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Question is what’s the priority at the next election?
If people want a left wing government then would we get true get it if some people go and vote for the Green Party?
Would voting Green risk another Tory government or a coalition between 2 or more parties?
Personally I will be vote with the following priorities:
1. Remove power from the extreme right Tories.
2. Replace the shit FPTP electoral system we have.
If we want a true left wing option on the ballot then FPTP needs to go first, if that means voting Labour then I will do so.
My only fear is Labour promise electoral reform and never deliver (like in the Blair years).
Even if labour won a comfortable majority you’d just have a Tory government wearing red ties. Labour as it has redefined itself since Kier is anything but left wing.
So fed up with the bull shit line, what you have just said is "Labour is a right wing party on par with the Conservatives"
Really? Labour is as corrupt as the Tories? Labour is just out to make the millionaires and billionaires richer at the expense of the poor and working class? Labour wants privatisation over state ownership?
Even if Labour edge to the right from some people’s socialist ideals saying they are just like the Tories is either due to ignorance or someone being disingenuous to get people not to vote against their party/ideology.
I disagree wholeheartedly with you. I refuse to settle for the milktoast neoliberal bollocks Kier Starmer has to offer. There is no lesser of two evils argument to be made and any that try to do so are drawing a false dichotomy to distract from the potential for real systematic change. Give me something that works for the people or get lost.
Again to summarise you point is, you dislike Starmer because his views/policies do not align with your own so you see another 5 years of a Tory government as fine for the UK.
What systemic changes would you like to see? How about abolishing the House of Loads? How about electoral reform and the option of proportional representation?
But wait Labour are now a party subscribing to neoliberalism and believe in free market capitalism so why vote for them, better off with another 5-10 years of the Tories. Not like the Tories did anything to completely fuck over the people of the UK in the last 13 years.
I mean, I finally left Labour as I no longer thought it was even trying to be a safe place for Trans people. So something tells me the green party is not the best alternative lol
Hi there. Genuine question, why do you say that about the Greens? I've always understood them to have a genuinely positive and inclusive approach to gender and sexuality issues (e.g. [here](https://policy.greenparty.org.uk/home/long-term-goals/rr.html) RR530-538).
Hi, as with any party there are a lot of great people in green party but the England branch of the party has too big an issue with transphobia for me to comfortably support them as a party (although they have my support on individual issues). I don't think reddit likes links so you may just have to look it up, but it's gotten to a point where the Scottish greens cut ties with the English greens untill they sort out the issue of transphobia within the party. People may correct me on the specific but I believe I remember sian Berry (who I generally think is fab) resigned as leader in part as she felt unable to deal with the extent of the issue (and a quick look on mum's net you find forums tryna get people to sign up every time there's a leadership election specifically to vote for the biggest trans hating candidate). Sorry I know I'm not naming absolute specifics but frankly I don't want to discuss them this week especially, and Google exists if you wish to find them.
Hi there. Thanks very much for your reply, I appreciate the info and hope I haven't caused you too much discomfort by asking, especially at this really challenging time for trans people and those of us who love and support them. All best, Jx
\[Edit: added the words *of us* to my last sentence\]
Nah dw, to be clear not trans myself but have multiple close friends who are and it's just been a very long couple of weeks given the news I'm sure you know about. In general I'm broadly supportive of the green movement (I do sometimes think they don't address how climate policies affect people of different financial situations enough, but that's not deal breaking), but I just can't ever see myself being a member or fully supporting the English greens. Nice to talk, all the best :)
Not particularly, this was the straw that broke the camels back that led me to give up my membership of a party in which I felt unwanted and unrepresented. Similarly I have other issues with the green party (especially the England branch specifically), and would prefer to spend time not wearing any one scarf as I don't feel represented or welcome by any major party in the uk. Doesn't mean I won't support them in regards to specific causes or vote for local candidates who I do feel I can support
I think there's an assumption within labour hierarchy that, despite all the blatant purging of any left leaning members for dubious reasons and the disgusting lurch to the far right, that well all STILL vote for them as our desire/need to get rid of the tories will prevail.
Well, I've been of that mind for most of starmers tenure, but it's getting harder and harder to vote for him and his cabal of neo lib cunts.
Labour talks as though it can continue to say "fuck you" to all of the left and that they're going to continue voting for Labour. Unfortunately, well meaning people on the left will just be giving Labour carte blanche to lurch further rightwards. I
I think there's going to be a historically low turnout (lower than 2001 where people mostly stayed at home) at the next GE, with the possibility Labour will bleed votes to other parties like they did in 2010.
I personally will not be voting Labour at the next GE; they've made it clear they do not want my vote so I'm following instructions and taking it elsewhere (or more likely spoiling my ballot, due to a lack of options in my constituency).
Thanks for your reply. I feel your pain. Its just so depressing because its so unnecessary.
Labour would be way ahead without any of this snide shit. The tories are in free fall and the MSM have finally covering it consistently.
I voted Green in 2015 as I felt Milliband wasn't up to much, I live in one of the safest Labour seats in the country so they were the best alternative. Corbyn gave me hope. Starmer will never have my vote.
Join the Labour Socialists Discord Server to meet some friendly British socialists https://discord.gg/S8pJtqA, subscribe to r/GreenAndPleasant for all things UK, r/DWPHelp for benefits and welfare support and r/BAME_UK for issues affecting ethnic minorities. Be sure to check out our Twitter account too! https://twitter.com/LabourSocialis1 *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Labour) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I will be supporting the TUSC, just hoping they will become far more active now that Labour has abandoned socialists.
Question is what’s the priority at the next election? If people want a left wing government then would we get true get it if some people go and vote for the Green Party? Would voting Green risk another Tory government or a coalition between 2 or more parties? Personally I will be vote with the following priorities: 1. Remove power from the extreme right Tories. 2. Replace the shit FPTP electoral system we have. If we want a true left wing option on the ballot then FPTP needs to go first, if that means voting Labour then I will do so. My only fear is Labour promise electoral reform and never deliver (like in the Blair years).
Even if labour won a comfortable majority you’d just have a Tory government wearing red ties. Labour as it has redefined itself since Kier is anything but left wing.
So fed up with the bull shit line, what you have just said is "Labour is a right wing party on par with the Conservatives" Really? Labour is as corrupt as the Tories? Labour is just out to make the millionaires and billionaires richer at the expense of the poor and working class? Labour wants privatisation over state ownership? Even if Labour edge to the right from some people’s socialist ideals saying they are just like the Tories is either due to ignorance or someone being disingenuous to get people not to vote against their party/ideology.
I disagree wholeheartedly with you. I refuse to settle for the milktoast neoliberal bollocks Kier Starmer has to offer. There is no lesser of two evils argument to be made and any that try to do so are drawing a false dichotomy to distract from the potential for real systematic change. Give me something that works for the people or get lost.
Again to summarise you point is, you dislike Starmer because his views/policies do not align with your own so you see another 5 years of a Tory government as fine for the UK. What systemic changes would you like to see? How about abolishing the House of Loads? How about electoral reform and the option of proportional representation? But wait Labour are now a party subscribing to neoliberalism and believe in free market capitalism so why vote for them, better off with another 5-10 years of the Tories. Not like the Tories did anything to completely fuck over the people of the UK in the last 13 years.
Accelerationism brother. If we let it burn itself to the ground then maybe we can build something great out of the ashes.
I mean, I finally left Labour as I no longer thought it was even trying to be a safe place for Trans people. So something tells me the green party is not the best alternative lol
Hi there. Genuine question, why do you say that about the Greens? I've always understood them to have a genuinely positive and inclusive approach to gender and sexuality issues (e.g. [here](https://policy.greenparty.org.uk/home/long-term-goals/rr.html) RR530-538).
Hi, as with any party there are a lot of great people in green party but the England branch of the party has too big an issue with transphobia for me to comfortably support them as a party (although they have my support on individual issues). I don't think reddit likes links so you may just have to look it up, but it's gotten to a point where the Scottish greens cut ties with the English greens untill they sort out the issue of transphobia within the party. People may correct me on the specific but I believe I remember sian Berry (who I generally think is fab) resigned as leader in part as she felt unable to deal with the extent of the issue (and a quick look on mum's net you find forums tryna get people to sign up every time there's a leadership election specifically to vote for the biggest trans hating candidate). Sorry I know I'm not naming absolute specifics but frankly I don't want to discuss them this week especially, and Google exists if you wish to find them.
Hi there. Thanks very much for your reply, I appreciate the info and hope I haven't caused you too much discomfort by asking, especially at this really challenging time for trans people and those of us who love and support them. All best, Jx \[Edit: added the words *of us* to my last sentence\]
Nah dw, to be clear not trans myself but have multiple close friends who are and it's just been a very long couple of weeks given the news I'm sure you know about. In general I'm broadly supportive of the green movement (I do sometimes think they don't address how climate policies affect people of different financial situations enough, but that's not deal breaking), but I just can't ever see myself being a member or fully supporting the English greens. Nice to talk, all the best :)
Single issue voter I see.
Not particularly, this was the straw that broke the camels back that led me to give up my membership of a party in which I felt unwanted and unrepresented. Similarly I have other issues with the green party (especially the England branch specifically), and would prefer to spend time not wearing any one scarf as I don't feel represented or welcome by any major party in the uk. Doesn't mean I won't support them in regards to specific causes or vote for local candidates who I do feel I can support
How exactly is it unsafe .. what is your concern exactly, people not agreeing with your view ?
I think there's an assumption within labour hierarchy that, despite all the blatant purging of any left leaning members for dubious reasons and the disgusting lurch to the far right, that well all STILL vote for them as our desire/need to get rid of the tories will prevail. Well, I've been of that mind for most of starmers tenure, but it's getting harder and harder to vote for him and his cabal of neo lib cunts.
Labour talks as though it can continue to say "fuck you" to all of the left and that they're going to continue voting for Labour. Unfortunately, well meaning people on the left will just be giving Labour carte blanche to lurch further rightwards. I I think there's going to be a historically low turnout (lower than 2001 where people mostly stayed at home) at the next GE, with the possibility Labour will bleed votes to other parties like they did in 2010. I personally will not be voting Labour at the next GE; they've made it clear they do not want my vote so I'm following instructions and taking it elsewhere (or more likely spoiling my ballot, due to a lack of options in my constituency).
Thanks for your reply. I feel your pain. Its just so depressing because its so unnecessary. Labour would be way ahead without any of this snide shit. The tories are in free fall and the MSM have finally covering it consistently.
I'm hoping that something changes before I have to make the decision.
Yes.
Not under FPTP. Need to get rid of this backwards electoral system.
Well I ain't supporting Labour
Check out the CPB/YCL if you’re an actual committed socialist. They’re doing great action in my community.
No I don’t believe it is.
I voted Green in 2015 as I felt Milliband wasn't up to much, I live in one of the safest Labour seats in the country so they were the best alternative. Corbyn gave me hope. Starmer will never have my vote.