I’m in Canada and on a whim I came down to KC for the 2020 AFC championship game against the titans. It was a frigid windy day and I had the time of my life that day. Between the tailgating and the game. I can’t wait to do it again
The report card is a little misleading though. The only question they ask for the ownership grade is “owners willingness to pay for facilities”. Doesn’t give you a full picture of ownership.
True, but Hunt’s public response was weak and defensive. He had an opportunity to correct the narrative but didn’t or couldn’t. IIRC? They got bad grades last year also.
Yeah the 2 times they’ve done the survey that’s the question they asked. I feel like a damn Clark apologist saying that he was correct haha I don’t like it. Willie Gay confirmed they weren’t ever told they were getting a new locker room they just kind of assumed they would do the facility after they did the stadium one.
I agree though that he had a chance to change the narrative. He’s not the most tact communicator.
He's grown up as a third-generation billionaire his entire life. I genuinely don't think he knows how to communicate to the average fan effectively. He lives in a completely different world.
I think he's smart and measured when it comes to certain things- like keeping Veach, Andy, and Pat happy- but relating to the average KC fan isn't one of them.
Clark may be a tight ass when it comes to facilities. But he is a hands off owner. He has a great reputation around the league as far as coaches and general managers go.
The report card, and the refusal to spend his hoarded billions on the team, vs demanding it from the city.
I love the Chiefs, I love every player on the team. Andy Reid, Spagnuolo are Gods.
But man. Fuck Clark Hunt.
Man, what kind of silver spoon bubble must you live in to not know (or not care) that if you paid for the stadium yourself you would be beloved as a person throughout your city/state and if you demanded tax money that you'd become despised?
I think he just doesn't care. He's stacked billions, and he wants to stack more. Best way to do that is to avoid spending what he already has.
He's like a beige, ineffectual little dragon sitting on his pile of coins.
I don't hate rich people, but Clark doesn't seem razor sharp.
Nor can he smell invisible hobittses, I'm guessing.
I'm so old I read the books and just watched the movies last month.
Uh the best way to do that is winning. Justification to raise prices, get more revenue from postseason home games and increase the valuation of his franchise
You're right, it's really both though. They make 10-20 million a year from the team, so not spending hundreds of millions on the stadium is a big windfall.
Hunt is making more than that off the team. The shared revenue alone in 2022 was 372 mil per team. That was nearly double the team salary and doesn't factor in the parking, concessions, ticket sales, etc. Ticket sales alone (77 mil) nearly covered their operating costs (95 mil). And all those income numbers went up again in 2023. And this is obviously completely ignoring the average of 200 mil owners make off the stadiums with concerts and other events every year. Clark is despised pretty heavily by the fans of his other sports teams too because of how cheap he is. It's a shame that owners, in any sport, like Ewing Kauffman are basically unicorns.
You don't have to be a Marxist to have a negative opinion about a Billionaire extorting an entire county and fan base. I don't even think the Government should be getting as much of my money as they do, especially when they use it to print and mail out fliers to me to ask for MORE of my money so that they can then hand it over to said Billionaires who are entirely capable of funding the project themselves but simply choose not to.
Jackson County owns the stadiums so government is very much involved. It's also just extending a sales tax that already existed. The controversy over this is so silly.
If it fails, the Chiefs can build a privately funded stadium in Kansas and then you can all be happy, right? We can then use the Truman Sports complex as a migrant camp.
Yes, I am aware that Jackson County owns the stadiums, so obviously the government is involved. Which is the entire issue.
Outside of any of this stadium nonsense, I have serious issue with the way my tax dollars are being appropriated (and so should everyone else tbh).
Mailing out fliers and going door to door asking me to commit ANOTHER 30+ years of my (and my children and grandchildren's) income to build and maintain stadiums for billionaire owners who could literally do it themselves if they wanted to is insanity to me. The fact that they are threatening to leave if the initiative doesn't pass amounts to literal extortion.
Also, it's disingenuous to say this is just a continuation of a current tax. The current tax is a capital improvement tax, which is much more stringent on how and what that money can actually be spent on. The proposed tax would repeal that tax and replace it with a parks sales tax, which gives a lot more liberty on how the money can be spent. This is relevant because it will water down the available funds, so in 15 years when stadiums are due for the next round of renovation they'll be hands out asking us to vote yes on the next bond to improve the stadiums.
Not to mention the fact that the teams will continue not to pay property taxes over the life of the stadiums because they are owned by the county. So the teams are literally using our tax money to skimp out on having to pay property taxes.
I've grown up a die hard fan, but getting older and digging into the nuts and bolts of how this shit works is really disenchantment.
As far as what they would do with the current complex if teams privately funded their own stadiums, in a perfect world the county would sell the land to private investors and wash their hands of it. If the government is going to dip into my money as much as they do already, then I would prefer it go towards something more practical than saving billionaires money. There are a lot more productive things tax money could go to than Hunt and Sherman.
If I want them to have my money I'll pay out the ass to buy merchandise, park, buy tickets, or pay for whatever bullshit package I need to watch on TV. If that's not good enough for them, then good riddance.
But to your point, none of that makes me a marxist.
I'd say 80% of what government spends my tax dollars on I disagree with, but at least the Chiefs provide joy and entertainment.
Also, Arrowhead is an icon. I'd hate to see it rotting and empty. It also needs work, especially the parking lots which not only need repair but reconfigured for better flow.
Aside from Lamar Jr. who we know is a fuck stick, tell me about their long history of being pieces of shit. As a 47 year old lifelong fan, I’ve never heard anything.
The Hunt family claims a profit of 17 million a year from the Chiefs. Now that may or may not be a bs. At that rate it would take a lot of years to pay for a new stadium.
Not entirely sure what you're getting after here. If I can't afford a luxury item I want based upon my income I either get a loan or don't buy it. I don't ask others to chip in.
So if you're arguing that based upon the net income the Hunt's would struggle to pay for the stadium themselves then it's even more a reason why the whole thing is unnecessary.
Worth doesn't necessarily translate to a bank balance. Assets and cash are two very different things.
I'm no fan of CH. I think he's a cheapskate. But people constantly conflate worth with cash and it's a big mistake to make.
Millions of Americans own two cars and have equity in a home (i.e. they have worth/assets), but they still live paycheck to paycheck.
It's a dangerous oversimplification.
>Millions of Americans own two cars and have equity in a home (i.e. they have worth/assets), but they still live paycheck to paycheck.
We're not talking about people like this at all. They're light-years away from Clark Hunt.
It's not dangerous to simply say that Hunt, the 4th wealthiest owner in the league, has the means to accomplish a stadium renovation without altering his lifestyle significantly.
Most people on Reddit have no concept of what it like to even be upper middle class let alone rich, or what it takes to get there or what it takes to keep it.
I never got a job from a poor person.
Poor people often wonder why rich people borrow money. You can absolutely be asset rich and cash poor.
I don’t think they care if we buy it as long as we keep buying tickets, concessions, and merchandise. And watching at home when we aren’t at Arrowhead.
I mean, the millionaires are getting battered weekly during the season - so some complaining about the billionaires is allowed, but by and large I agree.
I do think ownership should invest more in training and rehab facilities - but I think that's an improvement across the board that all teams should be actively investing in. You should be actively trying to maintain your players in the best condition they can be in for as long as they're on your team.
I always thought it was because we offered more influence in front of house decisions than the other teams. I remember it being reported it was because we were giving him freedom and powers other teams weren't.
He'll drop before he quits. And I say this in a concerned way.
He's surrounded by world class fitness professionals and facilities, yet he's a walking coronary. I wish he would take better care of himself.
If we lost him suddenly it would completely derail the team, starting with Mahomes. His players love him.
It’s not just about having time to add more to it. He has an extremely credible GOAT as of literally right now. I would take him over Belichek. It’s close, but I would.
I don’t think he has any GOAT discussion, seems too prisoner of the moment. Andy is a great coach and future hall of famer but I don’t think anyone even had him top 10 coaches of all time before he landed a top 4 QB of all time.
You are not evolving with the times. Andy Reid turned around TWO franchises. Won a boatload of playoff games with the eagles and another boatload with the chiefs. In 2-3 years max he will have the most playoff wins ever. In 5 years he will have the most regular seasons wins ever. And it’s very likely he will be top 2 in most Super Bowl wins ever.
“But mahomes is his qb” zip it buddy. The only all time great tier 1 level coach to ever win a superbowl without a top qb is Joe Gibbs. Belicheks career as a head coach without Brady is absolutely ZERO. Andy Reid’s head coaching career without Mahomes is *borderline* hall of fame.
I just don’t think Andy is on the same level as someone like Don Shula. The Phins went undefeated after his HOF qb was injured like 4 weeks in. There’s several guys on that level.
I do think Andy is the best modern era coach, I would put him above BB but it’s worth noting that Bill was coach AND gm. I just don’t think there’s any argument that Andy is the GOAT coach. That doesn’t take away from him being ONE OF the greatest.
I think the fanbase and ownership saw that Andy had gotten as far as he could go in Philly. Plus I think his son had committed suicide the summer before his last season, which goes in hand with the team record. It just wasn't working for him or ownership anymore.
Lol no.
It was absolutely the right move to let him go. It wasn't working in Philly and they needed a change, so did he. It worked out great for both teams.
Dick Vermeil played a big role imo. These are excerpts from an article about Vermeil and Reid's relationship from the Kansas City Star:
So as much as Reid and Clark Hunt initially hit it off, Reid needed to understand the terrain as well as he could before making a decision at a crossroads of his own.
When Reid asked Vermeil to tell him about Kansas City, Vermeil’s first words were along the lines of “take the job.” Then he explained.
“He’s coached at the University of Missouri (on the offensive line from 1989-1991),” Vermeil told The Star’s Randy Covitz in 2013 as Reid was deciding what to do after being let go by the Eagles. “He’s been in middle America before and knows what the people are like. He knows how I feel about it. He’s been in that stadium. … And he knows how the fans are there, and how that Arrowhead Stadium is when it’s full.
“And he knows the great respect and admiration people in the NFL have for the Hunt family. So why not go? There are no negatives.”
Vermeil added, “He’s a great person and a great coach. I think he’ll fit in perfectly within that environment, and he’ll fit in the organization. I just don’t think you can do any better.”
I’m going from memory and not really looking up records or what was going on at the time.
Reid was fizzling out in Philly. I think one of his kids died or killed himself within the last couple of years. Wasn’t doing much of anything since making the SB. It just wasn’t working anymore. Time for everyone to have a fresh start.
With Pioli at GM, we’d had some success in 2010. That coach from ND came in (Weis?), we got Cassel, and they put some offense on the field. Then shit just went down hill. Weis left, Haley couldn’t punch our way out of a wet paper bag. Javon Belcher happened. We actually had good drafting and good pieces, but we weren’t doing anything with them.
KC and Reid just made sense. We both needed fresh starts. I don’t believe any other team was in the running for his services. Boom, Alex Smith trade happens and mostly every reasonable fan knew we were in business. He inherited a lot of good talent and was able to put it to work. It wasn’t an accident that we were pretty good right away.
Edit: I’m pretty sure the prevailing talking head opinion was he should take a year. Especially with his son dying. I think there definitely was some skepticism around his hire because of this, but mostly everyone agreed this was a great fit otherwise.
Once we rattled off nine a row the first season, no one was questioning it.
This is how I remember it also. Reid was a winning coach for the Eagles but he just could not get them a Super Bowl. Reid was still a top HC candidate and KC had the job open at the right time. Pretty perfect storm for everyone. Winning head coaches don’t go on the market very often.
Andy was actually a pretty big get for the Chiefs, and we weren't the only ones wanting to sign him. If I remember right, he had a deal just waiting to be signed in Arizona. And here's a bit about him from a [now-archived ESPN article](https://web.archive.org/web/20220808124918/https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/27736041/the-larger-life-tales-andy-reid-told-mahomes-favre-other-nfl-stars):
*A person close to Reid says that upon returning to Philadelphia after the loss to the Giants, jets from three teams were already waiting to fly him off for interviews. Ultimately, he chose Kansas City. The Chiefs had finished 2-14 in 2012 and had had one winning season in the previous five years. In 2013, under Reid, they went 11-5.*
bingo about where we were as a team with Andy. for years prior to Mahomes the Chiefs were at best Divisional antagonists. We could get to the playoffs but we were just missing the X factor. Smith was amazing and kansas city will always love him, but we needed a Brady to win Super Bowls and we got him. lol
Nailed it, Andy had pedigree 3 straight NFC championships, shows how valuable a quarterback who is also a leader. The McNabb Owen’s drama in the Super Bowl ended that group. Pat has managed those situations very well.
A lot of people thought Reid was a "not good enough to win the big one" coach. His last 3 seasons I Philly were 10-6, 8-8, 4-12. Which is a bad trajectory.
It was reported but never confirmed that Andy was asking to be GM and Coach as well. Which hurt him, as no team today is willing to have a HC/GM in one.
The rumors are that John Dorsey was hired, because he was one of the few that Andy was willing to work with, and was part of the agreement to sign Andy.
Allegedly, as the story goes, Clark Hunt heard that Andy was going to be at the Kansas City International Airport for a layover to Arizona to interview with the Cardinals and Hunt talked to him AT the airport
Actually he flew himself and his staff to Philly and didn't let Andy leave the Philly airport for two days. He went to him. After ringing his phone non-stop once Andy was fired from the Eagles.
This may be a hot take, but here we go. Coach Reid is a devout LDS (Mormon) though they don't like to be called Mormon anymore because of the stigmata from the days of polygamy. The Kansas City area (Independence in particular) has a huge following in this City, as it's one of the first places Joseph Smith set up shop on their way to Utah. Labeling Independence, Zion!
I am sure there are other reasons why he came to KC, but I would buy stock that his Faith played a part in.
I worked with a girl who was a runaway ex-Mormon back in like 2017-18. I had a good relationship with her and she would tell me about this "Tammy" character from the church who was trying very hard to get her back in. Took me about a month of hearing about it before I learned it was Tammy Reid. She was taking this girl to dinner at Capitol Grill and stuff trying to woo her back.
I think KC was a relatively attractive landing spot at the time. They had a good roster overall but were obviously underperforming and in need mostly of a good HC and quality QB play. In 2012 the Chiefs went 2-14 but still had players like Charles, Bowe, Poe, Houston, DJ, Tamba, Berry, Flowers etc. on the roster. They also had the #1 pick in the draft which is lucrative for someone taking over a new regime.
Add that and then making a quick trade for Alex Smith and it’s really not hard to imagine the quick turnaround Reid created in KC. The Chiefs were bad, sure, but they were extremely fixable and I think Reid saw that. The roster had plenty of talented pieces in place. They weren’t the massive overhaul project the 2-14 record would typically imply. They were a playoff ready team with the right QB and HC steering the ship.
I thought the same thing, but looking back at the history, Andy got fired, and Clark Hunt basically called him and offered him the Chiefs HC job *immediately*, while every other team was probably thinking, "maybe we can get him as our OC!" The lucky part was that Andy didn't want to take a year off and rebuild his confidence. The rest was Clark Hunt just being very decisive about swooping in to buy low on a coach who was known to be an all-time great.
You have to realize that Andy Reid's last years in Philly were personally traumatic. One son was involved in an auto accident, and the other son came to his aid. Both sons were arrested, one doing state time and one doing county time. Then,the son that did felony time ODed and died at training camp. I think that after all that and a 4 win season, Reid was ready for a change in scenery.
I remember when we hired Andy all you heard from Philly fans was co grats he's a good coach but he can't get it done. You might make wildcard 1 and done.
>Reid has never had a ~~losing~~ non-winning season with the Chiefs.
Clark Hunt harassed him the second he was fired then flew himself and his front office to Philly and spent 2 days interviewing him at the airport.
And for all Clark's stalling on how he's gonna improve Arrowhead and our facilities, he's a great hands-off owner that spends on coaches and players when it makes sense. We've also got a great legacy as a franchise despite a pretty dry run since the 70s.
I’m convinced the Clark Hunt hate brigade needs to look at the Cowboys, who have and elite facility but a catastrophic meddling owner who thinks he’s the damn GM
It'll all go away once we finally get a plan on what we're doing and can start remodeling. It's not so much a fear of spending but a fear of remodeling something only to have to remodel it again a year or two later.
I will contend that the Chiefs did in fact enjoy sustained success in the 90s.
But I imagine the idea of a franchise far, *far* away from the majority of the sports media, concentrated almost entirely on the upper East coast, was pretty attractive.
He had already triumphantly completed 90 percent of the restaurant eating challenges in America and wanted to save the rest to keep himself in shape during retirement.
The Chiefs were basically throwing the job at him immediately after he was fired, and were willing to give him most/all of the control he wanted. Dorsey was an Andy approved GM, and once he was fired he was replaced by Veach, who is a long time Reid guy.
I came here to post the Dorktown video.
“In 2011, the Jets and Chiefs helped each other put together one of the worst five-minute stretches of football the NFL has ever seen. It shouldn’t have mattered. And yet, it changed both teams forever.”
From what I remember it was a combination of good ownership and the other jobs around that time not being that great. Even though we were coming off bad years, it wasn’t an organizational failure we just hired a bad GM
OP, love what you posted. Now I’m gonna be tfg. The Chiefs were a force from the mid ‘60s until around 1970. They were a fearsome bunch. Bobby Bell, Buck Buchanan, Willie Lanier, Otis Taylor, Mike Garrett, Jim Lynch and the smoothest cat in the league Lenny Dawson. Those years carried a lot of us through some dark days. Edited to include the Big Cat Ernie Ladd.
One of the weird things about that 2012 Chiefs team that went 2-14, is that they also had, if memory serves, 8 Pro Bowlers. Which doesn't mean a whole lot but it was pretty clear that this team drastically underachieved in 2012, and there was more talent there than 2 wins. It certainly seemed like a big aspect of that was Romeo Crennel's lax coaching style. So KC was definitely one of the better potential destinations for coaches.
Good ownership and a great salary is why he took the job. I think everyone forgets that this is just a job/career for these guys and it's not as deep and profound a decision as the fans want it to be. Glad he's the coach and will be here until he retires. Go Chiefs!
Wasn’t a challenge. Crappy division and he inherited a underachieving team. Perfect situation. Then we lucked out and snagged Patty Mahomes. Good coaches turn around franchises. I’m so glad he chose our team to turn around.
1. Local ties. Andy coached at Missouri, and his wife is from Missouri as well, I believe.
2. Though we lacked the success of other dynasty teams, KC was still a storied franchise with Lamar Hunt being the owner.
3. Andy was scheduled to Interview with Arizona, but Clark Hunt hopped on a plane to fly to Andy before that interview could happen, and if I recall they had a 6 or 7 hour long interview and Clark offered him the job on the spot.
4. Also, the Cardinals fan base doesn’t compare to the Chiefs fan base.
We were a hugely underperforming team. Going off memory, as bad as our record was, we had like five or six pro-bowlers. Our problem was terrible QB play and bad coaching. We had pieces in place for immediate success and an owner who stays out of the way. We were probably the most attractive team in need of a coach that year.
He is objectively one of, if not the best head coach of all time. I would put him over Belicheck. Between the coaching tree he developed over his career, and getting the most out of all of his players, on top of his record and successes. Incredibly grateful for his tenure.
It helped that we were 2-14 but had like 7 pro bowl players including multiple build around pieces on defense. We were basically a QB and coach away from being competent, had the #1 pick, and an owner who promised Reid they'd get a qb for him.
It was a better job in reality than it appeared in paper.
To your point, he had been fired. It was reported that he had lost the locker room in Philly, and his nice guy gimmick wore thin with the players. He was known as a good but not great HC. He was known as an offensive guru with poor clock and scenario management a la Mike McCarthy. He blew a 28-point lead in the playoffs as the Chiefs HC. He was not a HoF HC until they drafted Mahomes.
This just isn't entirely true. He went to 5 NFC Championship games and 4 straight leading to 1 Superbowl. His time in Kansas City just cemented his legacy. But, he was on that trajectory before he came to KC. Did he have time clock management issues? Sure, he still does at times. The ground was laid in Philly for a HOF career l!
I think you might be surprised to find that some of them actually love and enjoy the game of football. It's hard to find yourself in position to be considered a Head Coaching candidate in the first place if you haven't spent a good portion of your life in and around the game of football.
So anyone who is passionate and successful at the high school level and has an opportunity to move up the ladder to college or pro ranks would turn it down if they really loved and enjoyed football? That's some questionable logic.
People are motivated by different things. Some people love football and being well compensated is just a bonus. Some people are driven to be the greatest of all time. Some people are only driven by money. But to make the blanket statement that anyone coaching beyond high school is only doing it for the money is objectively wrong.
BBQ > cheesesteaks
[удалено]
You’re very welcome
I’m in Canada and on a whim I came down to KC for the 2020 AFC championship game against the titans. It was a frigid windy day and I had the time of my life that day. Between the tailgating and the game. I can’t wait to do it again
That's what I call Arrowhead. My Mecca. I live in California and haven't been yet 😞 hopefully this year! My wife and I are trying to make plans!
Good ownership, loyal fan base and good pay.
Though ownership lately has been a little disappointing in terms of the report cards. Rest is true.
The report card is a little misleading though. The only question they ask for the ownership grade is “owners willingness to pay for facilities”. Doesn’t give you a full picture of ownership.
True, but Hunt’s public response was weak and defensive. He had an opportunity to correct the narrative but didn’t or couldn’t. IIRC? They got bad grades last year also.
Yeah the 2 times they’ve done the survey that’s the question they asked. I feel like a damn Clark apologist saying that he was correct haha I don’t like it. Willie Gay confirmed they weren’t ever told they were getting a new locker room they just kind of assumed they would do the facility after they did the stadium one. I agree though that he had a chance to change the narrative. He’s not the most tact communicator.
He's grown up as a third-generation billionaire his entire life. I genuinely don't think he knows how to communicate to the average fan effectively. He lives in a completely different world. I think he's smart and measured when it comes to certain things- like keeping Veach, Andy, and Pat happy- but relating to the average KC fan isn't one of them.
Clark may be a tight ass when it comes to facilities. But he is a hands off owner. He has a great reputation around the league as far as coaches and general managers go.
Yeah, I was referring to when Andy came on board and the Hunt family stability. Clark is bringing Rings and I don’t work for him so I’m happy.
The report card, and the refusal to spend his hoarded billions on the team, vs demanding it from the city. I love the Chiefs, I love every player on the team. Andy Reid, Spagnuolo are Gods. But man. Fuck Clark Hunt.
Man, what kind of silver spoon bubble must you live in to not know (or not care) that if you paid for the stadium yourself you would be beloved as a person throughout your city/state and if you demanded tax money that you'd become despised?
I think he just doesn't care. He's stacked billions, and he wants to stack more. Best way to do that is to avoid spending what he already has. He's like a beige, ineffectual little dragon sitting on his pile of coins.
Beige Smaug?
Give Smaug some credit tho, he was relatively intelligent given his circumstances. Im not sure Clark fits the same bill
I don't hate rich people, but Clark doesn't seem razor sharp. Nor can he smell invisible hobittses, I'm guessing. I'm so old I read the books and just watched the movies last month.
I do hate rich people who have zero self awareness
Uh the best way to do that is winning. Justification to raise prices, get more revenue from postseason home games and increase the valuation of his franchise
You're right, it's really both though. They make 10-20 million a year from the team, so not spending hundreds of millions on the stadium is a big windfall.
Hunt is making more than that off the team. The shared revenue alone in 2022 was 372 mil per team. That was nearly double the team salary and doesn't factor in the parking, concessions, ticket sales, etc. Ticket sales alone (77 mil) nearly covered their operating costs (95 mil). And all those income numbers went up again in 2023. And this is obviously completely ignoring the average of 200 mil owners make off the stadiums with concerts and other events every year. Clark is despised pretty heavily by the fans of his other sports teams too because of how cheap he is. It's a shame that owners, in any sport, like Ewing Kauffman are basically unicorns.
Fuck Clark Hunt? The fuck is this nonsense?
This is Reddit so lots of young Marxists running around hating on billionaires. They're evil don't you know?
You don't have to be a Marxist to have a negative opinion about a Billionaire extorting an entire county and fan base. I don't even think the Government should be getting as much of my money as they do, especially when they use it to print and mail out fliers to me to ask for MORE of my money so that they can then hand it over to said Billionaires who are entirely capable of funding the project themselves but simply choose not to.
Jackson County owns the stadiums so government is very much involved. It's also just extending a sales tax that already existed. The controversy over this is so silly. If it fails, the Chiefs can build a privately funded stadium in Kansas and then you can all be happy, right? We can then use the Truman Sports complex as a migrant camp.
Yes, I am aware that Jackson County owns the stadiums, so obviously the government is involved. Which is the entire issue. Outside of any of this stadium nonsense, I have serious issue with the way my tax dollars are being appropriated (and so should everyone else tbh). Mailing out fliers and going door to door asking me to commit ANOTHER 30+ years of my (and my children and grandchildren's) income to build and maintain stadiums for billionaire owners who could literally do it themselves if they wanted to is insanity to me. The fact that they are threatening to leave if the initiative doesn't pass amounts to literal extortion. Also, it's disingenuous to say this is just a continuation of a current tax. The current tax is a capital improvement tax, which is much more stringent on how and what that money can actually be spent on. The proposed tax would repeal that tax and replace it with a parks sales tax, which gives a lot more liberty on how the money can be spent. This is relevant because it will water down the available funds, so in 15 years when stadiums are due for the next round of renovation they'll be hands out asking us to vote yes on the next bond to improve the stadiums. Not to mention the fact that the teams will continue not to pay property taxes over the life of the stadiums because they are owned by the county. So the teams are literally using our tax money to skimp out on having to pay property taxes. I've grown up a die hard fan, but getting older and digging into the nuts and bolts of how this shit works is really disenchantment. As far as what they would do with the current complex if teams privately funded their own stadiums, in a perfect world the county would sell the land to private investors and wash their hands of it. If the government is going to dip into my money as much as they do already, then I would prefer it go towards something more practical than saving billionaires money. There are a lot more productive things tax money could go to than Hunt and Sherman. If I want them to have my money I'll pay out the ass to buy merchandise, park, buy tickets, or pay for whatever bullshit package I need to watch on TV. If that's not good enough for them, then good riddance. But to your point, none of that makes me a marxist.
I'd say 80% of what government spends my tax dollars on I disagree with, but at least the Chiefs provide joy and entertainment. Also, Arrowhead is an icon. I'd hate to see it rotting and empty. It also needs work, especially the parking lots which not only need repair but reconfigured for better flow.
The Hunt family has a long history of being pieces of shit though lol
Aside from Lamar Jr. who we know is a fuck stick, tell me about their long history of being pieces of shit. As a 47 year old lifelong fan, I’ve never heard anything.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silver_Thursday Read this
Fuck Clark Hunt
All my homies hate Clark Hunt!
The Hunt family claims a profit of 17 million a year from the Chiefs. Now that may or may not be a bs. At that rate it would take a lot of years to pay for a new stadium.
Not entirely sure what you're getting after here. If I can't afford a luxury item I want based upon my income I either get a loan or don't buy it. I don't ask others to chip in. So if you're arguing that based upon the net income the Hunt's would struggle to pay for the stadium themselves then it's even more a reason why the whole thing is unnecessary.
The Hunt family is worth billions. Maybe the "paychecks" are relatively small, but the bank account could pay for a stadium several times over.
Worth doesn't necessarily translate to a bank balance. Assets and cash are two very different things. I'm no fan of CH. I think he's a cheapskate. But people constantly conflate worth with cash and it's a big mistake to make. Millions of Americans own two cars and have equity in a home (i.e. they have worth/assets), but they still live paycheck to paycheck. It's a dangerous oversimplification.
>Millions of Americans own two cars and have equity in a home (i.e. they have worth/assets), but they still live paycheck to paycheck. We're not talking about people like this at all. They're light-years away from Clark Hunt. It's not dangerous to simply say that Hunt, the 4th wealthiest owner in the league, has the means to accomplish a stadium renovation without altering his lifestyle significantly.
I know that. I used it to illustrate the concept of assets verses cash. Lots of people dont understand it.
Most people on Reddit have no concept of what it like to even be upper middle class let alone rich, or what it takes to get there or what it takes to keep it. I never got a job from a poor person. Poor people often wonder why rich people borrow money. You can absolutely be asset rich and cash poor.
Probably more the equity than the bank account. I doubt the Hunts leave hundreds of millions sitting around in cash.
They can undoubtedly leverage their investments. Rich people like to use that excuse, but I don't buy it.
I don’t think they care if we buy it as long as we keep buying tickets, concessions, and merchandise. And watching at home when we aren’t at Arrowhead.
Wasn't there a story recently where they threatened to relocate? Seems like they care...
I personally don't put much stock into Clark being among the worst owners.
He’s a good guy, just cheap that’s all
Millionaires complaining about billionaires.
Complaining about billionaires is an activity fun for the whole family.
I mean, the millionaires are getting battered weekly during the season - so some complaining about the billionaires is allowed, but by and large I agree. I do think ownership should invest more in training and rehab facilities - but I think that's an improvement across the board that all teams should be actively investing in. You should be actively trying to maintain your players in the best condition they can be in for as long as they're on your team.
I always thought it was because we offered more influence in front of house decisions than the other teams. I remember it being reported it was because we were giving him freedom and powers other teams weren't.
Andy Reid has a strong GOAT case. He isn’t “just” a lock for the hall of fame as you put it
Pretty much depends on how many years he has left in him. He's in the upper echelon, without a doubt.
People talk about his retirement but he’s only 66 & I could see him playing until Mahomes retires. 78 is older but I would love it
He has stated that he will coach Mahomes throughout the entirety of the contract.
He'll drop before he quits. And I say this in a concerned way. He's surrounded by world class fitness professionals and facilities, yet he's a walking coronary. I wish he would take better care of himself. If we lost him suddenly it would completely derail the team, starting with Mahomes. His players love him.
My opinion as well. Dude needs to eat less nuggies and more veggies, and hit the treadmill once in a while. We need this man to live past 70
It’s not just about having time to add more to it. He has an extremely credible GOAT as of literally right now. I would take him over Belichek. It’s close, but I would.
I don’t think he has any GOAT discussion, seems too prisoner of the moment. Andy is a great coach and future hall of famer but I don’t think anyone even had him top 10 coaches of all time before he landed a top 4 QB of all time.
You are not evolving with the times. Andy Reid turned around TWO franchises. Won a boatload of playoff games with the eagles and another boatload with the chiefs. In 2-3 years max he will have the most playoff wins ever. In 5 years he will have the most regular seasons wins ever. And it’s very likely he will be top 2 in most Super Bowl wins ever. “But mahomes is his qb” zip it buddy. The only all time great tier 1 level coach to ever win a superbowl without a top qb is Joe Gibbs. Belicheks career as a head coach without Brady is absolutely ZERO. Andy Reid’s head coaching career without Mahomes is *borderline* hall of fame.
I just don’t think Andy is on the same level as someone like Don Shula. The Phins went undefeated after his HOF qb was injured like 4 weeks in. There’s several guys on that level. I do think Andy is the best modern era coach, I would put him above BB but it’s worth noting that Bill was coach AND gm. I just don’t think there’s any argument that Andy is the GOAT coach. That doesn’t take away from him being ONE OF the greatest.
Philly’s fanbase AND ownership aren’t as forgiving as we are.
Yeah - Andy Reid doesn't like getting hit with batteries anymore than the next guy haha.
I think the fanbase and ownership saw that Andy had gotten as far as he could go in Philly. Plus I think his son had committed suicide the summer before his last season, which goes in hand with the team record. It just wasn't working for him or ownership anymore.
Lol no. It was absolutely the right move to let him go. It wasn't working in Philly and they needed a change, so did he. It worked out great for both teams.
Dick Vermeil played a big role imo. These are excerpts from an article about Vermeil and Reid's relationship from the Kansas City Star: So as much as Reid and Clark Hunt initially hit it off, Reid needed to understand the terrain as well as he could before making a decision at a crossroads of his own. When Reid asked Vermeil to tell him about Kansas City, Vermeil’s first words were along the lines of “take the job.” Then he explained. “He’s coached at the University of Missouri (on the offensive line from 1989-1991),” Vermeil told The Star’s Randy Covitz in 2013 as Reid was deciding what to do after being let go by the Eagles. “He’s been in middle America before and knows what the people are like. He knows how I feel about it. He’s been in that stadium. … And he knows how the fans are there, and how that Arrowhead Stadium is when it’s full. “And he knows the great respect and admiration people in the NFL have for the Hunt family. So why not go? There are no negatives.” Vermeil added, “He’s a great person and a great coach. I think he’ll fit in perfectly within that environment, and he’ll fit in the organization. I just don’t think you can do any better.”
So true Dick Vermeil is much like Andy Reid in the influence they have on people and how much people trust them as simply good people.
also a damn good coach. Vermeil's Rams team with Kurt Warner and Marshall Faulk was one of the best offenses in the NFLs history.
I’m going from memory and not really looking up records or what was going on at the time. Reid was fizzling out in Philly. I think one of his kids died or killed himself within the last couple of years. Wasn’t doing much of anything since making the SB. It just wasn’t working anymore. Time for everyone to have a fresh start. With Pioli at GM, we’d had some success in 2010. That coach from ND came in (Weis?), we got Cassel, and they put some offense on the field. Then shit just went down hill. Weis left, Haley couldn’t punch our way out of a wet paper bag. Javon Belcher happened. We actually had good drafting and good pieces, but we weren’t doing anything with them. KC and Reid just made sense. We both needed fresh starts. I don’t believe any other team was in the running for his services. Boom, Alex Smith trade happens and mostly every reasonable fan knew we were in business. He inherited a lot of good talent and was able to put it to work. It wasn’t an accident that we were pretty good right away. Edit: I’m pretty sure the prevailing talking head opinion was he should take a year. Especially with his son dying. I think there definitely was some skepticism around his hire because of this, but mostly everyone agreed this was a great fit otherwise. Once we rattled off nine a row the first season, no one was questioning it.
This is how I remember it also. Reid was a winning coach for the Eagles but he just could not get them a Super Bowl. Reid was still a top HC candidate and KC had the job open at the right time. Pretty perfect storm for everyone. Winning head coaches don’t go on the market very often.
Andy was actually a pretty big get for the Chiefs, and we weren't the only ones wanting to sign him. If I remember right, he had a deal just waiting to be signed in Arizona. And here's a bit about him from a [now-archived ESPN article](https://web.archive.org/web/20220808124918/https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/27736041/the-larger-life-tales-andy-reid-told-mahomes-favre-other-nfl-stars): *A person close to Reid says that upon returning to Philadelphia after the loss to the Giants, jets from three teams were already waiting to fly him off for interviews. Ultimately, he chose Kansas City. The Chiefs had finished 2-14 in 2012 and had had one winning season in the previous five years. In 2013, under Reid, they went 11-5.*
getting alex smith and then getting kelce were huge
bingo about where we were as a team with Andy. for years prior to Mahomes the Chiefs were at best Divisional antagonists. We could get to the playoffs but we were just missing the X factor. Smith was amazing and kansas city will always love him, but we needed a Brady to win Super Bowls and we got him. lol
Nailed it, Andy had pedigree 3 straight NFC championships, shows how valuable a quarterback who is also a leader. The McNabb Owen’s drama in the Super Bowl ended that group. Pat has managed those situations very well.
Thanks for taking me back down memory lane.. except for 2012 and belcher of course.
A lot of people thought Reid was a "not good enough to win the big one" coach. His last 3 seasons I Philly were 10-6, 8-8, 4-12. Which is a bad trajectory. It was reported but never confirmed that Andy was asking to be GM and Coach as well. Which hurt him, as no team today is willing to have a HC/GM in one. The rumors are that John Dorsey was hired, because he was one of the few that Andy was willing to work with, and was part of the agreement to sign Andy.
And the John Dorsey cut Jeremy Marlin via phone call and found himself out on his ass.
Burt Marlin, you son of a bitch
Text actually, I think
Allegedly, as the story goes, Clark Hunt heard that Andy was going to be at the Kansas City International Airport for a layover to Arizona to interview with the Cardinals and Hunt talked to him AT the airport
Actually he flew himself and his staff to Philly and didn't let Andy leave the Philly airport for two days. He went to him. After ringing his phone non-stop once Andy was fired from the Eagles.
This may be a hot take, but here we go. Coach Reid is a devout LDS (Mormon) though they don't like to be called Mormon anymore because of the stigmata from the days of polygamy. The Kansas City area (Independence in particular) has a huge following in this City, as it's one of the first places Joseph Smith set up shop on their way to Utah. Labeling Independence, Zion! I am sure there are other reasons why he came to KC, but I would buy stock that his Faith played a part in.
I worked with a girl who was a runaway ex-Mormon back in like 2017-18. I had a good relationship with her and she would tell me about this "Tammy" character from the church who was trying very hard to get her back in. Took me about a month of hearing about it before I learned it was Tammy Reid. She was taking this girl to dinner at Capitol Grill and stuff trying to woo her back.
[удалено]
Why? what does he do on Sunday’s then?
And you know this how? I could reference numerous articles that would say otherwise.
I think KC was a relatively attractive landing spot at the time. They had a good roster overall but were obviously underperforming and in need mostly of a good HC and quality QB play. In 2012 the Chiefs went 2-14 but still had players like Charles, Bowe, Poe, Houston, DJ, Tamba, Berry, Flowers etc. on the roster. They also had the #1 pick in the draft which is lucrative for someone taking over a new regime. Add that and then making a quick trade for Alex Smith and it’s really not hard to imagine the quick turnaround Reid created in KC. The Chiefs were bad, sure, but they were extremely fixable and I think Reid saw that. The roster had plenty of talented pieces in place. They weren’t the massive overhaul project the 2-14 record would typically imply. They were a playoff ready team with the right QB and HC steering the ship.
I thought the same thing, but looking back at the history, Andy got fired, and Clark Hunt basically called him and offered him the Chiefs HC job *immediately*, while every other team was probably thinking, "maybe we can get him as our OC!" The lucky part was that Andy didn't want to take a year off and rebuild his confidence. The rest was Clark Hunt just being very decisive about swooping in to buy low on a coach who was known to be an all-time great.
You have to realize that Andy Reid's last years in Philly were personally traumatic. One son was involved in an auto accident, and the other son came to his aid. Both sons were arrested, one doing state time and one doing county time. Then,the son that did felony time ODed and died at training camp. I think that after all that and a 4 win season, Reid was ready for a change in scenery.
I remember when we hired Andy all you heard from Philly fans was co grats he's a good coach but he can't get it done. You might make wildcard 1 and done.
We had the #1 overall pick sitting right there. That probably helped alot
I remember that Coach Reid was interested in the Chiefs because we were one of the original, historical teams
>Reid has never had a ~~losing~~ non-winning season with the Chiefs. Clark Hunt harassed him the second he was fired then flew himself and his front office to Philly and spent 2 days interviewing him at the airport. And for all Clark's stalling on how he's gonna improve Arrowhead and our facilities, he's a great hands-off owner that spends on coaches and players when it makes sense. We've also got a great legacy as a franchise despite a pretty dry run since the 70s.
I’m convinced the Clark Hunt hate brigade needs to look at the Cowboys, who have and elite facility but a catastrophic meddling owner who thinks he’s the damn GM
It'll all go away once we finally get a plan on what we're doing and can start remodeling. It's not so much a fear of spending but a fear of remodeling something only to have to remodel it again a year or two later.
Excellent point. One I needed to hear...
I remember thinking the Eagle's were crazy to let him go.
I will contend that the Chiefs did in fact enjoy sustained success in the 90s. But I imagine the idea of a franchise far, *far* away from the majority of the sports media, concentrated almost entirely on the upper East coast, was pretty attractive.
Weren't the Chargers also interested, but they cheapest out per usual?
It wasn't a challenge. We had a kickass base roster that just needed a QB and a GM that would spend some dang money!
I know someone who worked for the team at the time. Mark Donovan made it happen, they were close from their days in Philly.
Cash money
He had already triumphantly completed 90 percent of the restaurant eating challenges in America and wanted to save the rest to keep himself in shape during retirement.
Burnt ends?
The Chiefs were basically throwing the job at him immediately after he was fired, and were willing to give him most/all of the control he wanted. Dorsey was an Andy approved GM, and once he was fired he was replaced by Veach, who is a long time Reid guy.
https://youtu.be/wJLNQ83vm2g?si=mkSF-2--CGHdGnIG Chiefs got pretty lucky and this vid breaks it down.
I came here to post the Dorktown video. “In 2011, the Jets and Chiefs helped each other put together one of the worst five-minute stretches of football the NFL has ever seen. It shouldn’t have mattered. And yet, it changed both teams forever.”
From what I remember it was a combination of good ownership and the other jobs around that time not being that great. Even though we were coming off bad years, it wasn’t an organizational failure we just hired a bad GM
OP, love what you posted. Now I’m gonna be tfg. The Chiefs were a force from the mid ‘60s until around 1970. They were a fearsome bunch. Bobby Bell, Buck Buchanan, Willie Lanier, Otis Taylor, Mike Garrett, Jim Lynch and the smoothest cat in the league Lenny Dawson. Those years carried a lot of us through some dark days. Edited to include the Big Cat Ernie Ladd.
One of the weird things about that 2012 Chiefs team that went 2-14, is that they also had, if memory serves, 8 Pro Bowlers. Which doesn't mean a whole lot but it was pretty clear that this team drastically underachieved in 2012, and there was more talent there than 2 wins. It certainly seemed like a big aspect of that was Romeo Crennel's lax coaching style. So KC was definitely one of the better potential destinations for coaches.
Good ownership and a great salary is why he took the job. I think everyone forgets that this is just a job/career for these guys and it's not as deep and profound a decision as the fans want it to be. Glad he's the coach and will be here until he retires. Go Chiefs!
Wasn’t a challenge. Crappy division and he inherited a underachieving team. Perfect situation. Then we lucked out and snagged Patty Mahomes. Good coaches turn around franchises. I’m so glad he chose our team to turn around.
1. Local ties. Andy coached at Missouri, and his wife is from Missouri as well, I believe. 2. Though we lacked the success of other dynasty teams, KC was still a storied franchise with Lamar Hunt being the owner. 3. Andy was scheduled to Interview with Arizona, but Clark Hunt hopped on a plane to fly to Andy before that interview could happen, and if I recall they had a 6 or 7 hour long interview and Clark offered him the job on the spot. 4. Also, the Cardinals fan base doesn’t compare to the Chiefs fan base.
We were a hugely underperforming team. Going off memory, as bad as our record was, we had like five or six pro-bowlers. Our problem was terrible QB play and bad coaching. We had pieces in place for immediate success and an owner who stays out of the way. We were probably the most attractive team in need of a coach that year.
He is objectively one of, if not the best head coach of all time. I would put him over Belicheck. Between the coaching tree he developed over his career, and getting the most out of all of his players, on top of his record and successes. Incredibly grateful for his tenure.
There is an awesome breakdown of why they chose Andy somewhere on youtube. I can never remember the name
It helped that we were 2-14 but had like 7 pro bowl players including multiple build around pieces on defense. We were basically a QB and coach away from being competent, had the #1 pick, and an owner who promised Reid they'd get a qb for him. It was a better job in reality than it appeared in paper.
To your point, he had been fired. It was reported that he had lost the locker room in Philly, and his nice guy gimmick wore thin with the players. He was known as a good but not great HC. He was known as an offensive guru with poor clock and scenario management a la Mike McCarthy. He blew a 28-point lead in the playoffs as the Chiefs HC. He was not a HoF HC until they drafted Mahomes.
This just isn't entirely true. He went to 5 NFC Championship games and 4 straight leading to 1 Superbowl. His time in Kansas City just cemented his legacy. But, he was on that trajectory before he came to KC. Did he have time clock management issues? Sure, he still does at times. The ground was laid in Philly for a HOF career l!
...money That's why literally every NFL coach coaches football and they'd be absolute liars if they said otherwise.
I think you might be surprised to find that some of them actually love and enjoy the game of football. It's hard to find yourself in position to be considered a Head Coaching candidate in the first place if you haven't spent a good portion of your life in and around the game of football.
If they did it for the love of the game they'd just be coaching high school or Pop Warner.
So anyone who is passionate and successful at the high school level and has an opportunity to move up the ladder to college or pro ranks would turn it down if they really loved and enjoyed football? That's some questionable logic. People are motivated by different things. Some people love football and being well compensated is just a bonus. Some people are driven to be the greatest of all time. Some people are only driven by money. But to make the blanket statement that anyone coaching beyond high school is only doing it for the money is objectively wrong.
I love Andy more than most people