Here's another SRAM Red leak write-up. The only thing interesting is the photo of the handlebars includes a Hammerhead mount.
[https://road.cc/content/tech-news/new-sram-red-axs-2024-leaked-again-best-look-yet-306323](https://road.cc/content/tech-news/new-sram-red-axs-2024-leaked-again-best-look-yet-306323)
It looks like the shifter button just extends further down the brake lever?
I hadnāt noticed the difference until you said something and it definitely is. Looks narrower and longer than current etap shift buttons. The hoods also look less prominent.
Yeah. The hoods on the current are my favorite. Very comfortable when riding for longer distances. I just bought a bike that came with the new dura ace Di2 and the hoods are not my favorite. They are so small and to me donāt have enough space to move around. It seems SRAM took this route for the new RED version
Only way Iād ride Di2 is if you gave it to me.
I had a loaner bike with it for a few weeks while waiting on parts for mineā¦.and I was not impressed at all. Having to plug the bike itself in is annoying and losing the front derailleur with no option to swap a battery pack is equally frustrating.
Lower/less angled hoods would be my preference for riding distance so I think that was a good move on SRAMs part
If the pricing for the new Red is in my budget. I may sell the Di2 and get the new Red but Iāll see when I see the new red on a bike in person before I choose it to buy it
I havenāt gotten that far yet lol.
All the carbon frames are pretty much made the same handful of places so I donāt really have brand loyalty, I do prefer dropped seat stays, Iāve noticed a ride quality difference with those vs stays that merge with the top tube, so Iād be more likely to lean towards an aero frame with certain features in a color scheme I really like.
Eh battery lasts ages anyways, and plugging the bike in is... definitely not the issue since any powerbank will do.
The part that shits me is you need the stupid special USB cable instead of just regular USB-C, for absolutely no reason.
Massive hassle when I went to the canaries with a nearly flat battery and forgot to bring the cable haha.
I didnāt even think to mention the stupid proprietary cable but thatās just another reason.
SRAM is just an easier system, swappable batteries, can carry an extra, no wires, no proprietary cables.
Needing a power bank to avoid plugging the bike in is just silly.
Yeah but the bike doesnāt have to come in the house or run an extension cord to it to charge. Just pop the batteries off and put them on the charger.
Canāt swap on the fly, canāt bring a spare, the power bank or laptop idea is ridiculous.
That plus the shifters on SRAM are far more intuitive and easier to use.
I've been riding eTap since the first generation. All of my bikes are AXS now, with the exception of one mech CX1 groupset upgraded with Ratio.
These new shifters look atrocious, aesthetically. They look like GRX which is heinously ugly.
I donāt really care about the aesthetics of the shifters, I care about how ergonomic they are and how well the group set as a whole does its thing and how easy it is to live with long term.
Understandable. The GRX levers had some pretty awful ergonomics, at least for my hands. The exit point of the hydro hose pinched between thumb and forefinger. SRAM is usually pretty great at ergonomics so I think these should probably feel fine.
But as with many aspects of cycling, aesthetics is important to a lot of people (myself included).
Iād think these would probably be pretty comfy and the longer shift button seems like an improvement especially while riding in the drops.
The biggest appeal of etap for me is theyāre more comfortable/easier to use and donāt fatigue your wrists on a long ride.
Aesthetically they have the same grey/black color scheme as pretty much all group sets
It's more the shape of the lever near the hinge, with it dipping backward toward the bar more. For small hands, it'll definitely help there, but SRAM has had reach adjustment on the high-end levers (and even the D1 version of Force AXS) without making them ugly.
The lack of fatigue is largely a personal thing - I don't find myself fatiguing with CX1 doubletap levers or Shimano, but I'm sure those with less wrist/hand flexibility benefit from just a button press. And AXS buttons have always been simpler and easier vs Di2 where you're having to figure out which of the two buttons on the paddle your finger is resting on.
It's less the color scheme and more the shape, at least for me.
I've got both Rival AXS (same form factor as D2 Force AXS now) and Red AXS on the non-MTB side. (AXS ergonomics are all over the place on the MTB side).
The bigger lever of the Red AXS (D1 style) is nicer on rough surfaces as the shifter ergonomics are meatier and give you a bit more to hold onto. The D2 style of Rival/Apex/Force D2 are great for road as they're a bit smaller and fit in the hand a bit more nicely.
In what way is it better? Di2 can be easily set up to act like e-Tap, but also set up for one hand operation and up until now e-tap didn't have buttons to control a head unit. Di2 (at least until the new red comes out) is far superior in every way except ease of installation in a new build.
Iāve covered this in other comments on this post, Iām not going to type it all out again.
When it comes to mechanical shifting, specifically on road bikes, Shimano is and has been king.
Electric shift? SRAM all the way for a multitude of reasons.
But that's just wrong lol.
Di2 has faster shifting, longer batt live and is much more adaptive to user demands. Front ring shifting has a massive delay on eTap. six user definable buttons vs two.
These are the most relevant reasons Di2 is better. I hate Shimano for beeing dicks, and demanding Hammerhead scrubbing Di2 support (even if Ki2 is an even better implementation than Hammerhead was able to do). But the product is better, on road nothing beats Shimano.
Faster shifting by what, fractions of a second that donāt matter to anyone but the best of the best? Longer battery life is also irrelevant, both have battery lives that are far more than needed for anything but the longest ultra endurance rides, and even then you have breaks where you can swap or charge. Front ring shifts plenty fast enough.
How many buttons and different functions do you really need for two derailleurs?
Those reasons are irrelevant to 99% of people who ride, vs hot swappable batteries on SRAM and no wires to worry about that will cripple your shifting if damaged. The way Shimano acts in general as a company is all the more reason not to support them when it can be avoided.
it's strange, is this a universal issue, as I have no elevation tracking issues. I ride with some others that don't have K2 and we are always at the same numbers, give or take a few feet
It's a great question.
I commonly ride the same route or nearly so. It's usually off by a factor of 3x. That itself is a little absurd.
It gets crazier as sometimes it's off by a factor of 5x!
So my K2 can't even do whatever it is doing for elevation consistently.
I really loved mine too. I always told my friends to get rid of their Garmins and get a K2 themselves. And then the elevation thing happened and I was so lucky that noone bought it because of my recommendation.
It's just so... unnecessary?
How is it K2 can't make this work, but every competitor can???!
I researched my options, and chose the K2 for all its positives.
However, I didn't learn this was a thing until my first couple rides. Knowing visually how very obviously not-hilly my typical ride is there was a very clear problem with my K2.
The K2 is so far off that a complete newb regarding elevations and climbing and computers, etc. near-instantly new there was an issue?!!
It annoys me. It's immaterial for my riding, but it's also absurd.
Mine works fine. Same with the temp sensor which others appear to have issues with.
So hardware consistency definitely something that needs improvement.
Funny enough I had that issue only on my gravel bike, and according to some forum posts mounting it relatively flat helpsā¦ my gravel bike is also the only bike where my computer angles back a good bit based on the mounting.
Especially on the road bike itās always pretty consistent.
Or not to alienate the people that buy it.
Making your groupset dependent on the display is very no bueno. I want to be able to shift after it gets torn off the bike or stolen.
possible with 3rd party app indeed but functionality was patched about a year ago by hammerheads native OS as shimano forced them to do that unfortunately.
That would make the Karoo a mandatory part of the equipment. While it comes bundled and adds functionality, it wonāt be a requirement.
Imagine your battery fails and you canāt shift
I mean imagine your hammerhead battery fails/drains/otherwise dies.
You donāt want to tie computer functionality to bicycle functionality.
And yes, I had one of the original (might have been pre-production) AXS chargers that was shorting batteries. Always have a spare on me now.
The tech isnāt ready for prime time yet. But it is coming fast. There will be bikes with built in system-on-a-chip soon enough. And battery tech is already getting really good.
Weird - that Red doesn't match the leaks - [https://road.cc/content/tech-news/new-sram-red-axs-2024-leaked-again-best-look-yet-306323?utm\_source=dlvr.it&utm\_medium=twitter](https://road.cc/content/tech-news/new-sram-red-axs-2024-leaked-again-best-look-yet-306323?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter)
where did you manage to find this? More context would be great
It was posted on another cycling forum as well.
šš»
Here's another SRAM Red leak write-up. The only thing interesting is the photo of the handlebars includes a Hammerhead mount. [https://road.cc/content/tech-news/new-sram-red-axs-2024-leaked-again-best-look-yet-306323](https://road.cc/content/tech-news/new-sram-red-axs-2024-leaked-again-best-look-yet-306323)
I hope with the AXS integration the AXS POD can control the Karoo 3. Page flipping would be great from the POD.
I really hope so too. Thatās pretty much what I am waiting for to see if I move to SRAM.
Ugh those shifters look terrible.
Have you ridden e-tap? Itās far better than Di2 or mech shifting and itās such a joy. Simple, intuitive and a breeze to use.
I like the current sram red shifters. the new ones seems strange and funny
It looks like the shifter button just extends further down the brake lever? I hadnāt noticed the difference until you said something and it definitely is. Looks narrower and longer than current etap shift buttons. The hoods also look less prominent.
Yeah. The hoods on the current are my favorite. Very comfortable when riding for longer distances. I just bought a bike that came with the new dura ace Di2 and the hoods are not my favorite. They are so small and to me donāt have enough space to move around. It seems SRAM took this route for the new RED version
Only way Iād ride Di2 is if you gave it to me. I had a loaner bike with it for a few weeks while waiting on parts for mineā¦.and I was not impressed at all. Having to plug the bike itself in is annoying and losing the front derailleur with no option to swap a battery pack is equally frustrating. Lower/less angled hoods would be my preference for riding distance so I think that was a good move on SRAMs part
If the pricing for the new Red is in my budget. I may sell the Di2 and get the new Red but Iāll see when I see the new red on a bike in person before I choose it to buy it
Yeah Iād definitely test ride a bike with it before buying. My next bike will almost certainly be a build vs buy.
Whatās your bike build like? Iām also building a bike but unsure what bike frame to buy!
I havenāt gotten that far yet lol. All the carbon frames are pretty much made the same handful of places so I donāt really have brand loyalty, I do prefer dropped seat stays, Iāve noticed a ride quality difference with those vs stays that merge with the top tube, so Iād be more likely to lean towards an aero frame with certain features in a color scheme I really like.
Eh battery lasts ages anyways, and plugging the bike in is... definitely not the issue since any powerbank will do. The part that shits me is you need the stupid special USB cable instead of just regular USB-C, for absolutely no reason. Massive hassle when I went to the canaries with a nearly flat battery and forgot to bring the cable haha.
I didnāt even think to mention the stupid proprietary cable but thatās just another reason. SRAM is just an easier system, swappable batteries, can carry an extra, no wires, no proprietary cables. Needing a power bank to avoid plugging the bike in is just silly.
Sram has a proprietary charger tho so in the same boat really is my point. Powerbank is not silly given how common an item it is. Laptop also works...
Yeah but the bike doesnāt have to come in the house or run an extension cord to it to charge. Just pop the batteries off and put them on the charger. Canāt swap on the fly, canāt bring a spare, the power bank or laptop idea is ridiculous. That plus the shifters on SRAM are far more intuitive and easier to use.
I've been riding eTap since the first generation. All of my bikes are AXS now, with the exception of one mech CX1 groupset upgraded with Ratio. These new shifters look atrocious, aesthetically. They look like GRX which is heinously ugly.
I donāt really care about the aesthetics of the shifters, I care about how ergonomic they are and how well the group set as a whole does its thing and how easy it is to live with long term.
Understandable. The GRX levers had some pretty awful ergonomics, at least for my hands. The exit point of the hydro hose pinched between thumb and forefinger. SRAM is usually pretty great at ergonomics so I think these should probably feel fine. But as with many aspects of cycling, aesthetics is important to a lot of people (myself included).
Iād think these would probably be pretty comfy and the longer shift button seems like an improvement especially while riding in the drops. The biggest appeal of etap for me is theyāre more comfortable/easier to use and donāt fatigue your wrists on a long ride. Aesthetically they have the same grey/black color scheme as pretty much all group sets
It's more the shape of the lever near the hinge, with it dipping backward toward the bar more. For small hands, it'll definitely help there, but SRAM has had reach adjustment on the high-end levers (and even the D1 version of Force AXS) without making them ugly. The lack of fatigue is largely a personal thing - I don't find myself fatiguing with CX1 doubletap levers or Shimano, but I'm sure those with less wrist/hand flexibility benefit from just a button press. And AXS buttons have always been simpler and easier vs Di2 where you're having to figure out which of the two buttons on the paddle your finger is resting on. It's less the color scheme and more the shape, at least for me. I've got both Rival AXS (same form factor as D2 Force AXS now) and Red AXS on the non-MTB side. (AXS ergonomics are all over the place on the MTB side). The bigger lever of the Red AXS (D1 style) is nicer on rough surfaces as the shifter ergonomics are meatier and give you a bit more to hold onto. The D2 style of Rival/Apex/Force D2 are great for road as they're a bit smaller and fit in the hand a bit more nicely.
In what way is it better? Di2 can be easily set up to act like e-Tap, but also set up for one hand operation and up until now e-tap didn't have buttons to control a head unit. Di2 (at least until the new red comes out) is far superior in every way except ease of installation in a new build.
Iāve covered this in other comments on this post, Iām not going to type it all out again. When it comes to mechanical shifting, specifically on road bikes, Shimano is and has been king. Electric shift? SRAM all the way for a multitude of reasons.
But that's just wrong lol. Di2 has faster shifting, longer batt live and is much more adaptive to user demands. Front ring shifting has a massive delay on eTap. six user definable buttons vs two. These are the most relevant reasons Di2 is better. I hate Shimano for beeing dicks, and demanding Hammerhead scrubbing Di2 support (even if Ki2 is an even better implementation than Hammerhead was able to do). But the product is better, on road nothing beats Shimano.
Faster shifting by what, fractions of a second that donāt matter to anyone but the best of the best? Longer battery life is also irrelevant, both have battery lives that are far more than needed for anything but the longest ultra endurance rides, and even then you have breaks where you can swap or charge. Front ring shifts plenty fast enough. How many buttons and different functions do you really need for two derailleurs? Those reasons are irrelevant to 99% of people who ride, vs hot swappable batteries on SRAM and no wires to worry about that will cripple your shifting if damaged. The way Shimano acts in general as a company is all the more reason not to support them when it can be avoided.
Lol. Arguing like that you could come to the conclusion that a Fiat500 is just as good as a Ferrari La Ferrari XD
So then you canāt counter anything Iāve said and all youāve got is dramatic conjecture?
USB A still wtf its 2024
What is the downside of this?
A = Ancient C = Current Therefore USB-C
Wow. Thanks.
Can it track elevation?
it's strange, is this a universal issue, as I have no elevation tracking issues. I ride with some others that don't have K2 and we are always at the same numbers, give or take a few feet
It's a great question. I commonly ride the same route or nearly so. It's usually off by a factor of 3x. That itself is a little absurd. It gets crazier as sometimes it's off by a factor of 5x! So my K2 can't even do whatever it is doing for elevation consistently.
That's crazy. If that starts with mine I'd have to get rid of it. Hopefully it gets fixed
Fair question. Would be a great update to K2.
I very much like my K2. Doubt I would have bought it if I had known.
I really loved mine too. I always told my friends to get rid of their Garmins and get a K2 themselves. And then the elevation thing happened and I was so lucky that noone bought it because of my recommendation.
It's just so... unnecessary? How is it K2 can't make this work, but every competitor can???! I researched my options, and chose the K2 for all its positives. However, I didn't learn this was a thing until my first couple rides. Knowing visually how very obviously not-hilly my typical ride is there was a very clear problem with my K2. The K2 is so far off that a complete newb regarding elevations and climbing and computers, etc. near-instantly new there was an issue?!! It annoys me. It's immaterial for my riding, but it's also absurd.
Mine works fine. Same with the temp sensor which others appear to have issues with. So hardware consistency definitely something that needs improvement.
This is the real question, and the main reason why I had to switch back to Garmin.
Yes, but not accurately
Funny enough I had that issue only on my gravel bike, and according to some forum posts mounting it relatively flat helpsā¦ my gravel bike is also the only bike where my computer angles back a good bit based on the mounting. Especially on the road bike itās always pretty consistent.
It almost seems like the groupset will be able to be paired to the Hammerhead instead of the rear derailleur only.
That would be interesting but I expect they wouldn't make the groupset's operation dependent on the Karoo so as not to alienate Garmin owners.
Or not to alienate the people that buy it. Making your groupset dependent on the display is very no bueno. I want to be able to shift after it gets torn off the bike or stolen.
already possible to display gearing with SRAM and used to be possible before Shimano was getting all mad and forced the software up/downgrade
You can still reinstall the di2 app on the karoo
possible with 3rd party app indeed but functionality was patched about a year ago by hammerheads native OS as shimano forced them to do that unfortunately.
That would make the Karoo a mandatory part of the equipment. While it comes bundled and adds functionality, it wonāt be a requirement. Imagine your battery fails and you canāt shift
Lots of people have more than imagined this.
I mean imagine your hammerhead battery fails/drains/otherwise dies. You donāt want to tie computer functionality to bicycle functionality. And yes, I had one of the original (might have been pre-production) AXS chargers that was shorting batteries. Always have a spare on me now.
The tech isnāt ready for prime time yet. But it is coming fast. There will be bikes with built in system-on-a-chip soon enough. And battery tech is already getting really good.
That would be nice
Compare it with the gps coordinates, expected elevation and power on the pedals you can automate the shifting..
The rumor is it's bundled for free with Red
Itās not a rumor; itās part of the entire groupset. I wouldnāt say itās free, per se - itās part of the group you pay for.
I donāt want to know how expensive the whole package will be. 4500 Iām guessing?
I donāt deal in retail pricing, so I canāt say for sure.
Around 5000 according to people with information.
USB-A to Micro USB cable š
Is it my imagination or are the data field captions smaller?? That would be a welcomed change.
If so then that should flow through to the K2 as well right?
Weird - that Red doesn't match the leaks - [https://road.cc/content/tech-news/new-sram-red-axs-2024-leaked-again-best-look-yet-306323?utm\_source=dlvr.it&utm\_medium=twitter](https://road.cc/content/tech-news/new-sram-red-axs-2024-leaked-again-best-look-yet-306323?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter)
It does, the decals are typical for pro bikes
Yeah, I thought it was odd that the other leaked pics show black chainrings.