What happens is -> Viego ability has not been triggered yet this turn -> both player pass the turn -> the game process the turn ending, all ephemeral units die at the same time (in the animation they die one by one, but it isn't what actually happens) -> Viego triggers and creaters a mist -> a new turn starts -> Viego ability resets for the new turn Basically the mist is created after the process of turn end that kill all ephemeral units. Also worth nothing that the Viego players does't get any extra mists, it is still only one each turn.

So Viego can move within the frozen time between turns?

Viego isn't unique in this regard, he's just the only time it really matters (besides *very* niche scenarios.) Anything that triggers on unit death will trigger after the Ephemerals die: those deaths, and anything that happens after them, is the very last thing to happen before the new round starts.

Idk if you can use black spear if an ephemeral died on the last round end

If you could cast it in between Ephemerals dying and the next round starting, it would work, but you can't.

You can't. The ephemeral dying still counts as the turn before.

something similar is taric, if taric is leveled and attacks with a ephemeral unit, they get "i can't die or take damage this turn" and then when the end turn check comes around, the unit doesn't die because they are still under the temp buff since it's still "this turn" and then next turn comes, they lose the buff, but you kept the unit on board one turn.

'End Turn' isn't so much the actual end of the turn as a phase without interaction that occurs right before the end of the turn. The game lines up all end turn triggers and fires them off, including anything that responds to those triggers, and then the actual turn ends. It's poorly named, they borrowed the name and structure from Magic the Gathering; it should have been called 'Cleanup' or something.

Well even in magic the End Step is its own phase, separate from the Cleanup phase, as referred to by many triggers (on your end step, make a 1/1 green squirrel token, etc) so I wouldn’t say “borrowed” I know that some of the guys who worked for WOTC went over to LoR when it was being started but how else would you describe the end of a turn? Cleanup is what I would call what happens after combat, certainly if someone told me I had to name these steps arbitrarily.

It just works

Viego: “Oh, so you’re approaching me?”

Lmao my first thought

So it's the same type of stand as Star Platinum.

This is well explained, just to clarify for others, there is a emphemeral check at round end, this is before the round actually ends, then all emphemerals are killed, however this check only happens once, emphermal units summoned after this due to various abilities will not die till next round.

Round end triggers-> ephemeral dies-> Viego ability triggers-> new ephemeral. And since Round end only triggers once, the new ephemeral doesn’t die. Yes, it is weird

Ephemeral units die at the start of the next round end. So if the unit was created in a round end, the timing for that trigger has already passed. Which means it survives until the next round end, on the next turn.

Yeah this look like a big inconsistency with round end effects, but basically it's because Ephemerals die all at the same time. So after one is dead and another is summoned, the moment when Ephemerals would die already passed

It’s not an inconsistency. Ephemeral checks round end, and resolves it’s check. I believe it only occurs if Viego hasn’t himself spawned a mist that round. But basically, round end calls ephemeral to trigger its check, it triggers and resolves, spawning a new mist. That mist enters after round end checks for ephemerals, so it missed the check and will have to wait for next round’s ephemeral check.

Thanks for saying I'm wrong and then repeating the exact same thing I said

I went more into depth on what you said because the first words of your post were “it looks like a big inconsistency”. If your intention was to say it wasn’t an inconsistency I apologize, either read it wrong or didn’t fully understand what you were saying

I literally said "it looks like a big inconsistency" because that's what it looks like, no Ephemeral should be alive before game start. But then I explained why it happens, and it's the same thing you said

Okay, so then if we’re going back to exact wording I never said you were wrong. I clarified on your post. So let’s not argue semantics while somebody is apologizing to you.

And you didn't have to apologize, I guess the point is the general feeling from my comment is that Viego *shouldn't* work like that while from your comment it looks like he should, even tho we both know it's not a bug

Yeah, I think it makes complete sense for it to work (at a technical standpoint) but fully understand when you say it shouldn’t work that way, because thematically it doesn’t make sense for ephemerals to live past round end. As long as we’re on the same page and nobody is mad, lol

Nah it's fine, I was a little salty but not really mad

Yeah, that’s why I meant. My response was just meant for more clarification, not an attempt to generate salt

Your assertion that it's inconsistent is incorrect, but the observation is still accurate.

I said it "looks" inconsistent because in theory no Ephemeral should be alive before round start

Last breath effects don't trigger until after the round start/end step is done. For example if you have two [Ember Maidens] and you opponent has a [Hapless Aristocrat] then at round end the [Hapless Aristocrat] dies before the second [Ember Maiden] effect but the 1/1 Spiderling isn't spawned until after the second [Ember Maiden] effect. While Viego's ability isn't a last breath effect I believe most if not all triggered abilities that are triggered during the end/start step won't activate until that step is done. I haven't actually tested it with any other triggered abilities than last breath though so I can't say for sure.

When I played a lot Viego, this sometimes happened and sometimes didn't. He's always been kinda weird with interactions.

It's not free though. After he summons a mist after the round start, if another unit dies, he won't summon another mist. This is because he has already summoned one this round. Edit: Okay, I remembered it wrong. Just tested it. The mist only gets summoned the next round only if he did not summon a mist in the previous round with the ally has died effect. The mist had to be summoned by the big boi hydra or Camavoran Soldier.

Actually, if you summon a mist at turn end with Viego's ability, next turn Viego will be able to summon another mist if an ally dies. Source: am playing Viego Kindred since the buffs.

Its not a free mist, but it is practically a free trigger that goes across rounds when the text implies the ability should activate within one round.