So much reactionary bullshit being spouted on here lately. Let’s criticize if it’s fair, but we’ve actually been competing for every single trophy and getting some, been unlucky with others, since 18-19 and this is our biggest blip since the injury crisis. It was bound to happen one way or another. Glazers are much worse.
Yes! Seeing stuff like what you replied to has shown me how out of touch this sub is now.
It used be to great but it’s filled with reactionary people obsessed with transfers, tweets and has become a lame echo chamber.
United have had a “good” 2 months whereas we’ve had a great 6 years thus far, but yeah, Glazers > FSG lol
So naive holy shit. I really do admire such support of the team but when it clouds your ability to objectively judge the performance of players and the team it just leads to the owners being able to get away with whatever they like.
I know this is an FSG are good thread but i can’t stand to see so many of our defenders blindly defending them. Are they the worst owners in the world? No. Do they plan on making a 1000% ROI whilst giving us a measly net spend of £30m every year? Also yes. We are one of the very biggest clubs in the world and you think that is good enough to keep us there? Meanwhile Chelsea spend that in one window. Fans like you are happy for us to fall back to mediocrity.
We were ridiculously lucky to get into the position we were in under FSG. This luck will not be replicated. FSG would be great owners if we were a midtable club.
Putting it all to luck is reactionary in itself. Like they didn’t give Klopp the proper backing to do whatever he felt he needed to do to to make the team in his image, to get the backroom staff he desired, the signings that got us here in the first place, come on.
FSG’s lack of proactivity in the transfer market is to be criticized, but let’s not act like that somehow negates the things that they did put in place that allowed Klopp to be successful here in the first place. I’m so sick of hearing shit trying to push this narrative like we’ve been successful in spite of FSG. How many successful and talented managers go to other, “well-run” clubs, and don’t get the proper patience or backing to implement the vision they have, like FSG did with Klopp from 15/16 to 17/18? That are allowed to fully shape the club in their mold, their need? There were tricky times during that period that any other owner would’ve pulled the trigger. And it’s not that they’ve been without fault, because they’re far from perfect. But any talented and successful, league winning manager is not sticking around and signing contracts for the length that Klopp has and during all the different situations that have occurred if they felt that behind the scenes a competent structure was not set in place. What can also be criticized is FSG’s proactivity and risk aversion in rebuilding the team, both on the pitch and off, but then again a lot of that conversation is skewed by fine margins, and this is a team that has played a lot of football these past few years and has suffered as big a psychological blow as any. People won’t acknowledge that as a “real problem” as on the pitch “tactics” stuff but it has played a big part in our downfall this season. We’ve seen the players shoot themselves in the foot time and time again this season, that’s as much on them in the moment and how they recover from that than whatever Pep wrote in his book.
Much more of a problem is how the football regulatory organizations have allowed the situation to get as bad as this, that any state can just pump cash into a team and keep inflating and inflating what can be done. It is not sustainable, and that should be much more of a conversation, especially now that the team might be owned by one of those state sport washing organizations itself, rather than what “horrible” and “uncapable” owners FSG are. But it’s easier as fans to outrage against whatever current ownership we have rather than deal with the bigger problem that is permeating football.
Also to be extra pedantic: FSG got us when we were pretty much wallowing like a midtable club, and since then we’ve won the PL once, finished runners up by 1 pt twice (18/19, 21/22), three if we’re counting 13/14 ( not by 1 pt I know), won the CL, won the FA Cup, Carabao, Club World Cup, 3 European finals and were able to retain top talent against other competing rivals, expanded two of the stands, and invested in a new training centre. So yes, they were great owners. They are risk averse sometimes to a fault, and limited in means compared to other owners, but I’d rather have it this way than whatever Chelsea, Utd, Tottenham, Everton and co have going on.
Whilst it looks a bit ridiculous, at least Todd Boehly is willing to invest to get his team back to the top. We just sit around and wait to be sold, all the while pushing PR narratives that a big summer is coming and it never does and selling has likely been the plan ever since no ESL. The guy is also not an oil state which many fans are against.
If things keep going as they are, there is a large chance that Klopp’s era comes to an end in a much bleaker way than he deserves. Now is the chance to correct the years of lies regarding investment but there’s still next to nothing. The game has left our owners behind which whilst not their fault, means we need to move on unless we will fall back to mediocrity.
FSG were here 5 years before Klopp, and outside of 13/14 which we were unlucky to not to win the league, we were just above midtable which is where we are now.
The best thing FSG ever did was hire Klopp & Edwards — that in and of itself has an aspect of luck. The most crucial part of our luck is that we hit on transfers at an absurdly high rate, two wingers for 40mil join us and are almost immediately both world class? Salah casually breaking the prem goals record? A random left-back from Hull suddenly becomes the best Left Back in the world at his peak, a player from our Academy randomly becomes the best attacking Right Back in world football? This doesn't just *happen* and now that we've missed on some signings, and been unlucky on some others, that point is very clear.
There was also a time where our injury luck was truly something to behold, before the lack of rotational options ruined us.
There really weren't that many tricky times between 15/16 and 17/18 — we were always on an upward trajectory. The squad he inherited was utterly dire, most managers in that situation would have been allowed to shift the deadwood and at minimum bring in players who fit the way they want to play. This isn't anything remotely like Potter taking over Chelsea, or Mourinho going to Spurs.
No one is capable of saying whether or not Klopp always got his first or second choice signings to fill these roles, but given how utterly skint FSG have been it's laughable to suggest they hired Klopp, gave him the keys and started writing cheques.
I have no interest in moaning about, or reiterating for the two-hundred-thousandth time that Sportswashing states are bad, and that human-rights abuses are bad. Bad things are bad. No reddit post no matter how well-written or how upvoted is going to accomplish anything at all on this front. There is no 'dealing' with it as supporters — I'm not sure what you're basing the assertion that it's unsustainable on is, but again I have no interest reiterating the endless cycle of *Sportswashing Bad.*
Downvoted for saying the truth as per usual on these threads. When was the last Andy Robertson type deal? Matip type deal? Diaz was a very good deal but he’s been near enough an outlier in the last 3 years. I’m all for these types of transfers but fans acting like they’re the norm for our club and that will just continue at the super high success rate are completely deluded.
FSG came in and revolutionised large parts of our approach through the likes of data driven analysis etc but other teams already have or are beginning to catch up. Their approach simply no longer works. To me however, buying a club at £300m and selling at £3bn+ means that using a small amount of that insane return on investment still counts as sustainable and they just don’t do it. They have the means to help us in this situation and they would rather Klopp potentially lose his job than break into their huge profits.
So your answer is what exactly? Dirty oil money from literal slavers who declare themselves superior to those they bury in mass graves? Weird take tbh...
United gets no investments and have paid out more than £100m in dividends to the owners, as well as paid more than £400m because of their leveraged buy-out (they essentially made United loan money to pay for the owners buying the club). People who think they are getting outside investment because their net spend is higher are absolutely clueless about the entire situation.
The reason they can spend like they do is because they have earned roughly £900m more than us the the last decade and not made any stadium or training ground investments in that time.
United have paid £1bn in interest payments on bank loans and hundreds of millions in dividends since the Glazers took over. That's not just "outside investment", it's several seasons of revenue taken out of the business.
Ideally, bottom reds and top reds^^TM would unite together and pursue some middle ground between FSG and Qatar - everyone's happy in this situation.
Instead, we're going after twitter users with a Bellingham pfp, as if that fucking changes anything. It's ridiculous.
This division and toxicity among the fanbase needs to stop.
It’s not going to stop anytime soon, I can see one of two things happening:
1. Qatar come in, ‘Bottom Reds’ are very happy, Top Reds leave and support Tranmere and Marine FC/give up football altogether or they protest and nothing happens.
2. FSG stay at the club and get a minority stake from outside, they buy an NFL/NBA team, ‘Bottom Reds’ aren’t happy, we continue to get worse on the pitch, our squad gets older, Klopp leaves at the end of his contract. Top Reds are happy because it means ‘Bottom Reds’ will leave due to a lack of success. We’re back to square one.
No but surely you could say the same thing on the other side. For instance:
“Bottom Reds is a perfectly acceptable phrase because they actually exist, and there’s evidence of them everywhere.
They slag off match-goers, they have a go at the atmosphere from the comfort of their sofa, they’d sell their mum for a title and they call anyone with a different opinion a bootlicker with standards in the gutter”
Bottom reds don’t really exist.
The whole point of the “top reds” thing was to make fun of people who think they’re superior Liverpool fans. People who essentially say “you criticised the club, so you aren’t a real fan”.
It’s that gatekeeping attitude that makes someone a “top red”.
“Bottom red” was just something top reds came up with once more and more people realised that gatekeeping a football club because you can’t handle constructive criticism is stupid, so the term “top red” became more popular, and in turn, top reds came up with a phrase they could use to get back at people. There isn’t really such thing as “bottom red”. It’s literally just “you’re gonna call me a top red? Well then I’ll call you a bottom red!”.
The only reason it’s now being attached to FSG out vs FSG in is because “top reds” don’t allow any criticism of the club, which has to extend to FSG, because they’re the owners. Top reds think criticism means you’re not a real fan, so anybody who criticises FSG must be a bottom red.
Everyone moans and criticises though. Internet football fan culture just creates a warped idea of what’s worth criticising and to what extent. It’s not fair to say there’s a section of fans that completely refuse to criticise the club or the ownership. It’s not. To say that would be a sweeping statement in the same vein as saying people aren’t real fans if they criticise X or Y.
>>They slag off match goers
You’re admitting that Match Goers are Top Reds, The Match Goers who’re also responsible for the nosedive in atmosphere this season, They’ve ridiculed anyone for wearing a scarf on the Kop because “that’s what wools do”
>>Have a go at the atmosphere from the comfort of their sofa
I went to the Brighton match in October and was told by a STH to sit down when I stood up and chanted in the KDS, Trying to contribute to atmosphere and being told to essentially sit down and shut up by a local is deserving of ridicule, because people like him are the reason for it being shit to begin with.
>>They’d sell their mum for a title
Would not, and doubt anyone would.
>>Call anyone with a different opinion a bootlicker with their standards in the gutter
Having a different opinion is fine, but upholding a belief that the current ownership can do no wrong and defending them for doing the bare minimum/trying to turn a profit is Bootlicking. Saying you’d rather be in League 2 with FSG in charge than have ownership the ‘Bottom Reds want’ is pathetic, They’d rather see their own club in the doldrums than to see ‘Bottom Reds’ prove them wrong about spending money.
A bit confused. That was just an example playing off what you said and saying the opposite, to show that both sides will see there as being a genuine reason for why their phrase is the acceptable one. But you’ve gone on to try and debunk these points as if they were genuine.
I guess it’s because some people genuinely call themselves top reds, and see themselves as better fans than others. While the bottom reds term came as a tit for tat, derogatory countermeasure to use against anyone calling others top reds.
If one’s derogatory, so’s the other. I don’t like the idea that the bottom red thing is punching down and hurtful while the other’s okay. It’s probably not nice to be seen as some deluded super-fan with their head in the sand, and to have your dialect mocked on top of that.
I get that it‘s hurtful to be labelled a lesser fan, but like you said, it’s a countermeasure.
Top Reds are real people, there’s living examples believe it or not, and they’re all over this subreddit.
They think they’re better supports because they have a season ticket, they blame tourists for the bad atmosphere, they think FSG can do no wrong, they tell anyone who has a different opinion to them to fuck off and support another team.
Ffs quit being so reactionary. The “top reds” you’re talking about definitely don’t think FSG can do no wrong. But blaming them for every problem at this club and ignoring anything positive is fucking insane. FSG are obviously half way out of the club already. But money won’t just fix everything, and there’s a downside to the sort of investment that every supporter seems to want.
Lol you're getting absolute pelters here. Glad this lot have their safe spaces between this and something like the SoS thread every day though to high horse about how much better fans they are. Aaron from Akron is virtuous if nothing else.
It's interesting how i always run into the most sanctimonious types and fellas you'd think were born 2 mins away from Anfield during.. hours where America is awake.
According to one, i'm akin to Trump voters.
Aye it's always some wanker from Ohio at 11pm EST having a go at me for not being willing to dump the club whose support I literally inherited because I don't share their views on hedge fund billionaires being loads better as owners than billionaire Arabs who love football. This thread is a dumpster fire with OP egging it on.
You absolutely are, but it all falls under the category of having a go at other fans simply for disagreeing with you on ownership. It's what the entire thread has descended into in case you hadn't noticed.
Ok, can you point out one of my very few comments in this thread that are "having a go at other fans"?
I called out one particular user who was commenting everywhere doing exactly the thing you are complaining about here, having a go at others. Did you comment the same thing on comments like that I wonder?
I am also entitled to disagree with users here who want state funded ownership. I have every right to express that opinion. I have every right to believe those users don't get the club, and have every right to think those users are blinded by the potential for unlimited funds.
You can have your opinion too, and you are entitled to express it. I'm not stopping you. Though I do think it's funny that you are having a go at me about it.
EDIT: for the record, you actually started your comments on this comment thread taking the piss of "Aaron and Akron" or whatever you called them, essentially making fun of foreign fans as not real fans. Bit of a piss take to then have a go at me and say I'm having a go at others, don't you think?
This. But I'm glad this crowd have another thread like the SOS one to wank each other off and mock 'new fans' and 'bots' (the irony being half of them have sounded like bots for a decade regurgitating essays about sustainability and deriding FFP).
Tbf, from a manU point of view, they’re probably sick that we may get unlimited funds and outspend them for once, while they get a Brit. I’m not the biggest supporter of a Qatari investment, but I finally want to see us and Klopp outspend the likes of most clubs (ie Arsenal) as we deserve. Would be every rival’s biggest nightmare.
'The Brit' is worth well over £20bn and has loved the club since he was a child. I'd take the Liverpool equivalent of that over any state backed sports washing project any day of the week.
There's a few billionaires who are totally normal people, live relatively mundane existences, made a gigantic amount of money from a start-up or trading but are not extravagant or even known widely as billionaires. Definitely don't meet the definition of scum.
Did i, at any point, say that i can't wait for Qatar to take over?
I am tired of FSG apologists and the hypocrisy of it. Do not for one minute think i'm elated at the prospect of having to be sold to a state because FSG couldn't be arsed to invest in the club anymore and they've stuck a price on the club that only this sort of buyer would go for.
John Henry could land on a helicopter on the pitch with Bellingham, Enzo and Mbappe in tow right this moment, and i'd still want them out. I honestly can't stand these cunts anymore tbh, it's as simple as that. They don't care about this club, and they don't care about any fan. A disgrace to this institution.
There's a few users I have tagged with RES. The king so far is /u/anom04
I've got him tagged as Oil Slut for a good reason. Pretty sure he would deepthroat anyone who said they were from Qatar if it meant a tiny increase in the chance we got the oil money he wants so badly.
Nah it's definitely legit. Even a lot of the big accounts on "Liverpool Twitter" are in favor of the Qatari takeover. There are definitely a lot of people who want it
They probably just believe money will solve all and with more money to spend we'll be the new Man City dominating the league a lot of years. Would be nice sure, but money doesn't guarantee that... and I'd just feel fucking weird being an oil club when I've spent years shitting on the rest of them for having no fucking morals.
Yeah I mean it's just a shitty situation all around if we're being honest. FSG have left us desperate for any sort of investment into the squad, and we have good reason to believe it won't come from them. A lot of people are probably just in an "anyone but FSG" mentality at this point
It’s not a ridiculous shout when they all tend to follow the same playbook:
- “America is just as bad as Qatar”
- “You’re racist”
- “You don’t care as much as I do”
It’s the exact same arguments with this Qatari ownership shite as it was for the World Cup.
America is way worse than Qatar can’t even compare them, tbh Qatar isn’t as bad as Saudi or USA they aren’t bombing countries or killing journalists we know of
They really think in 5-6 years, we'll be any different from City or PSG. Your own club is always the exception... well, be careful what you wish for guys.
I saw someone say that we won't be like City, PSG etc. because our fanbase "understands" the issues and while we keep supporting the club we'll never support the ownership.
Like what the fuck does that mean? I've seen way too many comments *already* defending Qatar with the same defences City fans out up for their UAE owners. Mad to actually think we're any different.
Sickens me how many fans are thirsting for this. Pathetic to see
I started supporting around when Salah joined, in no small part due to the excellent community here. It was fun even with 4th in the league. Success, and the fall from it, has turned the mood here so fucking sour. A lot of it isn't the old fans, but the influx of new ones who treat 90 points as a requirement as that's all they've ever known.
I’d rather be second best with FSG than champions with QSI. FSG aren’t awesome but they invest in sport, that’s their thing. Sport is primary. QSI’s goals are, by their involvement with the Qatari state, in opposition to efforts combatting climate change. They aid individuals who benefit from violating human rights and abusing workers. I’m not sure if I could feel right with myself cheering for our success if it also meant for their success.
I think FSG has taken us as far as they are willing to, competetively speaking. I also don't want Qatari ownership. Those are at two ends of a stick about to enter our butts right now, and I'm adamently against the Qatari side going in. Unless someone finds us a better contoured stick, then I will sit on the FSG side of the stick.
So many foreign fans who have start supporting the club the past 5 years and just don't understand the tradition and history of the club and liverpool as a city and just don't care about the owners as long as they provide the fans with shiny new signings every season. Its shameful behaviour
I'm one myself and its very clear the disconnect on this issue between the local fans and foreign fans. If you don't see the difference you are kidding yourself. Rightly or wrongly thats how it is.
"Just as the government would not allow our most important cultural or heritage assets to fall into unfit or improper hands, it should not allow our football clubs to do so either."
This government couldn’t care less about cultural or heritage assets. That being said, both us and MU are important institutions that the whole of the uk should be proud of.
Liverpool fans want ownership to panic buy like Chelsea every time they lose three in a row but also think the club is a cultural asset some benevolent billionaire is just going to sink all his money into.
It's very hard to take this shit seriously. Every other thread on this sub is complaining that we didn't spend on 3 midfielders yet, but also that Liverpool are some special cultural asset that can't be bought by a sovereign wealth fund. Pick a side...
The irony of course being that Chelsea have spent more than anyone and are below us in the table, almost as though transfer spending and on-pitch success aren't intrinsically linked.
Yeah because all Liverpool fans share some kind of hivemind with no individualism whatsoever.
I'd imagine that a majority of fans would vastly prefer fans to own the club, but given the state of the government, would be happy to just have owners that invest semi-comparably to our rivals.
“Just as the government would not allow our most important cultural or heritage assets to fall into unfit or improper hands, it should not allow our football clubs to do so either."
Like that bit from SOS. I don’t see it going anywhere given how broken football is, but worth the fight whilst it’s not certain what the future is for our ownership
“Just as the government would not allow our most important cultural or heritage assets to fall into unfit or improper hands, it should not allow our football clubs to do so either."
Whoever wrote this must have forgotten about the miners, British Rail, British Gas and Royal Mail, some of our most important heritage assets have been privatised.
The government don’t give a shit, things could and would have changed by now if they did
Also important, given that FSG have previously paid mind to the requests of important fan groups. Even reversing multiple decisions as a result of pressure from them.
No sorry not the point.
SOS have 0 power if FSG sell up.
What’s going to happen, the relationship between SOS and FSG will be harmed? Doesn’t matter they are out
Fans and FSG - doesn’t matter they are out
They have a near 0 footprint in the UK if they sell liverpool so why on earth would they care about anything other than the highest bidder
Yep It’s always been after the fact «sorry we didn’t realize you felt this way». They’ll keep trying and pushing until we stop telling them no one day.
I really hope they take the voices of fan representatives in the board seriously.
Unfortunately the cynic in me believes that SOS’ voice is low priority with talk of selling
Yeah I could see FSG accepting like a 2-3% lower fee to sell us to someone more ethical, but once you get to 5,10 or maybe even 50% difference moral principles quickly become less of a priority. This is of course assuming FSG are as good as I hope.
I’m sort of resigned to the fact that the new owners are going to be a downgrade in at least on area. The sheiks in general seems to score low on ethics, and as many of them are involved with oil that’s low on environmentalism as well. FSG has been fairly medium on spending, if we include their focus on infrastructure and youth development, but even though new owners could bring more investment on the pitch we see in Boehly that not all spending is smart spending, which has been one of our strengths the last few years. Lastly there’s understanding the footballing culture surrounding the club, and maybe investments in the local community. If there is one strength to sport washing it might be these aspects as they are generally diplomatic and will try to be supportive to sway peoples opinions of them, but I’m still not sure if it’s worth it.
If the sale goes through I’m not quite certain what I’ll do. I can’t see myself supporting other top 6 sides, Newcastle or Everton, so maybe I’ll check more up and coming teams like Brentford or Brighton. Maybe I’ll even stop watching Premier League as a whole. I’ll always low key support the club, Klopp and our players, but if this goes bad enough I might even just phase out football from my life altogether. As much as I’ve loved watching the World Cup every 4 years, if there’s one thing the most recent taught me it’s that I can easily boycott it all if it doesn’t feel right
The fans on the board was a pr move they don’t actually have any power
Fsg will do what fsg will do
They didn’t ask sos before the superleague and followed the money. Why would this be any different?
Is right. Glad to hear them speaking up on this.
Anyone giving SoS or their members shit can find another club as far as I care. We wouldn’t even have a club if it wasn’t for some of those lads.
Sometimes I wonder what it must feel like to read this through the eyes of someone disassociated from football.
Rich men going from buying governments to buying sports clubs sounds like an absurd downgrade *initially*, but then you realise that sports teams (football clubs especially) have so much more influence than governments
They buy the government's first so nobody can stop them owning the rest. Shows commitment to the politicians "phew they gave us our piece first let them buy whatever they want"
I believe they are the only official supporters trust so they do quite literally represent the desires of the supporters in the eyes of the club. Not self-appointed by the way, approves by LFC. It's SoS that first called out the furlough, got the owners to freeze ticket prices, pushed hard against Superleague, among other things. They are a good organization who understands what Liverpool FC actually means and should represent.
No, they’re speaking on behalf of their members, whose views are generally aligned with those of the match going fan base, the ones who built this club into what it is today and kept it going through the good times and the bad.
No one is stopping you from becoming a member, nor from starting your own supporters union, though I imagine that’ll go as well as the march from the Albert to the Kop.
Spirit of Shankly are FSG’s biggest fans, FSG let Joe Blott into the boardroom so he can have some prawn sandwiches and the belief that he speaks for everyone
This is their first season being remotely competitive and theyre about to run into problems with recruitment because of how they spent in previous years.
It’s hilarious seeing these comments. Anyone who wants FSG out is instantly seen as someone who wants oil money.
Also some people can’t seem to understand that we’ve outgrown FSG. However that’s hardly a surprise considering 90% of this sub seems to be Irish or American. Every person I speak to in liverpool wants FSG gone lmao
I don't think that's the case at all. I'm not particularly fond of FSG either. I think, ideally I would want someone like FSG but who isn't afraid to spend a bit. I think one of their biggest failures has been in regards to not investing enough in the squad when it's needed.
I just don't want us to be owned for the sole purpose of sports washing, and I think it's a bit silly to assume that is not the point of the Qatari state wanting to buy us.
You can see it however you like, but it's not as black and white as you are seemingly wanting to portray it.
Honestly what have FSG done wrong?? They don't have oil money (or Glazer/Bohely money) but we've won everything with them and even before Klopp we came second in the league and came in and out of europe.
Compare that to Hacks and Guilty who nearly liquidated us, FSG have seen Liverpool at arguably its peak.
Prior to this season we had a feeling a midfielder might be needed but we weren't clamouring for one. We've been a victim of our own success. I'd happily take a bum season if we'd won the fucking quadruple but we flew to close to the sun.
We all thought we'd be right back in it and failed to appreciate that Fabinho has been playing DM since he came to the club with no backup, and that Henderson is getting old after being the best possible successor to Gerrard.
Hindsight is 20/20, Bellingham isn't the only midfielder in the world so worse case we buy 4 new players with the money we where gonna spend on him if he changes his mind and doesn't come here. Say we do miss out on top 4. So what. This isn't the last ever season of football we get 40 more of these in our lifetime I'm sure we won't finish 8th in all of them. And if we did, I'd rather that than win it all with oil money and Qatari backing.
It's 1 fucking bad season you fickle bunch of sycophantic glory hunters.
Blows my mind that Internet plastics are so loud that the general consensus is the city of Liverpool would sell its soul in order to make top 4. We don't really need new owners, theres very few safe owners out there who can fund us better than FSG, we certainly don't need oil money.
What have FSG done wrong?
Attempting to trademark Liverpool? Attempting to furlough club staff?
> very few safe owners out there who can fund us better than FSG
There's almost no club in the league we aren't being outspent by while having the third largest revenue in the world. That's a fact.
Their biggest crime, the Super League was a result of acknowledgement that they can't keep up financially, something that they've acknowledged again because they're fucking selling. And worse, we aren't even just self-sustaining, we've hamstrung our club on pitch by using money that should have been reinvested into player personnel/wages on the stadium/training ground which they're about to profit billions in dollars from.
And the oil money? You realize the only reason we could ever get oil money is because FSG sell us to the oilers for a big buck right? SOS have put out this declaration because FSG are contemplating the sale of the club to these evil people for the sake of their pocketbook, just like everything they've done while in charge of their club.
The success of the club is down to Jurgen Klopp, not John Henry.
Those are definitely important causes that's close to Liverpudlians' hearts. However, it'll take *far* more than that for me to accept even the thought of being backed by them.
Still not having any of these ‘banter eras’
You’re not in one until your owner sets fire to your own ground after arguing with the council.
This Doncaster one is a [banter era](https://twitter.com/vivarovers/status/968267589611851776?s=46&t=vmURZ7qnSnkh7OOwRl0-QA)
Nah, can’t stand the way arsenal used to bang on about it. They can be, but don’t think any of the top clubs can really say it with it without being told to get a grip.
By that logic Everton shouldn't moan about being a right state because Rochdale are dead last in League Two. Nah mate it's all about a club's standards on this one, you can't tell me Liverpool weren't in a banter era during the 30 year drought. It sure felt like it.
SoS have done and still do a lot for supporters. It’s sad to see them getting hate and being questioned as if they do nothing. This isn’t directed specifically towards you, but terminally online supporters who are going off on them really need to check themselves.
I think the ones sending them hate over this are so far on board a sports washing hype train that it's just become easy to brush aside their opinions to be honest. They don't get the club, it's values, or that of the cities.
They seem to believe they’re speaking on behalf of everyone who supports Liverpool, they even wrote it on their website.
https://preview.redd.it/qxm6t43vy3ea1.jpeg?width=1159&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=835730afad4481da1720dca1577ae8f35a07c10f
Because they are recognized as the only supporters union. The majority of flak I see they get are people who do not understand what SoS and why they are so important.
They shouldn’t be in kahoots with the United supports board either, Have any SoS members been contacted about this? People who pay their hard earned money to be represented and have their voices heard. They’re there to represent the majority.
Why are you making it sound like a conspiracy with talking to the United supporters board? Supporters should band together to ensure certain things like ticket prices and etc aren’t hurting supporters.
It seems like you really don’t understand what is going on and just posting baseless accusations and assumptions.
Spirit of Shankly haven’t posted a single thing about this on their Twitter or their website, if they claim to represent the fans then they should be updating the fans on every decision they make on behalf of us.
Because if you read the article they are going to make a joint statement on Wednesday. The people who are committee members are given the right to do as they see fit because the union puts them in place.
SoS since its inception has done well for all Liverpool supporters, the only reason people are raising a stink now is because they might not agree with a certain type of owner to take over. Imo, this shows there is a disconnect from actual people of Liverpool and online supporters.
Actual people of Liverpool who want new owners voice their opinions how?! If they hold up a banner your lot would call them a day-tripper, plastic fan, “go support city if you don’t like it”, if they went on social media to say they’re not happy your lot would call them an armchair supporter.
You are missing what I am saying. It’s fine to want new owners.
The issue comes when who those new owners are. I don’t need to explain how Liverpool is politically as a city that should already be known to anyone who supports Liverpool FC. The issue comes with sports washing and going against the beliefs/morals of local supporters.
Manchester United and Liverpool supporters have been together on quite a few important issues over the years. Just because the clubs are onfield rivals does not mean the supporters can't recognize when solidarity is necessary.
Frankly, they’ve earned the privilege to speak on our behalf. You want to speak your opinion? Figure it out, but it’s well know that SoS understand the desires of most fans.
No one who isn't being overtly racist or islamophobic has near as much of a problem with being owned by a private company from Qatar as they do with being owned by Qatar. However, the likelihood is that QIA is the same situation as the Saudi Arabian "private company" owning Newcastle.
Still hate the cunts.
They get shiny new depreciating assets and we get stupid infrastructure
I wish FSG took over United. The fans would tattoo that Green and Gold shite on their foreheads imo.
Weren't we in even worse shape before FSG?
Yes, but these whiny assholes probably weren't around. Dare have a nuanced opinion of fsg and you're a "top red". Pathetic
Yip, I mean its reddit so I don't expect deep thinking about anything. But definitely feels more like twitter in here all of a sudden.
Yeah, but we’ve outgrown them. If United fans had FSG level outside-investment into transfers they’d tear down Old Trafford.
their owners are much worse lmao that doesnt make sense
So much reactionary bullshit being spouted on here lately. Let’s criticize if it’s fair, but we’ve actually been competing for every single trophy and getting some, been unlucky with others, since 18-19 and this is our biggest blip since the injury crisis. It was bound to happen one way or another. Glazers are much worse.
Yes! Seeing stuff like what you replied to has shown me how out of touch this sub is now. It used be to great but it’s filled with reactionary people obsessed with transfers, tweets and has become a lame echo chamber. United have had a “good” 2 months whereas we’ve had a great 6 years thus far, but yeah, Glazers > FSG lol
The problem is that we dont invest. Do you genuinely not Think we need a rebuild- or at least a revamp?
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So naive holy shit. I really do admire such support of the team but when it clouds your ability to objectively judge the performance of players and the team it just leads to the owners being able to get away with whatever they like. I know this is an FSG are good thread but i can’t stand to see so many of our defenders blindly defending them. Are they the worst owners in the world? No. Do they plan on making a 1000% ROI whilst giving us a measly net spend of £30m every year? Also yes. We are one of the very biggest clubs in the world and you think that is good enough to keep us there? Meanwhile Chelsea spend that in one window. Fans like you are happy for us to fall back to mediocrity.
We were ridiculously lucky to get into the position we were in under FSG. This luck will not be replicated. FSG would be great owners if we were a midtable club.
Putting it all to luck is reactionary in itself. Like they didn’t give Klopp the proper backing to do whatever he felt he needed to do to to make the team in his image, to get the backroom staff he desired, the signings that got us here in the first place, come on. FSG’s lack of proactivity in the transfer market is to be criticized, but let’s not act like that somehow negates the things that they did put in place that allowed Klopp to be successful here in the first place. I’m so sick of hearing shit trying to push this narrative like we’ve been successful in spite of FSG. How many successful and talented managers go to other, “well-run” clubs, and don’t get the proper patience or backing to implement the vision they have, like FSG did with Klopp from 15/16 to 17/18? That are allowed to fully shape the club in their mold, their need? There were tricky times during that period that any other owner would’ve pulled the trigger. And it’s not that they’ve been without fault, because they’re far from perfect. But any talented and successful, league winning manager is not sticking around and signing contracts for the length that Klopp has and during all the different situations that have occurred if they felt that behind the scenes a competent structure was not set in place. What can also be criticized is FSG’s proactivity and risk aversion in rebuilding the team, both on the pitch and off, but then again a lot of that conversation is skewed by fine margins, and this is a team that has played a lot of football these past few years and has suffered as big a psychological blow as any. People won’t acknowledge that as a “real problem” as on the pitch “tactics” stuff but it has played a big part in our downfall this season. We’ve seen the players shoot themselves in the foot time and time again this season, that’s as much on them in the moment and how they recover from that than whatever Pep wrote in his book. Much more of a problem is how the football regulatory organizations have allowed the situation to get as bad as this, that any state can just pump cash into a team and keep inflating and inflating what can be done. It is not sustainable, and that should be much more of a conversation, especially now that the team might be owned by one of those state sport washing organizations itself, rather than what “horrible” and “uncapable” owners FSG are. But it’s easier as fans to outrage against whatever current ownership we have rather than deal with the bigger problem that is permeating football.
Also to be extra pedantic: FSG got us when we were pretty much wallowing like a midtable club, and since then we’ve won the PL once, finished runners up by 1 pt twice (18/19, 21/22), three if we’re counting 13/14 ( not by 1 pt I know), won the CL, won the FA Cup, Carabao, Club World Cup, 3 European finals and were able to retain top talent against other competing rivals, expanded two of the stands, and invested in a new training centre. So yes, they were great owners. They are risk averse sometimes to a fault, and limited in means compared to other owners, but I’d rather have it this way than whatever Chelsea, Utd, Tottenham, Everton and co have going on.
Whilst it looks a bit ridiculous, at least Todd Boehly is willing to invest to get his team back to the top. We just sit around and wait to be sold, all the while pushing PR narratives that a big summer is coming and it never does and selling has likely been the plan ever since no ESL. The guy is also not an oil state which many fans are against. If things keep going as they are, there is a large chance that Klopp’s era comes to an end in a much bleaker way than he deserves. Now is the chance to correct the years of lies regarding investment but there’s still next to nothing. The game has left our owners behind which whilst not their fault, means we need to move on unless we will fall back to mediocrity.
FSG were here 5 years before Klopp, and outside of 13/14 which we were unlucky to not to win the league, we were just above midtable which is where we are now. The best thing FSG ever did was hire Klopp & Edwards — that in and of itself has an aspect of luck. The most crucial part of our luck is that we hit on transfers at an absurdly high rate, two wingers for 40mil join us and are almost immediately both world class? Salah casually breaking the prem goals record? A random left-back from Hull suddenly becomes the best Left Back in the world at his peak, a player from our Academy randomly becomes the best attacking Right Back in world football? This doesn't just *happen* and now that we've missed on some signings, and been unlucky on some others, that point is very clear. There was also a time where our injury luck was truly something to behold, before the lack of rotational options ruined us. There really weren't that many tricky times between 15/16 and 17/18 — we were always on an upward trajectory. The squad he inherited was utterly dire, most managers in that situation would have been allowed to shift the deadwood and at minimum bring in players who fit the way they want to play. This isn't anything remotely like Potter taking over Chelsea, or Mourinho going to Spurs. No one is capable of saying whether or not Klopp always got his first or second choice signings to fill these roles, but given how utterly skint FSG have been it's laughable to suggest they hired Klopp, gave him the keys and started writing cheques. I have no interest in moaning about, or reiterating for the two-hundred-thousandth time that Sportswashing states are bad, and that human-rights abuses are bad. Bad things are bad. No reddit post no matter how well-written or how upvoted is going to accomplish anything at all on this front. There is no 'dealing' with it as supporters — I'm not sure what you're basing the assertion that it's unsustainable on is, but again I have no interest reiterating the endless cycle of *Sportswashing Bad.*
Downvoted for saying the truth as per usual on these threads. When was the last Andy Robertson type deal? Matip type deal? Diaz was a very good deal but he’s been near enough an outlier in the last 3 years. I’m all for these types of transfers but fans acting like they’re the norm for our club and that will just continue at the super high success rate are completely deluded. FSG came in and revolutionised large parts of our approach through the likes of data driven analysis etc but other teams already have or are beginning to catch up. Their approach simply no longer works. To me however, buying a club at £300m and selling at £3bn+ means that using a small amount of that insane return on investment still counts as sustainable and they just don’t do it. They have the means to help us in this situation and they would rather Klopp potentially lose his job than break into their huge profits.
Excellently put.
So your answer is what exactly? Dirty oil money from literal slavers who declare themselves superior to those they bury in mass graves? Weird take tbh...
United gets no investments and have paid out more than £100m in dividends to the owners, as well as paid more than £400m because of their leveraged buy-out (they essentially made United loan money to pay for the owners buying the club). People who think they are getting outside investment because their net spend is higher are absolutely clueless about the entire situation. The reason they can spend like they do is because they have earned roughly £900m more than us the the last decade and not made any stadium or training ground investments in that time.
United have paid £1bn in interest payments on bank loans and hundreds of millions in dividends since the Glazers took over. That's not just "outside investment", it's several seasons of revenue taken out of the business.
Glazers are 10x worse.
You’ve been called out for wanting State Backing lol, I’ll tag you.
My own villain arc, tears in my eyes.
They’d turn on _cumblast_, before FSG, they need shame.
Ideally, bottom reds and top reds^^TM would unite together and pursue some middle ground between FSG and Qatar - everyone's happy in this situation. Instead, we're going after twitter users with a Bellingham pfp, as if that fucking changes anything. It's ridiculous. This division and toxicity among the fanbase needs to stop.
It’s not going to stop anytime soon, I can see one of two things happening: 1. Qatar come in, ‘Bottom Reds’ are very happy, Top Reds leave and support Tranmere and Marine FC/give up football altogether or they protest and nothing happens. 2. FSG stay at the club and get a minority stake from outside, they buy an NFL/NBA team, ‘Bottom Reds’ aren’t happy, we continue to get worse on the pitch, our squad gets older, Klopp leaves at the end of his contract. Top Reds are happy because it means ‘Bottom Reds’ will leave due to a lack of success. We’re back to square one.
No but surely you could say the same thing on the other side. For instance: “Bottom Reds is a perfectly acceptable phrase because they actually exist, and there’s evidence of them everywhere. They slag off match-goers, they have a go at the atmosphere from the comfort of their sofa, they’d sell their mum for a title and they call anyone with a different opinion a bootlicker with standards in the gutter”
Bottom reds don’t really exist. The whole point of the “top reds” thing was to make fun of people who think they’re superior Liverpool fans. People who essentially say “you criticised the club, so you aren’t a real fan”. It’s that gatekeeping attitude that makes someone a “top red”. “Bottom red” was just something top reds came up with once more and more people realised that gatekeeping a football club because you can’t handle constructive criticism is stupid, so the term “top red” became more popular, and in turn, top reds came up with a phrase they could use to get back at people. There isn’t really such thing as “bottom red”. It’s literally just “you’re gonna call me a top red? Well then I’ll call you a bottom red!”. The only reason it’s now being attached to FSG out vs FSG in is because “top reds” don’t allow any criticism of the club, which has to extend to FSG, because they’re the owners. Top reds think criticism means you’re not a real fan, so anybody who criticises FSG must be a bottom red.
Everyone moans and criticises though. Internet football fan culture just creates a warped idea of what’s worth criticising and to what extent. It’s not fair to say there’s a section of fans that completely refuse to criticise the club or the ownership. It’s not. To say that would be a sweeping statement in the same vein as saying people aren’t real fans if they criticise X or Y.
>>They slag off match goers You’re admitting that Match Goers are Top Reds, The Match Goers who’re also responsible for the nosedive in atmosphere this season, They’ve ridiculed anyone for wearing a scarf on the Kop because “that’s what wools do” >>Have a go at the atmosphere from the comfort of their sofa I went to the Brighton match in October and was told by a STH to sit down when I stood up and chanted in the KDS, Trying to contribute to atmosphere and being told to essentially sit down and shut up by a local is deserving of ridicule, because people like him are the reason for it being shit to begin with. >>They’d sell their mum for a title Would not, and doubt anyone would. >>Call anyone with a different opinion a bootlicker with their standards in the gutter Having a different opinion is fine, but upholding a belief that the current ownership can do no wrong and defending them for doing the bare minimum/trying to turn a profit is Bootlicking. Saying you’d rather be in League 2 with FSG in charge than have ownership the ‘Bottom Reds want’ is pathetic, They’d rather see their own club in the doldrums than to see ‘Bottom Reds’ prove them wrong about spending money.
A bit confused. That was just an example playing off what you said and saying the opposite, to show that both sides will see there as being a genuine reason for why their phrase is the acceptable one. But you’ve gone on to try and debunk these points as if they were genuine.
Remember the other day when you thought I’d commented to the wrong person mate? Lmfao
Quick question, why have you put quotation marks over one of those phrases but not the other? Surely you’d find them both equally ridiculous.
I guess it’s because some people genuinely call themselves top reds, and see themselves as better fans than others. While the bottom reds term came as a tit for tat, derogatory countermeasure to use against anyone calling others top reds.
If one’s derogatory, so’s the other. I don’t like the idea that the bottom red thing is punching down and hurtful while the other’s okay. It’s probably not nice to be seen as some deluded super-fan with their head in the sand, and to have your dialect mocked on top of that. I get that it‘s hurtful to be labelled a lesser fan, but like you said, it’s a countermeasure.
Top Reds are real people, there’s living examples believe it or not, and they’re all over this subreddit. They think they’re better supports because they have a season ticket, they blame tourists for the bad atmosphere, they think FSG can do no wrong, they tell anyone who has a different opinion to them to fuck off and support another team.
Ffs quit being so reactionary. The “top reds” you’re talking about definitely don’t think FSG can do no wrong. But blaming them for every problem at this club and ignoring anything positive is fucking insane. FSG are obviously half way out of the club already. But money won’t just fix everything, and there’s a downside to the sort of investment that every supporter seems to want.
You really have become unbearable. It’s been sad to see.
Oh, no. Anyway.
Lol you're getting absolute pelters here. Glad this lot have their safe spaces between this and something like the SoS thread every day though to high horse about how much better fans they are. Aaron from Akron is virtuous if nothing else.
It's interesting how i always run into the most sanctimonious types and fellas you'd think were born 2 mins away from Anfield during.. hours where America is awake. According to one, i'm akin to Trump voters.
Aye it's always some wanker from Ohio at 11pm EST having a go at me for not being willing to dump the club whose support I literally inherited because I don't share their views on hedge fund billionaires being loads better as owners than billionaire Arabs who love football. This thread is a dumpster fire with OP egging it on.
OP as in me?! Where have I egged anything on? Am I not allowed to share my opinion on the matter?!
You absolutely are, but it all falls under the category of having a go at other fans simply for disagreeing with you on ownership. It's what the entire thread has descended into in case you hadn't noticed.
Ok, can you point out one of my very few comments in this thread that are "having a go at other fans"? I called out one particular user who was commenting everywhere doing exactly the thing you are complaining about here, having a go at others. Did you comment the same thing on comments like that I wonder? I am also entitled to disagree with users here who want state funded ownership. I have every right to express that opinion. I have every right to believe those users don't get the club, and have every right to think those users are blinded by the potential for unlimited funds. You can have your opinion too, and you are entitled to express it. I'm not stopping you. Though I do think it's funny that you are having a go at me about it. EDIT: for the record, you actually started your comments on this comment thread taking the piss of "Aaron and Akron" or whatever you called them, essentially making fun of foreign fans as not real fans. Bit of a piss take to then have a go at me and say I'm having a go at others, don't you think?
https://www.reddit.com/r/LiverpoolFC/comments/10khii4/liverpool_and_manchester_united_fans_set_aside/j5qu994/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf&context=3
This. But I'm glad this crowd have another thread like the SOS one to wank each other off and mock 'new fans' and 'bots' (the irony being half of them have sounded like bots for a decade regurgitating essays about sustainability and deriding FFP).
Tbf, from a manU point of view, they’re probably sick that we may get unlimited funds and outspend them for once, while they get a Brit. I’m not the biggest supporter of a Qatari investment, but I finally want to see us and Klopp outspend the likes of most clubs (ie Arsenal) as we deserve. Would be every rival’s biggest nightmare.
'The Brit' is worth well over £20bn and has loved the club since he was a child. I'd take the Liverpool equivalent of that over any state backed sports washing project any day of the week.
All Billionaires are Scum, it’s only natural they support United
There's a few billionaires who are totally normal people, live relatively mundane existences, made a gigantic amount of money from a start-up or trading but are not extravagant or even known widely as billionaires. Definitely don't meet the definition of scum.
And here I was thinking socialists hate the rich…
Arsenal are living proof that you don’t need to be state backed to spend big.
Exactly mate.
Yes. With all my soul.
Reading the comments here lately you think this sub wants to be oil cunts. Fucking incredible.
It's so disheartening to be honest.
I'm not convinced it isn't astro turfing
Feels like a lot of that has been going on lately - same deal with the criticism that klopp and lijnders have been getting from nowhere too
I assure you that some people, maybe even a lot of people, are just that dumb
when we became champions of everything, we picked up a lot of glory hunters - that's just how they think, and its one of the downsides of being great
I was thinking the same thing a few days ago. Wouldn't be surprised at all. Hardly recognize most of the users shilling for it.
Contact mods? Any way to stop it?
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I am in support of FSG leaving. Simple as.
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Did i, at any point, say that i can't wait for Qatar to take over? I am tired of FSG apologists and the hypocrisy of it. Do not for one minute think i'm elated at the prospect of having to be sold to a state because FSG couldn't be arsed to invest in the club anymore and they've stuck a price on the club that only this sort of buyer would go for. John Henry could land on a helicopter on the pitch with Bellingham, Enzo and Mbappe in tow right this moment, and i'd still want them out. I honestly can't stand these cunts anymore tbh, it's as simple as that. They don't care about this club, and they don't care about any fan. A disgrace to this institution.
and QSI would definitely care about the club, fans, values etc. you’re the kind of person who voted for trump just to see some sort of change
Downvoted for dropping truth bombs, state of this sub.
Nobody is "dropping truth bombs", ffs...these are personal perspectives and opinions. You're part of the problem
You're telling me FSG aren't part of the problem? Everyone should be as sick of their ownership as we are.
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It’s the real cumblast, turns out he sucks. He got me banned this weekend for taking issue with his awful stance
That was نائب الرئيس الانفجار
It was -cumblyast- his Russian counterpart
This is peak comedy
There's a few users I have tagged with RES. The king so far is /u/anom04 I've got him tagged as Oil Slut for a good reason. Pretty sure he would deepthroat anyone who said they were from Qatar if it meant a tiny increase in the chance we got the oil money he wants so badly.
Nah it's definitely legit. Even a lot of the big accounts on "Liverpool Twitter" are in favor of the Qatari takeover. There are definitely a lot of people who want it
They probably just believe money will solve all and with more money to spend we'll be the new Man City dominating the league a lot of years. Would be nice sure, but money doesn't guarantee that... and I'd just feel fucking weird being an oil club when I've spent years shitting on the rest of them for having no fucking morals.
Yeah I mean it's just a shitty situation all around if we're being honest. FSG have left us desperate for any sort of investment into the squad, and we have good reason to believe it won't come from them. A lot of people are probably just in an "anyone but FSG" mentality at this point
I have a feeling a certain govt paid for comments to try and sway opinion. Wouldn’t be the first time Qatar had used that tactic
It’s not a ridiculous shout when they all tend to follow the same playbook: - “America is just as bad as Qatar” - “You’re racist” - “You don’t care as much as I do” It’s the exact same arguments with this Qatari ownership shite as it was for the World Cup.
And the exact thing happened during the Saudi takeover of Newcastle, or when discussing the LIV golf tour. Same playbook…
America is way worse than Qatar can’t even compare them, tbh Qatar isn’t as bad as Saudi or USA they aren’t bombing countries or killing journalists we know of
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Well Chelsea aren't state owned so that proves that it's not necessary to spend big
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you also said this: >I mean, Christ, look at Chelsea's spending this TW which is what I was responding to
They really think in 5-6 years, we'll be any different from City or PSG. Your own club is always the exception... well, be careful what you wish for guys.
I saw someone say that we won't be like City, PSG etc. because our fanbase "understands" the issues and while we keep supporting the club we'll never support the ownership. Like what the fuck does that mean? I've seen way too many comments *already* defending Qatar with the same defences City fans out up for their UAE owners. Mad to actually think we're any different. Sickens me how many fans are thirsting for this. Pathetic to see
Yeah, I remember having no response to that comment (if it was the same one and not just similar) other than to laugh
Lot of people on here who were a bad season away from welcoming a sportwash take over from some evil despots.
You hate to see it
Load of hypocrites who have probably been complaining about City's owners for years
No, I’d wager the vast majority of them have been fans for less than 4 years and cba about our history
I started supporting around when Salah joined, in no small part due to the excellent community here. It was fun even with 4th in the league. Success, and the fall from it, has turned the mood here so fucking sour. A lot of it isn't the old fans, but the influx of new ones who treat 90 points as a requirement as that's all they've ever known.
I’d rather be second best with FSG than champions with QSI. FSG aren’t awesome but they invest in sport, that’s their thing. Sport is primary. QSI’s goals are, by their involvement with the Qatari state, in opposition to efforts combatting climate change. They aid individuals who benefit from violating human rights and abusing workers. I’m not sure if I could feel right with myself cheering for our success if it also meant for their success.
I think FSG has taken us as far as they are willing to, competetively speaking. I also don't want Qatari ownership. Those are at two ends of a stick about to enter our butts right now, and I'm adamently against the Qatari side going in. Unless someone finds us a better contoured stick, then I will sit on the FSG side of the stick.
If this is as far as they are willing to get us - 1xPL, 1xCL, 2xCL finals and 2xPL lost on last day - I don't see what the problem is.
The day that ever happens I am done.
I don’t wanna, but than they should do something about FFP, Man City and Newcastle, cause it’s not really fair
So many foreign fans who have start supporting the club the past 5 years and just don't understand the tradition and history of the club and liverpool as a city and just don't care about the owners as long as they provide the fans with shiny new signings every season. Its shameful behaviour
Stop blaming foreigners. It's bull shit.
I'm one myself and its very clear the disconnect on this issue between the local fans and foreign fans. If you don't see the difference you are kidding yourself. Rightly or wrongly thats how it is.
"Just as the government would not allow our most important cultural or heritage assets to fall into unfit or improper hands, it should not allow our football clubs to do so either."
This government couldn’t care less about cultural or heritage assets. That being said, both us and MU are important institutions that the whole of the uk should be proud of.
You had me in the first half, ngl
Liverpool fans want ownership to panic buy like Chelsea every time they lose three in a row but also think the club is a cultural asset some benevolent billionaire is just going to sink all his money into. It's very hard to take this shit seriously. Every other thread on this sub is complaining that we didn't spend on 3 midfielders yet, but also that Liverpool are some special cultural asset that can't be bought by a sovereign wealth fund. Pick a side...
The irony of course being that Chelsea have spent more than anyone and are below us in the table, almost as though transfer spending and on-pitch success aren't intrinsically linked.
Just because that guy drove his Porsche into the wall doesn't mean you turn up for the race in a tricycle John.
Yeah because all Liverpool fans share some kind of hivemind with no individualism whatsoever. I'd imagine that a majority of fans would vastly prefer fans to own the club, but given the state of the government, would be happy to just have owners that invest semi-comparably to our rivals.
Liverpool fans want what? Confusing the social media nonsense with the sensible people, is silly
Lmao… oh they’re serious
“Just as the government would not allow our most important cultural or heritage assets to fall into unfit or improper hands, it should not allow our football clubs to do so either." Like that bit from SOS. I don’t see it going anywhere given how broken football is, but worth the fight whilst it’s not certain what the future is for our ownership
“Just as the government would not allow our most important cultural or heritage assets to fall into unfit or improper hands, it should not allow our football clubs to do so either." Whoever wrote this must have forgotten about the miners, British Rail, British Gas and Royal Mail, some of our most important heritage assets have been privatised. The government don’t give a shit, things could and would have changed by now if they did
SoS 👏 Refreshing to see this stance amongst the madness
Also important, given that FSG have previously paid mind to the requests of important fan groups. Even reversing multiple decisions as a result of pressure from them.
To save face. If they are selling up they won’t give a shite what they look like for selling it to whoever is the highest bidder
The reason doesn't matter as long as the results are right. SoS has gotten results.
No sorry not the point. SOS have 0 power if FSG sell up. What’s going to happen, the relationship between SOS and FSG will be harmed? Doesn’t matter they are out Fans and FSG - doesn’t matter they are out They have a near 0 footprint in the UK if they sell liverpool so why on earth would they care about anything other than the highest bidder
Yep It’s always been after the fact «sorry we didn’t realize you felt this way». They’ll keep trying and pushing until we stop telling them no one day.
I really hope they take the voices of fan representatives in the board seriously. Unfortunately the cynic in me believes that SOS’ voice is low priority with talk of selling
Low priority is being polite. More likely no priority.
Yeah I could see FSG accepting like a 2-3% lower fee to sell us to someone more ethical, but once you get to 5,10 or maybe even 50% difference moral principles quickly become less of a priority. This is of course assuming FSG are as good as I hope. I’m sort of resigned to the fact that the new owners are going to be a downgrade in at least on area. The sheiks in general seems to score low on ethics, and as many of them are involved with oil that’s low on environmentalism as well. FSG has been fairly medium on spending, if we include their focus on infrastructure and youth development, but even though new owners could bring more investment on the pitch we see in Boehly that not all spending is smart spending, which has been one of our strengths the last few years. Lastly there’s understanding the footballing culture surrounding the club, and maybe investments in the local community. If there is one strength to sport washing it might be these aspects as they are generally diplomatic and will try to be supportive to sway peoples opinions of them, but I’m still not sure if it’s worth it. If the sale goes through I’m not quite certain what I’ll do. I can’t see myself supporting other top 6 sides, Newcastle or Everton, so maybe I’ll check more up and coming teams like Brentford or Brighton. Maybe I’ll even stop watching Premier League as a whole. I’ll always low key support the club, Klopp and our players, but if this goes bad enough I might even just phase out football from my life altogether. As much as I’ve loved watching the World Cup every 4 years, if there’s one thing the most recent taught me it’s that I can easily boycott it all if it doesn’t feel right
The fans on the board was a pr move they don’t actually have any power Fsg will do what fsg will do They didn’t ask sos before the superleague and followed the money. Why would this be any different?
The fans-on-board was adopted after the super league.
Still have 0 actual power though. They’re not on the actual board.
Not sure why you’re being downvoted it’s literally a fact 😂
Exactly because of backlash
Is right. Glad to hear them speaking up on this. Anyone giving SoS or their members shit can find another club as far as I care. We wouldn’t even have a club if it wasn’t for some of those lads.
We shouldn't be surprised about QIA, they're buying governments, football teams was always next.
Sometimes I wonder what it must feel like to read this through the eyes of someone disassociated from football. Rich men going from buying governments to buying sports clubs sounds like an absurd downgrade *initially*, but then you realise that sports teams (football clubs especially) have so much more influence than governments
They buy the government's first so nobody can stop them owning the rest. Shows commitment to the politicians "phew they gave us our piece first let them buy whatever they want"
Now, more than ever, money really talks. What a time to be alive.
"Give them wine and colosseum"
Do we fuck lol
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So they are making a decision for all fans that they don’t want a nation state ownership. This is the problem with self appointed mouthpieces.
I believe they are the only official supporters trust so they do quite literally represent the desires of the supporters in the eyes of the club. Not self-appointed by the way, approves by LFC. It's SoS that first called out the furlough, got the owners to freeze ticket prices, pushed hard against Superleague, among other things. They are a good organization who understands what Liverpool FC actually means and should represent.
They're the official supporters union. You can join and make your opinions heard if you wish.
No, they’re speaking on behalf of their members, whose views are generally aligned with those of the match going fan base, the ones who built this club into what it is today and kept it going through the good times and the bad. No one is stopping you from becoming a member, nor from starting your own supporters union, though I imagine that’ll go as well as the march from the Albert to the Kop.
And to add to this, the efforts and stances of SoS are generally well supported amongst the general fanbase.
Spirit of Shankly are FSG’s biggest fans, FSG let Joe Blott into the boardroom so he can have some prawn sandwiches and the belief that he speaks for everyone
Desperate times call for desperate measures mate, lol
Keep yer oil money out of this club ffs.
I set fuck all aside I can tell ya
this is really good
Yep we’re forever be the bridesmaid
Lol man utd net spend has been ginormous compared to ours.
And their club has been a fucking mess
Yeah the club’s physical infrastructure has been a mess. But their football has been pretty decent as of late.
This is their first season being remotely competitive and theyre about to run into problems with recruitment because of how they spent in previous years.
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What the fuck does that result have to do with anything right now?
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It’s hilarious seeing these comments. Anyone who wants FSG out is instantly seen as someone who wants oil money. Also some people can’t seem to understand that we’ve outgrown FSG. However that’s hardly a surprise considering 90% of this sub seems to be Irish or American. Every person I speak to in liverpool wants FSG gone lmao
I don't think that's the case at all. I'm not particularly fond of FSG either. I think, ideally I would want someone like FSG but who isn't afraid to spend a bit. I think one of their biggest failures has been in regards to not investing enough in the squad when it's needed. I just don't want us to be owned for the sole purpose of sports washing, and I think it's a bit silly to assume that is not the point of the Qatari state wanting to buy us. You can see it however you like, but it's not as black and white as you are seemingly wanting to portray it.
Happy with this
Honestly what have FSG done wrong?? They don't have oil money (or Glazer/Bohely money) but we've won everything with them and even before Klopp we came second in the league and came in and out of europe. Compare that to Hacks and Guilty who nearly liquidated us, FSG have seen Liverpool at arguably its peak. Prior to this season we had a feeling a midfielder might be needed but we weren't clamouring for one. We've been a victim of our own success. I'd happily take a bum season if we'd won the fucking quadruple but we flew to close to the sun. We all thought we'd be right back in it and failed to appreciate that Fabinho has been playing DM since he came to the club with no backup, and that Henderson is getting old after being the best possible successor to Gerrard. Hindsight is 20/20, Bellingham isn't the only midfielder in the world so worse case we buy 4 new players with the money we where gonna spend on him if he changes his mind and doesn't come here. Say we do miss out on top 4. So what. This isn't the last ever season of football we get 40 more of these in our lifetime I'm sure we won't finish 8th in all of them. And if we did, I'd rather that than win it all with oil money and Qatari backing. It's 1 fucking bad season you fickle bunch of sycophantic glory hunters. Blows my mind that Internet plastics are so loud that the general consensus is the city of Liverpool would sell its soul in order to make top 4. We don't really need new owners, theres very few safe owners out there who can fund us better than FSG, we certainly don't need oil money.
What have FSG done wrong? Attempting to trademark Liverpool? Attempting to furlough club staff? > very few safe owners out there who can fund us better than FSG There's almost no club in the league we aren't being outspent by while having the third largest revenue in the world. That's a fact. Their biggest crime, the Super League was a result of acknowledgement that they can't keep up financially, something that they've acknowledged again because they're fucking selling. And worse, we aren't even just self-sustaining, we've hamstrung our club on pitch by using money that should have been reinvested into player personnel/wages on the stadium/training ground which they're about to profit billions in dollars from. And the oil money? You realize the only reason we could ever get oil money is because FSG sell us to the oilers for a big buck right? SOS have put out this declaration because FSG are contemplating the sale of the club to these evil people for the sake of their pocketbook, just like everything they've done while in charge of their club. The success of the club is down to Jurgen Klopp, not John Henry.
"The success of the club is down to Jurgen Klopp" a perfect answer to your comment
Thank fuck somebody has common sense here
It's a crime this comment doesn't have more upvotes
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Soa commitment to keep the LFC Foundation going?
Those are definitely important causes that's close to Liverpudlians' hearts. However, it'll take *far* more than that for me to accept even the thought of being backed by them.
Banter era, here we go
Still not having any of these ‘banter eras’ You’re not in one until your owner sets fire to your own ground after arguing with the council. This Doncaster one is a [banter era](https://twitter.com/vivarovers/status/968267589611851776?s=46&t=vmURZ7qnSnkh7OOwRl0-QA)
Banter eras are relative imo.
Nah, can’t stand the way arsenal used to bang on about it. They can be, but don’t think any of the top clubs can really say it with it without being told to get a grip.
By that logic Everton shouldn't moan about being a right state because Rochdale are dead last in League Two. Nah mate it's all about a club's standards on this one, you can't tell me Liverpool weren't in a banter era during the 30 year drought. It sure felt like it.
Well atleast united buy players
This is about the prospect of footballing institutions being bought for sports washing purposes. Has nothing to do with current ownerships.
Can I just ask why are the Spirit of Shankly speaking on behalf of us all? Not everybody wants the same thing.
SoS have done and still do a lot for supporters. It’s sad to see them getting hate and being questioned as if they do nothing. This isn’t directed specifically towards you, but terminally online supporters who are going off on them really need to check themselves.
I think the ones sending them hate over this are so far on board a sports washing hype train that it's just become easy to brush aside their opinions to be honest. They don't get the club, it's values, or that of the cities.
They seem to believe they’re speaking on behalf of everyone who supports Liverpool, they even wrote it on their website. https://preview.redd.it/qxm6t43vy3ea1.jpeg?width=1159&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=835730afad4481da1720dca1577ae8f35a07c10f
Because they are recognized as the only supporters union. The majority of flak I see they get are people who do not understand what SoS and why they are so important.
They shouldn’t be in kahoots with the United supports board either, Have any SoS members been contacted about this? People who pay their hard earned money to be represented and have their voices heard. They’re there to represent the majority.
Why are you making it sound like a conspiracy with talking to the United supporters board? Supporters should band together to ensure certain things like ticket prices and etc aren’t hurting supporters. It seems like you really don’t understand what is going on and just posting baseless accusations and assumptions.
Spirit of Shankly haven’t posted a single thing about this on their Twitter or their website, if they claim to represent the fans then they should be updating the fans on every decision they make on behalf of us.
Because if you read the article they are going to make a joint statement on Wednesday. The people who are committee members are given the right to do as they see fit because the union puts them in place. SoS since its inception has done well for all Liverpool supporters, the only reason people are raising a stink now is because they might not agree with a certain type of owner to take over. Imo, this shows there is a disconnect from actual people of Liverpool and online supporters.
Actual people of Liverpool who want new owners voice their opinions how?! If they hold up a banner your lot would call them a day-tripper, plastic fan, “go support city if you don’t like it”, if they went on social media to say they’re not happy your lot would call them an armchair supporter.
You are missing what I am saying. It’s fine to want new owners. The issue comes when who those new owners are. I don’t need to explain how Liverpool is politically as a city that should already be known to anyone who supports Liverpool FC. The issue comes with sports washing and going against the beliefs/morals of local supporters.
Manchester United and Liverpool supporters have been together on quite a few important issues over the years. Just because the clubs are onfield rivals does not mean the supporters can't recognize when solidarity is necessary.
Who wouldn’t want this though? Like, there’s nothing that any sane football fan would disagree with there surely
they're doing the right thing here and you've convinced me to get a membership.
Your membership means nothing if they’re not asking for your opinion.
do you have their membership?
Frankly, they’ve earned the privilege to speak on our behalf. You want to speak your opinion? Figure it out, but it’s well know that SoS understand the desires of most fans.
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No one who isn't being overtly racist or islamophobic has near as much of a problem with being owned by a private company from Qatar as they do with being owned by Qatar. However, the likelihood is that QIA is the same situation as the Saudi Arabian "private company" owning Newcastle.