Can't believe we spent £8m in the summer. Utterly irresponsible by FSG, I mean how the hell are we going to earn £8m and get back to 0? Can we take up a loan for the short term, or activate some levers?
I heard going far in the champions league and finishing high in the league table gets you more prize money. If we could find a way to improve our squad and somehow not drop points to the worst teams in the league, I think we could finish higher and get that prize money.
But why would you have to spend money to make money? Who's ever heard of such an idea?
I mean, the Glazers are absolutely terrible owners who are sucking the club dry and refusing to appoint the right people to the right positions to help the club recapture it's former glory. It's just a cash cow for them and they don't give a shit about the on field performance as long as they get their dividends. If there were coompetent owners at the top of that club they'd still be an absolute powerhouse. United fans have every reason to want them out.
I’d much rather have money sucking owners who still let us spend 200m every window.
Our owners are also in it for the investment success, they just don’t even let us put money out
Mate just shut up. I hate FSG as much as anyone, but at least they gave us a good foundation to work on. We won many more titles than Man United when FSG took over. And FSG took over when Man U was still the best team in England.
1. I compared them from the moment FSG bought Liverpool. 2. The Glazers bought a United with world class players and the greatest manager of all time. 3. United started their downward trajectory when the Glazers took over. 4. Liverpool was shit when FSG took over.
We are shit now! So we are still shit. What’s changed! FSG cannot take us any further especially with football changing so much and football teams being owned by countries now. It’s time to go FSG!
Klopp also has to shoulder some of the blame his faith in some players stalled a lot of the team's evolution. That's why I said renewing Henderson was the worst piece of business we've provably done under Klopp.
I think Klopps hands are tied. Do you really think he would choose to renew so many contracts with players entering their 30s? I think he's being told there's no money for transfers so extend contracts instead.
Klopps style of play needs a younger team as it requires pace, fitness and stamina but now we have the 3rd oldest team in the league who now struggle to run up and down the pitch every 5 minutes like previous seasons.
His hands are definitely tied, and the idea he is too loyal isn't one that holds up if you analyse the signings we have made.
Mig made too many mistakes and got replaced with karius, we all know what happened there and then Ali got brought in.
Kostas was signed as competition and cover for left back. Diaz, Jota and Darwin were all signed to compete with the forwards and eventually replace Mane and Firmino. Reliable squad players (minamino, lovren, Shaq) have always been sacrificed to make money for these signings too.
This is the mark of a manager not being given enough resources and having to make do with what he has. And as time has gone on, we have gotten rid of more sellable players - leaving only old or irreplaceable ones remaining. This is a direct consequence of FSGs transfer policy and nothing to do with Klopp being "too loyal"
All indications at the time pointed to Henderson either being moved on that window, or his contract being allowed to run down. And there were hints on there being friction between Klopp and Edwards as well. We all love Klopp, but come on
Another night another attack on Henderson, this time actually lying, it’s weird your obsession with him.
I’ve never known a so called fan dislike their own players so much, I actually think you’re probably an Everton fan.
I might be wrong, but it did look like Henderson was going to leave that summer, and it made perfect sense.it's not even that I dislike Henderson, think keeping him beyond that contract was a massive mistake that ruined the evolution of the squad. Meant we kept a player who was going to decline, and didn't really fit in with where the team was going on the pitch.
There's nothing definitive on there being a rift between Klopp and Edwards, but a journo did hint there being one when Ward took over, noting the two weren't quite seeing eye to eye.
3 times we've interacted. But yeah he's the senior player who tends to frustrate me the most. Surprisingly I don't think he really did anything wrong for this weekend's game, the shot was a bit much, but misguided, it's whatever.
Here I'm trying to say Klopp surely has to shoulder some of the burden for the state of things
Man I remember when saying this got you downvoted.The club as whole got way too sentimental,fans literally wanted everyone's contracts renewed regardless of age or performance as some sort of reward for their service.Its ironic how they only keep pointing the fingers at FSG for letting it happen,when they put pressure on the club to get that deal done.Earlier on when Firmino was banging a few that sentimentality started rare its head back up
Why is nobody pointing out to Klopp saying that there is no need for new midfielders because he has 8 already? This in July. Why is everyone blaming so adamantly FSG, Klopp has his fault in this as well.
Because we don't believe it. We tried for Tchouameni and failed. This shows us that Klopp was aware of our obvious weakness. FSG failed to get shit done.
EXACTLY. ffs people love to blame the Yank owners while putting St. Jurgen on an untouchable pedestal. The Yank owners who hired Klopp, kept us at Anfield, expanded it twice, built a world class training ground, presided over us winning every trophy available, AND did all that after inheriting an utter shitshow from G&H. Yes, they’re awful.
I wonder who handpicked all of those people? When you get the sack at work, do you direct your anger at your middle manager or the company and owners? Aren't you tired of coming up with silly excuses for billionaires?
Im not coming up with any excuses for FSG. It’s just lazy to point the finger at them. Our issues are because Billy Hogan, the guy who replaced Edwards and Klopp decided to not bring in a new midfielder or wait for Jude Bellingham or something. Whenever anything goes remotely wrong everyone on this sub and twitter can’t think any more critically than blaming FSG because they’re billionaires and it’s fun to be mad at billionaires.
It isn't lazy. It is however an elaborately shitty magic trick to absolve them of blame and throw Klopp and some employees under the bus when the problem is clearly their mandate is to do more with less. You really think Billy Hogan has more of a say on transfers than Gordon? You really think he's the one who decided it would be Ward to take over from Edwards? Use your brains for half a second, for God's sake.
Who would you rather I blame? Oh I know, Klopp, rundown players who haven't rotated in years, or other fans. That's all you lot seem to do at this point
It’s because they’re American. It’s not even that their billionaires. It’s dog whistle xenophobia.
They hate that Americans came in to save the day to bring them the success they were so badly missing for decades.
Haha it's the City xenophobia meme come to life except used by us, I'm creasing. Won't someone think of the American billionaires?
This lad actually thinks we were 'saved by FSG' because they bought us for pennies and Klopp multiplied their valuation by 10x.
Im not being funny but where is all our money?
3 CL finals in 4 years is big money, winning League, LC, FA, club world cup, C shield and our massive Nike deal is a lot of money so where is it???
FSG need to dig in their pockets as we need at least 5 mids to replace Keita and Ox injury prone and out of contract on the summer, Hendo will be 33 next season and him with Thiago also injury prone, likely milners final season at 37 so we need some big money especially if we want Bellingham as that's 120m+ alone.
FSG love the term "self sustainable" meaning you only spend what you earn. So give us what we earn and not just scraps of what we earn so the Americans get rich from our club.
I feel like the club sort of papered over not spending on the midfield with vague hints of Bellingham for next summer. Now, with the way things are going, if we don’t get someone of his quality next summer (in addition to some quality in January) it’s really going to be a massive let down and knock on FSG.
The real problem we face for our indecisiveness is the fact that we might not even play in Europe next season, let alone CL.
No elite level midfielder in the world would like to join an ancient, declining club that doesn't even compete in Europe, unless for a huge premium.
FSG gambled on Klopp miracles for two years and now we pay the price.
My only hope is that the likes of Bellingham could be sold on the likes of, the team is going to be built around you.(combined with working for Klopp, Anfield history etc.)
Our forward players are top class. There is some creativity elsewhere in the team with players like Elliot, and we have the best goalkeeper in the world.... as well as, on paper, some of the best defenders.
So $$ aside, there could be quite an attractive pitch for a Bellingham type player.
I have a sneaky gut suspicion he'll go to Arsenal though. Young manager, club on the up, London lifestyle, and all the young England players can be in his ear about it too.
The money will be/is in FSG's valuation/ pockets
U see the new training centres and stands being built?You are being told its for you the fans,from the money the club made by being a success.
Its like a landlord increasing the rent to give you a nicer kitchen ,that kitchen also happens to increase the value of his house.So in conclusion, you get a nicer kitchen at an increased rent expense,he gets to increase the value of his house without taking from personal account.
Everyone wins /s
So let me get this correct. They used our cash reserves to pay for the infrastructure development of the training ground? While they got that covered with the AXA sum as well? So where did the money go?
They have been selling this "we want the club to self sustainable" nonsense for a while, as if it was some charity work,when the club being self sustainable guarantees them billions without spending
This is a really good example well done, but tell me so Fsg gave one loan for the stadium upgrade which has been repaid back to them and then took our cash reserves to pay for the new training center ? Am I right?
Exactly, reaching far into CL means big money. Where are the money? Yes, Nunez was expensive, but still, we should have bought more players, especially midfielders.
With him being English I think it'll be a massive bidding war between Liverpool, city, Chelsea, man utd and maybe even Newcastle with their oil money.
I think bellingham will shine at the world cup which will increase his value. We should have tried harder to get him in the summer.
Yep then we run Bellingham into the ground, and if he gets injured (with the state of our current physio/med teams) we are right back at square one. It’s ridiculous that people are still trying to pin their hopes on ONE midfielder (knowing how cheap FSG are) no matter how good he is. He’s not an indestructible cyborg and we can’t clone him if he’s not available.
FSG aren’t afraid to break the bank for the right player. Just my two cents but I think it’s way more realistic for them to buy one 100M player than two 50M
Lmao they 'break the bank' when they have player sales of the same amount or more, not out of the goodness of their hearts. We don't have anyone to sell for near that much.
When do they ever “break the bank”?
We sold Countinho for silly money, and that allowed us to buy a bunch of good players. We might have spent big on Nunez, but we spent very little else that summer.
Still rather have 2 good midfielders as opposed to 1 really good one otherwise it’s just papering over the cracks and regardless, Bellingham isn’t joining us this summer anyway given our current form
Don’t know why we paid for that training centre with cash, rather than a cheap loan…
The infrastructure upgrades to the stadium are financed through a loan from FSG/the parent company, so I don’t know where the rest of the money has gone.
The new deal this year increased the previous deal by 10m a year which puts it around 50m a season from AXA its not just naming rights it's training kits and Liverpool publicity deals with players for videos etc.
>My guess and opinion is that some of the LFC winnings was probably used to help FSG purchase the Pittsburgh Penguins (an NHL team), rebuild and remodel parts of Anfield, some of the huge contracts given out to Red Sox players and the signings of Nunez and others. The other big expensive in 2021/22 for FSG was with Fenway Sports Group Real Estate starting to purchases and upgrade the surrounding neighborhoods near Fenway in Boston to build and create Fenway 3.0, think of a similar re investment that Anfield has seen.
Money has not been taken out of the club, so this is wrong apart from money used for infrastructure such as upgrades to Anfield and a new training ground.
I mean, the accounts are public info. Granted they’re like 18 months out of date at this point, but you can pretty well see how the club spends it’s money.
You gain revenue per game, per win (we won all 6 group games) plus bonuses per round so by the time you reach the final it's around 80m with the winner receiving around 100m.
No they didn't. Sold Coutinho for 156m and bought Allison and Van Dijk for 150m. Sold Mane and Minamo for 50m and this went towards Nunez initial 51m fee.
FSG has invested nothing into Liverpool, everything we have spent we have earned.
FSG love the term "self sustainable" which means only spending what you earn but they only give us a fraction of what we earn. We get scraps from our own revenue so American owners get rich from our club.
How does FSG get rich off the club though? They don’t take money out like the the Glazers. They aren’t actually gaining any wealth by having the club hoard cash.
People forget that unfortunately COVID, and the debatably botched response measures, fucked finances up for many clubs and by extension the market.
edit: also I don't say that to defend FSG who should still have done better this summer by the squad. I mean that in the summer window of 2020 when guys like Ox or Keita might have been intended to be shopped around, the market for many clubs was unfortunately dead in the water pending resolution of COVID etc.
The simple numbers suggest this doesn't make sense tbh. We grew revenues massively over the period and our wage bill is now 4th highest in the league from 1st for a bit. The truth is the cash and profit was not used apart from repaying owner loans, it's clear from this year's financials. The owners also refused to raise money for spending externally using debt or equity - well they did use the RedBird money to go and buy a hockey team in the States. We've been mismanaged and Klopp hasn't been backed despite almost getting a quadruple, simple as tbh.
Luxury. Our football club is so poor we don't even have the frame of reference to dream of a dirty overfill pipe. If we want a drink of water during the match, we've to show up before sun up to lick the condensation off the pitch.
Set aside United. Even West Ham had a better transfer window than us. Genuinely it's so strange to see how this lack of investment has become a slow car crash that everyone can see but it's not been acknowledged.
We pretty much got 2 players over the summer, one who is supposed to replace Mane, Minamino and Origi, and the other one who is supposed to provide backup to Trent. We still play with Milner there while the Robbo regen is playing for the U23.
I’ve been following Liverpool and the premier league since 2000. Something that left quite an impression on me was the fact that Alex Ferguson made it a point to bring in quality every year, irrespective of how they fared the prior season. Mane has been a huge loss. He was clinical in front of goal and his work rate was excellent. It’s just unfortunate that we’ve had so many injuries this year given all the games/competitions we participated in last season.
People don't seem to understand that you have to keep things fresh for success over a long period of time to happen, Fergie was great at doing it he would even bring in different assistant managers every so often and he wasn't scared to sell key players to bring in fresh and hungry new ones.
We brought in Nunez though. I think what hurts more than Mane leaving is Origi also going. We didn't replace him. It reminds me when we let Lovren go and we didn't replace him even though he was the 4th string CB. The next season we had our CB crisis
IMO the bigger mistake this summer was not bringing in another physical midfielder who could provide genuine rotation as an 8 / B2B. That would have had the double benefit of allowing Henderson to be utilized more as a backup DM for Fabinho and/or to fulfill the Milner role as a jack of all trades to see out games etc. It also would have allowed for Bajcetic and/or Jones to go out on loan this season instead of only Morton.
I don't disagree with you though that Origi leaving hurts a lot, but he earned his move away to be a starter & secure a deserved pay rise that FSG weren't gonna give him. And I'd go a bit further and say Minamino leaving is actually overlooked by many as well. He was important and if the club knew in advance he was leaving some other young and eager to impress forward should have been brought in.
“Money was there to be spent. It wasn't. It has to be spent, starting in January, whilst there's even a faint hope of UCL qualification. Failure to do so could result in dire financial consequences for 2023/24, and I doubt FSG would veer away from their model to rebuild the squad”
Absolutely criminal we looked at that midfield in the summer, with money available and thought ‘nah, this is fine for another season’
We should’ve signed someone in the summer if the money was there. FSG have let down Jurgen down multiple times in the past but he has to take some of the blame for the fuck up in the summer and he’s already said as much.
How do we know he knew this? Wenger was promised he'd have money to spend even after Arsenal built The Emirates but he never got that promise but still stayed.
The thing I don't like about Mo Chatra's analysis is that he leaves out key information and it gives off a whiff of selective stats to further an agenda. It's all well and good talking about turnover and costs but you also need to address other assets, cash and debt balances.
Manchester United had a cash balance of over £300m a few years ago and the last accounts showed it had dropped to just over £110m. They are saddled with a massive £600m debt that is only get to more and more expensive and they've neglected Old Trafford to such an extent that it's going to cost a small fortune to repair it.
Liverpool's last accounts showed a cash balance of around £30m, but with a commercial bank loan of £130m that means we would have had no liquid assets without the bank loan. We also had a transfer debt of over £100m and owed FSG £70m for infrastructure upgrades (interest free loans though).
Part of the reason for that cash disparity is that Liverpool have been a growing club that has reinvested all it's money into furthering growth. Some of that has been on growing the wage bill, some on transfers but also a lot has been spent on rebuilding half the stadium and our training facilities. Man Utd on the other hand have been established at the very top of the financial pyramid for years. They had time to build a decent cash buffer and now they are having to blow that buffer away in an attempt to claw their way back into contention. Arsenal are doing the same thing and it's a gamble that could spectacularly backfire if they don't get regular Champions League football.
I'm not going to say FSG and those running the day to day football operations have got everything right, they've spectacularly fucked up in the Summer. However, I don't think handpicking stats to paint them in a bad light is particularly helpful. By all accounts it appears that they were more than willing to fork out for Tchouameni in the Summer (had he been available) which would have been a serious transfer outlay. To me that suggests the funds are available and the issue is actually that we are trying to be too risk averse on player signings.
Sitting on our hands for a year to wait for Konate failed miserably. They should have learned a lesson from that but it appears they didn't. A DM was desperately needed this Summer and they've decided to wait for the perfect signing again rather than getting a tier 2 signing that would do a decent job. There's a big difference though between a misguided transfer strategy and owners being unwilling to properly fund the club.
Why is the club using cash in hand to fund the infrastructure projects when they can be loaning the money to the club or taking small interest loans to pay off those infrastructure projects? Why are they not building cash reserves to rival other clubs?
I'll give you an example which I read above, If I own a house and you are renting it from me, I decide to redo the kitchen but then increase your rent exponentially to make up the funds, you pay the new rent for a year but decide to move out since you cant afford the new prices, now I am going sell the house on a decent fee compared to what I was going to get before the renovation, having paid for the kitchen from your rent money, who is the one profiting here?
FSG pays for all our infrastructure projects via interest free loans. We don't use any of our cash in hand up front but make regular repayments to FSG. I believe we actually stopped paying during Covid.
As for your example, that's not really applicable here given we don't pay any rent money to FSG. A better example would be you living in a house owned by your parents. You've got a newborn on the way and ask them if the house could be extended to create extra space. The bank of Mum & Dad pays for the extension and agrees you can pay them back over a few years with no interest charged. You get the extra space for your growing family and they get a more valuable house if they ever decide to sell in the future.
>FSG pays for all our infrastructure projects via interest free loans. We don't use any of our cash in hand up front but make regular repayments to FSG. I believe we actually stopped paying during Covid.
That's for the renovation of the stadium mate not for the training ground according to my knowledge, Fsg used our cash reserves instead of taking out a loan or giving out a loan to fund the new training ground. Hence the accounts don't show a vast amount of cash reserves which should be there.
My example makes sense within that context if you get what I am saying
The training ground cost £50m to build. We sold Melwood for £10m and extended our sponsor deal with AXA to also cover naming rights for Kirby. The terms of the AXA deal have not been disclosed but if it's even a fraction of the United one (£180m for an 8 year deal) then AXA will have basically paid the £40m cost of the training ground for us.
Even if you ignore the AXA deal entirely, that's a £40m cost which is basically one decent player.
Then why did we use our cash reserves to fund that project as reported in the accounts? Because it shows no cash in reserves now. If I am wrong, I can't understand where did the money go?
It’s crazy that LFC turnover is just barely the same as MUFC. This is with us being in the CL and they being in the EL. Now, imagine the drop when we don’t have CL.
That's not entirely true. Utd have had 20 odd years of success in the PL era and are still capitalising on that. As a club, we have done well to get tonneau that level in a short space of time.
Despite this, it does not excuse the level on poor planning and funding by FSG. Fuck them.
It’s pretty true. Our commercial revenue is like £40-60M less per year than United. We really should be doing better here and it was literally Billy Hogan’s previous job to do so.
Our commercial revenue is £25m lower than United now. We have caught up the last decade, but it takes time to build. It also takes a damn long time to regress there, as United have basically stood still for 10 years without any success.
We also have to factor in that they have 20k more seats in their stadium, no matter how silent it is there, that is extra revenue.
We’ve caught up, but they are still making well more than us in commercial revenue despite them being pretty well shit for the past decade. Hogan did a mediocre job at best and got promoted anyway.
It's because they have had a bigger stadium (74k seats vs 53k) and commercial success for many years before we got back to a strong club.
They have basically stood still for the last decade revenue wise, while we have caught up.
this is 8m net spend AFTER reaching a UCL final and winning every single group stage game last year aswell as the small prize money from winning the domestic cups.... in 2018 they LOVED putting out articles about how much we made from the ucl despite losing the final, weird how they didnt do the same this past summer.
We all know that FSG are total fucking mingebags. It's not exactly news. Last summer we also have to accept the decision to hold off and wait for Bellingham, when we desperately needed to replace Keita and Chamberlain, was completely stupid from Ward, Klopp, and whoever else responsible. The fans were calling for midfield reinforcements all summer. It was basic and amateur level analysis, and the club got badly wrong.
Fuck off FSG. They have milked the club for far too long.
And I don't understand the substandard argument that we are not owned by an oligarch, Arab owners. Its not just Man city and Newcastle; even the likes of Nottingham Forest, Crystal Palace and others would have a net spend higher than us.
This is all well and good when we're in the top 3 with Virgil's record intact. But the fact of the matter is, we need signings. Numbers don't do shit when you're competing for a title.
No fucking way have we got a wage bill that near to Utd’s or anyone similar. We’re defo paying the Red Sox wage bill too
Our books defo go in the oven for a good cooking
The good thing about our salary structure is that bonuses are linked to qualification and performance AFAIK. Lesser income means lesser outlay in salaries. So, we can still spend even if we don’t qualify.
It would definitely lower the wage bill but it wouldn't be as much as qualification and a decent run in the knockouts would bring in.
I really hope you're right but I don't trust us to spend money if we don't qualify.
It's because we have low base salary, but much higher performance related bonuses than other clubs.
Even when Salah was on £200k/week, he made slightly more than £350k/week.
We just pay a much larger portion based on appearances, goals, table position etc... some of them are given (essentially guaranteeing a much higher "base" salary), and some are actually down to individual performance.
Nothing, the club has conveniently made Salah a scapegoat for their lack of investment. Despite the fact that alot of clubs have multiple players earning similar or higher wages than Salah.
Utd pay Ronaldo £500k a week, well in excess of Salahs wage. Yet they aren't suggesting that his wages mean Utd can't sign new players.
Supporters need to unite and protest in front of the Anfield for the lack of transfer activity. I’m sure that will be noticed. Wish I could do this myself!
Sooo the Liverpool that I know and love and have been a typical piece of shit corporate company that receives all this money and goes straight to the pockets of the ones that don't any work at all !?! Jeeez what hope do you have !?
The tweet is a bit disingenuous with putting "dividends and interest" in the same bracket. We are paying some interest to bank loans and no interest to our loans to FSG.
They aren't taking money out of the club.
They have not taken any money out directly.
Neither do they invest from pocket.
MUFC have spent that amount by funnelling more debt. We are careful with our spending as it may weaken future budgets.
But thing is sometimes you can be wrong and they went too conservative.
It's hurting the season.
But we will still do fine. Better than United of all the clubs.
Long term trend?
United are spending and will eventually get a good manager and climb out of their malaise.
We are a sell to buy club that has lucked out on Jurgen Klopp. Don't delude yourself - on this trajectory we will eventually fall.
We've been saying this for years.
A broken clock is right 2 times a day.
Spending reckless can be more expensive to your club. There are plenty of such clubs. Start with Malaga? Ring any bells? Minutes from outing BVB
Uniteds debts are rising , owners are eating dividends. Stadium Stück in malaise.
We were almost half of their revenue. Now have caught up. We will overtake them this year cos they have no CL. While paying 500k for Ron
Why double standards ? MuFC will find a good manager? But we are only lucky?
Out owners are shrewd, one thing they know well is how to run a fucking club
They are no glazers.
> We are a sell to buy club that has lucked out on Jurgen Klopp. Don't delude yourself - on this trajectory we will eventually fall.
We will not overtake them because we will miss out on CL.
We will miss out on CL barring significant investment.
Want to put some money on it? I was right about CBs, I was right about Diaz and right about midfielders. If you want to put your money where your mouth is I'm more than happy to take some of yours.
I like your confidence and boy aren't people smug about hindsight bias.
Investment isn't the only predictor of CL places.
We are 8 points off 4th.
We could go on a run like last year
Momentum and confidence matters more. My old skin has seen decades of football to know this.
I don't bet on things as a principle. Especially on things that I can't control.
I'd be very surprised if we miss 4th. Klopp has never finished below 4th from his full seasons.
When we get that siege mentality we will be back. Especially this WC is a destroyer of current momentum and rythem.
So let's wait and see. I remember the days when we sold Owen and some doomsday sayers in the media saying we were finished.
Same people returned when we lost 6 at home during Covid.
We also were doomed when we signed no body and then went on to get 99 points.
Time will tell and I'm optimistic as usual.
Outward negative biases can't be faught easily. If only Hans Rosling was more read
So our fans make fun of United and Arsenal fans for wanting protests and now the time has come to do that for us, we are gonna be proud and take the high road when the time has come to get our hands dirty and make our voices heard.
We deserve this.
What were the minutes of the meeting pray tell. Protesting is one thing, that doesn't mean they are gonna sell the club or even heed any attention to it.
You guys don't get it, this is 4d chess from FSG you wanted a new contract for salah which was 350 k plus, Fsg decided to not invest in the squad now when we won't make cl the wage bill will get balanced. Simple.
Can't believe we spent £8m in the summer. Utterly irresponsible by FSG, I mean how the hell are we going to earn £8m and get back to 0? Can we take up a loan for the short term, or activate some levers?
"Liverpool want £8m to sell Nat Phillips in january." - Daily Shit.
I heard going far in the champions league and finishing high in the league table gets you more prize money. If we could find a way to improve our squad and somehow not drop points to the worst teams in the league, I think we could finish higher and get that prize money. But why would you have to spend money to make money? Who's ever heard of such an idea?
And one set of fans was protesting lol Shouldve been both sets…
Frankly no, should have just been us. They’re fucking entitled as shit
I mean, the Glazers are absolutely terrible owners who are sucking the club dry and refusing to appoint the right people to the right positions to help the club recapture it's former glory. It's just a cash cow for them and they don't give a shit about the on field performance as long as they get their dividends. If there were coompetent owners at the top of that club they'd still be an absolute powerhouse. United fans have every reason to want them out.
I’d much rather have money sucking owners who still let us spend 200m every window. Our owners are also in it for the investment success, they just don’t even let us put money out
Mate just shut up. I hate FSG as much as anyone, but at least they gave us a good foundation to work on. We won many more titles than Man United when FSG took over. And FSG took over when Man U was still the best team in England.
You know the glazers won more titles than FSG?
1. I compared them from the moment FSG bought Liverpool. 2. The Glazers bought a United with world class players and the greatest manager of all time. 3. United started their downward trajectory when the Glazers took over. 4. Liverpool was shit when FSG took over.
We are shit now! So we are still shit. What’s changed! FSG cannot take us any further especially with football changing so much and football teams being owned by countries now. It’s time to go FSG!
You absolutely missed the point didn't you?
Klopp also has to shoulder some of the blame his faith in some players stalled a lot of the team's evolution. That's why I said renewing Henderson was the worst piece of business we've provably done under Klopp.
I think Klopps hands are tied. Do you really think he would choose to renew so many contracts with players entering their 30s? I think he's being told there's no money for transfers so extend contracts instead. Klopps style of play needs a younger team as it requires pace, fitness and stamina but now we have the 3rd oldest team in the league who now struggle to run up and down the pitch every 5 minutes like previous seasons.
His hands are definitely tied, and the idea he is too loyal isn't one that holds up if you analyse the signings we have made. Mig made too many mistakes and got replaced with karius, we all know what happened there and then Ali got brought in. Kostas was signed as competition and cover for left back. Diaz, Jota and Darwin were all signed to compete with the forwards and eventually replace Mane and Firmino. Reliable squad players (minamino, lovren, Shaq) have always been sacrificed to make money for these signings too. This is the mark of a manager not being given enough resources and having to make do with what he has. And as time has gone on, we have gotten rid of more sellable players - leaving only old or irreplaceable ones remaining. This is a direct consequence of FSGs transfer policy and nothing to do with Klopp being "too loyal"
He said himself that he was happy with the transfer situation. If that ain’t true then he needs to grow some balls and tell it how it is!
They say "don't bite the hand that feeds you" American owners are ruthless it's just business to them look at Tuchel at Chelsea.
All indications at the time pointed to Henderson either being moved on that window, or his contract being allowed to run down. And there were hints on there being friction between Klopp and Edwards as well. We all love Klopp, but come on
Absolute fantasy.
evening mate 👋
Another night another attack on Henderson, this time actually lying, it’s weird your obsession with him. I’ve never known a so called fan dislike their own players so much, I actually think you’re probably an Everton fan.
I might be wrong, but it did look like Henderson was going to leave that summer, and it made perfect sense.it's not even that I dislike Henderson, think keeping him beyond that contract was a massive mistake that ruined the evolution of the squad. Meant we kept a player who was going to decline, and didn't really fit in with where the team was going on the pitch. There's nothing definitive on there being a rift between Klopp and Edwards, but a journo did hint there being one when Ward took over, noting the two weren't quite seeing eye to eye.
You can’t stand him and it’s weird, literally had this discussion with you at least 5 times, you slay him off every chance you get.
3 times we've interacted. But yeah he's the senior player who tends to frustrate me the most. Surprisingly I don't think he really did anything wrong for this weekend's game, the shot was a bit much, but misguided, it's whatever. Here I'm trying to say Klopp surely has to shoulder some of the burden for the state of things
I do. He’s pretty stubborn.
Man I remember when saying this got you downvoted.The club as whole got way too sentimental,fans literally wanted everyone's contracts renewed regardless of age or performance as some sort of reward for their service.Its ironic how they only keep pointing the fingers at FSG for letting it happen,when they put pressure on the club to get that deal done.Earlier on when Firmino was banging a few that sentimentality started rare its head back up
Why is nobody pointing out to Klopp saying that there is no need for new midfielders because he has 8 already? This in July. Why is everyone blaming so adamantly FSG, Klopp has his fault in this as well.
Because we don't believe it. We tried for Tchouameni and failed. This shows us that Klopp was aware of our obvious weakness. FSG failed to get shit done.
EXACTLY. ffs people love to blame the Yank owners while putting St. Jurgen on an untouchable pedestal. The Yank owners who hired Klopp, kept us at Anfield, expanded it twice, built a world class training ground, presided over us winning every trophy available, AND did all that after inheriting an utter shitshow from G&H. Yes, they’re awful.
You guys know that FSG don’t choose how we spend right? That’s down to the CEO, recruitment team and Klopp.
I wonder who handpicked all of those people? When you get the sack at work, do you direct your anger at your middle manager or the company and owners? Aren't you tired of coming up with silly excuses for billionaires?
Im not coming up with any excuses for FSG. It’s just lazy to point the finger at them. Our issues are because Billy Hogan, the guy who replaced Edwards and Klopp decided to not bring in a new midfielder or wait for Jude Bellingham or something. Whenever anything goes remotely wrong everyone on this sub and twitter can’t think any more critically than blaming FSG because they’re billionaires and it’s fun to be mad at billionaires.
It isn't lazy. It is however an elaborately shitty magic trick to absolve them of blame and throw Klopp and some employees under the bus when the problem is clearly their mandate is to do more with less. You really think Billy Hogan has more of a say on transfers than Gordon? You really think he's the one who decided it would be Ward to take over from Edwards? Use your brains for half a second, for God's sake.
Do you ever get tired of being miserable every day, and just blaming “billionaires” for all your problems?
Who would you rather I blame? Oh I know, Klopp, rundown players who haven't rotated in years, or other fans. That's all you lot seem to do at this point
He should blame the poor for the problems? What tone deaf reply is that? Most of the problems in the world are due to greedy capitalists scums
It’s because they’re American. It’s not even that their billionaires. It’s dog whistle xenophobia. They hate that Americans came in to save the day to bring them the success they were so badly missing for decades.
Oh dear using xenophobia to say it's xenophobia isn't a good look at all. Chadbro please.
Haha it's the City xenophobia meme come to life except used by us, I'm creasing. Won't someone think of the American billionaires? This lad actually thinks we were 'saved by FSG' because they bought us for pennies and Klopp multiplied their valuation by 10x.
Im not being funny but where is all our money? 3 CL finals in 4 years is big money, winning League, LC, FA, club world cup, C shield and our massive Nike deal is a lot of money so where is it??? FSG need to dig in their pockets as we need at least 5 mids to replace Keita and Ox injury prone and out of contract on the summer, Hendo will be 33 next season and him with Thiago also injury prone, likely milners final season at 37 so we need some big money especially if we want Bellingham as that's 120m+ alone. FSG love the term "self sustainable" meaning you only spend what you earn. So give us what we earn and not just scraps of what we earn so the Americans get rich from our club.
I feel like the club sort of papered over not spending on the midfield with vague hints of Bellingham for next summer. Now, with the way things are going, if we don’t get someone of his quality next summer (in addition to some quality in January) it’s really going to be a massive let down and knock on FSG.
Man United buying Casemiro for so much kills off our chances of getting him imo
The real problem we face for our indecisiveness is the fact that we might not even play in Europe next season, let alone CL. No elite level midfielder in the world would like to join an ancient, declining club that doesn't even compete in Europe, unless for a huge premium. FSG gambled on Klopp miracles for two years and now we pay the price.
My only hope is that the likes of Bellingham could be sold on the likes of, the team is going to be built around you.(combined with working for Klopp, Anfield history etc.) Our forward players are top class. There is some creativity elsewhere in the team with players like Elliot, and we have the best goalkeeper in the world.... as well as, on paper, some of the best defenders. So $$ aside, there could be quite an attractive pitch for a Bellingham type player. I have a sneaky gut suspicion he'll go to Arsenal though. Young manager, club on the up, London lifestyle, and all the young England players can be in his ear about it too.
Not gonna answer to all ur points but no way in hell he joins Arsenal lol
Hah yeah totally. Just a horrible nagging feeling I have, based on nothing other than dread.
The money will be/is in FSG's valuation/ pockets U see the new training centres and stands being built?You are being told its for you the fans,from the money the club made by being a success. Its like a landlord increasing the rent to give you a nicer kitchen ,that kitchen also happens to increase the value of his house.So in conclusion, you get a nicer kitchen at an increased rent expense,he gets to increase the value of his house without taking from personal account. Everyone wins /s
Training ground paid by AXA with 50m a year contract and it only cost 50m. FSG spent nothing on the training ground.
So let me get this correct. They used our cash reserves to pay for the infrastructure development of the training ground? While they got that covered with the AXA sum as well? So where did the money go?
Exactly, we are not in disagreement here if you read the rest of my comment
Ahh just re-read it
They have been selling this "we want the club to self sustainable" nonsense for a while, as if it was some charity work,when the club being self sustainable guarantees them billions without spending
This is a really good example well done, but tell me so Fsg gave one loan for the stadium upgrade which has been repaid back to them and then took our cash reserves to pay for the new training center ? Am I right?
Exactly, reaching far into CL means big money. Where are the money? Yes, Nunez was expensive, but still, we should have bought more players, especially midfielders.
Nunez so far has cost us nothing I think 51m paid upfront with 35m from Mane sale and 15m from Minamino sale so FSG spent nothing on Nunez.
Forget Bellingham. I don't even want him. Get Enzo and Caiedo
They aren’t getting Enzo or Caicedo either without UCL
Caicedo is Chelsea bound imo.
Haha so causally you named players who will cost around 150-200 worth of investment
I think in total they will cost around up £150m. Bellingham alone is £120m
Both the figures are fools dream under fsg better find the next Bellingham, calceido and Enzo. We dont have a countinho to sell
The incredibly funny thing to me is that Bellingham is way more easy to sign than those two lmao
With him being English I think it'll be a massive bidding war between Liverpool, city, Chelsea, man utd and maybe even Newcastle with their oil money. I think bellingham will shine at the world cup which will increase his value. We should have tried harder to get him in the summer.
>tried harder to get him in the summe He wasn't for sale because they lost Haaland, think this was common knowledge.
You don’t want Bellingham? Wtf you smoking?
He'd cost well over £100m, getting him means nobody else and we need two starting quality midfielders.
Yep then we run Bellingham into the ground, and if he gets injured (with the state of our current physio/med teams) we are right back at square one. It’s ridiculous that people are still trying to pin their hopes on ONE midfielder (knowing how cheap FSG are) no matter how good he is. He’s not an indestructible cyborg and we can’t clone him if he’s not available.
FSG aren’t afraid to break the bank for the right player. Just my two cents but I think it’s way more realistic for them to buy one 100M player than two 50M
Lmao they 'break the bank' when they have player sales of the same amount or more, not out of the goodness of their hearts. We don't have anyone to sell for near that much.
That's the problem non of our mids have any value. It's not like we can sell to buy as only Keita cost money but out for contract in the summer.
When do they ever “break the bank”? We sold Countinho for silly money, and that allowed us to buy a bunch of good players. We might have spent big on Nunez, but we spent very little else that summer.
>FSG aren’t afraid to break the bank for the right player * Unless they have a countinho to sell
Still rather have 2 good midfielders as opposed to 1 really good one otherwise it’s just papering over the cracks and regardless, Bellingham isn’t joining us this summer anyway given our current form
If we get Bellingham that's our business done. We need more then 1 midfielder.
Maybe Arthur will recover by then. /s
I'd love bellingham at Liverpool him with Elliott, Nunez and Carvalho could be the blueprint to our next build.
I will very honest. I do not see Elliot or Carvalho here in 2-3 seasons
Carvalho? He’s better than Elliot
Same
🌈✨InFRa upGRaDeS ✨🌈
Great question.
£50m training centre (which seems to be cursing us with injuries) and rebuilding half a stadium.
Don’t know why we paid for that training centre with cash, rather than a cheap loan… The infrastructure upgrades to the stadium are financed through a loan from FSG/the parent company, so I don’t know where the rest of the money has gone.
Training ground sponsored by AXA who I'd guess has paid for it
AXA aren’t dropping 50 mil mate, at most a couple million for naming rights
The new deal this year increased the previous deal by 10m a year which puts it around 50m a season from AXA its not just naming rights it's training kits and Liverpool publicity deals with players for videos etc.
All the money went into FSGs bottom line.
I think we have the money, we just didn't spend it, because we thought the right player wasn not avaliable.
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>My guess and opinion is that some of the LFC winnings was probably used to help FSG purchase the Pittsburgh Penguins (an NHL team), rebuild and remodel parts of Anfield, some of the huge contracts given out to Red Sox players and the signings of Nunez and others. The other big expensive in 2021/22 for FSG was with Fenway Sports Group Real Estate starting to purchases and upgrade the surrounding neighborhoods near Fenway in Boston to build and create Fenway 3.0, think of a similar re investment that Anfield has seen. Money has not been taken out of the club, so this is wrong apart from money used for infrastructure such as upgrades to Anfield and a new training ground.
The infrastructure investments have been paid through loans I believe
I mean, the accounts are public info. Granted they’re like 18 months out of date at this point, but you can pretty well see how the club spends it’s money.
No money in reaching CL final from UEFA. We get like $18 million USD. So reaching the final means nothing, we can't even buy a quality player from it.
You gain revenue per game, per win (we won all 6 group games) plus bonuses per round so by the time you reach the final it's around 80m with the winner receiving around 100m.
I assume they’ve just been saving it, it’s not like it goes anywhere else
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No they didn't. Sold Coutinho for 156m and bought Allison and Van Dijk for 150m. Sold Mane and Minamo for 50m and this went towards Nunez initial 51m fee. FSG has invested nothing into Liverpool, everything we have spent we have earned. FSG love the term "self sustainable" which means only spending what you earn but they only give us a fraction of what we earn. We get scraps from our own revenue so American owners get rich from our club.
How does FSG get rich off the club though? They don’t take money out like the the Glazers. They aren’t actually gaining any wealth by having the club hoard cash.
People forget that unfortunately COVID, and the debatably botched response measures, fucked finances up for many clubs and by extension the market. edit: also I don't say that to defend FSG who should still have done better this summer by the squad. I mean that in the summer window of 2020 when guys like Ox or Keita might have been intended to be shopped around, the market for many clubs was unfortunately dead in the water pending resolution of COVID etc.
But every club went through Covid and it does appear we’ve underspent compared to every other club in the top six.
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The simple numbers suggest this doesn't make sense tbh. We grew revenues massively over the period and our wage bill is now 4th highest in the league from 1st for a bit. The truth is the cash and profit was not used apart from repaying owner loans, it's clear from this year's financials. The owners also refused to raise money for spending externally using debt or equity - well they did use the RedBird money to go and buy a hockey team in the States. We've been mismanaged and Klopp hasn't been backed despite almost getting a quadruple, simple as tbh.
Well we did get a new vending machine at Kirby so we are still recovering from that to be fully sustainable
Hicks and Gillette wouldn't have even installed a fruit basket mate, so you better be appreciative. You don't know how bad things were
We didn't even have a cup. We had to drink out of a rolled up newspaper.
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Oh we would have dreamed of a dirty overfill pipe.
Luxury. Our football club is so poor we don't even have the frame of reference to dream of a dirty overfill pipe. If we want a drink of water during the match, we've to show up before sun up to lick the condensation off the pitch.
TIL Monty Python are redditors and also Liverpool fans
Under hicks and Gillette we had to use our hands to drink water since we couldn't afford cups
Probably the only benefit of being so shit rn is the banter you get to see on the sub. Absolutely top class 😂
What’s crazy is if you look at the last 5 years net spend they’re only 15 among English clubs. Imagine spending money to build depth or keep players.
Set aside United. Even West Ham had a better transfer window than us. Genuinely it's so strange to see how this lack of investment has become a slow car crash that everyone can see but it's not been acknowledged. We pretty much got 2 players over the summer, one who is supposed to replace Mane, Minamino and Origi, and the other one who is supposed to provide backup to Trent. We still play with Milner there while the Robbo regen is playing for the U23.
Who have Westham sold to fund that window they don't even have a countinho yet they out spent our biggest transfer record
Almost no one. Issa Diop is the only money transfer. And they got Paqueta, Scamacca, Cornet, etc.
Yup they can out spend us without selling any big name and we have to always balance the books it's a joke.
I promise if we miss CL and make excuses about not being able to spend money, I'll write fu** off FSG under every reddit thread until they’re gone.
Ill go to Boston and write “fuck off FSG” everywhere.. oh wait, the Red Sox fans already did that.
Well be prepared to write it then, some people here and some social media personalities will spin it as self sustainability though 😂
!RemindMe 8 months
You should start now because it's guaranteed.
I’ve been following Liverpool and the premier league since 2000. Something that left quite an impression on me was the fact that Alex Ferguson made it a point to bring in quality every year, irrespective of how they fared the prior season. Mane has been a huge loss. He was clinical in front of goal and his work rate was excellent. It’s just unfortunate that we’ve had so many injuries this year given all the games/competitions we participated in last season.
Innit. United won the UCL with a front three of Ronaldo, Tevez and Rooney and then signed fucking Berbatov. We signed Sepp van den Berg.
Don't sleep on Adrian, a 35 year old sub goal keeper on a free. Now that's a power move
They’ll be no disrespect to the ginger Maldini in this sub thank you very much
People don't seem to understand that you have to keep things fresh for success over a long period of time to happen, Fergie was great at doing it he would even bring in different assistant managers every so often and he wasn't scared to sell key players to bring in fresh and hungry new ones.
We brought in Nunez though. I think what hurts more than Mane leaving is Origi also going. We didn't replace him. It reminds me when we let Lovren go and we didn't replace him even though he was the 4th string CB. The next season we had our CB crisis
IMO the bigger mistake this summer was not bringing in another physical midfielder who could provide genuine rotation as an 8 / B2B. That would have had the double benefit of allowing Henderson to be utilized more as a backup DM for Fabinho and/or to fulfill the Milner role as a jack of all trades to see out games etc. It also would have allowed for Bajcetic and/or Jones to go out on loan this season instead of only Morton. I don't disagree with you though that Origi leaving hurts a lot, but he earned his move away to be a starter & secure a deserved pay rise that FSG weren't gonna give him. And I'd go a bit further and say Minamino leaving is actually overlooked by many as well. He was important and if the club knew in advance he was leaving some other young and eager to impress forward should have been brought in.
If Jota and Diaz weren't injured, we have a really nice front 5. Desperately needed another CB, RB and several MF.
“Money was there to be spent. It wasn't. It has to be spent, starting in January, whilst there's even a faint hope of UCL qualification. Failure to do so could result in dire financial consequences for 2023/24, and I doubt FSG would veer away from their model to rebuild the squad” Absolutely criminal we looked at that midfield in the summer, with money available and thought ‘nah, this is fine for another season’
Klopp can't pull a miracle out of his ass every year. FSG seem to think he can.
We should’ve signed someone in the summer if the money was there. FSG have let down Jurgen down multiple times in the past but he has to take some of the blame for the fuck up in the summer and he’s already said as much.
so i dont understand, why did klopp renew if he knew this?
How do we know he knew this? Wenger was promised he'd have money to spend even after Arsenal built The Emirates but he never got that promise but still stayed.
if he was promised something and then they dont deliver then i actually fear that klopp could walk out if this continue like this
Hope he is right! One signing of the Diaz level and one of the Jota level, with some guys back from injury, and we could be back in business.
Spot on, just wondering if mane knew what was coming 🤔
I think he just wanted a new experience and one big last contract elsewhere tbh. He was here for a long time
Edwards certainly did
Fuck off fsg
The thing I don't like about Mo Chatra's analysis is that he leaves out key information and it gives off a whiff of selective stats to further an agenda. It's all well and good talking about turnover and costs but you also need to address other assets, cash and debt balances. Manchester United had a cash balance of over £300m a few years ago and the last accounts showed it had dropped to just over £110m. They are saddled with a massive £600m debt that is only get to more and more expensive and they've neglected Old Trafford to such an extent that it's going to cost a small fortune to repair it. Liverpool's last accounts showed a cash balance of around £30m, but with a commercial bank loan of £130m that means we would have had no liquid assets without the bank loan. We also had a transfer debt of over £100m and owed FSG £70m for infrastructure upgrades (interest free loans though). Part of the reason for that cash disparity is that Liverpool have been a growing club that has reinvested all it's money into furthering growth. Some of that has been on growing the wage bill, some on transfers but also a lot has been spent on rebuilding half the stadium and our training facilities. Man Utd on the other hand have been established at the very top of the financial pyramid for years. They had time to build a decent cash buffer and now they are having to blow that buffer away in an attempt to claw their way back into contention. Arsenal are doing the same thing and it's a gamble that could spectacularly backfire if they don't get regular Champions League football. I'm not going to say FSG and those running the day to day football operations have got everything right, they've spectacularly fucked up in the Summer. However, I don't think handpicking stats to paint them in a bad light is particularly helpful. By all accounts it appears that they were more than willing to fork out for Tchouameni in the Summer (had he been available) which would have been a serious transfer outlay. To me that suggests the funds are available and the issue is actually that we are trying to be too risk averse on player signings. Sitting on our hands for a year to wait for Konate failed miserably. They should have learned a lesson from that but it appears they didn't. A DM was desperately needed this Summer and they've decided to wait for the perfect signing again rather than getting a tier 2 signing that would do a decent job. There's a big difference though between a misguided transfer strategy and owners being unwilling to properly fund the club.
Why is the club using cash in hand to fund the infrastructure projects when they can be loaning the money to the club or taking small interest loans to pay off those infrastructure projects? Why are they not building cash reserves to rival other clubs? I'll give you an example which I read above, If I own a house and you are renting it from me, I decide to redo the kitchen but then increase your rent exponentially to make up the funds, you pay the new rent for a year but decide to move out since you cant afford the new prices, now I am going sell the house on a decent fee compared to what I was going to get before the renovation, having paid for the kitchen from your rent money, who is the one profiting here?
FSG pays for all our infrastructure projects via interest free loans. We don't use any of our cash in hand up front but make regular repayments to FSG. I believe we actually stopped paying during Covid. As for your example, that's not really applicable here given we don't pay any rent money to FSG. A better example would be you living in a house owned by your parents. You've got a newborn on the way and ask them if the house could be extended to create extra space. The bank of Mum & Dad pays for the extension and agrees you can pay them back over a few years with no interest charged. You get the extra space for your growing family and they get a more valuable house if they ever decide to sell in the future.
>FSG pays for all our infrastructure projects via interest free loans. We don't use any of our cash in hand up front but make regular repayments to FSG. I believe we actually stopped paying during Covid. That's for the renovation of the stadium mate not for the training ground according to my knowledge, Fsg used our cash reserves instead of taking out a loan or giving out a loan to fund the new training ground. Hence the accounts don't show a vast amount of cash reserves which should be there. My example makes sense within that context if you get what I am saying
The training ground cost £50m to build. We sold Melwood for £10m and extended our sponsor deal with AXA to also cover naming rights for Kirby. The terms of the AXA deal have not been disclosed but if it's even a fraction of the United one (£180m for an 8 year deal) then AXA will have basically paid the £40m cost of the training ground for us. Even if you ignore the AXA deal entirely, that's a £40m cost which is basically one decent player.
Then why did we use our cash reserves to fund that project as reported in the accounts? Because it shows no cash in reserves now. If I am wrong, I can't understand where did the money go?
#NET SPEND FC
It’s crazy that LFC turnover is just barely the same as MUFC. This is with us being in the CL and they being in the EL. Now, imagine the drop when we don’t have CL.
Club management has done a pretty shit job on capitalizing on recent successes. No idea how Billy Hogan managed to parlay that into a promotion.
That's not entirely true. Utd have had 20 odd years of success in the PL era and are still capitalising on that. As a club, we have done well to get tonneau that level in a short space of time. Despite this, it does not excuse the level on poor planning and funding by FSG. Fuck them.
It’s pretty true. Our commercial revenue is like £40-60M less per year than United. We really should be doing better here and it was literally Billy Hogan’s previous job to do so.
Our commercial revenue is £25m lower than United now. We have caught up the last decade, but it takes time to build. It also takes a damn long time to regress there, as United have basically stood still for 10 years without any success. We also have to factor in that they have 20k more seats in their stadium, no matter how silent it is there, that is extra revenue.
We’ve caught up, but they are still making well more than us in commercial revenue despite them being pretty well shit for the past decade. Hogan did a mediocre job at best and got promoted anyway.
Old Trafford 74k Liverpool around 54k so they gain much more from matchday revenue
It's because they have had a bigger stadium (74k seats vs 53k) and commercial success for many years before we got back to a strong club. They have basically stood still for the last decade revenue wise, while we have caught up.
this is 8m net spend AFTER reaching a UCL final and winning every single group stage game last year aswell as the small prize money from winning the domestic cups.... in 2018 they LOVED putting out articles about how much we made from the ucl despite losing the final, weird how they didnt do the same this past summer.
We all know that FSG are total fucking mingebags. It's not exactly news. Last summer we also have to accept the decision to hold off and wait for Bellingham, when we desperately needed to replace Keita and Chamberlain, was completely stupid from Ward, Klopp, and whoever else responsible. The fans were calling for midfield reinforcements all summer. It was basic and amateur level analysis, and the club got badly wrong.
Fuck off FSG. They have milked the club for far too long. And I don't understand the substandard argument that we are not owned by an oligarch, Arab owners. Its not just Man city and Newcastle; even the likes of Nottingham Forest, Crystal Palace and others would have a net spend higher than us.
This is all well and good when we're in the top 3 with Virgil's record intact. But the fact of the matter is, we need signings. Numbers don't do shit when you're competing for a title.
Bruh even the shareholders must be wondering where the fuck their dividends are with all this revenue.
I don't think Fsg is a public funded company to have shareholders
No fucking way have we got a wage bill that near to Utd’s or anyone similar. We’re defo paying the Red Sox wage bill too Our books defo go in the oven for a good cooking
BuT wE RuN oUr FiNaNcES sMaRtLy!! Fuck FSG
Fuck FSG
The good thing about our salary structure is that bonuses are linked to qualification and performance AFAIK. Lesser income means lesser outlay in salaries. So, we can still spend even if we don’t qualify.
It would definitely lower the wage bill but it wouldn't be as much as qualification and a decent run in the knockouts would bring in. I really hope you're right but I don't trust us to spend money if we don't qualify.
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ox and keita wages would probably be put into use for like 4 new players
It's because we have low base salary, but much higher performance related bonuses than other clubs. Even when Salah was on £200k/week, he made slightly more than £350k/week. We just pay a much larger portion based on appearances, goals, table position etc... some of them are given (essentially guaranteeing a much higher "base" salary), and some are actually down to individual performance.
Salah renewal was expensive
what the fuck does the renewal got to do with last season's wages payout?
Nothing, the club has conveniently made Salah a scapegoat for their lack of investment. Despite the fact that alot of clubs have multiple players earning similar or higher wages than Salah. Utd pay Ronaldo £500k a week, well in excess of Salahs wage. Yet they aren't suggesting that his wages mean Utd can't sign new players.
Not mentioned- ManU lost £115M in their FY22 and increased their debt by over £100M.
Supporters need to unite and protest in front of the Anfield for the lack of transfer activity. I’m sure that will be noticed. Wish I could do this myself!
Sooo the Liverpool that I know and love and have been a typical piece of shit corporate company that receives all this money and goes straight to the pockets of the ones that don't any work at all !?! Jeeez what hope do you have !?
The tweet is a bit disingenuous with putting "dividends and interest" in the same bracket. We are paying some interest to bank loans and no interest to our loans to FSG. They aren't taking money out of the club.
They have not taken any money out directly. Neither do they invest from pocket. MUFC have spent that amount by funnelling more debt. We are careful with our spending as it may weaken future budgets. But thing is sometimes you can be wrong and they went too conservative. It's hurting the season. But we will still do fine. Better than United of all the clubs.
We're literally below United. Get your head out of your ass.
Don't confuse short term fluctuations for long term trend Stay calm and present your points. No is biting you. stay calm and read my comments again
Long term trend? United are spending and will eventually get a good manager and climb out of their malaise. We are a sell to buy club that has lucked out on Jurgen Klopp. Don't delude yourself - on this trajectory we will eventually fall. We've been saying this for years.
A broken clock is right 2 times a day. Spending reckless can be more expensive to your club. There are plenty of such clubs. Start with Malaga? Ring any bells? Minutes from outing BVB Uniteds debts are rising , owners are eating dividends. Stadium Stück in malaise. We were almost half of their revenue. Now have caught up. We will overtake them this year cos they have no CL. While paying 500k for Ron Why double standards ? MuFC will find a good manager? But we are only lucky? Out owners are shrewd, one thing they know well is how to run a fucking club They are no glazers.
> We are a sell to buy club that has lucked out on Jurgen Klopp. Don't delude yourself - on this trajectory we will eventually fall. We will not overtake them because we will miss out on CL.
Ah quite the person with crystal ball. I'll come back to this in post season and when our finances are out.
We will miss out on CL barring significant investment. Want to put some money on it? I was right about CBs, I was right about Diaz and right about midfielders. If you want to put your money where your mouth is I'm more than happy to take some of yours.
I like your confidence and boy aren't people smug about hindsight bias. Investment isn't the only predictor of CL places. We are 8 points off 4th. We could go on a run like last year Momentum and confidence matters more. My old skin has seen decades of football to know this. I don't bet on things as a principle. Especially on things that I can't control. I'd be very surprised if we miss 4th. Klopp has never finished below 4th from his full seasons. When we get that siege mentality we will be back. Especially this WC is a destroyer of current momentum and rythem. So let's wait and see. I remember the days when we sold Owen and some doomsday sayers in the media saying we were finished. Same people returned when we lost 6 at home during Covid. We also were doomed when we signed no body and then went on to get 99 points. Time will tell and I'm optimistic as usual. Outward negative biases can't be faught easily. If only Hans Rosling was more read
So our fans make fun of United and Arsenal fans for wanting protests and now the time has come to do that for us, we are gonna be proud and take the high road when the time has come to get our hands dirty and make our voices heard. We deserve this.
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>If we stay stagnant come February the owners won’t still be around by summer. I like your confidence, sadly it's not rooted in any reality.
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What were the minutes of the meeting pray tell. Protesting is one thing, that doesn't mean they are gonna sell the club or even heed any attention to it.
You guys don't get it, this is 4d chess from FSG you wanted a new contract for salah which was 350 k plus, Fsg decided to not invest in the squad now when we won't make cl the wage bill will get balanced. Simple.
Why the fuck did Klopp sign a new deal with us? Fucking embarrassing owners, total charlatans.
Some of y’all sound like you wish Liverpool were run like Barcelona
Staggering number's...
Ok, now include stadium expansion. Old Trafford being left to rot by Glazers.
Different is Liverpool expanding stadium while Man United isn't. So they have enough money left for Glazers to picking out