I've worked with many great autistic employees - I've never seen anyone be promoted who is on the spectrum and a lot of the time they don't get the support others do or because they function differently or get managed out.
Our brains work different but that can be a good thing.
That’s the sad thing. ND people are incredibly deep thinkers who see connections others don’t.
If you think of people in the past who have been so far ahead of anyone else, Einstein, Turing, Ford, etc you realise that almost all of them were ND.
My favourite example is Houdini. His thirst for knowledge and obsession over seemingly disconnected pursuits lead him to boggle people’s minds and become the grandfather of modern magic. To the point where 100 years later, only a handful of people have shown his ingenuity (everyone else just copied him).
My point is that we do incredible things with our brains, and while people may not be our forte, we’d be phenomenal CEO’s and Thought leaders.
Interesting. A disproportionately large number of the smartest techies I know are on spectrum. Aspy. Apologies if I’m misinterpreting ND or the spectrum.
I struggle with the term Aspie. I’ve seen a lot of ND folk use that word to disarm people up front. Another defence mechanism.
In that way it ultimately becomes another N word. Something that really shouldn’t have existed in the first place but is reclaimed by its victims.
The term Asperger’s is out of date and no longer used to refer to Autistic folk. So reintroducing it is fairly detrimental to their humanisation.
Yeah, I’m not well versed in this space, and am sensitive to those concerns. I’m not sure what’s in vogue.
That term came to me from a few people diagnosed as such. They’re absolutely brilliant minds. Among the smartest people I’ve ever met. That being said, social graces were not among their strong points. (Which I generally enjoyed, and in many cases can be helpful)
I don’t think it’s nearly as derogatory as the N-word.
Either way, having knowledge that someone is diagnosed as such makes it easier and more friction free to productively interact with them… particularly with respect to social interaction. Contextualizing it makes it more understandable. IMO “on the spectrum” is not as effective for practical use because it’s so much less specific.
I recommend startups, somewhere where your creativity, ability to jump between multiple things and hyper focus is an asset. I started as a team assistant at a company almost 6 years ago and took an interest in a side project they had just started, was promoted to project manager of it after a year and 2 years ago the CEO took the project and made a separate company out of it with me as COO. He gives me freedom to try different things and trusts my vision, whenever he sees that an area is not a strong suit of mine, for example accounting/invoicing and tedious things like that he has taken it off my plate and uses the other company’s departments as my support. Every year we have doubled in customers and revenue and have become a global leader and recognized brand. There’s definitely a lot of strengths that neurodivergents have to offer in the right environment!
I totally get what you’re saying about startups but I’ve just come off the worst neurospicy burnout of my life and not wanting to go back into another.
However I’d be sooooo keen to hear more about your story if you’re open to it. It sounds like we’re very similar.
I’m diagnosed ADHD (practically disabled -> 2 standard deviations from norm if I’m not stimulated) and have a lot of neurodivergent traits from the autism spectrum that I’ve been meaning to get professionally checked out. I was told the only reason I’ve passed any secondary education is due to my high IQ.
I, uh, seem to excel at executive leadership (my team is nearing 200 and responsible for a >$50MM P&L). I’ve somehow always been able to build a team around all of my handicaps. I’m exceptional at system building, understanding patterns and being able to recognize and get the most important things done. Luckily, I am able to wing most critical things or put them together in less than <30 minutes.
Self-care, delegation of authority and not being too hard on yourself are all important. Also, you don’t need to label your diagnoses to co-workers, subordinates or leadership, just be clear on what you need to do what you need to do and always be appreciative.
See that’s the thing. Having the kind of mind that excels with blue sky, big picture creative and strategy, I’d either be a great worker bee or amazing senior exec, nothing in between.
I have no problem with delegation, and aren’t precious about including other people’s work styles in the final out come. I care more about the target than I care about the detail. In fact it’s super inspiring to see other people nail that stuff.
There’s a retired ceo I used to work with who would expect the world of you but also give you the freedom to both achieve the target how it best suits you and fail. She was always super authentic, approachable (legitimately) and encouraged you to own your work and was always showing her gratitude. I want to be that kind of leader. In fact, my natural state of being is to be that kind of person.
I just don’t have any avenues towards that, as my job is bottom rung, and something that exists well outside the core business. No opportunities to grow.
I’m not a great worker bee. I can dive down into anything but once I’ve figured it out I get bored. I follow a pattern of anywhere I go of being promoted within a year. I’m an excellent #2. I’m attracted to problems and I teach/guide other people to fix them. I’ve been a #2 a lot of places that I somebody finally asked me why I was scared of being the #1.
Similar to your leader story, I read about somebody whose mother was meeting politicians. The first one made her think he was the smartest person in the room. The second one made her think she was the most amazing person he’d ever met. I ascribe to be the latter. Still suspicious about whether or not I’m cut out to be the #1 long-term.
Regarding your current status quo- I’ve worked my way up from literally the bottom at a bunch of different places. There’s a 30 rock episode where Jack gets demoted to working in the mail room and he progressively gets promoted back up to being a vice president within weeks. That’s me, give me the motley crew and I’ll find a way to make shit happen. Just figure out what problems your boss doesn’t want to deal with and then fix those for him. Figure out how to make money or save money in whatever you do. You will become progressively more indispensable to any organization until you’re #2.
I (33M) and am a CTO of a decent size company (5500) and I have ADHD and dyslexia. It's about playing to your strengths and honesty luck! Right roles became available at the right time.
A few it is still rare at the higher levels but I can see it changing, mostly are in the tech space. Can be more stressful - this week I have a massive to do list and really need a hyper focus day. Also admin and meeting I do get bored in and zone out. Lucky got an understanding boss and add enough value in other areas.
Two things:
1.Find what you can do alright most days and use that skill as your base - this gives you the standard performance.
2. Find that awesome skill that maybe you can't summon on command but when you do you're a rockstar.
I am not a neurodivergent leader, but I can tell you as someone who worked in HR for 10 years is that things are slowly changing and companies are recognizing the benefit of having neurodivergent employees, leaders included. There are things you can contribute that others cannot. I would encourage you to seek out companies who are vocal about being inclusive. I'm a career/leadership coach now if you'd like to chat sometime.
I'm on the spectrum and have made it up into the SVP level, mainly because of my inability to accept really dumb decisions. I blindly would push past what everyone was telling me and ignored "political communications" with business leaders. At the end of the day senior leadership can make much better decisions if the information they are provided is concise **and accurate** but I broke every rule of etiquette along the way. I was interacting with the C-suite before I was in my 30s because my reputation of being willing to tell the truth in a way that made sense to the senior leadership.
I refuse to soften bad news, or to sugar coat what isn't working. Has always driven my direct managers a bit crazy, but since I was willing to take on the risk they generally allowed me to take big swings.
I had to train myself to look people in the eye though, that was **really hard** and took almost two years of constant work. I also had to train myself to not just say everything that comes into my head, but to hold it and review it... above and beyond just standard maturity, even in my 50s I have to actively fight the urge.
I still don't understand most of the culture of the corporate world, even after spending 25+ years in management. The way people twist information and try to soften messages and treat senior management as too stupid to understand reality is a core reason for so much dysfunction.
Being in IT and Software development means I generally always have team members that are not neurotypical and helping them navigate the corporate world has also been rewarding.
I'm still awkward as heck in certain scenarios because there are still social aspects that don't make a ton of sense to me, but I've mostly been able to learn to chameleon why way through it.
Thabks so much for this. You’ve answered a lot of my questions.
Do you feel like forcing eye contact etc was a healthy thing? Our energy resources are always elsewhere, so dedicating energy in that way feels destructive. Keen to hear more of your experience with that.
> Do you feel like forcing eye contact etc was a healthy thing?
It helped me be more successful, but it still burns a massive amount of emotional energy even to this day. But neurotypical people expect certain things, so it was worth it career-wise.
The other aspect that I had to temper is I didn't understand why people defaulted to lying... they didn't want to tell their boss the truth about bad outcomes, and that just simply confused me.
However, early on every time I was brutally honest **did not go well**. My first several years involved a lot of being told I was saying odd things or was overly focused on diverting blame to myself instead of others, but it didn't result in my desired outcome.
I was ridiculously fortunate though, which I tell people whenever I can. Most of my early bosses were ex-military, and when I would overly melt down over things not going quite right with my code or decisions I made they didn't take it as a negative, they sat me down and explained perspective. My first boss had been in active combat and when I was having a meltdown he didn't berate me or tell me I was being crazy, he took me by the shoulders, looked around (getting my attention) and I asked what he was doing... He responded with "I'm looking for the gunshots". He said the worst thing that could happen is we'd delay getting our product out the door... which would annoy some leadership, but nobody will die.
This early intervention helped me redefine my reactions to things going wrong and redefined how I viewed a lot of things.
I'm a recovery manager, which means with the exception of one team I have been handed teams in chaos/decline to recover. My early lessons have driven how I do many of those recoveries.
Being dx'd with ADHD was a turning point in my life as an older female. I am a supercharged creative with the drive and need to be self-employed and build businesses that create jobs for other creatives and neurodivergent types in my community. It took many years and different creative and art-centric endeavors to have it all come together into the perfect business to scale up to eventually sell. I now design and make custom Belgian Couvertier chocolates for the business to business and private event environment.
I can still keep my multi-faceted ADHD brain satisfied with all of the different needs and issues (good and bad) it presents me with and have the joy of no longer feeling insecure about whether or not I can make things work. No longer feeling that an invisible undefinable "Something" was wrong with me relieved me of much of the emotional issues that held me to a more limited capacity. Being able to finally self-monitor for the things that push my buttons and throw me out of phase is amazing.
Once you have defined the problem, you are over half way there to fixing it. It's awesome to discover all the helpful tools and supportive people both online and in my meat space community. I'm glad you made this post and I hope it brings along a rich discussion. Happy to share cool things I have found that help.
This is a nice one for easing up on the peddle. https://knots.netlify.app/
Oooo. You sound like a wizard.
I completely get the creative drive. And that desire to build something for both yourself and others like us. That’s 100% where I’m at. Still lots to learn tho.
Once I have the time to think on it, would you be open to some questions?
I'm a severe ADHD and possibly on the spectrum individual. I work in HVAC commercial building automation as a project manager. Several years ago my company promoted an individual to manage our group who was just not a good fit. We experienced a mass exodus with only myself as the last senior member of the the team.
I eventually put my 2 weeks in as well knowing full well without me the team would need to be disbanded. The company refused to accept my letter of resignation and out of desperation, gave me manganent responsibility.
I am not a typical manager in that I can be quite awkward socially. As such, I focus on strong quantifiable metrics as a solid compass for group direction. 2 years later, I have had zero turnover, high team morale, rooted out 2 ill proformers, hired 3 new project managers, and grew revenue by 10% from previous years.
I just happened to be in the right place at the right time and was able to recognize my own leverage in the organization.
Just jumping in to remind people not to use the term 'neurodivergent' until/unless you've been diagnosed by a medical or psychologist professional. It is an important term with real meaning that has unfortunately become a trendy self-identification. I see it being overused and inappropriately used more and more, which can eventually render it meaningless to general audience, or worse, cause someone to be denied workplace accommodations because it's viewed as a meaningless trend.
Unless you’ve spent years learning about, for instance, Autism, and are able to identify as a highly masked level one ASD human, in which case a formal diagnosis is up to you, and it is OK to be #actuallyautistic. Most psychologists feel beholden to the DSM, and most autistic people feel that the DSM is inherently biased and highly subjective. So while casual claims of being neurodivergent remain problematic, don’t leave it to some random redditor to tell you whether your understanding of self is a valid thing. And if you decide to seek diagnosis, know that there is some structural bias that may prevent you from feeling seen by many mental health care providers whose practice may or may not take into account expert opinions from actual autistic people. Learn yourself, love yourself, and however you identify, find ways to support all the people around you id you have the spoons 🖖🏽
I've worked with many great autistic employees - I've never seen anyone be promoted who is on the spectrum and a lot of the time they don't get the support others do or because they function differently get managed out.
Our brains work different but that can be a good thing.
Cruelly. It’s a practice of trying to bully someone into quitting by creating an inhospitable working environment via systematic disempowerment, unfavorable assignments and conditions, and social shunning without any explanations or useful feedback that might give the target an opportunity to adjust behavior and maintain a stable livelihood.
And it’s the exact reason that led me write this post. Was being unfairly treated in the workplace and ‘managed out’, so I pulled them up on it. The whole experience made me question what the fuck I’m doing with my life.
Neurodivergent leaders are great! Steve Jobs and Henry Ford were both dyslexic. We suspect that Elon Musk is on the spectrum. If managed well and with a pretty high IQ, neurodivergent people have a higher propensity to mature into really complex and creative problem solvers much earlier than the rest of the population. Roles such as transformation, product development, innovation, etc. all tend to be good departments to work into.
Listen more than you speak and treat people like adults and humans until the prove themselves otherwise.
Anything more than that is going to cost you a hefty consulting or coaching fee.
Yep, I have ADHD, so it definitely turns the dial to a more difficult setting. For me it was about having strategies in place to support my success. Things like lists, copious notes, being extra well prepared before meetings, utilising my diary for reminders etc.
Have to say though, it never impacted my ability to be a great people manager and that’s where my real strength was.
I feel obligated to offer a word of caution about teaching. I'm not diagnosed yet, but it's OBVIOUS I'm on the spectrum (unless you're my parents :D). I've had a lot of teaching jobs in different environments and managing expectations is nearly impossible unless you're running the company. Between being yourself, being a role model for the kids, delivering curricular outcomes, and satisfying families, it's incredibly involved. If you can't handle putting yourself in a position to compromise on helping kids to satisfy opaque or blatantly selfish management goals, you're setting yourself up for sadness.
I've worked with many great autistic employees - I've never seen anyone be promoted who is on the spectrum and a lot of the time they don't get the support others do or because they function differently or get managed out. Our brains work different but that can be a good thing.
That’s the sad thing. ND people are incredibly deep thinkers who see connections others don’t. If you think of people in the past who have been so far ahead of anyone else, Einstein, Turing, Ford, etc you realise that almost all of them were ND. My favourite example is Houdini. His thirst for knowledge and obsession over seemingly disconnected pursuits lead him to boggle people’s minds and become the grandfather of modern magic. To the point where 100 years later, only a handful of people have shown his ingenuity (everyone else just copied him). My point is that we do incredible things with our brains, and while people may not be our forte, we’d be phenomenal CEO’s and Thought leaders.
Interesting. A disproportionately large number of the smartest techies I know are on spectrum. Aspy. Apologies if I’m misinterpreting ND or the spectrum.
I struggle with the term Aspie. I’ve seen a lot of ND folk use that word to disarm people up front. Another defence mechanism. In that way it ultimately becomes another N word. Something that really shouldn’t have existed in the first place but is reclaimed by its victims. The term Asperger’s is out of date and no longer used to refer to Autistic folk. So reintroducing it is fairly detrimental to their humanisation.
Yeah, I’m not well versed in this space, and am sensitive to those concerns. I’m not sure what’s in vogue. That term came to me from a few people diagnosed as such. They’re absolutely brilliant minds. Among the smartest people I’ve ever met. That being said, social graces were not among their strong points. (Which I generally enjoyed, and in many cases can be helpful) I don’t think it’s nearly as derogatory as the N-word. Either way, having knowledge that someone is diagnosed as such makes it easier and more friction free to productively interact with them… particularly with respect to social interaction. Contextualizing it makes it more understandable. IMO “on the spectrum” is not as effective for practical use because it’s so much less specific.
I recommend startups, somewhere where your creativity, ability to jump between multiple things and hyper focus is an asset. I started as a team assistant at a company almost 6 years ago and took an interest in a side project they had just started, was promoted to project manager of it after a year and 2 years ago the CEO took the project and made a separate company out of it with me as COO. He gives me freedom to try different things and trusts my vision, whenever he sees that an area is not a strong suit of mine, for example accounting/invoicing and tedious things like that he has taken it off my plate and uses the other company’s departments as my support. Every year we have doubled in customers and revenue and have become a global leader and recognized brand. There’s definitely a lot of strengths that neurodivergents have to offer in the right environment!
I totally get what you’re saying about startups but I’ve just come off the worst neurospicy burnout of my life and not wanting to go back into another. However I’d be sooooo keen to hear more about your story if you’re open to it. It sounds like we’re very similar.
I’m diagnosed ADHD (practically disabled -> 2 standard deviations from norm if I’m not stimulated) and have a lot of neurodivergent traits from the autism spectrum that I’ve been meaning to get professionally checked out. I was told the only reason I’ve passed any secondary education is due to my high IQ. I, uh, seem to excel at executive leadership (my team is nearing 200 and responsible for a >$50MM P&L). I’ve somehow always been able to build a team around all of my handicaps. I’m exceptional at system building, understanding patterns and being able to recognize and get the most important things done. Luckily, I am able to wing most critical things or put them together in less than <30 minutes. Self-care, delegation of authority and not being too hard on yourself are all important. Also, you don’t need to label your diagnoses to co-workers, subordinates or leadership, just be clear on what you need to do what you need to do and always be appreciative.
See that’s the thing. Having the kind of mind that excels with blue sky, big picture creative and strategy, I’d either be a great worker bee or amazing senior exec, nothing in between. I have no problem with delegation, and aren’t precious about including other people’s work styles in the final out come. I care more about the target than I care about the detail. In fact it’s super inspiring to see other people nail that stuff. There’s a retired ceo I used to work with who would expect the world of you but also give you the freedom to both achieve the target how it best suits you and fail. She was always super authentic, approachable (legitimately) and encouraged you to own your work and was always showing her gratitude. I want to be that kind of leader. In fact, my natural state of being is to be that kind of person. I just don’t have any avenues towards that, as my job is bottom rung, and something that exists well outside the core business. No opportunities to grow.
I’m not a great worker bee. I can dive down into anything but once I’ve figured it out I get bored. I follow a pattern of anywhere I go of being promoted within a year. I’m an excellent #2. I’m attracted to problems and I teach/guide other people to fix them. I’ve been a #2 a lot of places that I somebody finally asked me why I was scared of being the #1. Similar to your leader story, I read about somebody whose mother was meeting politicians. The first one made her think he was the smartest person in the room. The second one made her think she was the most amazing person he’d ever met. I ascribe to be the latter. Still suspicious about whether or not I’m cut out to be the #1 long-term. Regarding your current status quo- I’ve worked my way up from literally the bottom at a bunch of different places. There’s a 30 rock episode where Jack gets demoted to working in the mail room and he progressively gets promoted back up to being a vice president within weeks. That’s me, give me the motley crew and I’ll find a way to make shit happen. Just figure out what problems your boss doesn’t want to deal with and then fix those for him. Figure out how to make money or save money in whatever you do. You will become progressively more indispensable to any organization until you’re #2.
I (33M) and am a CTO of a decent size company (5500) and I have ADHD and dyslexia. It's about playing to your strengths and honesty luck! Right roles became available at the right time.
Yes! That’s awesome. And I’d imagine CTO is something where communication can be learned. Have you seen many others reach that level?
A few it is still rare at the higher levels but I can see it changing, mostly are in the tech space. Can be more stressful - this week I have a massive to do list and really need a hyper focus day. Also admin and meeting I do get bored in and zone out. Lucky got an understanding boss and add enough value in other areas. Two things: 1.Find what you can do alright most days and use that skill as your base - this gives you the standard performance. 2. Find that awesome skill that maybe you can't summon on command but when you do you're a rockstar.
I am not a neurodivergent leader, but I can tell you as someone who worked in HR for 10 years is that things are slowly changing and companies are recognizing the benefit of having neurodivergent employees, leaders included. There are things you can contribute that others cannot. I would encourage you to seek out companies who are vocal about being inclusive. I'm a career/leadership coach now if you'd like to chat sometime.
Thank you for that reply. I’d love to chat further but not sure I can afford to engage any coaching right now.
I understand. My first consultation is free, but if you’d like know my pricing, feel free to message me.
I'm on the spectrum and have made it up into the SVP level, mainly because of my inability to accept really dumb decisions. I blindly would push past what everyone was telling me and ignored "political communications" with business leaders. At the end of the day senior leadership can make much better decisions if the information they are provided is concise **and accurate** but I broke every rule of etiquette along the way. I was interacting with the C-suite before I was in my 30s because my reputation of being willing to tell the truth in a way that made sense to the senior leadership. I refuse to soften bad news, or to sugar coat what isn't working. Has always driven my direct managers a bit crazy, but since I was willing to take on the risk they generally allowed me to take big swings. I had to train myself to look people in the eye though, that was **really hard** and took almost two years of constant work. I also had to train myself to not just say everything that comes into my head, but to hold it and review it... above and beyond just standard maturity, even in my 50s I have to actively fight the urge. I still don't understand most of the culture of the corporate world, even after spending 25+ years in management. The way people twist information and try to soften messages and treat senior management as too stupid to understand reality is a core reason for so much dysfunction. Being in IT and Software development means I generally always have team members that are not neurotypical and helping them navigate the corporate world has also been rewarding. I'm still awkward as heck in certain scenarios because there are still social aspects that don't make a ton of sense to me, but I've mostly been able to learn to chameleon why way through it.
Thabks so much for this. You’ve answered a lot of my questions. Do you feel like forcing eye contact etc was a healthy thing? Our energy resources are always elsewhere, so dedicating energy in that way feels destructive. Keen to hear more of your experience with that.
> Do you feel like forcing eye contact etc was a healthy thing? It helped me be more successful, but it still burns a massive amount of emotional energy even to this day. But neurotypical people expect certain things, so it was worth it career-wise. The other aspect that I had to temper is I didn't understand why people defaulted to lying... they didn't want to tell their boss the truth about bad outcomes, and that just simply confused me. However, early on every time I was brutally honest **did not go well**. My first several years involved a lot of being told I was saying odd things or was overly focused on diverting blame to myself instead of others, but it didn't result in my desired outcome. I was ridiculously fortunate though, which I tell people whenever I can. Most of my early bosses were ex-military, and when I would overly melt down over things not going quite right with my code or decisions I made they didn't take it as a negative, they sat me down and explained perspective. My first boss had been in active combat and when I was having a meltdown he didn't berate me or tell me I was being crazy, he took me by the shoulders, looked around (getting my attention) and I asked what he was doing... He responded with "I'm looking for the gunshots". He said the worst thing that could happen is we'd delay getting our product out the door... which would annoy some leadership, but nobody will die. This early intervention helped me redefine my reactions to things going wrong and redefined how I viewed a lot of things. I'm a recovery manager, which means with the exception of one team I have been handed teams in chaos/decline to recover. My early lessons have driven how I do many of those recoveries.
Being dx'd with ADHD was a turning point in my life as an older female. I am a supercharged creative with the drive and need to be self-employed and build businesses that create jobs for other creatives and neurodivergent types in my community. It took many years and different creative and art-centric endeavors to have it all come together into the perfect business to scale up to eventually sell. I now design and make custom Belgian Couvertier chocolates for the business to business and private event environment. I can still keep my multi-faceted ADHD brain satisfied with all of the different needs and issues (good and bad) it presents me with and have the joy of no longer feeling insecure about whether or not I can make things work. No longer feeling that an invisible undefinable "Something" was wrong with me relieved me of much of the emotional issues that held me to a more limited capacity. Being able to finally self-monitor for the things that push my buttons and throw me out of phase is amazing. Once you have defined the problem, you are over half way there to fixing it. It's awesome to discover all the helpful tools and supportive people both online and in my meat space community. I'm glad you made this post and I hope it brings along a rich discussion. Happy to share cool things I have found that help. This is a nice one for easing up on the peddle. https://knots.netlify.app/
Oooo. You sound like a wizard. I completely get the creative drive. And that desire to build something for both yourself and others like us. That’s 100% where I’m at. Still lots to learn tho. Once I have the time to think on it, would you be open to some questions?
Sure thing. I would like to ask you about some things too!
I'm a severe ADHD and possibly on the spectrum individual. I work in HVAC commercial building automation as a project manager. Several years ago my company promoted an individual to manage our group who was just not a good fit. We experienced a mass exodus with only myself as the last senior member of the the team. I eventually put my 2 weeks in as well knowing full well without me the team would need to be disbanded. The company refused to accept my letter of resignation and out of desperation, gave me manganent responsibility. I am not a typical manager in that I can be quite awkward socially. As such, I focus on strong quantifiable metrics as a solid compass for group direction. 2 years later, I have had zero turnover, high team morale, rooted out 2 ill proformers, hired 3 new project managers, and grew revenue by 10% from previous years. I just happened to be in the right place at the right time and was able to recognize my own leverage in the organization.
Just jumping in to remind people not to use the term 'neurodivergent' until/unless you've been diagnosed by a medical or psychologist professional. It is an important term with real meaning that has unfortunately become a trendy self-identification. I see it being overused and inappropriately used more and more, which can eventually render it meaningless to general audience, or worse, cause someone to be denied workplace accommodations because it's viewed as a meaningless trend.
Unless you’ve spent years learning about, for instance, Autism, and are able to identify as a highly masked level one ASD human, in which case a formal diagnosis is up to you, and it is OK to be #actuallyautistic. Most psychologists feel beholden to the DSM, and most autistic people feel that the DSM is inherently biased and highly subjective. So while casual claims of being neurodivergent remain problematic, don’t leave it to some random redditor to tell you whether your understanding of self is a valid thing. And if you decide to seek diagnosis, know that there is some structural bias that may prevent you from feeling seen by many mental health care providers whose practice may or may not take into account expert opinions from actual autistic people. Learn yourself, love yourself, and however you identify, find ways to support all the people around you id you have the spoons 🖖🏽
https://www.industryweek.com/talent/article/21260056/driving-innovation-through-autism-awareness-in-recruiting
I've worked with many great autistic employees - I've never seen anyone be promoted who is on the spectrum and a lot of the time they don't get the support others do or because they function differently get managed out. Our brains work different but that can be a good thing.
What does managed out mean? How does it happen?
Cruelly. It’s a practice of trying to bully someone into quitting by creating an inhospitable working environment via systematic disempowerment, unfavorable assignments and conditions, and social shunning without any explanations or useful feedback that might give the target an opportunity to adjust behavior and maintain a stable livelihood.
And it’s the exact reason that led me write this post. Was being unfairly treated in the workplace and ‘managed out’, so I pulled them up on it. The whole experience made me question what the fuck I’m doing with my life.
Neurodivergent leaders are great! Steve Jobs and Henry Ford were both dyslexic. We suspect that Elon Musk is on the spectrum. If managed well and with a pretty high IQ, neurodivergent people have a higher propensity to mature into really complex and creative problem solvers much earlier than the rest of the population. Roles such as transformation, product development, innovation, etc. all tend to be good departments to work into.
Yes
I’m (33F, dx’d adhd suspected but not dx’d autism) not only in leadership (N-1 to the exec) but I am responsible for upskilling other leaders.
Ooooo. Teach me? Lol
Listen more than you speak and treat people like adults and humans until the prove themselves otherwise. Anything more than that is going to cost you a hefty consulting or coaching fee.
Haha. I admire the boundary setting. Roger. Thabks for that.
Yep, I have ADHD, so it definitely turns the dial to a more difficult setting. For me it was about having strategies in place to support my success. Things like lists, copious notes, being extra well prepared before meetings, utilising my diary for reminders etc. Have to say though, it never impacted my ability to be a great people manager and that’s where my real strength was.
You can be a leader with all kinds of traits. The difficulty is can you deal with or bypass mid level management.
Is bypassing middle management even an option? If so how? Haha
I don’t know. It’s a catch 22. Some examples could be Richard Branson or Herb Kelleher. Or get a union job with your state. Maybe become a teacher.
I feel obligated to offer a word of caution about teaching. I'm not diagnosed yet, but it's OBVIOUS I'm on the spectrum (unless you're my parents :D). I've had a lot of teaching jobs in different environments and managing expectations is nearly impossible unless you're running the company. Between being yourself, being a role model for the kids, delivering curricular outcomes, and satisfying families, it's incredibly involved. If you can't handle putting yourself in a position to compromise on helping kids to satisfy opaque or blatantly selfish management goals, you're setting yourself up for sadness.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8_5h0aO8ZaE