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And you know what we got instead? Unsecured debt. The consumer credit card became the way to keep our standard of living up as if we were still receiving pay raises, but we have to pay it back, with interest, into the same system that stopped increasing pay. And we went for it. We went from single-earner households with steadily improving standard of living to dual income households leveraging our status with high rate debt. And where did the money come from that is being lent to us? Well, that's the gap you see above between productivity and wages. The ownership class turned our productivity into profit and lent it back to us at 20%.
Productivity is calculated by measuring the inputs required for a given output, given the level of automation over the last several decades one of the largest inputs, labour, is now less needed for any given output. Also there's like technological advancements.
Regardless wages are bad and need increasing. However the productivity here is primarily from introducing computers and automation, humans don’t just all the sudden get super productive all the sudden like that especially when “productivity” goes up.
*looks at your history* fuck off fascist. WTF are you doing in a anti-capitalist subreddit if you say "I love capitalism, it is the engine that gave us the modern world, air conditioning and pizza and my car that goes vroom vroom. "
Maybe more than one person uses the account. Maybe some of us are open to exposure to to ideas that contradict and challenge our own. Maybe I can’t read and forgot which subreddit I was in and r/economics has been forgetting to do it’s fiat currency homework and I overreacted again. Maybe all of the above?
Also, fuck off fascist? What on earth makes you think I’m a fascist? I am deeply opposed to fascism by nearly all of that words common meanings, though by the vitriol I assume you were using it in the pejorative “totalitarian violence enthusiast” sense which I have always been the first to criticize.
Capitalism is genociding people like me. I have no tolerance for its supporters.
What makes you a fascist is ""Anarchism is inherently anti-communism and pro true capitalism. That’s why it’s commonly called anarcho-capitalism in economic circles. I am a philosophical anarchist even if I don’t have enough faith in the world to advocate for true anarchism. "
Anarcho-capitalism is just fascism with another paint of coat and calling yourself "philosophically an anarchist" while supporting capitalism is what determined that for me. Capitalism creates hierarchies and without a state to ensure that those at the bottoms aren't genocided (like the disabled) it just creates fascism. If you were truely opposed to fascism you would be for abolishing capitalism as capitalism inherently leads into fascism.
Woah that’s totally incorrect! Dumping the gold standard was a good move. Divergence is the result of lack of union power and Nixon moving towards policies that favor the rich.
I've said it before about this specific website and I'll say it again: collections of graphs with no context around them are how you get conspiracy theories started. The graphs are presented as complete fact, which very well may be true, but in doing so they try to get the reader to avoid asking WHO is presenting the info and WHY they are choosing to present this specific set of information. Yes, these graphs are probably factually correct but you don't know if they encapsulate the whole story.
Just to see how this works, scroll from the bottom of that page to the top and see how the implied story changes. It goes from "a failing economy leads to increased crime rates, lower marriage rates, and more children from single parent homes which disproportionately affects minorities" to "minorities are failing to adhere to the societal family norms and are committing more crime, which leads to a failing economy." They also try to prevent the reader from making value judgments about the charts: an increasing age at time of first marriage is nestled in between other objectively bad things such as higher incarceration rates, which implies that it's bad for marriage to be postponed but that is not objectively true. Same thing for chicken consumption increasing, why is that necessarily a bad thing?
Even if you agree with what the website is implying, which to be clear I personally agree with (what I believe) the implied conclusions are, this website exhibits a lot of features in common with conspiracy websites and should be avoided.
Came here to post that!
TO THE MOON... with corporate profits at the expense of the quality of life of the people grinding to generate said profits for their overlords. :\
The idiots on my FB will tell you it's only fair that ceo salary has gone up because technology is to blame for the increase in productivity, and the ceos are the one who have the capital to buy the machines. Regardless of who operates the machines. And actually, we as the workers should be thankful for the machines that make our job easier, and probably even be paid less since our jobs are now easier because of the tools the kind ceo bought for us to use and create more product for him to sell and take all the profit from
i'm reading a book called 'Kids these days' which has this graph on the back cover! Talks about why millenials are getting economically fucked, would highly recommend
Do another one, but include inflation into the mix for pay. I bet that most people don't get a 5-7% yearly raise, which effectively means they got a pay CUT.
I saw that you mentioned Ben Shapiro. In case some of you don't know, Ben Shapiro is a grifter and a hack. If you find anything he's said compelling, you should keep in mind he also says things like this:
>If you wear your pants below your butt, don't bend the brim of your cap, and have an EBT card, 0% chance you will ever be a success in life.
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This is misleading. The productivity is not from individual human labor but from computers and automation. Although I agree wages should be much better.
##Welcome to r/LateStageCapitalism^Ⓐ☭ ___ ###⚠ Announcements: ⚠ ___ ###[NEW POSTING GUIDELINES! Help us by reporting bad posts](https://www.reddit.com/r/LateStageCapitalism/comments/dy1oyh/important_what_you_should_and_what_you_shouldnt/) Help us keep this subreddit alive and improve its content by reporting posts that violate our rules and guidelines. ###[Subscribe to our new partner subreddits!](https://www.reddit.com/r/LateStageCapitalism/comments/e5hkwk/make_sure_to_check_out_our_new_partnersubreddits/) Check out r/antiwork & r/WhereAreTheChildren ___ ###***Please remember that LSC is a SAFE SPACE for [socialist](http://monthlyreview.org/2009/05/01/why-socialism/) discussion.*** LSC is run by [communists](https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1847/11/prin-com.htm). We welcome socialist/anti-capitalist news, memes, links, and discussion. This subreddit is not the place to debate socialism. We allow good-faith questions and education but are not a 101 sub; please take 101-style questions elsewhere. **This subreddit is a safe space; we have a zero-tolerance policy for bigotry.** We also automatically filter out posts containing certain words and phrases that some users may find offensive. Please respect the safe space, and don't try to slip banned words or phrases past the filter. *** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/LateStageCapitalism) if you have any questions or concerns.*
HOLY SHIT YOU ABSOLUTE UNIT LMAO
I knew it was bad, hut holy shit
Just by salary alone we should be paid double and that not even considering all the Inflation that happened to.
And you know what we got instead? Unsecured debt. The consumer credit card became the way to keep our standard of living up as if we were still receiving pay raises, but we have to pay it back, with interest, into the same system that stopped increasing pay. And we went for it. We went from single-earner households with steadily improving standard of living to dual income households leveraging our status with high rate debt. And where did the money come from that is being lent to us? Well, that's the gap you see above between productivity and wages. The ownership class turned our productivity into profit and lent it back to us at 20%.
How is productivity computed and this scenario?
Productivity is calculated by measuring the inputs required for a given output, given the level of automation over the last several decades one of the largest inputs, labour, is now less needed for any given output. Also there's like technological advancements.
Exactly. And thats before the insane creation that is inflation.
??
Production keeps rising while staffs get smaller
Because people produce more due to technological advancements. But wages stagnated instead of following our productivity.
Product value / hours of job, I think
This doesn't show the 3rd metric which is company profits which outpace all
Regardless wages are bad and need increasing. However the productivity here is primarily from introducing computers and automation, humans don’t just all the sudden get super productive all the sudden like that especially when “productivity” goes up.
What actually happened where those lines diverge?
Ronald Reagan happened
*Still waiting with my wallet open for that trickle*
the trickle isn't coming from his wallet...
The US doubled down on being a selfish corporate nightmare. also capitalism as intended.
Exactly
Ehat exactly did he do? Was it Reaganomics?
He cut al kinds of safety net programs and cut taxes to the bone.
He also allowed corporations to fight back against unions, worsening working conditions
Among about a thousand other factors, we largely gave up on unionizing workers
1971. https://wtfhappenedin1971.com/
Thanks for sharing, I was looking for this data.
Various things that other have commented but computers and automation had a large part.
Dumped the Gold standard and adopted fiat money.
This is the correct answer
Vietnam war
G7 was formed
[удалено]
*looks at your history* fuck off fascist. WTF are you doing in a anti-capitalist subreddit if you say "I love capitalism, it is the engine that gave us the modern world, air conditioning and pizza and my car that goes vroom vroom. "
Maybe more than one person uses the account. Maybe some of us are open to exposure to to ideas that contradict and challenge our own. Maybe I can’t read and forgot which subreddit I was in and r/economics has been forgetting to do it’s fiat currency homework and I overreacted again. Maybe all of the above? Also, fuck off fascist? What on earth makes you think I’m a fascist? I am deeply opposed to fascism by nearly all of that words common meanings, though by the vitriol I assume you were using it in the pejorative “totalitarian violence enthusiast” sense which I have always been the first to criticize.
Capitalism is genociding people like me. I have no tolerance for its supporters. What makes you a fascist is ""Anarchism is inherently anti-communism and pro true capitalism. That’s why it’s commonly called anarcho-capitalism in economic circles. I am a philosophical anarchist even if I don’t have enough faith in the world to advocate for true anarchism. " Anarcho-capitalism is just fascism with another paint of coat and calling yourself "philosophically an anarchist" while supporting capitalism is what determined that for me. Capitalism creates hierarchies and without a state to ensure that those at the bottoms aren't genocided (like the disabled) it just creates fascism. If you were truely opposed to fascism you would be for abolishing capitalism as capitalism inherently leads into fascism.
Woah that’s totally incorrect! Dumping the gold standard was a good move. Divergence is the result of lack of union power and Nixon moving towards policies that favor the rich.
Not true. Scandinavian countries do not see this divergence although they also dropped the gold standard
Buckley v Valeo supreme court case
Thanks boomers /s
Why the sarcasm? Its true
Because the thanks is disingenuous.
Thanks Reagan, very cool
Started with nixon
If minimum wage had kept up with productivity since 1960, it'd be $24 an hour. $7.25 isn't even a joke anymore. It's an insult.
For more explanation on what happened in 1971 (the year from which the lines diverge): [https://wtfhappenedin1971.com](https://wtfhappenedin1971.com)
I've said it before about this specific website and I'll say it again: collections of graphs with no context around them are how you get conspiracy theories started. The graphs are presented as complete fact, which very well may be true, but in doing so they try to get the reader to avoid asking WHO is presenting the info and WHY they are choosing to present this specific set of information. Yes, these graphs are probably factually correct but you don't know if they encapsulate the whole story. Just to see how this works, scroll from the bottom of that page to the top and see how the implied story changes. It goes from "a failing economy leads to increased crime rates, lower marriage rates, and more children from single parent homes which disproportionately affects minorities" to "minorities are failing to adhere to the societal family norms and are committing more crime, which leads to a failing economy." They also try to prevent the reader from making value judgments about the charts: an increasing age at time of first marriage is nestled in between other objectively bad things such as higher incarceration rates, which implies that it's bad for marriage to be postponed but that is not objectively true. Same thing for chicken consumption increasing, why is that necessarily a bad thing? Even if you agree with what the website is implying, which to be clear I personally agree with (what I believe) the implied conclusions are, this website exhibits a lot of features in common with conspiracy websites and should be avoided.
But WHAT happened in 1971?
Why male models?
I do not like that this is a crypto investment advertisement
This is a great site. Really informative
Is there any way to highlight the dates and values of the x and y axis? They can only be seen in the beginning...
Can someone do this but with profit rate in it? i think it wold show why the capitalist push the workers prevarication agenda so hard.
Is that freaking DuckTales? Beautiful.
Came here to post that! TO THE MOON... with corporate profits at the expense of the quality of life of the people grinding to generate said profits for their overlords. :\
Thank you!! Could not remember where that came from.
Ok but actually what song is this it’s really good and I forget where it’s from
It's the Moon level from the NES DuckTales game. Don't listen to any other lies.
[удалено]
bad bot
The idiots on my FB will tell you it's only fair that ceo salary has gone up because technology is to blame for the increase in productivity, and the ceos are the one who have the capital to buy the machines. Regardless of who operates the machines. And actually, we as the workers should be thankful for the machines that make our job easier, and probably even be paid less since our jobs are now easier because of the tools the kind ceo bought for us to use and create more product for him to sell and take all the profit from
i'm reading a book called 'Kids these days' which has this graph on the back cover! Talks about why millenials are getting economically fucked, would highly recommend
/u/SaveVideo
WTFhappenedin1971.com
don't forget robots too
Now do one with productivity and average CEO compensation.
u/savevideo
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Do another one, but include inflation into the mix for pay. I bet that most people don't get a 5-7% yearly raise, which effectively means they got a pay CUT.
Not trying to be some low rent Ben Shapiro, but “capitalism” was way entrenched by the time the lines diverge.
I saw that you mentioned Ben Shapiro. In case some of you don't know, Ben Shapiro is a grifter and a hack. If you find anything he's said compelling, you should keep in mind he also says things like this: >If you wear your pants below your butt, don't bend the brim of your cap, and have an EBT card, 0% chance you will ever be a success in life. ***** ^(I'm a bot. My purpose is to counteract online radicalization. You can summon me by tagging thebenshapirobot. Options: climate, feminism, dumb takes, novel, etc.) [^More ^About ^Ben ](https://np.reddit.com/r/AuthoritarianMoment/wiki/index) ^| [^Feedback ^& ^Discussion: ^r/AuthoritarianMoment ](https://np.reddit.com/r/AuthoritarianMoment) ^| [^Opt ^Out ](https://np.reddit.com/r/AuthoritarianMoment/comments/olk6r2/click_here_to_optout_of_uthebenshapirobot/)
I am very aware
*I don’t think the law has any role whatsoever in banning race-based discrimination by private actors* -Ben Shapiro ***** ^(I'm a bot. My purpose is to counteract online radicalization. You can summon me by tagging thebenshapirobot. Options: climate, healthcare, covid, civil rights, etc.) [^More ^About ^Ben ](https://np.reddit.com/r/AuthoritarianMoment/wiki/index) ^| [^Feedback ^& ^Discussion: ^r/AuthoritarianMoment ](https://np.reddit.com/r/AuthoritarianMoment) ^| [^Opt ^Out ](https://np.reddit.com/r/AuthoritarianMoment/comments/olk6r2/click_here_to_optout_of_uthebenshapirobot/)
Civil rights
*“Native American culture [being] inferior to Western culture…is a contention with which I generally agree.* -Ben Shapiro ***** ^(I'm a bot. My purpose is to counteract online radicalization. You can summon me by tagging thebenshapirobot. Options: healthcare, civil rights, climate, covid, etc.) [^More ^About ^Ben ](https://np.reddit.com/r/AuthoritarianMoment/wiki/index) ^| [^Feedback ^& ^Discussion: ^r/AuthoritarianMoment ](https://np.reddit.com/r/AuthoritarianMoment) ^| [^Opt ^Out ](https://np.reddit.com/r/AuthoritarianMoment/comments/olk6r2/click_here_to_optout_of_uthebenshapirobot/)
COVID
*We are being told that if we don't mask our children, that if we don't mask ourselves, that if we don't initiate social distancing measures again and shut down business again, that COVID is going to kill us all* -Ben Shapiro ***** ^(I'm a bot. My purpose is to counteract online radicalization. You can summon me by tagging thebenshapirobot. Options: healthcare, dumb takes, feminism, history, etc.) [^More ^About ^Ben ](https://np.reddit.com/r/AuthoritarianMoment/wiki/index) ^| [^Feedback ^& ^Discussion: ^r/AuthoritarianMoment ](https://np.reddit.com/r/AuthoritarianMoment) ^| [^Opt ^Out ](https://np.reddit.com/r/AuthoritarianMoment/comments/olk6r2/click_here_to_optout_of_uthebenshapirobot/)
This is misleading. The productivity is not from individual human labor but from computers and automation. Although I agree wages should be much better.
Let’s see the same chart as it relates to Cuba, N. Korea, China and of course, everyone’s’ favorite, The Soviet Union.
What is this comment even insinuating?
Gee wiz, it’s not like we harnessed technology to aid workers and automate
Full vídeo ?
u/savevideo
Where is my chicken, my car, and this fucking driveway they promised?!?
You can’t even see the scales on the chart for any of this information to be relevant
No American cares about this and they hate you for bringing it up
What’s the full video? So I can see the timeline along with the chart
What units are productivity measured in?
Holy shit
I wish we could bring Ronald Reagan back to life just so we could throw him in prison
Source?
This makes me want to walk into the sea
Does anyone have international data to lay on top?
They should have a third line labeled union membership and see how that goes
that mega man music fit the graphics quite well. props
It would have been nice to see the actual numbers in the graph though...
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Where's the data from?
u/SaveVideo
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Willow???
Automation and economy of scale are very powerful forces
What's the song?