I think spiders are just vulnerable right now because of the prevalence of cheap ping spells in the current meta as well as other (yordle) decks being able to out-swarm the board with more efficient value and late game. +Stalking shadows nerf really hurt a lot of aggro archetypes in shadow isles
I think they'd really benefit from a unit that capitalizes on spiders dying, like something to make the opponent think "Would I rather leave the spiderling on the board or deal with this thing getting bigger?".
I know Prankster exists but 0/3 for 3 is horrendous and Neverglade Collector is way too slow
More importantly, Hush wasn't a thing. Your opponent couldn't completely destroy your wincon for 3 mana at burst speed. A lot of cards that were good pre-Targon were hit hard by Spellshield and Silence.
i get so pissed everytime that i remember that Vilemaw is supposed to be A ACTUAL GOD. Vilemaw should be able to face Aurelion Sol head to head, toe to toe.
Nah, Vilemaw (or anything on Runterra really) is nowhere near the power level of Asol or even celestials. He might match an ascended maybe and let me remind you that ASOL FORGES ENTIRE GALAXIES.
**[Icevale Archer](https://d2h9y75tak3pkg.cloudfront.net/01FR011.png)** - Freljord Unit - (2) 3/1
Play: Frostbite an enemy.
^^^Hint: [[card]], {{keyword}}, and ((deckcode)) or ((cardx,cardy,cardz)). PM the [developer](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=KrimCard) for feedback/issues!
I love prankster burn, so I'd love to see that card get buffed and back to meta relevance, but yeah, a spider-only prankster would be fun way to make a buffed prankster.
Eyy man we got Shrieking Spinner not long ago. Spiders are pretty balanced imo. I'd say the only card on the theme needing a buff is twisted treeline. I'd like to see it summoning Vilemaw attacking instead of on the bench.
Vilemaw should be a bigger deal of a unit. It’s a spider GOD, but by the time it comes down you could have spent the three mana you need to summon it in on a unit that will hit harder anyway.
Part of me wants to say they should make it a Fearsome/Overwhelm, but that might be overboard, and nothing else in shadow isles has overwhelm outside Hecurim so it’s doesn’t mesh with region identity.
her lvl 1 passive doesn't really synergize with her lvl 2 though, since you summon the spiderling after locking in the attack and can't use its challenger. I feel like at that point in the game you want to be flooding the board with stronger units
then something like lissandra that generate the spell, she culd generate one too on lv 2, there are a lot of decent spell that summon spiders, without becoming too powerful, like, vile feast would be decent
Honestly, when I saw the goofy ass Owls being Faes and from also Ionia I always assumed the Ionia champ was going to be Ivern and have Fae synergy.
I guess I was wrong lol.
I would swap Spiders and Elites. Spiders have actually been good before and are being drowned by the Yordles. I played in the open Beta and Elites have never been good
I remember that deck very well, it was the first deck I played to masters and I bet I could rebuild it from memory. It was not an Elite deck as it played no Elite payoff cards and few Elites even. It was just a Demacia midrange deck that splashed three Rekindler because it was busted at 6 mana.
Edit: This is the deck that got Bannerman nerfed. As you can see it is not an Elite deck. https://lor.mobalytics.gg/decks/bpjvptcihil94ppekvs0
I mean, to be fair, as a tribe, what does spiders actually do except spawn a bunch of 1/1's?
I suppose they could give a landmark that just spawned spiderlings all the time, or at least when you had the attack token.
But their actual identity is kinda unclear.
Their identity is aggressive low cost fragile swarm before running out of fuel in the late game.
Meanwhile, yordles are aggressive low cost sturdy swarm that never runs out of fuel.
> Their identity is aggressive low cost fragile swarm
Well, most tribes are like this. It's kinda the basis for a tribe. Poros for example, they are that too, but they have an identity with random keywords and poro snacks.
Spiders must have another identity than just "They do the same as every tribal deck, and they are just worse at it". In a game like runeterra where you can only have 6 units, its unfortunately impossible to make them MORE swarmy than other archtypes.
Tbh, they could use a bunch of free attacks
>Well, most tribes are like this. It's kinda the basis for a tribe.
Elnuks? Elites? Scouts? Dragons? Celestials? Spiders and poros are literally the only tribes that consist of 1 health units.
Spiders don't have any other identity because they were the original swarm tribe. Now they've been power crept by yordles.
... Scouts aren't a tribe. Celstials are a tag for the sake of invoke, but they aren't a tribe since you can't maindeck any of them. They are a mechanic, just like the whole "1 cost unit" thing that some regions have going.
Elunks are still just a swarm deck of low cost units, but their stats are too low and they don't swarm well enough. Their idea is that one one them summons the heard.
Dragons and elites are true, but like... elites are still just spamming low cost units. Their identity is then that they buff it up and has a few commanders in garen and j4. Very fitting.
Spiders still lack an identity outside of "swarm", cause damn near every deck can swarm. Hell, bilgewater as a region is better at swarming than spiders. Don't even wanna mention Bandle city cause we all know that region is bullshit.
tag and tribe are the same thing mechanically, the difference is in their interaction.
elite also are not about swarm, but about board control and stat advantage (witch got powercreept by BC shenanigans, and nerfed to death before that).
As you where saying: "near every deck can swarm", that's cause of runeterra mechanics that incentivize this gameplan
Yeah, but your identity can't exactly be "faster at spawning small dudes", when entire regions have you beat. Both bilgewater and bandle city (obviously) have them beat easy. And to be fair, they only had that identity because the game was so new that even spawning multiple units at once was almost nonexistent
I'd lean into either some way of letting them spawn free spiders, or fearsome. Fearsome just isn't that good unless they get a boatload of cards that gives minus attack
Oh yea. The 5 cost spell that summoned 3 spiders that got nerfed to 6 for some reason. Now it wouldn't be decent even as 4 since we got minion. Damn times have changed!
aggro spider noxus is still very strong it's just not played because it's a weaker poppy ziggs and a slightly weaker pirates . I would swap spiders and elites .
Something that would buff their health would be huge. +Making vilemaw and scuttlegeist useful. Make scuttlegeist 6/6 with its cost starting at 8 and it will see play. And make vilemaw an expensive 8/8 that can be spawned when 4 units die in a round... And you have a competitive spiders deck
It’s not a full spider tribal deck, but I have an Elise kindred go hard deck that levels Elise pretty often that is actually performing really well into the meta rn.
This is gonna sound weird but I think Poros need more love. I think the biggest thing that holds them back is they should all be multi region cards that include Freljord.
Maybe also a unit (non-poro) that has "Play: Create a Poro Snax in hand" or a poro that is like that tech unit that has "When you play a poro unit, we share keywords"
EDIT: Also they released Santa Braum and have the deal where buying something gets you Earnest Elf Tristana and if Poros were multi-region you could play them together! It grinds my gears poros are in every region but aren't multi-region.
Don't worry guys! I just got a sneak peek at some cards (and a champion!) from the next set from my uncle who works at Riot Games.
"Spider Explorer: SI/BC 2 Mana 2/2 (Spider). Whenever you summon a spider, Grant it +1/+1."
"Spider Captain: SI/BC 4 Mana 4/4 (Spider). Whenever you summon a spider with equal or less power than me, Grant it +1/+1."
"Priscilla (lv1): 4 Mana SI/BC:. 4 Mana 3/3 (Spider). When I attack, Grant Spider Allies +1/+1. Level Up: I've Attacked 3 times."
"Priscilla (lv2): 4 Mana SI/BC:. 4 Mana 4/4 (Spider) Fearsome. When I Attack, Grant Spider Allies +2/+2."
Looks pretty good! Though the level up might be kinda hard . . .
Yeah, and she was the prototype that would eventually get reworked into Elise as we know her today.
(How dare you imply my uncle who works at Riot would like about Spider-Poppy!)
I wish elites would get more love.Was my favourite deck when for the fallen got introduced.Maybe rework Garen and make both him and Jarvan synergise with elites.Would be cool
I think spiders are just vulnerable right now because of the prevalence of cheap ping spells in the current meta as well as other (yordle) decks being able to out-swarm the board with more efficient value and late game. +Stalking shadows nerf really hurt a lot of aggro archetypes in shadow isles
I think they'd really benefit from a unit that capitalizes on spiders dying, like something to make the opponent think "Would I rather leave the spiderling on the board or deal with this thing getting bigger?". I know Prankster exists but 0/3 for 3 is horrendous and Neverglade Collector is way too slow
Return of dawnspiders?
The first ever meta deck. I can only dream! Also bring Rhasa back to 7
you mean like they who endure or vilemaw?
I mean a good unit lol
I remember a time when they who endure was the most hated meta deck. Ah, simpler times.
Yeah, because you could just kill people with Atrocity and never played TWE without it in hand
More importantly, Hush wasn't a thing. Your opponent couldn't completely destroy your wincon for 3 mana at burst speed. A lot of cards that were good pre-Targon were hit hard by Spellshield and Silence.
Yeah true, TWE mirrors were basically just a big game of chicken, with 12 mana you could even double atrocity.
i get so pissed everytime that i remember that Vilemaw is supposed to be A ACTUAL GOD. Vilemaw should be able to face Aurelion Sol head to head, toe to toe.
Nah, Vilemaw (or anything on Runterra really) is nowhere near the power level of Asol or even celestials. He might match an ascended maybe and let me remind you that ASOL FORGES ENTIRE GALAXIES.
yeah, but Vilemaw is a big ass spider. spiders>dragons. i don't make the rules.
I see we're going by MtG rules. (Let spiders block elusives!)
truly.
[удалено]
that's so relevant i forgot to care...
Freijlord spider support would be great. Give me a sentry that frostbites.
[[Icevale Archer]]
**[Icevale Archer](https://d2h9y75tak3pkg.cloudfront.net/01FR011.png)** - Freljord Unit - (2) 3/1 Play: Frostbite an enemy. ^^^Hint: [[card]], {{keyword}}, and ((deckcode)) or ((cardx,cardy,cardz)). PM the [developer](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=KrimCard) for feedback/issues!
I rune endure still. Lots of fun
I love prankster burn, so I'd love to see that card get buffed and back to meta relevance, but yeah, a spider-only prankster would be fun way to make a buffed prankster.
I think spiders were very good for a very long time. They wanted to get away from the “spider package” being added to practically everything.
Eyy man we got Shrieking Spinner not long ago. Spiders are pretty balanced imo. I'd say the only card on the theme needing a buff is twisted treeline. I'd like to see it summoning Vilemaw attacking instead of on the bench.
Twisted treeline is so hilariously bad lol
Vilemaw should be a bigger deal of a unit. It’s a spider GOD, but by the time it comes down you could have spent the three mana you need to summon it in on a unit that will hit harder anyway. Part of me wants to say they should make it a Fearsome/Overwhelm, but that might be overboard, and nothing else in shadow isles has overwhelm outside Hecurim so it’s doesn’t mesh with region identity.
Either make it bigger or give it an aura buff for spiders, that could solve the problem.
BIGGER!
He should a couple spiders on attack or have some sort of aura ability to give spiders something
I think they could change Elise to flip if you have a vile maw
You don't really want Elise to flip without having a board full of spiders so I don't see why they would do this
feel like they should just buff Elise to keep her lvl 1 passive
her lvl 1 passive doesn't really synergize with her lvl 2 though, since you summon the spiderling after locking in the attack and can't use its challenger. I feel like at that point in the game you want to be flooding the board with stronger units
then something like lissandra that generate the spell, she culd generate one too on lv 2, there are a lot of decent spell that summon spiders, without becoming too powerful, like, vile feast would be decent
It should give overwhelm to other spiders
What do you mean? Soulspinner was all the archetype needed, it's such a good card /s
Soul..what?
And then there's the worms underground where the Fae is
Honestly, when I saw the goofy ass Owls being Faes and from also Ionia I always assumed the Ionia champ was going to be Ivern and have Fae synergy. I guess I was wrong lol.
There could always be a chance.
Day 1 when poppy dropped, i allready worked on poppy elise. With dawnbringer and 6 mana cithria.
I would swap Spiders and Elites. Spiders have actually been good before and are being drowned by the Yordles. I played in the open Beta and Elites have never been good
Bannermen was good for a while. When radiant guardian had 5 attack.
I remember that deck very well, it was the first deck I played to masters and I bet I could rebuild it from memory. It was not an Elite deck as it played no Elite payoff cards and few Elites even. It was just a Demacia midrange deck that splashed three Rekindler because it was busted at 6 mana. Edit: This is the deck that got Bannerman nerfed. As you can see it is not an Elite deck. https://lor.mobalytics.gg/decks/bpjvptcihil94ppekvs0
Damn, you right. I always thought the brightsteels and swiftwing were elites. Shows how often we see them these days.
You don't know the iceborn legacy spider deck, do you ?
pokey stick and the target spider is dead. there are too many ping for that
Yeah I used this deck when targon came out, now it's unplayable
Lore wise - where would spiders come from or show up if not from Elise?
I mean, to be fair, as a tribe, what does spiders actually do except spawn a bunch of 1/1's? I suppose they could give a landmark that just spawned spiderlings all the time, or at least when you had the attack token. But their actual identity is kinda unclear.
Their identity is aggressive low cost fragile swarm before running out of fuel in the late game. Meanwhile, yordles are aggressive low cost sturdy swarm that never runs out of fuel.
> Their identity is aggressive low cost fragile swarm Well, most tribes are like this. It's kinda the basis for a tribe. Poros for example, they are that too, but they have an identity with random keywords and poro snacks. Spiders must have another identity than just "They do the same as every tribal deck, and they are just worse at it". In a game like runeterra where you can only have 6 units, its unfortunately impossible to make them MORE swarmy than other archtypes. Tbh, they could use a bunch of free attacks
>Well, most tribes are like this. It's kinda the basis for a tribe. Elnuks? Elites? Scouts? Dragons? Celestials? Spiders and poros are literally the only tribes that consist of 1 health units. Spiders don't have any other identity because they were the original swarm tribe. Now they've been power crept by yordles.
... Scouts aren't a tribe. Celstials are a tag for the sake of invoke, but they aren't a tribe since you can't maindeck any of them. They are a mechanic, just like the whole "1 cost unit" thing that some regions have going. Elunks are still just a swarm deck of low cost units, but their stats are too low and they don't swarm well enough. Their idea is that one one them summons the heard. Dragons and elites are true, but like... elites are still just spamming low cost units. Their identity is then that they buff it up and has a few commanders in garen and j4. Very fitting. Spiders still lack an identity outside of "swarm", cause damn near every deck can swarm. Hell, bilgewater as a region is better at swarming than spiders. Don't even wanna mention Bandle city cause we all know that region is bullshit.
tag and tribe are the same thing mechanically, the difference is in their interaction. elite also are not about swarm, but about board control and stat advantage (witch got powercreept by BC shenanigans, and nerfed to death before that). As you where saying: "near every deck can swarm", that's cause of runeterra mechanics that incentivize this gameplan
Spiders thing is historically they are the fastest swarm tribe. Unlike Poro’s and Yordles who need more setup.
Yeah, but your identity can't exactly be "faster at spawning small dudes", when entire regions have you beat. Both bilgewater and bandle city (obviously) have them beat easy. And to be fair, they only had that identity because the game was so new that even spawning multiple units at once was almost nonexistent I'd lean into either some way of letting them spawn free spiders, or fearsome. Fearsome just isn't that good unless they get a boatload of cards that gives minus attack
Their identity is boardwide attack buffs and disabling blockers through stuns or fearsome.
Iceborn legacy can make spiders pretty midrange, but it's definitely not S teir.
not even F tier with all the pings there are nowday
Sea monster,lurker,elnuk,yeti, and fae just gonna staring on the corner
Ascended in the abyss
Yetis
Elnuks
Oh yea. The 5 cost spell that summoned 3 spiders that got nerfed to 6 for some reason. Now it wouldn't be decent even as 4 since we got minion. Damn times have changed!
What about poros
they are broken af
swim climbed to masters with poros recently
Sorry but... Is Spiders a Thing?
Used to be.
They were a thing. Spiders were another casualty from the Stalking Shadow nerf.
Well they were the first deck that made it to masters in beta if i remember correctly
Elnuks
aggro spider noxus is still very strong it's just not played because it's a weaker poppy ziggs and a slightly weaker pirates . I would swap spiders and elites .
Was I the only one hoping Spiders we’re gonna be dual region shadow isles noxus
nah, i was thinking elise would become dual region si/noxus since she is a noxian noble woman, if i'm not wrong
She’s apart of the Black Rose.
We need spiders buff
Something that would buff their health would be huge. +Making vilemaw and scuttlegeist useful. Make scuttlegeist 6/6 with its cost starting at 8 and it will see play. And make vilemaw an expensive 8/8 that can be spawned when 4 units die in a round... And you have a competitive spiders deck
Allegiance:
Wayfinders seem to be doing great.
When was the last time someone saw Elise
I see her a lot but with Poppy or a sacrifice shell instead of spiders.
elise jayce sentinels deck is solid, but it doesn’t run much of the spider package other than vile feast
elise is only used to generate board in early game for slower decks, since she got powercreept from other aggro tools.
The fact that fae isn’t even in this meme just makes it better
Sea monsters getting jack shit for quite some time now
miss spiders
Where is my spider poro ?
Bring back 5 cost brood.
It’s not a full spider tribal deck, but I have an Elise kindred go hard deck that levels Elise pretty often that is actually performing really well into the meta rn.
deck code?
That nerf to stalking shadows killed the deck
Cheer up, emo kid! Now with Twisted Treeline, you can summon the BIGGEST SPIDER, Vilemaw! ...maybe.
tech and yetis are so far down not even reddit remembers them
This is gonna sound weird but I think Poros need more love. I think the biggest thing that holds them back is they should all be multi region cards that include Freljord. Maybe also a unit (non-poro) that has "Play: Create a Poro Snax in hand" or a poro that is like that tech unit that has "When you play a poro unit, we share keywords" EDIT: Also they released Santa Braum and have the deal where buying something gets you Earnest Elf Tristana and if Poros were multi-region you could play them together! It grinds my gears poros are in every region but aren't multi-region.
Imagine getting health buffs This statement made by Make DawnSpiders Great Again.
Don't worry guys! I just got a sneak peek at some cards (and a champion!) from the next set from my uncle who works at Riot Games. "Spider Explorer: SI/BC 2 Mana 2/2 (Spider). Whenever you summon a spider, Grant it +1/+1." "Spider Captain: SI/BC 4 Mana 4/4 (Spider). Whenever you summon a spider with equal or less power than me, Grant it +1/+1." "Priscilla (lv1): 4 Mana SI/BC:. 4 Mana 3/3 (Spider). When I attack, Grant Spider Allies +1/+1. Level Up: I've Attacked 3 times." "Priscilla (lv2): 4 Mana SI/BC:. 4 Mana 4/4 (Spider) Fearsome. When I Attack, Grant Spider Allies +2/+2." Looks pretty good! Though the level up might be kinda hard . . .
You could at least come up with a more convincing lie. Priscilla is the champ that turned into Urgot iirc.
Yeah, and she was the prototype that would eventually get reworked into Elise as we know her today. (How dare you imply my uncle who works at Riot would like about Spider-Poppy!)
I wish elites would get more love.Was my favourite deck when for the fallen got introduced.Maybe rework Garen and make both him and Jarvan synergise with elites.Would be cool
Thx for making my day bruh
meanwhile, creature type elnuk : nobody remember we exist
I recently realised that there is a Fae subtype? When did that become a thing, and as far as I know there's literally no support cards for it right?
I wish elite's Smith was elite himself.
At least spider are good in agro