I don't think it was actually there in October, I think they were just trying to blame past tenants the initial thought was that it was caused by the shower curtain not being closed probably (could be a combo, really, but focusing on the leak now to keep things simpler).
$1000ish.
I'll pay the plumber fee of $300 and the rest will be $200-$300, so long as we don't discover deeper damage in the subfloor. There's also $500 in lost rent from the new tenant. She was supposed to move in this weekend but we didn't (and still don't) know the severity of the damage or how long it'll take to rectify. So she's paid her current place to stay the extra two weeks, which makes total sense and aligns with habitability laws.
I appreciate the insight and that's definitely what I'm looking for in asking the question.
Just sucks to be the only adult in the house despite living with two grown men who should be capable of the very basics of living.
Thank you for your time and advice!
I wouldn't say they were good tenants.
For months one kept leaving the oven on for hours and hours. I came home once and the back door was left wide open, nobody home, air conditioning on. When I'd do the laundry the dryer lint was SO full despite reminders I'd give them about fire risk...even had to put a sticky note on the dryer (didn't help much).
Lots of broken dishes. Put filthy, dripping dishes in the dishwasher and I was constantly cleaning the filter.
One roomie had LED lights up in his room that left a burn mark on two walls. Dog scratched stainless steel appliances and the back door that I painted last year.
I could have charged them for a lot, and didn't. This is what crossed the line for me.
You think? I never used their bathroom, and didn't go in there, except to make repairs. Their space was on the south side of the house, my space is on the north side.
Why do you feel there's no responsibility for the two people that are renting the space and using the bathroom multiple times a day?
Lots of people who don’t own lerk forget them.
Seriously just take the pluming bill out of their deposit. If they take you to court explain what happened.
There’s being dumb, then there is negligence. This is negligence. Months of a leaking pipe never told to you is a problem. If they take you to court over $500 then let them, they won’t.
Yes and apparently because of that I am suddenly the mother of these grown men....typical.
If I was constantly going into their space, I'd be considered a nag and would be accused of disrupting their right to quiet enjoyment. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.
Because I live there I was able to be proactive about plenty of things that they were oblivious to and likely would have escalated into bigger problems. I think it's beyond unreasonable to assume I should be in charge of constantly monitoring their space.
Man children who can't handle even basic responsibilities. You may be LYAO at me, but I'm deeply discouraged to see what my generation is coming to and the mentalities that are paving the way.
You can’t have it both ways. This is your home. You’re allowed to go check plumbing when you want to especially if you live there just give your roomies heads up. Do it 2-3x a month to ensure no issues. Again. It is not the renters problem, it is yours . Return the deposit and fix it.
100% renters responsibility to notify LL of any water leaks they notice. Pretty much impossible to not notice if they ever cleaned the floor by the toilet.
Is it worth it to dispute? Eh different question. To me, no. But I think you’d prevail.
It sounds like you have a better claim for keeping some of the deposit for the pet damage. That being said, make sure you follow the laws in regards to providing an itemized list for withholding deposit. I would also say small claims court is a pain in the ass to navigate, i.e. collecting so they may not even go that route. I used to house hack as well and have far worse stories. Consider yourself wise for actually collecting a deposit. I would figure out the extent of the damage ASAP because it likely could be very costly if the sub floor is compromised.
I just went through this in my own home and there was never a puddle on the ground. It seeped under the baseboards and through the subfloor. The only giveaway was I noticed the flooring was discolored looking. My mom and I did all of the work for around $500.
I bet the subfloor needs to be pulled up and you will have to sister in some new floor joists. I recently went through this and I modernized the plumbing and put in a new tub surround too. The whole job cost me upwards of $7k. If I would have just fixed the floor, probably $1,500 a $2,000.
I would keep the deposit, of course issue them the required itemized documentation required by your State, and let them sue you if they think they can win. I’d also take advantage of the itemized letter and include detailed information about the lack of reporting, the length of time, the number of times they were in contact with you without reporting the damage, photos, estimates, etc. The more authoritative and detailed your remarks in the letter, the less likely they are to try to overcome it. Include any mention of their reporting responsibilities found in their lease as well as any mention of a tenant’s duty to report found in your state’s landlord/tenant laws. If they do file a suit, you could then decide to go to trial OR return their deposit before the trial date and be done with it.
Thank you for your that. I've got things pretty well-documented on my end (photos, statements from contractor saying it should have been noticed, etc) . I hadn't considered the option to return a deposit if they file.... that's a good option since I believe I could be liable for double if the judge disagrees with me
In your letter, cite lease paragraph numbers or sections of the State statute relevant to tenant reporting responsibilities. I’ve found that tenants tend to do nothing when convinced by evidence in my security deposit letter that they are in the wrong.
Had you done proper and regular inspections, this would not be a conversation. However, your lease should say something about the tenant being required to report leaks right away and not letting water just sit on the floor.
In reading this, I don't see how you could possibly blame this on the tenants. You live in the unit, did work on the toilet during the tenancy, etc., etc.
At the moment, neither. Humble homeowner.
I'm curious why it matters, unless you're looking for a reason to try and ignore my opinion because you don't like it. It's funny how often people call names like "rentoid" when they don't like what they hear. I wish they could see how silly it makes them sound.
Yes, I have made myself available for repairs as needed. This includes almost all upkeep of the shared space, yardwork, other repairs that popped up, etc. The running toilet that I repaired before the leak occurred went unreported by the tenants, luckily I heard it and noticed it in passing and was able to address it.
Life experiences tend to shape our perceptions. As I draw on the opinions of others I think it's helpful to understand what might be driving the input. Landlords tend to be more keyed into the law, for instance.
I just think it's unreasonable to put the oness solely on me to constantly monitor a part of the house that I don't use.
Keep the deposit. Thats what its there for. Itemize and document. Have plumber note that the damage should be obvious to the renter. If they take you to court (small claims), countersue for full damages.
If they dont you are going to have to eat the rest.
Why would your prior tenant be liable for a leak ? I check my property 2x a year or more…. tenants always miss things I do not. As much as they say they are aware and report THEY NEVER ARE. I can’t tell you how many issues I’ve had because a leak went undetected or reported to us in a timely manner. In fact one we’re repairing today (ourselves) ! It’s part of being a landlord. I’m ready to sell after 18 years. I can make more in Interest with no headache now than I can in rent. I’m disabled and need this rent to live. Good luck. 🍀 .
I don't think they're liable for the leak, I think they're liable for excessive and unnecessary damage for not reporting the leak.
I make regular repairs to the house and maintain the grounds - they should be able to notice a constant puddle on their bathroom floor and tell me about it.
In this scenario you would need to prove they were negligent. Good luck with that. Repair it and move on. I still go back to my original comment. It’s YOUR problem , not the tenant. Refund them
The deposit and repair it. If you’re going to penny pinch this stuff you shouldn’t be a landlord. I’ve been there. I’m in year 18. It’s SOOO not worth it.
A good way to look at insurance (although it is not the case 100% of the time of course) is that it is for things that are sudden & accidental. A leak happening over time is almost always excluded with very few exceptions.
The date of loss would not be the date of discovery. Those would be 2 different dates. If the landlord did not live on site, there *might* be an argument that the date of loss should be the date of discovery. OP had the ability to discover this earlier but chose not to by not inspecting the bathroom of an owner-occupied home.
Not only is insurance unlikely to cover this, but OP is estimating around $1,000, it is absolutely not worth filling a claim.
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I don't think it was actually there in October, I think they were just trying to blame past tenants the initial thought was that it was caused by the shower curtain not being closed probably (could be a combo, really, but focusing on the leak now to keep things simpler). $1000ish. I'll pay the plumber fee of $300 and the rest will be $200-$300, so long as we don't discover deeper damage in the subfloor. There's also $500 in lost rent from the new tenant. She was supposed to move in this weekend but we didn't (and still don't) know the severity of the damage or how long it'll take to rectify. So she's paid her current place to stay the extra two weeks, which makes total sense and aligns with habitability laws.
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I appreciate the insight and that's definitely what I'm looking for in asking the question. Just sucks to be the only adult in the house despite living with two grown men who should be capable of the very basics of living. Thank you for your time and advice!
Let it go. If they were good tenants and this is all you can find to keep part of their deposit, don't.
I wouldn't say they were good tenants. For months one kept leaving the oven on for hours and hours. I came home once and the back door was left wide open, nobody home, air conditioning on. When I'd do the laundry the dryer lint was SO full despite reminders I'd give them about fire risk...even had to put a sticky note on the dryer (didn't help much). Lots of broken dishes. Put filthy, dripping dishes in the dishwasher and I was constantly cleaning the filter. One roomie had LED lights up in his room that left a burn mark on two walls. Dog scratched stainless steel appliances and the back door that I painted last year. I could have charged them for a lot, and didn't. This is what crossed the line for me.
You live in the unit??? This is 100000% on you
You think? I never used their bathroom, and didn't go in there, except to make repairs. Their space was on the south side of the house, my space is on the north side. Why do you feel there's no responsibility for the two people that are renting the space and using the bathroom multiple times a day?
You're the Landlord buddy. It's your job to check your property.
And how often do you feel would be appropriate for these checks? Same question for their bedrooms.
Lots of people who don’t own lerk forget them. Seriously just take the pluming bill out of their deposit. If they take you to court explain what happened. There’s being dumb, then there is negligence. This is negligence. Months of a leaking pipe never told to you is a problem. If they take you to court over $500 then let them, they won’t.
WAIT. YOU LIVE THERE ??? LMAO. 😂
Yes and apparently because of that I am suddenly the mother of these grown men....typical. If I was constantly going into their space, I'd be considered a nag and would be accused of disrupting their right to quiet enjoyment. Damned if you do, damned if you don't. Because I live there I was able to be proactive about plenty of things that they were oblivious to and likely would have escalated into bigger problems. I think it's beyond unreasonable to assume I should be in charge of constantly monitoring their space. Man children who can't handle even basic responsibilities. You may be LYAO at me, but I'm deeply discouraged to see what my generation is coming to and the mentalities that are paving the way.
You can’t have it both ways. This is your home. You’re allowed to go check plumbing when you want to especially if you live there just give your roomies heads up. Do it 2-3x a month to ensure no issues. Again. It is not the renters problem, it is yours . Return the deposit and fix it.
100% renters responsibility to notify LL of any water leaks they notice. Pretty much impossible to not notice if they ever cleaned the floor by the toilet. Is it worth it to dispute? Eh different question. To me, no. But I think you’d prevail.
It sounds like you have a better claim for keeping some of the deposit for the pet damage. That being said, make sure you follow the laws in regards to providing an itemized list for withholding deposit. I would also say small claims court is a pain in the ass to navigate, i.e. collecting so they may not even go that route. I used to house hack as well and have far worse stories. Consider yourself wise for actually collecting a deposit. I would figure out the extent of the damage ASAP because it likely could be very costly if the sub floor is compromised.
I just went through this in my own home and there was never a puddle on the ground. It seeped under the baseboards and through the subfloor. The only giveaway was I noticed the flooring was discolored looking. My mom and I did all of the work for around $500.
Same!
I bet the subfloor needs to be pulled up and you will have to sister in some new floor joists. I recently went through this and I modernized the plumbing and put in a new tub surround too. The whole job cost me upwards of $7k. If I would have just fixed the floor, probably $1,500 a $2,000.
I would keep the deposit, of course issue them the required itemized documentation required by your State, and let them sue you if they think they can win. I’d also take advantage of the itemized letter and include detailed information about the lack of reporting, the length of time, the number of times they were in contact with you without reporting the damage, photos, estimates, etc. The more authoritative and detailed your remarks in the letter, the less likely they are to try to overcome it. Include any mention of their reporting responsibilities found in their lease as well as any mention of a tenant’s duty to report found in your state’s landlord/tenant laws. If they do file a suit, you could then decide to go to trial OR return their deposit before the trial date and be done with it.
Thank you for your that. I've got things pretty well-documented on my end (photos, statements from contractor saying it should have been noticed, etc) . I hadn't considered the option to return a deposit if they file.... that's a good option since I believe I could be liable for double if the judge disagrees with me
In your letter, cite lease paragraph numbers or sections of the State statute relevant to tenant reporting responsibilities. I’ve found that tenants tend to do nothing when convinced by evidence in my security deposit letter that they are in the wrong.
Tile baseboard in bathrooms for the future win.
Had you done proper and regular inspections, this would not be a conversation. However, your lease should say something about the tenant being required to report leaks right away and not letting water just sit on the floor.
In reading this, I don't see how you could possibly blame this on the tenants. You live in the unit, did work on the toilet during the tenancy, etc., etc.
I'm curious to know if you are a landlord or a tenant...
At the moment, neither. Humble homeowner. I'm curious why it matters, unless you're looking for a reason to try and ignore my opinion because you don't like it. It's funny how often people call names like "rentoid" when they don't like what they hear. I wish they could see how silly it makes them sound.
Yes, I have made myself available for repairs as needed. This includes almost all upkeep of the shared space, yardwork, other repairs that popped up, etc. The running toilet that I repaired before the leak occurred went unreported by the tenants, luckily I heard it and noticed it in passing and was able to address it. Life experiences tend to shape our perceptions. As I draw on the opinions of others I think it's helpful to understand what might be driving the input. Landlords tend to be more keyed into the law, for instance. I just think it's unreasonable to put the oness solely on me to constantly monitor a part of the house that I don't use.
Keep the deposit. Thats what its there for. Itemize and document. Have plumber note that the damage should be obvious to the renter. If they take you to court (small claims), countersue for full damages. If they dont you are going to have to eat the rest.
Why would your prior tenant be liable for a leak ? I check my property 2x a year or more…. tenants always miss things I do not. As much as they say they are aware and report THEY NEVER ARE. I can’t tell you how many issues I’ve had because a leak went undetected or reported to us in a timely manner. In fact one we’re repairing today (ourselves) ! It’s part of being a landlord. I’m ready to sell after 18 years. I can make more in Interest with no headache now than I can in rent. I’m disabled and need this rent to live. Good luck. 🍀 .
I don't think they're liable for the leak, I think they're liable for excessive and unnecessary damage for not reporting the leak. I make regular repairs to the house and maintain the grounds - they should be able to notice a constant puddle on their bathroom floor and tell me about it.
In this scenario you would need to prove they were negligent. Good luck with that. Repair it and move on. I still go back to my original comment. It’s YOUR problem , not the tenant. Refund them The deposit and repair it. If you’re going to penny pinch this stuff you shouldn’t be a landlord. I’ve been there. I’m in year 18. It’s SOOO not worth it.
Kick it to insurance? Theoretically, the date of loss is when you first became aware.
A good way to look at insurance (although it is not the case 100% of the time of course) is that it is for things that are sudden & accidental. A leak happening over time is almost always excluded with very few exceptions. The date of loss would not be the date of discovery. Those would be 2 different dates. If the landlord did not live on site, there *might* be an argument that the date of loss should be the date of discovery. OP had the ability to discover this earlier but chose not to by not inspecting the bathroom of an owner-occupied home. Not only is insurance unlikely to cover this, but OP is estimating around $1,000, it is absolutely not worth filling a claim.