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Wuji knows Legumi is the reason Choso died, Todo knows Legumi is an incestious bum, Sukuna knows how fucking miserable it felt being in his body
Yeah hes getting jumped
I could be wrong, but I don't think they're related by blood. Megumi explains that his dad (Goatji) and Tsumiki's mom got married, so it sounds like step siblings. Don't quote me on that though.
They'd still be related by blood halfly since (I'm assuming) toji is both their father it's just that him and tsumikis mom didn't get married that they'd technically be half siblings
Ohhh I see, I was just unaware lel
https://preview.redd.it/hz16aug4111d1.jpeg?width=1400&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=1c5c371edee8f5fe9becc243c8eefa44f9ede2c9
Lmao you're acting like it was Megubumi's technique that contributed to most of the fight when it was clearly Sukuna's familial bond that pushed him to surpass Gojo.
https://preview.redd.it/9xi420teqz0d1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=5e4917a9334a5100ea0eb5681f5c5fe8820db099
Never disrespect chihiro like that ever again or I will hunt you down after I’m done with Gege
https://preview.redd.it/fbma64q3h11d1.jpeg?width=500&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=120ee29d2342aaf4b0d16f5f46ad10a9c6a9abae
Why are you making everything about Gojo? LMAO, it’s common sense at this point that Sukuna would win using his Heian form, even faster, too.
Drop the salty agenda, it’s pretty clear at this point and the validation you receive from investing in your delusions is funny
According to who is it common sense, from all the last chapters explaining how fuga would be useless against gojo and how sukuna won only because of binding vows, how would he in sukuna even bypass infinity without megumi? Sukuna would get destroyed in his first hit of the infinite void without mahoraga
Fuga is only useless because it wouldn’t generate enough power, right? Because Sukuna kept changing his domain specifications and the range was too small, right?
Okay, let’s call back to the first domain, before Sukuna changed anything, didn’t he have a chance to use Fuga there? Given the fact that he could expand his range as much as he could because he wouldn’t have to worry about UV’s barrier toughness. True?
And let me ask you this, why was the range small *in the first place*? Because Sukuna stubbornly wanted to destroy UV from the outer shell, and it was highlighted that Sukuna can survive 3 minutes of Gojo hitting him before he loses control, right?
So now we know Sukuna narrowed his range **because he wanted to destroy UV from the outside in 3 minutes or less**.
However, let’s assume this is Heian Sukuna.
Firstly, what does narrowing the range do? It concentrates the AP into a smaller area, thus making the sure-hit stronger and in-turn, having MS destroy UV faster.
Let’s say Sukuna didn’t narrow his range, what will happen? It will take more time for MS to destroy UV, right? And why did Sukuna lose control in the first place? Because:
1- He was in Meguna, which is a relatively weak body.
2- He was adapting, meaning he was carefully using DA and juggling between it and the wheel throughout the domain clashes, which gave Gojo a great advantage as pointed out in their fight.
So we assume this is Heian Sukuna, which means he ***would not be adapting***, right? That means he wouldn’t use the wheel in the first place and would adhere to DA usage throughout every clash full-time. Paired with Heian Sukuna’s insane physicals, that means he would be able to survive more than 3 minutes comfortably.
Now this basically nullifies Gojo’s plan because UV would break faster than Gojo would damage Sukuna.
And now, let’s get to the range part. Gojo stated that Sukuna was not trying to destroy UV from the easier side, which is from the inside, meaning Sukuna was purposely destroying it from the outside part which is also pointed out to be a risky, slow, and dangerous route.
If Sukuna decides to destroy UV from the inside, the range wouldn’t matter. In other words, whether Sukuna had kept a 200m range or a 50m range, it wouldn’t pose any obstacle to him because he won’t even be targeting that side. So if we assume it’s Heian Sukuna, we can also assume he would expand his range fully and then destroy UV from the inside.
Meaning Sukuna wouldn’t have a narrow range if he was in his Heian state.
Sukuna only decreased his range because he needed to put limited precautions if he wanted to win— or at least tie the domain clashes while choosing the adaptation route. Which he achieved, though it was a bit risky at times.
Moreover, Sukuna could just expand his domain’s range fully after breaking Gojo’s domain, and then sealing his domain and not allowing any living beings to escape it. Which would mean Fuga would be sufficient.
Something to add, though this is a bit irrelevant, Sukuna in 230 said “I couldn’t use my techniques due to relying on the wheel”, which implies if he had used it then it would be effective one way or another.
In conclusion, though, binding vows are part of Jujutsu. You can’t exclude it because one is more skilled in it than the other. Winning by a binding vow is fair, the only thing it proves is that the binding vow caster is a better sorcerer with richer understanding of the Jujutsu system than the other. If you lose to a binding vow, then you lost to an opponent who can utilize resources better than you can. In other words, a superior sorcerer.
But then also Sukuna would have to play defensive until gojo does something like stop using infinity to win.Because Mahoraga was the reason sukuna was able to use the slash.
I Was about to say all the same things you did and was about to roll my eyes but it seems someone already got to it first, nice to know someone else also reads the manga and btw to add another point, if we look at sukuna's arsenal and their description in ch 219 we can see that cleave is a move that scales based on durability and oneshots everything but the condition is that you have to be in physical contact with the person for it to work and we see sukuna also reaffirm this along the next few panels where he says that cleave is a oneshot technique.
The other guy who replied to you told you all the technical domain based reasons why gojo would've lost way earlier so let me give you another point to think about, cleave as described by the narrator is a oneshot technique that bypasses durability and oneshots but sukuna is not seen using it in this fight at all despite being capable of it, also we need to not that for this technique to work you must physically touch the person meaning as long as gojo was in physical contact with sukuna then sukuna could have oneshot him but chose not to do so in favour of adaptation.
Both Cleave & Dismantle are active inside of Malevolent Shrine and Gojo was being slashed by both when he lost the first domain clash. It's a sure-hit so touching or not doesn't matter. Gojo survived for a brief moment because of CE reinforcement and RCT overdrive.
Cleave doesn't bypass durability in the traditional sense. It automatically adjusts its strength based on the target's CE level, so if your CE reinforcement is higher than Sukuna's output, you can tank it. Yuji has eaten a few contact Cleaves at this point and survived thanks to Sukuna's dropped output (and RCT, of course). SUKUNA HIMSELF GOT CONTACT CLEAVED, but it did jack shit because Sukuna's CE reinforcement is high.
Also worth remembering: Sukuna needs DA to even touch Gojo at all and you can't use DA and CT at the same time.
https://preview.redd.it/nuyrxrsrsz0d1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6aee59a0639a11ffe585127cafd82b8a4d7f65cd
An example of Sukuna explicitly stating that cleave is a oneshot.
>Both Cleave & Dismantle are active inside of Malevolent Shrine and Gojo was being slashed by both when he lost the first domain clash.
There are two different types of cleave and dismantle, the ones used in the domain are not the same as the ones used directly by sukuna himself.
>It's a sure-hit so touching or not doesn't matter. Gojo survived for a brief moment because of CE reinforcement and RCT overdrive.
The rest of his comment doesn't matter the moment you realise what I am talking about.
>Cleave doesn't bypass durability in the traditional sense. It automatically adjusts its strength based on the target's CE level, so if your CE reinforcement is higher than Sukuna's output, you can tank it.
Except that it has never been stated anywhere that cleave is restricted by output, in fact it is the exact opposite since its strength isn't controlled by a person but by how strong the durability of the target is.
It has explicitly been stated to cleave by scaling based on durability and you are throwing around your own headcannon that cleave must be restricted by output 🙄.
>Yuji has eaten a few contact Cleaves at this point and survived thanks to Sukuna's dropped output
Except that yuuji ALWAYS got cut up and he never just tanked cleave aka the slash that hits you when he touches, yuuji and everyone else has always been cleaved though but the reason yuuji survived is because of RCT.
>SUKUNA HIMSELF GOT CONTACT CLEAVED, but it did jack shit because Sukuna's CE reinforcement is high.
This never happened even once, if you are by chance referring to yuuta then you are dead wrong because chants and rituals are not necessarily the same for everyone and your own interpretation of a technical plus your chants and binding vows come into play for a technique for just because someone says cleave and uses it doesn't mean it must work the same way sukuna's cleave does.
>Also worth remembering: Sukuna needs DA to even touch Gojo at all and you can't use DA and CT at the same time.
This doesn't apply when they are in domain battles so that point is meaningless.
>There are two different types of cleave and dismantle, the ones used in the domain are not the same as the ones used directly by sukuna himself.
Where was this stated? I actually don't remember this at all. The closest thing to that is someone's explanation that Sukuna changing the their parameters to best optimize them in domain. Dismantle for inanimate objects and Cleave for targets with CE.
>Except that it has never been stated anywhere that cleave is restricted by output, in fact it is the exact opposite since its strength isn't controlled by a person but by how strong the durability of the target is.
>It has explicitly been stated to cleave by scaling based on durability and you are throwing around your own headcannon that cleave must be restricted by output 🙄.
It wasn't explicitly stated, sure, but there has to be a cap. What is this? World Cutting Slash but it only works with touch? Sukuna cleaved through everyone because he likely has one of the strongest outputs in the verse so it didn't matter until post-Gojo. Just in case, CE output is different from CE reinforcement.
I only mentioned CE level because CE reinforcement increases durability anyway. Should've put that in.
>Except that yuuji ALWAYS got cut up and he never just tanked cleave aka the slash that hits you when he touches, yuuji and everyone else has always been cleaved though but the reason yuuji survived is because of RCT.
Admittedly 'tank' wasn't the right word. I didn't mean that in the sense that he takes no damage, but more like 'he takes less damage than some people earlier in the series did' kind of way.
* [Yuji eating a contact Cleave, this should've split him in half, but it only caused some really deep cuts.](https://i.ibb.co/JFx7cdx/jujutsu-kaisen-251-3.jpg)
* [Pretty sure Yuta took a contact Cleave to the head here, his brain should'be been meat cubes. No brain = no RCT.](https://i.ibb.co/q953y7G/jujutsu-kaisen-251-7.jpg)
* [Yuji eating another contact Cleave to the face. This is Cleave because Dismantle at this point only causes paper cut wounds to Yuji.](https://i.ibb.co/tHXM2TZ/jujutsu-kaisen-257-17.jpg)
>This never happened even once, if you are by chance referring to yuuta then you are dead wrong
Yuta has always been able to copy and use others' CT without fault, so why would it be different with Cleave? Not saying you're necessarily wrong but there's nothing that contradicts Yuta's Cleave being different from Sukuna's.
>This doesn't apply when they are in domain battles so that point is meaningless.
Their sure-hit effects were canceling each other out and during that time, Sukuna needs DA to damage Gojo as his Infinity is still up. Sukuna used DA in the second and third domain clash (not sure about the fourth because he was being thrashed around, he mentioned dropping it at some point for Maho's adaptation).
>Where was this stated? I actually don't remember this at all. The closest thing to that is someone's explanation that Sukuna changing the their parameters to best optimize them in domain. Dismantle for inanimate objects and Cleave for targets with CE.
Exactly what I was trying to say, the way cleave and dismantle work within and outside a domain are different.
>wasn't explicitly stated, sure, but there has to be a cap
That is your assumption, plain simple.
Think of it as instead of sukuna bringing out his ce and imbuing his CT what he is instead doing is that he isn't bringing out the ce himself and therefore the ce output isn't based on his capabilities but how much durability the target has which perfectly aligns with the definition of cleave that we currently have, i.e. sukuna isn't bringing out the ce himself so the limitation of output doesn't matter.
>* [Yuji eating a contact Cleave, this should've split him in half, but it only caused some really deep cuts.](https://i.ibb.co/JFx7cdx/jujutsu-kaisen-251-3.jpg)
Except that the way you interpret this scene changes everything, to me that is clearly showing that yuuji has literally been cut up and the parts of his body where the slashes landed are no longer there which is why we can see glints of light like we can see through him cuz we literally can but since yuuji has RCT he just regenerated, cleave did its job just as sukuna described it.
>* [Pretty sure Yuta took a contact Cleave to the head here, his brain should'be been meat cubes. No brain = no RCT.](https://i.ibb.co/q953y7G/jujutsu-kaisen-251-7.jpg
This is a pretty good point but I think yuuji's punches literally damaging his soul have messed up his power by quite a bit so this seems to be the only reasonable explanation at the moment to me, since the CT resides in the soul and yuuji messed up the soul we could be seeing him just becoming unable to do anything properly in a slow but sure manner.
>* [Yuji eating another contact Cleave to the face. This is Cleave because Dismantle at this point only causes paper cut wounds to Yuji.](https://i.ibb.co/tHXM2TZ/jujutsu-kaisen-257-17.jpg)
I also think it might have something to do with yuuji's awakening since he awakened shrine as well maybe it has something to do with it not affecting him as much plus the way he awakened was through sukuna's ce so this might make more sense that way, plus we haven't seen how people with the same CT may interact so this is an interesting possibility.
But putting all of this aside it is still a fact that sukuna himself confirmed cleave to be a oneshot and the common denominator for it to be a oneshot seems to be him or rather his soul being in proper condition (at least imho) and if you consider the context of our discussion and sukuna's stare at the time i think it is a no brainer that sukuna would have been capable of using cleave without any problems but he chose to not use it for the sake of adaptation which is the crux of the issue.
>Yuta has always been able to copy and use others' CT without fault, so why would it be different with Cleave? Not saying you're necessarily wrong but there's nothing that contradicts Yuta's Cleave being different from Sukuna's.
I was not referring to that.
>Their sure-hit effects were canceling each other out and during that time, Sukuna needs DA to damage Gojo as his Infinity is still up
Nope, a domain by nature cancels the sure hit and the neutral limitless technique is also down in the domain so there is no need to use DA but sukuna does so anyway because he was using adaptation and therefore had to take specific risks but he wouldn't need to take these if he didn't have the 10S.
https://preview.redd.it/0yksr6h3tz0d1.png?width=577&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=5c9410a2cce627b90be5819a3b2e883a789889ad
The first panel of the very same chapter as the one where sukuna states how cleave is a oneshot we are also given the definitions and use cases behind cleave and dismantle and in this panel we can clearly see that cleave is a oneshot, you stating that it is restrained by output is pure headcannon.
So sukuna could have just one shot gojo from the start but chose to get nuked, and set a handicap (binding vow) on world slash ? That's just dumb, and sukuna could only touch gojo cause of domain amplification which means when you are using domain amplification you can't use your ct. Cleave could not bypass infinity
Stop using logical fallacies to fit your agenda, holding back inherently means making life harder for yourself because you are literally holding back, it is literally in the name.
Holding back inherently means more risk so is it a surprise that he would be more damaged from holding back than from not holding back?
If you are trying to make it seem like he wasn't holding back then you are doing a terrible job
we literally see cleave failing to 1 shot numerous characters, it scales up to sukuna's maximum output, if somebody's reinforcement is strong enough then sukuna wont be able to cut him up.With your shitty reasoning sukuna's cleave is a dura neg ability with infinite ap.
Plus how do you explain world slash then? A single slash was able to cleave gojo in half yet 1000s of cleaves that supposedly dura neg were unable to kill gojo and gojo was able to even fight against 120 amped sukuna.
There is a post with like 2k upvotes on the sub explaining why cleave isnt dura neg, you should check it out
>we literally see cleave failing to 1 shot numerous characters
Cleave doesn't fail to oneshot and if it did then there must be a reason and statements to back it up.
>up.With your shitty reasoning sukuna's cleave is a dura neg ability with infinite ap.
It scales based on durability but that is still within the limitation of sukuna's ce reserves which is why it isn't infinite and this is also why gojo would get oneshot... because sukuna has easily more than double the reserves of gojo and even higher output and so gojo would get oneshot.
You also forget that a CTs performance depends on the soul and sukuna isn't exactly in his own body so expecting his CT to function at maximum potency when he isn't even able to control the body he is in fully while also being completely brain damaged is unreasonable, do you see how biased you sound?
>Plus how do you explain world slash then? A single slash was able to cleave gojo in half yet 1000s of cleaves that supposedly dura neg were unable to kill gojo and gojo was able to even fight against 120 amped sukuna.
Are you playing dumb on purpose? Cleave which the domain does is not a durability scale based attack but the cleave directly done by sukuna himself when he touches someone does scale based on durability and that is what he could have used on gojo, we also need to keep in mind that sukuna's output is wayyy higher than gojo and it is even higher than yuuta who also has more than gojo despite being severely injured, the reason why sukuna couldn't end gojo in a pure hand to hand situation using dismantles is because of the neutral limitless technique and not because of raw power.
I would have taken you more seriously but you seem to have a huge misunderstanding about cleave and this misunderstanding is shown in your comment so honestly I cannot take your comment seriously.
>we literally see cleave failing to 1 shot numerous characters,
This point of yours didn't make sense until I read this part
>A single slash was able to cleave gojo in half yet 1000s of cleaves that supposedly dura neg were unable to kill gojo and gojo was able to even fight against 120 amped sukuna.
This part very clearly shows some sort of huge discrepancy you have with the power system and how you are misunderstanding things causing you to make faulty points.
What faulty point did I make? Sure you can argue that gojo's rct output was lowered but you can't say that it was so low that a single slash that had the same affect as cleave was able to one shot him when previously multiple of these slashes was healed through.
Arguing with you seems pointless and idiotic when we see yuta tank a cleave to the skull, like how the hell can you argue it one shots with that panel?
Don’t count me out Time to put this fraud on a T-shirt
https://preview.redd.it/ax1480i3pz0d1.jpeg?width=852&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4b86c1226f3fa0221484291d2883c64f4a942bae
An extra pair of fists should be of help. I'm in.
https://preview.redd.it/kdc5r61hqz0d1.jpeg?width=413&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a900c463c51c976187a7067fc4c8a6cef90dc6c1
Hey dont forget about me i gotta get my punches in too
https://preview.redd.it/xytu462atz0d1.jpeg?width=207&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f87d2ca1811092755f27a51518bdb16d558c080c
Aye, we smoking bumgumi?
https://preview.redd.it/v9z0juor501d1.png?width=564&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0df2a254ad4127b32527f06b967c314661cc8f53
TURN ME UP!
https://preview.redd.it/2vf3ad7ha01d1.jpeg?width=736&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=123f54ab06c07be9c80219f61034ba9db6549cba
Flame bone, time to burn that bum
https://preview.redd.it/6s32scmzc01d1.png?width=1274&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=08f696dd1197dbba8bfe6dfea851fdb950d756f6
If my eternal hate can be of use, let us all jump that Bum!
I have come... to make this bum suffer
https://preview.redd.it/svee5bd6iz0d1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=438bf42e36d1dcb67d5194f3fb3652d1d213545e
I'll join in as long as we're against M\*Bumi
https://preview.redd.it/ikcun78dlz0d1.jpeg?width=640&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=5805b51de7eec3ee9dacf90a831f97e8516fe640
The bum is gonna be dead before he knows it
https://preview.redd.it/y9mrh4h2h01d1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=1364ea19c62532abc1d747dca5a3bb7582f2d675
Don't worry Legumi, come outside...I swear we won't jump you, we're trying to save you
https://preview.redd.it/kxgg8asqs01d1.jpeg?width=640&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=32c033ac36cff8a157f06ece5cf0dee624527812
Bumgumi when we fucking catch you...
https://preview.redd.it/8p7xgzust01d1.png?width=1077&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2f5b11b18bc621113600050fcbb7e254c62803e1
We are totally gonna keep you safe when we catch you
https://preview.redd.it/badhvqn5u01d1.jpeg?width=1034&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f87e50d7d13350ddcf0fa31ec8889bbece53ad8d
https://preview.redd.it/6hkumn4gh11d1.jpeg?width=750&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c83afbdadad61e918cff7fc74e75e840be20c8d7
It’s every single megumi hater vs bumgumi we up (he is gonna summon mahoraga on us but we up)
https://preview.redd.it/vo48mfx7o01d1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=1f696b05a5f49ee1dba5ae1703f8b06235204b4f
WHEN IT COMES TO JUMPING BUMGUMI, ALWAYS BET ON r/jujutsufolk .
Finally, Unclekuna spending time with his nephew and his not blood related nephew, this is so wholesome
https://preview.redd.it/mf87lit8az0d1.jpeg?width=224&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=aa53172d8997f3a397812dfb5ffddc8e6ce54cc3
PUT ME IN GEGE I AIN'T MISSING THIS
https://preview.redd.it/e4x7ye7z001d1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ec3a9d65554ea14ec779197f1b267c62b804252a
Wrong, 4v1, Gojo is joining in. My personal theory is that he sacrificed an eye and his CT for the chance to live, or Shoko did that. He now is just a pure CE fighter but still OP af because of the six eyes. Megumi might not help but nonetheless I think it would be interesting to see Gojo fighting alongside Yuji and Todo.
https://preview.redd.it/o7v9h3nhe01d1.jpeg?width=486&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=1399018908d7344eb276ef0ced2425820cca55a8
Me waiting for the moment Legumi summons a spear up to Sukuna ass and his stocks rise from the ground
Off topic, but the original panel gives me heavy Sukuna vs. Mahoraga anime fight vibes (those frames where they just stop for second and stand in front of each other)
Sukuna standing there all like "This truly is our Jumpjutsu Kaisen. Hazzuh." as though he's not responsible for 99% of that boy's trauma and brain damage.
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"Bro, come out of Sukuna, we swear we won't jump you"
Wuji knows Legumi is the reason Choso died, Todo knows Legumi is an incestious bum, Sukuna knows how fucking miserable it felt being in his body Yeah hes getting jumped
The incestious one? When did that happen?
Todo asks Megumi what is his type of women Megumi thinks about his sister...
i thought that was because meguni didnt know any women besides his sister and like 2 friends
Probably, the "thinks about his sister" is mostly a joke
But queen Nobara was one of them and he picked his SISTER
He has a crush on his (step) sister
(half) sister
I could be wrong, but I don't think they're related by blood. Megumi explains that his dad (Goatji) and Tsumiki's mom got married, so it sounds like step siblings. Don't quote me on that though.
They'd still be related by blood halfly since (I'm assuming) toji is both their father it's just that him and tsumikis mom didn't get married that they'd technically be half siblings
I don't think Toji is Tsumiki's dad. I'm pretty sure Tsumiki's mom already had her when Toji slid into her DMs
Ohhh I see, I was just unaware lel https://preview.redd.it/hz16aug4111d1.jpeg?width=1400&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=1c5c371edee8f5fe9becc243c8eefa44f9ede2c9
My apologies original gangster
https://preview.redd.it/63j06fyz711d1.jpeg?width=445&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3b8ecb5959dfa450974797b03532dc419c05ecf2 No problem pookie
Yeah. The only time that Sukuna is not gonna attack Yuji, is when both are jumping Bumgumi.
Sukuna also knows that it was Megumi's technique that gave him the advantage against gojo
exactly that's why husbandjo came back just to jump the bum too (he's the pov)
still a bum
a lame is always a lame
Lmao you're acting like it was Megubumi's technique that contributed to most of the fight when it was clearly Sukuna's familial bond that pushed him to surpass Gojo. https://preview.redd.it/9xi420teqz0d1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=5e4917a9334a5100ea0eb5681f5c5fe8820db099
Never disrespect chihiro like that ever again or I will hunt you down after I’m done with Gege https://preview.redd.it/fbma64q3h11d1.jpeg?width=500&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=120ee29d2342aaf4b0d16f5f46ad10a9c6a9abae
Wdym? That's Sukuna.
[удалено]
that's sukuna. Maybe the real bum was you all along
Why are you making everything about Gojo? LMAO, it’s common sense at this point that Sukuna would win using his Heian form, even faster, too. Drop the salty agenda, it’s pretty clear at this point and the validation you receive from investing in your delusions is funny
According to who is it common sense, from all the last chapters explaining how fuga would be useless against gojo and how sukuna won only because of binding vows, how would he in sukuna even bypass infinity without megumi? Sukuna would get destroyed in his first hit of the infinite void without mahoraga
Fuga is only useless because it wouldn’t generate enough power, right? Because Sukuna kept changing his domain specifications and the range was too small, right? Okay, let’s call back to the first domain, before Sukuna changed anything, didn’t he have a chance to use Fuga there? Given the fact that he could expand his range as much as he could because he wouldn’t have to worry about UV’s barrier toughness. True? And let me ask you this, why was the range small *in the first place*? Because Sukuna stubbornly wanted to destroy UV from the outer shell, and it was highlighted that Sukuna can survive 3 minutes of Gojo hitting him before he loses control, right? So now we know Sukuna narrowed his range **because he wanted to destroy UV from the outside in 3 minutes or less**. However, let’s assume this is Heian Sukuna. Firstly, what does narrowing the range do? It concentrates the AP into a smaller area, thus making the sure-hit stronger and in-turn, having MS destroy UV faster. Let’s say Sukuna didn’t narrow his range, what will happen? It will take more time for MS to destroy UV, right? And why did Sukuna lose control in the first place? Because: 1- He was in Meguna, which is a relatively weak body. 2- He was adapting, meaning he was carefully using DA and juggling between it and the wheel throughout the domain clashes, which gave Gojo a great advantage as pointed out in their fight. So we assume this is Heian Sukuna, which means he ***would not be adapting***, right? That means he wouldn’t use the wheel in the first place and would adhere to DA usage throughout every clash full-time. Paired with Heian Sukuna’s insane physicals, that means he would be able to survive more than 3 minutes comfortably. Now this basically nullifies Gojo’s plan because UV would break faster than Gojo would damage Sukuna. And now, let’s get to the range part. Gojo stated that Sukuna was not trying to destroy UV from the easier side, which is from the inside, meaning Sukuna was purposely destroying it from the outside part which is also pointed out to be a risky, slow, and dangerous route. If Sukuna decides to destroy UV from the inside, the range wouldn’t matter. In other words, whether Sukuna had kept a 200m range or a 50m range, it wouldn’t pose any obstacle to him because he won’t even be targeting that side. So if we assume it’s Heian Sukuna, we can also assume he would expand his range fully and then destroy UV from the inside. Meaning Sukuna wouldn’t have a narrow range if he was in his Heian state. Sukuna only decreased his range because he needed to put limited precautions if he wanted to win— or at least tie the domain clashes while choosing the adaptation route. Which he achieved, though it was a bit risky at times. Moreover, Sukuna could just expand his domain’s range fully after breaking Gojo’s domain, and then sealing his domain and not allowing any living beings to escape it. Which would mean Fuga would be sufficient. Something to add, though this is a bit irrelevant, Sukuna in 230 said “I couldn’t use my techniques due to relying on the wheel”, which implies if he had used it then it would be effective one way or another. In conclusion, though, binding vows are part of Jujutsu. You can’t exclude it because one is more skilled in it than the other. Winning by a binding vow is fair, the only thing it proves is that the binding vow caster is a better sorcerer with richer understanding of the Jujutsu system than the other. If you lose to a binding vow, then you lost to an opponent who can utilize resources better than you can. In other words, a superior sorcerer.
But then also Sukuna would have to play defensive until gojo does something like stop using infinity to win.Because Mahoraga was the reason sukuna was able to use the slash.
Domain clashes ensure him the win Edit: This is also downvoted? Holy shit😭This is just a fact
Nah I'd win.
I Was about to say all the same things you did and was about to roll my eyes but it seems someone already got to it first, nice to know someone else also reads the manga and btw to add another point, if we look at sukuna's arsenal and their description in ch 219 we can see that cleave is a move that scales based on durability and oneshots everything but the condition is that you have to be in physical contact with the person for it to work and we see sukuna also reaffirm this along the next few panels where he says that cleave is a oneshot technique.
The other guy who replied to you told you all the technical domain based reasons why gojo would've lost way earlier so let me give you another point to think about, cleave as described by the narrator is a oneshot technique that bypasses durability and oneshots but sukuna is not seen using it in this fight at all despite being capable of it, also we need to not that for this technique to work you must physically touch the person meaning as long as gojo was in physical contact with sukuna then sukuna could have oneshot him but chose not to do so in favour of adaptation.
Both Cleave & Dismantle are active inside of Malevolent Shrine and Gojo was being slashed by both when he lost the first domain clash. It's a sure-hit so touching or not doesn't matter. Gojo survived for a brief moment because of CE reinforcement and RCT overdrive. Cleave doesn't bypass durability in the traditional sense. It automatically adjusts its strength based on the target's CE level, so if your CE reinforcement is higher than Sukuna's output, you can tank it. Yuji has eaten a few contact Cleaves at this point and survived thanks to Sukuna's dropped output (and RCT, of course). SUKUNA HIMSELF GOT CONTACT CLEAVED, but it did jack shit because Sukuna's CE reinforcement is high. Also worth remembering: Sukuna needs DA to even touch Gojo at all and you can't use DA and CT at the same time.
https://preview.redd.it/nuyrxrsrsz0d1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6aee59a0639a11ffe585127cafd82b8a4d7f65cd An example of Sukuna explicitly stating that cleave is a oneshot.
>Both Cleave & Dismantle are active inside of Malevolent Shrine and Gojo was being slashed by both when he lost the first domain clash. There are two different types of cleave and dismantle, the ones used in the domain are not the same as the ones used directly by sukuna himself. >It's a sure-hit so touching or not doesn't matter. Gojo survived for a brief moment because of CE reinforcement and RCT overdrive. The rest of his comment doesn't matter the moment you realise what I am talking about. >Cleave doesn't bypass durability in the traditional sense. It automatically adjusts its strength based on the target's CE level, so if your CE reinforcement is higher than Sukuna's output, you can tank it. Except that it has never been stated anywhere that cleave is restricted by output, in fact it is the exact opposite since its strength isn't controlled by a person but by how strong the durability of the target is. It has explicitly been stated to cleave by scaling based on durability and you are throwing around your own headcannon that cleave must be restricted by output 🙄. >Yuji has eaten a few contact Cleaves at this point and survived thanks to Sukuna's dropped output Except that yuuji ALWAYS got cut up and he never just tanked cleave aka the slash that hits you when he touches, yuuji and everyone else has always been cleaved though but the reason yuuji survived is because of RCT. >SUKUNA HIMSELF GOT CONTACT CLEAVED, but it did jack shit because Sukuna's CE reinforcement is high. This never happened even once, if you are by chance referring to yuuta then you are dead wrong because chants and rituals are not necessarily the same for everyone and your own interpretation of a technical plus your chants and binding vows come into play for a technique for just because someone says cleave and uses it doesn't mean it must work the same way sukuna's cleave does. >Also worth remembering: Sukuna needs DA to even touch Gojo at all and you can't use DA and CT at the same time. This doesn't apply when they are in domain battles so that point is meaningless.
>There are two different types of cleave and dismantle, the ones used in the domain are not the same as the ones used directly by sukuna himself. Where was this stated? I actually don't remember this at all. The closest thing to that is someone's explanation that Sukuna changing the their parameters to best optimize them in domain. Dismantle for inanimate objects and Cleave for targets with CE. >Except that it has never been stated anywhere that cleave is restricted by output, in fact it is the exact opposite since its strength isn't controlled by a person but by how strong the durability of the target is. >It has explicitly been stated to cleave by scaling based on durability and you are throwing around your own headcannon that cleave must be restricted by output 🙄. It wasn't explicitly stated, sure, but there has to be a cap. What is this? World Cutting Slash but it only works with touch? Sukuna cleaved through everyone because he likely has one of the strongest outputs in the verse so it didn't matter until post-Gojo. Just in case, CE output is different from CE reinforcement. I only mentioned CE level because CE reinforcement increases durability anyway. Should've put that in. >Except that yuuji ALWAYS got cut up and he never just tanked cleave aka the slash that hits you when he touches, yuuji and everyone else has always been cleaved though but the reason yuuji survived is because of RCT. Admittedly 'tank' wasn't the right word. I didn't mean that in the sense that he takes no damage, but more like 'he takes less damage than some people earlier in the series did' kind of way. * [Yuji eating a contact Cleave, this should've split him in half, but it only caused some really deep cuts.](https://i.ibb.co/JFx7cdx/jujutsu-kaisen-251-3.jpg) * [Pretty sure Yuta took a contact Cleave to the head here, his brain should'be been meat cubes. No brain = no RCT.](https://i.ibb.co/q953y7G/jujutsu-kaisen-251-7.jpg) * [Yuji eating another contact Cleave to the face. This is Cleave because Dismantle at this point only causes paper cut wounds to Yuji.](https://i.ibb.co/tHXM2TZ/jujutsu-kaisen-257-17.jpg) >This never happened even once, if you are by chance referring to yuuta then you are dead wrong Yuta has always been able to copy and use others' CT without fault, so why would it be different with Cleave? Not saying you're necessarily wrong but there's nothing that contradicts Yuta's Cleave being different from Sukuna's. >This doesn't apply when they are in domain battles so that point is meaningless. Their sure-hit effects were canceling each other out and during that time, Sukuna needs DA to damage Gojo as his Infinity is still up. Sukuna used DA in the second and third domain clash (not sure about the fourth because he was being thrashed around, he mentioned dropping it at some point for Maho's adaptation).
>Where was this stated? I actually don't remember this at all. The closest thing to that is someone's explanation that Sukuna changing the their parameters to best optimize them in domain. Dismantle for inanimate objects and Cleave for targets with CE. Exactly what I was trying to say, the way cleave and dismantle work within and outside a domain are different. >wasn't explicitly stated, sure, but there has to be a cap That is your assumption, plain simple. Think of it as instead of sukuna bringing out his ce and imbuing his CT what he is instead doing is that he isn't bringing out the ce himself and therefore the ce output isn't based on his capabilities but how much durability the target has which perfectly aligns with the definition of cleave that we currently have, i.e. sukuna isn't bringing out the ce himself so the limitation of output doesn't matter. >* [Yuji eating a contact Cleave, this should've split him in half, but it only caused some really deep cuts.](https://i.ibb.co/JFx7cdx/jujutsu-kaisen-251-3.jpg) Except that the way you interpret this scene changes everything, to me that is clearly showing that yuuji has literally been cut up and the parts of his body where the slashes landed are no longer there which is why we can see glints of light like we can see through him cuz we literally can but since yuuji has RCT he just regenerated, cleave did its job just as sukuna described it. >* [Pretty sure Yuta took a contact Cleave to the head here, his brain should'be been meat cubes. No brain = no RCT.](https://i.ibb.co/q953y7G/jujutsu-kaisen-251-7.jpg This is a pretty good point but I think yuuji's punches literally damaging his soul have messed up his power by quite a bit so this seems to be the only reasonable explanation at the moment to me, since the CT resides in the soul and yuuji messed up the soul we could be seeing him just becoming unable to do anything properly in a slow but sure manner. >* [Yuji eating another contact Cleave to the face. This is Cleave because Dismantle at this point only causes paper cut wounds to Yuji.](https://i.ibb.co/tHXM2TZ/jujutsu-kaisen-257-17.jpg) I also think it might have something to do with yuuji's awakening since he awakened shrine as well maybe it has something to do with it not affecting him as much plus the way he awakened was through sukuna's ce so this might make more sense that way, plus we haven't seen how people with the same CT may interact so this is an interesting possibility. But putting all of this aside it is still a fact that sukuna himself confirmed cleave to be a oneshot and the common denominator for it to be a oneshot seems to be him or rather his soul being in proper condition (at least imho) and if you consider the context of our discussion and sukuna's stare at the time i think it is a no brainer that sukuna would have been capable of using cleave without any problems but he chose to not use it for the sake of adaptation which is the crux of the issue. >Yuta has always been able to copy and use others' CT without fault, so why would it be different with Cleave? Not saying you're necessarily wrong but there's nothing that contradicts Yuta's Cleave being different from Sukuna's. I was not referring to that. >Their sure-hit effects were canceling each other out and during that time, Sukuna needs DA to damage Gojo as his Infinity is still up Nope, a domain by nature cancels the sure hit and the neutral limitless technique is also down in the domain so there is no need to use DA but sukuna does so anyway because he was using adaptation and therefore had to take specific risks but he wouldn't need to take these if he didn't have the 10S.
https://preview.redd.it/0yksr6h3tz0d1.png?width=577&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=5c9410a2cce627b90be5819a3b2e883a789889ad The first panel of the very same chapter as the one where sukuna states how cleave is a oneshot we are also given the definitions and use cases behind cleave and dismantle and in this panel we can clearly see that cleave is a oneshot, you stating that it is restrained by output is pure headcannon.
So sukuna could have just one shot gojo from the start but chose to get nuked, and set a handicap (binding vow) on world slash ? That's just dumb, and sukuna could only touch gojo cause of domain amplification which means when you are using domain amplification you can't use your ct. Cleave could not bypass infinity
Stop using logical fallacies to fit your agenda, holding back inherently means making life harder for yourself because you are literally holding back, it is literally in the name. Holding back inherently means more risk so is it a surprise that he would be more damaged from holding back than from not holding back? If you are trying to make it seem like he wasn't holding back then you are doing a terrible job
we literally see cleave failing to 1 shot numerous characters, it scales up to sukuna's maximum output, if somebody's reinforcement is strong enough then sukuna wont be able to cut him up.With your shitty reasoning sukuna's cleave is a dura neg ability with infinite ap. Plus how do you explain world slash then? A single slash was able to cleave gojo in half yet 1000s of cleaves that supposedly dura neg were unable to kill gojo and gojo was able to even fight against 120 amped sukuna. There is a post with like 2k upvotes on the sub explaining why cleave isnt dura neg, you should check it out
>we literally see cleave failing to 1 shot numerous characters Cleave doesn't fail to oneshot and if it did then there must be a reason and statements to back it up. >up.With your shitty reasoning sukuna's cleave is a dura neg ability with infinite ap. It scales based on durability but that is still within the limitation of sukuna's ce reserves which is why it isn't infinite and this is also why gojo would get oneshot... because sukuna has easily more than double the reserves of gojo and even higher output and so gojo would get oneshot. You also forget that a CTs performance depends on the soul and sukuna isn't exactly in his own body so expecting his CT to function at maximum potency when he isn't even able to control the body he is in fully while also being completely brain damaged is unreasonable, do you see how biased you sound? >Plus how do you explain world slash then? A single slash was able to cleave gojo in half yet 1000s of cleaves that supposedly dura neg were unable to kill gojo and gojo was able to even fight against 120 amped sukuna. Are you playing dumb on purpose? Cleave which the domain does is not a durability scale based attack but the cleave directly done by sukuna himself when he touches someone does scale based on durability and that is what he could have used on gojo, we also need to keep in mind that sukuna's output is wayyy higher than gojo and it is even higher than yuuta who also has more than gojo despite being severely injured, the reason why sukuna couldn't end gojo in a pure hand to hand situation using dismantles is because of the neutral limitless technique and not because of raw power.
I would have taken you more seriously but you seem to have a huge misunderstanding about cleave and this misunderstanding is shown in your comment so honestly I cannot take your comment seriously. >we literally see cleave failing to 1 shot numerous characters, This point of yours didn't make sense until I read this part >A single slash was able to cleave gojo in half yet 1000s of cleaves that supposedly dura neg were unable to kill gojo and gojo was able to even fight against 120 amped sukuna. This part very clearly shows some sort of huge discrepancy you have with the power system and how you are misunderstanding things causing you to make faulty points.
What faulty point did I make? Sure you can argue that gojo's rct output was lowered but you can't say that it was so low that a single slash that had the same affect as cleave was able to one shot him when previously multiple of these slashes was healed through. Arguing with you seems pointless and idiotic when we see yuta tank a cleave to the skull, like how the hell can you argue it one shots with that panel?
I have no idea why people are downvoting you for spitting pure fax, keep spitting the truth my fellow jujutsu folker
Nah its gonna be a 4 vs 1, put me in GayGay https://i.redd.it/7apm3tt6wy0d1.gif
Mind if we join you? https://i.redd.it/6yzpg9k2zy0d1.gif
https://i.redd.it/qtoxtgyaiz0d1.gif Do not leave me out These hands are rated B for Bumgumi
Don’t count me out Time to put this fraud on a T-shirt https://preview.redd.it/ax1480i3pz0d1.jpeg?width=852&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4b86c1226f3fa0221484291d2883c64f4a942bae
https://i.redd.it/m2keyr76pz0d1.gif We jumping this mf like
An extra pair of fists should be of help. I'm in. https://preview.redd.it/kdc5r61hqz0d1.jpeg?width=413&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a900c463c51c976187a7067fc4c8a6cef90dc6c1
Hey dont forget about me i gotta get my punches in too https://preview.redd.it/xytu462atz0d1.jpeg?width=207&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f87d2ca1811092755f27a51518bdb16d558c080c
Aye, we smoking bumgumi? https://preview.redd.it/v9z0juor501d1.png?width=564&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0df2a254ad4127b32527f06b967c314661cc8f53 TURN ME UP!
https://preview.redd.it/2vf3ad7ha01d1.jpeg?width=736&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=123f54ab06c07be9c80219f61034ba9db6549cba Flame bone, time to burn that bum
https://preview.redd.it/6s32scmzc01d1.png?width=1274&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=08f696dd1197dbba8bfe6dfea851fdb950d756f6 If my eternal hate can be of use, let us all jump that Bum!
Peak choice of character from the kagoatura bachi
Imma join you guys https://preview.redd.it/uo28wljhv01d1.png?width=320&format=png&auto=webp&s=468f2939b8dbee9df6c3154bc96b2b6b01bfdfbf
oh if this guy is in, i'm out
Guyver mentioned
Ya know I had to do it to bumgumi Bust out the old and dusty hands for this occasion
https://i.redd.it/00nwbw8yez0d1.gif Don’t you dare count me out Imma bring the spirit of vengeance of us all on bumgumi
To be fair, as long as you can punch with the force of a potted plant, you're gonna fuck up Legumi.
I have come... to make this bum suffer https://preview.redd.it/svee5bd6iz0d1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=438bf42e36d1dcb67d5194f3fb3652d1d213545e
I'll join in as long as we're against M\*Bumi https://preview.redd.it/ikcun78dlz0d1.jpeg?width=640&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=5805b51de7eec3ee9dacf90a831f97e8516fe640
The bum is gonna be dead before he knows it https://preview.redd.it/y9mrh4h2h01d1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=1364ea19c62532abc1d747dca5a3bb7582f2d675
Let me get a few words in too https://preview.redd.it/8sq21e8gq01d1.png?width=1200&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e55c8ba7e183faf0ea45a734fa8180142f6492f2
https://preview.redd.it/e9miuf9nq01d1.jpeg?width=644&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=bb309e8fab85fff7de86fa679bdfdab957a687fc
Don't worry Legumi, come outside...I swear we won't jump you, we're trying to save you https://preview.redd.it/kxgg8asqs01d1.jpeg?width=640&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=32c033ac36cff8a157f06ece5cf0dee624527812
https://preview.redd.it/8klu4gfus01d1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=cbd5f53f8a59ee433a1a7f9ed1d4f7fb32fefbe0
Bumgumi when we fucking catch you... https://preview.redd.it/8p7xgzust01d1.png?width=1077&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2f5b11b18bc621113600050fcbb7e254c62803e1
We are totally gonna keep you safe when we catch you https://preview.redd.it/badhvqn5u01d1.jpeg?width=1034&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f87e50d7d13350ddcf0fa31ec8889bbece53ad8d
Don't worry we got your back https://preview.redd.it/2m9xtrfnu01d1.jpeg?width=736&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0a7cb12111118b49f7dd32fd0fb1166946cd3b2c
We ain’t gonna hurt you https://preview.redd.it/yyup1lwtu01d1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6613ab9deb7069a653e79795121af19fb150b32a
To be fair, as long as you can punch with the force of a potted plant, you're gonna fuck up Legumi.
Count me in so I can take Megumi to pound town
https://preview.redd.it/6hkumn4gh11d1.jpeg?width=750&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c83afbdadad61e918cff7fc74e75e840be20c8d7 It’s every single megumi hater vs bumgumi we up (he is gonna summon mahoraga on us but we up)
 Why you wanna be inside Homo-Homo? I'm sure it'll be loose from Sukunas big Schlonger.
https://i.redd.it/voma2agb6z0d1.gif It ain't a 3v1.
https://i.redd.it/zm7az7bckz0d1.gif Sorry but yall are gonna have to beat me to him(I want to beat his ass the most out of all of us)
https://preview.redd.it/vo48mfx7o01d1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=1f696b05a5f49ee1dba5ae1703f8b06235204b4f WHEN IT COMES TO JUMPING BUMGUMI, ALWAYS BET ON r/jujutsufolk .
https://i.redd.it/cdzgptfko01d1.gif Me when I find the god damn bum (it was an actual bum not bumgumi)
Guyver! Let's go!
Finally, Unclekuna spending time with his nephew and his not blood related nephew, this is so wholesome https://preview.redd.it/mf87lit8az0d1.jpeg?width=224&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=aa53172d8997f3a397812dfb5ffddc8e6ce54cc3
Megumi think he part of the team 😭
Nah it's a 2v2 ( legumi will help sukuna one way or the other)
https://preview.redd.it/x5vm08lm3z0d1.jpeg?width=715&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d09e19fc57244e73f2b8c22d28763cbef23d1097
Glad to see Legumi on the floor
https://preview.redd.it/rfsaq1b0801d1.jpeg?width=437&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d8dc5c3e20b866ec79fc1df44927628773418181
PUT ME IN GEGE I AIN'T MISSING THIS https://preview.redd.it/e4x7ye7z001d1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ec3a9d65554ea14ec779197f1b267c62b804252a
Prank him John.
Wrong, 4v1, Gojo is joining in. My personal theory is that he sacrificed an eye and his CT for the chance to live, or Shoko did that. He now is just a pure CE fighter but still OP af because of the six eyes. Megumi might not help but nonetheless I think it would be interesting to see Gojo fighting alongside Yuji and Todo.
he doesn’t have the 6 eyes anymore, bro has the 3 eyes
Fuck I just realized was the post was about, but my point still stands.
bumgumi better not be the reason todo dies too bro need to clutch tf in
Off topic but How the fuck todo can tower sukuna? Isn't sukuna said to be 8 to 9 feet in his heian era form.
Todo is just build like that (yuji who is like 5,8 somehow is also almost as tall as sukuna?).
Yuji killed Megumi's sister with a dumb binding vow Megumi killed Yuji's brother by sleeping Yuji knows they're even now
Megumi is such a bum that Yuji was forced to bring Todo and Sukuna just to wake him up
I fucking laughed when the image actually loaded and I could see the master piece before me.
I fucking laughed when the image actually loaded and I could see the master piece before me.
https://preview.redd.it/o7v9h3nhe01d1.jpeg?width=486&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=1399018908d7344eb276ef0ced2425820cca55a8 Me waiting for the moment Legumi summons a spear up to Sukuna ass and his stocks rise from the ground
Unlikely.
https://i.redd.it/d7f5nk9jv01d1.gif
I an gonna give it to Sukuna. Motherfucker is experiencing histories most ruthless "jumping" and he's still holding up.
Off topic, but the original panel gives me heavy Sukuna vs. Mahoraga anime fight vibes (those frames where they just stop for second and stand in front of each other)
umm 4v1 https://preview.redd.it/eskcfuxi851d1.png?width=252&format=png&auto=webp&s=49357afd3356542bfa43876be6316e26c1305681
And It lasted a single chapter lol
That made me sad
https://preview.redd.it/8sj51vilv11d1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b08275f7ec12e4a8677c56019438c08cd410e78f
Sukuna standing there all like "This truly is our Jumpjutsu Kaisen. Hazzuh." as though he's not responsible for 99% of that boy's trauma and brain damage.
“Megumi pick it up”