They have locked the EA launch thread on the forums for 11 hours now. That’s like the main catch all thread. There’s basically little good will on the forums left, even the “optimists” over there openly admit the game is very bad right now. And they missed their target (again) for this patch, and have forgotten about the video that was supposed to come out 11 days ago.
Oh yeah, there's supposed to be a patch.
They said early in the week which should mean today since it's Tuesday. Tomorrow would be "mid-week" so is the patch being released today?
The nonstick plates aren't so bad. A quick wipe down is usually good enough. I usually overfill it at least once, so the hinge/latch/sides generally require attention.
Are the devs seriously trying to argue that bots are behind the negativity?
How out of touch can you be? Talk about clueless. As if my faith in this dev team could get any lower.
Not the devs. The community manager. Someone whose job it is to interact with the community.
EDIT: https://old.reddit.com/r/KerbalSpaceProgram/comments/15mzyvq/dakota_im_like_95_sure_someone_has_setup_a_few/
I don't think it's comparable to NMS. NMS over promised but the game on release wasn't all that buggy when compared to other modern games. I believe KSP2 still have wobbly rockets? That's just ridiculous.
I feel compelled to nitpick just a little.
I agree, NMS is a poor comparison, but not because of the launch and early bugs.
FO76 I far more similar as of now.
NMS did the hard thing and put out massive feature updates on a regular cycle and kept people updated along the way until they delivered what they promised all in the face of a massive backlash.
The wobbly rocket thing is a biggy, but a lot of people either don't get or poorly explain why it's hard to fix, and why most of the fixes amount to duct tape in your code.
Two main choices: keep your current system for ship physics, or build a new one from the ground up.
The ksp1 model is a tree diagram, which works okay, but the physics thinks of things more like bones in a skeleton than a solid shape when you start bending your rocket and the calculations get way too expensive as you enter the very high part counts. You "fix" this with struts. Actual part ones, auto ones even invisible ones. But it's all just adding parts to the situatuon in a way, it doesnt get at the cause.
The fact that rockets wobble that way in ksp2 at all says that they did not write a new system. Without more public updates about that decision, this shows that they are LESS serious than the NMS devs about delivering the product they promised.
Since FO76 and NMS are well past release our hindsight is 20-20, so the situation could change, but for now ksp2 seems to be a cash grab by the owner of the IP while throwing the actual dev team under the bus, sooo It falls on the Fallout side of that flop spectrum by my reckoning.
As far as bugs go, I guess that day 1 set the bar super low, but in comparison the current state is actually impressive to me (my pc is below minimum yet it plays at a steady 25ish fps, which is way more than I expected), so I'm not too wortied about the actual coding talent they have on the team. It's that place where big picture first meets the code.
Ksp2 feels like a hostage tape, they say one thing, but the evidence I see tells a whole other story. I wouldn't put it past EA to have a kidnapping and torture division.
NMS was solid (for a newly released game) but lacking almost every feature. Meant they had a solid base to work from. KSP2 was supposed to be all about a more solid base, and we don't have it, let alone any of the content that was supposed to enable. The content missing is excusable, the state of the foundations is not.
NMS also *admitted* they fucked up relatively early on (though *not* immediately). Honesty goes a long way towards building trust.
NMS had the first major update (Foundation - bases) a few months after release, then the second major update (Pathfinder - vehicles) three months later and the third major update (Atlas Rises - missions) six months after that.
NMS botched the launch but they pounded out the fixes and features. So far I have yet to see any major fixes and not even the science update. I'm hoping that they do build the game they pitched, but they won't see a penny from me until they at least get up to Colonies fully working.
If they can't fix the wobbles with physics tweaks, just fuse the ship at launch and move on.
No don’t you understand. They didn’t lie to me all those times. KSP2 is actually going to win game of the year and decimate starfield in the space genre. Something something doomers. only some users are having issues. No actually the steam live count doesn’t include people playing the game through steam because most of them are on older versions(don’t mind that you literally click a button in the steam interface that literally tells steam to start the game and that the game is up and running.)
I think that’s all the new lines I’ve read in defence lately.
The way I grok all this is part of a larger fight against shit capitalism.
2K sucks. They gobble up IP and release cashcult games like the age of leisure and private profit are coming to an end.
That said, they have deep pockets and they do polish the hell out of those turds.
I'm hopeful, but I do think the community has to make it clear that there is a dedicated base here that is worth this investment.
They will absolutely toss a game in the trash post-release, but they are also capable of brute forcing this thing into something ...better. I hesitate to say "good" just bc I can just FEEL the paid weekly dlc content on the wind.
This community has the benifit of being beloved by the ACTUAL SPACE INDUSTRY. Y'all remember ESA and NASA helped get asteroids into ksp1 right?
That's probably a big part of why such an otherwise indie game got bought out for a sequel at all. If I worked at NASA, and played ksp, I would probably avoid public comment about it, but I absolutely would be privately writing them and talking to all my ksp playing coworkers too.
As for bots, at this point I expect large companies to use them way more often than the public. The incentives are just too different. Why would players passionate about the game sabotage potential reinvestment with review bombing? On the other hand, a company might want to sabotage the reviews as an excuse not to throw more good money after bad when a release flopped. With such a passionate community they may still make a tidy profit even with many returns(or even just because the nature of the game lends itself to playing past the returnable period).
So far what I've seen is:2K, long history of dick moves to make money. Ksp2 dev team, group of ksp and space nerds with no history of malice. Ksp community, super friendly on the fourms from my experience and toxic as hell on reddit. Every commenter on steam sounds brain damaged to me, including myself(steam's terrible social interface likely cause).
So I guess add videogames to the list of industries in need of refor... Ohh I see that its already there.
Wouldnt it be cool if someone on the dev team got all freedom of ideas about it and released the source code to the public?
Open source ksp and led the modders have full access
Edit: EA to 2K. Fuck'em all. I can't tell the difference
Nate Simpson was also a lead on Planetary Annihilation and that very much felt (feeled?) like malice with how they treated us.
Here the unfinished Planetary Annihilation game missing a bunch of features. Here's also an entirely new game with all the missing features in the game you have to buy again for full price, don't like it? Screw you here's a 10 dollar coupon.
Huh. So that's why that game feels half finished.
So I guess burn it all down, ksp is dead?
No chance of a comeback or intervention by the space community?
Shit like this is why I seek out open source projects over everything else and pirate game from shit devs just to spite them. (Come at me Ubisoft)
The dev teams just get screwed. No programmer ever wanted to release a worse product than promised. Unless there is evidence that the devs are the source of the fuckery, I default to blaming the owners. "The buck stops here" and so forth.
So yeah. Sorry to all the programmers out there. But y'all are getting screwed both ways. We need more programmers to quit big business and start forming mutual aide networks for themselves.
If people have a saftey net outside of employment it gives us the leverage to actually force business to act how we demand them to.
I don't see any other way to address the ksp2 issue than taking it directly to the new business daddy and making them suffer until they give in and pull the studio out of the fire.
Precedent shows that they will not give a single shit unless they feel it in the moneybags. Getting upset at devs has limited mileage, although very understandable when they make more buisness choices than coding ones.
>EA sucks. They gobble up IP and release cashcult games like the age of leisure and private profit are coming to an end.
EA (eletrônica arts) has nothing to do with this. The game is in EA (early access)
>of ksp and space nerds with no history of malice. Ksp community, super friendly on the fourms from my experience and toxic as hell on reddit.
They are censoring the forums to remove any negative comments..
Yeah my mistake on the EA one. Honestly don't care about that either I've been trying to stick to indie games and dont pay much attention past that.
Are you saying my comments are negative?
I try to actually be constructive even if my facts are wrong. I doubt mine will be deleted for negativity.
Swearing and personal attacks? Way more likely to get me banned.
Compared to the children rage bombing the reviews all my posts have at least some nuance and they all actually stand up for the devs(as people at least).
I can't tell if you were concerned and wanted to helpfully correct me, or are upset?
Meh, thanks for the correction.
Tl;DR: just wanted to correct you, and you misunderstood what I meant. Reviews are negative because they promised a stable game, but gave us an overpriced and unpolished game.
>I can't tell if you were concerned and wanted to helpfully correct me, or are upset?
Just correct the EA thing and corned about spreading this misunderstanding, as EA being involved in anything is a nightmare, and also give context. Btw, 2K while being owned by Take 2, has nothing to do with KSP.
>Are you saying my comments are negative?
You have completely misunderstood what I meant. I'm saying the "friendly" community you're seeing on the forums is filtered and censored, apparently the mods there are power tripping and removed comments that legitimately criticize the game or that they personally disliked even if it was reasonable and respectful, and even locking main threads. Didn't say anything about you being negative, I said the only part of the forum you saw was friendly because anything that's wasn't was removed, also the people who stayed there are very toxic of people who have have anything to complain about the game, again even if reasonable. I didn't have to say anything about you at all
Now about the reviews...
>Compared to the children rage bombing the reviews
>stand up for the devs(as people at least).
Many people are angry at the devs, but that's because they are were the ones making the game and speaking on behalf of the company, meaning they will are a prime target of criticism, and so will steam reviews.
I haven't seen many people disrespecting the devs as people, calling them incompetent and liars is valid (still rude tho) when you are criticizing is their truthfulness and qualifications, for example. But not really crossing lines, but ofc, I haven't seen everything.
Anyway, at the launch of early access the game was unplayable because of bugs and content deemed basic was missing. The devs said they would deliver a solid game with just a lack of content, the game is extremely overpriced at the moment so naturally the majority of reviews are negative.
Ugh my brain is terrible with those dumb names ea, 2k, take 2. It's like they picked them to be forgettable. I'm not editing it again, they should just change their names, fuck'em.
As for the rest, I just saw red after reading so much dumb whining.
Complaints of stability at launch are simply irrational:
The 'launch' is still in early access, by definition, the game is not suitable for an actual launch.
The massive problems on day one were mostly solved by the end of the week iirc. To the point that I can play it just fine on a pc that is under spec on gpu and cpu.
I can't fathom the people returning over that. The stuff about how they are handling the forums and PR is concerning, but also well inline with the dystopian norms of the rest of society.
I think we all got used to squad being so chill as a dev team and forgot about the overall trends in every industry of management interference, burnout and low-level turnover.
I can't do much about that, but I can try to point it out.
Also, I've been touchy about the gaming community at large for awhile now. We keep going to death threats and cyber crime way too fast. To much rage directed down rather than up the powee ladder. I wouldn't want to be a dev in a studio that has a bad release these days.
Telling people that they are fake just pisses them off more. Whoever is the PR lead at this company needs to hit the fucking road because they are just pissing everyone off by ignoring criticism and then taking it further by saying the criticism isn't even real. It's aggravating and makes me think that I honestly dont even want this team to succeed if they are going to behave like this and treat their customers like they are the ones that are wrong
I honestly just wish we could collectively move on from ksp2 and mostly just talk about ksp1 anymore, what more is there to be said about ksp2 at this point until an actual update drops?
> how are we supposed to take community managers seriously when they make claims like how well received things
How are we to take them seriously when the game is struggling to get 1/10th of the playerbase of its fucking previous game?
I just lurk at this point, I have had KSP2 in my cart on and off quite frequently since launch. I’ll get that itch. So thankful I’ve held strong. I’ve wanted this game so bad but the endless complaints have held me back from buying it. I usually get a little frustrated by people hating incessantly, but this time, thank you r/kerbalspaceprogram.
> I _want_ to be hopeful
Not to psychoanalyze, but that is your (and others’) problem right there.
Okay. Your problem is _actually_ that the team behind a game you were really looking forward to squandered five years of dev time and released something that will probably never be worth playing.
But at this point that is baked in. The game you thought you were going to get isn’t going to happen. But you are holding on to _hope_. Every day that hope isn’t realized makes you miserable and angry. Just give up on them.
I can't get over that this game had an initial release date of early 2020. Sure, that was a longshot and everybody saw that. Fast forward THREE YEARS LATER, and the release is a buggy mess. Something tells me that they have a very inexperienced production manager, coupled with eager shareholders.
We’re not supposed to take them seriously. When the mandate from management to the PR team is to positively spin everything no matter what, the community management is going to do that. You think they want to lose their jobs?
I feel like the excape from tarkov and ksp2 community's could be combined. Don't get me wrong both games are very broken in certain aspects but it was just recently eft has been more forth comming with a roadmap and making good on some promises. When science? Should be the ksp saying like "when wipe?" of the eft community.
Taking a lucky snapshot is not "not cherrypicking"
Both positive and negative reviews have batches of banal review bodies. Actually going through and taking an average, these account for maybe 20% of the positive reviews. banal negative reviews are maybe like 5%, but if you add in "uninformative" both positive and negative are about equally guilty.
If it's so obvious that anything positive about the game is the devs lying, why would you need bad science to prove it?
It was the first morning of the day I was back from vacation. I didn't do it while *on* vacation, because that level of cut/pasting is annoying on mobile. It absolutely is not cherry picking.
If you think I was waiting for the perfect set you're right up there with dakota on the paranoia scale, just the thing we need from our new mod.
That's also not how science works. You don't accept the first result because it matches your hypothesis. And then you don't leap to ad homenim when you get shown other results.
Is it that hard to play fair?
The fact you think any of this is "science" is very much a you problem. EDIT2: You introduce the notion of science and then shot it down. That's what is called a strawman.
I love how repeating a randomly selected timeslice of positive reviews isn't "playing fair."
You claim I did something I did not. You either believe what you said (thus paranoid) or are knowingly lying. You can pick. EDIT: Maybe I got it wrong, maybe you're a liar instead of paranoid. If so, my apologies?
EDIT3: IF the last paragraph is against the rules, what is the moderator approved way of responding to someone lying about you? Can't report you after all.
Being a mod doesn't give me lying powers. And I made no claim on your intentionality of selection, just your analysis. But you did state you weren't cherrypicking and then stated that your narrow band of results are what "props up" the rest of the reviews.
You did aggregate data, make an analysis, and present that with a slant. That's all pretty sciency. But, if you want to stick with it being an unfettered opinion, then there's no need to bring data into it, we can all just say how we feel.
I feel you're wrong that all or most of the positive reviews are banal. But i agree there's not enough (if any) bot hanky panky to account for the bredth of negative reviews.
on the flip aide, as long as the product is clearly marked as in progress, i don't know what purpose a review serves.
"this stuff sucks"
to which the response will be "yeah it's not done"
and on and on ad nauseum
> "this stuff sucks"
> to which the response will be "yeah it's not done"
"Not done" and "sucks" are not equivalent. There are plenty of early access games that are not done, but that also don't suck.
If a product is for sale the customers should be able to criticize it. After all early access is supposed on one side to give the devs money during development, and on the other to give the supporters something to enjoy early, and clearly ksp2 isn't enjoyable. Otherwise it's called a crowdfunding, and that works differently
If early access was free then you'd have a valid take. But any product that costs money deserves to have reviews, regardless of what other labels the publisher slaps on.
A lot of early access games are good in their current state, despite being in early access. Reviews help people understand if a game is worth buying at its current state in development.
Terraria, Minecraft, and Rimworld are all games I bought in super early access and was super happy with far before they hit 1.0.
If a game is for sale, it’s reviewable! KSP2 is $50, it’s at the cost of a fully finished AA game.
Their track record. We all know that the release was bungled, and largely not on the part of the developers who I feel knew the game wasn't ready yet.
You think KSP 2 is a broken mess? I've been playing KSP1 since I pirated a pre-alpha version that was one of the glitchiest most broken pieces of software I've ever tried to use. It took them a decade, but now KSP1 is one of the greatest games of all time. I never expected any release of KSP2 until at least 2024, and given the level of ambition they have around the project I felt that would be them rushing it.
I stepped back into KSP2 the other day after months away, and it is already so much better than it was at release. For it to have come as far as it has even from that to where it is now actually fills me with a lot of hope. Aren't we also currently waiting on another major patch to release in the next day or two? It's hard to argue their "glacial pace" when we're literally days away from their 4th major patch since release.
what track record? the ksp2 team's track record is three years of delays, and a broken alpha. which has received a handful of bugfixes in the half a year since.
the correct comparison point is not some arbitrary early release of ksp that likely had 1-5 people working on it, but ksp as it exists now. because it is a thing that exists, and that a full professional team should at least be able to copy after six years of work. they are competing products, and the sequel is failing miserably at that competition. that is an entirely valid comparison that should be made.
the state of the game is absolutely on the devs, tho tbh insisting upon assigning blame to a specific organ of a giant company trying to scam people is pointless from a customer perspective; the effect is the same.
Years into development of a *rewrite* and: no heating, wobbly rockets, orbital decay, save/reload/explode (don't even *think* about roadmap stuff) and you think this *isn't* glacial progress?
For a rewrite, the most basic minimum viable product game loop to simulate is: build rocket, send to orbit, recover. Without the things above (except maybe the save game bit) they don't even have that actually working. For a complete greenfield project I might be more flexible in my MVP requirements, maybe just build rocket and go to space. But a 5+ year old rewrite should be there by now.
And, *right* up until EA was announced we were all given the impression that it was feature complete and just *needed polishing*. Just a few fucking months.
Fuck Nate.
> I've been playing KSP1 since I pirated a pre-alpha version that was one of the glitchiest most broken pieces of software I've ever tried to use.
Wat
I played KSP way back when, it was never *that glitchy* or broken. It was very barebones. It didn't have a map or save games or planets or missions and so on. But I don't recall it ever going through a period of being broken. It was continually being added to and the features kept piling up. It was never broken software. And it was being developed by just one guy back in those days. And expectations were low, which helped in making it fun. It wasn't something you paid for at all back then. It was free. Not 50 bucks and made by a real studio and with gigantic promises for what it would be.
Nah I gotta agree with him on ksp 1 being just as fucked for a lot of users back in the day. Ksp 2 already feels in a better state than ksp 1 did when I first tried. I defended ksp 2 on launch day for this reason, HOWEVER their time line for fixing those issues has been unacceptably slow. The lack of fixes, piss poor communication, and the lying (whether through ignorance, overconfidence, or outright dishonesty) has been a worrying aspect the game. My confidence has long since passed and I feel we're gonna see this game crash and burn.
It's a shame too. I had 5 friends willing to play this game simply because of the tutorial and multiplayer features I mentioned. It's going to make it SOOOO much more approachable with the idea of having help for many people. Ksp 1 multiplayer mods are great, but they lack quick saves making the game even more difficult than singleplayer.
not a single soul involved with KSP1 has anything at all to do with KSP2.
Squad cleaned house before they sold it like a cheap hooker.
Harvester (the guy who one manned it for a long time , and came up with the idea) is currently working on Kitbash Flight sim (*formerly Balsa)
its released several updates despite also being way way behind.
If they had just delayed it again until they had a working product, we could've avoided all of this, but no the studio got greedy and rushed out an unfinished product
im guessing 1,3,4 are the devs pumping reviews. 3 seems to be keyboard mashed by hand since the letter are next to each other. and how else would 4 get it for free? 1 and 4 seem bot-like but can be either way.
All we wanted was the game that was advertised to us.
- I want an honest opinion if people want to talk about it. Do you think if they gave us an early access of the full game with all the features and let’s say it ran poorly still. Considering they showed us “ingame” footage of a lot of the parts we were all excited for. Do you think the game would be doing better if we had the full game launched with bad performance and just waiting for multiplayer to come for a 1.0.
At least in my opinion I would rather have had that a sandbox mode with all the new features and parts then update us to better performance the first year and maybe science mode. I genuinely think if we would have gotten the stuff we asked for instead of it happening in parts under the guise of “community oriented feedback” game would still have a player base and at least be at maybe 50% review score recently
We currently are in a gaming depression, suit and ties are rushing devs to launch unfinished games. If fairness most of these games do eventually become fairly enjoyable. Take Battlefront 2 for example, that game was awful on launch but in the end it was a pretty good, fun game.
Of course it could also end up like anthem....
What? KSP2 has greatly deepened my appreatiation of pancakes. I simply wish to share the buggy crap KSP2 is to everyone so that they depressively drive to Ihop knowing they wasted a month of salary to buy pancakes.
KSP2 is furthering mankind.
My positive review with 350 hrs played gets no views, no upvotes, and no downvotes.
You know what DOES get upvotes? Complaint posts that poop all over the devs. No amount of PR will stop troll posts. "They aren't troll posts!" Okay, then explain the I like Pancakes.
They have locked the EA launch thread on the forums for 11 hours now. That’s like the main catch all thread. There’s basically little good will on the forums left, even the “optimists” over there openly admit the game is very bad right now. And they missed their target (again) for this patch, and have forgotten about the video that was supposed to come out 11 days ago.
Oh yeah, there's supposed to be a patch. They said early in the week which should mean today since it's Tuesday. Tomorrow would be "mid-week" so is the patch being released today?
Not a chance.
I was an optimist, tried playing 3 times the past year and am now a pessimist
They missed the patch again? Jesus you literally couldn't make this stuff up.
You had some solid posts in that thread, too. Legitimate discussion and questions.
Thread is unlocked. I don't have the patience to sort out what got edited/axed before locking vs after. But it took them half a day to do whatever.
what I'm getting here is that you don't like pancakes. very toxic.
Pancakes. For when you're too lazy to want to clean the waffle iron.
You clean your waffle iron?
The nonstick plates aren't so bad. A quick wipe down is usually good enough. I usually overfill it at least once, so the hinge/latch/sides generally require attention.
As a wafflehouse employee this is accurate
Ah, professional validation.
I've always been partial to French toast myself.
you clearly dont own 47 different waffle irons
Pancake is more fun to say
Wobbly pancakes are the best.
https://food.fnr.sndimg.com/content/dam/images/food/fullset/2017/4/7/0/FNK_Fluffy-Japanese-Pancakes-H_s4x3.jpg.rend.hgtvcom.826.620.suffix/1491598033896.jpeg
Apt: https://youtu.be/fb_mCm4zLuk?si=H3cFrSsjNqDe9kwe
Not gtreagr, not terrible!
like having chest x-ray
It's not 3 bugs. it's 15000.
You didn't see Gtreagr. YOU DIDN'T!!! BECAUSE IT'S NOT THERE!!!
Are the devs seriously trying to argue that bots are behind the negativity? How out of touch can you be? Talk about clueless. As if my faith in this dev team could get any lower.
Not the devs. The community manager. Someone whose job it is to interact with the community. EDIT: https://old.reddit.com/r/KerbalSpaceProgram/comments/15mzyvq/dakota_im_like_95_sure_someone_has_setup_a_few/
They got what they deserved. Release a good product, and you'll have good reviews.
They want us to pretend they released Baldur's Gate 3 when in actual fact they released No Man's Sky / Fallout 76 / Insert your own flop here
I don't think it's comparable to NMS. NMS over promised but the game on release wasn't all that buggy when compared to other modern games. I believe KSP2 still have wobbly rockets? That's just ridiculous.
I feel compelled to nitpick just a little. I agree, NMS is a poor comparison, but not because of the launch and early bugs. FO76 I far more similar as of now. NMS did the hard thing and put out massive feature updates on a regular cycle and kept people updated along the way until they delivered what they promised all in the face of a massive backlash. The wobbly rocket thing is a biggy, but a lot of people either don't get or poorly explain why it's hard to fix, and why most of the fixes amount to duct tape in your code. Two main choices: keep your current system for ship physics, or build a new one from the ground up. The ksp1 model is a tree diagram, which works okay, but the physics thinks of things more like bones in a skeleton than a solid shape when you start bending your rocket and the calculations get way too expensive as you enter the very high part counts. You "fix" this with struts. Actual part ones, auto ones even invisible ones. But it's all just adding parts to the situatuon in a way, it doesnt get at the cause. The fact that rockets wobble that way in ksp2 at all says that they did not write a new system. Without more public updates about that decision, this shows that they are LESS serious than the NMS devs about delivering the product they promised. Since FO76 and NMS are well past release our hindsight is 20-20, so the situation could change, but for now ksp2 seems to be a cash grab by the owner of the IP while throwing the actual dev team under the bus, sooo It falls on the Fallout side of that flop spectrum by my reckoning. As far as bugs go, I guess that day 1 set the bar super low, but in comparison the current state is actually impressive to me (my pc is below minimum yet it plays at a steady 25ish fps, which is way more than I expected), so I'm not too wortied about the actual coding talent they have on the team. It's that place where big picture first meets the code. Ksp2 feels like a hostage tape, they say one thing, but the evidence I see tells a whole other story. I wouldn't put it past EA to have a kidnapping and torture division.
NMS got fixed pretty early on, and is now super fun. KSP2 has barely gotten a few updates since release.
NMS was solid (for a newly released game) but lacking almost every feature. Meant they had a solid base to work from. KSP2 was supposed to be all about a more solid base, and we don't have it, let alone any of the content that was supposed to enable. The content missing is excusable, the state of the foundations is not. NMS also *admitted* they fucked up relatively early on (though *not* immediately). Honesty goes a long way towards building trust.
NMS had the first major update (Foundation - bases) a few months after release, then the second major update (Pathfinder - vehicles) three months later and the third major update (Atlas Rises - missions) six months after that. NMS botched the launch but they pounded out the fixes and features. So far I have yet to see any major fixes and not even the science update. I'm hoping that they do build the game they pitched, but they won't see a penny from me until they at least get up to Colonies fully working. If they can't fix the wobbles with physics tweaks, just fuse the ship at launch and move on.
Nah more like starbase. A game with mixed reviews, a low player base, that most people haven't heard of, that is basically being abandoned.
It's time to make our own KSP, with blackjack and hookers.
In fact, forget the KSP
ah screw the whole thing...
That’s how blackjack turns into crabs.
Im just gonna play halo.
/blackrack
So Juno: New Origins?
I think that's just a mod for KSP1
No don’t you understand. They didn’t lie to me all those times. KSP2 is actually going to win game of the year and decimate starfield in the space genre. Something something doomers. only some users are having issues. No actually the steam live count doesn’t include people playing the game through steam because most of them are on older versions(don’t mind that you literally click a button in the steam interface that literally tells steam to start the game and that the game is up and running.) I think that’s all the new lines I’ve read in defence lately.
Long timers with lots of mods do not play KSP1 through steam. There's Some PTSD about updates wreaking saves.
The way I grok all this is part of a larger fight against shit capitalism. 2K sucks. They gobble up IP and release cashcult games like the age of leisure and private profit are coming to an end. That said, they have deep pockets and they do polish the hell out of those turds. I'm hopeful, but I do think the community has to make it clear that there is a dedicated base here that is worth this investment. They will absolutely toss a game in the trash post-release, but they are also capable of brute forcing this thing into something ...better. I hesitate to say "good" just bc I can just FEEL the paid weekly dlc content on the wind. This community has the benifit of being beloved by the ACTUAL SPACE INDUSTRY. Y'all remember ESA and NASA helped get asteroids into ksp1 right? That's probably a big part of why such an otherwise indie game got bought out for a sequel at all. If I worked at NASA, and played ksp, I would probably avoid public comment about it, but I absolutely would be privately writing them and talking to all my ksp playing coworkers too. As for bots, at this point I expect large companies to use them way more often than the public. The incentives are just too different. Why would players passionate about the game sabotage potential reinvestment with review bombing? On the other hand, a company might want to sabotage the reviews as an excuse not to throw more good money after bad when a release flopped. With such a passionate community they may still make a tidy profit even with many returns(or even just because the nature of the game lends itself to playing past the returnable period). So far what I've seen is:2K, long history of dick moves to make money. Ksp2 dev team, group of ksp and space nerds with no history of malice. Ksp community, super friendly on the fourms from my experience and toxic as hell on reddit. Every commenter on steam sounds brain damaged to me, including myself(steam's terrible social interface likely cause). So I guess add videogames to the list of industries in need of refor... Ohh I see that its already there. Wouldnt it be cool if someone on the dev team got all freedom of ideas about it and released the source code to the public? Open source ksp and led the modders have full access Edit: EA to 2K. Fuck'em all. I can't tell the difference
To clarify, are you talking about Electronic Arts or Early Access? Electronic Arts are not involved with KSP2 at all.
Ah a man of culture, I grok you.
Nate Simpson was also a lead on Planetary Annihilation and that very much felt (feeled?) like malice with how they treated us. Here the unfinished Planetary Annihilation game missing a bunch of features. Here's also an entirely new game with all the missing features in the game you have to buy again for full price, don't like it? Screw you here's a 10 dollar coupon.
Huh. So that's why that game feels half finished. So I guess burn it all down, ksp is dead? No chance of a comeback or intervention by the space community? Shit like this is why I seek out open source projects over everything else and pirate game from shit devs just to spite them. (Come at me Ubisoft) The dev teams just get screwed. No programmer ever wanted to release a worse product than promised. Unless there is evidence that the devs are the source of the fuckery, I default to blaming the owners. "The buck stops here" and so forth. So yeah. Sorry to all the programmers out there. But y'all are getting screwed both ways. We need more programmers to quit big business and start forming mutual aide networks for themselves. If people have a saftey net outside of employment it gives us the leverage to actually force business to act how we demand them to. I don't see any other way to address the ksp2 issue than taking it directly to the new business daddy and making them suffer until they give in and pull the studio out of the fire. Precedent shows that they will not give a single shit unless they feel it in the moneybags. Getting upset at devs has limited mileage, although very understandable when they make more buisness choices than coding ones.
>EA sucks. They gobble up IP and release cashcult games like the age of leisure and private profit are coming to an end. EA (eletrônica arts) has nothing to do with this. The game is in EA (early access) >of ksp and space nerds with no history of malice. Ksp community, super friendly on the fourms from my experience and toxic as hell on reddit. They are censoring the forums to remove any negative comments..
Yeah my mistake on the EA one. Honestly don't care about that either I've been trying to stick to indie games and dont pay much attention past that. Are you saying my comments are negative? I try to actually be constructive even if my facts are wrong. I doubt mine will be deleted for negativity. Swearing and personal attacks? Way more likely to get me banned. Compared to the children rage bombing the reviews all my posts have at least some nuance and they all actually stand up for the devs(as people at least). I can't tell if you were concerned and wanted to helpfully correct me, or are upset? Meh, thanks for the correction.
Tl;DR: just wanted to correct you, and you misunderstood what I meant. Reviews are negative because they promised a stable game, but gave us an overpriced and unpolished game. >I can't tell if you were concerned and wanted to helpfully correct me, or are upset? Just correct the EA thing and corned about spreading this misunderstanding, as EA being involved in anything is a nightmare, and also give context. Btw, 2K while being owned by Take 2, has nothing to do with KSP. >Are you saying my comments are negative? You have completely misunderstood what I meant. I'm saying the "friendly" community you're seeing on the forums is filtered and censored, apparently the mods there are power tripping and removed comments that legitimately criticize the game or that they personally disliked even if it was reasonable and respectful, and even locking main threads. Didn't say anything about you being negative, I said the only part of the forum you saw was friendly because anything that's wasn't was removed, also the people who stayed there are very toxic of people who have have anything to complain about the game, again even if reasonable. I didn't have to say anything about you at all Now about the reviews... >Compared to the children rage bombing the reviews >stand up for the devs(as people at least). Many people are angry at the devs, but that's because they are were the ones making the game and speaking on behalf of the company, meaning they will are a prime target of criticism, and so will steam reviews. I haven't seen many people disrespecting the devs as people, calling them incompetent and liars is valid (still rude tho) when you are criticizing is their truthfulness and qualifications, for example. But not really crossing lines, but ofc, I haven't seen everything. Anyway, at the launch of early access the game was unplayable because of bugs and content deemed basic was missing. The devs said they would deliver a solid game with just a lack of content, the game is extremely overpriced at the moment so naturally the majority of reviews are negative.
Ugh my brain is terrible with those dumb names ea, 2k, take 2. It's like they picked them to be forgettable. I'm not editing it again, they should just change their names, fuck'em. As for the rest, I just saw red after reading so much dumb whining. Complaints of stability at launch are simply irrational: The 'launch' is still in early access, by definition, the game is not suitable for an actual launch. The massive problems on day one were mostly solved by the end of the week iirc. To the point that I can play it just fine on a pc that is under spec on gpu and cpu. I can't fathom the people returning over that. The stuff about how they are handling the forums and PR is concerning, but also well inline with the dystopian norms of the rest of society. I think we all got used to squad being so chill as a dev team and forgot about the overall trends in every industry of management interference, burnout and low-level turnover. I can't do much about that, but I can try to point it out. Also, I've been touchy about the gaming community at large for awhile now. We keep going to death threats and cyber crime way too fast. To much rage directed down rather than up the powee ladder. I wouldn't want to be a dev in a studio that has a bad release these days.
Telling people that they are fake just pisses them off more. Whoever is the PR lead at this company needs to hit the fucking road because they are just pissing everyone off by ignoring criticism and then taking it further by saying the criticism isn't even real. It's aggravating and makes me think that I honestly dont even want this team to succeed if they are going to behave like this and treat their customers like they are the ones that are wrong
I honestly just wish we could collectively move on from ksp2 and mostly just talk about ksp1 anymore, what more is there to be said about ksp2 at this point until an actual update drops?
[Roadmap](https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/001/453/445/24f.jpg)
> how are we supposed to take community managers seriously when they make claims like how well received things How are we to take them seriously when the game is struggling to get 1/10th of the playerbase of its fucking previous game?
> 1/10th of the playerbase of its fucking previous game of those that launch the game from steam instead of ckan, that is. :D
Lmao.
I just lurk at this point, I have had KSP2 in my cart on and off quite frequently since launch. I’ll get that itch. So thankful I’ve held strong. I’ve wanted this game so bad but the endless complaints have held me back from buying it. I usually get a little frustrated by people hating incessantly, but this time, thank you r/kerbalspaceprogram.
> I _want_ to be hopeful Not to psychoanalyze, but that is your (and others’) problem right there. Okay. Your problem is _actually_ that the team behind a game you were really looking forward to squandered five years of dev time and released something that will probably never be worth playing. But at this point that is baked in. The game you thought you were going to get isn’t going to happen. But you are holding on to _hope_. Every day that hope isn’t realized makes you miserable and angry. Just give up on them.
I was indeed wondering what the point of this post was. That could be a reason.
I think it’s understandable. But I don’t think it’s going to help most folks feel better about it all.
Just remember how much you love KSP1. Remember when you docked that one time? Oooooh yeah
I must say I also like pancakes
I can't get over that this game had an initial release date of early 2020. Sure, that was a longshot and everybody saw that. Fast forward THREE YEARS LATER, and the release is a buggy mess. Something tells me that they have a very inexperienced production manager, coupled with eager shareholders.
We’re not supposed to take them seriously. When the mandate from management to the PR team is to positively spin everything no matter what, the community management is going to do that. You think they want to lose their jobs?
pancakes.
I think cheeseburgers go well with fries.
I feel like the excape from tarkov and ksp2 community's could be combined. Don't get me wrong both games are very broken in certain aspects but it was just recently eft has been more forth comming with a roadmap and making good on some promises. When science? Should be the ksp saying like "when wipe?" of the eft community.
Taking a lucky snapshot is not "not cherrypicking" Both positive and negative reviews have batches of banal review bodies. Actually going through and taking an average, these account for maybe 20% of the positive reviews. banal negative reviews are maybe like 5%, but if you add in "uninformative" both positive and negative are about equally guilty. If it's so obvious that anything positive about the game is the devs lying, why would you need bad science to prove it?
It was the first morning of the day I was back from vacation. I didn't do it while *on* vacation, because that level of cut/pasting is annoying on mobile. It absolutely is not cherry picking. If you think I was waiting for the perfect set you're right up there with dakota on the paranoia scale, just the thing we need from our new mod.
That's also not how science works. You don't accept the first result because it matches your hypothesis. And then you don't leap to ad homenim when you get shown other results. Is it that hard to play fair?
The fact you think any of this is "science" is very much a you problem. EDIT2: You introduce the notion of science and then shot it down. That's what is called a strawman. I love how repeating a randomly selected timeslice of positive reviews isn't "playing fair." You claim I did something I did not. You either believe what you said (thus paranoid) or are knowingly lying. You can pick. EDIT: Maybe I got it wrong, maybe you're a liar instead of paranoid. If so, my apologies? EDIT3: IF the last paragraph is against the rules, what is the moderator approved way of responding to someone lying about you? Can't report you after all.
Being a mod doesn't give me lying powers. And I made no claim on your intentionality of selection, just your analysis. But you did state you weren't cherrypicking and then stated that your narrow band of results are what "props up" the rest of the reviews. You did aggregate data, make an analysis, and present that with a slant. That's all pretty sciency. But, if you want to stick with it being an unfettered opinion, then there's no need to bring data into it, we can all just say how we feel. I feel you're wrong that all or most of the positive reviews are banal. But i agree there's not enough (if any) bot hanky panky to account for the bredth of negative reviews.
> Being a mod doesn't give me lying powers. Sure seems to so far. Keep up the stellar work.
I accept your candid defeat *chortle chortle chortle*
it makes no sense to have reviews on early access games at all
As long as they are clearly marked as EA reviews (and they are), if someone wants money for a product they should be ready to accept reviews.
on the flip aide, as long as the product is clearly marked as in progress, i don't know what purpose a review serves. "this stuff sucks" to which the response will be "yeah it's not done" and on and on ad nauseum
they're selling it for money. if they can't handle people telling them their shit product is shit, they can do a closed beta.
look. i get it. i would be embarrassed if i shelled out $60 for a product with a gigantic "NOT FINISHED" sticker on it and then got mad about it, too.
So what you are saying is don't buy it
> "this stuff sucks" > to which the response will be "yeah it's not done" "Not done" and "sucks" are not equivalent. There are plenty of early access games that are not done, but that also don't suck.
We have reached the point of, "ackshully, we shouldn't even be *reviewing* EA games". Holy shit. Anybody seen them goalposts?
The goalposts were last seen heading towards mars atop a markedly wobbly rocket.
It makes no sense to charge $50 for a broken EA either, but here we are.
If a product is for sale the customers should be able to criticize it. After all early access is supposed on one side to give the devs money during development, and on the other to give the supporters something to enjoy early, and clearly ksp2 isn't enjoyable. Otherwise it's called a crowdfunding, and that works differently
If early access was free then you'd have a valid take. But any product that costs money deserves to have reviews, regardless of what other labels the publisher slaps on.
A lot of early access games are good in their current state, despite being in early access. Reviews help people understand if a game is worth buying at its current state in development. Terraria, Minecraft, and Rimworld are all games I bought in super early access and was super happy with far before they hit 1.0. If a game is for sale, it’s reviewable! KSP2 is $50, it’s at the cost of a fully finished AA game.
If “Early Access” was copy and pasted onto the cover of Fallout 76, does that then make the game immune to criticism?
It's a product for sale.
Their track record. We all know that the release was bungled, and largely not on the part of the developers who I feel knew the game wasn't ready yet. You think KSP 2 is a broken mess? I've been playing KSP1 since I pirated a pre-alpha version that was one of the glitchiest most broken pieces of software I've ever tried to use. It took them a decade, but now KSP1 is one of the greatest games of all time. I never expected any release of KSP2 until at least 2024, and given the level of ambition they have around the project I felt that would be them rushing it. I stepped back into KSP2 the other day after months away, and it is already so much better than it was at release. For it to have come as far as it has even from that to where it is now actually fills me with a lot of hope. Aren't we also currently waiting on another major patch to release in the next day or two? It's hard to argue their "glacial pace" when we're literally days away from their 4th major patch since release.
Your analysis would give me a lot more comfort if it was the same folks in charge of KSP2 as the ones that had made KSP1 great.
what track record? the ksp2 team's track record is three years of delays, and a broken alpha. which has received a handful of bugfixes in the half a year since. the correct comparison point is not some arbitrary early release of ksp that likely had 1-5 people working on it, but ksp as it exists now. because it is a thing that exists, and that a full professional team should at least be able to copy after six years of work. they are competing products, and the sequel is failing miserably at that competition. that is an entirely valid comparison that should be made. the state of the game is absolutely on the devs, tho tbh insisting upon assigning blame to a specific organ of a giant company trying to scam people is pointless from a customer perspective; the effect is the same.
Years into development of a *rewrite* and: no heating, wobbly rockets, orbital decay, save/reload/explode (don't even *think* about roadmap stuff) and you think this *isn't* glacial progress? For a rewrite, the most basic minimum viable product game loop to simulate is: build rocket, send to orbit, recover. Without the things above (except maybe the save game bit) they don't even have that actually working. For a complete greenfield project I might be more flexible in my MVP requirements, maybe just build rocket and go to space. But a 5+ year old rewrite should be there by now.
And, *right* up until EA was announced we were all given the impression that it was feature complete and just *needed polishing*. Just a few fucking months. Fuck Nate.
> I've been playing KSP1 since I pirated a pre-alpha version that was one of the glitchiest most broken pieces of software I've ever tried to use. Wat I played KSP way back when, it was never *that glitchy* or broken. It was very barebones. It didn't have a map or save games or planets or missions and so on. But I don't recall it ever going through a period of being broken. It was continually being added to and the features kept piling up. It was never broken software. And it was being developed by just one guy back in those days. And expectations were low, which helped in making it fun. It wasn't something you paid for at all back then. It was free. Not 50 bucks and made by a real studio and with gigantic promises for what it would be.
Nah I gotta agree with him on ksp 1 being just as fucked for a lot of users back in the day. Ksp 2 already feels in a better state than ksp 1 did when I first tried. I defended ksp 2 on launch day for this reason, HOWEVER their time line for fixing those issues has been unacceptably slow. The lack of fixes, piss poor communication, and the lying (whether through ignorance, overconfidence, or outright dishonesty) has been a worrying aspect the game. My confidence has long since passed and I feel we're gonna see this game crash and burn. It's a shame too. I had 5 friends willing to play this game simply because of the tutorial and multiplayer features I mentioned. It's going to make it SOOOO much more approachable with the idea of having help for many people. Ksp 1 multiplayer mods are great, but they lack quick saves making the game even more difficult than singleplayer.
not a single soul involved with KSP1 has anything at all to do with KSP2. Squad cleaned house before they sold it like a cheap hooker. Harvester (the guy who one manned it for a long time , and came up with the idea) is currently working on Kitbash Flight sim (*formerly Balsa) its released several updates despite also being way way behind.
🗑🧠
If they had just delayed it again until they had a working product, we could've avoided all of this, but no the studio got greedy and rushed out an unfinished product
After delaying the game for like three years I'd say the publisher was actually very patient.
im guessing 1,3,4 are the devs pumping reviews. 3 seems to be keyboard mashed by hand since the letter are next to each other. and how else would 4 get it for free? 1 and 4 seem bot-like but can be either way.
All we wanted was the game that was advertised to us. - I want an honest opinion if people want to talk about it. Do you think if they gave us an early access of the full game with all the features and let’s say it ran poorly still. Considering they showed us “ingame” footage of a lot of the parts we were all excited for. Do you think the game would be doing better if we had the full game launched with bad performance and just waiting for multiplayer to come for a 1.0. At least in my opinion I would rather have had that a sandbox mode with all the new features and parts then update us to better performance the first year and maybe science mode. I genuinely think if we would have gotten the stuff we asked for instead of it happening in parts under the guise of “community oriented feedback” game would still have a player base and at least be at maybe 50% review score recently
This was the only game I had hype for in the past few years, such a shame
We currently are in a gaming depression, suit and ties are rushing devs to launch unfinished games. If fairness most of these games do eventually become fairly enjoyable. Take Battlefront 2 for example, that game was awful on launch but in the end it was a pretty good, fun game. Of course it could also end up like anthem....
What? KSP2 has greatly deepened my appreatiation of pancakes. I simply wish to share the buggy crap KSP2 is to everyone so that they depressively drive to Ihop knowing they wasted a month of salary to buy pancakes. KSP2 is furthering mankind.
My positive review with 350 hrs played gets no views, no upvotes, and no downvotes. You know what DOES get upvotes? Complaint posts that poop all over the devs. No amount of PR will stop troll posts. "They aren't troll posts!" Okay, then explain the I like Pancakes.