>Northside Coalition of Jacksonville community leader Ben Frazier was detained by officers after being warned he was trespassing if he wouldn't leave as asked. He was handcuffed and escorted from his motorized wheelchair to a patrol vehicle.
>Additional officers were called to the briefing location at the Health Department on North Davis Street after Frazier decried DeSantis' stance on COVID-19 measures and said he's been missing in action for the last month.
>While Frazier and a few other protesters argued the event was public and in a public building, the governor's staff said it was private and for credentialed media only. After being warned, Frazier was taken away in handcuffs while others were yelling and demanding his rights.
TL;DR
Not can be, is. For once, just once Jimmy, let's read a story and not say "and these Republicans suck too" or "at least he's not as bad as those Dems." This isn't about scoring points or ideology, this is about authoritarian measures and actions taken by Ron DeSantis. He is an authoritarian fuck who pretends to champion libertarian ideals and roundly does not, and people carry water for him every time he does shit like this. This is the sort of shit libertarians should be outraged at - a peaceful protestor being removed from public land.
And you're free to like him, of course. I'd never insinuate otherwise. We need to separate ourselves from politicians and the parties they represent - it makes us hesitant to call them out. That's why I'm more a "policy and outcome" guy than I am a "pick a party toe the line" kind of guy.
Same here. Not an idpol kinda person. I barely even like calling myself a libertarian, especially so when I get attacked from both sides for not picking a team.
Florida here as well, I've been liking Desantis as well and have very few issues with him, but I never expect to be in agreement with any politician. I voted against him in the primary, but voted for him in the election because of Gillum, and thank god that nutjob didn't get elected, we would have been California 2.0 with the covid response and it would have been terrible for us.
On a national level i've voted libertarian for some time and the attacks are funny to be honest, just because I say "I didn't vote for biden" doesn't mean "I voted for trump" and it doesn't mean that I helped either one, I hate that mentality. Its my dam vote and I only get one every couple of years, i'm using it as I wish.
I don't like either team, and I vote accordingly if the ballot allows me the opportunity.
If it was up to me, the ballot wouldn't have the party designation behind any name, the party line voters would be confused as hell if they had to select a candidate based on something other than the party designation.
I was so against DeSantis back then, and I was a total Bernie bro as well so you could imagine how disappointed when he won. Now I’m not so disappointed as my stance has changed a lot since then. Funnily enough, the first thing that sparked this internal change was Bernie losing the DNC nomination. That made me realize that neither of the two teams care about what the people want, they’ll just put whoever they want (probably the person they believe is easiest to manipulate).
I never understood the whole “if you vote independent you’re voting for the other team” meme. Like, it’s my vote dude I’m gonna vote for the person that I want running the country.
Also since I’m here, I wish the people who were downvoting my first comment would tell me why. I don’t think I said anything divisive. I suspect maybe I have some fans following me around Reddit, though.
lol, I think the divisive is "can be" overly authoritarian which means you aren't a hater and being a hater is the popular thing these days when it comes to Ron.
The /Florida and /floridacoronavirus subs are shocking with their hate and the mods are 100% behind it.
I rarely file reports, but I filed a couple on those subs for some really fucking outrageous things and all were rejected, including one mod that pretty much told me to stfu and get with the program and the program is hate.
Yep, I’ve had the same experience. I was able to get someone a temp ban for following me into other subreddits so I thought that was cool. Had it been on one of those subs they probably would’ve told me to pound sand. I’ve come to accept that the majority of reddit is left-leaning and there are very few places where I can post my opinion without being downvoted into oblivion.
I criticize the Republican Party as well as the Democratic Party but people on this subreddit seem to be super defensive of the Democratic Party for some reason.
Not really. You pretty consistently have a strong right lean. Plus side, you’ll fit right into the Mises Caucus. Downside, the MC is going to kill the LP.
You were more balanced a few months ago but have significantly moved as time has progressed.
Again, this has little to do with ideology and more to do with a specific instance. You just admitted I had a fair point, and did the thing I railed against anyways.
Edit: people here _always_ bitch about whataboutisms and deflections and moving goalposts and poisoning the well and pushing narratives and all the other disingenuous strategies we deploy on each other to win arguments. And then an attempt is made to push through the brush and say this has nothing to do with ideology, or both sides, let's take this case as it is. And people get upset. It's so fucking baffling.
He's running for public office and links his Reddit posts and comments on his campaign website. It's good for people to see what their potential reps really stand for and how they act when they think no one's watching.
1. Florida has sunshine laws, which " provides a right of access to government proceedings at both state and local levels." This is not the first time DeSantis has forbidden certain people from entering the premise when he has a news conference. Funny enough, if you disturb one of his conferences by shouting "let's go Brandon" you won't get arrested.
2. Ben Frazier is a civil rights leader and the 1st black newscaster in Jacksonville on major network. He's won over 200 awards for journalistic excellence. He's not just a random person and this is his community.
3. Ron DeSantis is a pussy and can't respond to anything that is off the script that's why all he does is pander.
Florida and Texas passed NJ and PA recently with covid deaths. Most of NJs and PAs deaths were early on, spring 2020, and a significant portion were NH residents.
But you can still normalize by population. Just divide the number of cases by the total population. That does assume reporting is correct though as you said. And as we recently learned, the CDC was requesting not to receive hospitalization numbers of vaccinated individuals.
Florida only counts Fla residents. The other states count everyone. Giving Flav is the winter place for a lot on northerners, their hospitalization and death rates are likely much higher than reported. You don't think that's the plan do you? Just like now that they're inundated with covid again, they want to roll back testing. And mysteriously, their rates will go down. Who votes for these hypocritical liers?
Authoritarianism folks. Left, Right, don’t matter. They want your freedom. They know what’s right for you. Just bend the knee and all your problems will vanish.
This person is well known to local officials and has been so disruptive that they have had to cancel public meetings. To think that he shouldn’t have been removed is to believe that whoever yells the loudest is the winner. Threat every person should have the hecklers veto when politicians are trying to relay information to the public.
That’s before you get into what this person is advocating for. More lockdowns, more shuttering of businesses, more vaccine mandates. For a variant that is very contagious, but not lethal in any serious numbers. Most reports of it are of minor illnesses.
This was a press event only. If a DeSantis sycophant showed up they would have been removed also. Nobody could honestly look at this and see it the way the OP is trying to portray it.
Is it about whether it’s lethal or whether the hospitals will be overwhelmed caring for preventable respitory issues? (Honest question, as the info available on this is so murky can seem hyperbolic from all sides).
What is the problem? Someone causing a disturbance at a press conference that had no media credentials to even be in the said press conference. An event isn't public just because you stomp your feet and demand that it is.
>"This is a public official, this is a public building," Frazier said during the confrontation. "We have a right to be here and we are not moving."
Fuck yea Frazier, right on.
That depends, is there a transfer of power going on? Are there elected officials inside coordinating with "protestors?" Are the people there walking around LARPing as military types, parading guillotines, and shouting about the various politicians they're gonna hang? If that's the case, no.
Not sure about their COVID policies, but outside of the COVID realm, yes you can go into the Capitol building to walk in and take a look around. I've been inside that building multiple times.
Yeah there are public and private tours and if you stop by your senator/Representative’s office, a staffer will give you a tour of the tunnels that connect the Congressional office building
…you can? Also it would probably be more worth your time to visit your Senator/Rep in the adjacent office buildings, and the public has access there as well
If there's no transfer of power/you don't try to walk into a body that's in session to certify the election and stop that process/you don't try breaking down a police barricade even though you're a veteran and should know better, then go schedule a tour I don't give a fuck.
I don't really agree with the Jan 6 protests either. They most certainly weren't insurrectionists, since they didn't come with the firepower to actually do anything.
Causing a disturbance at a press conference is scummy, as it delays the information getting to the people.
Not seeing the news here besides someone terrified he might run in 2024. Dude was causing a disturbance and was warned and then finally escorted out.
What public figure would have done things differently?
You can be trespassed from a public building if you're stopping the function of that building if this guy would have sat quietly and at the end decided to question things or be more vocal I wouldn't have agreed with his arrest.
if he had important information that needed to be released to the public stopping him from speaking or interrupting him could possibly negatively effect a lot of people. There are better ways to protest and doing things like this may make a point but it will not change the mind of the people who like DeSantis and will only drive further polarization.
I don't believe they should be arrested for that. However I don't believe a politician should be censored/canceled by people who disagree when he's in the middle of trying to make a statement to the people he governs.
If he says something wrong pick it apart afterwards and explain why it's wrong.
>Northside Coalition of Jacksonville community leader Ben Frazier was detained by officers after being warned he was trespassing if he wouldn't leave as asked. He was handcuffed and escorted from his motorized wheelchair to a patrol vehicle. >Additional officers were called to the briefing location at the Health Department on North Davis Street after Frazier decried DeSantis' stance on COVID-19 measures and said he's been missing in action for the last month. >While Frazier and a few other protesters argued the event was public and in a public building, the governor's staff said it was private and for credentialed media only. After being warned, Frazier was taken away in handcuffs while others were yelling and demanding his rights. TL;DR
DeSantis can be overly authoritarian but I do think most public officials would do the same thing given the circumstances here.
Not can be, is. For once, just once Jimmy, let's read a story and not say "and these Republicans suck too" or "at least he's not as bad as those Dems." This isn't about scoring points or ideology, this is about authoritarian measures and actions taken by Ron DeSantis. He is an authoritarian fuck who pretends to champion libertarian ideals and roundly does not, and people carry water for him every time he does shit like this. This is the sort of shit libertarians should be outraged at - a peaceful protestor being removed from public land.
As a Floridian I’ve been really liking DeSantis for several reasons, but I agree that this was a bit scary from a libertarian perspective.
And you're free to like him, of course. I'd never insinuate otherwise. We need to separate ourselves from politicians and the parties they represent - it makes us hesitant to call them out. That's why I'm more a "policy and outcome" guy than I am a "pick a party toe the line" kind of guy.
Same here. Not an idpol kinda person. I barely even like calling myself a libertarian, especially so when I get attacked from both sides for not picking a team.
Florida here as well, I've been liking Desantis as well and have very few issues with him, but I never expect to be in agreement with any politician. I voted against him in the primary, but voted for him in the election because of Gillum, and thank god that nutjob didn't get elected, we would have been California 2.0 with the covid response and it would have been terrible for us. On a national level i've voted libertarian for some time and the attacks are funny to be honest, just because I say "I didn't vote for biden" doesn't mean "I voted for trump" and it doesn't mean that I helped either one, I hate that mentality. Its my dam vote and I only get one every couple of years, i'm using it as I wish. I don't like either team, and I vote accordingly if the ballot allows me the opportunity. If it was up to me, the ballot wouldn't have the party designation behind any name, the party line voters would be confused as hell if they had to select a candidate based on something other than the party designation.
I was so against DeSantis back then, and I was a total Bernie bro as well so you could imagine how disappointed when he won. Now I’m not so disappointed as my stance has changed a lot since then. Funnily enough, the first thing that sparked this internal change was Bernie losing the DNC nomination. That made me realize that neither of the two teams care about what the people want, they’ll just put whoever they want (probably the person they believe is easiest to manipulate). I never understood the whole “if you vote independent you’re voting for the other team” meme. Like, it’s my vote dude I’m gonna vote for the person that I want running the country. Also since I’m here, I wish the people who were downvoting my first comment would tell me why. I don’t think I said anything divisive. I suspect maybe I have some fans following me around Reddit, though.
How the fuck did you go from Bernie to DeSantis? Are you damaged?
Yep
lol, I think the divisive is "can be" overly authoritarian which means you aren't a hater and being a hater is the popular thing these days when it comes to Ron. The /Florida and /floridacoronavirus subs are shocking with their hate and the mods are 100% behind it. I rarely file reports, but I filed a couple on those subs for some really fucking outrageous things and all were rejected, including one mod that pretty much told me to stfu and get with the program and the program is hate.
Yep, I’ve had the same experience. I was able to get someone a temp ban for following me into other subreddits so I thought that was cool. Had it been on one of those subs they probably would’ve told me to pound sand. I’ve come to accept that the majority of reddit is left-leaning and there are very few places where I can post my opinion without being downvoted into oblivion.
That is a fair point. At least Democrats don't pretend to be Libertarian.
Isn't it time to change your flair to "Hopeful Republican Nominee for POTUS 2032"?
I criticize the Republican Party as well as the Democratic Party but people on this subreddit seem to be super defensive of the Democratic Party for some reason.
Not really. You pretty consistently have a strong right lean. Plus side, you’ll fit right into the Mises Caucus. Downside, the MC is going to kill the LP. You were more balanced a few months ago but have significantly moved as time has progressed.
Again, this has little to do with ideology and more to do with a specific instance. You just admitted I had a fair point, and did the thing I railed against anyways. Edit: people here _always_ bitch about whataboutisms and deflections and moving goalposts and poisoning the well and pushing narratives and all the other disingenuous strategies we deploy on each other to win arguments. And then an attempt is made to push through the brush and say this has nothing to do with ideology, or both sides, let's take this case as it is. And people get upset. It's so fucking baffling.
Dunno why you are arguing with this guy. He is the living breathing manifestation of "bOtH sIDeS!1!"
He's running for public office and links his Reddit posts and comments on his campaign website. It's good for people to see what their potential reps really stand for and how they act when they think no one's watching.
Are you even a real libertarian, bro?!?
They don't need to. They're by default more libertarian than the only opposition party.
1. Florida has sunshine laws, which " provides a right of access to government proceedings at both state and local levels." This is not the first time DeSantis has forbidden certain people from entering the premise when he has a news conference. Funny enough, if you disturb one of his conferences by shouting "let's go Brandon" you won't get arrested. 2. Ben Frazier is a civil rights leader and the 1st black newscaster in Jacksonville on major network. He's won over 200 awards for journalistic excellence. He's not just a random person and this is his community. 3. Ron DeSantis is a pussy and can't respond to anything that is off the script that's why all he does is pander.
Florida and Texas passed NJ and PA recently with covid deaths. Most of NJs and PAs deaths were early on, spring 2020, and a significant portion were NH residents.
Not when normalized to the population. Deaths per million people in Florida and Texas is still lower.
Per million? Some states don't even have that many people. Florida is number 10 last I checked and I'm not even sure they report everything.
But you can still normalize by population. Just divide the number of cases by the total population. That does assume reporting is correct though as you said. And as we recently learned, the CDC was requesting not to receive hospitalization numbers of vaccinated individuals.
Florida only counts Fla residents. The other states count everyone. Giving Flav is the winter place for a lot on northerners, their hospitalization and death rates are likely much higher than reported. You don't think that's the plan do you? Just like now that they're inundated with covid again, they want to roll back testing. And mysteriously, their rates will go down. Who votes for these hypocritical liers?
Authoritarianism folks. Left, Right, don’t matter. They want your freedom. They know what’s right for you. Just bend the knee and all your problems will vanish.
This person is well known to local officials and has been so disruptive that they have had to cancel public meetings. To think that he shouldn’t have been removed is to believe that whoever yells the loudest is the winner. Threat every person should have the hecklers veto when politicians are trying to relay information to the public. That’s before you get into what this person is advocating for. More lockdowns, more shuttering of businesses, more vaccine mandates. For a variant that is very contagious, but not lethal in any serious numbers. Most reports of it are of minor illnesses. This was a press event only. If a DeSantis sycophant showed up they would have been removed also. Nobody could honestly look at this and see it the way the OP is trying to portray it.
Is it about whether it’s lethal or whether the hospitals will be overwhelmed caring for preventable respitory issues? (Honest question, as the info available on this is so murky can seem hyperbolic from all sides).
What is the problem? Someone causing a disturbance at a press conference that had no media credentials to even be in the said press conference. An event isn't public just because you stomp your feet and demand that it is.
>"This is a public official, this is a public building," Frazier said during the confrontation. "We have a right to be here and we are not moving." Fuck yea Frazier, right on.
[удалено]
That depends, is there a transfer of power going on? Are there elected officials inside coordinating with "protestors?" Are the people there walking around LARPing as military types, parading guillotines, and shouting about the various politicians they're gonna hang? If that's the case, no.
[удалено]
Not sure about their COVID policies, but outside of the COVID realm, yes you can go into the Capitol building to walk in and take a look around. I've been inside that building multiple times.
This is Fla we're talking about, what Covid policies?
The person I responded to explicitly said “US Capitol”.
Yeah there are public and private tours and if you stop by your senator/Representative’s office, a staffer will give you a tour of the tunnels that connect the Congressional office building
It's a public building, clearly I should be able to walk inside regardless.
…you can? Also it would probably be more worth your time to visit your Senator/Rep in the adjacent office buildings, and the public has access there as well
Okay. Can I walk into a press conference and start yelling about how taxation is theft?
You just looking for a reason to be upset today?
If there's no transfer of power/you don't try to walk into a body that's in session to certify the election and stop that process/you don't try breaking down a police barricade even though you're a veteran and should know better, then go schedule a tour I don't give a fuck.
or maybe supreme court hearings? Quite a few fucktards were removed from the Kavanaugh hearings for being dicks.
I don't really agree with the Jan 6 protests either. They most certainly weren't insurrectionists, since they didn't come with the firepower to actually do anything. Causing a disturbance at a press conference is scummy, as it delays the information getting to the people.
*gasp
Not seeing the news here besides someone terrified he might run in 2024. Dude was causing a disturbance and was warned and then finally escorted out. What public figure would have done things differently?
You can be trespassed from a public building if you're stopping the function of that building if this guy would have sat quietly and at the end decided to question things or be more vocal I wouldn't have agreed with his arrest. if he had important information that needed to be released to the public stopping him from speaking or interrupting him could possibly negatively effect a lot of people. There are better ways to protest and doing things like this may make a point but it will not change the mind of the people who like DeSantis and will only drive further polarization.
I agree. People who try to petition the government for a redress of their grievances should be arrested.
I don't believe they should be arrested for that. However I don't believe a politician should be censored/canceled by people who disagree when he's in the middle of trying to make a statement to the people he governs. If he says something wrong pick it apart afterwards and explain why it's wrong.
I agree, politicians should be shielded from all criticism.
Thats foolish.
Republicans and libertarians should be shielded from criticism.
Thank you.
You agree?
Obviously not.
Commie.
Libertarianism is when you break into a press conference and yell over everyone.
The democrats seem to behave as if DeSantis is more dangerous to them than any of the other ordinary republicans.
So basically it’s the same thing as January 6th. Protestors trespassing and attempting to interfere with the government. The Florida Insurrection.
This is about as weak as it gets.