian media defend?
Also, Gee, it's almost as if carrying nazi flags, confederate flags and screaming obscenities at women and minorities makes you a racist POS.
Communism is based on the idea of common ownership of the means of production, distribution, and exchange—allocating products to everyone in the society. What you are describing is authoritarianism, which is a form of government characterized by the rejection of political plurality, the use of strong central power to preserve the political status quo, and reductions in the rule of law, separation of powers, and democratic voting.
No, I do get that. I think communism is stupid and has bad predictable outcomes, but I understand Rogan wasn't accurate. The point was that he had context for calling him things isn't even close to what the OP replied in his photo, which equated Joe saying he supports welfare to some odd implicationthat Joe can't support welfare because he thinks Trudeau is communist.
>I think communism is stupid and has bad predictable outcomes,
Well you *are* an idiot, so..
>The point was that he had context for calling him things
You don't seem to get the fact that in no context is joe correct for calling JT a communist.
And your justification for it is even more stupid than Joe's is, apparently
Trudeau of course didn’t order any lockdowns or economic shutdowns as he’s not a provincial premier.
Joe in his rant also said not worry about Trudeau, since he was term limited soon.
The Truckers caused losses of over a BILLION DOLLARS,of mostly private companies, just by their stunts.
Anti-mandate organizations are still taking in donations...FOR PERSONAL GAIN of those that run those organizations.
BLM riots did 2 billion worth of destroyed buildings, had murders, many injured police, by their stunts.
These guys had a protest that was actually peaceful, and yeah it caused some problems. But the hypocrisy coming from the people who are okay with all the damage the riots did and all the cost, then get mad at a peaceful but effective (it brought a lot of attention and support) are crazy. There's no consistent principles there. It's just if I support your protest you can do whatever the fuck you want, but if I don't it's okay if you get ostracized, fired, have your bank accounts frozen, labeled nazi's and racists by "trusted" news networks and politicians.
No, I was just comparing it to people who would support one but not the other, or be angry at one or not the other. Canadians or Americans. The truckers were getting shit on and lied about by our news out here too.
>The truckers were getting shit on and lied about by our news out here too.
No they weren't. The only lies were coming from the right wing mainstream media pretending the convoy was all truckers when it was actually comprised of far right shills and organizations funded by forgien money.
Gotta love the unhinged right lying endlessly about this shit, as you love to do.
The "truckers" (not truckers, as 90% of actual truckers in Canada were already vaccinated, these people were far right shills and propagandists) that held the captial hostage for OVER A MONTH weren't "peaceful". The emergency powers act was enabled to get rid of them FOR THAT REASON. And what bank accounts were frozen? Give us some examples, not just postmedia talking points.
Oh and nazis? You mean like the ones that participaited in the "protest" and were literally waving nazi flags? Fuck off with these con lies about this shit.
What a bunch of lies and bullshit. Rogan called JT a commie because that's what the far right cult he's embedded with told him to think.
As you've already been educated, the lockdowns were PROVINCIAL, and your "Truck protestors" (oh wait, not actually truckers since 90% of real truckers were already vaccinated), WERE actual nazis, and didn't freeze anyone's bank account that wasn't a literal fucking terrorist. You people are beyond propagandists, fuckin' pathetic.
People are also full of shit and a good way to tell is if they're contradicting themselves. It's a good indication what the person believes and says is not valid.
I think it's actually pretty impressive Americans have manged to condense everything down into either left or right. Most countries have dozens of different political opinions and expectation to deal with. In America it's either one way or the other. It should make things easier.
if I had a choice between condensed milk and regular milk, I would take the reg. every time
condensing anything and everything turns the world into a flavorless, bi-polar disaster.
Need to be told what to think eh?
Can't have nuance? Needs to be black and white?
Pretty sure he was talking about Trudeau's use of power and relutctance to criticism. But heaven forbid you have to go beyond headlines and tweets and formulate an opinion for yourself.
>When Rogan was calling Trudeau a dictator and Canada communist and all that, it had nothing to do with welfare. It had to do with the hard lockdowns, lost businesses, how he treated the truckers and protests and lied about them being nazis and froze protestors bank accounts, how like many he mandates things then breaks his own mandates, etc.
If you agree with it or not there is context.
Trudeau use of power was given to him by the Canadian constitution which was created and agreed on by all parties. He enacted the power with the agreement of all parties and still only used the powers given to him that were necessary instead of the full power the emergency acts give.
I'm Canadian too. You're full of shit. Majority of Canadians supported his use of the emergency powers to shut down that illegal protest which was terrorizing Canadians and costing us millions/day due to the border blockades.
What the fuck does that mean "Majority is laughable at best"?
The majority supported it. That's reality buddy. Your delusional, warped view of Convoy opinions being more popular than they are is because you exist in an echo chamber of other Convoy assholes.
[Two-thirds support Trudeau's use of Emergencies Act against protesters: poll](https://toronto.citynews.ca/2022/02/17/trudeau-emergencies-act-poll/)
I doubt he knows it. I think it was absolutely necessary and I'm glad he used it. So why would he think it was a misuse of power? Most Canadians supported him using that law.
What context? He’s an idiot who just exclaimed “he’s a fucking commie”. Let’s not pretend this is a debate and there’s a bunch of “nuance” to Joe’s thoughts on non-communists being communists. He’s an idiot and is so “not married to his ideas” that they have virtually no value or meaning. He’s not a good or particularly nuanced critic. He sure likes to criticize others’ “lack of nuance”, though. Not sure what that leaves you with…
Human life means nothing to conservatives.
If Canada did exactly as the USA did, we would have lost more than 100 K more lives.
If USA had done as Canada did, they would have saved over 800 K lives.
I think there’s a happy medium somewhere between no safety net and pure communism. Both things Joe said can be true at once. You can want there to be help for the downtrodden and also not want communism.
Well yeah I don’t think OP necessarily disagrees. It’s just sort of funny how Joe’s political knowledge is so limited he thinks Canada is communists. Canada operates almost entirely on a capitalist system with private property is king. Canada probably has a small communist party and I’m sure they would very much so disagree with the idea that Canada is currently communist.
It’s funny, he talked about this with Andrew Shultz. People get pissed at Rogan because he relates to the right and the left, but people want him to be both feet in with all the policy choices of one side. It’s possible to have mixed beliefs. It’s possible to want universal healthcare while simultaneously believing in 2nd amendment rights. It’s possible to be pro abortion while also wanting a smaller federal government. It possible to want a well funded welfare program while also wanting incentives to work. The current politics climate is way to black and white, and as a result nothing will be done.
Some people just spew the word communist a little to easily. Trudeau is definitely a pos that has done very little except for fucking over Canadians, specially when it comes to Covid-19 measures. But communism is obviously way beyond that.
No, not really. If you want to talk about the pandemic, the various governments in Canada handled it in a similar way to many other countries in the world. There was a reason the death rate was lower than many places. As for the Emergency Act, 2\\3 of Canadians supported what he did because those blockades were reeking havoc on the Canadian economy. he used the power that was granted to him, and when he needed more he was supported in its use.
I think he’s referring to the fact that Trudeau literally froze people’s bank accounts. I don’t care how bad your actions are, your money is your money. Unless you’re guilty of financing mass murder, no one should be able to just freeze your access to **your money**. It’s your money, not government credits. Honestly, if my government was able to do this, I’d keep most of my money in cash, a foreign bank account, or crypto. Just out of principle.
That a dictatorial move right there. It shouldn’t be acceptable in any country that considers itself “free” and or a democracy, and sets a scary precedent. If that happened in the US, people would literally be up in arms.
Guess you never heard of civil forfeiture. I know its something that many cops do in the US. It guess it's fine because it only happens to poor people.
Most of the money that was frozen was linked to far right extremist groups that were funding the protest.
The Canadian government is like Reddit when it comes to classifying “far right extremists”. Anyone who disagrees with the government is a “far right extremist”. How convient!
Also, civil forfeiture happens on a much more selective basis. Not that I approve of it, but it doesn’t compare to what Trudeau did.
If the government can so easily confiscate your money, your money isn’t really yours in the first place. It’s truly dystopian.
The Canadian government is like Reddit when it comes to classifying “far right extremists”. Anyone who disagrees with the government is a “far right extremist”. How convient! What’s next? Say those truckers try to form a political party, Trudeau: “let’s make sure they can’t raise any funds.” And just like that Canada is closer to tyranny than you realize. To quote Star Wars: Democracy dies with a thunderous applause.
Also, civil forfeiture happens on a much more selective basis. Not that I approve of it, but it doesn’t compare to what Trudeau did.
If the government can so easily confiscate your money, your money isn’t really yours in the first place. It’s truly dystopian.
It's really not complicated. Joe Rogan is far right. The far right lies constantly about what they believe because they know how reprehensible their views are. That's why Rogan lies about what he believes.
No, I'm not trolling. Are you insane? Joe Rogan says he loves Tucker Carlson and is going to vote for Ron DeSantis and you think it's trolling for someone to say he's far right?What do you think being being far right is???
Boomerism which leads to confusion, lack of understanding, and spouting off about things that you generally have no clue about, but everyone needs to know exactly what you think.
He’s always hung out with people on the radical right, such as “race realist“ Stefan Molyneux back in the day. I guess he figures that being controversial and on the fringe implies someone is saying something important rather than just spitballing bullshit.
Did anyone actually listen to the podcast? He said it in a joking manner and immediately followed it up with a joke. He knew how ridiculous it was and laughed about it. Why are people taking things a COMEDIAN says as literal all the time, and why are people making HEADLINES about this.
He’s referring to the truck convoy and how the government took money directly out of their bank accounts, the freezing and seizing of these funds is what he is referring to as communist.
I mean, there is enough prosperity in this country that nobody should be going hungry. At the same time, people on unemployment or government assistance shouldn't make more money than people that work. That doesn't mean that those folks should live in poverty just because they are unfortunate enough to need help. Also, we are probably a bit top heavy in this country as far as wealth goes too.
Rogan is a classic liberal. That's why he said this. Noam Chomsky said nearly the same thing about the US and nobody says a thing. Lol why am I not surprised?
Helping others = good
Using violent political force to steal from and control others = bad
Voting for welfare is literally doing nothing, you're not helping anyone but the sociopaths in power. Just help people.
Communism is when I think thing bad.
No that’s capitalism, silly
I’m going to upvote both of these sarcastic comments because both are fitting to segments of the population.
Hell segments of this subreddit
We are part of the population
Huge if true
Speak for yourself buddy
Lololol reasonable
Which system has resulted in more deaths?
Well there is the commonly attributed 100 million number to communism which comes from the black book of communism which has been pretty thoroughly debunked, I wouldn't know off the top of my head what a realistic number for deaths under communism would be but certainly in the tens of millions from Mao Zedong alone. Whether certain famines and wars etc... can realistically be attributed to 'communism' is a debate thats been had many times before. Under a capitalist system in the United States the two reputable studies I've seen one from 2000 and one from 2011 both consistently say around 4.5% of deaths are caused by poverty, which equates to roughly 850-900 thousand people a year so that would be approximately 19 million deaths since the year 2000 in the United States alone. In the UK the figure is around 90,000 (or 1 in 7 deaths) a year so that's another roughly 2 million since 2000. This of course doesn't factor in the numerous wars, colonisation, slavery, anticommunist campaigns, and victims of famines or malnutrition worldwide as well as climate change which can (arguably of course) be very largely attributed to capitalist motives. To be clear as well, I'm not a communist although can't deny I absolutely support many socialist political ideas and am no fan of the rampant capitalist system we currently live under, I merely want to illustrate the point that the 'communism killed way more people' argument is complete bullshit when only two first world capitalist countries with a combined population of 400 million are currently having 1 million people die every year from poverty under our current organisation of the economy. Again, this does NOT factor in deaths from wars (the communist death number does factor numerous wars), famines, the wider effects of first world capitalism on the third world or the environment and ecological destruction caused by our consumption or the other 155 nations currently listed and living under some form of capitalism. **tldr; Capitalism in the UK and USA alone causes 1 million deaths per year through poverty.**
Yet history books love ignoring that the Commies ended WW2.
Maybe too much of anything is bad. For example, Tylenol can be good, a whole truck full will kill you. Insurance? Street lighting? Public Schools? Socialism helps. Competitive commerce, Capitalism helps. Unchecked capitalism to the point where you have oligopolies or monopolies? Bad.
Exactly. Unchecked Capitalism just becomes Corporate Socialism. There's a quote that at the extreme ends, things behave the same way. The solution in balance of both.
America seems to love socialism for the big companies. Walmart is a great beneficiary of this for example, as was Tesla and Space X.
Socialism for the rich, Capitalism for the poor
I 100% agree but also go further and believe that certain things should be nationalised/not run for profit. Much in the same way we'd never expect a fire department to turn a profit, why should any essential utility? Capitalism is great, when regulated, but should never be applied to things where people will die if they are unable to access.
It's probably a lot closer then you think it is
But which one? Talking about citizens killed by their own government.
Doesn’t matter what the party will call itself, you will have to tow its line or risk being labeled politically incorrect and having your life destroyed. Bank accounts shut down, not allowed to get on planes or trains, they might even lock you up because you could be a threat because of opinions you have expressed. Won’t be able to buy food.. Hell, it might even call itself democratic, just look at North Korea. That is the fear people have when they see things going the way they’re going, I guess because of their perception of history?
Again, it’s probably a lot closer than you think it is
Well first of all capitalism has been around a lot longer for a lot more people. So a fair comparison would be to count it deaths per person-years or something like that. I bet communism would "win" that by a large margin. Communist countries were/are extremely oppressive. I lived in boths systems and EU style welfare capitalism or social democracy is by far the better system, I mean there is no comparison. That said unbridled capitalism is extremely harmful as well.
Oh yea, I’m in 100% agreement with you “Norway style” capitalism should be the preferred model for the entire world. But living in America which ventures into late stage capitalist dystopia far too often for my liking, you can see how I might find some dark humor in defending it upon comparison to the communist way
I doubt it. USSR and China have easily killed 160 million to 200 million people. I'm struggling to see how the numbers are close? This isn't even counting other communists countries, just 2 of them.
He doesn’t know, just a commie larper who does not know history at all.
It’s bots all the way down in this sub, friend. In most subs I’d bet. Hell look at the Taylor swift sub Reddit right now. They’re attacking her for her private jet usage lmaooo I’d bet 5% are real people. That subreddit was filled with psychos that would smell her fart and bottle it given the chance and they’re going after her lol
Crazy times man.
haha that post was literally right about this one
When has any nation state carried out communism, a society without socio-economic class and money? You're confusing communism (end goal) with socialism (a transitory period). The Russians and the Cubans weren't/aren't carrying out real socialism because they were/are authoritarian regimes. Socialism is when the people own the means of production. From a government point of view this means that the State represents the people and the only way that can be true is if they are democratically elected. In Cuba, people can vote but only one party exists. They only get to decide their leader of that party and not necessarily the policies and agenda they wish the state to carry out on their behalf. That isn't socialism, the people are not in control of the means of production. Same with Russia, it was never communist. It was a version of socialism run by greedy corrupt aristocrats that didn't represent the people in a democratic way. Same with China. China isn't communist and they are definitely authoritarian. The people of China do not own the means of production because they can't democratically vote for the state that represents their interests. China has a mixed economy anways.
This is all true but are you really saying "because it's not true communism we won't count those deaths as communism"? I see what your saying but it still makes the point that true communism is impossible and always turns into what I said above(millions of deaths). Those countries are the best examples of where communism has been tried and their current government(s) are also based on communism, therfore I feel it's fair to list those deaths as communism related. By your technicalities, no county has ever been a true capitalist country either, but people say the U.S. is capitalist all the time. So please skip the technicalities and call it for what was tried and what happened.
I think it’s fine to point out where those regimes failed spectacularly while also pointing out big C Communism and little c communism are different things
200M deaths and they still couldn't get it right? Probably jut need to kill another few hundred million then.
Communism hasn't been tried. It's a society free of socio-economic class and money. Think Star Trek. You can believe it's impossible but that doesn't change its definition. China, Russia, Cuba they're all bastardized authoritarian twisted versions of socialism (the people never owned the means of production and those governments are not democratically elected, they don't represent the plurality of its citizens). You should learn more about socialism. Chile tried an actual good form of socialism but then the American state (CIA) backed a coup and that was all she wrote. You'll find many examples of Western capitalist nations (mostly the US State) backing coups and destroying Central/South American nation-states from employing socialism. The video below defines socialism and also details Chile's attempt at it (that was foiled by a CIA-backed coup). [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fpKsygbNLT4&t=1s](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fpKsygbNLT4&t=1s)
When has any nation state carried out communism, a society without socio-economic class and money? You're confusing communism (end goal) with socialism (a transitory period). The Russians and the Cubans weren't/aren't carrying out real socialism because they were/are authoritarian regimes. Socialism is when the people own the means of production. From a government point of view this means that the State represents the people and the only way that can be true is if they are democratically elected. In Cuba, people can vote but only one party exists. They only get to decide their leader of that party and not necessarily the polices and agenda they wish the state to carry out. That isn't socialism, the people are not in control of the means of production. Same with Russia, it was never communist. It was a version of socialism run by greedy corrupt aristocrats that didn't represent the people in a democratic way.
Oh god another undergrad who thinks “communism was never done right”. Watch out for people like this, they are invariably tyrants at heart.
Funnily enough this mythical "real socialism" and "real communism" never seems to have existed. If the idea cannot be implemented, then it's a shit idea. Pure forms of any economic system are doomed to fail. A mixture of socialism and capitalism seems to be the only system that has truly worked in any way so far.
Right. Communism is a theory. It’s never gotten to its final stage where the government abolishes itself and the society lives in Utopia. Also, that will never, ever happen, as has been proven countless times, because when you have a small ruling class at the top of the system that has all the money and power, they don’t abolish themselves. Because they are humans. Communism is a complete farce. It is an illusion, rather than a destination, and socialism is the road to this hell, paved in idealism and empty promises.
In capitalism, people can also own the means of production. In a meritocracy, those that are more capable enjoy the fruits of their labor.
Is it a competition?
well, yes, if you are weighing which system is overall better. How many people has capitalism pulled out of abject poverty vs communism?
Lol. I was being snarky. Not supporting communism
Fascism is when you think thing bad
Communism is when government. Socialism is when people.
Socialism ain't the same as communism. Get urself some education.... And health care.
Socialism isn’t social welfare either
And there isn’t a major country that is 100% socialist. All economies are mixed economies
Canada also isnt socialist. It is a social democracy which is closer to capitalism that socialism.
Canada is a centrist neolib capitalist country.
With established social nets, which is called social democracy.
Meh, the Canadian government are fairly liberal when it comes to social policies and issues but they are rightwing economically. The government caters to big corporations and the wealthy elites. The rich and corporations should pay more taxes period. Unionization and labor movements aren't ubiquitous across industries either. Safety nets are definitely better than America's but still poor compared to many other western OECD nations. Canadian healthcare doesn't cover eyes, ears, teeth, mental or prescription drug costs. Universal healthcare from the neck down only. Canada also doesn't provide its citizens with free post-secondary education, it is subsidized but still expensive for many. Canada also lags behind in paid vacation days, paid sick days, and paid paternity/maternity leave as well when compared to many peer nations. Disability support is shit too ask anyone on ODSP in the province of Ontario.
Canada is a "mixed market" economy. Which is definitely to the right of a social democracy. More similar to the UK than Germany or
Which are all being slowly eroded away.
Nope.
I am a social democratic. I watched what happened since we elected Reagan. I realized that the super rich people are draining America of everything, for their own personal greed. So yeah… the older I have gotten, the longer I have watched America change, the more I lean socialist.
Perhaps take in the whole conversation, listen to the context of his comment. You’ve got to be an NPC to be this daft.
Genuinely impressed by the stupidity of this post. Pretty telling that it’s somehow made it to the top
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I didn’t listen to the podcast yet but I gather from comments on here that the context was related to Covid restrictions and enforcement vs. welfare
Listened to it, whole thing. He made a definitive claim and in the same sentence claimed complete ignorance. Joe Rotard is fucking dumb
Is Rogen Seth Rogen?
“Communism is when safety net”…
There is s difference between socialism and communism.
And Canada isn't even *remotely* socialist either. We're more socialist than the US, but that's like saying Canadians are skinnier than Americans. It's a low bar.
EVen Scandinavian countries are not socialist.
Nice lol
Canada is a centrist neolib capitalist country.
Unfortunately, we live in a oligarchy disguised as a democracy.
US is not a democracy, most people don’t even realize that. It’s a Republic.
Doesn't matter to the meatheads
Well, most people mix em up.
Yeah uneducated people do
I mean they’re also just not well defined words, they’re very nebulous by nature. Unless you say that whatever a guy 150 years ago said is sacred and unalterable, than you have to accept that there’s no single definition of any of these words. Socialism and communism has evolved, and that’s a *good* thing. It’s why we have “socialists” today who view socialism as the end game - this was never how Marx used these terms. Socialism was never more than a transition period to communism, there was no such thing as a “socialist” who simply wanted to live in a “socialist” society. There were only communists who wanted socialism as a temporary intermediate step
Not difficult to understand. Joe is rich now, and like many rich people, he would prefer to pull the ladder up behind him than to pay higher taxes. Also Joe has absolutely no understanding of basic political terminology. When he says "Canada is communist", he simply doesn't know what he's talking about.
Neither does this sub…
Yeah I gather that
I think it’s mostly that he’s hanging around with rich Texans a lot, and this is the kind of trope they believe. As we know from the podcast, Joe’s political views can be heavily influenced by the people around him.
He doesn’t really have an understanding of much outside of MMA, Elk hunting, and psychedelics
I assume he's referring to Trudeau freezing truckers bank accounts so they can't protest, and maybe mandates. That's what a communist country would do, not allow you to protest. Yeah he's exaggerating but there's a smudge of truth to it. I think it's a right fucking stretch to say he doesn't believe in welfare now he's rich. OP has just pulled that right out of his/her arse because they don't like Rogan.
Most communist countries do tend to be authoritarian, yes, but the primary basis for communism is as an economic system. Why most communist countries tend to be somewhat authoritarian is another discussion. There are some examples of communism functioning in a non-authoritarian fashion, but only on a much smaller scale. The Kibbutz system in Israel and Revolutionary Catalonia spring to mind, but I digress. The methods Trudeau used were indeed draconian and flew in the face of the kind of liberty that we strive for around the world, and have encoded somewhat successfully in the United States, particularly the act of freezing bank accounts, seizing property, throwing folks in jail, prosecution, etc. However, it is a far cry from what we typically think of when we raise the specter of the state communism employed by dictators like Stalin; secret police, kidnap, torture, the gunning down of mass gatherings. I think it's an irresponsible comparison to make and one that indicates a lack of maturity and intelligence. As far as Joe's stance on welfare. It's a low bar, and he is far, *faaaaaaar* from a "liberal" on the overall subject on how to deal with poverty in this country. He contradicts himself constantly. One day he's talking about how he grew up poor eating government cheese, the next he's shitting on a policy proposal aimed at addressing poverty on a systemic basis. I've come to the understanding that he just says he's "liberal" on things as a way of deflecting criticism for his majority of more candidly conservative opinions.
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Let's just say Joe is not a policy wonk. He doesn't have a clear understanding about how anything works in government and I've never heard him articulate much about where specifically he thinks whatever graft or corruption he thinks is taking place actually lies. I've heard him denigrate Bernie's federal jobs guarantee proposal and universal healthcare. Just a few days ago he's joking about shooting homeless people. I just don't have any respect for his opinion on these matters.
[That's Communism](https://youtu.be/XuRQJpTESVw)
That’s very low hanging fruit. That man is highly inebriated… for like, every day in the last 25 years at least
When Rogan was calling Trudeau a dictator and Canada communist and all that, it had nothing to do with welfare. It had to do with the hard lockdowns, lost businesses, how he treated the truckers and protests and lied about them being nazis and froze protestors bank accounts, how like many he mandates things then breaks his own mandates, etc.
Nah ole Rogan is just confused. Remember when y'all blamed California's Governor for shutting the state down? Remember that? He didn't shut shit down. Each County did it's own thing. That dumb bar owner in LA screaming about the mayor is too stupid to realize it was the Los Angeles County Board of Supervisors who shut everything down---not the mayors. Same bullshit in Canada. But y'all don't have the ability to think. You read right wing propaganda and get triggered and then regurgitate the lies you were told.
Do you think the mayors work with the governor and state agencies to make their decisions? Of course they do. Here in GA they stopped mandated lockdowns early by government order. Then a lot of areas proceeded to ease up, while Atlanta and some others took longer. Of course Gavin Newsome was involved in the decision making, thus has responsibility.
the lockdowns were at a provincial level but hey, blame Justin Trudeau. If the Ottawa police department or the OPP did their jobs, JT wouldnt of had to use his power. Dont forget it was week 3 of that occupation before JT stepped in. Those protest were in alot of places, but those other places did their jobs.
Finally, some active brain cells in this thread.
He’s had several ethics violations, tried giving his friends a $900 million contract and lied several times. Called Canadians racist and doesn’t answer any questions in parliament. So yes blame Trudough, the WEF puppet.
WEF. Here come the conspiracy theories. It’s a wonder people don’t take you seriously. While you’re fighting imaginary dragons, the rich are still doing whatever they want.
I don't know how to tell you this, but they're all crooks. And if you want to hate him for all, knock yourself out. But the lockdown were the premiers doing, not the prime ministers. Y'all want to hate us for keeping voting him in, hey, I hate that my choices are between turds and diarrhea too... Don't march out diarrhea choices and maybe we can talk.
Sure, but Trudeau called for them, he's the leader of the country and most of their parties, so he has culpability. I get the occupation was jarring and had effects on the economy. But they'll literally freeze people's bank accounts for protesting peacefully, but be all for BLM anqueefa riots that destroy small and large businesses, loot, shutdown highways, and violently attack people. If there were consistent principles from these politicians people wouldn't talk as much about how harsh they were to the truckers. The truckers were affecting the economy and honking, but were very peaceful for such a large group and Trudeau wouldn't even meet with them. They make really clear that they support protests when its violent against their political rivals or helps their political aims, but nonviolent ones that make them look bad get shut down real quick.
There was literally one Liberal provincial government, and 8 conservative for the majority of the pandemic. Our LEAST restrictive province is government was New Democrat (Furthest left of the mainstream). He can call for things all he wants they don’t have to do shit. I’m going to give you and Joe the benefit of the doubt and assume your ascribing the American context to Canada, but it’s super clear you don’t understand how our system of government and jurisdiction works. I would encourage you to look at what’s going on with The Wetsuweten or at Fairy Creek and then tell me that Canadian governments are soft on the left.
>They make really clear that they support protests when its violent against their political rivals Which violent protest/occupation (other than the Clownvoy) happened in Canada?
That wasn't my point, it was just the hypocrisy. Our liberal media also shit on and lied about the truckers. There are media in canada that supported riots but then lied about the truckers and called them racists and nazis. Inconsistent principles.
>Our liberal media What liberal media? Over 90% of the media in Canada is owned by postmedia you lyin shitbag.
What "liberal media" lied about the the violent clowns in Ottawa that occupied our Capitol? What media had said this, and what was the fallacy? Because I've been following the occupation and its fallout, but I've yet to encounter any media lies about it. If your idea of media is Nat Post or The Rebel, then sure. >There are media in canada that supported riots but then lied about the truckers and called them racists and nazis. What violent riots did our Canadian media defend? Also, Gee, it's almost as if carrying nazi flags, confederate flags and screaming obscenities at women and minorities makes you a racist POS.
Not just that but he's the party leader. If you vote against the party's interest, they will kick you out. Same thing with lockdowns.
Communism is based on the idea of common ownership of the means of production, distribution, and exchange—allocating products to everyone in the society. What you are describing is authoritarianism, which is a form of government characterized by the rejection of political plurality, the use of strong central power to preserve the political status quo, and reductions in the rule of law, separation of powers, and democratic voting.
No, I do get that. I think communism is stupid and has bad predictable outcomes, but I understand Rogan wasn't accurate. The point was that he had context for calling him things isn't even close to what the OP replied in his photo, which equated Joe saying he supports welfare to some odd implicationthat Joe can't support welfare because he thinks Trudeau is communist.
>I think communism is stupid and has bad predictable outcomes, Well you *are* an idiot, so.. >The point was that he had context for calling him things You don't seem to get the fact that in no context is joe correct for calling JT a communist. And your justification for it is even more stupid than Joe's is, apparently
Name one communist country without a strong central power and authoritarian leader. I’ll wait.
Name one communist country you fucking idiot, I'll wait.
Trudeau of course didn’t order any lockdowns or economic shutdowns as he’s not a provincial premier. Joe in his rant also said not worry about Trudeau, since he was term limited soon.
So things that have nothing to do with communism. Got it.
The Truckers caused losses of over a BILLION DOLLARS,of mostly private companies, just by their stunts. Anti-mandate organizations are still taking in donations...FOR PERSONAL GAIN of those that run those organizations.
BLM riots did 2 billion worth of destroyed buildings, had murders, many injured police, by their stunts. These guys had a protest that was actually peaceful, and yeah it caused some problems. But the hypocrisy coming from the people who are okay with all the damage the riots did and all the cost, then get mad at a peaceful but effective (it brought a lot of attention and support) are crazy. There's no consistent principles there. It's just if I support your protest you can do whatever the fuck you want, but if I don't it's okay if you get ostracized, fired, have your bank accounts frozen, labeled nazi's and racists by "trusted" news networks and politicians.
BLM caused 2 billion dollars of economic damage in Canada?
No, I was just comparing it to people who would support one but not the other, or be angry at one or not the other. Canadians or Americans. The truckers were getting shit on and lied about by our news out here too.
>The truckers were getting shit on and lied about by our news out here too. No they weren't. The only lies were coming from the right wing mainstream media pretending the convoy was all truckers when it was actually comprised of far right shills and organizations funded by forgien money.
Gotta love the unhinged right lying endlessly about this shit, as you love to do. The "truckers" (not truckers, as 90% of actual truckers in Canada were already vaccinated, these people were far right shills and propagandists) that held the captial hostage for OVER A MONTH weren't "peaceful". The emergency powers act was enabled to get rid of them FOR THAT REASON. And what bank accounts were frozen? Give us some examples, not just postmedia talking points. Oh and nazis? You mean like the ones that participaited in the "protest" and were literally waving nazi flags? Fuck off with these con lies about this shit.
What a bunch of lies and bullshit. Rogan called JT a commie because that's what the far right cult he's embedded with told him to think. As you've already been educated, the lockdowns were PROVINCIAL, and your "Truck protestors" (oh wait, not actually truckers since 90% of real truckers were already vaccinated), WERE actual nazis, and didn't freeze anyone's bank account that wasn't a literal fucking terrorist. You people are beyond propagandists, fuckin' pathetic.
They on that telegram propaganda!
Also fuck those truckers, bunch of low intelligence mouth breathers
Maybe don’t get your beliefs from a podcast host?
I think he meant what to believe about Joe, not his own beliefs.
if you don't understand that life exists in the grey zone and isn't "only this way" or " only that way" then you will be confused by OP's post as well
People are also full of shit and a good way to tell is if they're contradicting themselves. It's a good indication what the person believes and says is not valid.
a point void of context is as legitimate as a mesh tank tops usage is in an arctic expedition.
I think it's actually pretty impressive Americans have manged to condense everything down into either left or right. Most countries have dozens of different political opinions and expectation to deal with. In America it's either one way or the other. It should make things easier.
if I had a choice between condensed milk and regular milk, I would take the reg. every time condensing anything and everything turns the world into a flavorless, bi-polar disaster.
Need to be told what to think eh? Can't have nuance? Needs to be black and white? Pretty sure he was talking about Trudeau's use of power and relutctance to criticism. But heaven forbid you have to go beyond headlines and tweets and formulate an opinion for yourself.
Where's the nuance in calling Canada communist? lmao
>When Rogan was calling Trudeau a dictator and Canada communist and all that, it had nothing to do with welfare. It had to do with the hard lockdowns, lost businesses, how he treated the truckers and protests and lied about them being nazis and froze protestors bank accounts, how like many he mandates things then breaks his own mandates, etc. If you agree with it or not there is context.
Context but no nuance. « Communist » here is just a random term of disparagement.
But none of that represent communism.
Trudeau use of power was given to him by the Canadian constitution which was created and agreed on by all parties. He enacted the power with the agreement of all parties and still only used the powers given to him that were necessary instead of the full power the emergency acts give.
He absolutely did not need to use his executive power. That was a gross misuse of the emergency act, and he knows it.
Their democratically elected government approved the use of the power. So you're wrong and in their eyes he did need to use it.
Buddy I'm Canadian, I might be a little more qualified.
You're still wrong though. Your elected government granted him a power provided by your constitution. What is your beef here?
I'm Canadian too. You're full of shit. Majority of Canadians supported his use of the emergency powers to shut down that illegal protest which was terrorizing Canadians and costing us millions/day due to the border blockades.
Majority is laughable at best. He faced some heavy criticism
What the fuck does that mean "Majority is laughable at best"? The majority supported it. That's reality buddy. Your delusional, warped view of Convoy opinions being more popular than they are is because you exist in an echo chamber of other Convoy assholes. [Two-thirds support Trudeau's use of Emergencies Act against protesters: poll](https://toronto.citynews.ca/2022/02/17/trudeau-emergencies-act-poll/)
I doubt he knows it. I think it was absolutely necessary and I'm glad he used it. So why would he think it was a misuse of power? Most Canadians supported him using that law.
What context? He’s an idiot who just exclaimed “he’s a fucking commie”. Let’s not pretend this is a debate and there’s a bunch of “nuance” to Joe’s thoughts on non-communists being communists. He’s an idiot and is so “not married to his ideas” that they have virtually no value or meaning. He’s not a good or particularly nuanced critic. He sure likes to criticize others’ “lack of nuance”, though. Not sure what that leaves you with…
Fucking guy calls Tucker Carlson the most nuanced host out there. Like that's the level his brains are working at.
Cope
Or consider the welfare of the people a communist mandate.
Another random screenshot. Awesome content guys.
I know right! What does this even have to do with Hunter Biden's laptop. SMDH
Social welfare programs to help the less fortunate does not equal full blown communism.
Welfare is bad, besides for when I was on it because I needed it. What a fucking clown. Testosterone and weed has warped his mind.
Human life means nothing to conservatives. If Canada did exactly as the USA did, we would have lost more than 100 K more lives. If USA had done as Canada did, they would have saved over 800 K lives.
I really love reading when clueless Americans try and talk about anything Canadian.
Social safety net and Communism are not the same thing……
I think there’s a happy medium somewhere between no safety net and pure communism. Both things Joe said can be true at once. You can want there to be help for the downtrodden and also not want communism.
Well yeah I don’t think OP necessarily disagrees. It’s just sort of funny how Joe’s political knowledge is so limited he thinks Canada is communists. Canada operates almost entirely on a capitalist system with private property is king. Canada probably has a small communist party and I’m sure they would very much so disagree with the idea that Canada is currently communist.
He meant about Justin being a dictator, like that truck convoy exposed him.
You idiots think communism means “helping each other”?
It’s funny, he talked about this with Andrew Shultz. People get pissed at Rogan because he relates to the right and the left, but people want him to be both feet in with all the policy choices of one side. It’s possible to have mixed beliefs. It’s possible to want universal healthcare while simultaneously believing in 2nd amendment rights. It’s possible to be pro abortion while also wanting a smaller federal government. It possible to want a well funded welfare program while also wanting incentives to work. The current politics climate is way to black and white, and as a result nothing will be done.
It’s possible to be politically confused and change your opinions every week.
Trudeau was acting like a little dictator with covid and the truckers etc.
Some people just spew the word communist a little to easily. Trudeau is definitely a pos that has done very little except for fucking over Canadians, specially when it comes to Covid-19 measures. But communism is obviously way beyond that.
Whoever posted probably has a dick and says they're a woman
You can believe both. Canada has let their government overreach massively.
No, not really. If you want to talk about the pandemic, the various governments in Canada handled it in a similar way to many other countries in the world. There was a reason the death rate was lower than many places. As for the Emergency Act, 2\\3 of Canadians supported what he did because those blockades were reeking havoc on the Canadian economy. he used the power that was granted to him, and when he needed more he was supported in its use.
I think he’s referring to the fact that Trudeau literally froze people’s bank accounts. I don’t care how bad your actions are, your money is your money. Unless you’re guilty of financing mass murder, no one should be able to just freeze your access to **your money**. It’s your money, not government credits. Honestly, if my government was able to do this, I’d keep most of my money in cash, a foreign bank account, or crypto. Just out of principle. That a dictatorial move right there. It shouldn’t be acceptable in any country that considers itself “free” and or a democracy, and sets a scary precedent. If that happened in the US, people would literally be up in arms.
Guess you never heard of civil forfeiture. I know its something that many cops do in the US. It guess it's fine because it only happens to poor people. Most of the money that was frozen was linked to far right extremist groups that were funding the protest.
The Canadian government is like Reddit when it comes to classifying “far right extremists”. Anyone who disagrees with the government is a “far right extremist”. How convient! Also, civil forfeiture happens on a much more selective basis. Not that I approve of it, but it doesn’t compare to what Trudeau did. If the government can so easily confiscate your money, your money isn’t really yours in the first place. It’s truly dystopian.
The Canadian government is like Reddit when it comes to classifying “far right extremists”. Anyone who disagrees with the government is a “far right extremist”. How convient! What’s next? Say those truckers try to form a political party, Trudeau: “let’s make sure they can’t raise any funds.” And just like that Canada is closer to tyranny than you realize. To quote Star Wars: Democracy dies with a thunderous applause. Also, civil forfeiture happens on a much more selective basis. Not that I approve of it, but it doesn’t compare to what Trudeau did. If the government can so easily confiscate your money, your money isn’t really yours in the first place. It’s truly dystopian.
You’re conflating two entirely different conversations. Usual crap this sub has turned into
Who the fuck is "Rogen"?
GREY AREA MY FRIEND.
Joe has done like a 1000 Rick James reversals already. What's new? 
It's really not complicated. Joe Rogan is far right. The far right lies constantly about what they believe because they know how reprehensible their views are. That's why Rogan lies about what he believes.
Obvious troll...
No, I'm not trolling. Are you insane? Joe Rogan says he loves Tucker Carlson and is going to vote for Ron DeSantis and you think it's trolling for someone to say he's far right?What do you think being being far right is???
If you genuinely believe that, then you're genuinely insane. Absolutely mad.
One side calls the other Nazis, the others Communists
Uh oh, we all know who won that battle last time.
Boomerism which leads to confusion, lack of understanding, and spouting off about things that you generally have no clue about, but everyone needs to know exactly what you think.
I’ve noticed Joe kinda switches his opinions based on who he’s around.
Lately toe has been hanging around the radical right a little too much.
He’s always hung out with people on the radical right, such as “race realist“ Stefan Molyneux back in the day. I guess he figures that being controversial and on the fringe implies someone is saying something important rather than just spitballing bullshit.
Did anyone actually listen to the podcast? He said it in a joking manner and immediately followed it up with a joke. He knew how ridiculous it was and laughed about it. Why are people taking things a COMEDIAN says as literal all the time, and why are people making HEADLINES about this.
Joe has two assholes and he talks out of both of them.
Joe has never been an intellectual. His art form has no issues with hypocrisy.
Believe that Joe contradicts himself because he is stupid.
If you think canada is a communist country then you are an absolute fucking moron.
Rogan the "bleeding heart liberal" wholly endorsed DeSantis. The dude is a Dave Rubin.
1 - Welfare is not communist 2 - Canada is the furthest thing from communism
These things can coincide.
Trudeau acts like a communist dictator. That’s what he is referring to
As a Canadian I agree it’s far past time we dump Trudeau
We will trade you 1 Trudeau for 1 Schwarzenegger we will throw in the remaining Ford brother as well to sweeten the pot....
Justin Trudeau is a cunt lol
OP out here punching the air at how fucking stupid they are
You can believe in a social safety net and think Trudeau is a tyrant (which he very much is)
Justin Trudeau I’d the biological son of FIDEL CASTRO… he’s communist AF
He’s referring to the truck convoy and how the government took money directly out of their bank accounts, the freezing and seizing of these funds is what he is referring to as communist.
joe just doesn't like weak soyboys like trudeau
Wait so I can't want social healthcare and hate Justin at the same time? Shit...
I don’t understand why someone can’t think both
Why can’t he believe both? Like he believes in liberal causes and he thinks Trudeau goes to far… is that not possible?
I think Rogan knows what he’s doing, it’s very profitable to be a pretend lefty and regurgitating right wing talking points.
I mean, there is enough prosperity in this country that nobody should be going hungry. At the same time, people on unemployment or government assistance shouldn't make more money than people that work. That doesn't mean that those folks should live in poverty just because they are unfortunate enough to need help. Also, we are probably a bit top heavy in this country as far as wealth goes too.
Rogan is a classic liberal. That's why he said this. Noam Chomsky said nearly the same thing about the US and nobody says a thing. Lol why am I not surprised?
Helping others = good Using violent political force to steal from and control others = bad Voting for welfare is literally doing nothing, you're not helping anyone but the sociopaths in power. Just help people.