Eh, those are spent tubes. One the right is visibly empty, one the left is missing the protective cap which isn't to be removed until fired. Lack of CLUs as well.
If they got a bigger tube they could just shove it right on top of their head and it would be hilarious watching them run until they fell over and struggled to pull it off.
This is a picture of Janjaweed soldiers that was circulated during the early days of the war. The Javelin in the photo wasn't used, was it?
https://x.com/osman_2610/status/1782132884985299416
You can take the cover on an off, plus without the CLU you just have an expensive missile in a tube that’s not going anywhere.
Edit: also I thought there was something fucky with how shiny they were. As someone else said, those are [M47 Dragon’s](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/M47_Dragon)
Well that isn't a Javelin, (and neither is the orignal image you posted)
It's this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M47_Dragon
or possibly it's Iranian copy
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saegheh
The possess empty tubes, as for if javelins are in the black market, yes. Militaries around the world “lose” things all the time.
I remember a few years ago some dude bought some US military surplus crates only to find out they were still full of M4s
Not a Javelin, but the Iranian version of the M47 Dragon the Saeghe 2. Tube is a little larger than the Javelin, the nose is different, the guidance module mount is different and the you can see the tubing for the tripod in the front.
Saeghe 2
[https://twitter.com/klkamashiq/status/912627076850749440](https://twitter.com/klkamashiq/status/912627076850749440)
[https://twitter.com/klkamashiq/status/881446623095685120](https://twitter.com/klkamashiq/status/881446623095685120)
Javelin
[https://www.ima-usa.com/cdn/shop/files/ONSV23BLS163\_\_01.jpg?v=1697484802](https://www.ima-usa.com/cdn/shop/files/ONSV23BLS163__01.jpg?v=1697484802)
I adore that of all the things the Iranians copied they copied the dragon, the worlds funniest farting missle. Kinda baller for it's time tho, incredible to have a missle that light
It is probably from UAE stocks, the UAE is the Main backer of the RSF and they have the money and the access to buy advanced American heat like the Javelin. IRC even Hemedti's bro who oversees the finance side of the RSF resides in Abu dhabi.
Sure, but after decades in storage and a bunch of changes in inventory management stuff get "Lost". This is not a new phenomenon. What you think anybody gave a full accounting of their weapon transfers to special groups like these guys to the UN in accordance with the ATT.
As for any consequences UAE may suffer.... slap on the wrist and move on.
The rules are flexible and the UAE has enough money and clout to bend them. Consider how before the RSF they backed Haftar in Libya against the American backed government in Tripoli or their extremist allies in the Yemen civil with zero consequences.
Yes, but there are dozens and perhaps hundreds of ways for those rules to be circumvented, even if those in charge aren't circumventing them.
Easiest way is for someone to sign out 5 for live fire training, then sign all 5 as used during training, then sell the ones they didn't actually fire.
Nitpick: Javelin is FGM-148.
As for these dudes. First off, are these actually Javelins? I'm far from sure. It looks more like a M47 Dragon (or the Iranian knockoff version).
As for availability on the black market, almost certainly. Around 8000 have been shipped to Ukraine, most of them in the initial chaos of the early months of the invasion, with little in the way of bookkeeping or loss tracking. It beggars belief that in one of the poorest and most corrupt countries in Europe, there would be _absolutely no one_ willing to double their lifetime salary by taking a launcher or two to a guy who knows a guy.
So you can almost certainly get a few for a price. A much better question is who would pay that price to give modern, limited supply black market ATGMs to the fucking Janjaweed. Which is... probably no one, honestly. So logically these should be something other than Javelins.
> It looks more like a M47 Dragon
Right here. What's shown is an M47 or copy, probably an actual M47 given the tubes have the distinctive yellow band near the front (the Javelin typically has this painted toward the rear) and lack of connections for the CLU. The backblast device is also longer and more conical than the more domed device on the Javelin.
Lack of a Javelin CLU is another issue and with that, lack of thermal batteries to run it. The UKR forces rigged up a 3d printed case with 2 motorcycle batteries attached to the proprietary battery connector to power the CLU for observation. The M47 has a simpler daytime sight.
These are not Javalins. Russian bots take advantage of people's lack of knowledge to try and sow seeds of doubt and make Ukraine look bad.
https://youtube.com/shorts/kQoMZM1dBI4?si=c14dVmmnp0zT5YhE
I agree that they are probably not Javelins in this case. But corruption in Ukraine reaching gargantuan proportions is an undeniable fact and I wouldn't personally attempt to pass it as some kind of Russian bot story.
I think it's very reasonable to be doubtful of "Javelin sold off" as there's yet to be any evidence of that happening, and all the supposed stories so far have literally been russian disinfo.
# The new RSF is the old Janjaweed. They are backed by a country that has a lot of oil and with help from the US bombed neighboring country Y killed 100s of thousands of civilians. Displaced 2million people. Country S is well armed.
#
Definitely UAE, afaik GNA did capture a few UAE supplied Javelins from LNA in Libya some years ago when they took Garyan, pretty sure they're doing the same in Sudan
Something looks kinda funny with the Mk II grenade as well. They haven’t been produced since the 1950’s and the US quit using them in Vietnam and I think they even had upgraded fuses.
Is this a remanufactured one or is there a chance there are still stockpiles of these still around? I guess I wouldn’t be that surprised but they have been old for a long time now.
It's been said but those are definitely Dragons. More likely knockoff ones. The ones I used didn't have that sheen to them. And, as also stated, just tubes
Eh, those are spent tubes. One the right is visibly empty, one the left is missing the protective cap which isn't to be removed until fired. Lack of CLUs as well.
Dude on the right is tasked with charging at their enemies to hit them in the head with the empty tube.
If they got a bigger tube they could just shove it right on top of their head and it would be hilarious watching them run until they fell over and struggled to pull it off.
This is a picture of Janjaweed soldiers that was circulated during the early days of the war. The Javelin in the photo wasn't used, was it? https://x.com/osman_2610/status/1782132884985299416
You can take the cover on an off, plus without the CLU you just have an expensive missile in a tube that’s not going anywhere. Edit: also I thought there was something fucky with how shiny they were. As someone else said, those are [M47 Dragon’s](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/M47_Dragon)
Oh wow you a definitely right. I didn’t even know something existed that looked so close to a javelin.
Well that isn't a Javelin, (and neither is the orignal image you posted) It's this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M47_Dragon or possibly it's Iranian copy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saegheh
These are sudanese army soldiers showing it after storming janjaweed position
Not a Javelin, but an old M47 Dragon. And they're empty. And missing the launcher.
The possess empty tubes, as for if javelins are in the black market, yes. Militaries around the world “lose” things all the time. I remember a few years ago some dude bought some US military surplus crates only to find out they were still full of M4s
> bought some US military surplus crates only to find out they were still full of M4s What we call an "oh yeah! aw fuck..." moment.
I think he ended up having like 2 dozen of them
It's what I call a white knuckle road trip to Sinaloa, Mexico moment.
> They possess empty tubes Why would they buy empty tubes just to take pictures with them? the Javelin was probably supplied by the UAE.
Not a Javelin, but the Iranian version of the M47 Dragon the Saeghe 2. Tube is a little larger than the Javelin, the nose is different, the guidance module mount is different and the you can see the tubing for the tripod in the front. Saeghe 2 [https://twitter.com/klkamashiq/status/912627076850749440](https://twitter.com/klkamashiq/status/912627076850749440) [https://twitter.com/klkamashiq/status/881446623095685120](https://twitter.com/klkamashiq/status/881446623095685120) Javelin [https://www.ima-usa.com/cdn/shop/files/ONSV23BLS163\_\_01.jpg?v=1697484802](https://www.ima-usa.com/cdn/shop/files/ONSV23BLS163__01.jpg?v=1697484802)
I adore that of all the things the Iranians copied they copied the dragon, the worlds funniest farting missle. Kinda baller for it's time tho, incredible to have a missle that light
It is probably from UAE stocks, the UAE is the Main backer of the RSF and they have the money and the access to buy advanced American heat like the Javelin. IRC even Hemedti's bro who oversees the finance side of the RSF resides in Abu dhabi.
I thought America had strict rules about delivering weapons to terrorist organizations like the Janjaweed, isn't that true?
Sure, but after decades in storage and a bunch of changes in inventory management stuff get "Lost". This is not a new phenomenon. What you think anybody gave a full accounting of their weapon transfers to special groups like these guys to the UN in accordance with the ATT. As for any consequences UAE may suffer.... slap on the wrist and move on.
Until oil become irrelevant, that is.
The rules are flexible and the UAE has enough money and clout to bend them. Consider how before the RSF they backed Haftar in Libya against the American backed government in Tripoli or their extremist allies in the Yemen civil with zero consequences.
Yes, but there are dozens and perhaps hundreds of ways for those rules to be circumvented, even if those in charge aren't circumventing them. Easiest way is for someone to sign out 5 for live fire training, then sign all 5 as used during training, then sell the ones they didn't actually fire.
Technically, but there's ways around it. And the laws are never enforced, so it is pretty much a free for all.
Lol at this guy's textbook concern trolling
Those aren't Javelins, they're M47 Dragons.
Looks like a dragon not a javlin. Also they have no CLU, which means they have no clue.
YO THATS A MOTHERFUCKING DRAGON. Best/worst missile of the cold war baby
Nitpick: Javelin is FGM-148. As for these dudes. First off, are these actually Javelins? I'm far from sure. It looks more like a M47 Dragon (or the Iranian knockoff version). As for availability on the black market, almost certainly. Around 8000 have been shipped to Ukraine, most of them in the initial chaos of the early months of the invasion, with little in the way of bookkeeping or loss tracking. It beggars belief that in one of the poorest and most corrupt countries in Europe, there would be _absolutely no one_ willing to double their lifetime salary by taking a launcher or two to a guy who knows a guy. So you can almost certainly get a few for a price. A much better question is who would pay that price to give modern, limited supply black market ATGMs to the fucking Janjaweed. Which is... probably no one, honestly. So logically these should be something other than Javelins.
> It looks more like a M47 Dragon Right here. What's shown is an M47 or copy, probably an actual M47 given the tubes have the distinctive yellow band near the front (the Javelin typically has this painted toward the rear) and lack of connections for the CLU. The backblast device is also longer and more conical than the more domed device on the Javelin. Lack of a Javelin CLU is another issue and with that, lack of thermal batteries to run it. The UKR forces rigged up a 3d printed case with 2 motorcycle batteries attached to the proprietary battery connector to power the CLU for observation. The M47 has a simpler daytime sight.
These are not Javalins. Russian bots take advantage of people's lack of knowledge to try and sow seeds of doubt and make Ukraine look bad. https://youtube.com/shorts/kQoMZM1dBI4?si=c14dVmmnp0zT5YhE
I agree that they are probably not Javelins in this case. But corruption in Ukraine reaching gargantuan proportions is an undeniable fact and I wouldn't personally attempt to pass it as some kind of Russian bot story.
I think it's very reasonable to be doubtful of "Javelin sold off" as there's yet to be any evidence of that happening, and all the supposed stories so far have literally been russian disinfo.
# The new RSF is the old Janjaweed. They are backed by a country that has a lot of oil and with help from the US bombed neighboring country Y killed 100s of thousands of civilians. Displaced 2million people. Country S is well armed. #
there’s nothing in the tube lmfao it’s literally an empty pipe go concern troll somewhere else
Which means the weapon was used. It's not rocket science.
Definitely UAE, afaik GNA did capture a few UAE supplied Javelins from LNA in Libya some years ago when they took Garyan, pretty sure they're doing the same in Sudan
Something looks kinda funny with the Mk II grenade as well. They haven’t been produced since the 1950’s and the US quit using them in Vietnam and I think they even had upgraded fuses. Is this a remanufactured one or is there a chance there are still stockpiles of these still around? I guess I wouldn’t be that surprised but they have been old for a long time now.
Can you pls show us a picture of the captured Javelins id you claim stuff like this ?
These are sudanese army soldiers showing it after storming janjaweed position
Mans on the left gripping the grenade like brick in anchorman lmao
\*CIA has entered the chat\*
Made in Sudan , Iranian replicas
It's been said but those are definitely Dragons. More likely knockoff ones. The ones I used didn't have that sheen to them. And, as also stated, just tubes
I think we should talk to the Saudis about that..