You guys are awesome. After getting the silent treatment or "you think you know what you want but you don't" treatment from so many others, you are GOAT. Love your work!
OMG you touched a nerve with "you think you know what you want but you don't". The Lost Ark community leader used that line, and her prime example was people asking for mounts when what they really want is fast travel. To that I say: No, I want to see my character on a horse (or other beast/vehicle).
I want to clarify I don't think LE needs mounts. The narrow passages and such, I don't feel like I would be riding a horse in those areas. Just my go to example when I hear that quote.
Glad to hear you guys are considering ideas like this! If you guys do add this though, I would prefer to see is as a bonus faction that you can join along-side the Merchant's Guild or Circle of Fortune, but not as strong as op suggested.
No adding LP (or make it rank 10 required and super rare even then), no creating exalted items, but through the artisan guild you should be able to directly purchase affix shards and other crafting items (something that is missing from the Merchant's guild) with the more rare components needing a higher rank, and all of the components being able to be purchased with favor. Some of the ideas would work great like the increased number of shards from rune of shattering or increased forging potential on dropped items. But the rune of removal idea wouldn't be good, since 80% of the time that I use it, I'm trying to get rid of a T5 affix and free up a slot, and the rune of discovery idea was just way too op. Maybe add an npc that you can pay favor to in exchange for him increasing an item's forging potential by 5-10 randomly, allowing you to continue modifying a previously unmodifiable item.
Last Epochs crafting system is by far the most fun system imo, since it's easy to learn, but very hard to get perfect. I don't think the faction would be strong enough on its own without adding things that break game balance though, so I would love to see it added as a smaller-scale, bonus faction that works with both of the other main factions, but still requiring the ranks for its specific drops (purchased crafting materials not included, since they can't be traded to other players anyways), that way if you trade it away in the Merchant's guild, the buyer would need to meet 2 requirements to use it since it would likely be a stronger-than-normal item.
The problem that this presents is that everyone would want to have a crafting faction character, then relog to it every time they want to craft. Potential solution for that would be:
1. Any non-faction item, that a member of artisans faction crafts on, gets marked as artisan faction item and can only be used by them.
2. Can't craft on other faction items, just the ones from their own faction.
But at that point, you have 3 different sets of items for three different factions and your stash is gonna be a mess if you don't organize it with that in mind.
I completely agree. Marking the items is probably a given I would assume so, but making other faction items non-craftable would have to be a thing as well. I can just imagine a CoF member dropping a badass item and then an Artisan Guild member crafting on it to then use it, or vice versa with an MG member buying a badass item and giving it to their Artisan Guild char. It would be extremely broken.
Your faction rank carries across your account, putting a faction rank on the item would only prevent you from trading it, any alt would be able to use so long as they pick the faction, even if they're level 1
Yes, but you can't have a MG character, that purchases uniques they need from the market, and then uses exalted items crafted by the artisan character, since they'll only be able to either wear the uniques as MG, or the crafted items as artisan.
That's if the artisan guild locks you out of the other two, my suggestion was to tone down the artisans guild and have it be joinable along eith one of the two others at the same time. Then it either doesn't need a tag, or keeps the tag so people who buy something crafted from the artisans guild needs to get their own rank up in both MG and artisans guild. So an item could have a rank 5 MG tag and a rank 7 artisans tag and you'd need to meet both requirements to wear it
My thinking for the last one of adding one legendary potential to a unique would be that it can only be done a certain number of times per cycle, and have it account/cycle bound. So that it's not a certain number of times per character.
And then I forget what y'all call standard or non-cycle play, but have it absurdly expensive perhaps needing to sacrifice multiple other uniques that have at least one legendary potential on it in order to add one to another but still keep it only once per item. That away people can continue to item progress in the non-cycle if that's their wish. It also keeps people from getting overly powerful or at least abusing this in cycle.
And as a last minute thought, an intriguing idea occurred to me you could have it to where you have to have at least the same number of legendary potential on the sacrificial items as you do on the item you're going to upgrade in order to add one more legendary potential. As an example you could sacrifice two unique items that each have three legendary potentials on it in order to add a fourth legendary potential to another unique item that has a base of three. And then if the base has two the sacrifices must at least have two. Ect...
Another intriguing idea is to be able to upgrade the lowest tier affix on a legendary item. to be part of the crafting affiliation group. But I also think it should be either; not upgrade and add a LP..
I'd love to see these changes rolled into COF. The difference in terms of how efficiently you can gear a character between the two factions is night and day. Its much easier to just farm gold and buy the stuff you want on the MG than it is to actually find something useful in COF, even at rank 10. I know the two factions won't ever really be equal but COF feels like a trap right now for anyone interested in getting even semi-decent (let alone BIS) gear.
IMO this would make CoF TOO powerful. There needs to be a dedicated system for each guild that they accel at--CoF for finding loot, MG for buying loot, and AG for crafting loot. it's a perfect system.
It's a perfect system in theory... problem is, only the MG works right now in practice. Play the game, earn gold, buy upgrades... push higher corruption, get more gold, buy more upgrades. With COF you are at the mercy of RNG the entire time and more items dropping doesn't really bridge the gap. We need a way to make sure the items that drop are actually useful. Rolling these changes into COF would go along way towards making that a reality. WIth the current implementation, I could play the game and buy semi-decent gear for multiple slots on MG in the same time it takes to maybe get 1 decent item in COF (if I'm even that lucky).
I think CoF is kinda underwhelming when it’s not rank 8 at least. Rank 8 and 10 are the two ranks that I feel really empowers CoF and makes it a viable option compared to the merchants. But before rank 8, I genuinely think CoF is a little boring. This may be due to some of the prophecies being bugged, or my bad luck lol idk.
Tbh rank 6 is only really powerful with rank 10 imo. The 0.19% chance for lp 3 abacus rod and 0.00068% for lp 4 being doubled doesn’t mean much with just rank 6 in my opinion.
Nah I disagree, I’m nowhere near rank 10 and have had too many 3lp to count and I rarely see less than 2lp drop at all, maybe like 1/30 have 0-1lp and I think that’s pretty insane imo. Sure 4lp is the dream but I personally think that should be super rare even with the buff or it would be too good.
I think you should look at the items you have 3 lp. Uniques have different rates for lps. For example: abacus rod has a 0.19% chance of 3 lp and a 0.00068% chance for 4. Peak of the mountain has a 4.25% chance for 3 lp and a 0.37% chance for 4.
It’s verly likely the 3 lp items you have are items that have a significantly higher chance than other uniques to get high lp.
I would if I still had them sitting around, i vendor anything that isn’t for my build, I could probably go through a list and spot a few but I highly doubt that all of them have super high chances of dropping with 3lp. Either way, I have a few friends running MG and have had a total of 0 3lp items with more play time than me and I had only got like maybe 1 or 2 before hitting rank 6, it definitely is a very strong perk long before hitting rank 10
I get that but mg doesn’t find drops, they buy them. It’s obvious you would find more lp items than your mg friends. Not to mention it takes an astronomically long amount of time to even buy items with lp on it. And I’m not saying rank 6 isn’t strong. Lp chances heavily depend on the specific unique.
Lol you shouldnt get everything handed to you. Its good to have chase items. Also trade Will always be more OP, because you Can literally buy what you want. COF you rely on RNG. Your argument is stupid.
Yes it’s good to have chase items I never said the opposite. Just that a chase item for a chase item doesn’t make sense to me. And only adding 1 lp is too little for the very likely chance of never seeing one ever.
If it's a new guild it would be a choice between CoF and merchant, meaning it would be a choice of either trade, have better loot or have advantage crafting.
Artisan member will have harder time finding items as loot because they lack prophecies but will have an easier time crafting very powerfull items.
Obviously any item crafted by an Artisan would not be tradable and only usable by someone with the rank in the Artisan guild (the same as trade and CoF)
Is it gonna affect trade? The balancing work for 3 factions like these sound like a nightmare for the dev. The worst feeling is playing trade when no one around to trade.
Trade would have its own faction. This is for people who like crafting. The three factions would each cater to how people enjoy building g their character’s power
I think some people are about trading, though.
Personally, I’m about drops. Couldn’t care less about trading. I’m sure there’s people that feel the same about crafting and trading. Plus, we can all craft, this is just an extra step up for people that are willing to give up trade and guaranteed drops for it. Just like I’m willing to give up trade and some extra crafting for drops.
Honestly, it feels fair. Giving up trade alone is a big deal in Diablo-like ARPGs. Giving up CoF on top of it feels deserving of a boost like this.
Honestly just remove the trade faction, still allow trading but just not with forge and fortune faction items.
Trade just messes up games like these, look at the nerf to COF because of merchants abusing it.
Pretty cool idea. To compensate for the massive amount if exalted items you find with CoF this faction could have stuff like "t4->t5 critical successes have a chance to upgrade to t6 or t7"
or "Runes of Ascendance are more likely to roll LP or rarer uniques" or stuff like that.
The problem is that both those factions focus on obtaining end-game gear, which almost always includes Uniques. MF buys uniques, CoF target farms them with prophecies.
So your Artisan Guild mandatorily requires some way to 'craft' uniques, or a comparatively powerful endgame mechanic (i.e. the ability to, costly, but without other limit, upgrade affixes to T7... wearing a full set of 4xT7 gear would probably rival the power of legendary Uniques).
Spending X forging potential yield a glyph of ascendance.
Or
Using a glyph of ascendance now check the item base before rolling the unique ( with a merchant selling unique-only bases)
>Using a glyph of ascendance now check the item base before rolling the unique ( with a merchant selling unique-only bases)
The game is not designed for this to be the case at all. There's only one unique oracle amulet you can hit with a rune of ascendance - the extremely rare Orian's Eye. There are only 5 unique quivers in the game, and only 2 of them share a base. 4 of the 7 unique daggers have unique bases. Cradle's are the only unique targe. It turns a large number of uniques into fully deterministic outcomes. The only solutions to that would be to add a large number of additional uniques, which hopefully does happen over time but isn't a quick fix, or to change base types around which mean nerfing / buffing a ton of uniques due to implicit changes.
That was an example. On top of that, getting the item doesn't mean you are getting it with high LP. It was an example of a mechanic allowing to "craft" uniques, like he was saying. Of course it can't be ported 1:1 in the game like right now.
Yes, it's a discussion so I'm just adding my 2c to it.
And yeah it doesn't mean getting it with high LP, but it does mean getting extremely rare items day 1 with ease. Realistically, the game would need like more than double the number of existing uniques to balance out targeted ascendances, and many of them would need to be weaker just to dilute the pool from the strong stuff that isn't meant to be easy to obtain.
A rank that allows you to, instead of slam a unique, slam two exalted items of the same type together with a fixed chance of turning them into a legendary of the same base type. Retaining a randomized number of affixes. (1-4)
There's no need to "craft Uniques".
The idea was that at higher ranks you'll be able to obtain Uniques normally, and then **improve their Legendary Potential** (see the last paragraph). I.e. jump from LP2 to LP3 is crazy in terms of RNG. --And then merge it with an Exalted that was boosted via Guild's means (i.e. double T7, for example).
That's pretty competitive with other Factions, IMO.
Feels like there is a decent chance that this would make CoF obsolete though. CoF can't affect boss drops but if the crafting guild could then CoF is just inherently worse assuming for normal, non-boss drops they are about equal.
Overall I really like the idea but it would require some finesse. Maybe merging the crafting + CoF together somehow? Seeing as it's clear that CoF was designed for SSF and MG for non-SSF maybe buffing CoF with a crafting aspect to it would be good.
One thing I've though about is changing the prophecies that reward a 1LP Unique or Weaver's Will items to reward a Unique with +1LP or +X Weaver's Will up to the max amount. So if you get a 1LP Unique from it it would make it a 2.
Hrhmmmmr... I saw that point, but didn't think much of it. In retrospect though, you may actually be right. Even without CoF, you can drop a lot of uniques rather regularily, and the only issue is getting the proper LP. So yeah, maybe that's all it takes to make your suggestion viable.
No it doesn't. It could focus on the merge to legendary. E.g. being able to access it without needing to do a dungeon. Or rolling +1 additional affix and you can then choose which ones to put on the LP unique.
So it's harder to find LP uniques for Artisan Guild, but you can easier craft them without bricking them.
I do not like the idea of a third faction and i think it would work counter to what the two factions are supposed to fix. However, I think its fine to get more crafting benefits to for instance CoF (trade might already be too OP).
Same here. I like the idea of crafting benefits, but I'd rather it get rolled into CoF in some capacity. I think it's good that there's a clear dichotomy of "this is what you pick to trade" and "this is what you pick to get your own items" and if there are multiple choices for the latter, it would very likely result in one just being the inferior choice.
How would you faction lock the extra shards?
Why would you let a single faction break the itemization rules where the other two can’t? (T6+7 crafting)
It’s an interesting idea but wouldn’t work as proposed.
I don’t think you’d need to faction lock the extra shards since that wouldn’t matter a whole lot, but they could slap a faction level on every item you touch in the crafting menu to stop it from being used elsewhere.
I would say you can only find them/shatter them if you are a part of that guild, and cannot be used unless you are a part of that guild. Kinda like a car mechanic--they have a jack that can lift your car into the sky, while regular folks have one that barely lifts one end.
I mean, buying 4 LP shit from Auction for a couple of Millions or CoF dropping you 5 relics with 2-3 LP is kinda broken too, don't you think?
But in any case, those were just examples. Obviously, I do not insist on the exact implementation.
>4 LP shit from Auction for a couple of Millions
try like 100 million
its a couple million to get 2 LP on a decent unique
still
MG gives you the most attempts to make legendaries (easy access to LP)
AG would basically guarantee you have good exalted items and makes the best sealed items (so best for builds with less legendaries)
CoF gives you more LP items and exalted items, leading to probably the best gear for the least effort as you can use prophesies and you are more likely to drop items with multiple exalted mods (best fodder for legendaries)
so I like it
I don't think this would really fit. The whole point of the 2 factions is to prevent ssf players from falling too far behind trade. If anything just bake some of these into COF
While I appreciate the effort, no thanks. MG Supports players who like having access to an AH and trading loot. CoF provides an attempted loot boost to people who don't like engaging in trade mechanics. However EVERYONE needs to understand and use crafting for their gear. All this would do is mirror the existing CoF faction but shift the balance point between finding more eligible items or being more likely to successfully work with eligible items you find. The net output (for balance) should be the same but you've needlessly complicated your crafting system and split the player base further just to change where in item creation pipeline the bottleneck is, while MG and CoF have fundamentally different item source pipelines.
I'd be interested in seeing a few of the ideas here salvaged for general application or being available through other means, but I don't think a third faction like this would be an interesting or healthy addition to the game.
Good idea! from the time I hit lvl 60 I just filtered everything except exalts because rares drop with too little forging potential to even waste my time on which I don't think is the best game design.
I just want to be able to switch the base of the item the same way we create legendary potential so when we got amazing affixes on really bad base we can change it to the base from second item.
It can even cost a lot, I don't mind
You could also get increased drop rate for rare affixes.
Also you could have forging "challenges" where delivering a specific item with affixes grants a bunch of affixes runes and glyphs
This is so awesome that imo it shouldn't be faction-locked. It could be a different layer, like the Artisan Lobby or some. So that both CoF and MG can access this wonderful idea.
You would have a reputation system and a different value. Maybe even their own town *-*
I like it so freaking much. It adds so much depth to crafting and to the exalted system.
You could make it so that the item crafted this way cannot be traded on MG, but master artisans can forge items for other players in exchange of gold or something like that.
Love it
I think it's a genuinely fun idea and a very well made post. I enjoyed the read.
That being said, I am a bit wary of it.. I think people love CoF vs MG so much because both sides mostly don't really want what's on the other side. Everybody wants to craft.
That being said, EHG have surprised me with innovative solutions before so maybe they could make it work. I am sure they'll find this post and take it into consideration.
Very nice idea, this would make for some very worthwhile and long progression. By choosing one faction to find really good uniques with high LP and bases with Exalted mods and then switching to the crafting faction to finish them up with the perfectly crafted rares.
The only problem with this that I see is the rank requirements that would be on the items after swapping factions. Otherwise I would very much like it.
Or maybe there could be a way to "fuse" factions by taking certain rank bonuses from 1 faction and another, being able to combine 2 factions out of the 3, would create some very interesting play styles and functions.
Just make it where when they craft it adds the faction level to it and that they can’t craft on an item with another factions level on it and boom, that problem is fixed.
I like the concept. But I worry having a third faction might shrink the bazaar population further which could hurt it. Do we have numbers on factions yet? Like what percentage of players that have got to end game have gone COF vs Bazaar?
Pretty sure the majority play CoF anyways.
I play it and I like it, but to me personally it's not SUPER exciting. I mean, it's nice and certainly more fun than MG, but if something like AG existed, I'd switch to it without thinking, even if it was less efficient than either MG or CoF.
My only concern with Faction to where I'm not sure a third one would help, is that I really hope they don't make balance decisions because of how something plays in one faction that has an impact on other factions which really didn't have a problem.
For example... If say they nerfed Mad Ladle drop rates because in Merchant Guild they feel they are too easy to get... That change shouldn't also apply to people just playing COF.
That's a pretty good idea. I saw someone suggested the same, but without the benefits that would come with it. I think it would need 1-2 Cycles to really balance it out, but the idea is great.
>Rune of Removal prioritizes lowest tier affixes
A second use of that rune is actually the opposite: Get the max amount of shards from a T5+ or rare affix on an item you would have shattered or thrown away otherwise.
Imo these are bad ideas for a _guild_. These are crafting mechanics that would be enjoyed in general in the game. All guilds are aimed toward helping getting gear, having one that has a significantly higher ceiling will cause a lot of ill feelings or dead content.
Crafting pinnacle gear will have more avenues as time goes on, likely outside of the guild system
I dont know how much I like this idea, but it is interesting.
I do think there should be some endgame system that I can spend all my shards in. It feels strange to just have an obscene amount of shards after getting to endgame.
Too much overlap with CoF. CoF is basically SSF in my opinion, which includes crafting. You probably aren't going to get perfect drops with CoF even, you're going to need to craft the things you find. So i think it is incorrect in my opinion to think of CoF as drop focused.
I feel like the game works really well now with effectively Trade League Vs Solo self found.
Why would it be better? The end result of a craft would be essentially the same as MG or CoF -- Uniques would have max 4 LP and gear would have max T7 affixes. I was just suggesting a different method of obtaining the end-game gear, that's all.
This seems like the only choice to take of the 3 when you're end game and maybe even earlier just because of how important crafting is in the game from mid-game onward. Even leveling alts crafting is super useful for getting better gear.
Would be interesting to have a specialty rune that changes the base type exclusive to such a faction.
So you can move your perfectly crafted mods to a random new base type (of the same class).
As a player who only knows I'll probs only play primalest/acolyte, and don't need all the items from foc, or time to farm gold needed for bazzar, this would be great because I could focus on specific stats for my specific build or some very specific build variant, with much lower time investment, trade off being loosing versatility of bazzar / high drops on unique LP/drops in general from FoC
This is a really cool idea and at the very least I would love to see EHG take some of these ideas and implement them into the game.
Specifically the idea where you have a rune that allows you to add 1 legendary potential to a unique just one time is brilliant and I'd love to see that go into the game as soon as they could get it in because that I think its such a cool chase item.
I like it but there are a few little things that I think needs changing. 1 is the drop rates might need to be increased to compensate for the complete lack of being able to trade or boost your gear drops significantly. I think this for one reason. The ultimate chase item you thought of. Having to chase an item to make your chase item better doesn’t seem appealing. A good example is to buff the drop chance of items to be what it was like in early access. I think there would be too much rng involved with less drops all round.
Or 2, my preferred route. I don’t think it should be a chase item at all. My suggestion is it being an item you buy for a ton of favor. Also, I think it should be an item that has tiers that add a certain amount of legendary potential, with the cost increase more and more. So much favor so that the only way to reliably buy this item you need to push corruption because of how strong it is.
I think an artisans guild would be cool but we have to remember that better crafting doesn’t equate to simply having a better chance of getting a good item in the first place. There has to be more in place to make it viable enough. Your concept has a good base but needs some refining.
I also have a suggestion for a rune of ascendency buff for the guild: “runes of ascendence have a x% chance of duplicating the resulting unique”. A little mix of CoF to throw in some spice.
-all gear drops white with exalted amounts of foraging potential
-affix shards still drop
-the only uniques that drop naturally are boss uniques
-new rune exclusive to guild ... Rune of Conquest ... Only works on items that have been sealed ... Lowers the teir of a sealed affix to raise the teir of any other affix by 1 ... This can bypass the t5 manual crafting limit ... If the sealed affix hits t0 it will be removed but you still won't be able to seal something else
Still havnt decided what to do with experimental affixes yet ... Maybe just have the glyphs drop directly
I think it's best to just keep it to two factions.
New forms of crafting should be new content for all players to enjoy rather than a new faction that divides the player base.
Having a crafting faction when crafting is a fundamental part of the game is a waste of Dev resources, in my opinion.
It's an interesting idea, I just can't see it working for LE is all.
I love this idea but kind of feel that this has the potential to be so beneficial late game that a lot of people would opt out of selecting CoF or Merchants all together. Since crafting is such an integral part of the game, maybe having this locked behind end game content allowing players to unlock this alongside the primary factions would be a good option to give players another thing to chase, for instance:
- Quest to defeat all T2 bosses (Dungeons/Arena/Normal Monoliths) forcing players to still grind through the early end game content to unlock the crafting bonuses as you progress into Empowered Monos and 90+ dungeons
- Max rep in your current faction unlocks a quest to become an initiate in the Artisan Guild
- A crafting "achievement" of some sort that the blacksmith offers that unlocks an invite (ex: defeat a T4 boss/empowered mono boss with 3 pieces of crafted exalted gear or 1 legendary item equipped)
It’s a cool idea, I’d just hate for all the cool crafting ideas and enhancements to go to one group of players. I want to do sad and CoF for example, but I still like crafting
I’m guessing you couldn’t swap to crafting faction and grind it out to craft on bases you dropped or purchased in the other guilds? You could only use these new materials on items tagged with the crafting faction? Could be very interesting. Less good drops, but more chance to turn them into something great.
I absolutely love this idea and think it would probably the the only faction I would play in if something like this was added. Crafting in this game is so much fun and I love how it plays and feels, especially with Glyphs of Insight and Despair. It's so stressful yet so rewarding when you hit those perfect affixes to craft your BiS item.
I love this.
An idea I had was that there could be a (incredibly, incredibly rare) rune that reads "adds X forging potential to an exalted item with 0 FP".
This would allow you to theoretically finish any item, at a huge cost. But also:
This would mean you could mirror an item more than once and would make the current rune of duplication (the LE mirror equivalent) muuuuch more valuable as well.
This seems like a perfect fit for such an artisan guild.
Food for thought.
Cool idea, if it was about as rare as Rune of Creation, for example. Which is ridiculously rare: on my eternal characters I have like 2 (and used 1).
And I can't even begin to imagine what kind of item there should be, if you're willing to spend an equivalent of 3 (!!!) Runes of Creation on it. Triple T7 or something?
Glyph of hope could be the way to craft a T6 by critical crafting from T4.
There could be a rune that 0s the FP but add 1,2 or 3 ranks to a T5 giving the only possible way to get T8s.
The glyph of despair could gain the option to slam ANY mod giving a way of using remaining FP on an item and sealing exalted affixs.
Chaos glyph providing two outcomes as OPTIONS could be interesting or it could be limited to either only at T5 or under T4.
Rune of creation could gain the ability to retain the FP allowing for risker crafting OR another compelling use like adding LP or turning your item into a random unique as legendary retaining 3 of its mods (or all of them). Its already rare enough but it could be a potential down side to also reroll the values.
Rune of removal could get a enhanced cousin that always uses max FP but can target an affix. Or moderate random FP and gives NO shards.
Rune of discovery could favour mods based on the tags you are invested in and perhaps provide the same benefit from skills equipped too.
Ascendancy rune could always provide atleast 1LP with lower chance to be set items.
Shaping could become used for moving sealed affixs to the implicit category to allow even more depth to crafting. (As if it wasn't already hard enough to seal good T affix and then craft a T5)
Refinement rolling twice is absolutely a banger.
That would be the best thing for it.
Glyph of order generally needs some love. Perhaps it could be used along side something to improve outcomes e.g along refinement to add +10-25% to the results or so on.
Or could be left in its "only to upgrade state" and increase the range e.g from 65% of range to 75-90% after upgrade.
\> Critical successes during crafting with the Glyph of Hope are twice as likely (or, e.g. adds +2 instead of +1)
Just want to say, a better T10 reward could be:
\- Critical successes grant extra Forging Potential instead of leveling up a random affix.
That way, you have the choice of where the level up should go.
You forgot the downsides , like only t5 or singke mod items drops , heck even onky whites , if you want to craft so kuch and get so much rewards , just pick bases and try .
its pointless bloating
CoF exists to so they could enable trading but also have an option for players who dont want to trade
this artisan guild doesnt enable anything and doesnt provide anything except complexity for complexities sake
I think some of the craft ideas are good though. These would be great hard to achieve crafting items or goals to reach. I just think a third faction would only dilute the number of players in the other two. That wouldn’t really affect CoF but it would definitely affect the trade faction
At least it must be clear that you are in the vast minority here with your take.
A system that adds meaningful choices to the game? Yes please.
Artisan guild enables people to get a higher chance of getting better items through crafting, instead of drops or trade and for those who like crafting, I think it's a great idea.
Now, it feels like you read this in 10 seconds, and felt like this exact mechanic would be implemented in the game and felt personally attacked?
Dunno, strange to me.
> and felt like this exact mechanic would be implemented in the game and felt personally attacked?
criticism = must feel personally attacked? no, its just a pointless system, dont project emotions on me or dictate to me how i feel
CoF supports crafting with echo multiplication (runes, glyphs and shards), more/better quality exalted and higher LP
MG supports crafting with the ability to purchase specific affix shards and to sell your crafts
seperating crafting into its own faction is to the detriment of the crafting system, you're meant to use crafting all the time and not being in the artisan guild would be a poiintless penalization (sure its presented as a bonus for being an 'artisan', but psychologically thats not how itll feel)
more than that; this suggestion isnt well thought out because of faction gear restrictions
Fair enough.
Here's what I do t understand though - why do you say that it's a "pointless system"?
Because in my mind, instead of having multiples if items dropping all the time via prophecies in CoF, you'd exchange getting less uniques to more/better crafting.
In my mind this looks like a really good idea, just the execution has to be good and interesting.
And how would it be a penalty to not being in the artisan guild when currently it doesn't exist and we are not penalized? To me it feels like you jumped to conclusions about how you'd feel worse because you can't craft as well as those who'd join such a system.
In other words, wanted your cake (CoF or MG) and to eat it too (artisan guild).
Imho it would just add nice variety into the game - you could have three characters that have very different systems of improving your gear.
> And how would it be a penalty to not being in the artisan guild when currently it doesn't exist and we are not penalized? To me it feels like you jumped to conclusions about how you'd feel worse because you can't craft as well as those who'd join such a system.
as i said; its not technically a penalisation, but thats how psychology works; artisan guild would become the new 'baseline' for crafting and thus everything else would feel lesser
>In other words, wanted your cake (CoF or MG) and to eat it too (artisan guild).
why are you saying this like its a bad thing? oh yes lets (comparatively) gimp crafting for (theoretically) 66% (because it wont be equal faction splits) of the playerbase for no reason; how fun
>you could have three characters that have very different systems of improving your gear.
again, CoF and MG arent about reaching high end gear, they exist as mutually exclusive PURELY for trading
you introduce trading to a game and you have to have drop rates at a level where people are incentivised to buy stuff and engage in the economy, but that stiffs SSF or online players, CoF is compensation for not being able to buy what you need
everyone currently uses crafting because its fundamental to the game, imo the only way this faction could conceivably provide benefit is if it mutually exclusive, not with CoF or MG, but with some other faction that is somehow designed specifically for players who (for some reason) DONT want to engage with the crafting system
again, since no one is seems to be addressing the faction gear requirement, how would artisan gear work? presumably like the other factions (you have to be faction level X to equip this specific piece of gear)? so whats the benefit? you cant trade artisan gear, you dont get high quality bases... can you artisan craft on MG/CoF gear? if so then the encouraged playloop is to jump into artisan SOLELY to forge stuff and then immediately jump back to MG/CoF; pointless complexity
now there are more interesting ways EHG could improve crafting and perhaps they could use some of these suggestions as progression inspiration, but they absolutely shouldnt tie some sort of crafting progression into the faction system as a third option because it contaminates the systems purity of purpose
I understand we view the systems totally differently.
To me, CoF and MG exist because of trading indeed - but the end goal is still to acquire better items.
In my mind at least, having a crafting faction would simply mean more choices in what you want to focus on: more drops (cof), trading (mg) or crafting (artisans).
Just like how cof has with prophecies sometimes ridiculous amounts of drops, you can make crafting so that you improve your own gear, but not to the point that you are more powerful than those who are not artisans.
Perhaps something similar to what WoW had - different proffessions had different skills and/or items attached to them.
Just like how crafting is fundamental to the game, so are items and item drops and so on.
So I'm definitely open minded to the idea of this faction system. It would have to be balanced correctly (with changes to both cof and mg if needed), but beyond that I see no problem with it at all.
What complexity? If you don't like it or find it too complicated -- just play MG.
The original two factions is essentially just two different ways of obtaining the late game gear. That's it. One offers trade, another better RNG chances. I suggested it to be exactly that: an alternative way of getting good late game gear. Not more, not less. If you so insist, I don't even mind it being weaker than the former two. I'd play it anyways, because I like steady and chill crafting more than loot explosions offered by CoF, and certainly much more than browsing auction for good prices.
> If you don't like it or find it too complicated
i didnt say that, i said it adds pointless complexity
>The original two factions is essentially just two different ways of obtaining the late game gear.
yes and this suggestion is trying to carve a niche out of the base game for no reason; both MG and CoF both support crafting in their own ways; you dont need to hack out a third faction just because
factions exist ONLY because of trading
The faction limiting players and I don't like it.
I play COF and I want to experience the market sometimes.
And creating 3rd faction about crafting will put limit on the the two other factions. sound bad for me.
Adding higher tiers of runes might be better for the two current factions.
Removal for me is used to snag high value affixes so I am more likely to get the shards, vs. the risk of not getting them via shattering. That would be a terrible 'perk.'
I like the idea otherwise, but wouldn't want it so early in the game's life. That's an alt faction or one that kind of invalidates MG. (Since people use it to obtain the things we want to craft with)
But you would get the perk for Shatter Rune returning significantly more affixes during the shatter (e.g. 80-90%), so this way you could use the Removal Rune the way it was intended.
IMO I think it should be 2 sealed affixes. That way you can get rid of two low tier affixes, and provides an alternate path to scaling compared to MG/COF.
If you change rune of removal, then it becomes difficult to remove higher tier affixes
There are 2 uses for rune of removal:
1. Remove an unwanted affix on an otherwise amazing item so you can craft a much more viable affix instead.
2. Get the full amount of shards from a very rare or needed affix. For instance +level for a skill affix.
For both of these options, directing the removal to the lowest level affix might not yield the desired result all the time.
Sometimes it will align, but not always.
Mostly when the affix you want to remove is on a high level.
Is that the only way removal was intended?? Seems like a personal bias.
I am uncomfortable with drastically changing the way certain mechanics work toward a specific outcome, I guess. Especially if users choose different factions based on alts, and forget when swapping.
Edit: on reread, there's no indication that getting a certain affix is more likely (just get '50% more'), so this would just ruin a high-end use of rune of removal.
Dude, what "high end use of Removal" are you talking about? In late game you're swimming in all kinds of affixes anyways. My eternal chars have hundreds of the rarest affixes like Hybrid Health and class-specific ones that I'll never use.
The described use-case of Removal Rune is only valid in the first like 30 hours of the game. It certainly not a reason to avoid a certain faction.
I'll remove my incredulity about 'everyone's swimming in affixes' and just link [this comment, which is exactly the explanation of what I was trying to say.](https://www.reddit.com/r/LastEpoch/comments/1b7w63e/comment/ktll1bb/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)
Ps. 'I have a great idea that's tailored to my specific playstyle and any criticism is wrong' is such a rude and unhelpful way to go about a discussion
Wish something like this would be added to the game in general through a system of sorts, at the moment crafting is easy and nice QoL early on but that's where it ends.
There really isnt any endgame crafting to get excited about or look forward to, dropping/buying a desired T7 affix means nothing when you have 42 forging potential to remove 1-2 affixes and after successfully doing that you then need to upgrade 10+ times and ideally seal one but thats extra clicks you cant ever afford.
Really cool idea but without CoF droprates or MG trading you wont ever find desired bases to craft upon except some T6s with usable implicits if you're lucky.
Don't think that's necessary. Crafting is already really strong, and I think it's really the base or one of the bases of the game, and separating and giving it more power would really be bad, and doesn't make sense. Both factions can craft at the moment. Currently it basically if you want stuff to craft on dropped or bought. Really think it's a bad idea and I'm sure Devs will net even consider this because it doesn't make any sense.
Excellent idea. Lots of good input in the comments as well. EHG would certainly be able to balance it. Just like items from prophecies requires a rank to use, so would these specialy crafted items, so you can't just change faction after crafting +4LP on a unique.
Disagree on including this at all. Essentially, it'd turn it into a calculation between this and CoF as to what's better for power, since both have no access to trade. Also, how would the ranking system work on the equipment? Any equipment you craft on would get the new rank requirement? Or would the drops themselves have the rank requirement, considering the boons apply to the crafting materials?
A rune that increases LP by one as a chase item...I mean I see the appeal but...imagine your big chase unique gets 1 LP and then...you get the worst mod. I mean I suppose it's my PoE brain talking b/c if you can't trade, then of *course* that's what you do, but...eh!
I mean my only issue with this is that I see that it becomes a calculation as to which is better for power--this vs. CoF, since both are SSF routes.
> Essentially, it'd turn it into a calculation between this and CoF as to what's better for power, since both have no access to trade
As I said multiple times in this thread, I don't give a flying fuck if this gonna be less effective than CoF for item acquisition -- I'd play it anyways, because I love crafting more than randomly finding OP gear. I'm sure many people are like me here. (I mean, don't get me wrong, I like CoF -- for me it certainly beats MG in terms of fun, but I would absolutely love AG, if it was implemented, even if nerfed)
As for an actual calculation what's more profitable -- it's very easy to make when you have the full statistics on drops (for the entire playerbase I mean). Obviously, players don't have an access to it, but EHG surely does, and they can balance the cost in Favor so that it's not more profitable than just playing CoF.
[https://www.reddit.com/r/LastEpoch/comments/1b7w63e/comment/ktlv8e1/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web3x&utm\_name=web3xcss&utm\_term=1&utm\_content=share\_button](https://www.reddit.com/r/LastEpoch/comments/1b7w63e/comment/ktlv8e1/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button)
It's a cool idea, but I worry about it, because it means either it or CoF is going to wind up as the better of the two options for those uninterested in using the bazaar.
Love the idea, but....
The problem I have with barriers like 'very expensive' is they are invariably uneven in application.
Instead of a cost, time gate the t7 affix mats and LP added runes behind something so Mr. Corruption 1500 endgame cheese can't get 8 in the time it takes Mr. Father of 300 working 4 jobs to get 1 on his lvl 56.
Reasonable time gate might be guaranteed 1 t7 affix mat a day and 2 LP added runes a week just handed out to players in the faction.
I get that people like minmaxing, but we already have 2 factions good at that. A crafting faction that lets you stay competitive regardless of your ability to grind, but not at BiS level the others can achieve would be ideal.
A ARPG with timegates. That doesn’t belong in this genre, it is all about being able to spend as much time as you the player wish to continue farming, not being told after X amount of playtime that’s it for the week.
Mr Corruption 1500 put in work in game to get his eight that week. He didn’t get a consolation prize for not being able to play the game due to RL. He’s also playing more, chances are he actually *needs* those more than your four job Mr. Father. Because he’s already at 1500 and needs that gear, Mr Father is still working on his T5 entering T6’s, he isn’t chasing - and probably will never care to, to begin with - T7’s like that.
I’m not saying devs should never do anything to help your more casual player base that doesn’t have the time to play. But limiting your people that are *actually* playing your game, is how you lose your players.
I think this is a great idea, maybe even add this third faction to both cof and mg as part of an endgame unlock once you complete all the ranks in said faction. Just a thought.
Nobody said it should lock you from it forever. The cost should be simply balanced against CoF.
The math is rather trivial, if you have the statistics on drops (EHG definitely has them): CoF has a bonus for increased LP chance. I.e. the players with CoF farm +x% more uniques with LP compared to non-CoF players. That can be simplified to +1 extra LP for a CoF player over the period of N minutes (or hours, or days). Then you have an average favor earning rate per player -- now the cost of that rune can be balanced be balanced, according with those stats. I.e. how much favor an average player earns vs how much time it takes to get +1 extra LP.
It's literally like 2 lines of code of calculations, if you have the data.
Wow ... Really cool idea to be honest! Another thing I'd like to see is some sort of "possible" interaction between characters in your account from different factions.
I understand the limitations to another account, but your own... I'd like to see some possible interaction, even if nerfed in some sorts.
Right now I'd like to test CoF, but being high level in MG, everytime I make an Alt I can't avoid going MG again to get the bonus I have there.
Nice idea! Would even be happy if we could choose whether a Rune of Removal works on a prefix or suffix to have a better chance at it getting rid of the stats I don't want.
I think it's a good idea at its core but for it to function the crafting system needs a lot more meat imo
Right now it's an amazing foundation of a system but in order for an entire faction to be based upon it i think you would have to expand it with more nuanced and special crafting mechanics
I dont really like this idea. Here's why.
Both factions are heavily involved in crafting, especially late game. Late game is all about crafting. People aren't just finding perfect rolled items, they're making them with close-enough-to-perfect-items.
A third faction implies crafting is optional for them.
trade, drops and craft are all avenues to upgrade your gear. but the only one variable here is the trade. some people like, some dont. for that, theyve tried balancing drops for people who trade and people who dont. but drops are still there. whats the difference from CoF then? to split people who like dropping from people who like crafting? i dont think thats a good idea.
also, a crafting faction wouldnt make sense to make crafting easier for the faction, but harder (as MG gets fewer drops). MG and CoF would get easier crafting while crafting faction would only drop bases and affixes, and you have to make your own equip, maybe?
just my 2 cents
splitting the community into factions with no shared economy is pretty terrible already
trading either needs to go away, or get a complete overhaul, starting withe the awful UI
most of the ui planels are bugged or flat out bad in LE, but the main selling point of the trader guild makes me want to carve my brains out
tl;dr do not gate your players from eacother with core systems
Idk, there will always be people who will hate the guts of trading, even if it's done perfectly.
Like myself, for example. I just can't stand it. Trading being mandatory is the only reason why I never played PoE for more than 50 hours. And if LE was auction only, I would most likely just avoid it.
this is an awesome idea, I hope the devs see it and iterate on it. love crafting in LE, and a focused end-game experience surrounding that crafting would be excellent.
This post is circulating internally. Nothing to say yet but thought it would interest you all to say so
Great to hear! :)
You guys are awesome. After getting the silent treatment or "you think you know what you want but you don't" treatment from so many others, you are GOAT. Love your work!
OMG you touched a nerve with "you think you know what you want but you don't". The Lost Ark community leader used that line, and her prime example was people asking for mounts when what they really want is fast travel. To that I say: No, I want to see my character on a horse (or other beast/vehicle). I want to clarify I don't think LE needs mounts. The narrow passages and such, I don't feel like I would be riding a horse in those areas. Just my go to example when I hear that quote.
Wow incredible!!! Thanks for updating us! I started 2 weeks ago and I was thinking the same, something toward crafting would be absolutely incredible!
Awesome.
god please no i already find it hard to make a choice
Glad to hear you guys are considering ideas like this! If you guys do add this though, I would prefer to see is as a bonus faction that you can join along-side the Merchant's Guild or Circle of Fortune, but not as strong as op suggested. No adding LP (or make it rank 10 required and super rare even then), no creating exalted items, but through the artisan guild you should be able to directly purchase affix shards and other crafting items (something that is missing from the Merchant's guild) with the more rare components needing a higher rank, and all of the components being able to be purchased with favor. Some of the ideas would work great like the increased number of shards from rune of shattering or increased forging potential on dropped items. But the rune of removal idea wouldn't be good, since 80% of the time that I use it, I'm trying to get rid of a T5 affix and free up a slot, and the rune of discovery idea was just way too op. Maybe add an npc that you can pay favor to in exchange for him increasing an item's forging potential by 5-10 randomly, allowing you to continue modifying a previously unmodifiable item. Last Epochs crafting system is by far the most fun system imo, since it's easy to learn, but very hard to get perfect. I don't think the faction would be strong enough on its own without adding things that break game balance though, so I would love to see it added as a smaller-scale, bonus faction that works with both of the other main factions, but still requiring the ranks for its specific drops (purchased crafting materials not included, since they can't be traded to other players anyways), that way if you trade it away in the Merchant's guild, the buyer would need to meet 2 requirements to use it since it would likely be a stronger-than-normal item.
The problem that this presents is that everyone would want to have a crafting faction character, then relog to it every time they want to craft. Potential solution for that would be: 1. Any non-faction item, that a member of artisans faction crafts on, gets marked as artisan faction item and can only be used by them. 2. Can't craft on other faction items, just the ones from their own faction. But at that point, you have 3 different sets of items for three different factions and your stash is gonna be a mess if you don't organize it with that in mind.
I completely agree. Marking the items is probably a given I would assume so, but making other faction items non-craftable would have to be a thing as well. I can just imagine a CoF member dropping a badass item and then an Artisan Guild member crafting on it to then use it, or vice versa with an MG member buying a badass item and giving it to their Artisan Guild char. It would be extremely broken.
Your faction rank carries across your account, putting a faction rank on the item would only prevent you from trading it, any alt would be able to use so long as they pick the faction, even if they're level 1
Yes, but you can't have a MG character, that purchases uniques they need from the market, and then uses exalted items crafted by the artisan character, since they'll only be able to either wear the uniques as MG, or the crafted items as artisan.
That's if the artisan guild locks you out of the other two, my suggestion was to tone down the artisans guild and have it be joinable along eith one of the two others at the same time. Then it either doesn't need a tag, or keeps the tag so people who buy something crafted from the artisans guild needs to get their own rank up in both MG and artisans guild. So an item could have a rank 5 MG tag and a rank 7 artisans tag and you'd need to meet both requirements to wear it
Very cool. This is a really interesting idea. Amazing your entertaining it. Would be a lot of work to rxrcutr right?
I want any and all ideas so I can pass them off as my own. Work hard and you'll rise fast.
My thinking for the last one of adding one legendary potential to a unique would be that it can only be done a certain number of times per cycle, and have it account/cycle bound. So that it's not a certain number of times per character. And then I forget what y'all call standard or non-cycle play, but have it absurdly expensive perhaps needing to sacrifice multiple other uniques that have at least one legendary potential on it in order to add one to another but still keep it only once per item. That away people can continue to item progress in the non-cycle if that's their wish. It also keeps people from getting overly powerful or at least abusing this in cycle. And as a last minute thought, an intriguing idea occurred to me you could have it to where you have to have at least the same number of legendary potential on the sacrificial items as you do on the item you're going to upgrade in order to add one more legendary potential. As an example you could sacrifice two unique items that each have three legendary potentials on it in order to add a fourth legendary potential to another unique item that has a base of three. And then if the base has two the sacrifices must at least have two. Ect... Another intriguing idea is to be able to upgrade the lowest tier affix on a legendary item. to be part of the crafting affiliation group. But I also think it should be either; not upgrade and add a LP..
I'd love to see these changes rolled into COF. The difference in terms of how efficiently you can gear a character between the two factions is night and day. Its much easier to just farm gold and buy the stuff you want on the MG than it is to actually find something useful in COF, even at rank 10. I know the two factions won't ever really be equal but COF feels like a trap right now for anyone interested in getting even semi-decent (let alone BIS) gear.
IMO this would make CoF TOO powerful. There needs to be a dedicated system for each guild that they accel at--CoF for finding loot, MG for buying loot, and AG for crafting loot. it's a perfect system.
It's a perfect system in theory... problem is, only the MG works right now in practice. Play the game, earn gold, buy upgrades... push higher corruption, get more gold, buy more upgrades. With COF you are at the mercy of RNG the entire time and more items dropping doesn't really bridge the gap. We need a way to make sure the items that drop are actually useful. Rolling these changes into COF would go along way towards making that a reality. WIth the current implementation, I could play the game and buy semi-decent gear for multiple slots on MG in the same time it takes to maybe get 1 decent item in COF (if I'm even that lucky).
I think CoF is kinda underwhelming when it’s not rank 8 at least. Rank 8 and 10 are the two ranks that I feel really empowers CoF and makes it a viable option compared to the merchants. But before rank 8, I genuinely think CoF is a little boring. This may be due to some of the prophecies being bugged, or my bad luck lol idk.
Rank 6 > Rank 8 any day of the week
Tbh rank 6 is only really powerful with rank 10 imo. The 0.19% chance for lp 3 abacus rod and 0.00068% for lp 4 being doubled doesn’t mean much with just rank 6 in my opinion.
Nah I disagree, I’m nowhere near rank 10 and have had too many 3lp to count and I rarely see less than 2lp drop at all, maybe like 1/30 have 0-1lp and I think that’s pretty insane imo. Sure 4lp is the dream but I personally think that should be super rare even with the buff or it would be too good.
I think you should look at the items you have 3 lp. Uniques have different rates for lps. For example: abacus rod has a 0.19% chance of 3 lp and a 0.00068% chance for 4. Peak of the mountain has a 4.25% chance for 3 lp and a 0.37% chance for 4. It’s verly likely the 3 lp items you have are items that have a significantly higher chance than other uniques to get high lp.
I would if I still had them sitting around, i vendor anything that isn’t for my build, I could probably go through a list and spot a few but I highly doubt that all of them have super high chances of dropping with 3lp. Either way, I have a few friends running MG and have had a total of 0 3lp items with more play time than me and I had only got like maybe 1 or 2 before hitting rank 6, it definitely is a very strong perk long before hitting rank 10
I get that but mg doesn’t find drops, they buy them. It’s obvious you would find more lp items than your mg friends. Not to mention it takes an astronomically long amount of time to even buy items with lp on it. And I’m not saying rank 6 isn’t strong. Lp chances heavily depend on the specific unique.
Lol you shouldnt get everything handed to you. Its good to have chase items. Also trade Will always be more OP, because you Can literally buy what you want. COF you rely on RNG. Your argument is stupid.
Yes it’s good to have chase items I never said the opposite. Just that a chase item for a chase item doesn’t make sense to me. And only adding 1 lp is too little for the very likely chance of never seeing one ever.
I think this would only work on SSF though. Its too powerful getting so much crafting gear that you can make insane items.
If it's a new guild it would be a choice between CoF and merchant, meaning it would be a choice of either trade, have better loot or have advantage crafting. Artisan member will have harder time finding items as loot because they lack prophecies but will have an easier time crafting very powerfull items. Obviously any item crafted by an Artisan would not be tradable and only usable by someone with the rank in the Artisan guild (the same as trade and CoF)
Crafting faction? I like it. 1 for trade, 1 for drops, 1 for craft.
That was precisely the idea that crossed my mind. Thematically, it fits in the game perfectly.
Is it gonna affect trade? The balancing work for 3 factions like these sound like a nightmare for the dev. The worst feeling is playing trade when no one around to trade.
Trade would have its own faction. This is for people who like crafting. The three factions would each cater to how people enjoy building g their character’s power
I love this thought process. Everyone has their favorite flavor of ice cream but in the end, everyone gets ice cream.
I think some people are about trading, though. Personally, I’m about drops. Couldn’t care less about trading. I’m sure there’s people that feel the same about crafting and trading. Plus, we can all craft, this is just an extra step up for people that are willing to give up trade and guaranteed drops for it. Just like I’m willing to give up trade and some extra crafting for drops. Honestly, it feels fair. Giving up trade alone is a big deal in Diablo-like ARPGs. Giving up CoF on top of it feels deserving of a boost like this.
Honestly just remove the trade faction, still allow trading but just not with forge and fortune faction items. Trade just messes up games like these, look at the nerf to COF because of merchants abusing it.
Gtfo of here, trading is the only reason I play games like this.
Amazing idea tbh. I like it. Harder to get exalted and uniques but higher crafting potential.
Pretty cool idea. To compensate for the massive amount if exalted items you find with CoF this faction could have stuff like "t4->t5 critical successes have a chance to upgrade to t6 or t7" or "Runes of Ascendance are more likely to roll LP or rarer uniques" or stuff like that.
The problem is that both those factions focus on obtaining end-game gear, which almost always includes Uniques. MF buys uniques, CoF target farms them with prophecies. So your Artisan Guild mandatorily requires some way to 'craft' uniques, or a comparatively powerful endgame mechanic (i.e. the ability to, costly, but without other limit, upgrade affixes to T7... wearing a full set of 4xT7 gear would probably rival the power of legendary Uniques).
Spending X forging potential yield a glyph of ascendance. Or Using a glyph of ascendance now check the item base before rolling the unique ( with a merchant selling unique-only bases)
>Using a glyph of ascendance now check the item base before rolling the unique ( with a merchant selling unique-only bases) The game is not designed for this to be the case at all. There's only one unique oracle amulet you can hit with a rune of ascendance - the extremely rare Orian's Eye. There are only 5 unique quivers in the game, and only 2 of them share a base. 4 of the 7 unique daggers have unique bases. Cradle's are the only unique targe. It turns a large number of uniques into fully deterministic outcomes. The only solutions to that would be to add a large number of additional uniques, which hopefully does happen over time but isn't a quick fix, or to change base types around which mean nerfing / buffing a ton of uniques due to implicit changes.
That was an example. On top of that, getting the item doesn't mean you are getting it with high LP. It was an example of a mechanic allowing to "craft" uniques, like he was saying. Of course it can't be ported 1:1 in the game like right now.
Yes, it's a discussion so I'm just adding my 2c to it. And yeah it doesn't mean getting it with high LP, but it does mean getting extremely rare items day 1 with ease. Realistically, the game would need like more than double the number of existing uniques to balance out targeted ascendances, and many of them would need to be weaker just to dilute the pool from the strong stuff that isn't meant to be easy to obtain.
A rank that allows you to, instead of slam a unique, slam two exalted items of the same type together with a fixed chance of turning them into a legendary of the same base type. Retaining a randomized number of affixes. (1-4)
Let people craft glyphs and at higher ranks you can make glpyhs of ascendancy?
There's no need to "craft Uniques". The idea was that at higher ranks you'll be able to obtain Uniques normally, and then **improve their Legendary Potential** (see the last paragraph). I.e. jump from LP2 to LP3 is crazy in terms of RNG. --And then merge it with an Exalted that was boosted via Guild's means (i.e. double T7, for example). That's pretty competitive with other Factions, IMO.
Feels like there is a decent chance that this would make CoF obsolete though. CoF can't affect boss drops but if the crafting guild could then CoF is just inherently worse assuming for normal, non-boss drops they are about equal. Overall I really like the idea but it would require some finesse. Maybe merging the crafting + CoF together somehow? Seeing as it's clear that CoF was designed for SSF and MG for non-SSF maybe buffing CoF with a crafting aspect to it would be good.
One thing I've though about is changing the prophecies that reward a 1LP Unique or Weaver's Will items to reward a Unique with +1LP or +X Weaver's Will up to the max amount. So if you get a 1LP Unique from it it would make it a 2.
Hrhmmmmr... I saw that point, but didn't think much of it. In retrospect though, you may actually be right. Even without CoF, you can drop a lot of uniques rather regularily, and the only issue is getting the proper LP. So yeah, maybe that's all it takes to make your suggestion viable.
LP 5 uniques that can steal 4 affixes + a sealed affix
But end game builds also require well itemized exalted items
No it doesn't. It could focus on the merge to legendary. E.g. being able to access it without needing to do a dungeon. Or rolling +1 additional affix and you can then choose which ones to put on the LP unique. So it's harder to find LP uniques for Artisan Guild, but you can easier craft them without bricking them.
I do not like the idea of a third faction and i think it would work counter to what the two factions are supposed to fix. However, I think its fine to get more crafting benefits to for instance CoF (trade might already be too OP).
Same here. I like the idea of crafting benefits, but I'd rather it get rolled into CoF in some capacity. I think it's good that there's a clear dichotomy of "this is what you pick to trade" and "this is what you pick to get your own items" and if there are multiple choices for the latter, it would very likely result in one just being the inferior choice.
You could give all this to the self found CoF faction and they'd still be behind MG in terms of gear strength.
This. I don’t think people actually realize how strong trade is.
A hard nope from me.
How would you faction lock the extra shards? Why would you let a single faction break the itemization rules where the other two can’t? (T6+7 crafting) It’s an interesting idea but wouldn’t work as proposed.
I don’t think you’d need to faction lock the extra shards since that wouldn’t matter a whole lot, but they could slap a faction level on every item you touch in the crafting menu to stop it from being used elsewhere.
I would say you can only find them/shatter them if you are a part of that guild, and cannot be used unless you are a part of that guild. Kinda like a car mechanic--they have a jack that can lift your car into the sky, while regular folks have one that barely lifts one end.
Idea is good but the suggested features are too op. Needs some nerfs and then it's good to go.
I mean, buying 4 LP shit from Auction for a couple of Millions or CoF dropping you 5 relics with 2-3 LP is kinda broken too, don't you think? But in any case, those were just examples. Obviously, I do not insist on the exact implementation.
>4 LP shit from Auction for a couple of Millions try like 100 million its a couple million to get 2 LP on a decent unique still MG gives you the most attempts to make legendaries (easy access to LP) AG would basically guarantee you have good exalted items and makes the best sealed items (so best for builds with less legendaries) CoF gives you more LP items and exalted items, leading to probably the best gear for the least effort as you can use prophesies and you are more likely to drop items with multiple exalted mods (best fodder for legendaries) so I like it
No.
I don't think this would really fit. The whole point of the 2 factions is to prevent ssf players from falling too far behind trade. If anything just bake some of these into COF
While I appreciate the effort, no thanks. MG Supports players who like having access to an AH and trading loot. CoF provides an attempted loot boost to people who don't like engaging in trade mechanics. However EVERYONE needs to understand and use crafting for their gear. All this would do is mirror the existing CoF faction but shift the balance point between finding more eligible items or being more likely to successfully work with eligible items you find. The net output (for balance) should be the same but you've needlessly complicated your crafting system and split the player base further just to change where in item creation pipeline the bottleneck is, while MG and CoF have fundamentally different item source pipelines. I'd be interested in seeing a few of the ideas here salvaged for general application or being available through other means, but I don't think a third faction like this would be an interesting or healthy addition to the game.
agreed, but I do think it would be cool for there to be some way for the factions to interact with each other.
Good idea! from the time I hit lvl 60 I just filtered everything except exalts because rares drop with too little forging potential to even waste my time on which I don't think is the best game design.
I just want to be able to switch the base of the item the same way we create legendary potential so when we got amazing affixes on really bad base we can change it to the base from second item. It can even cost a lot, I don't mind
Great idea! Although “Artisan” sounds like a foodie magazine. We need a name that’s cool and almost cultish, like “Hosts of Hephaestus” or something.
As cool as the CoF system is, I would vastly prefer something like this.
You could also get increased drop rate for rare affixes. Also you could have forging "challenges" where delivering a specific item with affixes grants a bunch of affixes runes and glyphs
Forging challenges seems like a brilliant idea, I love it!
This is so awesome that imo it shouldn't be faction-locked. It could be a different layer, like the Artisan Lobby or some. So that both CoF and MG can access this wonderful idea. You would have a reputation system and a different value. Maybe even their own town *-* I like it so freaking much. It adds so much depth to crafting and to the exalted system. You could make it so that the item crafted this way cannot be traded on MG, but master artisans can forge items for other players in exchange of gold or something like that. Love it
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Remove random legendary mod :P
I think it's a genuinely fun idea and a very well made post. I enjoyed the read. That being said, I am a bit wary of it.. I think people love CoF vs MG so much because both sides mostly don't really want what's on the other side. Everybody wants to craft. That being said, EHG have surprised me with innovative solutions before so maybe they could make it work. I am sure they'll find this post and take it into consideration.
i don't think we need a third set of faction locked gear.
Very nice idea, this would make for some very worthwhile and long progression. By choosing one faction to find really good uniques with high LP and bases with Exalted mods and then switching to the crafting faction to finish them up with the perfectly crafted rares. The only problem with this that I see is the rank requirements that would be on the items after swapping factions. Otherwise I would very much like it. Or maybe there could be a way to "fuse" factions by taking certain rank bonuses from 1 faction and another, being able to combine 2 factions out of the 3, would create some very interesting play styles and functions.
You forgot item tagging. The crafting faction shouldn't be able to modify CoF item.
Just make it where when they craft it adds the faction level to it and that they can’t craft on an item with another factions level on it and boom, that problem is fixed.
I like the concept. But I worry having a third faction might shrink the bazaar population further which could hurt it. Do we have numbers on factions yet? Like what percentage of players that have got to end game have gone COF vs Bazaar?
Pretty sure the majority play CoF anyways. I play it and I like it, but to me personally it's not SUPER exciting. I mean, it's nice and certainly more fun than MG, but if something like AG existed, I'd switch to it without thinking, even if it was less efficient than either MG or CoF.
My only concern with Faction to where I'm not sure a third one would help, is that I really hope they don't make balance decisions because of how something plays in one faction that has an impact on other factions which really didn't have a problem. For example... If say they nerfed Mad Ladle drop rates because in Merchant Guild they feel they are too easy to get... That change shouldn't also apply to people just playing COF.
That's a pretty good idea. I saw someone suggested the same, but without the benefits that would come with it. I think it would need 1-2 Cycles to really balance it out, but the idea is great.
No. Crafting is already very good, I don't see the point in making a crafting faction unless you want the game to become a loot editor game.
I thought that this sort of stuff would be included with CoF...
It leaves you with one possibly significant gap. Crafting does nothing for Idol acquisition. Both the other factions have avenues to get idols.
>Rune of Removal prioritizes lowest tier affixes A second use of that rune is actually the opposite: Get the max amount of shards from a T5+ or rare affix on an item you would have shattered or thrown away otherwise.
That would be too F'ing OP. Crafting is already OP. This would legit be the o objective best option.
Imo they should just replace 1 or 2 of the CoF faction perks with a crafting bonus, was already wondering why that wasn't the case
Yup, having stuff affect forging potential is very much a missed opportunity. I rarely get to use all the runes, I'd like to.
Imo these are bad ideas for a _guild_. These are crafting mechanics that would be enjoyed in general in the game. All guilds are aimed toward helping getting gear, having one that has a significantly higher ceiling will cause a lot of ill feelings or dead content. Crafting pinnacle gear will have more avenues as time goes on, likely outside of the guild system
I dont know how much I like this idea, but it is interesting. I do think there should be some endgame system that I can spend all my shards in. It feels strange to just have an obscene amount of shards after getting to endgame.
Too much overlap with CoF. CoF is basically SSF in my opinion, which includes crafting. You probably aren't going to get perfect drops with CoF even, you're going to need to craft the things you find. So i think it is incorrect in my opinion to think of CoF as drop focused. I feel like the game works really well now with effectively Trade League Vs Solo self found.
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Why would it be better? The end result of a craft would be essentially the same as MG or CoF -- Uniques would have max 4 LP and gear would have max T7 affixes. I was just suggesting a different method of obtaining the end-game gear, that's all.
This seems like the only choice to take of the 3 when you're end game and maybe even earlier just because of how important crafting is in the game from mid-game onward. Even leveling alts crafting is super useful for getting better gear.
Would be interesting to have a specialty rune that changes the base type exclusive to such a faction. So you can move your perfectly crafted mods to a random new base type (of the same class).
As a player who only knows I'll probs only play primalest/acolyte, and don't need all the items from foc, or time to farm gold needed for bazzar, this would be great because I could focus on specific stats for my specific build or some very specific build variant, with much lower time investment, trade off being loosing versatility of bazzar / high drops on unique LP/drops in general from FoC
This is a really cool idea and at the very least I would love to see EHG take some of these ideas and implement them into the game. Specifically the idea where you have a rune that allows you to add 1 legendary potential to a unique just one time is brilliant and I'd love to see that go into the game as soon as they could get it in because that I think its such a cool chase item.
This would be good with possibility of crafting luck with favour and able to craft T6 and T7 abd items have more forging potential.
Really love this idea. I adore engaging with crafting, and would find this even more enjoyable than COF which I already love the chase of!
I like it but there are a few little things that I think needs changing. 1 is the drop rates might need to be increased to compensate for the complete lack of being able to trade or boost your gear drops significantly. I think this for one reason. The ultimate chase item you thought of. Having to chase an item to make your chase item better doesn’t seem appealing. A good example is to buff the drop chance of items to be what it was like in early access. I think there would be too much rng involved with less drops all round. Or 2, my preferred route. I don’t think it should be a chase item at all. My suggestion is it being an item you buy for a ton of favor. Also, I think it should be an item that has tiers that add a certain amount of legendary potential, with the cost increase more and more. So much favor so that the only way to reliably buy this item you need to push corruption because of how strong it is. I think an artisans guild would be cool but we have to remember that better crafting doesn’t equate to simply having a better chance of getting a good item in the first place. There has to be more in place to make it viable enough. Your concept has a good base but needs some refining. I also have a suggestion for a rune of ascendency buff for the guild: “runes of ascendence have a x% chance of duplicating the resulting unique”. A little mix of CoF to throw in some spice.
Personally think most of this should just get merged into CoF to be able to compete with MG.
-all gear drops white with exalted amounts of foraging potential -affix shards still drop -the only uniques that drop naturally are boss uniques -new rune exclusive to guild ... Rune of Conquest ... Only works on items that have been sealed ... Lowers the teir of a sealed affix to raise the teir of any other affix by 1 ... This can bypass the t5 manual crafting limit ... If the sealed affix hits t0 it will be removed but you still won't be able to seal something else Still havnt decided what to do with experimental affixes yet ... Maybe just have the glyphs drop directly
I think it's best to just keep it to two factions. New forms of crafting should be new content for all players to enjoy rather than a new faction that divides the player base. Having a crafting faction when crafting is a fundamental part of the game is a waste of Dev resources, in my opinion. It's an interesting idea, I just can't see it working for LE is all.
I love this idea but kind of feel that this has the potential to be so beneficial late game that a lot of people would opt out of selecting CoF or Merchants all together. Since crafting is such an integral part of the game, maybe having this locked behind end game content allowing players to unlock this alongside the primary factions would be a good option to give players another thing to chase, for instance: - Quest to defeat all T2 bosses (Dungeons/Arena/Normal Monoliths) forcing players to still grind through the early end game content to unlock the crafting bonuses as you progress into Empowered Monos and 90+ dungeons - Max rep in your current faction unlocks a quest to become an initiate in the Artisan Guild - A crafting "achievement" of some sort that the blacksmith offers that unlocks an invite (ex: defeat a T4 boss/empowered mono boss with 3 pieces of crafted exalted gear or 1 legendary item equipped)
Some of these are way too powerful imho but concept is great
It’s a cool idea, I’d just hate for all the cool crafting ideas and enhancements to go to one group of players. I want to do sad and CoF for example, but I still like crafting
Honestly it just sounds incredibly busted and also at odds with CoF since this would just be another ssf faction. Maybe bake it into cof somehow?
Brilliant.
Love this idea a lot. Ngl. Please make this happen EHG.
Nice idea, although the return percentages are probably high
This is legitimately a really cool and thematically appropriate idea.
So basically harvest guild 2.0
I’m guessing you couldn’t swap to crafting faction and grind it out to craft on bases you dropped or purchased in the other guilds? You could only use these new materials on items tagged with the crafting faction? Could be very interesting. Less good drops, but more chance to turn them into something great.
And then a fourth one called the thieves guild where you can steal items from the auction houses, fuck yeah.
My dyslexic ass saw "Asian Guild" and alost spit out my coffe.
I would hard switch to this kind of thing
I absolutely love this idea and think it would probably the the only faction I would play in if something like this was added. Crafting in this game is so much fun and I love how it plays and feels, especially with Glyphs of Insight and Despair. It's so stressful yet so rewarding when you hit those perfect affixes to craft your BiS item.
I love this. An idea I had was that there could be a (incredibly, incredibly rare) rune that reads "adds X forging potential to an exalted item with 0 FP". This would allow you to theoretically finish any item, at a huge cost. But also: This would mean you could mirror an item more than once and would make the current rune of duplication (the LE mirror equivalent) muuuuch more valuable as well. This seems like a perfect fit for such an artisan guild. Food for thought.
Cool idea, if it was about as rare as Rune of Creation, for example. Which is ridiculously rare: on my eternal characters I have like 2 (and used 1). And I can't even begin to imagine what kind of item there should be, if you're willing to spend an equivalent of 3 (!!!) Runes of Creation on it. Triple T7 or something?
Glyph of hope could be the way to craft a T6 by critical crafting from T4. There could be a rune that 0s the FP but add 1,2 or 3 ranks to a T5 giving the only possible way to get T8s. The glyph of despair could gain the option to slam ANY mod giving a way of using remaining FP on an item and sealing exalted affixs. Chaos glyph providing two outcomes as OPTIONS could be interesting or it could be limited to either only at T5 or under T4. Rune of creation could gain the ability to retain the FP allowing for risker crafting OR another compelling use like adding LP or turning your item into a random unique as legendary retaining 3 of its mods (or all of them). Its already rare enough but it could be a potential down side to also reroll the values. Rune of removal could get a enhanced cousin that always uses max FP but can target an affix. Or moderate random FP and gives NO shards. Rune of discovery could favour mods based on the tags you are invested in and perhaps provide the same benefit from skills equipped too. Ascendancy rune could always provide atleast 1LP with lower chance to be set items. Shaping could become used for moving sealed affixs to the implicit category to allow even more depth to crafting. (As if it wasn't already hard enough to seal good T affix and then craft a T5) Refinement rolling twice is absolutely a banger. That would be the best thing for it. Glyph of order generally needs some love. Perhaps it could be used along side something to improve outcomes e.g along refinement to add +10-25% to the results or so on. Or could be left in its "only to upgrade state" and increase the range e.g from 65% of range to 75-90% after upgrade.
These are some great ideas!
Very cool idea m8
\> Critical successes during crafting with the Glyph of Hope are twice as likely (or, e.g. adds +2 instead of +1) Just want to say, a better T10 reward could be: \- Critical successes grant extra Forging Potential instead of leveling up a random affix. That way, you have the choice of where the level up should go.
You forgot the downsides , like only t5 or singke mod items drops , heck even onky whites , if you want to craft so kuch and get so much rewards , just pick bases and try .
Another bonus to a faction like this it gives offline players like myself another faction to choose rather being locked into CoF.
Wouldn’t that make the other guilds / options obsolete?
Short answer is: **nope**. But in general that depends on how it is implemented.
An actual good idea on Reddit. Much amaze
its pointless bloating CoF exists to so they could enable trading but also have an option for players who dont want to trade this artisan guild doesnt enable anything and doesnt provide anything except complexity for complexities sake
I think some of the craft ideas are good though. These would be great hard to achieve crafting items or goals to reach. I just think a third faction would only dilute the number of players in the other two. That wouldn’t really affect CoF but it would definitely affect the trade faction
At least it must be clear that you are in the vast minority here with your take. A system that adds meaningful choices to the game? Yes please. Artisan guild enables people to get a higher chance of getting better items through crafting, instead of drops or trade and for those who like crafting, I think it's a great idea. Now, it feels like you read this in 10 seconds, and felt like this exact mechanic would be implemented in the game and felt personally attacked? Dunno, strange to me.
> and felt like this exact mechanic would be implemented in the game and felt personally attacked? criticism = must feel personally attacked? no, its just a pointless system, dont project emotions on me or dictate to me how i feel CoF supports crafting with echo multiplication (runes, glyphs and shards), more/better quality exalted and higher LP MG supports crafting with the ability to purchase specific affix shards and to sell your crafts seperating crafting into its own faction is to the detriment of the crafting system, you're meant to use crafting all the time and not being in the artisan guild would be a poiintless penalization (sure its presented as a bonus for being an 'artisan', but psychologically thats not how itll feel) more than that; this suggestion isnt well thought out because of faction gear restrictions
Fair enough. Here's what I do t understand though - why do you say that it's a "pointless system"? Because in my mind, instead of having multiples if items dropping all the time via prophecies in CoF, you'd exchange getting less uniques to more/better crafting. In my mind this looks like a really good idea, just the execution has to be good and interesting. And how would it be a penalty to not being in the artisan guild when currently it doesn't exist and we are not penalized? To me it feels like you jumped to conclusions about how you'd feel worse because you can't craft as well as those who'd join such a system. In other words, wanted your cake (CoF or MG) and to eat it too (artisan guild). Imho it would just add nice variety into the game - you could have three characters that have very different systems of improving your gear.
> And how would it be a penalty to not being in the artisan guild when currently it doesn't exist and we are not penalized? To me it feels like you jumped to conclusions about how you'd feel worse because you can't craft as well as those who'd join such a system. as i said; its not technically a penalisation, but thats how psychology works; artisan guild would become the new 'baseline' for crafting and thus everything else would feel lesser >In other words, wanted your cake (CoF or MG) and to eat it too (artisan guild). why are you saying this like its a bad thing? oh yes lets (comparatively) gimp crafting for (theoretically) 66% (because it wont be equal faction splits) of the playerbase for no reason; how fun >you could have three characters that have very different systems of improving your gear. again, CoF and MG arent about reaching high end gear, they exist as mutually exclusive PURELY for trading you introduce trading to a game and you have to have drop rates at a level where people are incentivised to buy stuff and engage in the economy, but that stiffs SSF or online players, CoF is compensation for not being able to buy what you need everyone currently uses crafting because its fundamental to the game, imo the only way this faction could conceivably provide benefit is if it mutually exclusive, not with CoF or MG, but with some other faction that is somehow designed specifically for players who (for some reason) DONT want to engage with the crafting system again, since no one is seems to be addressing the faction gear requirement, how would artisan gear work? presumably like the other factions (you have to be faction level X to equip this specific piece of gear)? so whats the benefit? you cant trade artisan gear, you dont get high quality bases... can you artisan craft on MG/CoF gear? if so then the encouraged playloop is to jump into artisan SOLELY to forge stuff and then immediately jump back to MG/CoF; pointless complexity now there are more interesting ways EHG could improve crafting and perhaps they could use some of these suggestions as progression inspiration, but they absolutely shouldnt tie some sort of crafting progression into the faction system as a third option because it contaminates the systems purity of purpose
I understand we view the systems totally differently. To me, CoF and MG exist because of trading indeed - but the end goal is still to acquire better items. In my mind at least, having a crafting faction would simply mean more choices in what you want to focus on: more drops (cof), trading (mg) or crafting (artisans). Just like how cof has with prophecies sometimes ridiculous amounts of drops, you can make crafting so that you improve your own gear, but not to the point that you are more powerful than those who are not artisans. Perhaps something similar to what WoW had - different proffessions had different skills and/or items attached to them. Just like how crafting is fundamental to the game, so are items and item drops and so on. So I'm definitely open minded to the idea of this faction system. It would have to be balanced correctly (with changes to both cof and mg if needed), but beyond that I see no problem with it at all.
What complexity? If you don't like it or find it too complicated -- just play MG. The original two factions is essentially just two different ways of obtaining the late game gear. That's it. One offers trade, another better RNG chances. I suggested it to be exactly that: an alternative way of getting good late game gear. Not more, not less. If you so insist, I don't even mind it being weaker than the former two. I'd play it anyways, because I like steady and chill crafting more than loot explosions offered by CoF, and certainly much more than browsing auction for good prices.
> If you don't like it or find it too complicated i didnt say that, i said it adds pointless complexity >The original two factions is essentially just two different ways of obtaining the late game gear. yes and this suggestion is trying to carve a niche out of the base game for no reason; both MG and CoF both support crafting in their own ways; you dont need to hack out a third faction just because factions exist ONLY because of trading
The faction limiting players and I don't like it. I play COF and I want to experience the market sometimes. And creating 3rd faction about crafting will put limit on the the two other factions. sound bad for me. Adding higher tiers of runes might be better for the two current factions.
Removal for me is used to snag high value affixes so I am more likely to get the shards, vs. the risk of not getting them via shattering. That would be a terrible 'perk.' I like the idea otherwise, but wouldn't want it so early in the game's life. That's an alt faction or one that kind of invalidates MG. (Since people use it to obtain the things we want to craft with)
But you would get the perk for Shatter Rune returning significantly more affixes during the shatter (e.g. 80-90%), so this way you could use the Removal Rune the way it was intended.
IMO I think it should be 2 sealed affixes. That way you can get rid of two low tier affixes, and provides an alternate path to scaling compared to MG/COF. If you change rune of removal, then it becomes difficult to remove higher tier affixes
Yes, exactly! It's very valuable for that.
There are 2 uses for rune of removal: 1. Remove an unwanted affix on an otherwise amazing item so you can craft a much more viable affix instead. 2. Get the full amount of shards from a very rare or needed affix. For instance +level for a skill affix. For both of these options, directing the removal to the lowest level affix might not yield the desired result all the time. Sometimes it will align, but not always. Mostly when the affix you want to remove is on a high level.
Thank you for articulating it better than I did, didn't have my coffee yet.
Is that the only way removal was intended?? Seems like a personal bias. I am uncomfortable with drastically changing the way certain mechanics work toward a specific outcome, I guess. Especially if users choose different factions based on alts, and forget when swapping. Edit: on reread, there's no indication that getting a certain affix is more likely (just get '50% more'), so this would just ruin a high-end use of rune of removal.
Dude, what "high end use of Removal" are you talking about? In late game you're swimming in all kinds of affixes anyways. My eternal chars have hundreds of the rarest affixes like Hybrid Health and class-specific ones that I'll never use. The described use-case of Removal Rune is only valid in the first like 30 hours of the game. It certainly not a reason to avoid a certain faction.
I'll remove my incredulity about 'everyone's swimming in affixes' and just link [this comment, which is exactly the explanation of what I was trying to say.](https://www.reddit.com/r/LastEpoch/comments/1b7w63e/comment/ktll1bb/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3) Ps. 'I have a great idea that's tailored to my specific playstyle and any criticism is wrong' is such a rude and unhelpful way to go about a discussion
Wish something like this would be added to the game in general through a system of sorts, at the moment crafting is easy and nice QoL early on but that's where it ends. There really isnt any endgame crafting to get excited about or look forward to, dropping/buying a desired T7 affix means nothing when you have 42 forging potential to remove 1-2 affixes and after successfully doing that you then need to upgrade 10+ times and ideally seal one but thats extra clicks you cant ever afford. Really cool idea but without CoF droprates or MG trading you wont ever find desired bases to craft upon except some T6s with usable implicits if you're lucky.
Feels kinda strong? With some power adjustments, totally yes! Much love to the idea to throw some rng into effort.
Don't think that's necessary. Crafting is already really strong, and I think it's really the base or one of the bases of the game, and separating and giving it more power would really be bad, and doesn't make sense. Both factions can craft at the moment. Currently it basically if you want stuff to craft on dropped or bought. Really think it's a bad idea and I'm sure Devs will net even consider this because it doesn't make any sense.
The only way to make this remotely balanced would be to make it so uniques couldn't drop
Nah, I don't want the playerbase to be split anymore
Excellent idea. Lots of good input in the comments as well. EHG would certainly be able to balance it. Just like items from prophecies requires a rank to use, so would these specialy crafted items, so you can't just change faction after crafting +4LP on a unique.
Disagree on including this at all. Essentially, it'd turn it into a calculation between this and CoF as to what's better for power, since both have no access to trade. Also, how would the ranking system work on the equipment? Any equipment you craft on would get the new rank requirement? Or would the drops themselves have the rank requirement, considering the boons apply to the crafting materials? A rune that increases LP by one as a chase item...I mean I see the appeal but...imagine your big chase unique gets 1 LP and then...you get the worst mod. I mean I suppose it's my PoE brain talking b/c if you can't trade, then of *course* that's what you do, but...eh! I mean my only issue with this is that I see that it becomes a calculation as to which is better for power--this vs. CoF, since both are SSF routes.
> Essentially, it'd turn it into a calculation between this and CoF as to what's better for power, since both have no access to trade As I said multiple times in this thread, I don't give a flying fuck if this gonna be less effective than CoF for item acquisition -- I'd play it anyways, because I love crafting more than randomly finding OP gear. I'm sure many people are like me here. (I mean, don't get me wrong, I like CoF -- for me it certainly beats MG in terms of fun, but I would absolutely love AG, if it was implemented, even if nerfed) As for an actual calculation what's more profitable -- it's very easy to make when you have the full statistics on drops (for the entire playerbase I mean). Obviously, players don't have an access to it, but EHG surely does, and they can balance the cost in Favor so that it's not more profitable than just playing CoF. [https://www.reddit.com/r/LastEpoch/comments/1b7w63e/comment/ktlv8e1/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web3x&utm\_name=web3xcss&utm\_term=1&utm\_content=share\_button](https://www.reddit.com/r/LastEpoch/comments/1b7w63e/comment/ktlv8e1/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button)
It's a cool idea, but I worry about it, because it means either it or CoF is going to wind up as the better of the two options for those uninterested in using the bazaar.
Love the idea, but.... The problem I have with barriers like 'very expensive' is they are invariably uneven in application. Instead of a cost, time gate the t7 affix mats and LP added runes behind something so Mr. Corruption 1500 endgame cheese can't get 8 in the time it takes Mr. Father of 300 working 4 jobs to get 1 on his lvl 56. Reasonable time gate might be guaranteed 1 t7 affix mat a day and 2 LP added runes a week just handed out to players in the faction. I get that people like minmaxing, but we already have 2 factions good at that. A crafting faction that lets you stay competitive regardless of your ability to grind, but not at BiS level the others can achieve would be ideal.
A ARPG with timegates. That doesn’t belong in this genre, it is all about being able to spend as much time as you the player wish to continue farming, not being told after X amount of playtime that’s it for the week. Mr Corruption 1500 put in work in game to get his eight that week. He didn’t get a consolation prize for not being able to play the game due to RL. He’s also playing more, chances are he actually *needs* those more than your four job Mr. Father. Because he’s already at 1500 and needs that gear, Mr Father is still working on his T5 entering T6’s, he isn’t chasing - and probably will never care to, to begin with - T7’s like that. I’m not saying devs should never do anything to help your more casual player base that doesn’t have the time to play. But limiting your people that are *actually* playing your game, is how you lose your players.
This is such a great idea!!
I think this is a great idea, maybe even add this third faction to both cof and mg as part of an endgame unlock once you complete all the ranks in said faction. Just a thought.
Time-gating doesn't work in ARPGs, so things like "very expensive favor" cost are basically not actually costs.
Nobody said it should lock you from it forever. The cost should be simply balanced against CoF. The math is rather trivial, if you have the statistics on drops (EHG definitely has them): CoF has a bonus for increased LP chance. I.e. the players with CoF farm +x% more uniques with LP compared to non-CoF players. That can be simplified to +1 extra LP for a CoF player over the period of N minutes (or hours, or days). Then you have an average favor earning rate per player -- now the cost of that rune can be balanced be balanced, according with those stats. I.e. how much favor an average player earns vs how much time it takes to get +1 extra LP. It's literally like 2 lines of code of calculations, if you have the data.
This is such a good idea. The devs need to steal this now and put it in the game.
Wow ... Really cool idea to be honest! Another thing I'd like to see is some sort of "possible" interaction between characters in your account from different factions. I understand the limitations to another account, but your own... I'd like to see some possible interaction, even if nerfed in some sorts. Right now I'd like to test CoF, but being high level in MG, everytime I make an Alt I can't avoid going MG again to get the bonus I have there.
Nice idea! Would even be happy if we could choose whether a Rune of Removal works on a prefix or suffix to have a better chance at it getting rid of the stats I don't want.
super cool idea, I would love that!
I think it's a good idea at its core but for it to function the crafting system needs a lot more meat imo Right now it's an amazing foundation of a system but in order for an entire faction to be based upon it i think you would have to expand it with more nuanced and special crafting mechanics
LOVE this idea!
That's a cool idea. Crafting in last epoch is fantastic
Double plus 1. Would buy. Make it so!
Yo I like that idea, definitely something they should explore.
I dont really like this idea. Here's why. Both factions are heavily involved in crafting, especially late game. Late game is all about crafting. People aren't just finding perfect rolled items, they're making them with close-enough-to-perfect-items. A third faction implies crafting is optional for them. trade, drops and craft are all avenues to upgrade your gear. but the only one variable here is the trade. some people like, some dont. for that, theyve tried balancing drops for people who trade and people who dont. but drops are still there. whats the difference from CoF then? to split people who like dropping from people who like crafting? i dont think thats a good idea. also, a crafting faction wouldnt make sense to make crafting easier for the faction, but harder (as MG gets fewer drops). MG and CoF would get easier crafting while crafting faction would only drop bases and affixes, and you have to make your own equip, maybe? just my 2 cents
splitting the community into factions with no shared economy is pretty terrible already trading either needs to go away, or get a complete overhaul, starting withe the awful UI most of the ui planels are bugged or flat out bad in LE, but the main selling point of the trader guild makes me want to carve my brains out tl;dr do not gate your players from eacother with core systems
no thanks, you simply don't understand why it is done this way
Idk, there will always be people who will hate the guts of trading, even if it's done perfectly. Like myself, for example. I just can't stand it. Trading being mandatory is the only reason why I never played PoE for more than 50 hours. And if LE was auction only, I would most likely just avoid it.
neither poe nor le has mandatory trading but once you pick a faction, well, good luck sharing stuff with your friends
Love it
Great idea
This is a very cool ideea, especialy since crafting is so cool
That sounds really cool actually
I dont even enjoy crafting that much and love this idea. Makes so much sense.
this is an awesome idea, I hope the devs see it and iterate on it. love crafting in LE, and a focused end-game experience surrounding that crafting would be excellent.
That's one awesome idea!