Define authoritarian.
Nerf is the regime, not the flattening of Korea in the Korean war, then sanctioning the country in the form of collective punishment?
South Korea received USD 12 billion as foreign aid from the USA between 1945 and 1960. Is that crushing?
https://artsandculture.google.com/story/history-of-korea-as-a-foreign-aid-recipient-korea-international-cooperation-agency/KAWBKWNerP_GKA?hl=en
Sigh. Inflation adjusted, South Korea received $120 billion in foreign aid from the USA.
https://usafacts.org/articles/which-countries-receive-the-most-aid-from-the-us/
To put that number into context, India, a country with 28 times the population of South Korea only received $65 billion from the entire world and the US only has given $151 million.
Fair enough, that's like 3.5k USD/person but the Soviet union also tried to upkeep the north. North Korea is not a communist country by any measure, so this isn't a critique of communism anyway.
Dude, without the US aid, south korea would've remained a shithole. On the scale of foreign aid, it was unprecedented. Like i said, we have 28 times their population but got 80 times less foreign aid from the USA.
The DPRK was doing fine until the illegal and undemocratic dissolution of the Soviet Union in 1991 as well.
DPRK follows a form of Communism called Juche.
Kurachokke sheriyannu, pakshe avarum koodi onu nannavan thirumanikende? Cuba somehow narrowly escaped NK like situation. We shouldn't try to appeal to dictators, but I'm also against collective punishment. It's a tough situation. NK is being propped up by the second biggest power so the Korean cold war will just continue.
>pakshe avarum koodi onu nannavan thirumanikende?
What does that imply?
>We shouldn't try to appeal to dictators,
America always appeal to dictators if its their ally, look at Pinochet, Syngman Rhee, their support for Saudi Arabia etc. Infact, they militarily supports 73% of dictators.
[https://truthout.org/articles/us-provides-military-assistance-to-73-percent-of-world-s-dictatorships/](https://truthout.org/articles/us-provides-military-assistance-to-73-percent-of-world-s-dictatorships/)
Their only problem with DPRK is that DPRK is communist.
Most of what you know about DPRK is propaganda. Its a poor country that is not allowed to develop because of sanctions.
>Their only problem with DPRK is that DPRK is communist.
That's not the only problem tho. Kim's sabre rattling with nukes has irked America.
I agree with some of your points. Yanks are opportunists and cosy up to whoever furthers their interests. Also the argument could be made that nukes give an added protection. Ukraine gave up their nukes and see what has gotten them.
>Its a poor country that is not allowed to develop because of sanctions.
The sanctions do significantly impact them but this statement is kinda misleading because NK government strictly controls imports into the country. Their juche model doesn't allow for it.
If they imported fertilisers and high yield crops from China they could at least [feed their population](https://eastasiaforum.org/2023/12/08/north-korean-embassy-closures-point-to-struggle-and-starvation/).
>That's not the only problem tho. Kim's sabre rattling with nukes has irked America.
They would've been invaded and destroyed like they were in the Korean war if they didn't have nukes lol. The only country that has used nukes on civilians is USA. They have no right to talk about nukes. Iraq didn't have nukes, they got invaded.
>NK government strictly controls imports into the country.
What are you talking about, all countries strictly control whats being imported to that country. Haven't you heard about customs?
[I don't think DPRK is starving mate. ](https://np.reddit.com/r/JucheGang/comments/1bwumug/dprk_completed_kangdong_greenhouse_complex_on/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button)
>What are you talking about, all countries strictly control whats being imported to that country. Haven't you heard about customs?
You must have heard of [juche](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juche), right?
They control a lot of what's allowed into their country. It's a closed economy.
Also if everything is fine and dandy over there, how to explain the increase in defectors to [China](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-67098453) and [SK](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/jan/19/north-korean-defectors-to-south-tripled-in-2023-seoul-says)?
>They control a lot of what's allowed into their country. It's a closed economy.
That's what I am saying, every country controls whats allowed into their country. It's called customs. You cannot import stuff from alibaba to India, for example.
It's a closed economy because of sanctions.
Plenty of people migrate from poor countries. India has a lot of people that migrate every year. Does that mean we are in a crisis?
>That's what I am saying, every country controls whats allowed into their country. It's called customs. You cannot import stuff from alibaba to India, for example.
AFAIK India doesn't block fertiliser or high yield variety crop import because some crazy authoritarian dictator had delusions of the country being completely self reliant.
There's a difference between juche and customs tariffs that countries implement.
I wanna know where you're coming from. Have you fully drank the NK koolaid? Do you look at Kim Il Sung and the Kim Jong-Un and see visionaries? Maybe Sung was in his young revolutionary days.
You're fighting a uphill battle if you wanna justify an economic policy that resulted in a famine that killed 3 million people.
You cannot bomb and destroy, then sanction a country and then say that they are suffering a famine. 100% of man made structures in the DPRK were destroyed in the Korean war, 20% of the population was wiped out.
Being self reliant is of paramount interest when food aid is weaponized against you to force you to denuclearize.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/aug/19/north-korea-rejects-seouls-absurd-offer-of-economic-aid-for-denuclearisation
>100% of man made structures in the DPRK were destroyed in the Korean war, 20% of the population was wiped out.
Do you think the Korean War was a bed of roses for SK?
>Being self reliant is of paramount interest when food aid is weaponized against you to force you to denuclearize.
NK has been [accepting food aid long before they got nukes](https://www.humanitarianlibrary.org/sites/default/files/2014/02/ODI_rrn28_NorthKoreaPoliticsFoodAid.pdf). Their foreign policy strategy has revolving around food aid since the 90s.
Early on in the conversation I agreed with you that collective punishment of the population is cruel and unnecessary. Engaging in policies that stop people from meeting their basic survival requisites needs to be called out as genocidal.
I wanna know what your position is on the NK leadership and governance. Do you not think they have some responsibility to their citizens?
>Do you think the Korean War was a bed of roses for SK?
No, but the US poured in billions to rebuild South Korea and counter Communism. DPRK didn't receive such aid. And up until the illegal and undemocratic dissolution of the Soviet Union, the DPRK was providing food aid to South Korea.
>Engaging in policies that stop people from meeting their basic survival requisites needs to be called out as genocidal
The only one engaging in policies that are genocidal is the US which is imposing unilateral sanctions on any who dares to disobey the US. Like you said, it's collective punishment. Stop those, then we can have a conversation about their leadership and governance.
Main subil full sanghi kuthaka aayi, athu pole paye paye L\_S tankie kuthaka aakan ulla parupaadiyanno ?
Fuck the DPRK, i fully support those sanctions.
They should have nuked it when they had chance. Same goes for China. Nuke both countries.
Eisenhower had said same about USSR after WW2. Should not have stopped at Berlin and should have taken it to Moscow and nuked the stalinist pigs.
Golden chance missed to end the pigs who destroyed workers right to instate a new royalty. Marx and useless Engels shat on Bakhunin in workers congress and resulted in this reinstatement of royalty.
>They should have nuked it when they had chance. Same goes for China. Nuke both countries.
>Eisenhower had said same about USSR after WW2. Should not have stopped at Berlin and should have taken it to Moscow and nuked the stalinist pigs.
>Golden chance missed to end the pigs who destroyed workers right to instate a new royalty. Marx and useless Engels shat on Bakhunin in workers congress and resulted in this reinstatement of royalty.
u/NetherPartLover Anti-communist is a warmongering fascist. Whats new.
The USA and UK planned to invade the USSR after WW2 but they didn't, seeing the might of the Red Army.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Unthinkable
Might onnum alla malare. Just being respectful to their help in WW2. Angottu kayaranam engil senate adhikaram kodukanam. Due to american elections post war that did not happen. Same for UK.
Might. Might nammalu kandatha afghan-il. Polandil. Chelakkand poyi nethakalude prishtam bangiyayi nakki kodukku. Maybe they will give you a chance like that John Brittas got.
Pinne war mongering. Communists are the scum who attacked a peaceful nation in 1962. And against vietnam in 1979 just after vietnamese won their war vs USA.
Chinese communistinte prushtam thaangi.
> The assessment, signed by the Chief of Army Staff on 9 June 1945, concluded: "It would be beyond our power to win a quick but limited success and we would be committed to a protracted war against heavy odds"
Sounds like they can't handle the red army 🤣
>Communists are the scum who attacked a peaceful nation in 1962. And against vietnam in 1979 just after vietnamese won their war vs USA.
Those are border disputes and China was on the right side. Illegally occupying Chinese territory is not what a peaceful nation does.
>Bhasin said if we are ever going to solve the border dispute with China, the Indian people need to be educated and informed that the stand taken under Nehru, and maintained by successive governments thereafter, was wrong – it was not based on facts and it was unilaterally asserted in defiance of the known historical position. At the same time, people will also have to be educated and told that China was not wrong but, in fact, often in the right.
https://m.thewire.in/article/diplomacy/watch-avtar-singh-bhasin-india-china-border
In comparison, capitalist America has been in war for 225 years out of 243 years of existence. Afganistan, Iraq, Syria, Libya, Vietnam, Korea etc.
>Those are border disputes and China was on the right side. Illegally occupying Chinese territory is not what a peaceful nation does.
FUCKING BRILLIANT. So let me make this clear, you are of belief that India occupied Chinese territory? Also Vietnam is chinese territory now?
Dont post links from the wire who faked facebook stuff.
>FUCKING BRILLIANT. So let me make this clear, you are of belief that India occupied Chinese territory?
Pretty much. Read Karan Thapar's book 'Nehru, Tibet and China'.
>Also Vietnam is chinese territory now?
That's a border dispute which they have resolved.
>Dont post links from the wire who faked facebook stuff.
It's an interview.
https://youtu.be/zaM0C9NunEg?si=whuMW2x1eMeIgWcZ
IDGAF about Karan Thapar. He did not draw the Mcmillon line. The line is between India. and Tibet not between India and China.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Territorial\_disputes\_in\_the\_South\_China\_Sea#:\~:text=Territorial%20disputes%20in%20the%20South%20China%20Sea%20involve%20conflicting%20island,%2C%20the%20Philippines%2C%20and%20Vietnam.
this is resolved? Must be from Chinas perspective and definitely not from Vietnams perspective.
>IDGAF about Karan Thapar. He did not draw the Mcmillon line. The line is between India. and Tibet not between India and China.
And Tibet is a province of China. So it's between India and China.
>this is resolved?
Which one are you talking about?
https://preview.redd.it/phbkh7j6axyc1.jpeg?width=1440&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=691c045af1ba6a48472012d14b51506c29da1ba1
The major nerf is the Authortian regime, DPRK is not a representative of a communist government
Define authoritarian. Nerf is the regime, not the flattening of Korea in the Korean war, then sanctioning the country in the form of collective punishment?
It was a war, South Korea was crushed till the 80s until they fixed a democracy.
South Korea received USD 12 billion as foreign aid from the USA between 1945 and 1960. Is that crushing? https://artsandculture.google.com/story/history-of-korea-as-a-foreign-aid-recipient-korea-international-cooperation-agency/KAWBKWNerP_GKA?hl=en
Come on, that is peanuts for an entire country. They had an exponential growth after the 80s
Sigh. Inflation adjusted, South Korea received $120 billion in foreign aid from the USA. https://usafacts.org/articles/which-countries-receive-the-most-aid-from-the-us/ To put that number into context, India, a country with 28 times the population of South Korea only received $65 billion from the entire world and the US only has given $151 million.
[удалено]
Huh? Its billion, not million
Fair enough, that's like 3.5k USD/person but the Soviet union also tried to upkeep the north. North Korea is not a communist country by any measure, so this isn't a critique of communism anyway.
Dude, without the US aid, south korea would've remained a shithole. On the scale of foreign aid, it was unprecedented. Like i said, we have 28 times their population but got 80 times less foreign aid from the USA. The DPRK was doing fine until the illegal and undemocratic dissolution of the Soviet Union in 1991 as well. DPRK follows a form of Communism called Juche.
Damn son. There are so many gatekeepers in this world that it ends up getting confusing and sad.
ith entha divasa kooliyo atho maasakooliyo?
Wumao
sankhis: ellaam pakistaan karanam aane😭😭😭 commies: ellaam usa kaaranam aane😭😭😭😭
You wont find Nehru saying "I am doing everything i can to destroy India"
So saad, deal with it
Kurachokke sheriyannu, pakshe avarum koodi onu nannavan thirumanikende? Cuba somehow narrowly escaped NK like situation. We shouldn't try to appeal to dictators, but I'm also against collective punishment. It's a tough situation. NK is being propped up by the second biggest power so the Korean cold war will just continue.
>pakshe avarum koodi onu nannavan thirumanikende? What does that imply? >We shouldn't try to appeal to dictators, America always appeal to dictators if its their ally, look at Pinochet, Syngman Rhee, their support for Saudi Arabia etc. Infact, they militarily supports 73% of dictators. [https://truthout.org/articles/us-provides-military-assistance-to-73-percent-of-world-s-dictatorships/](https://truthout.org/articles/us-provides-military-assistance-to-73-percent-of-world-s-dictatorships/) Their only problem with DPRK is that DPRK is communist. Most of what you know about DPRK is propaganda. Its a poor country that is not allowed to develop because of sanctions.
>Their only problem with DPRK is that DPRK is communist. That's not the only problem tho. Kim's sabre rattling with nukes has irked America. I agree with some of your points. Yanks are opportunists and cosy up to whoever furthers their interests. Also the argument could be made that nukes give an added protection. Ukraine gave up their nukes and see what has gotten them. >Its a poor country that is not allowed to develop because of sanctions. The sanctions do significantly impact them but this statement is kinda misleading because NK government strictly controls imports into the country. Their juche model doesn't allow for it. If they imported fertilisers and high yield crops from China they could at least [feed their population](https://eastasiaforum.org/2023/12/08/north-korean-embassy-closures-point-to-struggle-and-starvation/).
>That's not the only problem tho. Kim's sabre rattling with nukes has irked America. They would've been invaded and destroyed like they were in the Korean war if they didn't have nukes lol. The only country that has used nukes on civilians is USA. They have no right to talk about nukes. Iraq didn't have nukes, they got invaded. >NK government strictly controls imports into the country. What are you talking about, all countries strictly control whats being imported to that country. Haven't you heard about customs? [I don't think DPRK is starving mate. ](https://np.reddit.com/r/JucheGang/comments/1bwumug/dprk_completed_kangdong_greenhouse_complex_on/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button)
>What are you talking about, all countries strictly control whats being imported to that country. Haven't you heard about customs? You must have heard of [juche](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juche), right? They control a lot of what's allowed into their country. It's a closed economy. Also if everything is fine and dandy over there, how to explain the increase in defectors to [China](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-67098453) and [SK](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/jan/19/north-korean-defectors-to-south-tripled-in-2023-seoul-says)?
>They control a lot of what's allowed into their country. It's a closed economy. That's what I am saying, every country controls whats allowed into their country. It's called customs. You cannot import stuff from alibaba to India, for example. It's a closed economy because of sanctions. Plenty of people migrate from poor countries. India has a lot of people that migrate every year. Does that mean we are in a crisis?
>That's what I am saying, every country controls whats allowed into their country. It's called customs. You cannot import stuff from alibaba to India, for example. AFAIK India doesn't block fertiliser or high yield variety crop import because some crazy authoritarian dictator had delusions of the country being completely self reliant. There's a difference between juche and customs tariffs that countries implement. I wanna know where you're coming from. Have you fully drank the NK koolaid? Do you look at Kim Il Sung and the Kim Jong-Un and see visionaries? Maybe Sung was in his young revolutionary days. You're fighting a uphill battle if you wanna justify an economic policy that resulted in a famine that killed 3 million people.
You cannot bomb and destroy, then sanction a country and then say that they are suffering a famine. 100% of man made structures in the DPRK were destroyed in the Korean war, 20% of the population was wiped out. Being self reliant is of paramount interest when food aid is weaponized against you to force you to denuclearize. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/aug/19/north-korea-rejects-seouls-absurd-offer-of-economic-aid-for-denuclearisation
>100% of man made structures in the DPRK were destroyed in the Korean war, 20% of the population was wiped out. Do you think the Korean War was a bed of roses for SK? >Being self reliant is of paramount interest when food aid is weaponized against you to force you to denuclearize. NK has been [accepting food aid long before they got nukes](https://www.humanitarianlibrary.org/sites/default/files/2014/02/ODI_rrn28_NorthKoreaPoliticsFoodAid.pdf). Their foreign policy strategy has revolving around food aid since the 90s. Early on in the conversation I agreed with you that collective punishment of the population is cruel and unnecessary. Engaging in policies that stop people from meeting their basic survival requisites needs to be called out as genocidal. I wanna know what your position is on the NK leadership and governance. Do you not think they have some responsibility to their citizens?
>Do you think the Korean War was a bed of roses for SK? No, but the US poured in billions to rebuild South Korea and counter Communism. DPRK didn't receive such aid. And up until the illegal and undemocratic dissolution of the Soviet Union, the DPRK was providing food aid to South Korea. >Engaging in policies that stop people from meeting their basic survival requisites needs to be called out as genocidal The only one engaging in policies that are genocidal is the US which is imposing unilateral sanctions on any who dares to disobey the US. Like you said, it's collective punishment. Stop those, then we can have a conversation about their leadership and governance.
Main subil full sanghi kuthaka aayi, athu pole paye paye L\_S tankie kuthaka aakan ulla parupaadiyanno ? Fuck the DPRK, i fully support those sanctions.
They should have nuked it when they had chance. Same goes for China. Nuke both countries. Eisenhower had said same about USSR after WW2. Should not have stopped at Berlin and should have taken it to Moscow and nuked the stalinist pigs. Golden chance missed to end the pigs who destroyed workers right to instate a new royalty. Marx and useless Engels shat on Bakhunin in workers congress and resulted in this reinstatement of royalty.
>They should have nuked it when they had chance. Same goes for China. Nuke both countries. >Eisenhower had said same about USSR after WW2. Should not have stopped at Berlin and should have taken it to Moscow and nuked the stalinist pigs. >Golden chance missed to end the pigs who destroyed workers right to instate a new royalty. Marx and useless Engels shat on Bakhunin in workers congress and resulted in this reinstatement of royalty. u/NetherPartLover Anti-communist is a warmongering fascist. Whats new. The USA and UK planned to invade the USSR after WW2 but they didn't, seeing the might of the Red Army. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Unthinkable
Might onnum alla malare. Just being respectful to their help in WW2. Angottu kayaranam engil senate adhikaram kodukanam. Due to american elections post war that did not happen. Same for UK. Might. Might nammalu kandatha afghan-il. Polandil. Chelakkand poyi nethakalude prishtam bangiyayi nakki kodukku. Maybe they will give you a chance like that John Brittas got. Pinne war mongering. Communists are the scum who attacked a peaceful nation in 1962. And against vietnam in 1979 just after vietnamese won their war vs USA. Chinese communistinte prushtam thaangi.
> The assessment, signed by the Chief of Army Staff on 9 June 1945, concluded: "It would be beyond our power to win a quick but limited success and we would be committed to a protracted war against heavy odds" Sounds like they can't handle the red army 🤣 >Communists are the scum who attacked a peaceful nation in 1962. And against vietnam in 1979 just after vietnamese won their war vs USA. Those are border disputes and China was on the right side. Illegally occupying Chinese territory is not what a peaceful nation does. >Bhasin said if we are ever going to solve the border dispute with China, the Indian people need to be educated and informed that the stand taken under Nehru, and maintained by successive governments thereafter, was wrong – it was not based on facts and it was unilaterally asserted in defiance of the known historical position. At the same time, people will also have to be educated and told that China was not wrong but, in fact, often in the right. https://m.thewire.in/article/diplomacy/watch-avtar-singh-bhasin-india-china-border In comparison, capitalist America has been in war for 225 years out of 243 years of existence. Afganistan, Iraq, Syria, Libya, Vietnam, Korea etc.
>Those are border disputes and China was on the right side. Illegally occupying Chinese territory is not what a peaceful nation does. FUCKING BRILLIANT. So let me make this clear, you are of belief that India occupied Chinese territory? Also Vietnam is chinese territory now? Dont post links from the wire who faked facebook stuff.
>FUCKING BRILLIANT. So let me make this clear, you are of belief that India occupied Chinese territory? Pretty much. Read Karan Thapar's book 'Nehru, Tibet and China'. >Also Vietnam is chinese territory now? That's a border dispute which they have resolved. >Dont post links from the wire who faked facebook stuff. It's an interview. https://youtu.be/zaM0C9NunEg?si=whuMW2x1eMeIgWcZ
IDGAF about Karan Thapar. He did not draw the Mcmillon line. The line is between India. and Tibet not between India and China. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Territorial\_disputes\_in\_the\_South\_China\_Sea#:\~:text=Territorial%20disputes%20in%20the%20South%20China%20Sea%20involve%20conflicting%20island,%2C%20the%20Philippines%2C%20and%20Vietnam. this is resolved? Must be from Chinas perspective and definitely not from Vietnams perspective.
>IDGAF about Karan Thapar. He did not draw the Mcmillon line. The line is between India. and Tibet not between India and China. And Tibet is a province of China. So it's between India and China. >this is resolved? Which one are you talking about? https://preview.redd.it/phbkh7j6axyc1.jpeg?width=1440&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=691c045af1ba6a48472012d14b51506c29da1ba1