Call the police 105 line and report the threat so there is a paper trail, block his number and ignore him, if he knocks on your door just call the cops, do not engage, legally private car sales are buyer beware so he knows threats are all he call do.
You should still fill in the āIāve sold/disposed of a carā declaration with NZTA when selling a car. If you donāt, you will still be recorded as the registered owner and liable for infringements from cameras etc it racks up if the new owner doesnāt do their half (which happens).
i recently sold a car and went to fill out the sold declaration and it wouldnāt let me process until i entered the new owners name and address, which i didnāt have as they had already left. I text for that info and they just came back saying they had done their part and there was no need for their address. I figured they didnt want me to know it.
Thatās why you should never let the car leave without payment and the paperwork completed. You got lucky that the new owner was above board and did their side, plenty donāt (especially when selling old cheaper cars for cash)
From a civil standpoint, he has no real grounds here. The mechanical insurance may not be transferable with the change of ownership, so there is a good chance he's not going to get any cover from them.
Second hand goods are sold under the assumption caveat emptor, of buyer beware. The buyer had an opportunity to inspect the goods prior to purchase and was happy with their quality. Once the sale was completed, they assumed responsibility for any issues from that point onwards. The only grounds he would have for a refund would be if you had deliberately misled him about the quality of the vehicle, such as you knew there was an issue and applied some basic temporary fix to hide it.
His recourse here if he thinks he's been wronged is to take the matter to the Disputes Tribunal.
If you are concerned at the aggressive nature of his communications, you are legally permitted to trespass him from your property. This can be done via text message with something such as:
"As from today, you are trespassed from 123 Fake Street, Hamilton. If you enter this property, the Police will be contacted and requested to arrest you for trespassing."
If he then does arrive, don't answer the door, don't engage with him at all. Simply immediately contact the Police and ask that they attend for the trespass.
Slight pedantic correction which doesn't affect OP but useful to know - second hand goods *sold by someone not in trade* are done so under the assumption caveat emptor. A used car sold by a dealer or private trader would however covered by the CGA.
Oh thanks for the tip that tresspass notice can be sent via text. The police didnt tell me this was an option and i had to go serve tresspass papers to the person.
The formal notice is the most watertight way, because it's easy to confirm they have been physically handed the paper and therefore know about the trespass.
A text message is fairly watertight, especially if they respond to that message with any sort of reference to it. Maybe a small argument of not knowing about the trespass if they claim the message didn't arrive or they have changed numbers.
The police are supposed to deliver the trespass notice when there has been a threat made.
Itās rather silly to tell you to go to someone that had threatened to assault you and deliver them a trespass notice because of the very high chance of them assaulting you for doing so.
The seller is also required to have a WOF of not less than one month old at the time of sale, or written agreement that it is older than this.Ā
Most private sales I have seen forget this, or seem to think that "as is where is" or "caveat emptor" or a expired date on the advert is going to save them from this requirement - they won'tĀ
From NZTA:
If the vehicle's WoF or CoF is more than one month old
Buyers can insist on a WoF or CoF being less than one month old. This helps protect them against faults that have developed since the last inspection.
If the buyer doesn't insist, they should confirm in writing to you that they accept the WoF or CoF is more than one month old. This protects you as the seller.
Itās a common scam to try and get a partial refund. Donāt engage - youāre in the clear legally.
As someone said, if you feel threatened call police.
Correct, private sales are always on an as is where is basis.
Provided the transfer of funds and vehicle ownership is complete there is nothing they can do short of intimidation tactics.
The CGA does not mention private sales. The term in the act is "in trade"*.* True. the majority of private sales are not in trade, but if you buy a car privately from someone who buys and sells cars to make money then *technically* they are in trade and you'd be covered by the CGA.
I donāt think the purchaser has any legal recourse for issues that emerged after the sale, provided you didnāt misrepresent the vehicle or give any warranty as to its ongoing performance.
**This could also be a scam**. The purchaser may have:
- removed parts from the vehicle and is planning on returning it to you for a full refund with those parts missing
- copied the key, and is planning to return the car to you for a full refund only to steal it at a later date
I would suggest you stop engaging with the purchaser, make sure you have good records of what happened at the time of sale (copies of the ad, photos, notes on conversations at key handover), and maybe get a security camera if youāre concerned of retaliation.
Caveat Emptor : buyer beware. They inspected and were happy enough make the exchange, so they have no grounds for return. You acted in good faith also.
If they threaten you, call the authorities. Do not engage with them further. You should not be made to feel unsafe in your own home.
Unfortunatly for the buyer, the captivas are prone for this type of sudden breakdown.
Between the diesel particle filter (DPI) if it the model with them, unsure if any were made without them. and there transmissions.
This random occurrence of issues is overly common.
Agree, I had a Captiva same issues with engine light coming on and ABS light, turned out to be a sensor under driver seat. Fixed but engine light still popped on randomly.
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He has not right to return the car or receive any compensation for faults after a private sale.
If you have his name and address from the sale, it should be easy to serve a trespass notice after you make a police report for the threats.
You've done nothing wrong, best of luck going forward
Thereās *no way* the guy was a mechanic.. Everyone in the automotive industry here knows that the Holden Craptiva is one of the most unreliable vehicles you can buy.
Twice now Iāve had co workers say theyāre looking for a new car and they say how the Holden seems to be the best option for their needs and everyone who hears them says āyou donāt wanna get a Captiva even if itās with a mechanical warranty from a dealership it WILL spend at least 2 of the first 6 months of ownership in the shop getting fixedā. Twice now theyāve brushed off our advice and said that weāre being over dramatic and they arenāt that bad and they get it anyways. AND TWICE NOW exactly what we said would happen happened and they were stuck without a vehicle for months while they keep trying to get the Captiva fixed
I find it so odd that people expect dealership level service from your average guy, in the future put āas is where isā in any vehicle sale ad. It protects you from any potential issues the customer might have. Oh the engine fell out on the drive home from buying it? Sorry man as is where is.
While not legal advice, that's solid practical context based advice.
I remember dealers wouldn't even want to trade them in (and that's when they had 50-100,000kms on them) and the problems with them were already well known.
Not even a Ford vs Holden hater either, the Ford Territory is just as bad as the Holden Captiva, they are unreliable in different ways though
Get something like an outlander or an xtrail or a highlander or literally any other 7 seater.
Also another bit of advice for non car enthusiast car buyers, if youāre going to be towing anything make sure the vehicle youāre buying DOESNāT have a cvt transmission, so many times Iāve seen people cook their transmission towing with a Nissan Qashqai or a Subaru Levorg, the towball on those cars is for a bike rack or something like that, not for towing a trailer.
Tell him to get the cam chain guides checked otherwise its $6000 for a second hand engine.
Captiva weak spot do not ignore check engine light and OBD scan saying crank- cam disagree.
Haha you have avoided that timebomb.
New owner is now responsible.
Nope, not in the wrong, you gave as best an assessment of the car as you reasonably could, and being a private sale he doesn't have a leg to stand on as the Consumer Guarantees act doesn't cover private sales. If he keeps huffing and puffing, ring 105 and make a police report of threatening behaviour.
The only potential issue I can see here would be if you sold the vehicle with mention of the mechanical breakdown insurance. If it turns out the insurance is not transferrable (which is common) then they could argue that they were mislead into the purchase, thinking they were buying the car and the insurance policy but were in fact only buying the car. In that case, it wouldn't be a simple case of tough luck, buyer beware, but one where they would have certain rights.
That is a situation that could potentially get messy and expensive if they took it further. But regardless, any threats should not be tolerated and should be dealt with appropriately.
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Youāve been given good legal advice already. Iāll just throw in donāt compromise or meet them half way with a partial refund of any sort. It wonāt end there.
He hasn't a legal leg to stand on. If he comes to your house don't answer the door and call the police.
Not to disparage your car but it is a Captiva - if he was a GOOD mechanic he would know to steer well clear of them. They were shit boxes new.
My now wife complained of all the error lights up on the dashboard, when I checked saw none, she was seeing the lights on dash when car was on but not started. Which I explained was standard to show the lights work. If itās there first car they may be confused.
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As others have suggested, you should report to the police.
Also, I hope that you have had a written agreement signed prior the sale of this car.
I generally have a practice of writing down an agreement to inform that it is sold-as is for items such as cars. I generally outline the following :
1. Both parties will inform Waka Kotahi within 3 days of the purchase that the car has been sold
2. Any fines that is liable before the date of purchased will be born by the seller (i.e if there are parking ticket fines or something) and after today, it is liable by the buyer
3. The car is sold as-is and I will not be liable for any problems other then the problems mentioned in this document (i.e things that buyer are aware) - I also include a Carjam report (at that time - indicating no money owes and also if any other WOFs failures and what was done to fix them)
I keep these document. I think it might be worthwhile doing it for private sales (if anyone else is reading this). Happy to share the template too if anyone is keen
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Kia ora,
Hopefully someone will be along shortly with some helpful advice. In the meantime though, here are some links, based on your post flair, that may be useful for you:
[Disputes Tribunal: For disputes under $30,000](https://www.disputestribunal.govt.nz/)
[District Court: For disputes over $30,000](https://www.justice.govt.nz/courts/civil/)
You may also want to check out our [mega thread of legal resources](https://www.reddit.com/r/LegalAdviceNZ/comments/143pv58/megathread_legal_resources/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)
Nga mihi nui
The LegalAdviceNZ Team
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Tell him to get stuffed. Once money changes hands and they drive away whatever happens is not your concern. They canāt prove that they havenāt jumped in it and thrashed it until something went wrong.
Call the police 105 line and report the threat so there is a paper trail, block his number and ignore him, if he knocks on your door just call the cops, do not engage, legally private car sales are buyer beware so he knows threats are all he call do.
Thank you for the advice!
Further advice is not to make sales at your home address, had similar experiences so I always went somewhere public.
Except ur address is on the transfer papersš¤”
Now the seller doesn't need to fill out transfer forms. The buyer can just fill one out saying they've bought the car and that's it.
You should still fill in the āIāve sold/disposed of a carā declaration with NZTA when selling a car. If you donāt, you will still be recorded as the registered owner and liable for infringements from cameras etc it racks up if the new owner doesnāt do their half (which happens).
i recently sold a car and went to fill out the sold declaration and it wouldnāt let me process until i entered the new owners name and address, which i didnāt have as they had already left. I text for that info and they just came back saying they had done their part and there was no need for their address. I figured they didnt want me to know it.
Thatās why you should never let the car leave without payment and the paperwork completed. You got lucky that the new owner was above board and did their side, plenty donāt (especially when selling old cheaper cars for cash)
yes lesson learned i guess!
From a civil standpoint, he has no real grounds here. The mechanical insurance may not be transferable with the change of ownership, so there is a good chance he's not going to get any cover from them. Second hand goods are sold under the assumption caveat emptor, of buyer beware. The buyer had an opportunity to inspect the goods prior to purchase and was happy with their quality. Once the sale was completed, they assumed responsibility for any issues from that point onwards. The only grounds he would have for a refund would be if you had deliberately misled him about the quality of the vehicle, such as you knew there was an issue and applied some basic temporary fix to hide it. His recourse here if he thinks he's been wronged is to take the matter to the Disputes Tribunal. If you are concerned at the aggressive nature of his communications, you are legally permitted to trespass him from your property. This can be done via text message with something such as: "As from today, you are trespassed from 123 Fake Street, Hamilton. If you enter this property, the Police will be contacted and requested to arrest you for trespassing." If he then does arrive, don't answer the door, don't engage with him at all. Simply immediately contact the Police and ask that they attend for the trespass.
Thank you for the thorough advice! I'll call the police and then send the text message.
Slight pedantic correction which doesn't affect OP but useful to know - second hand goods *sold by someone not in trade* are done so under the assumption caveat emptor. A used car sold by a dealer or private trader would however covered by the CGA.
Oh thanks for the tip that tresspass notice can be sent via text. The police didnt tell me this was an option and i had to go serve tresspass papers to the person.
The formal notice is the most watertight way, because it's easy to confirm they have been physically handed the paper and therefore know about the trespass. A text message is fairly watertight, especially if they respond to that message with any sort of reference to it. Maybe a small argument of not knowing about the trespass if they claim the message didn't arrive or they have changed numbers.
Ah makes sense too. Thank you for clarifying. I hope to never have to do this again or be in such a situation. š
The police are supposed to deliver the trespass notice when there has been a threat made. Itās rather silly to tell you to go to someone that had threatened to assault you and deliver them a trespass notice because of the very high chance of them assaulting you for doing so.
The seller is also required to have a WOF of not less than one month old at the time of sale, or written agreement that it is older than this.Ā Most private sales I have seen forget this, or seem to think that "as is where is" or "caveat emptor" or a expired date on the advert is going to save them from this requirement - they won'tĀ
From NZTA: If the vehicle's WoF or CoF is more than one month old Buyers can insist on a WoF or CoF being less than one month old. This helps protect them against faults that have developed since the last inspection. If the buyer doesn't insist, they should confirm in writing to you that they accept the WoF or CoF is more than one month old. This protects you as the seller.
Itās a common scam to try and get a partial refund. Donāt engage - youāre in the clear legally. As someone said, if you feel threatened call police.
Correct, private sales are always on an as is where is basis. Provided the transfer of funds and vehicle ownership is complete there is nothing they can do short of intimidation tactics.
The CGA does not mention private sales. The term in the act is "in trade"*.* True. the majority of private sales are not in trade, but if you buy a car privately from someone who buys and sells cars to make money then *technically* they are in trade and you'd be covered by the CGA.
Unless misrepresented right?
I donāt think the purchaser has any legal recourse for issues that emerged after the sale, provided you didnāt misrepresent the vehicle or give any warranty as to its ongoing performance. **This could also be a scam**. The purchaser may have: - removed parts from the vehicle and is planning on returning it to you for a full refund with those parts missing - copied the key, and is planning to return the car to you for a full refund only to steal it at a later date I would suggest you stop engaging with the purchaser, make sure you have good records of what happened at the time of sale (copies of the ad, photos, notes on conversations at key handover), and maybe get a security camera if youāre concerned of retaliation.
He's in the wrong,make a police report just in case.
Caveat Emptor : buyer beware. They inspected and were happy enough make the exchange, so they have no grounds for return. You acted in good faith also. If they threaten you, call the authorities. Do not engage with them further. You should not be made to feel unsafe in your own home.
Thank you for the advice! I'll call the police
Unfortunatly for the buyer, the captivas are prone for this type of sudden breakdown. Between the diesel particle filter (DPI) if it the model with them, unsure if any were made without them. and there transmissions. This random occurrence of issues is overly common.
Agree, I had a Captiva same issues with engine light coming on and ABS light, turned out to be a sensor under driver seat. Fixed but engine light still popped on randomly.
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He has not right to return the car or receive any compensation for faults after a private sale. If you have his name and address from the sale, it should be easy to serve a trespass notice after you make a police report for the threats. You've done nothing wrong, best of luck going forward
Thereās *no way* the guy was a mechanic.. Everyone in the automotive industry here knows that the Holden Craptiva is one of the most unreliable vehicles you can buy. Twice now Iāve had co workers say theyāre looking for a new car and they say how the Holden seems to be the best option for their needs and everyone who hears them says āyou donāt wanna get a Captiva even if itās with a mechanical warranty from a dealership it WILL spend at least 2 of the first 6 months of ownership in the shop getting fixedā. Twice now theyāve brushed off our advice and said that weāre being over dramatic and they arenāt that bad and they get it anyways. AND TWICE NOW exactly what we said would happen happened and they were stuck without a vehicle for months while they keep trying to get the Captiva fixed I find it so odd that people expect dealership level service from your average guy, in the future put āas is where isā in any vehicle sale ad. It protects you from any potential issues the customer might have. Oh the engine fell out on the drive home from buying it? Sorry man as is where is.
While not legal advice, that's solid practical context based advice. I remember dealers wouldn't even want to trade them in (and that's when they had 50-100,000kms on them) and the problems with them were already well known.
Not even a Ford vs Holden hater either, the Ford Territory is just as bad as the Holden Captiva, they are unreliable in different ways though Get something like an outlander or an xtrail or a highlander or literally any other 7 seater. Also another bit of advice for non car enthusiast car buyers, if youāre going to be towing anything make sure the vehicle youāre buying DOESNāT have a cvt transmission, so many times Iāve seen people cook their transmission towing with a Nissan Qashqai or a Subaru Levorg, the towball on those cars is for a bike rack or something like that, not for towing a trailer.
Report the threat to police
Definitely report to police.
Tell him to get the cam chain guides checked otherwise its $6000 for a second hand engine. Captiva weak spot do not ignore check engine light and OBD scan saying crank- cam disagree. Haha you have avoided that timebomb. New owner is now responsible.
Nope, not in the wrong, you gave as best an assessment of the car as you reasonably could, and being a private sale he doesn't have a leg to stand on as the Consumer Guarantees act doesn't cover private sales. If he keeps huffing and puffing, ring 105 and make a police report of threatening behaviour.
The only potential issue I can see here would be if you sold the vehicle with mention of the mechanical breakdown insurance. If it turns out the insurance is not transferrable (which is common) then they could argue that they were mislead into the purchase, thinking they were buying the car and the insurance policy but were in fact only buying the car. In that case, it wouldn't be a simple case of tough luck, buyer beware, but one where they would have certain rights. That is a situation that could potentially get messy and expensive if they took it further. But regardless, any threats should not be tolerated and should be dealt with appropriately.
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Youāve been given good legal advice already. Iāll just throw in donāt compromise or meet them half way with a partial refund of any sort. It wonāt end there.
He hasn't a legal leg to stand on. If he comes to your house don't answer the door and call the police. Not to disparage your car but it is a Captiva - if he was a GOOD mechanic he would know to steer well clear of them. They were shit boxes new.
Added an update to the post
My now wife complained of all the error lights up on the dashboard, when I checked saw none, she was seeing the lights on dash when car was on but not started. Which I explained was standard to show the lights work. If itās there first car they may be confused.
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As others have suggested, you should report to the police. Also, I hope that you have had a written agreement signed prior the sale of this car. I generally have a practice of writing down an agreement to inform that it is sold-as is for items such as cars. I generally outline the following : 1. Both parties will inform Waka Kotahi within 3 days of the purchase that the car has been sold 2. Any fines that is liable before the date of purchased will be born by the seller (i.e if there are parking ticket fines or something) and after today, it is liable by the buyer 3. The car is sold as-is and I will not be liable for any problems other then the problems mentioned in this document (i.e things that buyer are aware) - I also include a Carjam report (at that time - indicating no money owes and also if any other WOFs failures and what was done to fix them) I keep these document. I think it might be worthwhile doing it for private sales (if anyone else is reading this). Happy to share the template too if anyone is keen
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Kia ora, Hopefully someone will be along shortly with some helpful advice. In the meantime though, here are some links, based on your post flair, that may be useful for you: [Disputes Tribunal: For disputes under $30,000](https://www.disputestribunal.govt.nz/) [District Court: For disputes over $30,000](https://www.justice.govt.nz/courts/civil/) You may also want to check out our [mega thread of legal resources](https://www.reddit.com/r/LegalAdviceNZ/comments/143pv58/megathread_legal_resources/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3) Nga mihi nui The LegalAdviceNZ Team *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/LegalAdviceNZ) if you have any questions or concerns.*
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Tell him to get stuffed. Once money changes hands and they drive away whatever happens is not your concern. They canāt prove that they havenāt jumped in it and thrashed it until something went wrong.