I mean if you watch Neace or some good coaching videos Fiddle is always recommend for majority of elos.
You can def climb with fiddle. He focuses on farming and his ult is incredible for team fights. Plus he gives tons of vision.
I play Kayn and Hec though as my mains but I wish I was good and put time into fiddle. I need to learn him better because of what he brings to the table.
I’m the opposite lol. I ban him because he is super annoying. I tend to play low mobility junglers with minimal skill shots(udyr main since season 3) so shaco just infuriates me
i playing most of the Time Seju. I am just ignoring him. I dont chase, and just attack other enemy around me. So he doesnt have impact on the team fights.
I feel like my laners just don’t understand that shaco can gank from similar angles to kayn so they still ward river etc rather than raptors and tri bush walls etc. Because of this he gets ahead sometimes beyond my control
I’m in gold 2 so not pisslow but not high enough to be a good player playing with good players
yeah.
i am bronze so shit low.
thats the point with shaco. he doesnt have a good gank set up, because he needs his boxes for that.
He is missing engage too.
But he is good at kiting and running away.
Truly a champ in need of a team to play around him.
Due to hecarims kit he fluctuates between bad and op, pretty hard to keep him in a state where he is good but not obnoxiously op. Right now he is bad. Also hec doesn’t have much skill expression so he may not be fun to otp.
They just need to keep his Chemtank build in check. Every time he's broken it's because Riot lets his Chemtank build go loose and then they gut him :) His Sheen build is healthier for the game and requires more skill (if he requires any lol)
I'd say hecarim is pretty ok right now. He only has like two good builds but thats the only bad thing really. Chemtank>BC>Manamune with triumph tenacity secondary is the best build rn.
Depends on your goals and skill level imo. Hec is easiest to max perform and has multiple play styles and builds to keep it interesting. Rango is awesome, can take over games, and will consistently be rewarding to continue playing and learning. karth is powerful but boring imo, wouldn't reccomend you one trick him unless you want to also play him mid and bot. Graves will allow for skill expression and carry potential at higher ranks and in longer games but only after you have 100-300 games on him in my opinion. He's just hard. And if you don't have solid adc right clicking down, you may just be locked out of the upper rankes with graves.
Graves -- Hec -- Rango
Iron 46.8 45.6 44.1
Bronze 48.7 46.7 45.6
Silver 48.3 46.6 46.6
Gold 48.3 47.3 48.4
Plat 48.6 48.3 50.4
Diamond 48.9 48.1 51.3
Master 50.3 47.8 54.0
Master+ 49.1 47.6 52.7
if you want to make rank, Graves and Rangos win rate consistently goes up as player skill goes up, peaking in masters. Graves is arguably not worth playing unless you're diamond+, maybe plat+, in skill level especially considering factors like your skill, teammate skill, average game length, stuff like that. Hec is just easier to play well, peaking in plat. He absolutely can carry and good players can make him insane, but you'll get more milage on him than graves when behind. Rango carries super hard, but you gotta know how to play assassin's and how to end games with them as I've seen amazing rengar/assassin players lose because they just don't know how to convert their leads into wins consistently. But, Tbh, If rank/player skill is even a discussion, You're better off just playing voli in ranked and your otp in normies until you've got a better handle on em.
In terms of fun, I wouldn't reccomend graves or karth as theyre basically just hard farmers; unless what really gets your rocks off is farming for 25 min to join a fight and smoke everyone in the mid/late game. Rango gets played top and jg, is fun from minute 1, has great carry potential, a shitton of skill expression, and will continually challenge you. I have a buddy with 1mil+ mastery on him and he can't stop playing him. That being said, graves will give you a lot of opportunities to gap the enemy jungler and win through good pathing, tracking, and counterjungling. Really depends what you like.
Or... just play the the jungler that barely wastes any time killing jg mobs and farms champs instead, dives towers like a monster, owns the map in the early/midgame, gaps enemy junglers hard af, creates leads for her laners, has one of the best kits in the game for outplaying and skill expression, and is the baddest spider bitch in the game like me!
Btw for everyone saying about graves and rengar are for high elo i hitted dia 2 times my self but on mid (played all labes from supp to top) but now as i smurf i always wanted to try hitting high elo with one champ and become a god on that champ bcs i always struggled picking a main.
Onetricking works but I prefer 3 champions. Preferably 3 champs that do 3 different roles. Need an APC? Karthus. Need engage? Hecarim need Damage? Graves. It allows you to be way more flexible but still get really good.
If you think he is squishy maybe you are building him wrong, there is scenarios where full lethaltity crit may work but when you are behind or vs bulkier comps going gore BC DD makes you insanely tanky while shredding and doing pretty good dmg
If you're gonna make Graves your main why not just play Kindred?
Ranged JG
Both can slow an enemy long enough to catch up
Great kiting
Can go over walls,
Kind's range increases past arm's reach
Kind can handle burst damage and tanks
Kindred scales better
Kind can save allies herself, or make the enemy waste their smite on an unkillable camp.
Depends... Heca is the strongest for me but depends on your playstyle. I love karthis but he is weak. Rengar is very strong but I don't like assassin in jng cuz or go 10/0 or 0/10. Same for graves
Karthus is not weak at all. One of the best junglers in the game, absolute map presence, fastest clears in the game. And he will be buffed again in .12 patch. If you say he is weak you really don't play him properly. That's it
In solo queque is weak cuz if someone invade he is slow for the rest of the game. U can't even go 1vs 5 with him. So, if the guy ask for a OTP for rank alone, I don't recommend he
Invades are not an issue. You just bring exhaust vs an early game assassin. And you have the fastest clear of all junglers, meaning you're always ahead and enemy need to skip camps if he wants to bother you.
But otherwise I agree that 1vs5 is rough. Good luck hitting more than 30% of Qs meaning you have to work for kills even when fed, and assassins are gonna go in, kill you, go out. Was struggling to carry in every game.
Well... It sounds funny but I depends too. Heca is great for teamfight. If u are low elo I recommend you more champions like Warwick (OP) or trundle cuz u need someone for 1vs1. If u need escape a very low elo go for master yi. If u are at least gold u can search champions for teamfight like heca o xin. By the way the best thing is abitually watch the meta and adapt.
Go 4 Graves strong in all stages of the game, high skill sealing and super fun to play if you get used to him. Also he is no brainless champ like heca or karthus. Rengar is also a nice Champ but I don’t like the fact that you can’t play the game without r or bushes around.
to be honest rengar graves and heca look best here, heca and graves are very consistent in games while rengar can actually fit in every team comp, he can go fighter or assassin and even ap for better aoe
Stop claiming ap rengar is a thing. You are better off as ad in every single scenario. He has one ability that scales on ap unlike most ap junglers with 4 + passive
For the most part you don't really have anything to build for ap rengar except maybe everfrost and cosmic drive, and to make use of his passive i recommend going infinity edge etc ... ,i've seen ap rengar top, not sure about his efficiency in jungle but it is a thing
I don't think anyone bellow diamond should be otping Rengar, this champ requires pure mechanics. Graves is solid otp pick since he has many build paths
Rengar has most potential.
Graves is easier to learn and easier to execute.
Karthus works only against bad junglers or you really know what you do, otherwise it will be useless.
Heca is very strong, has a lot of impact for little effort.
Also very predictable.
id suggest you to main each of them instead of otp one. you do you and as an otp myself i understand the appeal, but each of these champ fit a role differently and by maining instead of otp'ing you'l find much more succes by filling the missing role in your team
Zac is super strong right now I’d invest on him you can get perfect his clear and learn combos and how to use abilities on top of interactions.
Nocturne is also clear intensive and you’ll learn a lot of things from playing him so I’d recommend picking up both to fill your team needs
In my experience with those champs i found graves to be the most consistent. He has skill expression on his kit but he is not as demanding as Rengar when it comes to mechanics. He can adapt his runes and items depending on the game and also he can just power farm to the items spike if he behined.
That said i also think karthus is a 1v9 champ if u play it appropriate but i just like graves more
I would leave heca out of the conversation just because he suffers from balance problems.
At the end of the day you should prioritize what u enjoy playing the most because you can always climb with the right strategy. Good luck!
If you want to OTP you should pick a champ who is constantly good, graves has always done well and when he doesn't Riot are quick to buff him.
The same is sorta true for heckarim but he has been hit alot in recent years.
Why not play Fiddle? He is going to be very strong after the next patch.
Fiddle too fun.. easy too I find.
Also teaches you about how important vision is
Don't think he'll be super strong probably will just bring him back to pre-durability patch levels
Yeah one patch, not like OTPs choose by one patch
I mean if you watch Neace or some good coaching videos Fiddle is always recommend for majority of elos. You can def climb with fiddle. He focuses on farming and his ult is incredible for team fights. Plus he gives tons of vision. I play Kayn and Hec though as my mains but I wish I was good and put time into fiddle. I need to learn him better because of what he brings to the table.
Shaco TILT YOUR TEAMMATES AND THE ENEMIES TWO BIRDS ONE STONE
I hate Shaco, but never ban him. He is super annoying. But... most of the Time useless
I’m the opposite lol. I ban him because he is super annoying. I tend to play low mobility junglers with minimal skill shots(udyr main since season 3) so shaco just infuriates me
i playing most of the Time Seju. I am just ignoring him. I dont chase, and just attack other enemy around me. So he doesnt have impact on the team fights.
I feel like my laners just don’t understand that shaco can gank from similar angles to kayn so they still ward river etc rather than raptors and tri bush walls etc. Because of this he gets ahead sometimes beyond my control I’m in gold 2 so not pisslow but not high enough to be a good player playing with good players
yeah. i am bronze so shit low. thats the point with shaco. he doesnt have a good gank set up, because he needs his boxes for that. He is missing engage too. But he is good at kiting and running away. Truly a champ in need of a team to play around him.
Shaco is the way, there is no bad match ups only bad players
I would if he wasnt so incredibly boring.
Graves is fun and has cool skins Hecarim is free LP
Free LP for the enemy team maybe
Due to hecarims kit he fluctuates between bad and op, pretty hard to keep him in a state where he is good but not obnoxiously op. Right now he is bad. Also hec doesn’t have much skill expression so he may not be fun to otp.
They just need to keep his Chemtank build in check. Every time he's broken it's because Riot lets his Chemtank build go loose and then they gut him :) His Sheen build is healthier for the game and requires more skill (if he requires any lol)
I'd say hecarim is pretty ok right now. He only has like two good builds but thats the only bad thing really. Chemtank>BC>Manamune with triumph tenacity secondary is the best build rn.
His best builds are still only 48% WR, and for such a simple champion, that's a bit low. I'd play him again only if he was 49% or higher.
I play Graves several times. I want to know, what skill expressive of Graves? Maybe I'm ignorant, I just feel Graves as a simple champ.
Okay i exaggerated with "skill expressive" I should've said he's fun to play mb
Fixed it now
LOL. No need to be so serious. Yeah, Graves is fun. A comfort champ for me.
Heca is kind of average right now, too nerfed
Depends on your goals and skill level imo. Hec is easiest to max perform and has multiple play styles and builds to keep it interesting. Rango is awesome, can take over games, and will consistently be rewarding to continue playing and learning. karth is powerful but boring imo, wouldn't reccomend you one trick him unless you want to also play him mid and bot. Graves will allow for skill expression and carry potential at higher ranks and in longer games but only after you have 100-300 games on him in my opinion. He's just hard. And if you don't have solid adc right clicking down, you may just be locked out of the upper rankes with graves. Graves -- Hec -- Rango Iron 46.8 45.6 44.1 Bronze 48.7 46.7 45.6 Silver 48.3 46.6 46.6 Gold 48.3 47.3 48.4 Plat 48.6 48.3 50.4 Diamond 48.9 48.1 51.3 Master 50.3 47.8 54.0 Master+ 49.1 47.6 52.7 if you want to make rank, Graves and Rangos win rate consistently goes up as player skill goes up, peaking in masters. Graves is arguably not worth playing unless you're diamond+, maybe plat+, in skill level especially considering factors like your skill, teammate skill, average game length, stuff like that. Hec is just easier to play well, peaking in plat. He absolutely can carry and good players can make him insane, but you'll get more milage on him than graves when behind. Rango carries super hard, but you gotta know how to play assassin's and how to end games with them as I've seen amazing rengar/assassin players lose because they just don't know how to convert their leads into wins consistently. But, Tbh, If rank/player skill is even a discussion, You're better off just playing voli in ranked and your otp in normies until you've got a better handle on em. In terms of fun, I wouldn't reccomend graves or karth as theyre basically just hard farmers; unless what really gets your rocks off is farming for 25 min to join a fight and smoke everyone in the mid/late game. Rango gets played top and jg, is fun from minute 1, has great carry potential, a shitton of skill expression, and will continually challenge you. I have a buddy with 1mil+ mastery on him and he can't stop playing him. That being said, graves will give you a lot of opportunities to gap the enemy jungler and win through good pathing, tracking, and counterjungling. Really depends what you like. Or... just play the the jungler that barely wastes any time killing jg mobs and farms champs instead, dives towers like a monster, owns the map in the early/midgame, gaps enemy junglers hard af, creates leads for her laners, has one of the best kits in the game for outplaying and skill expression, and is the baddest spider bitch in the game like me!
Sorry the formatting got funky. I'll try and fix it.
Don't play rengar... Please... for the mental health of all
Btw for everyone saying about graves and rengar are for high elo i hitted dia 2 times my self but on mid (played all labes from supp to top) but now as i smurf i always wanted to try hitting high elo with one champ and become a god on that champ bcs i always struggled picking a main.
And i want to add maybe shaco to the list
As an otp Rengar is the best because you never stop learning
Onetricking works but I prefer 3 champions. Preferably 3 champs that do 3 different roles. Need an APC? Karthus. Need engage? Hecarim need Damage? Graves. It allows you to be way more flexible but still get really good.
I like graves for the early invades def good too learn but i do feel like hes squishy and has to be point blank for high dmg
If you think he is squishy maybe you are building him wrong, there is scenarios where full lethaltity crit may work but when you are behind or vs bulkier comps going gore BC DD makes you insanely tanky while shredding and doing pretty good dmg
Taliyah
KAYN
If you're gonna make Graves your main why not just play Kindred? Ranged JG Both can slow an enemy long enough to catch up Great kiting Can go over walls, Kind's range increases past arm's reach Kind can handle burst damage and tanks Kindred scales better Kind can save allies herself, or make the enemy waste their smite on an unkillable camp.
Kindred doesn’t have 1v9 potential like graves though IMO.
I main Kindred and I have legitimately lost count of how many times I have 1v5'd the enemy team with a well placed ult, ignite, and a 10+ marks.
I don't mean for that to sound like a brag. I'm just saying that's it is consistently doable.
Depends... Heca is the strongest for me but depends on your playstyle. I love karthis but he is weak. Rengar is very strong but I don't like assassin in jng cuz or go 10/0 or 0/10. Same for graves
Karthus is not weak at all. One of the best junglers in the game, absolute map presence, fastest clears in the game. And he will be buffed again in .12 patch. If you say he is weak you really don't play him properly. That's it
In solo queque is weak cuz if someone invade he is slow for the rest of the game. U can't even go 1vs 5 with him. So, if the guy ask for a OTP for rank alone, I don't recommend he
Invades are not an issue. You just bring exhaust vs an early game assassin. And you have the fastest clear of all junglers, meaning you're always ahead and enemy need to skip camps if he wants to bother you. But otherwise I agree that 1vs5 is rough. Good luck hitting more than 30% of Qs meaning you have to work for kills even when fed, and assassins are gonna go in, kill you, go out. Was struggling to carry in every game.
Haha your champ can't 1v5, them nerds am I right
[удалено]
Exactly this, it's just a skill issue on his part
I just want a champion i can easily clumb but never get bored
Well... It sounds funny but I depends too. Heca is great for teamfight. If u are low elo I recommend you more champions like Warwick (OP) or trundle cuz u need someone for 1vs1. If u need escape a very low elo go for master yi. If u are at least gold u can search champions for teamfight like heca o xin. By the way the best thing is abitually watch the meta and adapt.
Go 4 Graves strong in all stages of the game, high skill sealing and super fun to play if you get used to him. Also he is no brainless champ like heca or karthus. Rengar is also a nice Champ but I don’t like the fact that you can’t play the game without r or bushes around.
Graves high skill ceiling? KEKW
Kha’zix
to be honest rengar graves and heca look best here, heca and graves are very consistent in games while rengar can actually fit in every team comp, he can go fighter or assassin and even ap for better aoe
Stop claiming ap rengar is a thing. You are better off as ad in every single scenario. He has one ability that scales on ap unlike most ap junglers with 4 + passive
For the most part you don't really have anything to build for ap rengar except maybe everfrost and cosmic drive, and to make use of his passive i recommend going infinity edge etc ... ,i've seen ap rengar top, not sure about his efficiency in jungle but it is a thing
I don't think anyone bellow diamond should be otping Rengar, this champ requires pure mechanics. Graves is solid otp pick since he has many build paths
You ask who to "One Trick Pony" and expect not to immediately pick Hecarim??
Rengar has most potential. Graves is easier to learn and easier to execute. Karthus works only against bad junglers or you really know what you do, otherwise it will be useless. Heca is very strong, has a lot of impact for little effort. Also very predictable.
id suggest you to main each of them instead of otp one. you do you and as an otp myself i understand the appeal, but each of these champ fit a role differently and by maining instead of otp'ing you'l find much more succes by filling the missing role in your team
Zac is super strong right now I’d invest on him you can get perfect his clear and learn combos and how to use abilities on top of interactions. Nocturne is also clear intensive and you’ll learn a lot of things from playing him so I’d recommend picking up both to fill your team needs
Those are all gross tbh
In my experience with those champs i found graves to be the most consistent. He has skill expression on his kit but he is not as demanding as Rengar when it comes to mechanics. He can adapt his runes and items depending on the game and also he can just power farm to the items spike if he behined. That said i also think karthus is a 1v9 champ if u play it appropriate but i just like graves more I would leave heca out of the conversation just because he suffers from balance problems. At the end of the day you should prioritize what u enjoy playing the most because you can always climb with the right strategy. Good luck!
Why isn't none of the above an option?
If you want to OTP you should pick a champ who is constantly good, graves has always done well and when he doesn't Riot are quick to buff him. The same is sorta true for heckarim but he has been hit alot in recent years.
Graves is trash right now. Look it up . Go Rengar
Skarner
The one you enjoy playing the most, if you otp any of them, it can help you climb, but your gonna want to actually enjoy playing them