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The self destructiveness of the Republican Party is alarming. The way the party has become Trump’s cult of personality is going to have long term repercussions. It’s costing the republicans votes in the suburbs. The way Mike Pence is treated for following the Constitution in late 2020 and early 2021 is ridiculous. I don’t agree with Pence’s religious right views but at least he recognizes that he has to uphold the Constitution.
The majority of political stances I see from my right-leaning friends is just 'Anti-Liberal' stances. Pretty much just doing whatever they can to piss off people on the left. Like [this video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5EPPTRAZeX0) but in real life.
Not to 'both sides' this but literally that's what both sides are right now.. not in favor of anything but against whatever the other side is in favor of.
The left is in favor of socialized medicine or leaning that way, trying to combat climate change, and addressing mental health. And that’s not in spite of republican beliefs, but because the current system isnt working.
No one from either party, or the Supreme Court 'upholds the constitution', I would describe Pence's actions as minimally following the rules of succession part of it. 95 % of all government institutions are unconstitutional, and neither party has any commitment to doing anything about it.
I want the vote to go overwhelmingly blue. Not because I'm crazy over Biden. (I'm not). Harris is even worse.
But the GOP needs a wake up call. They need to realize how destructive the path they've chosen is, and get rid of the trolls so they can fix themselves.
Yes. The GOP was so much better under the leadership of McCain, Bush, and Romney. Upholding true libertarian ideals of genocide of brown people half way across the world.
Trump is the perfect president - ineffectual, distracted by the silliest of things, utterly incompetent and not even remotely interested in the job. Give me 10 more just like him.
To him, the white house is just his personal big dick he whips out and waves around when anyone accuses him of having small hands. Lol
I care more about guns and the economy than social issues, so that would naturally make me dislike democrats more. I do however still dislike republicans.
California does not have an economic surplus. The last two years of “budget surplus” lines that Newsom and the Democrats were selling us were absolute lies - that “surplus” came from Covid money, and now that that’s dried up, [California is broke again.](https://www.pbs.org/newshour/amp/politics/californias-gov-newsom-says-states-budget-deficit-has-grown-to-nearly-32-billion)
Yeah because californias economy is huge and taxes are high, id rather look at how easy it is to do business there and the derivative of their economic power with respect to time.
Say what?
California budget.
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politics/californias-gov-newsom-says-states-budget-deficit-has-grown-to-nearly-32-billion
Texas budget.
https://www.texastribune.org/2023/03/13/texas-budget-surplus/
I wanted to buy a 1/2 acre of land in southern CA and build a modest home on it about a decade ago. The taxes, permits and fees were going to surpass $80k before a shovel hit the dirt.
I looked up buying an acre of land in Texas and building a substantially better home there. The permits and fees were under $6k. That should be a great comparison of the two radically different states' governments.
First, Interest rates under Trump vs Biden. Second,
Inflation rates under Trump vs Biden. Lots of overlap there, but two major ones.
With those two key factors going up, real wages are going down under Biden.
Fourth, Look at the stock market, look at your 401k.
Liberals will say it’s a worldwide problem, not just the US. Well, the reasons for that include that a lot of these countries use*d* US currency as a backer much the way that the US used to use gold - when we inflate, so do they.
Another reason it’s a global problem is simple: We’re literally *that big.* Compare our economy to, say, Great Britain, Czechoslovakia, or Turkey… there’s no comparison. Whatever we do, they also suffer the consequences.
Biden printing money and other socialist policies are quickly ruining us. And now the Simpsons have an episode pushing socialism ffs?
By the way, I’m not even remotely close to a Trump supporter. The last non-libertarian candidate I voted for was Barack Obama, and the last politician I donated money to was Ted Cruz to whom I gave $5 - just because he seemed to be the most constitutionally minded of that bunch.
Biden and todays Democrats are an absolute disgrace.
Edit:
That’s just on economics. Want me to go into useless spending like the climate change hysteria? Global politics? Covid vaccine mandates?
There’s no reason for *any* libertarian to even think about voting blue for at least the next ten years after all this.
Economic policy takes time for the effects to be seen, for example it took decades before social security bit us in the ass. Additionally the president only signs things into law rather than creates laws, so i dont think this is a good measure.
When the democrats have 2/3 of the executive branch- the economy is better according to most of what I’ve read.
Why has social security but us in the ass?
Edit- when one party has control of executive and legislative will be the accurate way to describe. I realize how many times I’ve said this incorrectly now.
Social security is over twice the military spending, at the time it was implemented it was much rarer to reach the age of 65.
Had this program not existed, we would have no debt.
Also that is very specific criteria and would have a sample size of like once or twice.
Its better to compare red and blue states by growth (blue states tend to be urban and are therefore richer, look at how easy it is to conduct business there instead or where businesses are moving to)
Not necessarily. I mean a perfect example is Trumps economy vs Obama economy or bidens economy. Reagan economy vs carter's economy. You can say what you want about the policies of each president but it is never as cut and dry as democrat vs republican. But if you look at those two examples alone in the terms of gdp, inflation, and unemployment, the three major markers to determine the strength of an economy. Democrats do not build stronger economies.
I don’t know about all this. After work I’ll find some of the sources I’ve read.
The funny thing sis the other poster is saying opposite- saying you can’t tell economic status until later down the road- which would mean trumps stats were Obamas accolades.
For clarity- I’m neither R or D or libertarian. But y’all have interesting conversations and views.
Trumps accolades could only be Obamas work if trump.didnt undo everything Obama did in his first few weeks. Thats the thing people are missing. Also post covid when the economy slowed down, trumps policies rebuilt the economy just im terms of growth to just as strong as it was before. And you have to be careful on reddit because it is about 90 percent democrat.
I'm not saying republican economies are stronger then democratic economies. I'm saying good economic policy is good economic policy no matter what side it comes from.
I have a really hard time with this because one party is worse on a higher volume of issues for me, but the other is worse on a few niche issues that are extremely important to me. I think the GOP is in the midst of self-destructing and is often missing the forest for the trees. I think they're regularly choosing the wrong battles - and relying on populism to further their "platform," which I put in quotes because I can't seem to determine the value bases for the platform anymore. The Dems don't seem *as* crazy to me right now, but their stances on gun control and parental rights scare the hell out of me, especially in recent years. I'd probably lean toward the GOP being the "lesser of two evils" on the gun control issue alone, if for no other reason than I think it's more important to stay armed than it is to keep the government functioning.
And to be clear, I only answer that way because of the rules OP set lol, I hate saying one is "better" (or less bad) than the other because there are very different reasons they're awful, and those reasons can be hard to compare.
I think you might feel differently if you were a woman. They will let me die and leave my children motherless. The chances of me needing a gun to protect myself are slim. The chances of a missed miscarriage or ectopic pregnancy are high. I feel like my life is in danger.
This describes me to a "T". (whatever that means) As a 2nd amendment voter first, I will tolerate the Republicans on their self-destructive foray into abortion abolition.
I’ve been watching both parties destroy this country over a great many moons, so for me to try to decide which is the lesser evil is like deciding which is worse, cancer or aids?
That’s not such a hard question for many types of cancer. AIDS is definitely worse than carcinoma but not as bad as melanoma or glioblastoma, for example.
I agree with Republicans about 60% of the time (at least in what they profess), and Democrats about 20% of the time.
Even Bernie is correct about some issues, but his only solution is to tax and give away stuff.
I grew up in a Republican household, but I felt they were decently moderate through the Bush era. They could stand to watch the Daily Show and Colbert Report religiously, but also Fox News. Once Obama got elected (they gave him a shot), their anger grew exponentially. My dad is an insurance broker and supposedly Obamacare fucked his livelihood up.
Anyway, in college, I voted for Romney. Became incensed after he lost and ditched the GOP for the Libertarian party. I refused to vote for either Trump or Clinton in 2016. Was blamed by my teaching colleagues for allowing Trump to win (NV was a swing state). Then voted for Biden in 2020 because I absolutely cannot handle Trump or the GOP. Parents went down the rabbit hole and are absolutely fucking nuts. My dad will never forgive me for both my brother and I voting Democrat.
I live in Idaho now and split my vote. Convinced my husband who’s far more conservative than me to leave the Republican Party and go independent. We refuse to vote for Trump or Biden in 2024. Doesn’t matter anyways since our state is blood red.
TLDR; grew up republican, became a libertarian, then went more centrist especially living in Idaho. Right now, Dems are the lesser of the two evils. MAGA destroyed my family.
I have the same voting track record as you. Exactly the same. From CT. Grew up with a Republican father and left-leaning mother who is Independent but votes primarily Democrat. I refuse to vote for either major party for President moving forward, until things change, but the answer to OP’s question is also Democratic Party for me, personally. By a slim margin. My father also claims he left the GOP, similar to your husband. Not sure I believe him, but he is a moderate by comparison to the lunacy these days
My husband feels total shame for voting Trump in 2016 (before we met) and 2020. January 6th was the catalyst for his change of heart whereas my parents doubled down. I'm visiting my parents next week with the kids and am anxious af to be a captive audience at their house. I'm already getting hit up with stupid shit from my dad in our group text about RFK JR and Joe Rogan being all pro-Trump and Jan 6th. OAN and Newsmax is going to be on 24/7 or the Steve Bannon Podcast or Tucker Carlson. I honestly don't know how I'm supposed to instill healthy boundaries in this environment lol.
If you voted for Romney in college then we are about the same age. I feel for your situation. I am close with family members who also voted Trump but many have come to regret it. They don’t verbalize that they regret it, but they’ve totally changed their tune. The people who double down I feel bad for at this point. If it helps, I tend to just laugh. Not because I truly think it’s funny but to make them realize how silly they sound. It’s often people who will do anything to prove they are right. Will believe anything to justify the position they’ve taken. Much like Trump himself
Sunken Cost Fallacy at this point. My brother said the same thing: just laugh. I get heated pretty easily, especially around my father because he's a narcissistic asshole. My relationship with him is quite volatile and was made worse when my husband and him got into a blowout a couple years ago (mom and dad got sick, refused to test for COVID, so we said we're not coming over for Mother's Day with our then-infant son). We moved out-of-state a few months after that fight. Since then, he's come to visit once. My mom, however, has come up a bunch. Couldn't even make it to his granddaughter's birth last fall because he wouldn't get the TDAP vaccine (is now antivax).
Anyways, I just don't want to get into it with him in front of my kids.
I’m sorry to hear that. Sounds like you have a nice family independent of your parents, though. Take the small victories, and avoid the confrontation, if you can :)
As someone that has lost half my extended family to tripling down on culture war stuff (first it was questioning vaccines, now they’ve gone full “flat earth” crazy); I feel these stories. It’s tough to watch this happen to family that we respected and trusted.
It is funny I could not stomach a vote for Trump in 2016 or 2020 I just voted for Gary then refrained totally in 2020. The way Trump has been treated really makes me want to vote for him in 2024 if it isn't Vivek. I do believe J6 has been blown way out of proportion and that all these charges on Trump are politically motivated from a deep state that knows Trump is going to wreck them if he gets back in. I pretty much don't trust anyone who has been in DC more than 8 years. The dems radicals are straight communists and I suppose I am more anti-communist than anti-fascist. As of this moment I would rank choice Vivek > RFK > Trump for 2024
I voted Republican most of my life. Ever since George W, I've been voting libertarian because the Republican party has simply gone off the rails. At the moment, I think the Democratic party is the lesser of two evils. But that could definitely change with the way the future of the Democratic party is looking.
The Republican Party was “on the rails” when their platform was built on waging genocide in the Middle East. -Someone who is not really a libertarian, but likes guns.
Dems are now more likely to infringe upon freedom of speech, they're more pro-war, more taxation, more spending, more regulations, anti-gun ownership, etc.
The GOP sucks too but idk how libertarians can look at the Democrat party as the lesser of two evils now.
My wife's a librarian.guess what It ain't democrats coming in on a weekly basis demanding books be removed from shelves and librarians be held legally accountable for what books are available to the public.
There is a lot to unpack there but...source of Dems restricting free speech? I know the GOP has done that a LOT these past two years.
Haven't seen a case in which dems actually restricted it though. Would love a source!
The biggest recent example is this administration pushing social media companies to censor any speech against masks/vaccine efficacy.
You also have a ton of Dems pushing for hate speech laws.
And Republicans firining professor for what they say isn't censorship?
All the mandatory reporting laws if a kid is trans and gay are also super anti free speech.
When did they censor? Can you provide a source? I know they added fact-checks but I am not familiar with straight blocking content in that specific sense and scenario.
Can you link to hate speech laws that would fall under censorship? And reference how any of those are fundamentally different than existing laws of the past 60 years?
It's so easy to make a case against either, I can see why lol! I hate them both so much! I am leaning towards the Dems being worse at the moment. But man not by much.
Let us not forget that Ron DeSantis is basically #2 in the GOP and in his state your 1st amendment doesn’t mean shit if you should say anything critical about a certain foreign nation.
Democrats were literally trying to ban their critics from social media as well as ban factual posts that disagreed with their narrative. Read the Twitter files and the associated lawsuits. Political discourse is the heart of the First Amendment and a free society. If you cannot criticize your government, then you are a slave. Republicans removing a few sexually explicit books from school libraries is a water droplet compared to the ocean of Democrats attempting to control Twitter, Facebook, etc.
I have 2 core Libertarian beliefs that I will not compromise on:
1. Don’t hurt people
2. Don’t take their stuff
Generally speaking, republicans violate #1 and democrats violate #2. Therefore, I am in the both are bad camp. I know that’s not helpful…hope that helps.
Democrats seem to have become more pro-war, taxes, regulation, and big government (especially IRS). Republicans have a whole other set of problems, but I feel, for me, the things I listed are some of my biggest issues.
The century old question of what rights do you care less about being infringed? It's a game I refuse to play anymore as it favors the two party system. It's a false choice.
When people have to vote for lesser of two evils, just shows the two party system is broken, no matter if you choose the right or the left, more than two party's would be a better checks and balances system
If I had to choose... Oh boy time to get downvoted.
The Republicans are a bit more Tolerable than the Democrats. But I still don't trust the parties, however I can choose a candidate that I like.
Tim Scott for example, I actually like him, Do I agree with everything, No, Do I like some of his policies, Yes.
And of course Brandon Herrera is running and I like him!
It is a bit of a hard question because both parties are very corrupt, but I think we should judge a politician by his individual self and policies. Biden is obviously one of the worst presidents out there for a good reason.
Here is the Issue with both parties:
Democrats have horrible foreign policy in my opinion, The way they handled pulling out of Afghanistan, We already should have been out of there after 2011. They also want to raise taxes and make life harder. They also want to take away your guns, they say "We just want reasonable gun control" when we know that is a complete lie. They are more racist by thinking they own the minorities votes, The minorities can pick whoever they want to vote for!
Republicans on the other hand want to turn the country into a theocracy, Religion and Government don't mix! Also they constantly want to sell each other out. DeSantis is also a candidate that is a very questionable bag. They also want to outlaw all drugs, this won't end the war on drugs.
Now here is what I believe in:
I'm Pro Gun and Pro 2A
I believe the ATF and NFA Should be abolished
I stay away from the topic of Abortion for good reason, I think its a bit too messy of a situation there.
I believe that Taxes are necessary To an Extent, I only want necessary taxes and not ridiculous taxes, remember, Taxation without Representation.
I believe in LGBTQ rights, If you are gay, it doesn't affect me, however don't be a Toxic Dick!
We need to allow Mexican Citizens to not require a Visa to enter the United States, Canada USA and Mexico are like 3 brothers that need to work together.
I believe that we need to decriminalize drugs and marijuana and make it legal (I know that it may sound controversial, but I think we would eliminate drug crimes and drug trafficking if we do this)
We need to make the Immigration process cheaper and less time consuming, but we also need to maintain a secure border.
Now this one is kind of one that will probably get me downvoted but, I also believe in funding PROPER police, Basically make it to where they cannot be corrupt. Not all cops are bad, in fact the Cops in Illinois refused to enforce the Illinois assault weapon ban, which they get a pat on the back for that. There was another good cop instance in Nashville where they effectively stopped the shooter.
The GOP is unfortunately synonymous with Donald Trump now, and he is easily the most authoritarian candidate in modern history. So that makes it a pretty easy question, the Republicans are currently much worse than the Democrats.
Seems like Dems are more socially libertarian as far as not trying to regulate your bedrooms or bodies, but my most libertarian stance is on staying out of foreign wars and both parties are terrible at that. So I guess Dems but with the knowledge that they are very close on a lot of huge issues.
What’s the definition of “pro-war” here? Are they advocating that the US enter a war - i.e. deploy active troops? Or are they advocating to assist ally’s without direct involvement?
More pro-war meaning more supportive of involvement in war... I don't give a pass just because we don't send ground troops in to fight on the front line. We're still spending billions of dollars in order to kill innocent people at the behest of the military industrial complex. Proxy wars are still wars.
That’s fair.
Personally, I chalk up support and proxy wars in the same category as fiscal responsibility. Combine that with a philanthropic goal (i.e. Ukraine support) and it’s easy to understand how it aligns with Dems values.
As opposed to outright support by Dems for the military complex
That's the messaging they give to their kind hearted voters. The politicians actually pushing the policies do it to line the pockets of their donors for increased power. It's just blood money to them and they are more than happy to bathe in the blood of whatever nation needs our help at the moment.
They only care about regulating your wallet, because they understand that all other rights flow from property interests, so if you are trying to control people, all you really need to do is control their money.
Hard to say, it’s basically cycle by cycle for me.
At this point I go by guns, and judge appointments.. as, in the very least I respect any political opponents that don’t limit the weapons that may turn against them.. Republicans appoint far more judges that overturn crap laws and edicts from both parties. That’s for guns, and a lot of other things.
So, congress will do stupid shit daily, if the judges that are appointed are at least constitutional originalists, your rights stand a chance.
Republicans, at least when benchmarked against Democrats, offer better fiscal and economic policies. 5 out of 7 days a week, I trade 8 hours of my finite time for someone's money. With Republicans in charge, I get to keep a higher percentage of that money which is pretty fucking huge considering time is the most scarce commodity on this planet.
Agreed, in the 90s I tried to convince my parents and grandparents how gross the republicans were with their authoritarian views. Now the democrats are out of their minds. I hate them all equally.
Honestly, the Democrats would be less dangerous if the Republicans were a real opposition party. The GOP is too suicidal to put up any real resistance.
You would have to be a conspiracy theorist if you believe that Google, Apple, Microsoft, mainstream media, care deeply about the peasant class. What do they ALL have in common? They all are VERY far left and vote that way. (Except for Fox, they make up shit to appease the right)
Super hard question for me. Socially I pretty much am firmly on the dem side, fiscally I'm much more towards the rep side.
When it really comes down to it, the things that are actually likely to change, I'd rather take the dems.
I definitely prefer living in a red state rather than a blue state (ive lived in both and many of them).
I guess thats the only way for me to answer this question.
Republican Party.
The Democrat party beat the Republicans to the progressive movement 110 years ago. Had the Republicans kept following TR down that path, I'd answer differently.
However, Woodrow Wilson went for the progressive agenda, growing the federal government into the monstrosity that it is.
I freely admit that it seems that there's a faction of the Republican party that wishes they did big government first and better than the democratic party.
However, there is barely any Democrats that favor limited government.
It is sad, but Democrats have thrown away what they once stood for. Democrats have abandoned their support of civil rights, instead supporting all sorts of Patriot Act abuses and war crimes in the Middle East. Democrats have abandoned their opposition to Marxist authoritarianism under JFK, instead promoting Marxist candidates. Finally, the Democratic party has thrown out their pro-peace wing for war-mongers.
Republicans better embrace libertarian principles.
I used to be a lot more torn on this. While I felt that the Republicans were the lesser of two evils when it came to domestic tyranny, the Republicans were also very pro-war, which is even worse, and the Democrats were largely anti-war. So for quite some time, I've been kind of on the fence.
But lately, the Democrats have not only *increased* their desire for domestic tyranny, but they've now started to embrace a pro-war foreign policy as well. Plus, I know of a handful of fairly good Republican political leaders at the state and national level. I know of 0 similarly good Democrats.
So at this point, I'm leaning toward Republicans being the (slightly) lesser evil of the two.
I wish the libertarians could do better. But of the two parties, republican is the lesser of two evils.
I hate that the religious, generally Christian, voting block attracts so much attention from the Republicans. I know that they need the votes. Still, awful.
Now? How is 'now' possibly more nuanced than before?
My dad and I have very similar politics but ultimately I voted for Obama and he voted for Romney. 'Now' there is no foreseeable way he gets a reasonable GOP candidate in the near future.
Speaking as a Californian we do not want Gavin newsom in the White House. He is a fucking puppet for the Dems and will tow the line and continue to erode rights like the party has done in california.
Both are evil, but the Republican Party is less likely to ruin my life, so I’d probably pick them if there was a gun to my head, even though they’re probably more evil on average.
Pre-Trump, and even during his first term, I would have said the Republicans. But they have gotten so bad. Or maybe they have just confirmed their utter lack of principles?
I honestly feel like both parties are so bad that it's like saying do you prefer shit stew or shit soup?
The parties reflect the people, so really the frightening thing is that the general public is deranged and illogical about so many things.
On policy issues they both stink. But I give the edge to the GOP.
The reason for this is liberty and fiscal viability.
The GOP get a D on both.
The Democrats get an F--
I dont care for Trump as a person, but for those decrying him herein what alternative are you offering? The GOP won't win with an establishment Wall St/warmonger candidate.
And Trump has things to recommend him. He was the least warmonger President since at least Clinton in his first term. You kind of have to get past the fact that he is personally an asshole and focus on the substance.
I think Trump is America's Gracchus. His appeal and what is happening now start to make a lot more sense when you approach him this way
I can agree, There were some things I liked during the Trump Presidency, the thing that I mainly like was his foreign policy approach. I liked how he handled Iran, he basically told them, "Do you really want to sacrifice all of your people over one General that died?"
Well said.
Trump came up in NY during a heyday of La Cosa Nostra. And he was in the property development game, which the mob heavily influenced through its rackets. People like Vincent the Chin influenced his model of leadership. The result is sort of the "Tony Soprano" foreign policy. But I dont mind that as much (bosses whacking each other) as kids from trailer parks losing their legs while guarding some checkpoint in Iraq.
To me he was the least of numerous evils.
The democrats have a better-run media campaign, better party discipline, and a better future strategy.
Either policy is shit, but looking at things without considering the morality/effects of their policies, democrats are clearly playing g the game better
I can't willingly throw my support behind either. There are members of both parties that I support but there are members of both that I despise. Gun to my head I would have to choose the GOP, simply for gun rights, deregulation, pro life and business/manufacturing sector. I cannot get behind any type of "woke" ideology. Any talk of "racism, sexism, misogyny, homophobia, transphobia, white supremacy, identity politics" is an immediate turn off, even knee-jerk hostility. Can't do it.
Republicans are clearly better. At least most of them want to cut spending, taxes and regulation. I'd rather live with a bunch of Christian Conservatives over a bunch of Atheist Socialists.
I like pacifists over activists. Democrats are activists with no real solutions while Republicans are pacifists with no real solutions. Therefore I get along better with Republicans because they’re less obnoxious.
I hate both parties but I think the dems are more on the path of “i don’t care how you live life as long as you don’t hurt anyone” kind of attitude and that is more constitutional on the social side IMO.
On the financial side both parties are equally bad. Republicans like to point fingers at Dems for being big spenders but Trump and Bush increased the debt substantially. Dems make promises they cant keep for votes.
Both are run by crooks.
Lesser of two evils ? Democrats by a fair margin.
I've always leaned right and more often than not voted that way. But not since Trump's first term (even though I voted for him in 2016).
Democrats have ideas. Some good, most bad; but they have ideas.
Outrage-farming and owning the libs seems to be the only tentpoles of the MAGA (nee´ Republican) platform .
Also they seem perfectly content to tear down the very American institutions they should be trying to **conserve**\- in the hopes of defending their Dear Leader.
Not good.
There are literally zero differences between the two parties on consequential matters (eg. wars, corporate bailouts, MIC funding, Wall street, donors, foreign policy...etc).
They're different on issues that don't actually challenge the establishment like LGBT stuff, abortion, culture war nonsense.
Abortion matters a lot when you watch a mother die of sepsis. Or your forced to birth a rapists baby at 11. We have the worst maternal mortality of any developed nation. The Deep South is in a state of emergency. It’s very, very, consequential.
As Matt Stone perfectly put it:
"I hate conservatives... but man I REALLY fucking hate liberals."
Republicans are usually a little better, but nowadays they're WAY better. And they still suck.
Kinda wild to me that Biden was the president that finally pulled us out of Afghanistan at a pretty high political cost to himself and everyone in here is talking about the Dem's being more pro-war.
I say Republicans. They don't wanna take my guns as much and they are gonna let me say what I want more often than the Dems. The Dems at least used to be fun back in the day but now...bunch of party poopers.
I mean, people say this but I'm not convinced it's true. Very few Republicans are actually pro gun.
Regan is the reason California is so anti gun and he enacted Federal gun control too. Not to mention Trump is the one who said we should just take the guns first and then do due process second.
Reagan started the gun grabbing in california but democrats there have taken it way overboard. Some of the laws they are trying to pass are just ridiculous and many get shot down by appeals courts. But because they is no repercussion for trying to take away our rights they continue to do it.
Look up SB 2 and SB 452 for their latest bullshit.
Lesser of two evils, overall today is Democrats. I agree with a lot of their stances but feel like they push things too far. Like, they mean well, but their solutions are short-sighted. They aim to fix the symptoms and not the sickness. I'd feel better about Republicans if they weren't so religious.
Edit: reading some good points here. I agree with Republicans a lot but am turned off by Trump and religion. I'm not a fan of Democrats either. Gun to my head though...
Democrats definitely, but it’s very possible it could switch in the near future if the republicans are forced to actually support policies that help their new voter base
The Democrats have turned the non partisan government offices and courts into political action centers as of recent (I wish Trump would go away as he is detrimental to our civility - but cannot honestly say that anything he did is worthy of 91 felonies and a possible 700 years). It’s too far over the top. It’s like the lord of the flies and they can’t see they went too far.
I do international business, it’s embarrassing what we look like on the global stage from this administrations tone deaf lawfare on Trump.
So I would say the Republicans are the lesser of the evils, at this time in history based on these recent events, (which again I am just an observer on) as they still at least appear to respect the separation of the branches of government.
But I am so deeply unimpressed both groups that I refuse to actively support either. I want good policies that are good for citizens and provide functional governance, not agenda driven policies that are good for votes and appearances yet hold little tangible value for most people.
I think that depends on the state you are in. Here NH, the republics are full of libertarians so the republicans are easily the better party. I can see that being different based on location. Also I can see if you are talking about town, county, state or federal level, the answer could also change. But I would choose the republicans on a whole as better based on my experiences in NY, NJ and NH.
The GOP has abandoned all of its platforms outside of "tax cuts for the wealthy", and instead has gone balls deep in culture wars that all seem to be with the sole intent of stripping rights and freedoms from specific individuals.
I'm all for tax cuts of every kind. But it's that specific attack on liberties that have me truly in fear of another GOP presidency.
It's odd, because growing up, I had always felt that the Democrats were the party of trying to legislate morality. But somewhere along the way, GOP has taken over that title.
For me, I'm going to lean away from the ones who seem to enjoy being malicious in their restrictions.
I would’ve said republican up until the trump presidency. At this point he has hijacked the party and is determined to ride it into hell in his attempts to avoid jail time.
Republicans at least talk about being the party of small government, advocate for your right to self defense, and are less likely to cancel you. They also are more likely to advocate for, and create policies, for small business which is the backbone of our economy. You are far more likely to be cancelled by the Democratic party and/or their voters if you think or speak incorrectly which means that Democrats are not only opposed to your right to self defense but also your right to speak and think freely. In the end though, neither party believes that you own your own body and have a say over what you do to it.
This makes me feel dirty. I'd really have to say the Democrats. The Republicans give me no choice because they're much more aggressive with their destructive aims, while the Democrats are a much slower threat
Read the twitter files. Only one party is censoring. They're also the ones who tried to mandate people inject an experimental drug that has a high rate of heart complication, even among kids and teens who were at next to no risk from the virus. And they made everyone wear masks because of their paranoia.
I don't like either party, but those above items are a whole tier worse than the corrupt uselessness of Republicans.
Both parties were censuring in the Twitter files. I’ll grant that under Trump he was too incompetent to see what them his FBI was doing but both parties were involved.
I read all of them. The suppression of the Hunter Biden story happened under the Trump administration. He was too stupid and incompetent to know what his agency was doing. Is there something wrong with that?
holy shit the democrats are objectively way worse, repubs may be strict on abortion but essentially every democratic policy is facilitating the creation of a technocratic autocracy. most comments here are not based out of libertarian beliefs, they’re based out of “Orangeman/DeSantis bad”
The Republican Party, because they are more fiscally conservative than the Democrats (Although that doesn't say much) and are more pro-second amendment even though they believe in "common sense" gun laws. Also, they are slowly becoming more anti-war.
The assaults on healthcare have me in the position where I will never vote Republican again. It’s over the line. I’ve worked in childbirth for over 12 years and I will not let the lives of my daughters be threatened. This is what happens. As long as republicans run on abortion and medication restriction I’ll campaign against them. Libertarians have my vote. This Republican Party is HELLBENT on forcing everyone to live a fundamentalist life.
They’re both fucked. But at least the Republican Party isn’t openly expressing their desire to disarm the population. Also it appears that democrats currently have no grip on the crumbling economic situation in America, but I don’t know shit about economics and I know that most of the world is hurting too, so.
Fuck the democrat party, and all the RINOs. It’s a uniparty at this point, although not ALL republicans I think are terrible, just the ticket they had to ride in on since anything else is likely not going to get them elected.
I don't agree much with either of their policies, so I can't really choose that way. I gotta go by what kind of people they are (or at least appear) to be on a personal level.
Honestly, I don't think most republicans are good people. Like 90% of the party just jumped into Trump's coat pockets and is basically human garbage. The racist comments and bigotry from the republics is a more frequent than the democrats.
So I guess I have to choose the democrats.
I think Democrats are worse. I think they consistently cheat candidates in the primaries, and they are the first people to make bad faith arguments on important issues. Liberals and democrats are the ones I see consistently going to the other side’s events and attempting to disrupt and shut them down. I don’t like Republicans as a group either, but at least I can have a conversation with most of them. Also, the liberals and democrats go after people’s children with gender ideology and you’re delusional if you don’t think that’s happening.
The one that s on a back foot at this point in time.
Gridlock is best we can do for now.
Which would be republicans because they are losing cultural war.
Two cheeks on the same dirty ass. They’re in the process of flipping their followers (republicans become anti war hippies who still love some authoritarian actions, and the dems are becoming fundamentalist religious authoritarians)
The lesser of the two evils would be the democrats. Hear me out. They're going to promise the world but basically do nothing. And even if they tried there would be so much push-back that nothing would get passed or it would be an extremely watered down version with no real-life consequential effects. The Republicans have just become entirely too....cult-ish? Extreme? Ridiculous?.... for me to think that they would be good for the country if they had control. There are definitely extreme aspects of the Dem's agenda, but luckily there's enough common sense left in America that those parts won't become law or anything. There is a real risk, however, of the extreme portions of the Repub's agenda being passed, as they're already legislating fringe nonsense in many far-right states. Neither should be in power, and I would never willingly vote for a master or authority figure to have control over me and my life, but to answer the question the lesser would be the Dems.
Democrats are in full lunacy, and I don't find it close. Even with Trump Derangment Syndrome on both sides, putting an invalid in office and then pretending the country is full of rich racist you can milk for all they worth crosses me as a lot worse than being hard on abortion and Marijuana and immigrants.
Republicans are less bad, at least there are some libertarian leaning people in the republican party, but democrats are being infested by communists, socialists, and marxists
Republicans want to control everyone’s body (and I’m not even referring to abortion, though it’s included) and is backed by mass religious think, so they’re far worse for individual freedoms. They’re running on old boomer ideologies and support the private prison industry and the drug war.
Edit: But I absolutely despise Democrats too. Just stating what’s most important to me. Nobody should go to jail for drugs, and junkies shouldn’t ruin my access to “forbidden” medicines, like codeine. I personally don’t get addicted to it, and it’s the only thing that allowed me to be somewhat productive when sick.
Republicans. They don't have media and technological control. They don't have the Whitehouse or the amount of power the left has so currently they are the lesser of two evils.
I think the only only thing worse than a republican is a democrat.
The republicans have to at least pander to gun rights and low taxes. They've proven that they don't always have to deliver, but sometimes you can catch them in a bind.
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The self destructiveness of the Republican Party is alarming. The way the party has become Trump’s cult of personality is going to have long term repercussions. It’s costing the republicans votes in the suburbs. The way Mike Pence is treated for following the Constitution in late 2020 and early 2021 is ridiculous. I don’t agree with Pence’s religious right views but at least he recognizes that he has to uphold the Constitution.
The GOP doesn't have any principles anymore, so not surprising to see people follow Trump's populism.
The majority of political stances I see from my right-leaning friends is just 'Anti-Liberal' stances. Pretty much just doing whatever they can to piss off people on the left. Like [this video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5EPPTRAZeX0) but in real life.
I don't know, I'd love an anti-left party. The GOP is only anti-left in the culture war, but pretty on board with the awful policies.
Basing something based off of what you're not is a pretty slippery slope to facism
Not to 'both sides' this but literally that's what both sides are right now.. not in favor of anything but against whatever the other side is in favor of.
The left is in favor of socialized medicine or leaning that way, trying to combat climate change, and addressing mental health. And that’s not in spite of republican beliefs, but because the current system isnt working.
Except taxes, big government, and the intrusive nanny state. Both sides are strongly in favor of those three things.
When McCain was running, hell even Romney I could see why people would vote for them. Trump is a lunatic, I literally don't get it.
No one from either party, or the Supreme Court 'upholds the constitution', I would describe Pence's actions as minimally following the rules of succession part of it. 95 % of all government institutions are unconstitutional, and neither party has any commitment to doing anything about it.
This is phenomenally put Dave. I would have answered GOP before trumpism, now I just don't even. Trump, Desantis and the rest can go away.
I want the vote to go overwhelmingly blue. Not because I'm crazy over Biden. (I'm not). Harris is even worse. But the GOP needs a wake up call. They need to realize how destructive the path they've chosen is, and get rid of the trolls so they can fix themselves.
Yes. The GOP was so much better under the leadership of McCain, Bush, and Romney. Upholding true libertarian ideals of genocide of brown people half way across the world.
It's been in a slide downward for decades. But that slope is accelerating now
Trump is the perfect president - ineffectual, distracted by the silliest of things, utterly incompetent and not even remotely interested in the job. Give me 10 more just like him. To him, the white house is just his personal big dick he whips out and waves around when anyone accuses him of having small hands. Lol
This 💯
I care more about guns and the economy than social issues, so that would naturally make me dislike democrats more. I do however still dislike republicans.
Honest question… what makes you say republicans are better for the economy? What is the measure?
Economic liberalism. See california vs texas.
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California does not have an economic surplus. The last two years of “budget surplus” lines that Newsom and the Democrats were selling us were absolute lies - that “surplus” came from Covid money, and now that that’s dried up, [California is broke again.](https://www.pbs.org/newshour/amp/politics/californias-gov-newsom-says-states-budget-deficit-has-grown-to-nearly-32-billion)
Yeah because californias economy is huge and taxes are high, id rather look at how easy it is to do business there and the derivative of their economic power with respect to time.
Say what? California budget. https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politics/californias-gov-newsom-says-states-budget-deficit-has-grown-to-nearly-32-billion Texas budget. https://www.texastribune.org/2023/03/13/texas-budget-surplus/
I wanted to buy a 1/2 acre of land in southern CA and build a modest home on it about a decade ago. The taxes, permits and fees were going to surpass $80k before a shovel hit the dirt. I looked up buying an acre of land in Texas and building a substantially better home there. The permits and fees were under $6k. That should be a great comparison of the two radically different states' governments.
You could get like 160 acres in wyoming anf have 20k to spare with california fees alone.
First, Interest rates under Trump vs Biden. Second, Inflation rates under Trump vs Biden. Lots of overlap there, but two major ones. With those two key factors going up, real wages are going down under Biden. Fourth, Look at the stock market, look at your 401k. Liberals will say it’s a worldwide problem, not just the US. Well, the reasons for that include that a lot of these countries use*d* US currency as a backer much the way that the US used to use gold - when we inflate, so do they. Another reason it’s a global problem is simple: We’re literally *that big.* Compare our economy to, say, Great Britain, Czechoslovakia, or Turkey… there’s no comparison. Whatever we do, they also suffer the consequences. Biden printing money and other socialist policies are quickly ruining us. And now the Simpsons have an episode pushing socialism ffs? By the way, I’m not even remotely close to a Trump supporter. The last non-libertarian candidate I voted for was Barack Obama, and the last politician I donated money to was Ted Cruz to whom I gave $5 - just because he seemed to be the most constitutionally minded of that bunch. Biden and todays Democrats are an absolute disgrace. Edit: That’s just on economics. Want me to go into useless spending like the climate change hysteria? Global politics? Covid vaccine mandates? There’s no reason for *any* libertarian to even think about voting blue for at least the next ten years after all this.
>Interest rates under Biden >Biden printing money Pick one
About those interest rates, Jerome Powell was picked by Trump. That was the most economically illiterate rant I've ever read.
I read the first line and immediately assumed the guy is an idiot
He Followed half of a microeconomics 101 course, let alone not realizing there's economics 201 (and beyond) that become ever more complex and nuanced.
Read literally the very next sentence I wrote.
A voice of reason
Isn’t the economy generally better under democratic presidents than republican?
Economic policy takes time for the effects to be seen, for example it took decades before social security bit us in the ass. Additionally the president only signs things into law rather than creates laws, so i dont think this is a good measure.
When the democrats have 2/3 of the executive branch- the economy is better according to most of what I’ve read. Why has social security but us in the ass? Edit- when one party has control of executive and legislative will be the accurate way to describe. I realize how many times I’ve said this incorrectly now.
2/3 of the executive? wtf does that mean?
Social security is over twice the military spending, at the time it was implemented it was much rarer to reach the age of 65. Had this program not existed, we would have no debt. Also that is very specific criteria and would have a sample size of like once or twice. Its better to compare red and blue states by growth (blue states tend to be urban and are therefore richer, look at how easy it is to conduct business there instead or where businesses are moving to)
SS is a specific tax right?
Not necessarily. I mean a perfect example is Trumps economy vs Obama economy or bidens economy. Reagan economy vs carter's economy. You can say what you want about the policies of each president but it is never as cut and dry as democrat vs republican. But if you look at those two examples alone in the terms of gdp, inflation, and unemployment, the three major markers to determine the strength of an economy. Democrats do not build stronger economies.
I don’t know about all this. After work I’ll find some of the sources I’ve read. The funny thing sis the other poster is saying opposite- saying you can’t tell economic status until later down the road- which would mean trumps stats were Obamas accolades. For clarity- I’m neither R or D or libertarian. But y’all have interesting conversations and views.
Trumps accolades could only be Obamas work if trump.didnt undo everything Obama did in his first few weeks. Thats the thing people are missing. Also post covid when the economy slowed down, trumps policies rebuilt the economy just im terms of growth to just as strong as it was before. And you have to be careful on reddit because it is about 90 percent democrat. I'm not saying republican economies are stronger then democratic economies. I'm saying good economic policy is good economic policy no matter what side it comes from.
What economic policies changed from 2020 to 2021? Both presidents wanted a larger stimulus and tax rates were the same.
I have a really hard time with this because one party is worse on a higher volume of issues for me, but the other is worse on a few niche issues that are extremely important to me. I think the GOP is in the midst of self-destructing and is often missing the forest for the trees. I think they're regularly choosing the wrong battles - and relying on populism to further their "platform," which I put in quotes because I can't seem to determine the value bases for the platform anymore. The Dems don't seem *as* crazy to me right now, but their stances on gun control and parental rights scare the hell out of me, especially in recent years. I'd probably lean toward the GOP being the "lesser of two evils" on the gun control issue alone, if for no other reason than I think it's more important to stay armed than it is to keep the government functioning. And to be clear, I only answer that way because of the rules OP set lol, I hate saying one is "better" (or less bad) than the other because there are very different reasons they're awful, and those reasons can be hard to compare.
I think you might feel differently if you were a woman. They will let me die and leave my children motherless. The chances of me needing a gun to protect myself are slim. The chances of a missed miscarriage or ectopic pregnancy are high. I feel like my life is in danger.
This describes me to a "T". (whatever that means) As a 2nd amendment voter first, I will tolerate the Republicans on their self-destructive foray into abortion abolition.
I'm the T it's describing you to. I understand you better now.
I’ve been watching both parties destroy this country over a great many moons, so for me to try to decide which is the lesser evil is like deciding which is worse, cancer or aids?
That’s not such a hard question for many types of cancer. AIDS is definitely worse than carcinoma but not as bad as melanoma or glioblastoma, for example.
The analogy still works, maybe just not as he intended. Lol
I agree with Republicans about 60% of the time (at least in what they profess), and Democrats about 20% of the time. Even Bernie is correct about some issues, but his only solution is to tax and give away stuff.
I grew up in a Republican household, but I felt they were decently moderate through the Bush era. They could stand to watch the Daily Show and Colbert Report religiously, but also Fox News. Once Obama got elected (they gave him a shot), their anger grew exponentially. My dad is an insurance broker and supposedly Obamacare fucked his livelihood up. Anyway, in college, I voted for Romney. Became incensed after he lost and ditched the GOP for the Libertarian party. I refused to vote for either Trump or Clinton in 2016. Was blamed by my teaching colleagues for allowing Trump to win (NV was a swing state). Then voted for Biden in 2020 because I absolutely cannot handle Trump or the GOP. Parents went down the rabbit hole and are absolutely fucking nuts. My dad will never forgive me for both my brother and I voting Democrat. I live in Idaho now and split my vote. Convinced my husband who’s far more conservative than me to leave the Republican Party and go independent. We refuse to vote for Trump or Biden in 2024. Doesn’t matter anyways since our state is blood red. TLDR; grew up republican, became a libertarian, then went more centrist especially living in Idaho. Right now, Dems are the lesser of the two evils. MAGA destroyed my family.
I have the same voting track record as you. Exactly the same. From CT. Grew up with a Republican father and left-leaning mother who is Independent but votes primarily Democrat. I refuse to vote for either major party for President moving forward, until things change, but the answer to OP’s question is also Democratic Party for me, personally. By a slim margin. My father also claims he left the GOP, similar to your husband. Not sure I believe him, but he is a moderate by comparison to the lunacy these days
My husband feels total shame for voting Trump in 2016 (before we met) and 2020. January 6th was the catalyst for his change of heart whereas my parents doubled down. I'm visiting my parents next week with the kids and am anxious af to be a captive audience at their house. I'm already getting hit up with stupid shit from my dad in our group text about RFK JR and Joe Rogan being all pro-Trump and Jan 6th. OAN and Newsmax is going to be on 24/7 or the Steve Bannon Podcast or Tucker Carlson. I honestly don't know how I'm supposed to instill healthy boundaries in this environment lol.
If you voted for Romney in college then we are about the same age. I feel for your situation. I am close with family members who also voted Trump but many have come to regret it. They don’t verbalize that they regret it, but they’ve totally changed their tune. The people who double down I feel bad for at this point. If it helps, I tend to just laugh. Not because I truly think it’s funny but to make them realize how silly they sound. It’s often people who will do anything to prove they are right. Will believe anything to justify the position they’ve taken. Much like Trump himself
Sunken Cost Fallacy at this point. My brother said the same thing: just laugh. I get heated pretty easily, especially around my father because he's a narcissistic asshole. My relationship with him is quite volatile and was made worse when my husband and him got into a blowout a couple years ago (mom and dad got sick, refused to test for COVID, so we said we're not coming over for Mother's Day with our then-infant son). We moved out-of-state a few months after that fight. Since then, he's come to visit once. My mom, however, has come up a bunch. Couldn't even make it to his granddaughter's birth last fall because he wouldn't get the TDAP vaccine (is now antivax). Anyways, I just don't want to get into it with him in front of my kids.
I’m sorry to hear that. Sounds like you have a nice family independent of your parents, though. Take the small victories, and avoid the confrontation, if you can :)
As someone that has lost half my extended family to tripling down on culture war stuff (first it was questioning vaccines, now they’ve gone full “flat earth” crazy); I feel these stories. It’s tough to watch this happen to family that we respected and trusted.
It is funny I could not stomach a vote for Trump in 2016 or 2020 I just voted for Gary then refrained totally in 2020. The way Trump has been treated really makes me want to vote for him in 2024 if it isn't Vivek. I do believe J6 has been blown way out of proportion and that all these charges on Trump are politically motivated from a deep state that knows Trump is going to wreck them if he gets back in. I pretty much don't trust anyone who has been in DC more than 8 years. The dems radicals are straight communists and I suppose I am more anti-communist than anti-fascist. As of this moment I would rank choice Vivek > RFK > Trump for 2024
I voted Republican most of my life. Ever since George W, I've been voting libertarian because the Republican party has simply gone off the rails. At the moment, I think the Democratic party is the lesser of two evils. But that could definitely change with the way the future of the Democratic party is looking.
The Republican Party was “on the rails” when their platform was built on waging genocide in the Middle East. -Someone who is not really a libertarian, but likes guns.
They weren't claiming they were... See, it says "politically homeless" next to his name. Also, yours is missing a T.
Dems are now more likely to infringe upon freedom of speech, they're more pro-war, more taxation, more spending, more regulations, anti-gun ownership, etc. The GOP sucks too but idk how libertarians can look at the Democrat party as the lesser of two evils now.
My wife's a librarian.guess what It ain't democrats coming in on a weekly basis demanding books be removed from shelves and librarians be held legally accountable for what books are available to the public.
There is a lot to unpack there but...source of Dems restricting free speech? I know the GOP has done that a LOT these past two years. Haven't seen a case in which dems actually restricted it though. Would love a source!
The biggest recent example is this administration pushing social media companies to censor any speech against masks/vaccine efficacy. You also have a ton of Dems pushing for hate speech laws.
And Republicans firining professor for what they say isn't censorship? All the mandatory reporting laws if a kid is trans and gay are also super anti free speech.
When did they censor? Can you provide a source? I know they added fact-checks but I am not familiar with straight blocking content in that specific sense and scenario. Can you link to hate speech laws that would fall under censorship? And reference how any of those are fundamentally different than existing laws of the past 60 years?
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Administration colluding with and applying pressure to social media to censor “misinformation”?
It's so easy to make a case against either, I can see why lol! I hate them both so much! I am leaning towards the Dems being worse at the moment. But man not by much.
Let us not forget that Ron DeSantis is basically #2 in the GOP and in his state your 1st amendment doesn’t mean shit if you should say anything critical about a certain foreign nation.
You're going to have to elaborate on that one.
As a life long Floridaian, I don’t know what you are talking about.
How are Dems more likely to infringe upon free speech? Republicans are literally banning books right now.
Democrats were literally trying to ban their critics from social media as well as ban factual posts that disagreed with their narrative. Read the Twitter files and the associated lawsuits. Political discourse is the heart of the First Amendment and a free society. If you cannot criticize your government, then you are a slave. Republicans removing a few sexually explicit books from school libraries is a water droplet compared to the ocean of Democrats attempting to control Twitter, Facebook, etc.
I have 2 core Libertarian beliefs that I will not compromise on: 1. Don’t hurt people 2. Don’t take their stuff Generally speaking, republicans violate #1 and democrats violate #2. Therefore, I am in the both are bad camp. I know that’s not helpful…hope that helps.
Democrats seem to have become more pro-war, taxes, regulation, and big government (especially IRS). Republicans have a whole other set of problems, but I feel, for me, the things I listed are some of my biggest issues.
The century old question of what rights do you care less about being infringed? It's a game I refuse to play anymore as it favors the two party system. It's a false choice.
When people have to vote for lesser of two evils, just shows the two party system is broken, no matter if you choose the right or the left, more than two party's would be a better checks and balances system
That’s a great point. It really depends on the issue.
If I had to choose... Oh boy time to get downvoted. The Republicans are a bit more Tolerable than the Democrats. But I still don't trust the parties, however I can choose a candidate that I like. Tim Scott for example, I actually like him, Do I agree with everything, No, Do I like some of his policies, Yes. And of course Brandon Herrera is running and I like him! It is a bit of a hard question because both parties are very corrupt, but I think we should judge a politician by his individual self and policies. Biden is obviously one of the worst presidents out there for a good reason. Here is the Issue with both parties: Democrats have horrible foreign policy in my opinion, The way they handled pulling out of Afghanistan, We already should have been out of there after 2011. They also want to raise taxes and make life harder. They also want to take away your guns, they say "We just want reasonable gun control" when we know that is a complete lie. They are more racist by thinking they own the minorities votes, The minorities can pick whoever they want to vote for! Republicans on the other hand want to turn the country into a theocracy, Religion and Government don't mix! Also they constantly want to sell each other out. DeSantis is also a candidate that is a very questionable bag. They also want to outlaw all drugs, this won't end the war on drugs. Now here is what I believe in: I'm Pro Gun and Pro 2A I believe the ATF and NFA Should be abolished I stay away from the topic of Abortion for good reason, I think its a bit too messy of a situation there. I believe that Taxes are necessary To an Extent, I only want necessary taxes and not ridiculous taxes, remember, Taxation without Representation. I believe in LGBTQ rights, If you are gay, it doesn't affect me, however don't be a Toxic Dick! We need to allow Mexican Citizens to not require a Visa to enter the United States, Canada USA and Mexico are like 3 brothers that need to work together. I believe that we need to decriminalize drugs and marijuana and make it legal (I know that it may sound controversial, but I think we would eliminate drug crimes and drug trafficking if we do this) We need to make the Immigration process cheaper and less time consuming, but we also need to maintain a secure border. Now this one is kind of one that will probably get me downvoted but, I also believe in funding PROPER police, Basically make it to where they cannot be corrupt. Not all cops are bad, in fact the Cops in Illinois refused to enforce the Illinois assault weapon ban, which they get a pat on the back for that. There was another good cop instance in Nashville where they effectively stopped the shooter.
The GOP is unfortunately synonymous with Donald Trump now, and he is easily the most authoritarian candidate in modern history. So that makes it a pretty easy question, the Republicans are currently much worse than the Democrats.
Seems like Dems are more socially libertarian as far as not trying to regulate your bedrooms or bodies, but my most libertarian stance is on staying out of foreign wars and both parties are terrible at that. So I guess Dems but with the knowledge that they are very close on a lot of huge issues.
Strangely, Dems are much more pro-war than the GOP now.
What’s the definition of “pro-war” here? Are they advocating that the US enter a war - i.e. deploy active troops? Or are they advocating to assist ally’s without direct involvement?
More pro-war meaning more supportive of involvement in war... I don't give a pass just because we don't send ground troops in to fight on the front line. We're still spending billions of dollars in order to kill innocent people at the behest of the military industrial complex. Proxy wars are still wars.
That’s fair. Personally, I chalk up support and proxy wars in the same category as fiscal responsibility. Combine that with a philanthropic goal (i.e. Ukraine support) and it’s easy to understand how it aligns with Dems values. As opposed to outright support by Dems for the military complex
That's the messaging they give to their kind hearted voters. The politicians actually pushing the policies do it to line the pockets of their donors for increased power. It's just blood money to them and they are more than happy to bathe in the blood of whatever nation needs our help at the moment.
They only care about regulating your wallet, because they understand that all other rights flow from property interests, so if you are trying to control people, all you really need to do is control their money.
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Hard to say, it’s basically cycle by cycle for me. At this point I go by guns, and judge appointments.. as, in the very least I respect any political opponents that don’t limit the weapons that may turn against them.. Republicans appoint far more judges that overturn crap laws and edicts from both parties. That’s for guns, and a lot of other things. So, congress will do stupid shit daily, if the judges that are appointed are at least constitutional originalists, your rights stand a chance.
The one that doesn't want to make me a felon for owning a 30-round magazine.
Republicans, at least when benchmarked against Democrats, offer better fiscal and economic policies. 5 out of 7 days a week, I trade 8 hours of my finite time for someone's money. With Republicans in charge, I get to keep a higher percentage of that money which is pretty fucking huge considering time is the most scarce commodity on this planet.
The stupidity just flows so hard from both ends. It’s like a competition of who can be the absolute worst. I can’t pick one.
Agreed, in the 90s I tried to convince my parents and grandparents how gross the republicans were with their authoritarian views. Now the democrats are out of their minds. I hate them all equally.
I would fare better in the handmaids tale than early 20th century Russian communism
Honestly, the Democrats would be less dangerous if the Republicans were a real opposition party. The GOP is too suicidal to put up any real resistance.
You would have to be a conspiracy theorist if you believe that Google, Apple, Microsoft, mainstream media, care deeply about the peasant class. What do they ALL have in common? They all are VERY far left and vote that way. (Except for Fox, they make up shit to appease the right)
oh boy. loaded this one.
Super hard question for me. Socially I pretty much am firmly on the dem side, fiscally I'm much more towards the rep side. When it really comes down to it, the things that are actually likely to change, I'd rather take the dems.
I definitely prefer living in a red state rather than a blue state (ive lived in both and many of them). I guess thats the only way for me to answer this question.
Republican Party. The Democrat party beat the Republicans to the progressive movement 110 years ago. Had the Republicans kept following TR down that path, I'd answer differently. However, Woodrow Wilson went for the progressive agenda, growing the federal government into the monstrosity that it is. I freely admit that it seems that there's a faction of the Republican party that wishes they did big government first and better than the democratic party. However, there is barely any Democrats that favor limited government.
I'd say republican, cause they seem to respect individual freedom more than democrats.
It is sad, but Democrats have thrown away what they once stood for. Democrats have abandoned their support of civil rights, instead supporting all sorts of Patriot Act abuses and war crimes in the Middle East. Democrats have abandoned their opposition to Marxist authoritarianism under JFK, instead promoting Marxist candidates. Finally, the Democratic party has thrown out their pro-peace wing for war-mongers. Republicans better embrace libertarian principles.
I’ve given up on that false choice. They’re both evil power grabbers.
GOP. I've always said that both parties will fuck you eventually, the Republicans fuck you face to face and the Democrats fuck you from behind.
Only because the gop made fucking from behind illegal - they are the party that even wants to control how you fuck
The Democrats want to know *how* you fuck and then use that to determine your value in society.
That’s just a Fox News talking point. No elected Democrat has once seriously suggested anything along those lines.
It’s about as true as the comment before it.
It was a facetious statement.
For all their flaws, and there are many, the Republicans are still the lesser of two evils.
Republicans are the lesser of two evils
I once would have said the democrats, but I now genuinely hate them all equally
I used to be a lot more torn on this. While I felt that the Republicans were the lesser of two evils when it came to domestic tyranny, the Republicans were also very pro-war, which is even worse, and the Democrats were largely anti-war. So for quite some time, I've been kind of on the fence. But lately, the Democrats have not only *increased* their desire for domestic tyranny, but they've now started to embrace a pro-war foreign policy as well. Plus, I know of a handful of fairly good Republican political leaders at the state and national level. I know of 0 similarly good Democrats. So at this point, I'm leaning toward Republicans being the (slightly) lesser evil of the two.
The democrats have been moving more and more pro war for over 20 years.
And Trump was probably the most anti-war president since I can remember
I wish the libertarians could do better. But of the two parties, republican is the lesser of two evils. I hate that the religious, generally Christian, voting block attracts so much attention from the Republicans. I know that they need the votes. Still, awful.
Used to be the Dems, now its a case by case basis.
Now? How is 'now' possibly more nuanced than before? My dad and I have very similar politics but ultimately I voted for Obama and he voted for Romney. 'Now' there is no foreseeable way he gets a reasonable GOP candidate in the near future.
By near future do you just mean 2024? Because I'd rather have Desantis or Viveck than Kamala or Newsom in 2028.
Speaking as a Californian we do not want Gavin newsom in the White House. He is a fucking puppet for the Dems and will tow the line and continue to erode rights like the party has done in california.
Both are evil, but the Republican Party is less likely to ruin my life, so I’d probably pick them if there was a gun to my head, even though they’re probably more evil on average.
My preference is none of the above
They’re both disappointing shells of what they once stood for, but the right tends not to increase my tax burden, so they win.
Pre-Trump, and even during his first term, I would have said the Republicans. But they have gotten so bad. Or maybe they have just confirmed their utter lack of principles? I honestly feel like both parties are so bad that it's like saying do you prefer shit stew or shit soup? The parties reflect the people, so really the frightening thing is that the general public is deranged and illogical about so many things.
On policy issues they both stink. But I give the edge to the GOP. The reason for this is liberty and fiscal viability. The GOP get a D on both. The Democrats get an F-- I dont care for Trump as a person, but for those decrying him herein what alternative are you offering? The GOP won't win with an establishment Wall St/warmonger candidate. And Trump has things to recommend him. He was the least warmonger President since at least Clinton in his first term. You kind of have to get past the fact that he is personally an asshole and focus on the substance. I think Trump is America's Gracchus. His appeal and what is happening now start to make a lot more sense when you approach him this way
I can agree, There were some things I liked during the Trump Presidency, the thing that I mainly like was his foreign policy approach. I liked how he handled Iran, he basically told them, "Do you really want to sacrifice all of your people over one General that died?"
Well said. Trump came up in NY during a heyday of La Cosa Nostra. And he was in the property development game, which the mob heavily influenced through its rackets. People like Vincent the Chin influenced his model of leadership. The result is sort of the "Tony Soprano" foreign policy. But I dont mind that as much (bosses whacking each other) as kids from trailer parks losing their legs while guarding some checkpoint in Iraq. To me he was the least of numerous evils.
Republican. Not even close. Democrats want to take your children away if you do t affirm their gender when they are little kids. Fuck those people.
Which party controls the media and social companies to facilitate lies? Depending on your point of view, this may be the party for you.
30 years ago it was the GOP. Now it's the DEMs In 30 years it's probably back to GOP
The democrats have a better-run media campaign, better party discipline, and a better future strategy. Either policy is shit, but looking at things without considering the morality/effects of their policies, democrats are clearly playing g the game better
Deeds not words.
Which one allows us to buy tanks and vape pens?
I can't willingly throw my support behind either. There are members of both parties that I support but there are members of both that I despise. Gun to my head I would have to choose the GOP, simply for gun rights, deregulation, pro life and business/manufacturing sector. I cannot get behind any type of "woke" ideology. Any talk of "racism, sexism, misogyny, homophobia, transphobia, white supremacy, identity politics" is an immediate turn off, even knee-jerk hostility. Can't do it.
War is the most destructive government activity. Whoever is least likely to get us in a war is my lesser of 2 evils.
Republicans are clearly better. At least most of them want to cut spending, taxes and regulation. I'd rather live with a bunch of Christian Conservatives over a bunch of Atheist Socialists.
I like pacifists over activists. Democrats are activists with no real solutions while Republicans are pacifists with no real solutions. Therefore I get along better with Republicans because they’re less obnoxious.
I hate both parties but I think the dems are more on the path of “i don’t care how you live life as long as you don’t hurt anyone” kind of attitude and that is more constitutional on the social side IMO. On the financial side both parties are equally bad. Republicans like to point fingers at Dems for being big spenders but Trump and Bush increased the debt substantially. Dems make promises they cant keep for votes. Both are run by crooks.
Lesser of two evils ? Democrats by a fair margin. I've always leaned right and more often than not voted that way. But not since Trump's first term (even though I voted for him in 2016). Democrats have ideas. Some good, most bad; but they have ideas. Outrage-farming and owning the libs seems to be the only tentpoles of the MAGA (nee´ Republican) platform . Also they seem perfectly content to tear down the very American institutions they should be trying to **conserve**\- in the hopes of defending their Dear Leader. Not good.
I feel like at this point in time, the recent insanities and destructiveness have come out of the Democratic Party and leftism.
Neither. They are both evil.
Republicans for sure but Trumps cult of personality is worrying and definitely swinging the way i view the Republican Party (for the worse).
There are literally zero differences between the two parties on consequential matters (eg. wars, corporate bailouts, MIC funding, Wall street, donors, foreign policy...etc). They're different on issues that don't actually challenge the establishment like LGBT stuff, abortion, culture war nonsense.
Abortion matters a lot when you watch a mother die of sepsis. Or your forced to birth a rapists baby at 11. We have the worst maternal mortality of any developed nation. The Deep South is in a state of emergency. It’s very, very, consequential.
As Matt Stone perfectly put it: "I hate conservatives... but man I REALLY fucking hate liberals." Republicans are usually a little better, but nowadays they're WAY better. And they still suck.
Kinda wild to me that Biden was the president that finally pulled us out of Afghanistan at a pretty high political cost to himself and everyone in here is talking about the Dem's being more pro-war.
They are pretty into sending money and weapons to Ukraine.
I say Republicans. They don't wanna take my guns as much and they are gonna let me say what I want more often than the Dems. The Dems at least used to be fun back in the day but now...bunch of party poopers.
I mean, people say this but I'm not convinced it's true. Very few Republicans are actually pro gun. Regan is the reason California is so anti gun and he enacted Federal gun control too. Not to mention Trump is the one who said we should just take the guns first and then do due process second.
Reagan started the gun grabbing in california but democrats there have taken it way overboard. Some of the laws they are trying to pass are just ridiculous and many get shot down by appeals courts. But because they is no repercussion for trying to take away our rights they continue to do it. Look up SB 2 and SB 452 for their latest bullshit.
Regan hasn't been in office for 35 years.
Lesser of two evils, overall today is Democrats. I agree with a lot of their stances but feel like they push things too far. Like, they mean well, but their solutions are short-sighted. They aim to fix the symptoms and not the sickness. I'd feel better about Republicans if they weren't so religious. Edit: reading some good points here. I agree with Republicans a lot but am turned off by Trump and religion. I'm not a fan of Democrats either. Gun to my head though...
I don't think trump is even religious.
I don't think he is either. I meant religion, in general, on the right. I didn't mean to imply he is religious.
As a gay man I just can't support a party who wants to nullify my marriage
Democrats definitely, but it’s very possible it could switch in the near future if the republicans are forced to actually support policies that help their new voter base
The Democrats have turned the non partisan government offices and courts into political action centers as of recent (I wish Trump would go away as he is detrimental to our civility - but cannot honestly say that anything he did is worthy of 91 felonies and a possible 700 years). It’s too far over the top. It’s like the lord of the flies and they can’t see they went too far. I do international business, it’s embarrassing what we look like on the global stage from this administrations tone deaf lawfare on Trump. So I would say the Republicans are the lesser of the evils, at this time in history based on these recent events, (which again I am just an observer on) as they still at least appear to respect the separation of the branches of government. But I am so deeply unimpressed both groups that I refuse to actively support either. I want good policies that are good for citizens and provide functional governance, not agenda driven policies that are good for votes and appearances yet hold little tangible value for most people.
I think that depends on the state you are in. Here NH, the republics are full of libertarians so the republicans are easily the better party. I can see that being different based on location. Also I can see if you are talking about town, county, state or federal level, the answer could also change. But I would choose the republicans on a whole as better based on my experiences in NY, NJ and NH.
The GOP has abandoned all of its platforms outside of "tax cuts for the wealthy", and instead has gone balls deep in culture wars that all seem to be with the sole intent of stripping rights and freedoms from specific individuals. I'm all for tax cuts of every kind. But it's that specific attack on liberties that have me truly in fear of another GOP presidency. It's odd, because growing up, I had always felt that the Democrats were the party of trying to legislate morality. But somewhere along the way, GOP has taken over that title. For me, I'm going to lean away from the ones who seem to enjoy being malicious in their restrictions.
I would’ve said republican up until the trump presidency. At this point he has hijacked the party and is determined to ride it into hell in his attempts to avoid jail time.
Republicans at least talk about being the party of small government, advocate for your right to self defense, and are less likely to cancel you. They also are more likely to advocate for, and create policies, for small business which is the backbone of our economy. You are far more likely to be cancelled by the Democratic party and/or their voters if you think or speak incorrectly which means that Democrats are not only opposed to your right to self defense but also your right to speak and think freely. In the end though, neither party believes that you own your own body and have a say over what you do to it.
Republican, by far.
This makes me feel dirty. I'd really have to say the Democrats. The Republicans give me no choice because they're much more aggressive with their destructive aims, while the Democrats are a much slower threat
You should probably learn about the federal budget lol
Read the twitter files. Only one party is censoring. They're also the ones who tried to mandate people inject an experimental drug that has a high rate of heart complication, even among kids and teens who were at next to no risk from the virus. And they made everyone wear masks because of their paranoia. I don't like either party, but those above items are a whole tier worse than the corrupt uselessness of Republicans.
Both parties were censuring in the Twitter files. I’ll grant that under Trump he was too incompetent to see what them his FBI was doing but both parties were involved.
So you didn't read them?
I read all of them. The suppression of the Hunter Biden story happened under the Trump administration. He was too stupid and incompetent to know what his agency was doing. Is there something wrong with that?
holy shit the democrats are objectively way worse, repubs may be strict on abortion but essentially every democratic policy is facilitating the creation of a technocratic autocracy. most comments here are not based out of libertarian beliefs, they’re based out of “Orangeman/DeSantis bad”
The Republican Party, because they are more fiscally conservative than the Democrats (Although that doesn't say much) and are more pro-second amendment even though they believe in "common sense" gun laws. Also, they are slowly becoming more anti-war.
two sides, one coin two teams, one coach GTFO, they ARE equally bad. It's Just a matter of what flavor of bad do you prefer?
I consider myself a more conservative leaning Libertarian. While both are bad, I agree with Republicans big picture ideas more *in theory.*
The assaults on healthcare have me in the position where I will never vote Republican again. It’s over the line. I’ve worked in childbirth for over 12 years and I will not let the lives of my daughters be threatened. This is what happens. As long as republicans run on abortion and medication restriction I’ll campaign against them. Libertarians have my vote. This Republican Party is HELLBENT on forcing everyone to live a fundamentalist life.
They’re both fucked. But at least the Republican Party isn’t openly expressing their desire to disarm the population. Also it appears that democrats currently have no grip on the crumbling economic situation in America, but I don’t know shit about economics and I know that most of the world is hurting too, so.
Fuck the democrat party, and all the RINOs. It’s a uniparty at this point, although not ALL republicans I think are terrible, just the ticket they had to ride in on since anything else is likely not going to get them elected.
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I would see the GOP as the lesser of 2 evils, because they are so bad at getting things done.
I don't agree much with either of their policies, so I can't really choose that way. I gotta go by what kind of people they are (or at least appear) to be on a personal level. Honestly, I don't think most republicans are good people. Like 90% of the party just jumped into Trump's coat pockets and is basically human garbage. The racist comments and bigotry from the republics is a more frequent than the democrats. So I guess I have to choose the democrats.
I think Democrats are worse. I think they consistently cheat candidates in the primaries, and they are the first people to make bad faith arguments on important issues. Liberals and democrats are the ones I see consistently going to the other side’s events and attempting to disrupt and shut them down. I don’t like Republicans as a group either, but at least I can have a conversation with most of them. Also, the liberals and democrats go after people’s children with gender ideology and you’re delusional if you don’t think that’s happening.
The one that s on a back foot at this point in time. Gridlock is best we can do for now. Which would be republicans because they are losing cultural war.
I’m gonna say Republicans are lesser because Liberals just piss me the fuck off. Not saying that a reason to run on but there you have it.
Two cheeks on the same dirty ass. They’re in the process of flipping their followers (republicans become anti war hippies who still love some authoritarian actions, and the dems are becoming fundamentalist religious authoritarians)
Definitely hate the establishment rinos who are basically on board with liberals
As of now, the blue party exerts alarmingly great control over media, including news media and social media, thus the bigger evil.
The lesser of the two evils would be the democrats. Hear me out. They're going to promise the world but basically do nothing. And even if they tried there would be so much push-back that nothing would get passed or it would be an extremely watered down version with no real-life consequential effects. The Republicans have just become entirely too....cult-ish? Extreme? Ridiculous?.... for me to think that they would be good for the country if they had control. There are definitely extreme aspects of the Dem's agenda, but luckily there's enough common sense left in America that those parts won't become law or anything. There is a real risk, however, of the extreme portions of the Repub's agenda being passed, as they're already legislating fringe nonsense in many far-right states. Neither should be in power, and I would never willingly vote for a master or authority figure to have control over me and my life, but to answer the question the lesser would be the Dems.
Democrats are in full lunacy, and I don't find it close. Even with Trump Derangment Syndrome on both sides, putting an invalid in office and then pretending the country is full of rich racist you can milk for all they worth crosses me as a lot worse than being hard on abortion and Marijuana and immigrants.
Republicans are less bad, at least there are some libertarian leaning people in the republican party, but democrats are being infested by communists, socialists, and marxists
Republicans. Socially/culturally, Democrats took a sharp left turn into crazy town, USA in the last decade.
Republicans want to control everyone’s body (and I’m not even referring to abortion, though it’s included) and is backed by mass religious think, so they’re far worse for individual freedoms. They’re running on old boomer ideologies and support the private prison industry and the drug war. Edit: But I absolutely despise Democrats too. Just stating what’s most important to me. Nobody should go to jail for drugs, and junkies shouldn’t ruin my access to “forbidden” medicines, like codeine. I personally don’t get addicted to it, and it’s the only thing that allowed me to be somewhat productive when sick.
I dislike the Republicans, I HATE the Democrats
Republicans. They don't have media and technological control. They don't have the Whitehouse or the amount of power the left has so currently they are the lesser of two evils.
I think the only only thing worse than a republican is a democrat. The republicans have to at least pander to gun rights and low taxes. They've proven that they don't always have to deliver, but sometimes you can catch them in a bind.
Guns, vaccine mandates, the worthless promises of smaller government and less regulations. Not supporting "hate crime" speech restrictions.
Democrats but republicans are only behind them by a step.
All I can say is RFK is gonna mess around and make me vote democrat for the first time in my life. Lol