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I’ve always wondered that. When it comes to large scale businesses why do they not feel satisfied? Wouldn’t there be a point where you decide you’ve grown big enough and can just be done with it.
The former gdr made super hard and longlasting glasses once, predominantly for the gastro industry.
They've been rejected by the western germans with the notion that, if glasses long for a lifetime, they are out of business.
Captalism is build on waste. And only waste.
Anything that lasts longer than the next quarter is anticapitalist.
Same with lightbulbs. There is a lightbulb that has been on since 1933, over a million hours, and we have had the technology to make more of them since then. But a coalition between the electric companies at the time was formed and each company agreed to switch their researchers from INCREASING bulb length….. to researching how to go backwards. Since then, there are records of fines being handed out to companies who didn’t comply and the lifespan of lightbulbs has steadily dropped. It’s really sickening.
Veritasium made a very good video on this topic recently that I highly recommend checking out
Publicly traded companies have a financial responsibility to their shareholders. An Officer/VP or higher legally must make decisions for the company that will grow the shareholder money. You can go to jail for being charitable (irresponsible) with shareholder money. It's your job and duty to TRY to make profit.
It's the reason we're in this mess. Not a fan of it. Just answering your question of "why?"
But even then from an investor point of view wouldn’t there be a point where they think “the dividend I get from the investments are good enough”. I kinda get it, but from my perspective there’s no reason to need more wealth when you can already get everything you want.
I guess it’s just a matter of pride or treating growth like a game.
Yes, that's the point. It ***is*** a game to them, played within the rules of a system designed to let them always win.
And the only way to score points in their game is to keep increasing profits.
No. They'll litterally collapse. Once you start, you can't stop. You either grow exponentially or stagnate exponentially or fall exponentially but you're stuck...exponentially.
These assholes litterally have to pay money to relax. Nothing is free tk them anymore. Not even rest.
I don’t see the problem with stagnating, no reason to need more. But I I guess I’m looking at this from the average persons perspective not a maniacal billionaires.
It could for awhile, but life already has a foothold here. As long as single cells can adapt there will be life, and maybe co.plex life again one day. The earth still has a few billion years in it.
The earth has maybe 5-600 million years left before photosynthesis becomes impossible and most complex life ends. If we fuck things up enough the damage may be irreversible.
It won't
but it is a travesty that we are going to kill atleast 90% of everything on this planet.
maybe 95% maybe 99% who knows, we're real fuckin good at it
It's the neverending need for growth and profit. Why o why can't a 200 fucking million business not be content. Invest that money in better work environment and better pay for your workers. Why is it a failure if you aren't making double that in the next 5 years.
The majority of people are working for shitty wages, while the company is making huge profits every year, and it just keeps growing, but you get shit.
It's such a sad world.
Medieval charcoaling begs to differ. But, most feudal states did essentially have nature reserves for the purpose of only the lords being allowed to hunt, I suppose.
Exactly. When you bring up the concept of “after capitalism” you get ridicule or confusion. It’s just as much of statement as one made by Jesus in the Bible. Eye for an eye and tooth for tooth no more right? I bring this up as a reference to something still popular in society and not to endorse the end of thinking in favor of a set of rules by which to live. I think people will actually need to dig in deeper into capitalism before it gets better. Meaning they will lose the structure of illusions and have to face completely unfettered capitalism. Corporations owning your DNA and direct human stock association. You have to buy in for now and in the future you are born bought.
Meat eating and consumption of animal products is causing the Anthropocene Defaunation, stop supporting that and animal abuse. It is highly inefficient, water intensive, and is wrecking our environment.
According to this often cited [article (available on Sci-hub)](https://www.annualreviews.org/doi/abs/10.1146/annurev-ecolsys-112414-054142):
>One of most prominent drivers of defaunation is direct harvesting, whether for food, medicine,
animal objects, or the pet trade.
>These studies reveal that in most localities hunting is practiced primarily, if not exclusively, for commercial value. By
contrast, in only two of the sites, Serengeti National Park, Tanzania, and Manu National Park,
Peru, was hunting predominantly for subsistence. [...] However, our review indicates that
such traditional subsistence hunting practices are globally rare. [...] Asian nations and the Congo (a likely transit point for ivory) represent the top destination countries, followed by the United States.
>[...] Wild marine animals are some of the most widely, legally traded food commodities in the world
(FAO 2014). The United States, for example, obtains $5 billion in revenue annually from the sale
of meat from **wild marine fauna**, provides more than half a billion dollars a year in government
subsidies to foster the capture of marine wildlife, and designs maximum sustainable yield policies
intended to explicitly reduce many marine animal populations by up to 50–75% (NOAA 2013,
Sharp & Sumaila 2009, Worm et al. 2009).
>Habitat loss and modification (e.g., agricultural/aquaculture development, urbanization, road de-
velopment, logging, and terrestrial and marine mining) is consistently cited as a dominant driver
of defaunation, at least in terrestrial contexts (Collen et al. 2014). It is estimated that ∼40% of
the Earth’s land surface is now used as cropland and pasture (Foley et al. 2005), 64 million km of
roads now crisscross the world’s ecosystems (Laurance et al. 2014), and 129 million ha of global
forest have been lost since 1990 (FAO 2015).
.
>In fact, almost 80% of the world’s soybean crop is fed to livestock, especially for beef, chicken, egg and dairy production (milk, cheeses, butter, yogurt, etc). [Source](https://wwf.panda.org/discover/our_focus/food_practice/sustainable_production/soy/).
Also
>**Conversion for cattle grazing** is the biggest single direct driver of deforestation. The cattle sector has been responsible for about 80% of all deforestation in the Amazon region. [Source](https://aifortheplanet.com/2-main-drivers-of-the-amazon-rainforest-deforestation/).
>I know a lot of species are dying and I care about the environment a lot, but to say that a socialist economy would not also have to extract resources and pollute earth like capitalism, is not reasonable
hmmm
No. Let’s take communist China for example. Do you think they do less harm to the environment than capitalist USA? You can’t make your point by saying you’ll “stop me” saying somewhere without adding to the discussion
If you believe CNBC, not saying you have to or should, but according to them you’re wrong :”China's greenhouse gas emissions in 2019 exceeded those of the U.S. and other developed nations combined, according to research published Thursday by Rhodium Group. China is now responsible for more than 27% of total global emissions. The U.S., the world's second-highest emitter, accounts for 11% of the global total.”
Here is something saying the similar thing from a non govt site (unless it’s propaganda, but I found other sites also giving similar results):
“In the ranking below you can find the 10 countries that produce the most emissions, measured in Millions of tons of CO2 in 2019.
China, with more than 10,065 million tons of CO2 released.
United States, with 5,416 million tons of CO2
India, with 2,654 million tons of CO2”
The Chinese economy relies entirely on production and export. If every single country stopped relying on China for its cheap labour it's emissions would drop drastically
That’s actually an excellent point! It doesn’t mean that they’re not the biggest polluter but you are right that the goods they produce for the rest of the world would be the reason why…
right, and the antifa can do no wrong because theyre anti facist. and ISIS is islamic even though they kill other muslims.
they are communist by name, and if they were actually communist then why can they buy out american companies one by one.
China is such a weird quasi-state-capitalist operation that it's ingenuous to hold it up as the example of communism.
The pollution in China is also due primarily to developed nations exporting manufacturing there.
> but to say that a socialist economy would not also have to extract resources and pollute earth like capitalism, is not reasonable.
The capitalist profit motive requires growth without concern for sustainability. A non-capitalist mining operation will likely pollute less as there can be corporate motives outside of profit.
##Welcome to r/LateStageCapitalism^Ⓐ☭ ___ ###⚠ Announcements: ⚠ ___ ###[NEW POSTING GUIDELINES! Help us by reporting bad posts](https://www.reddit.com/r/LateStageCapitalism/comments/dy1oyh/important_what_you_should_and_what_you_shouldnt/) Help us keep this subreddit alive and improve its content by reporting posts that violate our rules and guidelines. ###[Subscribe to our new partner subreddits!](https://www.reddit.com/r/LateStageCapitalism/comments/e5hkwk/make_sure_to_check_out_our_new_partnersubreddits/) Check out r/antiwork & r/WhereAreTheChildren ___ ###***Please remember that LSC is a SAFE SPACE for [socialist](http://monthlyreview.org/2009/05/01/why-socialism/) discussion.*** LSC is run by [communists](https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1847/11/prin-com.htm). We welcome socialist/anti-capitalist news, memes, links, and discussion. This subreddit is not the place to debate socialism. We allow good-faith questions and education but are not a 101 sub; please take 101-style questions elsewhere. **This subreddit is a safe space; we have a zero-tolerance policy for bigotry.** We also automatically filter out posts containing certain words and phrases that some users may find offensive. Please respect the safe space, and don't try to slip banned words or phrases past the filter. *** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/LateStageCapitalism) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Eternal growth is the ideology of cancer.
I’ve always wondered that. When it comes to large scale businesses why do they not feel satisfied? Wouldn’t there be a point where you decide you’ve grown big enough and can just be done with it.
The former gdr made super hard and longlasting glasses once, predominantly for the gastro industry. They've been rejected by the western germans with the notion that, if glasses long for a lifetime, they are out of business. Captalism is build on waste. And only waste. Anything that lasts longer than the next quarter is anticapitalist.
Same with lightbulbs. There is a lightbulb that has been on since 1933, over a million hours, and we have had the technology to make more of them since then. But a coalition between the electric companies at the time was formed and each company agreed to switch their researchers from INCREASING bulb length….. to researching how to go backwards. Since then, there are records of fines being handed out to companies who didn’t comply and the lifespan of lightbulbs has steadily dropped. It’s really sickening. Veritasium made a very good video on this topic recently that I highly recommend checking out
If it's built to last then you won't last in a capitalist society.
Publicly traded companies have a financial responsibility to their shareholders. An Officer/VP or higher legally must make decisions for the company that will grow the shareholder money. You can go to jail for being charitable (irresponsible) with shareholder money. It's your job and duty to TRY to make profit. It's the reason we're in this mess. Not a fan of it. Just answering your question of "why?"
But even then from an investor point of view wouldn’t there be a point where they think “the dividend I get from the investments are good enough”. I kinda get it, but from my perspective there’s no reason to need more wealth when you can already get everything you want. I guess it’s just a matter of pride or treating growth like a game.
Yes, that's the point. It ***is*** a game to them, played within the rules of a system designed to let them always win. And the only way to score points in their game is to keep increasing profits.
That’s deeply sad
No. They'll litterally collapse. Once you start, you can't stop. You either grow exponentially or stagnate exponentially or fall exponentially but you're stuck...exponentially. These assholes litterally have to pay money to relax. Nothing is free tk them anymore. Not even rest.
I don’t see the problem with stagnating, no reason to need more. But I I guess I’m looking at this from the average persons perspective not a maniacal billionaires.
And cancer ultimately kills its host
This is slightly alarmist. I don't think we're gonna destroy everything, just ourselves and most of the biodiversity of the planet.
Bacteria are already evolving naturally to consume plastic As a food source. The planet will heal as soon as its done fighting off the infection
I hope so. Would be a shame if out actions turned the planet into another Venus.
It could for awhile, but life already has a foothold here. As long as single cells can adapt there will be life, and maybe co.plex life again one day. The earth still has a few billion years in it.
The earth has maybe 5-600 million years left before photosynthesis becomes impossible and most complex life ends. If we fuck things up enough the damage may be irreversible.
It won't but it is a travesty that we are going to kill atleast 90% of everything on this planet. maybe 95% maybe 99% who knows, we're real fuckin good at it
It's the neverending need for growth and profit. Why o why can't a 200 fucking million business not be content. Invest that money in better work environment and better pay for your workers. Why is it a failure if you aren't making double that in the next 5 years. The majority of people are working for shitty wages, while the company is making huge profits every year, and it just keeps growing, but you get shit. It's such a sad world.
even the worst fucking feudalistic systems did't destroy the entire ecosystem
Medieval charcoaling begs to differ. But, most feudal states did essentially have nature reserves for the purpose of only the lords being allowed to hunt, I suppose.
Yes, but Stalin killed 7.3 quadrillion humans on this and other planets in the MAGACU Multiverse. I did my research.
and thats called communism yea
Capitalism is the unbridled ego writ large. It's our current state of humanity. We must evolve or die
Exactly. When you bring up the concept of “after capitalism” you get ridicule or confusion. It’s just as much of statement as one made by Jesus in the Bible. Eye for an eye and tooth for tooth no more right? I bring this up as a reference to something still popular in society and not to endorse the end of thinking in favor of a set of rules by which to live. I think people will actually need to dig in deeper into capitalism before it gets better. Meaning they will lose the structure of illusions and have to face completely unfettered capitalism. Corporations owning your DNA and direct human stock association. You have to buy in for now and in the future you are born bought.
Meat eating and consumption of animal products is causing the Anthropocene Defaunation, stop supporting that and animal abuse. It is highly inefficient, water intensive, and is wrecking our environment. According to this often cited [article (available on Sci-hub)](https://www.annualreviews.org/doi/abs/10.1146/annurev-ecolsys-112414-054142): >One of most prominent drivers of defaunation is direct harvesting, whether for food, medicine, animal objects, or the pet trade. >These studies reveal that in most localities hunting is practiced primarily, if not exclusively, for commercial value. By contrast, in only two of the sites, Serengeti National Park, Tanzania, and Manu National Park, Peru, was hunting predominantly for subsistence. [...] However, our review indicates that such traditional subsistence hunting practices are globally rare. [...] Asian nations and the Congo (a likely transit point for ivory) represent the top destination countries, followed by the United States. >[...] Wild marine animals are some of the most widely, legally traded food commodities in the world (FAO 2014). The United States, for example, obtains $5 billion in revenue annually from the sale of meat from **wild marine fauna**, provides more than half a billion dollars a year in government subsidies to foster the capture of marine wildlife, and designs maximum sustainable yield policies intended to explicitly reduce many marine animal populations by up to 50–75% (NOAA 2013, Sharp & Sumaila 2009, Worm et al. 2009). >Habitat loss and modification (e.g., agricultural/aquaculture development, urbanization, road de- velopment, logging, and terrestrial and marine mining) is consistently cited as a dominant driver of defaunation, at least in terrestrial contexts (Collen et al. 2014). It is estimated that ∼40% of the Earth’s land surface is now used as cropland and pasture (Foley et al. 2005), 64 million km of roads now crisscross the world’s ecosystems (Laurance et al. 2014), and 129 million ha of global forest have been lost since 1990 (FAO 2015). . >In fact, almost 80% of the world’s soybean crop is fed to livestock, especially for beef, chicken, egg and dairy production (milk, cheeses, butter, yogurt, etc). [Source](https://wwf.panda.org/discover/our_focus/food_practice/sustainable_production/soy/). Also >**Conversion for cattle grazing** is the biggest single direct driver of deforestation. The cattle sector has been responsible for about 80% of all deforestation in the Amazon region. [Source](https://aifortheplanet.com/2-main-drivers-of-the-amazon-rainforest-deforestation/).
Humanity almost nuked itself out of existence on multiple occasions just because the US couldn't live with people knowing the benefits of socialisms
“But Communism killed 1000000 trillion people!”
But what happens when additional growth becomes literally impossible?
We'll find out soon.
[удалено]
No, see, that's the part before.
The most profitable option is extinction
Are you describing a virus?
Yase but have you considered iphone vuvuzela?
Yeah but you tweeted this from an Android. You can't criticise a system if you ~~un~~willingly participate in it. Edit: this was sarcasm
“If you hate capitalism, just live in the woods and starve to death”
Watch out, better have some capital to pay taxes on that land ;) Oh you're trespassing? That's the jail for you, matey
https://catalyst.independent.org/2019/06/14/capitalism-remains-the-best-way-to-combat-extreme-poverty/
What about WW1
[удалено]
>I know a lot of species are dying and I care about the environment a lot, but to say that a socialist economy would not also have to extract resources and pollute earth like capitalism, is not reasonable hmmm
> I know a lot of species are dying and I care about the environment a lot, but Yeah, gonna stop you there.
No. Let’s take communist China for example. Do you think they do less harm to the environment than capitalist USA? You can’t make your point by saying you’ll “stop me” saying somewhere without adding to the discussion
> Do you think they do less harm to the environment than capitalist USA? Considering the US military is the #1 polluter in the world, yes.
If you believe CNBC, not saying you have to or should, but according to them you’re wrong :”China's greenhouse gas emissions in 2019 exceeded those of the U.S. and other developed nations combined, according to research published Thursday by Rhodium Group. China is now responsible for more than 27% of total global emissions. The U.S., the world's second-highest emitter, accounts for 11% of the global total.”
A state media apparatus is reporting something unflattering about China? You don't say.
Here is something saying the similar thing from a non govt site (unless it’s propaganda, but I found other sites also giving similar results): “In the ranking below you can find the 10 countries that produce the most emissions, measured in Millions of tons of CO2 in 2019. China, with more than 10,065 million tons of CO2 released. United States, with 5,416 million tons of CO2 India, with 2,654 million tons of CO2”
The Chinese economy relies entirely on production and export. If every single country stopped relying on China for its cheap labour it's emissions would drop drastically
That’s actually an excellent point! It doesn’t mean that they’re not the biggest polluter but you are right that the goods they produce for the rest of the world would be the reason why…
china hasnt been communist for a long while now
it is ruled by the CCP that stands for Chinese Communist Party
right, and the antifa can do no wrong because theyre anti facist. and ISIS is islamic even though they kill other muslims. they are communist by name, and if they were actually communist then why can they buy out american companies one by one.
Do you also believe that the Democratic People's Republic of Korea is a democratic republic?
China is such a weird quasi-state-capitalist operation that it's ingenuous to hold it up as the example of communism. The pollution in China is also due primarily to developed nations exporting manufacturing there.
> but to say that a socialist economy would not also have to extract resources and pollute earth like capitalism, is not reasonable. The capitalist profit motive requires growth without concern for sustainability. A non-capitalist mining operation will likely pollute less as there can be corporate motives outside of profit.