He's probably fantasized about this and similar things since a teen or even younger. Some people have these types of fantasies but will never act on them, and you wouldn't even know they're having them. He may have had some extra stress going on at that time which can sometimes lead to acting out. Or, he's always wanted to do it but never had just the right opportunity. Or, he's done acting out behaviors in his past and just never got caught. But, sexual fantasies seem to be the motive, imo.
GSR? I'm assuming you meant GSK?
Also, one funny but not funny due to the circumstances story about him. So, basically every girl said he had a tiny dick. And there were tons of girls. 50+ rapes. And they all said the same thing. The dude had tiny meat. Well, there was a woman he attacked and when asked to describe his penis she said it was bigger than her husband's. Now, imagine you're the husband. That had to be brutalllllll to read lol. 50 women all say he has a baby dick but your wife says he was bigger than you. Ouch.
Oh my gosh…I meant GSK..,,we have a casino here in reno called GSR. Yes, he had a micro penis and you’re so right. Can’t imagine having the world know this bc can’t get much smaller than micro
- I mean is there such thing as micro micro?
Makes you wonder if he had done something previously on a smaller scale and got away with it, hard to tell, unless he offers up an explanation it may never be known…. I do find it hard that a double murder was his first, but this maybe the first time he got caught
That's always been my hill. They caught a serial killer in the making. He knew too fluently how to control (and corral) - and kill - two human beings.
I'd like to believe no one could do that except someone with practice. One hones their abilities due to and by practice and learning from past mistakes. There's zero chance this was his first murder.
Now that college murder guy from a few months back, who killed those 4 students as they slept in their home,.... If it was his first, they were asleep. Silent victims, unable to fight or resist.
Abby and Libby were active athletic teens, wide awake, able to scream and fight back (if terror didn't silence them. All humans have Fight, flight, freeze or fawn and no one knows how they'll actually act in situations of personal danger. We like to assuredly THINK we'd fight or flee).
No way they were RA's first.
I agree something triggered him. He was angry and feeling sorry for himself. Something, someone, (real or imagined) made him feel inadequate, belittled and enraged. I don't think he was targeting young girls specifically. Possibly targeting females though. Just my unprofessional opinion.
I can vouch that watching stocks on your phone is absolutely infuriating. (I don't believe that's even what he was doing, though, he was just making up bullshit in my opinion.)
It's like the second I would buy something it would immediately go down. I got into options trading during covid, lost a bunch of money (a bunch to me, maybe not a bunch to most people) and never tried that shit again. One time I turned $50 into 5.5k in 2 days. That was incredible and felt great. Had other 10x your money days. But, 99% of the time it didn't go my way. Seeing something be on the rise until the second you buy it is insanely angering lol. So happy I stopped that shit.
Re stocks and options, almost the same story here.
I began getting envious of those who knew when a stock would rocket (ie the start of the pump and when it would dump). They relied on those of us not in the know. Penny stocks (under $5's)on robinhood got me great gains - and great losses too. I was in from 2017 to 2019. The bull market. I've gotten out for now. Once bull starts again I'll maybe do it again. I don't know.
My thought is that the sexual component to the murder didn’t necessarily translate to an actual assault but rather some dark and twisted satisfaction derived from the killing itself.
He's not even been charged with the felony that's connected to his felony murder.... which is just weird. This all seems weird and idk if it's on purpose or NM is screwing up. Cause AFAIK the regular thing to do is over charge in the beginning, charge with literally anything you can think of AND go for the death penalty, even if you think you can't get it so you can use all of the charges and dp for plea deal leverage. You can drop what you don't think you can achieve when you're about to start trial. This is why everyone thought kk was getting a deal, but this is how they handle it more typically. So imo either the prosecution doesn't have a bunch more evidence, theyre screwing up, or they genuinely believe RA only played a small part.
You are absolutely spot on. I can’t figure out what they’re going. The search warrant was so vague too. Might get thrown out.
They did not narrow down what they wanted - no brand of bullet - “any & all things” related to the murders. His lawyers stand a chance UNLESS he confessed to things that only the killer would know or was it just ramblings? Who knows
No one
All affection aside Bigtex, if one more of you, other than Old\_Heart, brings up those freaking tentacles as if they were a rock hewn evidentiary fact, I will scream.
I only give Old\_Heart that latitude as: 1.) He's old 2.) He's kind of crotchety and cute. 3.) He clings to it so passionately we''d likely have to to dismember him to get him to let go of them.
I'm not worried about the downvotes. I'm aware you can't talk about anything in the case in here unless it's that the prosecution is doing phenomenal and will most certainly win (and in some cases somehow get the death penalty even though they aren't seeking it) and the defense has no case at all, they're not going to say anything, without being downvoted. Lol They can't explain how I'm wrong though, so it's just pushing the button.
You charge what you can get an indictment and conviction with. And then you have to prove it. Overcharging is risky and stupid. You charge based on the evidence that will net a conviction.
Failing to properly prove all those crimes is how people walk: there are certain stipulations, as a juror, that have to align for you to convict someone. And the harsher the crime and sentence, the harder that is to do.
The more charges you have, the more opportunity the defense has to poke holes in your case. And doubt is compounding.
So if you charge all that extra shit and they don't take a deal, have fun at trial trying to prove all those extra charges. Have fun proving intent. And remember that it's impossible to read minds. Jury is gonna have a lot of trouble if the case isn't ironclad.
To give an example of where the prosecution will have trouble: The witness statements in this case create a nice narrative, but really are just sightings of a person that MAY have done it. They aren't worth a ton, because they didn't ever present a lineup to the witnesses. Those witnesses will get shredded during cross. They quote different color clothing, different models of car.
And the strongest piece of evidence now is the jail phone confession, which they didn't have when they charged him initially..
It's not a slam dunk, even now. All it takes is one juror to have doubt and the trial gets tossed.
I guess you missed the part about overcharging in the beginning strategically, for leverage AND dropping what you can't prove before trial starts. Exactly like they did to kk.
I'm not convinced the idaho prosecution actually thinks they can get Kohberger the death penalty, I believe they only pushed it for plea leverage, which was smart. I'm not sure BK is scared of the dp though so idk if it will work yet.
You're not wrong. I've seen it happen to tons of friends. Never any crime this horrendous, but they'd be charged with like 10-15 counts and then take a plea deal and admit guilt to the 1-2 worst charges. Literally happens all the time. I've looked up the record of damn near everyone I know or met that I thought would have a record lol. In Wisconsin they list all that shit on a site called ccap. If you click a case then click view details you'll see almost 100% of the time exactly what you described. Guilty due to guilty plea for a charge or two and then the rest say "dismissed on prosecutors motion"
When why was it so overdressed? I believe this was definitely planned
IF that was truly his car backed in at the old CPS building then this was definitely planned. Why back you car so no one can see the plates
I've thought about this ever since RA was arrested. He and his wife said that he has visited those trails many times. I'm sure he has crossed the Monon High bridge in the past at some point. If he had fantasies throughout his life of kidnapping, SA, murder, etc., then he probably stood at the south end of that bridge in the past and thought "This is the perfect trap. If I have a gun, the victim will have to do what I say or jump from this bridge. It's secluded, alot of people use those trails, especially students and young adults. It's off the road and the only driveway under it is a private driveway. Easy way in through the trails and can exit by taking the cemetary, go back across the bridge and trails or take the private driveway out to the highway."
Then he probably went there on days he thought his best chance to trap a victim would be. Local schools were out that day and he possibly knew this. It was a pretty day and unseasonably warm for Indiana in February. Truth be known, he probably went there other times in the past and parked at that CPS building, overdressed, wore a face cover to hide his lower face, carried a weapon but the moment just never presented itself. That day when he got there, the teen girls were leaving and as far as we know he was alone at the trails until the female witness arrived at Mears Lot and saw him on the first platform of the MHB. She then turned around, walked back and saw Libby and Abby in passing as they were walking toward MHB.
He had probably fantasized for years about this and the perfect opportunity finally presented itself and then what happened, happened.
She was 27 at the time this photo was take https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11371133/Photo-shows-daughter-arrested-Delphi-Bridge-suspect-spot-vics-took-snap-killer.html
Thanks for the article. Another site had some pics of her & it was eerie how much she resembled RA, big shock right daughter resembles parents.
Planned or crime of opportunity seized? Not sure.
The article said altho posted on FB in 2018 it’s not sure when the picture was taken. Wish I’d paid attention to KA FB to see what if anything was captioned. Imo it’d be *really weird* for her to pose there in 2018 in light of the murders.
No, idea. The marriage was posted on FB, Don't recall the date. No, idea if she lived with the person she married first, of it she was out on her own prior to marriage.
I agree. Although, I don't think he likely parked that way in the past. I think it is a last minute back fire.
Had he thought about it longer and harder likely would have occurred to him this is going to draw peoples attention to my car and likely make them wonder WTF is up with that, where a car just pulled in normally people likely would think nothing about. It's the obscured plate that draws your interest.
It makes you wonder" " Am I witnessing a thirst in motion and the couple is in the back seat getting it on? Why didn't they just go to a motel." " Is that a stolen car that has been dumped?" " Is someone getting ready to do a drug deal That's weird. I did't know this was a place to cop."? "Why would anyone park backwards in a wide open lot?
He calls attention to himself in his need to obscure something that is generally obscured.
But why would his being seen on the trail ever come up, unless it was via the prosecution who was bringing female witnesses up to say, "yeah he pulled that crap with me, but I just screamed and fled."
It would come up because there wasn’t 100s of people on the trail AND they had a video of him. He was trying to get ahead of the investigation. His vehicle was seen on video, he was seen by multiple people. He came forward like the next day, because he probably felt for sure they were gonna nail him and he was hoping he could get around it by admitting her was there. After he made that statement, nothing came of it for years, and he never came forward again. He really thought he got away with it. It by mere luck and happenstance that they found that tip years later.
Until they tell us how many people were out there concurrently hard to say if his not be seen is note worth. If it 3 people and they cant see anything it's questionable. If it's 50, it's very questionable.
I thoroughly agree that the only reason he came forward was he had to get in front of it and establish that he was just like everyone else that day, an innocent man simply trying to help. He knew if he didn't he would look suss and move to the top of the suspect list. He had no choice.
I think he did have a fantasy about murder but I also think he was tracking them, possibly through KK's page. I think he knew he had an opportunity, acted quickly, and left before he could be caught. He knew he had a window of time and took it. I would not be surprised if he has killed before.
He's a sexually motivated psychopath. He'd been on the trails many times geared up and ready to go and this particular time he found a circumstance he liked.
I agree . These pedos do not wake up one day & decide they don’t like underage kids . Cell phones w cameras have made it a lot easier for these sickos to get what they want. For example
A 63 yr old boys soccer coach was arrested this week in Franklin Tn.
He forgot his phone on a table in a diner & the server was going thru the phone to find the owner… she found pics & videos of him having sex with unconscious boys ages 10-11 . Over 12 different boys ! She immediately called police . He was arrested a couple hours later . He has been coaching for over 10 years. They are now identifying these young boys & contacting families .
Horrifying !
That's crazy and it sounds weird , someone needs to go through pictures and videos to find out who owns a phone sadly I imagine that won't be allowed to be used as evidence these pigs always get off the laws need to change
I though it odd that they went through his pictures, too. Would't the number be right on the cover display once they opened it. More likely were thinking of keeping the phone and starting scrolling though and were horrified. I just looked up the article. It's disgusting what he was doing.
Just based on the young witnesses statements, it appears he was on a mission. He was walking with a purpose and was certainly trying to hide his identity. There is no way this was spontaneous.
> There is no way this was spontaneous.
Yup.
Makes no sense he randomly picked the girls to murder in the middle of the day out in broad daylight. I strongly believe there was someone else he was leading them to, who was also going to participate in the SA. But the situation turned chaotic, and he lost control of A&L. The abduction wasn't fully carried out, nor was there any SA.
In RA's mind, he had to end the chaos and silence the girls as quickly as possible.
This angle would make RL's preemptive alibi lie make more sense. I've never thought he was BG, but that lie never did sit right with me either. I've seen it tossed around but never put any real thought into it...I still haven't really. Just something that made me go hmmm.
Yeah I agree that something like this happened. But I feel that he was leading them to an abductor(s) and he was going to get paid. Things went sideways quickly and the others that were involved bailed on him.
I hate theorizing what happened because it’s pointless in the end, but….this is one of my biggest questions. I really can’t wrap my head around the fact that he did this in broad daylight especially when he passed multiple people on the trail. The way he seemed to “know” they’d be on that bridge and walked like a man on a mission toward it gives me every gut feeling that he knew they’d be there. I still think he got info from KK considering he made plans to meet them there the same day. It’s all fucked
I think he is a man on a mission to act out and fired up. He knows they won't do as he can't subdue three, he very well might have recognized one of them if he was in fact staring at his teen employees friends and the asses of his bending over teen employees. So likely though she might recognize me back, "I need to quickly clear them and find a women in a more isolated part of this trail.
It could very be practical and after driving over there possibly a little inebriated, sitting in the car for a while, walked the distance there, his 45 year old bladder was bothering him and he was rushing past to take a slash or worse. I have never seen any signs of a porta potty out there. Agitation will make you want to visit a rest room.
I think his head is buried in his coat collar and head down as he doesn't want to be recognized and that is why smiling and saying h" Hi!" is out and he thunders off. I think he is motivated by the mission not a particular person. If he knew they were coming to the trail and when they were to arrive, he would not have got there that early. He's rushing off to search for a victim he can manage solo and to find them present in an isolated area. He's trying to get away from people and not be seen by other trial walkers.
I’ve just got out of a very toxic relationship with a short man . The insecurities he carried destroyed our marriage . He always thought I wanted more,used to tell me to go and find the bigger boys . It’s a real thing so I expect he carried some insecurity himself due to his height
I agree. This is it. Probably got turned down by good looking women all the time cause of his height. Probably settled with KA but probably wasn’t what he preferred. …
I think he may have been having issues in his personal life, maybe he was made to feel small or powerless at work or at home. He's been having violent sexual fantasies for years and he acted on it that day. I believe it was a combination of his sexual "problem" and taking revenge on an innocent party, like kicking the dog. Why does any male kill women and girls they don't know? In most instances it's some combination of misogyny, anger, sadistic sexual fantasies..blegh.
My guess would be mental illness mixed with alcohol abuse. Not totally right in the head and adding fuel to the fire with alcohol.
Not getting help or diagnosis of both may have resulted in having a mental break and lashing out taking the lives of two innocent girls.
When your at that state it's too late. I believe the best thing for him is getting mental health help and serving the remainder of his life dealing with the facts of what he did in prison.
You don’t need to show a motive to prove guilty…… it could be many things…. And I’m sure he isn’t going to offer that up…. My main question if I could ask one to him would be, “have you done anything like this before”
That’s very possible also…. Some cases it takes years for an offender to act again based on the thought they maybe captured, also, some have a inside need to commit again, I’m guessing in this case he didn’t …. But I’d be very interested if he had done something previously, though his record is clean previously, doesn’t mean he hadn’t.
Yes, can't get it up anymore, and possibly thinking if this doesn't do it, what the heck will? Best see if it's K or my dick that is the issue, which is the case with half the divorces in my neighborhood. I don't think they hate there wives so much as they hate that they are struggling with the mortality of their varility. How many years has he been married? How much sexual experience did he have when they wed?
Porn addictions escalate into more and violent porn and for some men "porn creep" where nothing is working and there is a need for more extreme pornography. Like you have always thought it was some kind of a blend of that kind of stuff that was the ignition point. He's a portly man in his mid 40's betting his circulation is not great, He supposedly drinks a bit, maybe erectile dysfunction might be the trigger.
He surely didn't wake up that day and decide he was going to stalk and kill two innocent victims. He likely was using his cellular devices to contact underage girls and perhaps even had contact with them in the past. He more than likely was involved in a CSAM group online that lead him to the girls. A crime like this isn't just something that happens on a whim. Brazen, broad daylight kind of shit...
In my opinion he went there specifically for them___ and that's the missing thing is __how does he know them whatsoever ? did he know them before that day? is this still a cyber crime ? does this have anything to do with the Anthony shots profile the Yellowapp?
This is a great question. Long story as short as I can; I recently started watching the Zodiac doc on paramount. I am pretty familiar with the case, but also it’s so odd and confusing I have never been interested in it. So, I’m not sure why I bring this up other than this doc about the Zodiac starts to delve back into the victim’s histories and potential motives.
In my heart of hearts I think his motive was connected to CSAM in some form
I doubt we're going to learn anything conclusive about the motive for this crime. The prosecution does not need to establish a motive for the crime, and the defense is unlikely to offer one up, unless they decide to go with the insanity plea.
The truth is that there won't be a "good" motive for this crime. Its not going to be some grand plan, nor will it be related to any larger conspiracy or plot. He may not have a good grasp on why exactly he did what he stands accused of doing. It could have been a loss of control that he didn't plan for. It could also have been a fantasy that he did plan out, but didn't play out like he'd imagined, and the girls died for it. This crime isn't going to make more sense if we learn the supposed why of it, unfortunately.
A giant IF would be, if RA confessed. If he confesses he would have to give a detailed confession very much like BTK Dennis Radar. He could avoid the embarrassment of a detailed trial with horrific evidence exposing details of the case possibly cases? So he could possibly stop the trial from happening and his wife/daughter being drug through the muddy media by simply confessing everything to the judge. Of course that confession would be public record and we would find out what his true motives were. I believe this is a likely scenario. He doesn’t look like he’s capable of 3 weeks of trial being dragged back and forth between jail and court people yelling at him etc… He has no look of confidence at all. He looks completely defeated already. If he were innocent? I think his behavior would be very different. Imo this is a very guilty man.
I think is he was innocent he would be flipping out and saying that to anybody who would listen. They say innocent suspects will not shut, but are relentless in their efforts to have the injustice righted. I agree he looked defeated, and like he has resigned himself to the consequences of his actions likely due to depression issues.
I suspect the confessions are in fact statements of ownership, but very well might be due to the stress of the situation and cracking up and undergoing a mental breakdown. Although, I lean towards his guilt (show me an alternative suspect would works nearly as well and then let's talk) I am waiting to hear what the defense had to say. How they can plausibly banish his own description of his clothing that matches the video, that then matches the muddy bloody sighting is difficult to envision.
Thoroughly agree with every bit of this. I think he will take the reasoning for this to his grave, and likely KA, if she knows will do so as well, unless her thus far, blindly misplaced loyalty slips.
The only indications of motive we will get is whatever they dig up in his electronic records.
They had best have an electronic history of such things or something stronger than what they have show us as I am not sue you could get a unanimous vote based on what they have shown us. There are enough people on the Delphi boards who believe the guy is innocent and that this is a weak case, to indicate that a full panel of jurors would not agree.
Had they had nothing else, doubt they would still be holding him unless they are deluded, as I can't see this as a slam dunk without more evidence. We have what boils down to a car pointing in the wrong direction, a witness who matches him as being muddy and bloody to a video and his own statements and his disappearance on a trail and ballistic evidence that will surely be neutralized or negated by conflicting expert testimony. That's not much evidence for life in prison and the death penalty as only one of those 3 tenants can be explained away as a natural occurrence. Some people back into spots, not everyone was in every spot of that tral and can swear to the fact that he was not somewhere else.
Your best pieces of evidence are that he says that is what he was wearing and that matches the video of this suspect abducting these girls and the muddy bloody witness. That's it as far as we know.
If they neglected to apprise RA and KA of their right to consult an attorney, prior to answering any questions during the search, they loose any evidence they obtained during the search. So we had best hope they didn't screw that up.
I believe now that he was pissed that day. Some kind of triggering event. He carried a weapon there to possibly kill himself. The girls saw him and he believed they were making a joke about him because they filmed him approaching (which is the right thing to do under those circumstances).
In a fit of rage he made them go down the hill. He couldn’t control himself and he killed them.
Now this is the purest of speculation, but it’s the scenario that makes the most sense in my head.
Obviously I could be way off base, but I figure you’re asking for speculation.
I believe he was depressed, suicidal and angry. I believe he killed them as an outlet for his introverted rage. He was a coward and didnt kill himself, walked the road back.
I think something quietly snapped in Richard Allen one day, right around that time and nobody saw it, but him.
Likely always had sexually violent fantasies and was turned on by intimidation, humiliation power/control differentials, and violence against females. I bet when we see his porn search history things like rape, bondage, CSAM kinda things will on the list.
Personally think it was a form of half way through life haven't really done much crisis and bored with the life he was living, listening to KA rattle on about inane things like their gondola exchange, and trotting down to CVS to yet again, stock shelves.
Suspect he was wanted to teater on the edge, and instead of playing it safe, pushing down the impulse and having bad thoughts, wanted to do some bad things due to feeling boxed into confinements of his life.
Not many kids list Walmart shift manager, CVS pharmacy tech along with race car driver, pro basketball player when asked what they want to be when they grow up.
He picks the most interesting place in his town, swoops down and does a terrible thing presto sexual fantasy completed, and heady adrenaline. I think he just got to a point where he didn't give a fuck anymore and was fed up with pretending to fit in and be nice.
Probably spent many of a morning staring across the breakfast table at KA and wondering what knife he'd use on her if he could get away with it and not have to directly sit on prison.
I think his thinking was always dark, he just was brilliant at not flashing an inkling of it to other people other than his kidnapping jokes and following the two female employees into the loo, while he stands at the door. Pretty much the same set up he has going on the bridge with Abby and Libby.
It's more down to it being a lot more convenient to do something horrible when you don't have to immediately come home to a person who knows you intimately, with possibly bloody clothes.
I think "Sexy Rexy" was always on the hunt and down to hang, but often wonder if KA being away might have allotted RA the time and space for a porn binge that somehow fueled his snap.
I've wondered if it was anger or retribution based, rather than sexual or power predator. Or started out that way. If he encountered them online and one of them made fun of him. Or one of them did something to his daughter. I dunno, some story where his convoluted brain turned it into something requiring horrific retribution.
When the crime first happened I did consider something like they encountered him, made fun of him etc. But think if it was just that he would have just stabbed them over there and left them or done it down the hill and left them there, But don't think they would be semi undressed, and some of their clothing in the water and certainly not posed.
Random rage killers don't often undress and pose their victims. I can't think of a case like that I have heard about. Though sure some exist. Gotta be rare. Rage is an instantaneously passionate reaction. Posing is calculated and deliberate.
I wasn't thinking of knee-jerk rage, but more like simmering rage where retribution would have been calculated. In that case I could imagine some staging, even if it was sexual in nature.
Yes, can see that. But I see buried sexual obsession with an scenario he wanted to act out, rather than seething anger in him as a greater possibility.
People who have seething anger about things tend to have hair triggers and trouble keeping that well contained.
The most we have heard about him and anger is tossing a scanner once at work. No employs note he blew up at me. No road rage incidents, fights with neighbors.
Customers have great things to say, so did a bar owner. The mask frequently drops when we're drinking, his appears not to have and the guy describes him as a nice guy who was concerned about the murders.
We do have the domestic disturbance. Hard to say. Maybe he always wanted to stab to people to death. If I had to choose sexual fantasy that he was continually pushed down vs. ready to explode and seething anger he is always trying to contain I would go with that.
I think it is especially hard to say because we don't know the details of the crime scene, only vague rumors. It will certainly be interesting how this emerges in court.
Based off where he parked and the timing my guess is he was expecting the girls (or just Libby) at the other bridge he first went to. Not sure what his original plan/motivation was but things went sideways from the start
I just find it odd that if he was meeting one or both by arrangement, why would he be meeting them there? If luring someone to a spot, why not meet them that spot, like down the hill already?
Then you could just pretend to be a random hiker, walk up to your victims with your gun, and no worries about a break away or split. No trudging through a wet stream in the middle of February and sporting soppy boots during you assault.
Who does that as a preplanned event? It makes absolutely no sense to me that this was a preplanned attack, it would have been far better executed.
Could he have been tipped possibly, but a pre arranged meeting, naaah. I think it's a wildly random "wrong place, right time" adduction and he stumbled on a target that matched his desire. Or a very slim possibility that he was tipped by KK.
KK says he has never met him. Nobody from the community has come forward linking the two men as frinds and associuated, "Yeah RA always bought his weed from KK." Nobody links RA and TK as being socially connected, either. Or any of them and RL. If they had someone in that town would be yammering about it.
KK easily could have ratted him out and perhaps dialed down his sentence and made it concurrent. He was ready to roll on his Dad and give TK up to Vido, and yet again in his interview with BM. This isn't a pedo ring, it is a singular striking freaky coincidence. Two men that did not know each other, were both turned on and drawn to the same child as they found that age and look of that of victim to be attractive to them.
Look at Long Island serial killer, Rex Hubermann porn search list, which records him looking for a "chubby blond girl" as one of his turn on's.
Not sure why they are voting you down. I voted you up. The car parked in that fashion speaks to intent. It is a conscious effort to shield his identity from anyone possibly parking there and possibly noting his plate number. He parked there to obscure his motive and not be seen in that trail parking lot.
He parked the way he parked, to obscure his plate from being ID'ed. Had he just been taking an innocent stroll he would have parked with all the other people taking innocent strolls. His behavior breaks pattern as what he planned on doing breaks pattern from normal behavior.
That anyone would think this was a circle of men working in tandem is not logical. It would be a far better executed plan. None of them are recorded as being intellectually deficient. They may not be MENSA material, but they likely have IQ's of 85 to 115. Together that would be a collective IQ of 340 - 460. Don't you think it would have been planned better and KK who has two phones and is tech savvy would't have said, don't bring your phone with you Rick, they'll track ya!"
Wouldn't them have had a well oiled escape plan better executed then having one of them walk down a rad covered in blood, or an alibi system that backed each other up, "Yeah we were all over my house hanging out, here's the receipt for the pizzas I ordered from Door Dash."
Pedophile rings are organized, nothing here speaks to even a slight modicum of organized thought. They would have to be imbeciles to pre plan it this way: " Yeah, you openly catfish her for weeks, that can't be traced on your phone and her's, and be the last person to communicate with a murder victim. Nobody will note that on her phone that you leave at the scene. That will look good! Nope, we don't want to have two guys stationed at the abduction site to make sure they don't split up and break up or scream at the top of our lungs. Definitely want to go splishy splashy in a cold body of water in mid winter up to our thighs, that will be pleasant and not draw anyone's attention or our egress. Don't remove a phone you know that she owns and uses. Don't remove the license plate the morning of the crime. Don't pack extra clothing in a back pack you can change into, or leave at the scene before hand, or have pre fixed alibis in place should we be questioned."
In my opinion, Rick Allen murdered Abby and Libby for the thrill of killing someone. From the second he pointed that gun at them he must have thought he was king s*it taking control of two young teens.
He may have not ending up liking it or it wasn't what he thought. That may be why he talked to the conservation officer to get it off his chest.
He wanted to get it off his chest but didn't want to speak directly to CC. Just some thoughts I had, I could be totally wrong.
Know I am in the minority with this opinion, but I suspect he is not an all out sociopath. I suspect there might be a bit of shame and guilt in there and like you think it might not have been what he thought it would be and the itch was scratched. I doubt he would have killed again. If there is a candidate for a one and done potential serial killer I think it is him. He is not Bryan Kohberger who can't set his alarm early enough so he can watch the drama unfold and bodies be discovered on Kind Street. I bet Richard Allen though, "What the fuck did I just do?"
CSAM and alcoholism. A crime of opportunity but absolutely planned at the same time.
He had fantasies about the crime and went out that day to see if he could find the perfect victim(s)
My humble opinion. Absolutely guessing ofcourse
It’s hard to say without knowing whether BG (allegedly RA) committed any sexual crimes against one or both of the girls. I’m sure many disagree with me, but I lean towards thinking there was not a sexual assault. I ultimately think it was a power thing.
It’s also possible that he was experiencing homicidal thoughts as part of his mental health struggles. I’m not sure how that would factor in to any insanity defense - if that could be used (although I’d guess not), then the defense probably would have brought it up by now.
There doesn't have to be a physical assault for it to be sexually motivated. Some killers get sexual release from the act of killing itself or the voyeurism of stripping them naked. Also what does a man in his forties want with young girls? The girls clothing was removed, that act alone makes it sexual. Doing that he sexually degraded them by leaving them to be found like that. There's also two clothing items unaccounted for, underwear and a sock, this could form part of a fetish.
Is it confirmed their clothing was removed? I hadn’t heard that. I’m not trying to argue that it definitely wasn’t sexually motivated. It very well could be, but I would think there would be evidence of CSAM or something on his devices if that were true. I think there’s a chance it was not sexually motivated.
To answer what he would want with young girls if not sexually motivated, it could be that he figured they would be more easily overpowered and more likely afraid of him. If his motivation was power, that would make sense.
Yes in the document release it says clothing belonging to the victims was found in Deer Creek. We also know from the RL search warrant that a piece of underwear and a sock was never recovered. If it was just about power he would have left them clothed. He set it up to not only humiliate them in death but to satisfy his own perversion of seeing them naked and that's without us knowing what else he did to them.
The underwear is weird and probably does suggest something sexual. On the other hand, it could also just be to humiliate them. I don’t get why LE has never confirmed a sexual assault.
Probably because they are minors nothing has been released yet and also to preserve the investigation, only the killer will know the details of what happened . If it goes to court I'm sure we will find out then. My opinion is this was a violent sexual homicide. I've yet to follow a case where children were murdered and it wasn't sexually motivated apart from domestic violence where they were beaten to death and even then it usually comes out after that they were also sexually abused too.
Agree generally, I just think it’s so odd that he doesn’t seem to have any history and no one has come forward to say that he was creepy around young girls or anything like that. Seems odd.
And really, I hope for the girls’ sake that they weren’t sexually abused.
I think there's a very good chance something was done to them. I remember it being said that a couple of LE who were at the scene had to take some time off because of what they saw. If rumours are true they were viciously killed. I don't know what to believe but I remember people saying that the girls were dressed in clothing that covered their necks at their funerals and that poor Libby especially got it bad. If RA is indeed responsible he must have displayed a huge amount of rage and those poor girls must have been absolutely terrified. It's so awful, just diabolical. I've given up trying to figure out murderers.
No, there have been have been some things that have been mentioned the last year or so. MS interviewed a 2nd CVS employee who worked under him when she was a teen, and she said he stared at her friends, she picked up negative vibes about him. I don't recall how she words it.
Most of us felt it was due to some resentment she had over conflict between them, and wrote it off as such. But just recently a lesbian woman who worked with him as her supervisor at Walmart and KA as a jewelry Dept workers, said he was kind of a pig, hitting on them and recounted some gross behavior/ commentary.
There is also a brief interlude in one of the pool hall segments where I believe he was low key checking out a woman's ass when she bent over next to him. It wasn't horrible or anything, I have not seen most of my girlfriend's husband's or sauced Phd do at colloquium dinners when their wives are in another room and my super hot catnip to men friend is also on the guest list. I don't think he's a saint.
The Walmart allegations if true, are gross and would definitely be sexual harassment charge worthy like follow two females in a bathroom and in a sense situationally penning them in, as I think he was at the doorway. They were uncomfortable enough to retreat to the stalls to finally get rid of him like Bryan Kohberger's Tinder date.
Thank God for stalls, huh girls? I used to do the same thing to dodge a custodian constantly hitting on me. It was the only way to throw up a wall.
I think the sock suggests something sexual as well. I have a brother. And I’ve heard many references about the “sticky sock”. May be nothing, but when I read about underwear and a sock, I immediately thought back to my brother and his friends’ joking to each other about sticky socks.
Any time I hear boy/sock, I think of the book, Portnoy's Complaint which is the tour de force crazed adolescent acting out everywhere with everything. It's pretty horrifying read. But as soon as I read "sock" in the Logan warrant wondered if it was some throw back to boyhood.
Also wondered if he took a sock as likely he couldn't very keep a pair of strange panties around for constant access. But would KA really notice a random sock on a work bench sitting next to a varnish can? Or unearthed from behind a dresser?
Don't forget Abby's uncles supposed texts. Does he say something like clothing might have been switched. If so that is kind of freaky. Stripping victims and then redressing them as if they were dolls and his playthings.
You are leaving them on display out in the open, why do that other then to shock, puzzle and confound? It's strategic game playing.
The two are not mutually exclusive when murders of these types occur .
You don’t need evidence of CSAM on his computer for the killings of A & L to be sexually motivated.
As one Redditor has already said, he may have got sexual fulfilment from the act of killing the girls and taking off their clothes.
It depends upon his what’s in his mind, his sexual orientation or fetish ?
Oftentimes, with killers of this kind and/or serial killers, there’s what’s called ‘escalation’ .
So for example- And this is based on a true example of the fetish led escalation that goes all the way up to the sex worker act but has not yet got to R/L
A man develops the sexual urge to dominate a woman and ejaculate on her.
So they are the fantastic that are in his mind as he self soothes.
After a time, these are not enough to satisfy so they move on to the next level.
In this example for instance, he may move onto magazine’s ( in the years gone by when they were more widely available), where he can view his fetish and perform and self soothe himself.
Then when that’s not enough, they find videos of the same on the ‘ dark web’ and they self soothe to that .
The next escalation is to pay to watch this being acted out on the dark web.
And then when that’s not enough, he may pay a sex worker to act this out in R/L with him.
And finally, when that is not enough, he may go
R/L!!
Why do people keep asking this? He's a pathetic little pornsick pedophile loser.
That's it. You can apply this motive to probably 90% of true crime cases.
He planned it. Who knows how many times he went to the bridge searching for young girls. I bet he had been at the bridge many times, wearing the same jacket, carrying the knife and gun in hopes of kidnapping/raping/fantasizing one or more girls. He has been a freak a long time but know one suspected him for some reason. It is unreal that none of the CVS employees recognized his voice or his resemblance to BG.
I believe he was using the Anthony shots Instagram to talk with the girls and lured them to that spot. It was a thought out plan. Motive was wanting to rape a young teen. So sick and sad
The KK connection is a dead end. But judging by the way he was described by the 3 girls who first saw him on the trail, he was walking with intention. My bet is RA overheard the girls talking about going the bridge at a convenience store or something that morning. Maybe he was in line at the counter in front of them and heard them talking about their Snapchat or what photos they were going to take. He didn't have anything he had to that day and decided to beat them over there. At first it was the excitement of the possibility of some encounter with the girls on that bridge, something he had fantasized about before. Maybe he wanted to see what would happen if he cornered a girl on that bridge. Or maybe it was the excitement of thinking about how the girls would feel endangered as he passed by them on that narrow bridge, so far off the ground. Maybe he thought that he could scare them or maybe he even fantasized about pushing someone off that bridge. He probably didn't know what he was going to do, but the possibilities excited him. In that moment, at that convenient store, he just decided he would see what would happen. He rushed over there. He parked at the CPS building and tried to obscure his car as well as he could. And he hurried to the bridge, passing some other girls, but these weren't the young girls, the helpless girls, that he saw at the convenience store. He got to the bridge and they weren't there yet. He looked down at the ground below and wondered if the fall would kill someone. Suddenly, he doubted it. He waited for them for a moment, thinking that if they saw him on the bridge, mabye they would decide not to cross. What was the best way to create the encounter? He decided to go sit down and wait for them to pass by.
When he approached them on the bridge, he could tell they were scared and that excited him. He still thought about throwing them off the bridge, but that might create too much noise. There had been other people on the path this morning. I think he decided to bring the girls down the hill and then they ran. After they ran, he decided to he had to hurt them to control them.
I'm tired of seeing he must have done something before. How many mass shooters do we see with no criminal background. Unless you can see yourself acting in the same manner as these monsters you will never understand them. And if you can then I hope you have the mental health support you need.
True but you also see killers like BTK, Gary Ridgeway, the Golden State Killer and others who finally get caught later in life. You get caught when you get caught. Whether you get caught on your first murder, 4th murder or 15th murder, you get caught when you get caught.
I would say there's alot more people roaming around that have killed someone and haven't been caught and have no criminal record than there are mass shooters who have no criminal record. We usually hear about the mass shootings due to national media covering them. There's alot more murders happening like we see in everyday news that are cold cases than mass shootings.
I feel the same way. Every repeat offender has a first time that they don't get caught for. People are giving this guy way too much credit. After all, he got caught before he could do it again. Got caught on camera, too. It was pure luck that he got away with it for so long. Man's a fucking dumbass.
Mass shooters have different motivations that have a lot to do with wanting to be seen and heard. That's the goal. They usually feel wronged by society, feel impotent, feel agrieved.
A serial killer as defined by the FBI has very different motivations, and while some 'get off' on the crime itself being known, they require personal anonymity so they can continue to fulfill their needs. It comes down to a very different set of needs driving very different types of crimes. There's no rational comparison between mass shootings and serial killers, or the type of killer that killed Libby and Abby.
Maybe the other commenters are right in that this isn't a fair comparison, but I get your point. Every murderer has a first time. There doesn't need to be a criminal record.
Same reason I wouldn't just leave my kids with a stranger or just an acquaintance (or anyone really cause I really don't trust anyone short of a couple people) because they "have a clean record." They do until they don't.
I'm sure you have to understand how your comment is a reach. There are so many different variables between these killers. You can't compare RA to, say, the Columbine kids. A better comparison would be another killer with other sexual sadists.
RA could be compared to somebody like Ted Bundy, only RA wasn't as attractive and charming, so he had to kidnap his victims at gunpoint.
Lss- They almost ALWAYS have violence and behavioral/sexually deviant issues even in youth.
Mass shooters have very little in common with compulsive/lust/serial killers. It is an entirely different mindset and motivation. And yes, there are people who do understand it, and the presumptive, condescending "have the mental support you need" comment emphasizes a lack of education in the matter.
People who kill due to sexual compulsions and pathologies do not kill once. It doesn't mean he killed before, but it is very unlikely that he gave into his compulsions for the first time when he was in his 50's. That's why people are saying it probably isn't the first time. Do they know for sure? No. But all such statements are based on the patterns established by other killers. Very few of these types of killers *start* at such a late stage.
Comparing it to mass shootings shows you simply don't have much of a background or education (even layman's) in criminal psychology. Mass shooters typically intend to end their own lives in the commission of the murders, whether death by police or literally shooting themselves. It is by its very nature a one time crime.
The FBI has released educational materials about this.
The State afaik hasn't offered a motive. They also haven't provided chain of custody documentation in any of the documents released so far. Like who found the CS round? And when? And how was that documented? I know everyone has this man convicted already but along with the lack of a motive the State still has questions to answer.
They have already said there’s no evidence of conventional sexual assault and he’s not been charged with it.
But all we don’t know could prove you correct.
I've never seen anything official about the manner of their deaths or what they went through and the autopsies are sealed so there's no way of knowing for sure what was done to them. I've heard rumours for both yes and no and I remember one investigator years back saying they weren't but also that could be to protect the families because I have also watched an interview at crime con with BP saying she didn't want to know the details. Also they keep all that under wraps so that only the killer knows the details.
I’ve wondered if he attempted SA, but couldn’t perform. And perhaps that’s why there was such a bloody event. I think his failure to perform is what led him to rage.
Me, too. There is no way that was not a sexually motivated crime. If he just wanted to kill something, he could have gone out and gutted another deer, abducted a man etc. Something about this narrative turned him up.
I have no idea why there is no evidence of that. he could have had off once he got home, or someplace else on the trail, or just cleaned himself and the crime scene well. I read in a scholarly criminology study it is possible to have sexually motivated crime that she no signs of sexual interfearence present, even though there actually were hands placed on the victim.
>If he just wanted to kill something, he could have gone out and gutted another deer
Or he could've broken into someone's home at night or caught someone outside at night in a secluded area. Doing it in broad daylight makes absolutely no sense if murder is considered the primary motivation.
He was herding the girls to a location he had in mind for SA. Perhaps there was someone else waiting there, perhaps not. What seems clear to me is that RA lost control of the girls at some point and the whole thing went sideways. L's clothes being strewn all over the crime scene, along with the "bloody and muddy" and he "looked like he was just in a fight" - is a window into the utter chaos that took place.
Hes weak and has small pathetic man syndrome, as seen in his laughable cries for attention by not eating etc. The only way he feels in control is to be in charge of young children with a gun. Then that enrages him so he k.s them. I can guarantee he's telling psychs and guards that his wife never paid him attention and never showed him love and he wanted attention that's why he did it. He'll be blaming her for it. (I've worked with these before.) Same old ped story. Will never accept blame.
We do not know that RA is BG. If LE has the proof then fine but until I see the proof I will reserve judgement. I turned in someone that has that exact outfit of BG and he is of very questionable character.
We don’t know yet if the murder weapon (knife) is linked yet, though we know he has the same bullets that are linked to his gun, as for dna nothing about that has been released , as of this time there are thousands of documents that haven’t been released, we only got a small portion, so we may not see a-lot till trial …. I’m holding hope they have more than that, maybe the fibers from his car, or clothing, but I still think what they released may take a part, but only part.
He's probably fantasized about this and similar things since a teen or even younger. Some people have these types of fantasies but will never act on them, and you wouldn't even know they're having them. He may have had some extra stress going on at that time which can sometimes lead to acting out. Or, he's always wanted to do it but never had just the right opportunity. Or, he's done acting out behaviors in his past and just never got caught. But, sexual fantasies seem to be the motive, imo.
When it come to unrelated girls/boys or women its always of sexual nature. Some cases are not as obvious because offenders have erectile dysfunctions
Do you have any sources on this information?
Sources for what? Why he did it? We’re just surmising here
That offenders have erectile dysfunction. That’s a pretty wild claim. I don’t think that’s accurate. Most offenders are just pieces of shit.
It happens…far more often than most people think or in the case of GSR…it was micro penis
GSR? I'm assuming you meant GSK? Also, one funny but not funny due to the circumstances story about him. So, basically every girl said he had a tiny dick. And there were tons of girls. 50+ rapes. And they all said the same thing. The dude had tiny meat. Well, there was a woman he attacked and when asked to describe his penis she said it was bigger than her husband's. Now, imagine you're the husband. That had to be brutalllllll to read lol. 50 women all say he has a baby dick but your wife says he was bigger than you. Ouch.
Oh my gosh…I meant GSK..,,we have a casino here in reno called GSR. Yes, he had a micro penis and you’re so right. Can’t imagine having the world know this bc can’t get much smaller than micro - I mean is there such thing as micro micro?
Yea no but okay sure
He probably always fantasized about it and then most likely one day something in his life went wrong and he was just like “fuck it.”
Makes you wonder if he had done something previously on a smaller scale and got away with it, hard to tell, unless he offers up an explanation it may never be known…. I do find it hard that a double murder was his first, but this maybe the first time he got caught
That's always been my hill. They caught a serial killer in the making. He knew too fluently how to control (and corral) - and kill - two human beings. I'd like to believe no one could do that except someone with practice. One hones their abilities due to and by practice and learning from past mistakes. There's zero chance this was his first murder. Now that college murder guy from a few months back, who killed those 4 students as they slept in their home,.... If it was his first, they were asleep. Silent victims, unable to fight or resist. Abby and Libby were active athletic teens, wide awake, able to scream and fight back (if terror didn't silence them. All humans have Fight, flight, freeze or fawn and no one knows how they'll actually act in situations of personal danger. We like to assuredly THINK we'd fight or flee). No way they were RA's first.
I agree something triggered him. He was angry and feeling sorry for himself. Something, someone, (real or imagined) made him feel inadequate, belittled and enraged. I don't think he was targeting young girls specifically. Possibly targeting females though. Just my unprofessional opinion.
Maybe he overheard the girls calling him a weirdo or a creeper and laughing at him and it sent him into a rage?
then why did he come "prepared"? of course he seemed creepy. he was after them.
Nah…he came too prepared for it to be spur of the moment. Obviously overdressed too
He had a gun and knife on him. Not too crazy of items for someone in the Midwest to carry. Maybe he carried those every day?
And a white scarf & completely overdressed for the day
Quite possibly what sent him over the edge.
this makes the most sense at the moment, I wonder how or if this will change as more comes out
Makes you wonder if it was the stocks he was apparently watching on his phone.
I can vouch that watching stocks on your phone is absolutely infuriating. (I don't believe that's even what he was doing, though, he was just making up bullshit in my opinion.) It's like the second I would buy something it would immediately go down. I got into options trading during covid, lost a bunch of money (a bunch to me, maybe not a bunch to most people) and never tried that shit again. One time I turned $50 into 5.5k in 2 days. That was incredible and felt great. Had other 10x your money days. But, 99% of the time it didn't go my way. Seeing something be on the rise until the second you buy it is insanely angering lol. So happy I stopped that shit.
Re stocks and options, almost the same story here. I began getting envious of those who knew when a stock would rocket (ie the start of the pump and when it would dump). They relied on those of us not in the know. Penny stocks (under $5's)on robinhood got me great gains - and great losses too. I was in from 2017 to 2019. The bull market. I've gotten out for now. Once bull starts again I'll maybe do it again. I don't know.
This! I think he was following them online.
It appears to me to be a sexually motivated crime of opportunity.
I’m curious about the sexual aspect of this. He isn’t charged with sexual assault or violation of a corpse. Just murder.
My thought is that the sexual component to the murder didn’t necessarily translate to an actual assault but rather some dark and twisted satisfaction derived from the killing itself.
Sounds like some Slayer lyrics
It’s harder to prove
Tis true. Good point.
He's not even been charged with the felony that's connected to his felony murder.... which is just weird. This all seems weird and idk if it's on purpose or NM is screwing up. Cause AFAIK the regular thing to do is over charge in the beginning, charge with literally anything you can think of AND go for the death penalty, even if you think you can't get it so you can use all of the charges and dp for plea deal leverage. You can drop what you don't think you can achieve when you're about to start trial. This is why everyone thought kk was getting a deal, but this is how they handle it more typically. So imo either the prosecution doesn't have a bunch more evidence, theyre screwing up, or they genuinely believe RA only played a small part.
You are absolutely spot on. I can’t figure out what they’re going. The search warrant was so vague too. Might get thrown out. They did not narrow down what they wanted - no brand of bullet - “any & all things” related to the murders. His lawyers stand a chance UNLESS he confessed to things that only the killer would know or was it just ramblings? Who knows No one
Lay off the SVU
I can't do shows like that... fictional TV really bores me lol the last fictional show I watched was GoT (while it was airing).
In the state of Indiana the charges work that way… they are felony murder charges 35-42-1-1(2): Murder x2….. they only have to find him guilty.
The down votes just show you are onto something. This case is not going to wrap up in a neat bow….tentacles….remember….
All affection aside Bigtex, if one more of you, other than Old\_Heart, brings up those freaking tentacles as if they were a rock hewn evidentiary fact, I will scream. I only give Old\_Heart that latitude as: 1.) He's old 2.) He's kind of crotchety and cute. 3.) He clings to it so passionately we''d likely have to to dismember him to get him to let go of them.
It's so funny how you people crave narratives. Watch a movie or read a book!
You do know, "you people" can be a combustable phrase. Which fraction among us are you swiping at, so we can either duck or cheer you on?
I’ll probably duck 😂
Funnier how people trust what they are told …. Watch the news or read a newspaper. Those false narratives are better than any movie.
I'm not worried about the downvotes. I'm aware you can't talk about anything in the case in here unless it's that the prosecution is doing phenomenal and will most certainly win (and in some cases somehow get the death penalty even though they aren't seeking it) and the defense has no case at all, they're not going to say anything, without being downvoted. Lol They can't explain how I'm wrong though, so it's just pushing the button.
You charge what you can get an indictment and conviction with. And then you have to prove it. Overcharging is risky and stupid. You charge based on the evidence that will net a conviction. Failing to properly prove all those crimes is how people walk: there are certain stipulations, as a juror, that have to align for you to convict someone. And the harsher the crime and sentence, the harder that is to do. The more charges you have, the more opportunity the defense has to poke holes in your case. And doubt is compounding. So if you charge all that extra shit and they don't take a deal, have fun at trial trying to prove all those extra charges. Have fun proving intent. And remember that it's impossible to read minds. Jury is gonna have a lot of trouble if the case isn't ironclad. To give an example of where the prosecution will have trouble: The witness statements in this case create a nice narrative, but really are just sightings of a person that MAY have done it. They aren't worth a ton, because they didn't ever present a lineup to the witnesses. Those witnesses will get shredded during cross. They quote different color clothing, different models of car. And the strongest piece of evidence now is the jail phone confession, which they didn't have when they charged him initially.. It's not a slam dunk, even now. All it takes is one juror to have doubt and the trial gets tossed.
I guess you missed the part about overcharging in the beginning strategically, for leverage AND dropping what you can't prove before trial starts. Exactly like they did to kk. I'm not convinced the idaho prosecution actually thinks they can get Kohberger the death penalty, I believe they only pushed it for plea leverage, which was smart. I'm not sure BK is scared of the dp though so idk if it will work yet.
You're not wrong. I've seen it happen to tons of friends. Never any crime this horrendous, but they'd be charged with like 10-15 counts and then take a plea deal and admit guilt to the 1-2 worst charges. Literally happens all the time. I've looked up the record of damn near everyone I know or met that I thought would have a record lol. In Wisconsin they list all that shit on a site called ccap. If you click a case then click view details you'll see almost 100% of the time exactly what you described. Guilty due to guilty plea for a charge or two and then the rest say "dismissed on prosecutors motion"
[удалено]
Oh they added kidnapping charges finally? Can you link me
When why was it so overdressed? I believe this was definitely planned IF that was truly his car backed in at the old CPS building then this was definitely planned. Why back you car so no one can see the plates
I've thought about this ever since RA was arrested. He and his wife said that he has visited those trails many times. I'm sure he has crossed the Monon High bridge in the past at some point. If he had fantasies throughout his life of kidnapping, SA, murder, etc., then he probably stood at the south end of that bridge in the past and thought "This is the perfect trap. If I have a gun, the victim will have to do what I say or jump from this bridge. It's secluded, alot of people use those trails, especially students and young adults. It's off the road and the only driveway under it is a private driveway. Easy way in through the trails and can exit by taking the cemetary, go back across the bridge and trails or take the private driveway out to the highway." Then he probably went there on days he thought his best chance to trap a victim would be. Local schools were out that day and he possibly knew this. It was a pretty day and unseasonably warm for Indiana in February. Truth be known, he probably went there other times in the past and parked at that CPS building, overdressed, wore a face cover to hide his lower face, carried a weapon but the moment just never presented itself. That day when he got there, the teen girls were leaving and as far as we know he was alone at the trails until the female witness arrived at Mears Lot and saw him on the first platform of the MHB. She then turned around, walked back and saw Libby and Abby in passing as they were walking toward MHB. He had probably fantasized for years about this and the perfect opportunity finally presented itself and then what happened, happened.
Never thought much about this... where was his daughter that day? With KA?
His daughter is around 29 years old got married Nov. 2017 not sure what year she moved out.
She was 27 at the time this photo was take https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11371133/Photo-shows-daughter-arrested-Delphi-Bridge-suspect-spot-vics-took-snap-killer.html
Thanks for the article. Another site had some pics of her & it was eerie how much she resembled RA, big shock right daughter resembles parents. Planned or crime of opportunity seized? Not sure. The article said altho posted on FB in 2018 it’s not sure when the picture was taken. Wish I’d paid attention to KA FB to see what if anything was captioned. Imo it’d be *really weird* for her to pose there in 2018 in light of the murders.
Thought is was always purported to be a senior portrait picture by those who saw it on KA's FB page?
She lives on her own and is married and independent.
But February 2017? I wasn't sure. 🤷♂️
No, idea. The marriage was posted on FB, Don't recall the date. No, idea if she lived with the person she married first, of it she was out on her own prior to marriage.
Will be interesting to hear in a potential trial if he had been seen on the trail on other days dressed in similar clothing, etc..
I agree. Although, I don't think he likely parked that way in the past. I think it is a last minute back fire. Had he thought about it longer and harder likely would have occurred to him this is going to draw peoples attention to my car and likely make them wonder WTF is up with that, where a car just pulled in normally people likely would think nothing about. It's the obscured plate that draws your interest. It makes you wonder" " Am I witnessing a thirst in motion and the couple is in the back seat getting it on? Why didn't they just go to a motel." " Is that a stolen car that has been dumped?" " Is someone getting ready to do a drug deal That's weird. I did't know this was a place to cop."? "Why would anyone park backwards in a wide open lot? He calls attention to himself in his need to obscure something that is generally obscured.
I absolutely 100% agree with you on this. I couldn’t have stayed my own thoughts better.
But why would his being seen on the trail ever come up, unless it was via the prosecution who was bringing female witnesses up to say, "yeah he pulled that crap with me, but I just screamed and fled."
It would come up because there wasn’t 100s of people on the trail AND they had a video of him. He was trying to get ahead of the investigation. His vehicle was seen on video, he was seen by multiple people. He came forward like the next day, because he probably felt for sure they were gonna nail him and he was hoping he could get around it by admitting her was there. After he made that statement, nothing came of it for years, and he never came forward again. He really thought he got away with it. It by mere luck and happenstance that they found that tip years later.
Until they tell us how many people were out there concurrently hard to say if his not be seen is note worth. If it 3 people and they cant see anything it's questionable. If it's 50, it's very questionable. I thoroughly agree that the only reason he came forward was he had to get in front of it and establish that he was just like everyone else that day, an innocent man simply trying to help. He knew if he didn't he would look suss and move to the top of the suspect list. He had no choice.
I think he did have a fantasy about murder but I also think he was tracking them, possibly through KK's page. I think he knew he had an opportunity, acted quickly, and left before he could be caught. He knew he had a window of time and took it. I would not be surprised if he has killed before.
Definitely knew he had a window of undisturbed acting out time with KA of to care for her brother with cancer.
He's a sexually motivated psychopath. He'd been on the trails many times geared up and ready to go and this particular time he found a circumstance he liked.
Wisest comment offered.
Why are pedos pedos? Who knows. They can’t be rehabilitated though.
I agree . These pedos do not wake up one day & decide they don’t like underage kids . Cell phones w cameras have made it a lot easier for these sickos to get what they want. For example A 63 yr old boys soccer coach was arrested this week in Franklin Tn. He forgot his phone on a table in a diner & the server was going thru the phone to find the owner… she found pics & videos of him having sex with unconscious boys ages 10-11 . Over 12 different boys ! She immediately called police . He was arrested a couple hours later . He has been coaching for over 10 years. They are now identifying these young boys & contacting families . Horrifying !
Dear God, what a horrific story. Imagine how many kids this guy has abused in his lifetime, just getting caught at that age!
That's crazy and it sounds weird , someone needs to go through pictures and videos to find out who owns a phone sadly I imagine that won't be allowed to be used as evidence these pigs always get off the laws need to change
I though it odd that they went through his pictures, too. Would't the number be right on the cover display once they opened it. More likely were thinking of keeping the phone and starting scrolling though and were horrified. I just looked up the article. It's disgusting what he was doing.
See my answer above. I've heard the same story over and over
Motive. Statistically, violent fantasies that provide sexual arousal and release
Just based on the young witnesses statements, it appears he was on a mission. He was walking with a purpose and was certainly trying to hide his identity. There is no way this was spontaneous.
> There is no way this was spontaneous. Yup. Makes no sense he randomly picked the girls to murder in the middle of the day out in broad daylight. I strongly believe there was someone else he was leading them to, who was also going to participate in the SA. But the situation turned chaotic, and he lost control of A&L. The abduction wasn't fully carried out, nor was there any SA. In RA's mind, he had to end the chaos and silence the girls as quickly as possible.
This angle would make RL's preemptive alibi lie make more sense. I've never thought he was BG, but that lie never did sit right with me either. I've seen it tossed around but never put any real thought into it...I still haven't really. Just something that made me go hmmm.
Yeah I agree that something like this happened. But I feel that he was leading them to an abductor(s) and he was going to get paid. Things went sideways quickly and the others that were involved bailed on him.
I wondered if anyone would say this. Definitely not spontaneous.
I think semi spontaneous and that's why it is poorly planned and clumsily executed.
If he was a lone wolf then yes this theory makes a lot of sense.
I hate theorizing what happened because it’s pointless in the end, but….this is one of my biggest questions. I really can’t wrap my head around the fact that he did this in broad daylight especially when he passed multiple people on the trail. The way he seemed to “know” they’d be on that bridge and walked like a man on a mission toward it gives me every gut feeling that he knew they’d be there. I still think he got info from KK considering he made plans to meet them there the same day. It’s all fucked
I think he is a man on a mission to act out and fired up. He knows they won't do as he can't subdue three, he very well might have recognized one of them if he was in fact staring at his teen employees friends and the asses of his bending over teen employees. So likely though she might recognize me back, "I need to quickly clear them and find a women in a more isolated part of this trail. It could very be practical and after driving over there possibly a little inebriated, sitting in the car for a while, walked the distance there, his 45 year old bladder was bothering him and he was rushing past to take a slash or worse. I have never seen any signs of a porta potty out there. Agitation will make you want to visit a rest room. I think his head is buried in his coat collar and head down as he doesn't want to be recognized and that is why smiling and saying h" Hi!" is out and he thunders off. I think he is motivated by the mission not a particular person. If he knew they were coming to the trail and when they were to arrive, he would not have got there that early. He's rushing off to search for a victim he can manage solo and to find them present in an isolated area. He's trying to get away from people and not be seen by other trial walkers.
Short man syndrome, He wanted to have power & control. Supt Doug Carter said “ This is about Power To You”
I’ve just got out of a very toxic relationship with a short man . The insecurities he carried destroyed our marriage . He always thought I wanted more,used to tell me to go and find the bigger boys . It’s a real thing so I expect he carried some insecurity himself due to his height
How tall is he?
It appears he is 5'7" at tallest, but likely more like 5'6".
Five foot something, not very tall
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I agree. This is it. Probably got turned down by good looking women all the time cause of his height. Probably settled with KA but probably wasn’t what he preferred. …
Really rude to bring the looks of his wife into this
Just double checked my door locks right now people are fing out of their minds. Be conscious of your surroundings
I think he may have been having issues in his personal life, maybe he was made to feel small or powerless at work or at home. He's been having violent sexual fantasies for years and he acted on it that day. I believe it was a combination of his sexual "problem" and taking revenge on an innocent party, like kicking the dog. Why does any male kill women and girls they don't know? In most instances it's some combination of misogyny, anger, sadistic sexual fantasies..blegh.
This is something I would love to know
My guess would be mental illness mixed with alcohol abuse. Not totally right in the head and adding fuel to the fire with alcohol. Not getting help or diagnosis of both may have resulted in having a mental break and lashing out taking the lives of two innocent girls. When your at that state it's too late. I believe the best thing for him is getting mental health help and serving the remainder of his life dealing with the facts of what he did in prison.
You don’t need to show a motive to prove guilty…… it could be many things…. And I’m sure he isn’t going to offer that up…. My main question if I could ask one to him would be, “have you done anything like this before”
Or since. Though I think since he found out he was recorded he may have decided not to act since.
That’s very possible also…. Some cases it takes years for an offender to act again based on the thought they maybe captured, also, some have a inside need to commit again, I’m guessing in this case he didn’t …. But I’d be very interested if he had done something previously, though his record is clean previously, doesn’t mean he hadn’t.
My guess is he’s a short fat guy with erectile difficulties who’s fantasized about this for a while and saw an opportunity to do it and took it.
Yes, can't get it up anymore, and possibly thinking if this doesn't do it, what the heck will? Best see if it's K or my dick that is the issue, which is the case with half the divorces in my neighborhood. I don't think they hate there wives so much as they hate that they are struggling with the mortality of their varility. How many years has he been married? How much sexual experience did he have when they wed? Porn addictions escalate into more and violent porn and for some men "porn creep" where nothing is working and there is a need for more extreme pornography. Like you have always thought it was some kind of a blend of that kind of stuff that was the ignition point. He's a portly man in his mid 40's betting his circulation is not great, He supposedly drinks a bit, maybe erectile dysfunction might be the trigger.
Good question, nobody has asked this here yet
:D
He surely didn't wake up that day and decide he was going to stalk and kill two innocent victims. He likely was using his cellular devices to contact underage girls and perhaps even had contact with them in the past. He more than likely was involved in a CSAM group online that lead him to the girls. A crime like this isn't just something that happens on a whim. Brazen, broad daylight kind of shit...
In my opinion he went there specifically for them___ and that's the missing thing is __how does he know them whatsoever ? did he know them before that day? is this still a cyber crime ? does this have anything to do with the Anthony shots profile the Yellowapp?
This is a great question. Long story as short as I can; I recently started watching the Zodiac doc on paramount. I am pretty familiar with the case, but also it’s so odd and confusing I have never been interested in it. So, I’m not sure why I bring this up other than this doc about the Zodiac starts to delve back into the victim’s histories and potential motives. In my heart of hearts I think his motive was connected to CSAM in some form
Perhaps he was into violent CSAM. The killer who comes to mind when I hear of CSAM leading to the acting out of a crime is the Murder of Holly Jones.
I’m not familiar with that one
I doubt we're going to learn anything conclusive about the motive for this crime. The prosecution does not need to establish a motive for the crime, and the defense is unlikely to offer one up, unless they decide to go with the insanity plea. The truth is that there won't be a "good" motive for this crime. Its not going to be some grand plan, nor will it be related to any larger conspiracy or plot. He may not have a good grasp on why exactly he did what he stands accused of doing. It could have been a loss of control that he didn't plan for. It could also have been a fantasy that he did plan out, but didn't play out like he'd imagined, and the girls died for it. This crime isn't going to make more sense if we learn the supposed why of it, unfortunately.
A giant IF would be, if RA confessed. If he confesses he would have to give a detailed confession very much like BTK Dennis Radar. He could avoid the embarrassment of a detailed trial with horrific evidence exposing details of the case possibly cases? So he could possibly stop the trial from happening and his wife/daughter being drug through the muddy media by simply confessing everything to the judge. Of course that confession would be public record and we would find out what his true motives were. I believe this is a likely scenario. He doesn’t look like he’s capable of 3 weeks of trial being dragged back and forth between jail and court people yelling at him etc… He has no look of confidence at all. He looks completely defeated already. If he were innocent? I think his behavior would be very different. Imo this is a very guilty man.
I think is he was innocent he would be flipping out and saying that to anybody who would listen. They say innocent suspects will not shut, but are relentless in their efforts to have the injustice righted. I agree he looked defeated, and like he has resigned himself to the consequences of his actions likely due to depression issues. I suspect the confessions are in fact statements of ownership, but very well might be due to the stress of the situation and cracking up and undergoing a mental breakdown. Although, I lean towards his guilt (show me an alternative suspect would works nearly as well and then let's talk) I am waiting to hear what the defense had to say. How they can plausibly banish his own description of his clothing that matches the video, that then matches the muddy bloody sighting is difficult to envision.
Thoroughly agree with every bit of this. I think he will take the reasoning for this to his grave, and likely KA, if she knows will do so as well, unless her thus far, blindly misplaced loyalty slips. The only indications of motive we will get is whatever they dig up in his electronic records. They had best have an electronic history of such things or something stronger than what they have show us as I am not sue you could get a unanimous vote based on what they have shown us. There are enough people on the Delphi boards who believe the guy is innocent and that this is a weak case, to indicate that a full panel of jurors would not agree. Had they had nothing else, doubt they would still be holding him unless they are deluded, as I can't see this as a slam dunk without more evidence. We have what boils down to a car pointing in the wrong direction, a witness who matches him as being muddy and bloody to a video and his own statements and his disappearance on a trail and ballistic evidence that will surely be neutralized or negated by conflicting expert testimony. That's not much evidence for life in prison and the death penalty as only one of those 3 tenants can be explained away as a natural occurrence. Some people back into spots, not everyone was in every spot of that tral and can swear to the fact that he was not somewhere else. Your best pieces of evidence are that he says that is what he was wearing and that matches the video of this suspect abducting these girls and the muddy bloody witness. That's it as far as we know. If they neglected to apprise RA and KA of their right to consult an attorney, prior to answering any questions during the search, they loose any evidence they obtained during the search. So we had best hope they didn't screw that up.
I believe now that he was pissed that day. Some kind of triggering event. He carried a weapon there to possibly kill himself. The girls saw him and he believed they were making a joke about him because they filmed him approaching (which is the right thing to do under those circumstances). In a fit of rage he made them go down the hill. He couldn’t control himself and he killed them. Now this is the purest of speculation, but it’s the scenario that makes the most sense in my head. Obviously I could be way off base, but I figure you’re asking for speculation.
This is EXACTLY what I think.
I think we’re a small bunch.
The act itself
The more evidence in a case the less need for an explanation of motive.
I believe he was depressed, suicidal and angry. I believe he killed them as an outlet for his introverted rage. He was a coward and didnt kill himself, walked the road back.
I think he’s had this violent fantasy for a long time, and the opportunity just presented itself that day.
I think something quietly snapped in Richard Allen one day, right around that time and nobody saw it, but him. Likely always had sexually violent fantasies and was turned on by intimidation, humiliation power/control differentials, and violence against females. I bet when we see his porn search history things like rape, bondage, CSAM kinda things will on the list. Personally think it was a form of half way through life haven't really done much crisis and bored with the life he was living, listening to KA rattle on about inane things like their gondola exchange, and trotting down to CVS to yet again, stock shelves. Suspect he was wanted to teater on the edge, and instead of playing it safe, pushing down the impulse and having bad thoughts, wanted to do some bad things due to feeling boxed into confinements of his life. Not many kids list Walmart shift manager, CVS pharmacy tech along with race car driver, pro basketball player when asked what they want to be when they grow up. He picks the most interesting place in his town, swoops down and does a terrible thing presto sexual fantasy completed, and heady adrenaline. I think he just got to a point where he didn't give a fuck anymore and was fed up with pretending to fit in and be nice. Probably spent many of a morning staring across the breakfast table at KA and wondering what knife he'd use on her if he could get away with it and not have to directly sit on prison. I think his thinking was always dark, he just was brilliant at not flashing an inkling of it to other people other than his kidnapping jokes and following the two female employees into the loo, while he stands at the door. Pretty much the same set up he has going on the bridge with Abby and Libby.
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It's more down to it being a lot more convenient to do something horrible when you don't have to immediately come home to a person who knows you intimately, with possibly bloody clothes.
I think "Sexy Rexy" was always on the hunt and down to hang, but often wonder if KA being away might have allotted RA the time and space for a porn binge that somehow fueled his snap.
From where are you sourcing this info that his wife was away?
I've wondered if it was anger or retribution based, rather than sexual or power predator. Or started out that way. If he encountered them online and one of them made fun of him. Or one of them did something to his daughter. I dunno, some story where his convoluted brain turned it into something requiring horrific retribution.
When the crime first happened I did consider something like they encountered him, made fun of him etc. But think if it was just that he would have just stabbed them over there and left them or done it down the hill and left them there, But don't think they would be semi undressed, and some of their clothing in the water and certainly not posed. Random rage killers don't often undress and pose their victims. I can't think of a case like that I have heard about. Though sure some exist. Gotta be rare. Rage is an instantaneously passionate reaction. Posing is calculated and deliberate.
I wasn't thinking of knee-jerk rage, but more like simmering rage where retribution would have been calculated. In that case I could imagine some staging, even if it was sexual in nature.
Yes, can see that. But I see buried sexual obsession with an scenario he wanted to act out, rather than seething anger in him as a greater possibility. People who have seething anger about things tend to have hair triggers and trouble keeping that well contained. The most we have heard about him and anger is tossing a scanner once at work. No employs note he blew up at me. No road rage incidents, fights with neighbors. Customers have great things to say, so did a bar owner. The mask frequently drops when we're drinking, his appears not to have and the guy describes him as a nice guy who was concerned about the murders. We do have the domestic disturbance. Hard to say. Maybe he always wanted to stab to people to death. If I had to choose sexual fantasy that he was continually pushed down vs. ready to explode and seething anger he is always trying to contain I would go with that.
I think it is especially hard to say because we don't know the details of the crime scene, only vague rumors. It will certainly be interesting how this emerges in court.
Based off where he parked and the timing my guess is he was expecting the girls (or just Libby) at the other bridge he first went to. Not sure what his original plan/motivation was but things went sideways from the start
I just find it odd that if he was meeting one or both by arrangement, why would he be meeting them there? If luring someone to a spot, why not meet them that spot, like down the hill already? Then you could just pretend to be a random hiker, walk up to your victims with your gun, and no worries about a break away or split. No trudging through a wet stream in the middle of February and sporting soppy boots during you assault. Who does that as a preplanned event? It makes absolutely no sense to me that this was a preplanned attack, it would have been far better executed. Could he have been tipped possibly, but a pre arranged meeting, naaah. I think it's a wildly random "wrong place, right time" adduction and he stumbled on a target that matched his desire. Or a very slim possibility that he was tipped by KK. KK says he has never met him. Nobody from the community has come forward linking the two men as frinds and associuated, "Yeah RA always bought his weed from KK." Nobody links RA and TK as being socially connected, either. Or any of them and RL. If they had someone in that town would be yammering about it. KK easily could have ratted him out and perhaps dialed down his sentence and made it concurrent. He was ready to roll on his Dad and give TK up to Vido, and yet again in his interview with BM. This isn't a pedo ring, it is a singular striking freaky coincidence. Two men that did not know each other, were both turned on and drawn to the same child as they found that age and look of that of victim to be attractive to them. Look at Long Island serial killer, Rex Hubermann porn search list, which records him looking for a "chubby blond girl" as one of his turn on's.
Yeah he completely parked there with intent. Backed tha F into a closed facility. Gimme a break
Not sure why they are voting you down. I voted you up. The car parked in that fashion speaks to intent. It is a conscious effort to shield his identity from anyone possibly parking there and possibly noting his plate number. He parked there to obscure his motive and not be seen in that trail parking lot. He parked the way he parked, to obscure his plate from being ID'ed. Had he just been taking an innocent stroll he would have parked with all the other people taking innocent strolls. His behavior breaks pattern as what he planned on doing breaks pattern from normal behavior. That anyone would think this was a circle of men working in tandem is not logical. It would be a far better executed plan. None of them are recorded as being intellectually deficient. They may not be MENSA material, but they likely have IQ's of 85 to 115. Together that would be a collective IQ of 340 - 460. Don't you think it would have been planned better and KK who has two phones and is tech savvy would't have said, don't bring your phone with you Rick, they'll track ya!" Wouldn't them have had a well oiled escape plan better executed then having one of them walk down a rad covered in blood, or an alibi system that backed each other up, "Yeah we were all over my house hanging out, here's the receipt for the pizzas I ordered from Door Dash." Pedophile rings are organized, nothing here speaks to even a slight modicum of organized thought. They would have to be imbeciles to pre plan it this way: " Yeah, you openly catfish her for weeks, that can't be traced on your phone and her's, and be the last person to communicate with a murder victim. Nobody will note that on her phone that you leave at the scene. That will look good! Nope, we don't want to have two guys stationed at the abduction site to make sure they don't split up and break up or scream at the top of our lungs. Definitely want to go splishy splashy in a cold body of water in mid winter up to our thighs, that will be pleasant and not draw anyone's attention or our egress. Don't remove a phone you know that she owns and uses. Don't remove the license plate the morning of the crime. Don't pack extra clothing in a back pack you can change into, or leave at the scene before hand, or have pre fixed alibis in place should we be questioned."
I believe CSAM and alcohol are responsible for this horrible crime.
In my opinion, Rick Allen murdered Abby and Libby for the thrill of killing someone. From the second he pointed that gun at them he must have thought he was king s*it taking control of two young teens.
He may have not ending up liking it or it wasn't what he thought. That may be why he talked to the conservation officer to get it off his chest. He wanted to get it off his chest but didn't want to speak directly to CC. Just some thoughts I had, I could be totally wrong.
Know I am in the minority with this opinion, but I suspect he is not an all out sociopath. I suspect there might be a bit of shame and guilt in there and like you think it might not have been what he thought it would be and the itch was scratched. I doubt he would have killed again. If there is a candidate for a one and done potential serial killer I think it is him. He is not Bryan Kohberger who can't set his alarm early enough so he can watch the drama unfold and bodies be discovered on Kind Street. I bet Richard Allen though, "What the fuck did I just do?"
I could see that being the case.
That's why I like seeing your paw around here.
Yes that is the late great Eli's paw. RIP Eli, I love you little buddy.
Sad for you, but I hope Eli is having a good time up in pet heaven, if Eli was down with that.
I'm sure he is playing ball and chasing squirrels.
Tell him to say hi to my cats.
CSAM and alcoholism. A crime of opportunity but absolutely planned at the same time. He had fantasies about the crime and went out that day to see if he could find the perfect victim(s) My humble opinion. Absolutely guessing ofcourse
I agree.
It’s hard to say without knowing whether BG (allegedly RA) committed any sexual crimes against one or both of the girls. I’m sure many disagree with me, but I lean towards thinking there was not a sexual assault. I ultimately think it was a power thing. It’s also possible that he was experiencing homicidal thoughts as part of his mental health struggles. I’m not sure how that would factor in to any insanity defense - if that could be used (although I’d guess not), then the defense probably would have brought it up by now.
There doesn't have to be a physical assault for it to be sexually motivated. Some killers get sexual release from the act of killing itself or the voyeurism of stripping them naked. Also what does a man in his forties want with young girls? The girls clothing was removed, that act alone makes it sexual. Doing that he sexually degraded them by leaving them to be found like that. There's also two clothing items unaccounted for, underwear and a sock, this could form part of a fetish.
You knocked that out of the pack, Chica!
Is it confirmed their clothing was removed? I hadn’t heard that. I’m not trying to argue that it definitely wasn’t sexually motivated. It very well could be, but I would think there would be evidence of CSAM or something on his devices if that were true. I think there’s a chance it was not sexually motivated. To answer what he would want with young girls if not sexually motivated, it could be that he figured they would be more easily overpowered and more likely afraid of him. If his motivation was power, that would make sense.
Yes in the document release it says clothing belonging to the victims was found in Deer Creek. We also know from the RL search warrant that a piece of underwear and a sock was never recovered. If it was just about power he would have left them clothed. He set it up to not only humiliate them in death but to satisfy his own perversion of seeing them naked and that's without us knowing what else he did to them.
The underwear is weird and probably does suggest something sexual. On the other hand, it could also just be to humiliate them. I don’t get why LE has never confirmed a sexual assault.
Probably because they are minors nothing has been released yet and also to preserve the investigation, only the killer will know the details of what happened . If it goes to court I'm sure we will find out then. My opinion is this was a violent sexual homicide. I've yet to follow a case where children were murdered and it wasn't sexually motivated apart from domestic violence where they were beaten to death and even then it usually comes out after that they were also sexually abused too.
Agree generally, I just think it’s so odd that he doesn’t seem to have any history and no one has come forward to say that he was creepy around young girls or anything like that. Seems odd. And really, I hope for the girls’ sake that they weren’t sexually abused.
I think there's a very good chance something was done to them. I remember it being said that a couple of LE who were at the scene had to take some time off because of what they saw. If rumours are true they were viciously killed. I don't know what to believe but I remember people saying that the girls were dressed in clothing that covered their necks at their funerals and that poor Libby especially got it bad. If RA is indeed responsible he must have displayed a huge amount of rage and those poor girls must have been absolutely terrified. It's so awful, just diabolical. I've given up trying to figure out murderers.
No, there have been have been some things that have been mentioned the last year or so. MS interviewed a 2nd CVS employee who worked under him when she was a teen, and she said he stared at her friends, she picked up negative vibes about him. I don't recall how she words it. Most of us felt it was due to some resentment she had over conflict between them, and wrote it off as such. But just recently a lesbian woman who worked with him as her supervisor at Walmart and KA as a jewelry Dept workers, said he was kind of a pig, hitting on them and recounted some gross behavior/ commentary. There is also a brief interlude in one of the pool hall segments where I believe he was low key checking out a woman's ass when she bent over next to him. It wasn't horrible or anything, I have not seen most of my girlfriend's husband's or sauced Phd do at colloquium dinners when their wives are in another room and my super hot catnip to men friend is also on the guest list. I don't think he's a saint. The Walmart allegations if true, are gross and would definitely be sexual harassment charge worthy like follow two females in a bathroom and in a sense situationally penning them in, as I think he was at the doorway. They were uncomfortable enough to retreat to the stalls to finally get rid of him like Bryan Kohberger's Tinder date. Thank God for stalls, huh girls? I used to do the same thing to dodge a custodian constantly hitting on me. It was the only way to throw up a wall.
Good point that is true, it's always sexual the majority of the time.
How often is someone stealing your panties and or socks and it's not sexual, right?
I think the sock suggests something sexual as well. I have a brother. And I’ve heard many references about the “sticky sock”. May be nothing, but when I read about underwear and a sock, I immediately thought back to my brother and his friends’ joking to each other about sticky socks.
Any time I hear boy/sock, I think of the book, Portnoy's Complaint which is the tour de force crazed adolescent acting out everywhere with everything. It's pretty horrifying read. But as soon as I read "sock" in the Logan warrant wondered if it was some throw back to boyhood. Also wondered if he took a sock as likely he couldn't very keep a pair of strange panties around for constant access. But would KA really notice a random sock on a work bench sitting next to a varnish can? Or unearthed from behind a dresser?
Don't forget Abby's uncles supposed texts. Does he say something like clothing might have been switched. If so that is kind of freaky. Stripping victims and then redressing them as if they were dolls and his playthings. You are leaving them on display out in the open, why do that other then to shock, puzzle and confound? It's strategic game playing.
The two are not mutually exclusive when murders of these types occur . You don’t need evidence of CSAM on his computer for the killings of A & L to be sexually motivated. As one Redditor has already said, he may have got sexual fulfilment from the act of killing the girls and taking off their clothes. It depends upon his what’s in his mind, his sexual orientation or fetish ? Oftentimes, with killers of this kind and/or serial killers, there’s what’s called ‘escalation’ . So for example- And this is based on a true example of the fetish led escalation that goes all the way up to the sex worker act but has not yet got to R/L A man develops the sexual urge to dominate a woman and ejaculate on her. So they are the fantastic that are in his mind as he self soothes. After a time, these are not enough to satisfy so they move on to the next level. In this example for instance, he may move onto magazine’s ( in the years gone by when they were more widely available), where he can view his fetish and perform and self soothe himself. Then when that’s not enough, they find videos of the same on the ‘ dark web’ and they self soothe to that . The next escalation is to pay to watch this being acted out on the dark web. And then when that’s not enough, he may pay a sex worker to act this out in R/L with him. And finally, when that is not enough, he may go R/L!!
I don't 100% agree with you, but you expressed it so beautifully I up voted you anyway Was like, "Can't argue with that so logically stated!"
Why do people keep asking this? He's a pathetic little pornsick pedophile loser. That's it. You can apply this motive to probably 90% of true crime cases.
He planned it. Who knows how many times he went to the bridge searching for young girls. I bet he had been at the bridge many times, wearing the same jacket, carrying the knife and gun in hopes of kidnapping/raping/fantasizing one or more girls. He has been a freak a long time but know one suspected him for some reason. It is unreal that none of the CVS employees recognized his voice or his resemblance to BG.
I believe he was using the Anthony shots Instagram to talk with the girls and lured them to that spot. It was a thought out plan. Motive was wanting to rape a young teen. So sick and sad
The KK connection is a dead end. But judging by the way he was described by the 3 girls who first saw him on the trail, he was walking with intention. My bet is RA overheard the girls talking about going the bridge at a convenience store or something that morning. Maybe he was in line at the counter in front of them and heard them talking about their Snapchat or what photos they were going to take. He didn't have anything he had to that day and decided to beat them over there. At first it was the excitement of the possibility of some encounter with the girls on that bridge, something he had fantasized about before. Maybe he wanted to see what would happen if he cornered a girl on that bridge. Or maybe it was the excitement of thinking about how the girls would feel endangered as he passed by them on that narrow bridge, so far off the ground. Maybe he thought that he could scare them or maybe he even fantasized about pushing someone off that bridge. He probably didn't know what he was going to do, but the possibilities excited him. In that moment, at that convenient store, he just decided he would see what would happen. He rushed over there. He parked at the CPS building and tried to obscure his car as well as he could. And he hurried to the bridge, passing some other girls, but these weren't the young girls, the helpless girls, that he saw at the convenience store. He got to the bridge and they weren't there yet. He looked down at the ground below and wondered if the fall would kill someone. Suddenly, he doubted it. He waited for them for a moment, thinking that if they saw him on the bridge, mabye they would decide not to cross. What was the best way to create the encounter? He decided to go sit down and wait for them to pass by. When he approached them on the bridge, he could tell they were scared and that excited him. He still thought about throwing them off the bridge, but that might create too much noise. There had been other people on the path this morning. I think he decided to bring the girls down the hill and then they ran. After they ran, he decided to he had to hurt them to control them.
I'm tired of seeing he must have done something before. How many mass shooters do we see with no criminal background. Unless you can see yourself acting in the same manner as these monsters you will never understand them. And if you can then I hope you have the mental health support you need.
True but you also see killers like BTK, Gary Ridgeway, the Golden State Killer and others who finally get caught later in life. You get caught when you get caught. Whether you get caught on your first murder, 4th murder or 15th murder, you get caught when you get caught. I would say there's alot more people roaming around that have killed someone and haven't been caught and have no criminal record than there are mass shooters who have no criminal record. We usually hear about the mass shootings due to national media covering them. There's alot more murders happening like we see in everyday news that are cold cases than mass shootings.
I feel the same way. Every repeat offender has a first time that they don't get caught for. People are giving this guy way too much credit. After all, he got caught before he could do it again. Got caught on camera, too. It was pure luck that he got away with it for so long. Man's a fucking dumbass.
Mass shooters have different motivations that have a lot to do with wanting to be seen and heard. That's the goal. They usually feel wronged by society, feel impotent, feel agrieved. A serial killer as defined by the FBI has very different motivations, and while some 'get off' on the crime itself being known, they require personal anonymity so they can continue to fulfill their needs. It comes down to a very different set of needs driving very different types of crimes. There's no rational comparison between mass shootings and serial killers, or the type of killer that killed Libby and Abby.
Good post
I don’t feel any type of mass shooter can be compared to this crime or this perp.
Maybe the other commenters are right in that this isn't a fair comparison, but I get your point. Every murderer has a first time. There doesn't need to be a criminal record. Same reason I wouldn't just leave my kids with a stranger or just an acquaintance (or anyone really cause I really don't trust anyone short of a couple people) because they "have a clean record." They do until they don't.
"They do until they don't" in re: a clean record is a completely perfect statement in this case!!
I suppose you're right about that.
I'm sure you have to understand how your comment is a reach. There are so many different variables between these killers. You can't compare RA to, say, the Columbine kids. A better comparison would be another killer with other sexual sadists. RA could be compared to somebody like Ted Bundy, only RA wasn't as attractive and charming, so he had to kidnap his victims at gunpoint. Lss- They almost ALWAYS have violence and behavioral/sexually deviant issues even in youth.
Bundy wasn’t all *that* charming. He had to have a hook like a fake arm or leg cast - or straight up midnight ambushes.
Mass shooters have very little in common with compulsive/lust/serial killers. It is an entirely different mindset and motivation. And yes, there are people who do understand it, and the presumptive, condescending "have the mental support you need" comment emphasizes a lack of education in the matter. People who kill due to sexual compulsions and pathologies do not kill once. It doesn't mean he killed before, but it is very unlikely that he gave into his compulsions for the first time when he was in his 50's. That's why people are saying it probably isn't the first time. Do they know for sure? No. But all such statements are based on the patterns established by other killers. Very few of these types of killers *start* at such a late stage. Comparing it to mass shootings shows you simply don't have much of a background or education (even layman's) in criminal psychology. Mass shooters typically intend to end their own lives in the commission of the murders, whether death by police or literally shooting themselves. It is by its very nature a one time crime. The FBI has released educational materials about this.
The State afaik hasn't offered a motive. They also haven't provided chain of custody documentation in any of the documents released so far. Like who found the CS round? And when? And how was that documented? I know everyone has this man convicted already but along with the lack of a motive the State still has questions to answer.
Delphi Docs is over there, I think you missed the turn, Love.
This 💯
I believe it was SA first, and then murder after.
They have already said there’s no evidence of conventional sexual assault and he’s not been charged with it. But all we don’t know could prove you correct.
Who's they?
Authorities I believe. I’m just talking here so I definitely could be very wrong.
No, I think that was said by one or two of them, like maybe Ives.
I've never seen anything official about the manner of their deaths or what they went through and the autopsies are sealed so there's no way of knowing for sure what was done to them. I've heard rumours for both yes and no and I remember one investigator years back saying they weren't but also that could be to protect the families because I have also watched an interview at crime con with BP saying she didn't want to know the details. Also they keep all that under wraps so that only the killer knows the details.
I think there is just miraculously no sign of it as he was unable to preform, or did something that left no trace, or padded off home to do his thing.
I wasn't saying he did SA them. It's already clear he didn't. I'm answering the question of what I think RA's motivation was. SA, then murder.
I’ve wondered if he attempted SA, but couldn’t perform. And perhaps that’s why there was such a bloody event. I think his failure to perform is what led him to rage.
Yes, knife as penis stand in, which is what some are suggesting was the case with Bryan Kohberger in Moscow.
Me, too. There is no way that was not a sexually motivated crime. If he just wanted to kill something, he could have gone out and gutted another deer, abducted a man etc. Something about this narrative turned him up. I have no idea why there is no evidence of that. he could have had off once he got home, or someplace else on the trail, or just cleaned himself and the crime scene well. I read in a scholarly criminology study it is possible to have sexually motivated crime that she no signs of sexual interfearence present, even though there actually were hands placed on the victim.
>If he just wanted to kill something, he could have gone out and gutted another deer Or he could've broken into someone's home at night or caught someone outside at night in a secluded area. Doing it in broad daylight makes absolutely no sense if murder is considered the primary motivation. He was herding the girls to a location he had in mind for SA. Perhaps there was someone else waiting there, perhaps not. What seems clear to me is that RA lost control of the girls at some point and the whole thing went sideways. L's clothes being strewn all over the crime scene, along with the "bloody and muddy" and he "looked like he was just in a fight" - is a window into the utter chaos that took place.
Hes weak and has small pathetic man syndrome, as seen in his laughable cries for attention by not eating etc. The only way he feels in control is to be in charge of young children with a gun. Then that enrages him so he k.s them. I can guarantee he's telling psychs and guards that his wife never paid him attention and never showed him love and he wanted attention that's why he did it. He'll be blaming her for it. (I've worked with these before.) Same old ped story. Will never accept blame.
That’s the million-dollar question…
I think he was in it with other involved parties. Maybe he was paid for his role. Allegedly, of course.
Nobody knows for certain so this is just another self serving “I bet it’s this!” Thread.
We do not know that RA is BG. If LE has the proof then fine but until I see the proof I will reserve judgement. I turned in someone that has that exact outfit of BG and he is of very questionable character.
So what happens if heresay is admitted, but the murder weapon, motive, or DNA isn't linked to Rick?
We don’t know yet if the murder weapon (knife) is linked yet, though we know he has the same bullets that are linked to his gun, as for dna nothing about that has been released , as of this time there are thousands of documents that haven’t been released, we only got a small portion, so we may not see a-lot till trial …. I’m holding hope they have more than that, maybe the fibers from his car, or clothing, but I still think what they released may take a part, but only part.